What if the National Security Agency had its own advice columnist? What would the eavesdroppers ask about?
You don’t need to guess. An NSA official, writing under the pen name “Zelda,” has actually served at the agency as a Dear Abby for spies. Her “Ask Zelda!” columns, distributed on the agency’s intranet and accessible only to those with the proper security clearance, are among the documents leaked by NSA whistleblower Edward Snowden. The columns are often amusing – topics include co-workers falling asleep on the job, sodas being stolen from shared fridges, supervisors not responding to emails, and office-mates who smell bad. But one of the most intriguing involves a letter from an NSA staffer who complains that his (or her) boss is spying on employees.
In the letter, which Zelda published in a column on September 9, 2011, the employee calls himself “Silenced in SID” – referring to the Signals Intelligence Directorate, the heart of the NSA’s surveillance operations. Zelda’s column, headlined “Watching Every Word in Snitch City,” offers an ironic insight into a spy agency where the spies apparently resent being spied upon.
“Dear Zelda,” the letter of complaint begins:
Here’s the scenario: when the boss sees co-workers having a quiet conversation, he wants to know what is being said (it’s mostly work related). He has his designated “snitches” and expects them to keep him apprised of all the office gossip – even calling them at home and expecting a run-down! This puts the “designees” in a really awkward position; plus, we’re all afraid any offhand comment or anything said in confidence might be either repeated or misrepresented.
Needless to say, this creates a certain amount of tension between team members who normally would get along well, and adds stress in an already stressful atmosphere. There is also an unspoken belief that he will move people to different desks to break up what he perceives as people becoming too “chummy.” (It’s been done under the guise of “creating teams.”)
Surveillance tends to sow suspicion and unease among the people who are being surveilled. Is anyone listening? Who might be the spy among us? What trouble might I get into with the things I say? These questions can eat away at the core of human relations – trust. And this is true even at the agency that is conducting the surveillance.
The letter continues:
We used to be able to joke around a little or talk about our favorite “Idol” contestant to break the tension, but now we’re getting more and more skittish about even the most mundane general conversations (“Did you have a good weekend?”). This was once a very open, cooperative group who worked well together. Now we’re more suspicious of each other and teamwork is becoming harder. Do you think this was the goal?
Silenced in SID
Zelda is shocked.
Dear Silenced,
Wow, that takes “intelligence collection” in a whole new – and inappropriate – direction. …. We work in an Agency of secrets, but this kind of secrecy begets more secrecy and it becomes a downward spiral that destroys teamwork. What if you put an end to all the secrecy by bringing it out in the open?
Her column reads like an unintended allegory – or a cleverly masked one. The NSA’s own advice columnist explores the ways in which pervasive surveillance can erode freedom of expression and social cohesion by making it difficult for people to have faith in the privacy of their communications.
Zelda continues:
You and your co-workers could ask [the supervisor] for a team meeting and lay out the issue as you see it: “We feel like you don’t trust us and we aren’t comfortable making small talk anymore for fear of having our desks moved if we’re seen as being too chummy.” (Leave out the part about the snitches.) Tell him how this is hampering collaboration and affecting the work, ask him if he has a problem with the team’s behavior, and see what he says. …. Stick to the facts and how you feel, rather than making it about him (“We’re uncomfortable” vs “You’re spying on us.”).
There is no indication that Zelda is trying to make a larger point, but some of what she goes on to propose would be useful for ordinary citizens outside the agency who worry about government and corporate surveillance.
If you are bothered by snitches in your office, whether of the unwilling or voluntary variety, the best solution is to keep your behavior above reproach. Be a good performer, watch what you say and do, lock your screen when you step away from your workstation, and keep fodder for wagging tongues (your Viagra stash, photos of your wild-and-crazy girls’ weekend in Atlantic City) at home or out of sight. If you are put in the “unwilling snitch” position, I would advise telling your boss that you’re not comfortable with the role and to please not ask that of you.
Who is Zelda? And who is “Silenced in SID”? The document provides no information about the identity of the letter’s author; he or she could be almost anybody at the agency. In a previous column, Zelda explains that Ask Zelda! was initially intended as a forum for supervisors in the Signals Intelligence Directorate, but that non-supervisory workers began submitting questions, too.
A bit more is known about Zelda. Her introductory column, in 2010, identifies her as serving for approximately 20 years as “a first-line and mid-level Agency supervisor.” At the time her column began, she was also an adjunct faculty member of the agency’s National Cryptologic School. Her column was part of a regular NSA bulletin called “SIDtoday” that is distributed on the agency’s classified NSAnet. According to traffic statistics, in fact, Ask Zelda! quickly proved to be among the bulletin’s most popular features.
“We usually end the calendar year by providing a suspenseful countdown of the top dozen most widely read SIDtoday articles of the year,” noted a SIDtoday bulletin on December 27, 2011, “but this time around it is not really a nail-biter, because Zelda articles occupied all of the top five slots!” Her most popular article that year, about swearing at the NSA, received 19,446 hits.
“Since SIDtoday is like an online newspaper, we decided to follow the tradition of newspaper write-in advice columnists (such as Dear Abby and Miss Manners) and give me a nom de plume,” Zelda writes in advance of the first anniversary of her column. “I like it because using a pen name creates a persona who’s more memorable and accessible than ‘Ask Mary Smith, Chief of S456.’ Plus it creates a certain mystique about Zelda… she’s bigger than life. It also prevents me from getting inundated with hate mail and requests for advice outside of the column.”
Zelda can be a church lady. Her first column addressed employee attire in summer months, and she was not pleased. “Somehow, shorts and flip-flops don’t exactly convey the image of a fierce SIGINT warrior,” she writes. “Not only is beach attire unprofessional in the workplace, but in certain cases it can be downright distracting to co-workers (if you get my drift).” She recommends that offenders, who might be just out of college and not know any better, should be told to dress “in a professional manner” even when it feels like a swamp outside. This column received 9,186 hits by the end of 2010 – placing it number four on the list of most-read SIDtoday articles for the year.
But on privacy, Zelda is surprisingly liberal, given that the agency where she works spies on vast numbers of private phone calls, emails, texts, chats, status updates, webcams and address books. In a column titled, “Guilty Until Proven Innocent?”, Zelda responds to an NSA worker who goes by the pen name “Innocent Bystander” and who explains that a colleague has filed an anonymous complaint about their bosses, calling them “abysmal” and “idiotic.” Unfortunately, everyone believes that Innocent Bystander has written the complaint, and as a result, “The chill I’m feeling is pretty severe!” Anonymous complaints should be discouraged, Innocent Bystander says, so that innocent parties do not come under suspicion.
“You make a good case against anonymous mailbags,” Zelda replies, “but a lot of people won’t give feedback at all if they know it will be attributed to them. I believe scathing comments such as your co-worker’s are the exception and not the rule.”
Her response to “Silenced in SID” does not acknowledge the irony – or hypocrisy – of an employee at a spy agency complaining about being spied on. But Zelda directly addresses the long-lasting effects of inappropriate surveillance. “Trust is hard to rebuild once it has been broken,” she observes. “Your work center may take time to heal after this deplorable practice is discontinued.”
Documents referenced in this article:


I tend not to drop a lot of responses, but after looking at a bunch of remarks on this page The NSA Has An Advice Columnist. Seriously.. I actually do have a few questions for you if you do not mind. Could it be just me or does it look as if like a few of these remarks look as if they are coming from brain dead people? :-P And, if you are posting on other places, I would like to keep up with you. Would you list of the complete urls of your social sites like your linkedin profile, Facebook page or twitter feed?
Asking questions are actually good thing if you are not understanding anything completely, but this paragraph gives nice understanding yet.
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“…one last question: will the readers ever find out who zelda is?”
answer: “no because we all sound exactly alike. For the world of me I don’t even know why I get any questions at all”
WAsn’t this on an episode of The Good Wife?
The Guinness is Good
Her answer to everything is “Put your hands on top of your desk. Officers will arrive shortly.”
There is a substantial difference between national security and the means by which it is enhanced and, security within a security organisation which is of extreme importance but, distinguishable from scuttlebutt or disinformation provided to harm a co-worker. Professional managers at all levels have always had an ear open to people giving information about other workers. The best managers can, and does, take care to distinguish between other workers points of view with supporting evidence and, plain lies or innuendo simply aimed at disparaging a colleague.
What a tangled web we weave when we practice to deceive.
Zelda? Really”
Dolliink,
This is why Bourbon was invented. I should know.
Regards, Zelda
This article provides some interesting insight to one properly aware or otherwise trained in psychology and human behavior.
The initial letter discussed, related to internal spying, most likely demonstrates a culture that is both inspired by, and inspires, the spying by the agency on American citizens. Interestingly, Zelda, likely not a person but a committee, provides for an interesting take on the agency’s attitude towards mass surveillance: as long as you have nothing to hide, you have no reason to fear every word, deed, and thought being monitored.
So here we have an agency that spies on Americans – each other. This inspires some to spy on each other within the NSA . And when this is discovered by some who actually engage in the act of spying on Americans; they are treated by their superiors the way we are treated by the agency. This both justifies the surveillance, and simultaneously causes the individual operators to seek a perverted and uniquely American form of vengeance; that of misdirected payback to a perceived lower echelon of an internally created hierachy. In other words, the people who spy are being spied on, and in response to being spied on, exceed their mandates in spying as “revenge” for their being spied on.
This behavior is quite readily exemplified in criminal justice in America. Here we have a law enforcement paradigm that obviously does not serve the will of the people. We know that law enforcement is universally corrupt; yet because law enforcement mistreats us, we then use law enforcement to “pay back” those around us who wrong us. The very nature of human behavior has been fundamentally altered by corruption.
And if we don’t think that such actions as mass surveillance of Americans can cause immediate problems; let’s examine the killing of Osama Bin Laden, and how it emboldened law enforcement to act as judge, jury, and executioner, starting most prominently with Christopher Dorner.
What I wouldn’t give to have access to those documents. As a victim of NSA rogue surveillance, and the rash of b.s. I get whenever I try to tell people; I am quite anxious to prove to Americans what I already know: that the NSA has become a rogue agency of children who act as no more than a massive network of internet trolls who have singlehandedly brought down the entire global communication infrastructure’s effectiveness through their clumsy efforts to play internet gods.
The only possible solution to this problem is the complete and total gutting of the NSA and revelation of all internal documents. Full and complete disclosure. In other words, the truth shall set us all free.
This may be off topic, but should be of general interest. Edward Snowden’s live-stream session on Monday, March 10 at the South by Southwest Festival (SXSW) in Austin, Texas, had Impressive audience viewing numbers. These audience participation numbers are encouraging as Edward Snowden’s enlightening revelations and heartfelt recommendations are now being heard by a much larger audience thanks to the journalistic efforts of Glenn, Laura, The Intercept, and other brave folks like the organizers at SXSW who refused to buckle to government pressure. The number of live-stream viewers, like me, of the Monday, March 10, Snowden SXSW session have been compiled by the Texas Tribune. Here are their Analytics:
“Okay, the numbers are coming in — here’s a summary of Snowden traffic from various other sites’ embeds of our feeds, etc.:
Visits: 271,823
Uniques: 228,712
Countries 203
Desktop/Mobile: 82%/18%
Per the Texas Tribune spokesperson, the live-stream numbers above are for embed feeds from the NYT, The Guardian, Verge, and others.
The Texas Tribune live-stream viewers peaked at 50,000. However, they reported that the Antarctica viewership, and I quote, “was paltry”.
Journalist attendees, regular attendees and photos show that the multiple viewing rooms at SXSW were packed. The total theater seating was 7600 so the journalist attendee estimates of over 7000+ are right on.
Feel free to repost these viewership numbers to other sites. People need to know that the message on privacy violations, and the NSA/GCHQ, … mass surveillance systems’ unlawful and unConstitutional activities are reaching a larger and more engaged world community. I am pleased.
I posted this to one other The Intercept article (Glenn and Ryan’s newest).
Will it post? Where?
WOW! The right hand does not even know the left! Blinded by righteousness! The right is malignant
this was interesting to read:
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/mar/11/nsa-snowden-whisteblower-michael-rogers
Ahhh – how sweeet.
There is no ‘read more’, on page 1,
for the ‘Ask Zelda’ article.
Are you in the documents section? Each doc is individual and some only have one page. I think there are four total. They’re “inneresting”, to say the least.
I’m on ‘page 1′, where it has all the recent titles.
After each title, there is a ‘read more’,
except for ‘Ask Zelda’.
This is the link that I use:
https://firstlook.org/theintercept/documents/
Then I click on the title of the document and it launches fine. There is an imbedded PDF viewer on the page that loads and the letters are within that box. Hope that helps.
Thanks for pointing it out; fixed now!
@EL B i know the bus, i know democracy, i don’t know what your objection was about……
@thomas … As I saw it – the comment you responded to (that I responded back to) was an attempt to re-ignite a flame that had already been extinguished – all because you wanted to split hairs on something you knew was a spin off on a previous misunderstanding. Your comment was irrelevant – and IMHO deserved a cutting response *only* because of your timing. That’s why I decided to jump in your face.
If you’d done your homework on these two folks you might recognize their “names”. I am familiar with them both. In as much as you can know someone in any community like this I also I believe them to be fellow compatriots – even if they didn’t know it themselves.
Please re-read that thread. It was my way of saying “butt out”. To gain a little perspective you might also read all of @Titonwan’s and @Citizen Sane’s comments. You might even like what they have to say – and the way that they say it, as I do.
The thought of any infighting in this community makes me cringe. I hope that by my response you and I can call no harm/no foul/shake hands and put this thing to bed. Thank you for asking.
i too agree we ought not hassle each other. if i over reacted it has something to do with
arguing with many apparaatchiks on other forums…….
thank you for your informative and polite reply……….
There are so many handicaps in communicating in the modern world of technology when typing words on a comment board. It’s sometimes hard for me discern tone and misunderstand intent. It appears we were both wrong and I appreciate the sincerity of your apology. I apologize to you, too.
I was curious about the letter SXSW received from a US Government representative that “asked” the SXSW organization not to allow Edward Snowden to speak at the South by Southwest Interactive festival (via video hookup from Russia). I just read the letter and am dumbfounded to believe that someone, especially one of our Congressional representatives, could write (and believe) all the lies in this letter.
I am a light sleeper and need to find out what government issued earplugs and eye shades he has been using. To believe and write the lies in his letter, he must have been asleep the past eight months. Another possibility is that he is best buddies with Mike Rogers, Diane Feinstein, or maybe even Clapper and Alexander.
Have a look, and then treat yourself to a stiff drink – you’ll need one.
Here is the link to the Congressional letter sent to SXSW asking them not to allow Edward Snowden to speak at their conference.
http://pompeo.house.gov/uploadedfiles/sxsw_letter.pdf
This just in: Pompeo is in eruption. “Stamp the imprimatur of your fine organization on a man that ill deserves such accolades.” Emperor Nero never turned such a fine phrase. Legio XVII Imprimatur will deploy to smite this conference!
I just read the letter again.
I saw it before, but I didn’t think it was real.
Wow. What a crock of stinking shit. There you have it folks. In writing. The list of USG lies in black and white. This schmuck is truly a shameless liar of biblical proportions. Nice to see the SXSW team allowed Snowden’s feed to happen…basically giving the middle finger to the USG.
W-T-F did I just read? Did Congressman Mike Pompeo REALLY send this letter to the organizers of SXSW to intimidate them from having Edward Snowden speak???
“…Mr. Snowden has put the lives of our soldiers, sailors, and airmen at risk – in addition to the lives of the people who will attend your conference.”
THIS IS AN OUT. RAGE. OUS. SCARE TACTIC AND DEPLORABLE BEHAVIOR!!! CONGRESSMAN MIKE POMPEO should be accused of sending terrorist threats on the basis of this statement. I can. not. believe. this letter.
Unadulterated horseshit signed, sealed and delivered by a congressman. The rest of the letter leaves me entirely SPEECHLESS. For me – the rambler … I’m actually impressed he shut me down. Thanks for the warning @Jim. I’m getting a double shot of Crown just to settle myself down. I’m not even kidding.
An Open Comment to The Intercept authors, managers and to whomever it might apply.
Please consider writing a story—I prefer a critique—of the ACLU’s video interview with Mr. Snowden. I strongly support him, I signed ACLU’s petition for his pardon, and I became a member of the ACLU, partly because of his revelations regarding NSA. However, the ill advised over cautioned effort of establishing a secure connection—via 7 proxies and likely other encryption measures—made him a caricature which resulted in a mockery of his message regarding security issues.
I have a limited bandwidth connection via my ISP, so I throttled my Internet use over several days to have enough bandwidth to view the full video without going over my limit—which results in marked penalties and slowing of my service to the extent that I cannot view video streaming or embedded videos, post streaming. Notwithstanding that preparation, I had to turn off the YouTube video after about 5 minutes because of its dismal visual and audio qualities—frozen frames of Mr. Snowden in grotesque ‘mug shots’ and the earache inducing echo chambering of his audio.
I commented here instead of at the ACLU for several reasons. The foremost reason is to caution the ‘The Intercept’ never to deploy such extreme encryption measures on Mr. Greenwald and/or other guests during any video conferencing efforts. The caricaturing of Mr. Snowden is enough of a travesty without making cartoon characters out other patriots and clouding such a critically important message.
NSA, its proponents, and ‘Zelda’ will most likely have a field day with this chaos.
I don’t think you should take the seven proxies as a statement of fact:
http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/good-luck-im-behind-7-proxies
Thank you for your link. However, we can assume the use of some number of proxies/ anonymizers, along with other encryption techniques because of the excessive buffering, et cetera. Did you view (or try to) view the stream or the YouTube video?
I did, it reminded me of the The Conversation which was somewhat apt. I don’t know why you are complaining here about technological issuses somewhere else though.
For the reasons I stated in my original comment above:
“I commented here instead of at the ACLU for several reasons. The foremost reason is to caution the ‘The Intercept’ never to deploy such extreme encryption measures on Mr. Greenwald and/or other guests during any video conferencing efforts.”
Thank you for your link.
I’m a bit confused. How did the slow speed create a caricature of Snowden? Technical issues happen and as long as you can actually hear what he says, I don’t think the ACLU should be criticized for what could be legitimate streaming issues out of Russia. If people criticize the medium and ignore the message, they don’t care about what he has to say in the first place.
If you want to press for anything, ask the Intercept or the ACLU for a transcript of the interview.
Did you view and/or try to listen to the video?
Yes I did. It was worth to watch the video. It did not create a caricature. A transcript might be helpful too. To be honest after travelling and normally not understanding a word of american english (or scottish and irish …) I was quite surprised to understand a bit of it. Encryption makes sense but it is extremely slow?
@ Keller: I commend you for your extra effort.
I watched the video on my iPad. I agree that the video/audio quality was poor. I have seen similar poor quality before from Iraq, Brazil, and other countries. However, I will not throw stones at the technicians who helped set up the video connection with Edward Snowden. I do not know what challenges they faced in protecting his location (the US has drones) and in protecting the video link. I was very concerned that there would be no hookup at all, that the NSA with its technology would hack the connection and I would see a blank screen with no audio. That didn’t happen and I do believe they tried.
Even with the challenging video and audio quality, I was thoroughly pleased to hear him speaking live to me and 1000s of others. I’m and old guy and once stood in the rain to hear President Eisenhower. I was far from the stage and caught glimpses at times plus the audio left much to be desired, I was, however, in the presence of my hero and am so glad I was there. I feel the same about my viewing Edward Snowden today via the video live-stream sponsored by the Texas Tribune.
Snowden has given us extraordinary insight into the mass surveillance programs implemented by our Government. Programs that collect and store (maybe forever) all our digital communications. By all, I mean from everyone, including all US citizens. As an extremely smart technical insider, he has also shared his views on how we can respond to reassert our Constitutional rights. Free speech, freedom of the press, protection from unwarranted searches and seizures, and the right to justice in open, not secretive, courts are the basic foundation of America and we need to defend these Constitutional rights against all enemies, even those originating from within our very own government.
So am I and like you, ‘I Like Ike’. However, I never had the opportunity to see him. I think he was the last great president, although like all humans, he was flawed, very wrong at times, and I did not agree with some of his policies or choices (e.g. R. Nixon).
President Eisenhower was the closest person I have seen that was well qualified, for all he accomplished inside and outside political life, to be a competent President and Commander-in-Chief. In fact, he is the reason I am still a registered Republican.
My father went off to war (WWII) a few years after I was born. He returned home safely in 1945. As a kid, rightly or wrongly, I thanked Ike for my father’s safe return. Ike was the one who first warned us about the “Military/Industrial Complex”.
I was a Republican until I watched the Clarence Thomas hearing and saw how ruthless the Republicans were in attacking Anita Hill. I watched every minute. I believed Anita Hill. I believed that Thomas was a lier and unqualified. After the confirmation hearing, I became an Independent.
Additional facts, uncovered in the decades since, prove that I was right in believing that Anita Hill was telling the truth, and believing Thomas to be unqualified for the Supreme Court. Who today believes that Thomas is qualified to serve on any court.
@ Jim M.
I agree with you regarding the Thomas/Hill situation. Perhaps we have similar perspectives on this particular issue because we were both born in the 1940s.
I knew Mr. Thomas was ‘guilty as charged’ when, during the televised hearings, I heard him say the following in a manner denoting that no human could judge him, only ‘God’ had that right. What an incredibly pious and telling statement.
http://mith.umd.edu//WomensStudies/GenderIssues/SexualHarassment/hill-thomas-testimony
Well I can certainly sleep well tonight knowing this information. Seriously, quit the bs.
Is there Live Streaming of Glenn Greenwald’s talk at SXSW?
I searched for a stream and came up with 0.
I think Glenn mentioned, just before he was to connect,
there might be no stream.
If firstlook took requests I’d like to see a story on how the Egyptian police broke Medea Benjamin’s arm last week. I’m pretty sure Egyptian authorities don’t just pull American citizens off a plane and put them in a cell and break their arms. Somebody in the US government must have alerted the Egyptians who she was and maybe that they wouldn’t mind seeing her have a hard time going through customs.
But I understand if they don’t have anyone working on that particular story yet. Its just the nature of just starting up.
this paragraph from a Cnet report on the Snowden SXSW talk sums up the Real Problem…………. FEAR…
(What good is Freedom of Speech, then, if people are to Fearful to use it )
…….Interestingly, given my fairly innocuous questions about people’s perceptions of the talk, several people I spoke with were nervous about having their name or their company associated with their comments about the Edward Snowden talk. Two told me specifically that even with just their first name and their professions, they felt sure people would be able to identify them — and clearly they worried that would not be good for them for one reason or another. This was not something I had encountered very often in the past at SXSW.
http://news.cnet.com/8301-1009_3-57620130-83/in-most-anticipated-sxsw-talk-in-years-edward-snowden-fires-up-austin/
Thanks for sharing this link. The article answered one of my curiosities – how many people at SXSW heard Snowden. The journalist attendee said 5000 in his room (theater seating for 4600) and thousands in the other rooms (theater seating for 3000). I’m pleased that he filled the rooms. I am waiting for the Texas Tribute to share the number of people like me that watched via their live-stream hookup.
I thought the overall session was balanced between the interviewers and Snowden. Could they have done better? Certainly. The video quality was poor due to passing through seven proxies and not using Skype. I was worried that the US Spooks would find a way to technically stop the video hookup. If they tried, they didn’t succeed. Maybe possible US interference was the reason Skype was not used. The ACLU participants were the right choice. They provided some insight into what Snowden was saying and asking us to do. As the journalist attendee said, the two ACLU participants could have had their own session with huge attendance.
A video is promised to be available soon via the ACLU website. I also hope there is a transcript. What Snowden said today at SXSW and what he said to the EU Parliament, plus the huge attendance and interest in today’s SXSW session means he, Glenn, Laura, and others are getting the truth out to more and more people. It’s been eight months and the word about what the NSA, GCHQ, CIA, DOJ, … were and are doing to secretly subvert the Constitution is getting into the mainstream and to more audiences. I’m very pleased.
I also hope there is a transcript. What Snowden said today at SXSW and what he said to the EU Parliament,
Snowden didn’t speak to the EU Parliament, he wrote his remarks and the Q&A was also written questions with written answers.
It’s all at this link: Popularresistance Snowden EU Parliament
Why not ask @livestream twitter?
Didn’t they handle the feed?
It appears that the majority of commenters to The Intercept articles do not use their real name, likely for the same reason the SXSW attendees were unwilling to share their name and employer with the journalist attendee: fear of alerting the US government to their possible dissenting views. I use my real name. I’m retired (an old guy) so have less to fear, maybe. Fear is what occurs when Whistleblowers like Chelsea Manning are more harshly punished than murderers, even some mass murders, and when secret courts and secret rulings are pervasive in our ?justice? system. The inverse actions of the DOJ in not punishing a single individual for the collapse of our economy in 2008 also creates fear. When the bad goy “walks” and the good guy is persecuted and jailed, fear and disgust are common outcomes for the American populace. “Outing” ourselves, I believe will have a positive outcome as the US Spy agencies can’t target and go after all of us if we number in the millions, maybe even if we only number in the 10,000s.
Jim,
I am also waiting for the transcript…. I couldn’t make out half of what was said in the video.
As far as not using a real name….I don’t believe it matters what name you use…………. if they have you in their sights…. a anonymous name will not stop them from finding you………..
But, I totally understand the point you are making….
Snowden: We need a watchdog that watches Congress, who can tell us when these guys just lied to us. (Andy Carvin, @acarvin)
You talking to me? http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2014/03/09/every-dog-has-its-data/
cognitive dissonance ….. epitomized. Just how dumb does one have to be to join the surveillance state?
Evidently, pretty dumb.
It worked for James “Help I’ve Fallen and Can’t Get Up” Clapper.
Oh @Citizen! The Clap got back up, ran over to the president, and jumped up on lap! Then sucked his thumb and rubbed his face on his blankey and sniffled – while giving us all stink eye!
What is this fuckery? How long before they amend the constitution to make it legal to lie to Congress – for national security reasons? Or have then done it already and we just don’t know about it, yet?
I think that people like Greenwald and Snowden are about the only types left, holding the line, and at least trying to make Government accountable. Right now, government has it in its mind that it can do anything it wants to anyone it wants to, anytime it wants to.
I am old enough to know the difference. Those muthers are supposed to be civil servants. They work for me (and you, and the rest of US). I should be able to hire and fire them at will, just as I would a gardener or domestic.
I only woke up to this nightmare a few years ago. I am grateful to Snowden … he was the Oz that pulled away the curtain, for me. I can’t believe how stupid I was – I am living the nightmare I was taught would stop when we fought wars. I should have known better than to trust blindly. ES and GG are heroic. I’m an old broad and I don’t throw that word around easily. And I’m most grateful I’m on the right team. These corporations and governments, when finally exposed, will enjoy quite a reckoning. Fire them all, I say. Preferably on a spit.
Dear Zelda,
When will a new article appear?
This topic has grown stale.
Anxiously awaiting………..
Like you, I would like the Intercept journalists to be more prolific as I am retired and have lots of free time to research, read, and comment. However, I realize that a journalist must thoroughly research a subject before writing. That takes time, especially since the critics for these articles are the all powerful US national security agencies who will jump on, exaggerate, and broadcast via the MSM even the smallest error,
Additionally, writing, editing, and reviewing an article takes time. So, I will not throw stones at any of the Intercept journalists, especially Glenn whose plate overflows with panels, interviews, collaboration with Snowden and others. Add to this that the Intercept journalists need to understand these often very technical programs before even writing one word.
While waiting for a new article, I spend my time researching and understanding what others are saying and doing. Currently, I am trying to better understand Jacob Appelbaums’s analysis and presentations on the national security documents that he has access to. Additionally, I do things like watch the live-stream one hour interview and Q & A with Snowden that the ACLU did this morning at SXSW in Austin, TX. SXSW provided multiple venues with a total theater seating capacity of 7600. I hope all the seat were taken.
If you get bored waiting for the next Intercept article by Glenn or others, go read the documents, articles, etc., available on the Free Snowden or Cryptome websites. What’s there could keep you busy for months.
FWIW, I just wanted to share some of my actions to keep from getting anxious or bored while waiting for another excellent and revealing article by The Intercept journalists.
Good post Jim! I think this is a matter of quality rather than quality. we’re just all used to the old models of media where we constantly have new stuff thrown at us all the time, usually stories that aren’t important.
Although I guess they could throw in a Justin Beiber story, I’d kind of rather they just stick with doing the stuff they’ve been publishing so far.
Indeed Jim. I too am retired with lots of winter snowed-in time on my hands(hahaha..no pun intended). Another main source of info is Marci Wheeler at emptywheel. Look no further for the most profound analysis of NSA/FISC and other relative issues. She’s…well, let’s just say beyond amazing.
http://www.emptywheel.net/
And so is Kevin Gosztola the Dissenter. He was at every session of Manning’s trial. And more.
http://dissenter.firedoglake.com/
And then, there is another Dissenter whistle blower/journalist who also maintains his own site covering his State Department beat….Peter Van Buren. I can’t begin to tell you his credentials.
Except, he went through the DOJ wringer just like Drake, for writing We Meant Well..a book about the monumental waste of human life, resources and political bullshit…
http://wemeantwell.com/blog/
Maybe we’ll meet there.
Jim, I have tried that. My eyes glazed over, and my brain rolled over on “tilt”.
Jim, these articles take lots of effort and time to research, write and edit, especially the ones that deal with government documents that require careful redactions. We’re working all-out. More soon.
Dear Mr. Maass,
You take your time doll. Though the wait times are excruciating, I’m impressed at the frequency given all the material you need to suss out. You and your team AL-WAYS deliver! FWIW it’s also refreshing to know the authors actually follow comments – let alone reply. Please don’t reply back to me, you have bigger fish to fry. Just wanted to say thank you to you – and to The Intercept.
Spied-on spies are now distrustful of their boss and even their colleagues, the boss has informants amongst them and wants to know even the smallest thing discussed in the office, calling his snitches at home to get the dirt. Sounds just a wee bit like 1984. Isn’t it ironic that the mass surveillance turned their little society into a little dictatorship? Big brother will be proud.
Can you blame them? For all their “biblical” leanings they also offer prayers to the shrine of St. Ayn Rand! A devout atheist. The only thing transparent about these spooks is their hypocrisy! She might have been a compelling and provocative novelist – but their hero worship of her “message” is as bizarre as it is creepy.
1984 is just another example of plagiarism. Captain McAlexander couldn’t even hire a decorator for his office – he had to redesign captains deck of the Enterprise! These have about as much originality as a hangnail … and they’ve certainly shattered any illusions I ever imagined about the finesse and stealth in the game of spying. Pu-Leeze.
p.s. before I get hate mail about atheism I’ll go on record as an admitted “believer” – and I got -no- problem with anyone who chooses not to believe in mine or anyone else’s “spirituality” for that matter. As long as no one gets hurt it’s all cool with me.
US Human Rights record undergoes International scrutiny ACLU
https://www.aclu.org/blog/human-rights-capital-punishment-prisoners-rights/us-human-rights-record-undergoes-international#page=14
How nice; a human interest story about the NSA. What a great way to honor the risk and sacrifice made by Edward Snowden in procuring the cache of documents that is now entrusted to The Intercept. Keep shaking up the world with your reporting.
I’m secure in knowing my man Glenn isn’t going to cut loose with anything not vetted to protect the innocent. I know there’s people that want him to dump this all at once, but they’re the same folks that vote shit on American Who Wants to Marry a Dancer dumbfucks. I welcome the torturously slow drip of info! It makes them sweat what’s next is coming out. Glenn and Edward are living my life of comeuppance.
It BURNS. (Kee!)
Deep Inhale. Deep Exhale. Hold the Breath. Hold. Hold. Hold. Exhale a bit more. And inhale again. Reeelax
“…they’re the same folks that vote shit on American Who Wants to Marry a Dancer dumbfucks. I welcome the torturously slow drip of info!” This show kicks all those other shows asses’! There is a delectable anticipation waiting for the Intercept to post a new revelation. That’s when I jump up and shake my tail to Mellencamp’s, {clap, clap} “Hurts So Good”!
http://www.europarl.europa.eu/document/activities/cont/201403/20140307ATT80674/20140307ATT80674EN.pdf
Carl, you do realize that it was Snowden who took this document?
Dear Zelda,
In my work in the NSA archives section I come across some real treasures. This week I found a lovely Renaissance-era folio, original edition, that turns out to be a cookbook by Lucrezia Borgia (classified TOP SECRET for obvious reasons). Now, it so happens I have a pair of nuisance neighbors, Mr. and Mrs. Posthumous, and I’m thinking of having them over next week for coffee. I was thinking of serving Lucrezia’s coffee-cake recipe, “Bitter Almond Crunch.” Trouble is, would I be breaching my oath of secrecy by using this?
Livia
– – –
Dear Livia,
Only if you reprint the recipe and circulate it. If you simply make the dish, and the coroner can’t trace it back to you, it’s fine — and a lot more original than Polonium Espresso would have been. It’s good to revive true traditions in our society. Oh, and a silver coffee service goes so well on these occasions, doesn’t it?
Zelda
Coram,
Where were you last night when I was looking for meatloaf recipes?
Dear Zelda..let’s cut to the chase. When the SHTF, and it surely will the day the USG pokes a sleeping wolverine with a stick, remember this. It will rip your balls off…or for those who have none..disembowel you.
http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com/2009/08/son-you-dont-poke-wolverine-with-sharp.html
I’ve stopped myself 3x responding to the because it’s+the link are so damn funny! I got nothin’ else. Except thanks for cattle branding the graphics and sound effects that are now seared into my brain. My heart’s all aflutter with anticipation.
Some of the comments here, are over the top hilarious!
“I’ve stopped myself 3x responding to the because it’s+the link are so damn funny!”
“Some of the comments here, are over the top hilarious!”
While you may find my comment hilarious or amusing, I guarantee, the meaning is not. In fact, in regards to the sleeping wolverine, I believe the State police of Connecticut are on the verge of poking one with a sharp stick of unconstitutional law. Unfortunately, given the nature of Unintended Consequences and 4th Gen warfare, now that the list NAMES AND ADDRESS’ of the collectivists Connecticut Legislature who voted FOR this law, just may learn the definition first fucking hand…..
http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com/2014/02/a-sipsey-street-public-service.html
And now, given a Connecticut State policeman has been recorded as saying…
quote: “I cannot wait to get the order to kick your door in”unquote
http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com/2014/03/bad-ass-uniformed-thug-runs-his-mouth.html
I do believe he has given credence to their true intent. Well, Great Moments in Stupidity notwithstanding, I guess they’ve never come across a sleeping wolverine before but they’ve been warned it will rip their balls off.. only it won’t be confined to Connecticut should these halfwits poke it with a stick.
Unfortunately, some of these politicians don’t believe it….
http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com/2014/03/connecticut-politicans-inch-closer-to.html
Well, all I can say is…in that case…Molon Labe..
http://www.enterstageright.com/archive/articles/0314/0314conngun.htm
While you may find my post amusing, I assure you, it wasn’t meant to. Here is why….
http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com/2014/03/connecticut-politicans-inch-closer-to.html
http://www.examiner.com/article/vet-conn-cop-said-i-cannot-wait-to-get-the-order-to-kick-your-door-in
In that case, I guess these people never ran across a sleeping wolverine…nor heard the term Unintended Consequences…
http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com/2014/02/a-sipsey-street-public-service.html
In that case…Molon Labe!
http://www.enterstageright.com/archive/articles/0314/0314conngun.htm
@bloodypitchfork … I replied after I clicked your link. As much as the image of packs of wolverines tearing certain people apart, starting from the stubs of their ball sacks is funny, to me, the subject matter behind your link is serious. Trust me when I say I have PLEN-TY to say about the modern military-police state – that conversation seemed OT in this comment thread so I didn’t throw it on the table. If it seemed I was laughing at the message behind the link please know I was not. Just pictures in my brain. I’m sorry.
I resemble that remark!
due to the disappearing comment syndrome, this is the third time I’ve tried to post this reply to El B and CitizenSane….please excuse me. I tried every thing I could.
While you may find my post amusing, I assure you, it wasn’t meant to. Here is why….
http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com/2014/03/connecticut-politicans-inch-closer-to.html
http://www.examiner.com/article/vet-conn-cop-said-i-cannot-wait-to-get-the-order-to-kick-your-door-in
In that case, I guess these people never ran across a sleeping wolverine…nor heard the term Unintended Consequences…and it’s relationship to 4thGen warfare..or the 100heads principle…
http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com/2014/02/a-sipsey-street-public-service.html
In that case…Molon Labe!
http://www.enterstageright.com/archive/articles/0314/0314conngun.htm
No worries… they came through. I responded ^^.
Says he who only comments on articles written by others. As just a commenter myself, with the upmost respect for Glenn, Jerry. Laura, Marcy, Ryan, and Dan, I am unwilling to cast stones in their direction. They are workaholics in the truest sense. Glenn, for example, is known for tirelessly working 16-hour days. I applaud his, Laura, and Jerry’s output of articles, appearances, interviews, books, and what is likely a multitude of behind-the-curtains activities. They are all passionate journalists and among the few who are willing to write about all powerful government subversion of our privacy and freedom.
I’m willing to wait as their past performance in writing and publishing is impressive. Snowden and Glenn both have sessions at SXSW Interactive on Monday. The SXSW organization is providing Snowden’s session with a total theater seating capacity of 7600. Glenn’s is 1/4 of that and still impressive.
Snowden’s session will be live-cast with video to follow. View SXSW Interactive Festival schedules and the ACLU website for more details.
SXSW 2014: Edward Snowden to Speak at SXSW…
Mon Mar 10, 2014 12:00pm EDT — Mon Mar 10, 2014 1:00pm EDT
http://new.livestream.com/texastribune/events/2823117
You neglected to mention the other irony/hypocrisy, about noting the need to be able to criticize anonymously (understandable, since there’s so many ironic parallels already). With the government doing everything it can to remove anonymity online, and its own feedback/petition site requiring real names (as an example), it seems an apt association, and target for calling out.
C’mon. You guys can’t an’t least put out one story per day? This thread is dead. Get with it, Interderp. I expected much more.
Still my favorite video- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=60lmDCGgW9k
It’s old, but notice the electronic tentacles. That’s the NSA, folks. It knocks big assed robots over.
It’s killin’ us, also.
Enjoy/learn.
It’s been quiet for a while. Not much on Twitter. I bet they are working hard on something big.
We’ll always have the comments thread, ongoing. It’s still the same old story, but the party at Glenn’s Cafe Americain goes on.
Don’t tell them the name of the venue Coram, or we will all be droned before we have finished our pie, and coffees !
Mr. Maass,
I am curious.
We that post here, and have enjoyed this article so.
Will we get any special treatment, or be the first ones on the bus………..?
Which buses are you referring to? What a cowardly thing to say. If we allegedly think we’re in a democracy, what are you saying exactly? Fuck think suppression.
What exactly am I saying?
Apparently, humor goes right over your head.
Further, I am not living in a democracy. You might be, but I am not.
I am living in a Republic.
I’m a nobody here but from what I’ve read you’re both on the same team. You both regularly inject welcome humor and sound intelligence to the dialogue and this community. You both are fierce in how you defend this website and the content it produces. I think this is a minor misunderstanding.
For what it’s worth I thought the “bus” was tongue-in-cheek for Intercept being the first domino in media releasing details of the docs . I also see how the question might be perceived as impertinent, but I took it was more cheeky. That’s why I’m even bothering to write this – because even if I’m wrong, in general the history of comments that I’ve enjoyed from both of you leads me to believe your on the same side.
Hmmm.
Thank you. An objective viewpoint is always welcome. Sometimes it can keep a person in check. Maybe I believe too fiercely in what I believe in. I am a simpleton. Not a complicated person. I believe in good and bad, right and wrong, black and white. I believe that our Government is running amok. I believe that the inmates have taken over the asylum.
The “bus” I was referring to (and it was tongue in cheek) was the bus to take me to the airport, prior to taking off for Gitmo to be water-boarded with the rest of the special people. I do hope that Mr. Maass and Mr. Greenwald save me a seat………
I have a simple mind, too. You and I think along the same lines. Ignorance is bliss so thanks for spelling out the joke for me … I LOL’d even harder! :-) I guess I’ll have to throw away my water wings – damn! I’m sure my bus will be slower, lacking a/c and commodes, and we’ll have to push it the last ten miles.
“I do hope that Mr. Maass and Mr. Greenwald save me a seat………”
Tongue in cheek notwithstanding, I’ll defer to the 2nd Amendment..thank you. These bastards will never load ME on a bus.
if you think you are in a democracy you are delusional.the FEMA buses ? herded on using the millions of bullets purchased ?
You know Tommy, shit stirring in this mini-dialogue is bullshit. You don’t even deserve to breath the exhaust fumes from the bus you’re trying to throw @Titonwan under – let alone a bus ticket to Gitmo. It’s people like “him/her” and @CitizenSane who will liberate your sorry ass from the FEMA camp.
p.s. STFU!
I stand by every other word I said, but I regret my p.s. It was said out of anger and I apologize for it.
cyber security panel discussion with NSA director general:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0ngwIIInXc
Dear Zelda, I’m concerned about the Snowdon revelations, I’m worried my first Email to you might be published. I’m also worried that you will stop writing these articles as I find them really helpful in deciding what to do with my own clearance level within the organization. I’m glad you talked me out of leaking those documents but on reading the ones published so far on the intercept our collective conciseness here in the NSA is much less to bare now some of these things have come out. We no longer have the burden of keeping what we do secret any longer… I find my job much easier to do now, the public seem to be lapping up the various excuses set forward by various statements even including a presidential address on metadata (which went down well) . I think we no longer have to feel guilty about doing what we do to protect the american people.
Terrahawk Captain Mary Falconer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QNRzgB8PNtM
THe difference between the Intercept and the governments of the world are greater than any valley on this earth. The Intercept (and I am a journalist) will write about problems in the world, but when a clear act of terrorism occurs and the facts will come out this week, it will be the govs of this world that will try to stamp out the problem. Media will only write or whine about it. Real terror needs to be dealt with, sometimes with any means necessary. So get over the righteous indignation about the NSA. Spying is the 5th profession and has been around since the caveman. It has been used to great effect by communists, dictators. The Intercept only exists in the free world. Don’t take that for granted.
Yes, that’s why the NSA is hacking into Brazilian oil companies, why it is listening to the Phone calls of the Brazilian and German heads of state, why it is sabotaging Internet security globally, and why it is collecting phone metadata of every American.
It’s the terrorism.
Plus all that webcam sex GCHQ is keeping tabs on in order to keep us safe.
There seems to be some perception that the NSA’s mission is simply counterterrorism, when it is actually much broader.
Per its site:
The National Security Agency/Central Security Service (NSA/CSS) leads the U.S. Government in cryptology that encompasses both Signals Intelligence (SIGINT) and Information Assurance (IA) products and services, and enables Computer Network Operations (CNO) in order to gain a decision advantage for the Nation and our allies under all circumstances.
Yea the US navy now calls itself “a global force for good” on its website too so I guess we have to change the military’s mission from defending the nation to policing the world.
After all, they adopted it as their motto and it is on their website.
those lasercruisers were MADE to distribute fried McNuggets to the world’s poor.
This is what they do! join now.
January had the interesting transmediale, with Jacob and Laura each presenting material. .It’s on youtube, and you will enjoy the hardware devices that Jacob introduces in the first half of his keynote.
Did any notice the insertion into comment on another article in the intercept of real delusion? Understand that tainting conversations is an excellent strategy for painting a source as farce – it’s far better than mere disinformation or misinformation in controlling the uneducated through suggesting that a news source is paranoid schizophrenic or otherwise delusional. Kind of like the admen who are now promoting the Navy, whose active sonar destroys the major communicative and orientation sense of cetaceans.
They’ve had me bleeding through my ears for years, and I’ve beached myself to avoid them, too, those protectors of the corporate profit.
I’m certainly not suffering from any “misperception.” The mandate needs to exclude such things as hacking into Brazilian oil comapanies; snagging fone calls of the heads of state in non-enemy countries; sabotaging Internet security for the global community, and; “collecting it all,” on everyone, everywhere.
“snagging fone calls of the heads of state in non-enemy countries”
And someone should point out that unless we ever get an actual declaration of war, they’re ALL non-enemy countries.
I never said you were, -Mona-
And learn how to appropriately use quotation marks.
US politicians bear much of the blame for this misconception. Fortunately, the Snowden documents have revealed that counterterrorism, as you state, is a only a small part of the NSA’s mission. As the PR part, it must still be considered important, but some much more significant programs are:
Undermining encryption technology
The NSA participates in many committees which develop encryption standards. Snowden’s documents indicate they have successfully weakened a number of encryption schemes on which internet commerce depends. Internet commerce is a nefarious activity and hopefully if enough hackers can take advantage of these weakened encryption standards, the NSA will succeed in killing it.
Spying on climate change conferences
Whether the world is actually heating or cooling is immaterial. In either case, the solution is obvious – burn more fossil fuels. The NSA is therefore committed to spying on these conferences, in order to pre-empt any measures that radical delegates might propose – such as energy conservation or using alternative fuel sources.
Spying on Ministries of Natural Resources
Many countries, such as Brazil, tend to favor their own oil industry when it comes to exploitation of their natural resources. But these firms contribute relatively little campaign financing to US politicians. American energy companies on the other hand, are incredibly generous at donating funds to US politicians. It is clear that the very least the NSA can do, is provide these companies with information about upcoming oil lease auctions and mineral exploration data.
Spying on Angel Merkel and Other World Leaders
This doesn’t actually produce any useful intelligence, since those leaders simply follow US instructions anyway. But for some reason US politicians like to know which ones are following instructions enthusiastically and which are following more reluctantly. This is really a distinction without a difference, but it is worthwhile for the NSA to humor American politicians. After all, they turn a blind eye to everything the NSA does, so the NSA owes them a favor.
Mass Surveillance
This is another activity which actually serves no useful purpose, since collecting the meaningless details of billions of people’s meaningless lives is just a make work activity. But psychologists tell us that knowing about this surveillance will cause people to be on their best behavior. The NSA asked Edward Snowden to release documents, in order to test this hypothesis. So while these people don’t have the capacity to actually affect anything, there is still an argument in favor of a hard working, compliant domestic pool of labor. With offshoring and robotics, some argue this may no longer be necessary, but collecting all this data poses an interesting technical challenge and a rationale for increasing the NSA’s budget.
So now that the full extent of these secret programs has been revealed, it is clear the NSA’s popularity will sharply increase.
Yes James, please don’t feel the need to offer us any further explanations as we all feel so safe, and secure knowing that this total, mass surveillance system has been so effective in protecting us. Oklahoma, 911, Boston, and the prevention of possible terrorists with false passports boarding planes. We all appreciate that a great job is being done, and it seems well worth giving up our privacy so that we can all sleep better at night knowing we are much safer from terrorist attacks. We did appreciate the presidential address on metadata, and the Yahoo webcam revelations only served to re-assure us further. Its evident that you boys at the NSA and GCHQ, are doing wonderful work, and we hope that more of our money as taxpayers will be invested in spying on these terrorist organisations which you call ” foreign corporations” and that this work will protect us even more..Words cannot express just how grateful we are, and we are thinking of awarding Terrahawk Captain Mary Falconer some purple hearts in recognition of these achievements.
“Real terror needs to be dealt with, sometimes with any means necessary.”
And as much as Camau argued that Suicide is the only real philosophical problem,
Today, I would posit, that the question might be what is “Terrorism”?
Is it the torture and murder and incarceration of innocent minorities around the world, or attacking the profits of a corporation “exploiting” “natural” resources, or ignoring the “externalities” of business?
While many of us share a deep horror of any loss of life (or any trauma), it is increasingly hard not to see a connection between “governments” actions, and the tragedies that the general populace may suffer.
There is a connection that we ignore and dare I say, externalize, in our equation of what is Terrorism and what is “National Defense”, or even, moral, human behavior.
I wish I could feel and “know” it in the simplistic back and white of a Presidential Address. . . .
“Real terror needs to be dealt with, sometimes with any means necessary.”
Is that your takeaway on what Intercept is doing? Um… ok. If that’s what you think the Intercept is doing then you’re entitled to your opinion. It’s off topic but do you mind if I to ask a few questions,? I’m not a journalist but it’s been a valuable learning tool for me. So I ask, what would you do if you had a source that suspected, claimed to have knowledge of, or had evidence that your own government was manufacturing terror and propaganda? And what if that propaganda was used to justify false flag ops to support the baseless and/or unwarranted invasions of innocent sovereign nations? And what if those people used such brute force it resulted in the loss of hundreds of thousands of lives? And what if that propaganda plastered those faces up as poster children to celebrate or mourn their death? And what if even one, if not many, of those very deaths – just so happened to be –your parent, sibling, child, loved one, neighbor, friend, countryman, or unknown citizen of your ancestral homeland? Or what if any one of those people were complicit in one, several, or all of those acts, with the government? And what if those acts were all a means to an end? And what if that end was to conquer and enslave indigenous peoples to control their natural resources? And what if the means were meant to serve their insatiable greed, political, and military ambitions? And what if discovering any one of these scenarios to be true meant sifting through thousand upon thousands of pieces of a jigsaw puzzle? As a journalist, where and when might you start telling that story?
I freely admit to have no knowledge that any of such conspiracy. But if it was happening – it wouldn’t be the first time in history that it had. Our continent and gold are proof enough of that. But my burning curiosity is, specifically, what would YOU do? Would you work on the puzzle until it was complete, and write the entire story A to Z in chronological order? Or would you start publishing little vignettes of truths based on evidence, perhaps eluding to other partially vetted but still incomplete story(ies) in the pipeline? And what if your proven published reports resulted in critics attacking not only the evidence – the means by which you received it – the conditions you made and honor before publishing it – your character – and even your lifestyle? And what if some of those critics were members of your own profession (maybe even former colleagues) who should know better? And what if the most powerful criticism, denials, and intimidation were being collectively used to silence everyone surrounding your reports? And what if those powers are being used perpetuate old and fabricate new conspiracies just to confuse and influence the rest of us all? And what if, all the while, they were furiously re-writing the constitution so they can silence or bury you, your source, your story, your evidence, and fellow journalists? How would you deal with the reality of THAT terror? And what if it all started because someone *might* get caught, red handed, manufacturing the illusion of terror that started all of this in the first place?
I apologize that I failed to be more succinct with my questions. I’m no English major, as I have no doubt my grammar and punctuation skills also prove. I’m just your average, ordinary citizen who sees and reads and asks people about about stuff. That’s why I defer to you, as a journalist. How would you write that story? What would be your timeline and method be of telling a story like that?
“Media will only write or whine about it.” That’s an interesting choice of words coming from someone who claims journalism as their profession. Since I know for a fact that media does play role in so-called “writing” journalism, but who is the “real” author? I also know, for a fact, they have 100% control of how it’s “portrayed” on their airwaves. Not the so-called journalists who sign employment contracts – trading pesky journalistic ethics for a paycheck – then whine about it. Let’s assume you aren’t one of “those” journalists. (Heaven forbid) How would you publish or report on that story? Or are you one of those anti righteous-indignation journalists who would sit on the entire story just to buy enough time to negotiate the movie rights? Who are the “real” journalists, spies, and cavemen and who are the terrorists? And who are the posers? Inquiring minds would like to know.
Thanks for sharing your perspective – very well articulated.
“any means necessary” was Bush, Cheney, Rumsfield, Yoo, and others justification for Torture, “black sites”, rendition, secret this and secret that, and a multitude of actions that are the essence of evil. Reminds me of the Spanish Inquisition, burning witches at the stake, and other horrible actions taken by misinformed but powerful forces during the Dark Ages and the century that followed.
@Jim… I actually wrote a response to your comment yesterday in which you offered some spare brain cells to folks at the NSA … it’s posted there so I don’t go off topic here.
I severely lack the measure of wit, stealth, and cutting power to do it quicker like so many on this site do. I’m not ashamed to admit that I’ve learned more than I could ever hope to pass along. Thanks you for reading my long comment above. I read yours and I like the perspectives you share regularly, too.
@James Grundvig
The 1st profession is generally conceded, although I’m not sure of the actual evidence to back it up. Politicians must be the 2nd profession, soldiers the 3rd and reporters (storytellers) the 4th. This is a sad reflection on the professions.
This is not actually an overwhelmingly favorable endorsement of spying, imho.
One of the editors of The Intercept lives in Berlin, another in Rio de Janeiro. Both would risk arrest for journalism if they were to enter the United States. I also hope they don’t take the freedom which still exists in countries such as Germany and Brazil for granted. As the US shows, freedom can be lost very easily, without even any public announcement of the fact.
Let’s take a look at the numbers in fighting “real terror”.
500 Billion Dollars budgeted to the national security agencies since 2001, 52 Billion budgeted just last year (2013). One substantiated case of catching/stopping a “terrorist”, a taxicab driver who transferred $8500 to Somalia.
Let’s look at the cost of two wars since 2001 – estimated at 3 Trillion Dollars when medical costs of treating just our returning soldiers for their lifetimes. We did kill Osama and Saddam is gone. Expert assessment is that our wars who killed and are still killing many innocents have created many more “terrorists”. We also failed miserably in establishing a democratic government in each case. Who would have thought?
So, spending 3.5 Trillion dollars in a dozen years has resulted in more “terrorists” than before, the loss of privacy for the whole world (NSA/GCHQ mass surveillance programs), and a USA whose Constitution is in shatters with secret laws, secret courts, sealed trials, and the jailing of truth tellers when the war criminals (Torturers, drone assassins, …) walk free.
“Any means possible” looks like a sure loser when I examine the numbers.
James Grundvig wrote “… and I am a journalist …”
James gives a great example of the approach that dominates the mainstream press, and shows why The Intercept is such an oasis in this journalistic desert. How did we get to this point, when a journalist would be sucking up the terrorism myth, hook, line and sinker, and referring to the media as whiners who should just butt out of the government’s illegal secret business?
By ‘terrorism myth’, I mean the myth that all these US wars are an attempt to end terrorism. Either your leaders’ heads are full of cheese, or they are perfectly aware that everything they are doing is promoting terrorism, and hardly preventing it. That’s a good thing for them, because it gives them a continued pretext for aggressively grabbing more and more economic, military and political power around the world — especially where there’s oil. A journalist’s job is critical investigation, not government PR.
“Real terror needs to be dealt with, sometimes with any means necessary.” The ‘means’ that the US is using to deal with ‘terror’ involves terrorism, torture and massive loss of civilian life. Look at the death squads the US war-mongers unleashed in Iraq, which have been primarily responsible for the horrendous civil war that has now erupted there. Having done exactly the same thing in El Salvador and numerous other South American nations, they knew exactly what the result would be. All this supposedly to combat ‘terror’, when all along they were lying through their teeth. They knew Hussein didn’t have ties with Al Qaeda. They knew he didn’t have weapons of mass destruction. And they knew he had oil and wasn’t going to sell it exclusively for US dollars.
The public are supposed to learn from journalists. If journalists make no attempt to learn, where does that leave us?
ACLU American Civil Liberties Union Time to rein in the surveillance state
https://www.aclu.org/time-rein-surveillance-state-0
Dear Zelda,
I work in the NSA’s online games division. Since publication of the Snowden documents, my friends give me a hard time about being paid to play online games all day. But struggling to contain and limit the violence within these games so that it doesn’t break out into the real world, is hard work. People scoff at this, but Baltimore has never been attacked by a band of Orcs – so I must be doing something right.
How can I recapture that feeling of being a great SigINT warrior?
Sincerely, Mighty ‘Tater
Dear MT, The online games devisions work is greatly appreciated here at the NSA and i’m sorry to hear your friends are giving you a hard time. Containing violence is what the NSA is all about, you are right to make the connection with real world where the publics online engagement of any form has the potential to spill out and affect the American peoples security at large. Recapturing the feeling that we all at one time or another loose (which ever division we are serving in) can be gained in looking at the NSA as a whole where each band of sigINT warrior does his or her bit to protect the nation.
I’m glad you mentioned Snowdon’s revelations as I get allot of mail about this subject, sometimes I wonder had he written to me explaining his desire to leak NSA documents I could have been able to talk him out of it. Snowdon has alerted the world to how we operate here at the NSA now all MY friends and colleges refer to me as Zelda so imagine how I feel… so much for a pen name!
Zelda
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Kc5Xvr24Aw
Dear Tater Tot,
I’m sorry you’re feeling so insecure in your role and future here at the NSA. It sounds like your bored with our on-going training and discouraged by your lack of upward mobility. It must be frustrating. It may not feel like it but these games, though they may appear insignificant on the surface, make a big difference in the safety and security of our world. There are real people behind your screen, who are served well and protected by your game play. It’s your talent that we chose you as one of our gamers. If you’re dissatisfied with your current position you hold the power to change your situation. You’ve come to the right place. The key is two-way communication.
I recommend using some of your personal time to draft an outline bullet-pointing your incremental games scores, the timeline in their advancement, percentages, maximum level reached, and your future career goals. Then schedule a sit-down with your supervisor to discuss. Their feedback may enlighten you to areas of improvement you may have been previously unaware of. In the mean time buckle down and apply those recommendations daily. Your tenacity and concentration will not go unnoticed, and it’s bound to improve your percentages and lead to new levels of play. The key is two-way communication.
Spend more time building camaraderie within your department for support. Go to lunch with colleagues. Ask questions. Take notes. Use a recorder. Take selfies. Then start networking outside your department and repeat the process. Encounter the farpoint – Your path and everyone you meet on the way hold the key to the destination you are seeking and to conquer your goals the devil is in the details. The key is two-way communication.
Hang in there, little buddy. Even warriors get the blues, sometimes. It’s how fast they rise up in the heat of battle that separates the spuds from the duds. It’s not what you are – it’s how you apply yourself. You weren’t even peeled once, let alone mashed … but look at you now! I wouldn’t be surprised if the next time we met you were scalloped, disco fries, or even a fully loaded. Only -you- limit your potential. A true warrior never gives up – and the NSA will never give up on you. The key is two-way communication.
May you live long and prosper,
Zelda
p.s. I’ve forwarded a WWZD rubber bracelet and FOZ T-shirt. I hope is helps as a life force and armour in your quest.
https://firstlook.org/theintercept/document/2014/03/07/an-interview-with-zelda/
Dear Zelda,
Thank you so very, very much; that was a mashing answer. I realize I’m just a small fry, but you took the time to respond and butter me up. So I immediately reported to my boss, Dick ‘Tater, and volunteered to keep my eyes peeled. You are a real Facili ‘Tater.
Sincerely, Mighty Once More
Dear Mighty,
Seeeeeeee? I new it was just a matter of two-way communication. You’re really going places! I’ve got my eye on you, mister!
Well played,
Zelda ;-)
Just on this thing about non appearing posts.
I made a post and it has still to appear.
After that post I made a reply to a comment and that has appeared.
Now time is of the essence in retort and the delay takes that feeling of spontaneity and replaces it with timelessness.
It can not be from moderation for I have been sober (well I am not drinking but a dry drunk may not be sober for some time. Nothing more pathetic than a dry drunk). Nothing harsh or remotely controversial was present.
This is becoming a concern for me.
I have refreshed till I am squeaky clean and the post pre-existed my reply that has shown.
This is happening at a rate greater than would be expected for random error.
……
I have found this article to be one of the best for promoting humourous comments.
Well done Intercept.
Well done Mr Maas.
…
P.S. I must thank Mr Owens for the tip on enlarging the comment writing box.
Thanks Bill.
The Dalai Lama said that if you speak or act with a pure mind, happiness will follow. Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid thanked the Dalai Lama for his prayers and words of encouragement.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xdpkP3wohvA&feature=player_embedded#at=91
How many years can some people exist,
Before they’re allowed to be free?
Privacy is the self time, all humans need to be creative, independent and healthy. Without privacy, under the State stare of the unblinking eye, “I”s dissappear. No longer an “I’ all become “we”. This is the opposite of freedom for the individual and the enforced compliance by individuals en masse to the State by observance of the State’s imposed doctrine. All must be the same, all must seem the same, all must indeed be seen the same as the State requires.
The State is not the collective sum of all its humanity but the division of wide and varying individuals. The State should be the means, by which, an individual can be able to achieve his self fulfillness.. The State, if there for the people, should be assisting in the particular needs of the individuals to be independent. This does not weaken the State.
America does not trust its citizens. America places its trust in surveillance and the heavy handed illegal harashment of “show trial” individuals for being “different” America the land of the freely disempowered.
….
Somebody stop me before I fall from this soap box.
……………
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0Q5JFHrGNk
I’m an Individual. Mark Jackson
http://www.lyricsforsong.net/lyrics/jacko-i-m-an-individual-lyrics_knlnrm.html
Jacko was “Everready” to show his unique beauty.
For those that don’t know, a full forward in AFL (Australian Football League) is a player that must be pretty physical, fuck mate, he has to be tough.
Many would argue that there was nothing “pretty” about Jacko.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uN6rSsoKY0w
Australia’s Toothless, Tactless Jacko, a Jock Who’s Energized to Plug Batteries—and Himself
But he was himself.
At the end of the day if we can say,
We were ourselves and liked it that way,
Then we are I and so to hell can fly
All that dismiss our self proclaimed high.
That was awesome! I remember that Energizer commercial.
Fun guy, looks like from the interview…sort of the Eric Byrnes/Kevin Millar type.
Perhaps its time to play the greatest protest song ever
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UB5XoBjSoP8
” masters of war”…..bob dylan.
The times they are a changing, Bob Dylan
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QqvUz0HrNKY
Lol, Mr. Pitchfork. The crab in that dude’s pants clearly represents James Clapper.
Call me nostalgic, but I prefered when national security was left to Rocky and Bullwinkle and General Peachfuzz at the Pentagon.
I was on Boris Baddenoff and Natasha’s side comrade.
The Squirrel was just to good to be true. I did have a soft spot for the Moose
Don’t ask about Rodger Ramjet and the American Eagles, and please, dont mention the proton pills.
I know where you are coming from and Boris in his cowboy disquise was priceless. Even back then they were taking the piss out of the establishment. Just a question. Was Ramjets’ arch enemy Noodles Romanoff and relation to comrade Boris.??
Commander McBragg FTW.
While thinking about this blog and the whole Edward Snowden affair in general, this bit of script from Easy Rider popped into my head. Can’t sum things up better than this:
George Hanson: You know, this used to be a helluva good country. I can’t understand what’s gone wrong with it.
Billy: Man, everybody got chicken, that’s what happened. Hey, we can’t even get into like, a second-rate hotel, I mean, a second-rate motel, you dig? They think we’re gonna cut their throat or somethin’. They’re scared, man.
George Hanson: They’re not scared of you. They’re scared of what you represent to ’em.
Billy: Hey, man. All we represent to them, man, is somebody who needs a haircut.
George Hanson: Oh, no. What you represent to them is freedom.
Billy: What the hell is wrong with freedom? That’s what it’s all about.
George Hanson: Oh, yeah, that’s right. That’s what’s it’s all about, all right. But talkin’ about it and bein’ it, that’s two different things. I mean, it’s real hard to be free when you are bought and sold in the marketplace. Of course, don’t ever tell anybody that they’re not free, ’cause then they’re gonna get real busy killin’ and maimin’ to prove to you that they are. Oh, yeah, they’re gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom. But they see a free individual, it’s gonna scare ’em.
Billy: Well, it don’t make ’em runnin’ scared.
George Hanson: No, it makes ’em dangerous. Buh, neh! Neh! Neh! Neh! Swamp!
From Easy Rider – 1969
Screenplay by Peter Fonda, Dennis Hopper, and Terry Southern.
Performances by Toni Basil, Karen Black, Peter Fonda, Dennis Hopper, and Jack Nicholson.
DVD Set. Criterion Collection – America Lost and Found: The BBS Story
Snowden, posting as TheTrueHOOHA on Ars Technica in 2009:
TheTrueHOOHA: HOLY SHIT
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/11/washington/11iran.html?_r=1&hp
TheTrueHOOHA: WTF NYTIMES
TheTrueHOOHA: Are they TRYING to start a war?
Jesus christ
they’re like wikileaks
User19: they’re just reporting, dude.
TheTrueHOOHA: They’re reporting classified shit
User19: shrugs
TheTrueHOOHA: about an unpopular country surrounded by enemies already engaged in a war
and about our interactions with said country regarding planning sovereignity violations of another country
you don’t put that shit in the NEWSPAPER
User19: meh
TheTrueHOOHA: moreover, who the fuck are the anonymous sources telling them this?
TheTrueHOOHA: those people should be shot in the balls.
Read the whole thing
http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2013/06/exclusive-in-2009-ed-snowden-said-leakers-should-be-shot-then-he-became-one/3/
Most readers here are familiar with Ed Snowden’s prior beliefs as he wrote them at Ars Technica. Then, he found himself immersed in governmental wrongdoing and understood why whistleblowing can be critically important, and absolutely patriotic.
He’s older and wiser now than he was as a brash mid-20s kid spewing at AT.
Mona, Death to Traitors dropped, fully formed and actualized straight from his/her mother’s cloaca. No need to grow, develop a philosophy – easier when you soak up everything that drips from the ass of authoritarians.
Critters like DtT (sounds like a pesticide, don’t it?) have no use for people who actually think. No empathy, so altering thought based on facts simply does not exist. Sorta sad.
Anyone who uses the tagline “Death to ‘Taters” should not be taken seriously.
I am not going to look up “cloaca.” I don’t want to know.
I have no use for trolls who have no facts or arguments, just trash talk.
I always find it ironic when trolls troll on comment boards that are polar opposite to the opinions they post. Especially when they *need* facts to *discredit* their assertions. Then get huffy about getting “trolled”! (Sounds a little like the USG, NSA, CIA, etc… – if you know what I mean!) :-/
Still, it’s fascinating to observe sometimes. Like going to the zoo and watching monkey’s. At first they seem cute and all – until one picks their butt then smells their fingers.
For crying out loud @DtT – if you want to find a huge audience that will appreciate your prolific prose, might I suggest Google. Just type “Snowden traitor” in the little box and hit enter. Follow your nose. Pick any site from that list and click. (Hurry though-I hear their numbers are dwindling). Repeat that process until you find one you like – then you can start commenting among your esteemed peers. They may even give you the validation and applause you so desperately seek. To do otherwise, on this site makes it appear as if you’re picking a fight – which is just pitiful. :-( Now, please do yourself a favor and go scratch that itch. It must be burning by now.
You’d like that wouldn’t you, to cleanse the site of any opposing arguments and inconvenient facts so you can go back to patting each other on the back and tilting at windmills.
@DtT … “You’d like that wouldn’t you, to cleanse the site of any opposing arguments and inconvenient facts”
Duh! But I hardly doubt I’m alone. And honey, it’s not because we’re all “jealous” of you either. We’re just prettier, that’s all.
Lemme break this down. I enjoy facts. Facts are good. Debate is healthy. I can’t possibly thank enough people on this site for teaching me something new every day – but I sure as shit apologize when I know I’m wrong. But you’re out of your league with me by pretending that you are presenting “inconvenient facts”!
So now that I have your attention, it’s my turn to share a few inconvenient truths about YOU. In the time you’ve fouled our air on this board with the putrid stench of your “facts” (supported by links, smoke signals, shadow puppets, and reflective orange pylons) they have consisted of nothing but a long rant of allegations, accusations, character assassinations, implied racial slurs, and “White House sources” taking short breaks to piss yourself, eat Cheetos with ranch dressing, and snort bacon salt. And in every challenge to your “so-called” facts your reply has amounted to nothing more than hissyfits of “I know you are but what am I?”. In fact, I challenge YOU to find even one reply to any one of your glottal stops posted anywhere on this page. Oh, that’s right – there isn’t one. BTW – Don’t get back to me on that.
That’s why I offered the suggestion of inviting you to seek –your- own journalistic-wannabe obsession in the first place. So you could some place on this lonely (for you) planet that might offer a haven and a shred of hope for some measure of happiness. This site seems to be ruining your day – everyday – and you just keep going on and on…
Listen young grasshopper. I could wax on and on and on (like a troll boss-lady from your hell) in poems and soft-rock ballads lamenting all the sad, little reasons that might explain a your profile in the DSM. But instead, I’ll break it to you gently – wax off. And the next time you hear from me, it will be in your sweet, sweet dreams. Like a Lulla-bye~
It actually demonstrates intellectual integrity to be able to change your mind in the face of new evidence.
Whatever he did in ’07 is irrelevant . In ’13 he was courageous to do what he did it the way that he did it, and it showed nobility. Hell! – for all we know, Edward was yankin’ their chain back then to throw them off his scent. We have no idea how long he’s been aware of this activity or how far back his documents go. And neither does the government. If anyone is “furious” of Snowden’s geography maybe they should worry that some his good character/ninja stealth might rub off on Putin – that could happen without so much as a sneeze or peeksy at a single document he took.
Know what would be more ironic than a spy agency’s advice columnist encouraging collaboration and trust, as most organizations do?
A media organization like First Look Media or the Guardian monitoring its employees’ computers and emails, as most employers do. After all, journalists operate a lot like spies, recruiting sources, acting on tips, going so far as to bribe police and hack phones in the U.K., only not to protect lives but for ratings.
behold the battlefront of Milprop maligancy.
Make that a perineal abscess draining from the USG’s stinking groin
Actually most employers don’t spy on their employees emails, and computers. Most have a better understanding of their employees rights to privacy, and have trust in people. This is a good thing since it helps ensure that society does not slip completely into a military minded, police state. You are right though to bring up the bribing of police and hacking phones which it has been alleged was done by part of the mass media that has regularly pumped out the Governments propaganda. I am yet to see any evidence that The Intercept has been involved in the activities which you mention, but if you have evidence then why not present it.
Back in 2007, 66% of surveyed employers monitored Internet connections; 43% monitored e-mail; 45% tracked content, keystrokes, and time spent at the keyboard; 43% stored and reviewed computer files. The percentages are probably higher by now.
http://press.amanet.org/press-releases/177/2007-electronic-monitoring-surveillance-survey/
The Intercept is involved in aiding the enemy by publishing stolen classified documents, which is worse than all the other stuff. At least it doesn’t sell ads yet, thanks to the $250 million contribution from the Iranian guy.
As Edward Snowden eloquently explained in his testimony to the EU parliament, the biggest success the suspicion-less surveillance system can claim, in all of its history, was finding a taxi driver in Los Angeles who transferred $8500 to Somalia. That came out in the report from the White House’s Privacy and Civil Liberties Oversight Board.
Your evidence-free assertions about helping enemies and whatnot is, frankly, laughable.
The privacy board only analyzed the Section 215 domestic metadata collection program, the White House rejected its findings, and in Annex A of the board’s report, board member Rachel Brand stated, “I disagree with much of the Report’s discussion and some of its recommendations… Evidence suggests that if the data from the Section 215 program had been available prior to the attacks of September 11, 2001, it could have been instrumental in preventing those attacks.”
The idea that publishing sources and methods of gathering intelligence on terrorists and other enemies doesn’t aid them is laughable. The Intercept’s piece on drones even states that terrorists “are increasingly aware of the NSA’s reliance on geolocating, and have moved to thwart the tactic.”
oh, and btw fuckface, when the SHTF, I hope you understand the Law of Unintended Consequences will fall squarely in your lap.
Yea, that’s exactly the same thing. Why didn’t we think of that? Investigative journalism vs. governments having the power to follow every personal on the planet at all times, in addition to other powers they can exercise based on that data. Brilliant.
@Death to Traitors
I am not sure whether you are just supercilious or also a super-silly-ass, but in either case you sound very Talibanesque with that name. Most Al Queda terror training manuals have your name as page headers, so you may want to call yourself by some other name before someone sends a drone up your super-silly-thing.
You mean “super-silly-sphyncter” ! Sanity lost again laughing, the ghost of MacBeth, the jinn of Aladin
This is a fraudulent attempt to hijack my style and sanity. If the Mod here is doing this, then Glenn’s hired GCHQ to do his Milgramming for US. It doesn’t hurt, you get that, right, sociopath? I’m screaming because I LIKE IT!
Any thespian worth their tart knows NOT to say that tragic thane’s NAME! Hope you have spare karma, Milgram.
“…. We work in an Agency of secrets, but this kind of secrecy begets more secrecy and it becomes a downward spiral that destroys teamwork. What if you put an end to all the secrecy by bringing it out in the open?”
Thanks for that belly laugh, I needed this after a good and pleasant day. Hahaha
Welcome to the Irony Coast.
“Welcome to the Irony Coast.” Just spit coffee out my nose. Literally! The wordplay and dialogue of almost every comment posted here is top notch. Thanks – now I have to clean up this mess!
not to make light of..but reinforce thoughts of liberty..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-cyKRNCWZN8
Sorry, I have nothing to contribute via this comment – I am merely testing the system.
The only other prior comment I submit was not posted and I am curious as to why.
Refresh your link to the Intercept from a fresh opening of your browser. I don’t know why, but it seems to work for me.
I’m in chrome and I’ve noticed that once I post a reply the hyperlink to that page changes. It changes it to a the url + a comment# … rather than just the original url. Sometimes it hiccups like that so I either have to either edit the link, removing everything past the last “/” (deleting the comment #), or I have to go to the Intercept landing page and re-enter the page through the front door. To avoid that I try to scroll up to the top of the page and monitor the quote bubble. When I refresh, if it increases by one, then my comment is usually posted. But other times, no matter what I do, my post is slow – but shows up eventually. I’m not a tekkie so I apologize for my clunky explanation. I hope this makes sense.
Bill Wolfe the first post is held for a short period to verify something or the other, afterwards your posts will show instantly as has been my experience.
I think holding the first comment is to capture commercial spam accts — since there is no registration process yet.
Subsequent comments often take awhile to show up, and can even disappear, only to then reappear. It’s some sort of tech issue that I understand is being worked on.
one might think that stolen passports would be on a data base, automatically checked.
no visa for China ?
no problem if you have intention of blowing plane up !
Look, among any group of jet-set travelers numbering 200 or more you might get some fake passports, probably some dicey business deals or smuggled currency or God knows what. Haven’t you ever read Arthur Hailey’s novels about airports and hotels and stuff?
today, with no fly lists, you would think that as your passport is being checked, and was reported stolen, that bells would ring…….
hailey’s novels were pre data bases..
not fake passports, stolen passports. big difference.
stolen was reported…not creating new entity .
“Haven’t you ever read Arthur Hailey’s novels about airports and hotels and stuff?”
You must be really bored tonight.
@coram nobis… I was wrong.. it was me who was bored.
WTF ?
I’m just trying to suggest that the passports may be moot. Whatever intrigue they suggest may not have to do with mechanical failure or wind shear or whatever may have happened. We don’t know yet. And a Malaysian airliner and Malaysian airport security may not be up to the high standards exhibited by our, you know, TSA.
They were on the computer, definitely for the Austrian guy. Why Kuala Lumpur did not pick that up is not known yet. Mistake, maybe hackers?
No system is foold proof. Russia did warn about the Boston Bombers, but nobody was paying attention in the US.
I think it’s a Deplorable and Outrageous for the headlines to start willy-nilly splashing up words like “TERRORISM” and “BOMB” with their caps on lock – every damn time something awful happens. This was a heartbreakingly horrible catastrophe – whatever it was. And he FACT is – the cause of the crash remains unknown. They know that there were a handful of stolen passports used by unknown individuals to travel aboard that aircraft … and that the airports themselves were lapse in their security procedures when verifying those travel documents. They know that many lives were lost and that many, many devastated families are suffering their very own, top-of-the-list “worst case scenario” imaginable. Maybe they could TRY to conduct themselves with a little dignity, tact and professionalism and extend a little compassion and be responsible with how they present the KNOWN facts when they hold their press conferences BEFORE they shout their baseless and presumptive “suspicions” from every rooftop -freaking the fuck out of everybody – and ending the inteview with condolences rubber stamped on a form letter!
Was this terrorism? We don’t know! Were those passports used by a family of refugees that bought the stolen passports on the black market to emigrate illegally? We don’t know! Did the the length of time from their last communication to the wreckage have any correlation with each other? We don’t know! Could this be a similar case to what felled Payne Stewart’s plane? We don’t know! (Does catastrophic cabin depressurization happen causing hypoxia and similar scenarios happen? uh -YES!) Could it have been a false flag operation on the part of the US or another country? We don’t know! WAS IT SNAKES ON A PLANE??? WE DON’T KNOW!!!! All we know is that they don’t know shit … they know it … we know it … they know we know it!
The way they throw around the word “terror” – it’s ??? AS IF ??? they’re trying to desensitize every earthling from here to Mars to accept that word … Just so they follow it up and with a syringe filled with “fear”. Then, after our inoculation, maybe we’ll all hold hands and cozy up to the safety and protection of a military-police state … and when we * finally * feel * secure * we’ll all just sit back, relax, and enjoy the ride. I call Bullshit.
Meanwhile, the massive international propaganda machine continues apace with its evidence-free smears.
http://www.cnn.com/2014/03/07/politics/snowden-leaks-russia/index.html?hpt=hp_c2
ya mean like this…..”Military spy chief: Have to assume Russia knows U.S. secrets”
Yes, military spy chief assimilates that which every concerned human on the face of the planet already knows, and has known for the last 8 months, thank you Edward notwithstanding. Now..reach down and touch your shoes so you can recalibrate your understanding of gravity.
sheeezus… if it weren’t for
I continue to be amazed at the unsupported and self-serving proclamations of the NSA,, GCHQ, and their beholden supporters. I’m over 70 but I can spare them a few brain cells so they will smarten up enough to realize that their propagandizing of falsehoods, such as Russia and China having everything Snowden copied, is as much a fantasy as the tooth fairy.
All their proclamations come without a shred of evidence of their imaginings. It seems most of those spewing lies about Snowden never got past their “terrible twos”. Clapper, Rogers, Feinstein. Alexander, heck, the list is too long to waste my time listing them. These are the ones with the most invites to MSM talk shows? Are we now living in a parallel universe lead by “stupids”? WTF!
It’s gotten to the point where they fabricate serious accusations with zero basis in reality and then publish it as news. “Just asking questions, folks.” Yea, I’d like to know when Clapper stopped beating his wife.
@Jim…If only brain cells could be transplanted like kidneys, or hearts – to improve the minimum i.q. levels to meet a standard of common sense. They could use some empathy and guilt cells too. I have plenty of those to spare if they want ‘em. Frankly – these asshats should have a license to think!
I laugh every time I hear them use the phrase, “worst case scenario”. How does their version of a WCS relate in any way to what my, or anyone elses version WCS is? It’s insulting and deplorable the way they inject more terror into the conversation based solely on a complete LACK of knowledge? This is the lynchpin in our nation’s Intelligence Community? Who’s on first. What’s on second. I Don’t Know’s on third. These asshats are taking the piss out of Abbott & Costello!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J_gSWTQKE-0
AS IF I truly believe that *their* WCS is Putin getting ahold of their power points and blue prints! (Because they don’t know that he doesn’t have them) When they’re also juggling that they don’t even know waht they don’t know – and they know it about the Snowden docs. (Again, the *not* knowing)!! It reminds me of that Friends episode, The One Where Everybody Finds Out: “They don’t know that we know they know we know. And you can’t tell ‘em!” What is this fuckery? At the rate their multiplying the double negatives into their logic NSA strategies in terms of modern linguistics the NSA has calculated pi! Their fear validates their terror and I choose to believe the real WCS for them is for us to see how they do what they do best and and sadly, for them, and my BCS kicks their WSC’s ass! (ba-dum-bump, chhh!)
If I had to venture a guess – They HAVE TO recycle some stale propaganda on trumped up charges to resurrect a pissing match in Snowden’s new neighborhood – and TRY to pass it off as their WCS – just to buy time. Time for what you ask? Well, I suppose that’s somebody else’s WCS. Is there a way to send pre-condolences? The terror that some families must be feeling is so very sad for me. I am so sorry for them.
But any one of the my many heart wrenching and cataclysmic visions of WCS’s that are firing the neurons in my feeble mind don’t hold a candle to the paranoia feeding the fireworks going off in nether regions of their cerebral cortex while they furiously stab ice picks in their ears out to silence the tune of Taps playing on a loop. I’d gladly give them all my brain cells just so they know how to use their ice picks properly!
They have to keep pumping out the putrid nausea, keep repeating the lies enough times from all their channels and eventually they think we will all believe it. Its called mind control and perception management of the masses.
“We really don’t know” what Snowden’s got, Flynn said, adding that “we have to assume the worst case and then begin to make some recommendations to our leadership about how do we mitigate some of the risks that may come from what may have been compromised.”
Would you prefer that they take Snowden at his word and assume the best case, also without any evidence for it? It would be the easier thing to do.
Let’s see what “responding to the worst case” might entail.
First of all, how many and which documents did Snowden copy? “We really don’t know” Flynn said. “Snowden may also have copied our war plans”. I guess this means that the NSA has swept up the military war plans as part of their mass surveillance of everything. Since Mike Rogers claims the number of documents taken is 1,700,000, putting together worse case recommendations looks like lifetime job security for 100s of NSA employees, whose current jobs, naturally, will have to filled with new hires.
A better response, in my view, would be, with 1.7 million documents suspected to be in “enemy” hands, to come clean and un classify everything, stop the unConstitution mass surveillance programs, and go back to targeting just terrorists. Quit targeting everybody in the world. Psychologists say that coming clean revitalizes the body and soul. What a joyful salvation for NSA employees.
It would be a joyful salvation for the FSB, Al Qaeda, Iran, and every other enemy of the United States, useful idiot. Do you want Americans to die, is that it?
The NSA is administered by the Department of Defense; it has access to U.S. war plans. The NSA would rather devote resources to protecting Americans and monitoring hot spots like Ukraine than fixing the Snowden clusterfuck and shutting down existing programs that may be compromised.
But if you know how to “target just terrorists” who hide among the general population and use the same means of communications as the population, then by all means, tell the NSA, you’ll be a hero.
I wonder why CNN chose not to include this in their report: “I would also add, for the record, that the United States government has repeatedly acknowledged that there is no evidence at all of any relationship between myself and the Russian intelligence service.”–Edward Snowden, from a written statement to EU Parliment a few days ago
This Lt. Gen. Flynn guy is a dolt, but what the hell is CNN? FOX is sillydope, but how much less so is CNN, really?
Please be advised that mainstream media who are persistently non-claqueurs to the system and the powers that be, will have their their correspondents kind of barred. People are then ‘not available’ for an interview, the invitation to the press-conference does not arrive. It’s all subtle and not intentional, of course. Even the Chief of the Associated Press was threatened by the George W. administration (Tom Curley speech in Kansas). Another journalist said on TV just a few days ago that he had finally got that visa to Ukraine but only through intervention from the (Australian) Foreign Affairs Department. Media are dependent on advertisers (think mega corporations), and journalists are dependent on the cooperation from ‘the system’. This obviously generates a tilt. We have some alternative media now on the internet and it sometimes pays to think about search word combinations to find the information that has been withheld.
Story selection – what to bin and what to run – is a great tool to influence people. Let’s not fall for it. My experience in journalism was only three years, but they were not for nothing.
Thanks for your elaboration on captured main stream and other media. I am aware of that and was being a combination of facetious about, and shaming of CNN with my comment. Even though media seems almost hopelessly bought and captured it should always be called out, just as we are calling out the hideously out of control Surveillance State right now as the revelations from Snowden are being published.
This latest accusation or propaganda play by this Lt. Gen. Flynn character is a bit more serious than most. Consequently I am wondering if Glenn will deal with either Flynn or with CNN or with both in either an article, an interview or at least in a tweet followed by twitter exchange.
Because “balance” is just an illusion, a fantasy, a pretense.
While any exposure of the Intercept out in MSM land is a good thing, here is living proof that MSM journalistsnot marginalize anything in regards to Snowden….
http://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2014/03/meet-ask-zelda-the-advice-column-for-nsa-workers/284294/
In this case, Ms HALFWIT completely missed the point of this current post.
Just read the article. Can anyone be this dumb? Especially a writer? She must have continuously failed reading comprehension starting in elementary school. Who pays writers like her to write? And who edits her work? They should be “let go”. Maybe, with luck, they can find a menial job that doesn’t require many brain cells since they, provenly, don’t possess any.
Of course, with an article so wildly missing the point of The Intercept’s “Ask Zelda” article, it seems more believable that she and her bosses are receiving benefits from the NSA and/or iits supporters. She and her bosses may have joined the “Teacher Pet” program funded by our National Security agencies. This fact will come to light when the next “Snowden” escapes his servitude and reveals what they have been doing to us since early 2013.
End Mass surveillance support FOIA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZzTPX-VSDNo&list=UU7j4UkGe9nYjMO2i06HgTWA
Thanks for the link. Well worth viewing and four minutes long. I’m starting to realize that not only is Edward Sowden the man who outsmarted the NSA and risked his future for America, he is, in my opinion, the most passionate, trusted and articulate spokesperson for our rights to privacy and its benefits to all humans on this planet. This video includes a few of his passionate heartfelt statements to the world community.
What about the redacted eyes.. were they attached by the intercept? She states she doesn’t look like the picture.. Or is that how the picture went out in the NSA.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSmDPN_HgHI
Dear Zelda,
I am having a young lady over for dinner tonight, and was planning on making a meatloaf. Do you have any decent recipes?
Yes dear we have several very good meat loaf recipes in the NSA cookbook which is available at the NSA bookstore. We have recently had to classify the recipe books and restrict access to Intelligence employees but If you have security clearance that should be no problem.
If you don’t then contact Congreeman Mike Roger’s office.
Here’s a hint, it has no eggs since it can’t include anything binding.
I keep thinking about how “Zelda” and her coworkers must have absolutely no self-insight and are seemingly unable to empathize with the masses whose privacy they violate on a daily basis. Their collective myopia would be a great premise for sitcom.
They must live in a very us vs. them reality kept intact by a false sense of superiority. That says something about the culture of the NSA and its partners. And it isn’t flattering.
Thank humanity for Edward Snowden.
Tater, I am curious.
I wonder if Lois Lehrner had a version of Zelda at the IRS?
“Ask Lois”?
Dear Lois,
If I bake you a cake will you order an audit on my ex-wife and that piece of shit she left me for? I hear you do personal favors.
— Burned in Michigan
Dear Burned, I invoke my Fifth Amendment right to not incriminate myself …
Nope Sane. I don’t think it would work.
Dear Zelda,
http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2012/may/11/rebekah-brooks-missing-blackberry-message
Look over this information and tell me if Cameron is in deep doodie, like Nixonian tape deep space.
GCHQ bragged to NSA THEY cracked the BlackBerry’s compression technology following this Berry’s failure to image after being in police custody. Brooks herself calls it compressed. It looks like evidence tampering to me, or a clumsy retrieval of email data from Tempora after it’s 30 day stay. Should I tell the boss or will some CREEP have me silenced or declared insane?
The don’t see the irony of feeling uncomfortable about being spied upon, because they think they are above the Law(s) that the rest of us must abide by. The latest current example is the CIA spying on the Congressional oversight committees about the Bush era torture report. All of these Fed Police=Military State agencies, FBI, CIA, DEA, NSA, state and local police, etc. think that we the people are accountable only to them, and not them to us or our representatives in Congress. Heads should roll (theirs).
“There’s a warning sign on the road ahead, people saying we’d be better of dead” Neil Young Keep on rocking in the free World
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PdiCJUysIT0
For those remaining silent ” Silence like a cancer grows ” The Sound of silence
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dTCNwgzM2rQ
We live in interesting times.
What you are seeing in the Ukraine? It will happen here.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bjSpO2B6G4s
I wonder if the NSA collected the data on whether anyone bookmarked Zelda’s textbook advice for Silenced in SID. Some people could, you know, use another shot of kool-aid whenever their conscience tickles their ass with a feather.
It seems ironic how an agency being depicted as “Big Brother” is doing the same thing internally. It must be a tense environment when all you say and do is being monitored and potentially recorded. Many of the Zelda comments almost seem like there is a high level of paranoia. This type of oversight can certainly change a sense of self confidence.
i wonder if Zelda is Clappers’ alias??
That is hilarious!
I cannot see Clapper, or even hear his name, without laughing hysterically. Clapper is the epitome of Buffoonery.
Can Zelda give me next weeks lottery winning numbers so that I can escape the UK forever, or do I need Mystic Meg for that ?
Hey Zelda,
There is a missing airplane in the South China Sea. Could you peer into your Rubik’s Cube and give the searchers some clues………..
Well CitizenSane the Mirror is reporting that two of the passengers on board were using stolen passports. So two of the passengers were not who they claimed to be if the report is right. Who were they then, and how did they manage to get on the plane, when one of the passports was reportedly stolen in Thailand last August ?
Honestly, I do not have an answer for that.
Perhaps the NSA should. Aren’t they all knowing, all seeing, and all powerful?
Didn’t you read your manual? Send in the drones, dipshit. You’ll be hearing from H.R. soon to discuss your incompetence, er treason. Good day, sir!
Hugs and kisses, blah blah blah,
Zelda
I’m so sorry. I haven’t ventured into the real world today until just now. I am sick to my stomach with regret. I thought I was responding to a joke, which it turns out, was the farthest thing from a joke possible. Please ignore my previous comment and know how truly sorry I am for this mistake. My heart and condolences go out to the all the families and loved ones involved.
Well CitizenSane the Mirror is reporting that two of the passengers on this plane were using stolen passports. So who were they, and how did they manage to get on this plane, when one of the stolen passports is reported as having been stolen in Thailand last August.
I am very tired of the NSA claiming that they are self-sacrificing heroes, who are conducting this surveillance to protect us. I do not need your protection. I would rather live with the risks and have my privacy, then to live safely under constant surveillance. The excuse that you are protecting Americans is running very thin. STOP SPYING ON ME AND MY FELLOW HUMAN BEINGS!
You’re gawddamned right!
@Paul
They are not protecting you. They will happily send you to another contrived war to kill or to get killed in order to protect what needs to be protected – their assets. Unfortunately, this is exactly the mentality of the Talibans and Al Queda that we have been fighting for decades now. Which sort of makes me wonder if our leaders have been reading their propaganda material too assiduously and thereby got influenced by Taliban ideology.
Mulla Omar, the Taliban CEO who refused to hand over Osama Bin Laden for which we went to war, is still alive. So is Aiyan Al Zawahiri. They have outlived our drone programs, perhaps for good. Surely, we can’t say we have won despite the fact that we have killed so many people.
But some people have won – those whose bank balances have swelled over these wars. And I am sure some of these victors are folks whom we call our enemies.
Precisely.
The Military-Industrial-Media Complex has siphoned off ONE TRILLION dollars into their wallets.
I think One Trillion dollars is low. I’ve seen believable estimates, by category, that the total cost is closer to Three Trillion once the long term medical costs of soldiers is factored into the estimate.
Can you imagine how many human beneficial actions could be paid for with Three Trillion dollars? That is $10,000 of benefits – medical, housing, education, food, … – for every single American (there are 300 million of us). And it was wasted on wars that failed miserably and left over 100,000 dead, mostly innocents.
,,,,,,,,,,,and that does not factor in the 8.5 trillion dollars that the Pentagon can’t account for since 1996. I believe the train has fallen plumb off the tracks……..
Report in the Guardian 7/3/14
ACLU asks US appeals court to outlaw NSA mass collection of phone data
Civil liberties advocates want federal appeals court in NYC to undo lower-court ruling that found dragnet program legal
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/mar/07/aclu-nsa-appeals-court-outlaw-mass-collection-phone-data
The previous judge was quite innovative. He conveniently abandoned the need to follow any law and resorted to unapproved philosophy in order to pass an opinion that may have been biased by some secret, youthful indiscretion of his that the defendant, doing what we now know they are doing, could have been gleefully aware of.
“unapproved philosophy”
That’s perfectly said. The judge had a pretty strong opinion about what ought to be done to protect America, which perhaps he used as substitute for his lack of knowledge of the law and the Constitution.
Love your adjectives, General.
Zelda asked me to pass on this reply, since she isn’t one of the NSA agents authorized to disrupt comments at The Intercept.
While I’m flattered to be the subject of this attention, I have concerns about the effects of this article on my NSA coworkers. Even though their names have not been published, they wrote to me in the expectation that their problems would be read by sympathetic coworkers who could identify with the issues they raised. Now, even though not named directly, their problems have been presented to a mass audience and become the subject of widespread speculation and ridicule. I therefore would like to officially protest this gross violation of NSA workers’ privacy.
The NSA is home to many damaged souls, who to protect this nation, have dedicated their lives to watching you through your webcam. While you proceed about your happy carefree lives, they are destined to only live those lives vicariously. So before publishing in future, please carefully weigh the potential benefits against our right to privacy.
Zelda, (Nonstop Snippets of Advice)
An Army of Flip-flop wearing do gooders!. Foot wear that should be seen and not heard by the enemy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Au_8GMUxVs
“The NSA is home to many damaged souls, who to protect this nation, have dedicated their lives to watching you through your webcam.”
Tater, that is hilarious!
Attraction Shadow Theatre Group for the shadows, and the NSA (Nasty Spying Arseholes),listen to the words and enjoy :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNG6BWa7oNE
God Bless the Whistleblower(s).
For the most part, I enjoy anonymous advice columns and detest anonymous ‘tip’ lines (h/t Innocent Bystander.).
*What’s the NSA motto nowadays: “boys and girls, inform on your classmates, rat on your friends and save your own skin … anything else and we’re going to burn you at stake”? Are they building a ship of sea-going snitches?
Well, ladies and gentlemen, when the shit hits the fan … some kids will play cubicle rubic cubes and some kids with integrity might involuntarily move to Russia.
Dear Morally Bankrupt:
Didn’t you get the memo?
http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2013/07/09/196211/linchpin-for-obamas-plan-to-predict.html
Warnings/Schmornings. Don’t trouble yourself. And congratulations! You’re our one-hundredth commenter today and you’ve won all expenses paid vacation aboard the U.S.S. Unsinkable. We’ve packed your bags – the limo is out front. The destination classified but we can assure you it’s where no man’s gone before. Then proceed to the deck where you’ll find some delicious purple beverages and a snappy little band. Then just sit back and relax. The cruise director has an itinerary chock full of fun and games – and word has it she’s easy on the eye, too. Bon voyage.
-XOXO, Zelda
thx El B! … for the jog. I couldn’t remember the name of Orwell’s “Insider Threat Program”.
*’but there’s nothing like the sight of an amputated spirit … there is no prosthetic for that’
*Scent of a woman … http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xq8CtJSQFL4
@bah… happy to oblige. It’s been amusing/revolting to see how they sneak in subliminal messages via pop culture within their twisted underworld paralyzed by terminal paranoia. Spies spying on spys spying on spys in perpetuity. For them it’s to get off on their phantom erection. Wait until the winds of karmic retribution hits the fan, History DOES repeat itself and there’s a shitstorm on the horizon, Captain!
http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/adamcurtis/posts/BUGGER
I just hope I live to see the day to see it’s movie title blazing on a marquee. Hmmmm … what to call it, what to call it ?????
This will reach exactly the audience it deserves. I chose this video because it let’s you decide what side you are on the present condition. (Research more, dullards)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GqmRDV0a_70
Taking sides?
Redacted Eyes:
“A rude, accusatory, or overly severe comment can turn the recipient off to your suggestion for improvement. Try to make your comment free from emotional coloring.”
“If you receive hostile feedback through an anonymous mailbag, it’s easy to discount and ignore it, especially if it pushes your “hot” buttons. Instead, try to look past the way it is worded to see if there is a kernel of truth that requires action. Often important feedback is not couched in the the most pleasant terms. While many people will accept gentle criticism from a friend, it takes a truly enlightened person to acknowledge that an adversary’s nasty comment might have some merit and to do something about it.”
Reaching the exact audience?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dvfkWaBH27A
Love me some Zappa. Thanks.
And yeah, I’m takin’ sides. Ours.
Zelda, Dobie, and Maynard G Krebbs were part of my youth. I trust her to give good advice. She always did right by Dobie and Maynard.
A footnote: that Zelda, or at least the actor portraying her, Sheila Kuehl, made good eventually, was a big success as a California State Senator.
coram:
Wasn’t Sheila Kuehl an out lesbian, one of the first in CA politics?
Yes. Perhaps the first in the State Senate. Big deal then; times have moved on. The last Speaker of the Assembly was Latino and gay, and the next, IIRR, will be lesbian. BTW, Ms. Kuehl is now running for LA County Supervisor, and with 10m people in that county, she may be representing more people than ever.
I too am an old guy, so I remember Ms. Zelda–her bangs and her a’wrinklin’ her nose at Dobie. I wonder if she now wrinkles her nose in a contentious way* at this ‘Zelda’ and the stench emanating from the NSA. (*opposite her intent with Dobie).
Now, this ‘Zelda, Esq.’ (Harvard Law grad and sometimes professor of law) has a very impressive Curriculum Vitae and seems to possess boundless energy with her professional, legislative, community, civic, and many other duties.
http://www.sheilakuehl.org/about-sheila-2/curriculum-vitae
“If you are bothered by snitches in your office, whether of the unwilling or voluntary variety, the best solution is to keep your behavior above reproach. Be a good performer, watch what you say and do, lock your screen when you step away from your workstation, and keep fodder for wagging tongues (your Viagra stash, photos of your wild-and-crazy girls’ weekend in Atlantic City) at home or out of sight. If you are put in the “unwilling snitch” position, I would advise telling your boss that you’re not comfortable with the role and to please not ask that of you.”
Zelda’s advice here is completely self-serving on the behalf of the NSA management. She is saying what they are hoping the effect of their program of always making everyone feel like they are under suspicion.
To follow the line of “good” behavior she is touting is to make oneself a very unhappy person. EVery person needs friendship. Every person needs autonomy (the ability to make choices for yourself according to your own best wisdom — even if you are “wrong”). To not have your needs met will make you sad or angry or depressed. To follow her program of “winning” at your workplace is to lose at the game of having a life worth living.
Better counter measures on the anti-friendship dynamic is to make your friends with people who are already far from your work spot. Another possiblity is to be friends with everybody. Both of these tactics make moving your desk to another spot pointless. (There are certainly other ways to achieve this aim — and an important part of any working strategy is that they don’t know and can’t tell that you are doing it.)
Another point — working as hard as you possibly can is probably not the best way to keep your job. It is probably the best way to get burned out — which your leadership is okay with — you are replacable. A better strategy is to know what is really required for them not to fire your behind and not do much more than that.
Lastly. the strategy of the management is completely tied to appearances. So, any really good counterstrategy will keep your appearance just the same, while completely altering what it is meaning to you. They cannot control what anything means to you unless you let them.
Maybe this will help a few of the trolls on this site (who are being paid by them to disrupt us) to better protect your humanity against the inhumanity of those who think they are in charge of the rest of us. Every little bit you can do is important.
I’m doing my duty to inform the ignorant on what’s goin’ down. They’re not accepting this at the moment because TV drones them into submission. It’s gonna take one bike ride at a time, it seems.
And I thought it was impossible to miss the irony. Guess not.
But maybe something can be gleaned from this. My first attempt at a blockquote follows:
Fingers crossed about the blockquote.
And since Denise advises that “Another possibility is to be friends with everybody,” perhaps we all could ‘connect’ and ‘friend’ absolutely everyone on LinkedIn and Facebook, especially seeking out people we do not know, people whose languages we do not speak, and people who live in supposedly terrorist nations. I’ve never been on LinkedIn and I deleted my little-used Facebook account, but perhaps the truly patriotic action is to develop extremely wide-ranging networks on both of these platforms.
I hope someone’s getting royalties over at Legend of Zelda and Star Trek. A little originality on the NSA’s part might make this a little less hilarious for us/humiliating for them. BTW – I wonder if Zelda’s identity will be suppressed for his/her own protection or in the name of national security? Both, I suppose. But I sure hope there’s a drip coming from a leaky faucet somewhere… Fingers crossed!
I there I was all along picturing Dobie’s Zelda – sneer and all.
Is there a Section for the Playboy Advisor?
Dear Zelda,
I know you know all, see all and tell all but could you keep this one on the Q T.
I was once given a DVD of the Coen Brothers movie, Burn After Reading. I thought it was just a movie but with current events I now realize it was an Instruction Video.
Did I fail the test?
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0887883/quotes
…….
………
…….
Dear Zelda,
My 12-year-old likes flying drones on his Gameboy, it’s a great video game after he comes home from middle school, but now I find out they’re real drones — real Dementor-B series drones! — and he just took out a border post in the Pakistan tribal areas. Do I need to worry about repercussions?
Sincerely,
Medeamatters
– – –
Dear Medea,
Repercussions? At work? Sign him up for our intern program. It’ll save on daycare expenses. Repercussions otherwise? We’re telling the local government that it was a normal wedding party incident.
Love this, and I think/hope Zelda would too. Who knows, maybe she’s reading this. Oh, they’re reading everything…
Yeah man, they read every comment and don’t mind when drone strikes miss the target. Because they’re evil cartoon characters.
This is a quote from Greenwald’s piece on drones:
“The former JSOC drone operator is adamant that the technology has been responsible for taking out terrorists and networks of people facilitating IED attacks against U.S. forces in Afghanistan… One problem, he explains, is that targets are increasingly aware of the NSA’s reliance on geolocating, and have moved to thwart the tactic. Some top Taliban leaders, knowing of the NSA’s targeting method, have purposely and randomly distributed SIM cards among their units in order to elude their trackers.”
So, Maasshole, publishing NSA’s sources and methods not only gets Americans killed, but it also gets Afghan civilians killed. I hope Greenwald is reading this too.
You are probably the most ignorant person I’ve read. Thanks for alerting me to this. Duly noted.
Most ignorant person?
What about James Clapper?
“So, Maasshole, publishing NSA’s sources and methods not only gets Americans killed, but it also gets Afghan civilians killed. I hope Greenwald is reading this too.”
Oh phullleese. Spare us your bullshit . And while your at it, tell all your NSA propaganda buddy’s that one day, YOUR name’s and ADDRESS’ WILL appear on the internet. Just like these collectivists Connecticut Legislators who tried to make every law abiding owner of a certain weapon into criminals ……….
http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com/2014/02/a-sipsey-street-public-service.html
Now they’re feeling the same thing and scurrying like doomed cockroaches under the light of day. YOU will too.
Hey loser (raising middle finger) Go spin on this !
You’ll like this
“How The NRA Built A Massive Secret Database Of Gun Owners”
http://www.buzzfeed.com/stevefriess/how-the-nra-built-a-massive-secret-database-of-gun-owners
Something that the likes of Wikileaks or Anonymous would happily publish, as the leftists are not fans of the NRA.
Asshole calling you Maasshole. What a total ignorant anus !
Your moniker should be used on you,as anyone who supports this total disaster of Zion using Americans as cannon fodder to secure their wacky entity,and our freedom and way of life destroyed,is an American traitor.sheesh,the absolute stupidity,or is it perfidy,hmmm…..of some.
Um, Death to Traitors, it’s okay. The Taliban leaders redistribute their SIM cards to other Taliban members, not to civilians. The drone operator might not take out the particular target s/he was hoping to destroy, but the victim will be one of those Taliban guys. Nothing to fret about. (sarcasm alert!)
Your sarcasm alert means you agree with me that it’s not okay, so what’s your point?
First, the Taliban members can redistribute their SIM cards to civilians. Second, we’re willing to tolerate more collateral damage to take out terrorist leaders who have lots of blood on their hands, than to take out random Taliban members.
Coram is formidable if you read him for a while. Nice guy and always has a little humor at the end. Nice touch. Class. Inspirational.
Thank you, Mr. Maass, and I would think they _are_ reading this. I hoped this was parody, but it probably isn’t. Seen the one about their Star Trek themed control room?
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/sep/15/nsa-mind-keith-alexander-star-trek
They were trying for the USS Enterprise, but it looks like a Cardassian intelligence center built by Ferenghi contractors. They’re really quite unoriginal. First Star Trek, now an Abigail Van Buren remake.
Just because NSA is spying on everybody doesn’t mean the NSA employees are all devils. In fact, they are some of the most decent individuals you can meet and befriend. They have their own trials and tribulations, their frustrations and joys. So they also need an outlet to vent and an anonymous voice to counsel. Snowden did not contact Aunt Zelda, otherwise he would have been safely behind bars by now.
“Just because NSA is spying on everybody doesn’t mean the NSA employees are all devils.”
Hahahahahahaha! Just because your kitchen is infested with cockroaches doesn’t mean their all pond scum filthy. right. Ya know pal, your addiction to Synthetic Lobotomy Serum is really getting out of hand.
Once you recover from your hysterical laugh, please stop for a moment to ponder about the strange fate of these NSA employees, of whom Snowden was one. They are not spying on you for any benefit to themselves, except maybe for the deviant ones among them looking for LOVEINT. They also have heart and soul like you, but unlike you they are caged in a web of secrecy that they were not aware of when they took on their jobs. Would they all enjoy this? A few would, but by and large I suspect they all suffer from trauma that need attention. We all know from Snowden’s admission that initially he was all charged up with patriotic fervor that lasted for a while, before he finally decided to download the evidence of what he though was a secret rape of the Constitution. Most of the NSA employees would go through this process, and Zelda’s function is to first counsel them, failing which she would alert the authorities.
Now they have installed SureView (Raytheon) and Wisdom (Lockheed) to aid Zelda.
@General … Then why don’t you extend the same courtesy to @bloody – because at least one other person (out of many) shares your sympathy – AND – she called the Intelligence community “creepy fuckers” to their face:
https://medium.com/quinn-norton/dbc0669aa9ca … May I suggest you read her fly-on-the-wall perspective. It’s compelling, thoughtful, generous, and damning. I shared my own takeaways and replied on a comment thread below, if you’re at all interested.
Sometimes humans also fail to live up to their spiritual or secular ideals – because a shameless betrayal by and of so-called, trusted, “decent individuals” defies every single thing we’ve been taught to believe about decency. Our government held secret trials and publicly sentenced us as treasonous terrorists. Then patted themselves on the back for it – and try shaming us for not shaking their hand. Fail. But here we sit, cast into their fire & brimstone. Now they’re trying to make it illegal to cry while we fry. Decency never entered their equation. Let alone our constitutional rights.
Sometimes there are two sides of the same coin – then there’s the other side. So check yourself. You made your point. Point taken, but to belabor it further turns your message of charity into a sermon.
p.s @bloody … I’m slapping my knee right with ya! Just making a mockery out of a mockery. No harm – No foul. Good one!!!
Um, I think General Hercules was engaging in irony.
Snowden says he contacted several people in NSA with his concerns, but the official investigation turned up no one who would admit to be contacted by Snowden. Could Zelda be prevented by ethical concerns from divulging that Snowden did talk to her? Protecting the privacy and anonymity of NSA employees, and all that. Or is Zelda afraid that her job is on the line because she didn’t report Snowden as a potential problem?
Read the last sentence of my first post in this thread.
@General. I stand corrected. I will try to do be more attentive before I open my big, fat trap. I take full responsibility for my oversight and hope you will accept my sincere apology. Thank you for being so nice about it.
@tortoiseshell … yup, I made a mistake. Thank you for pointing it out … I’m usually more attentive but I was catching up on the comments and was fresh off an unusually long tear that got my dander up. I think he said his name was Newt, but I can’t remember. Anyway, It was in that frame of mind the irony escaped my attention … plus I should’ve read twice before I hit reply. No excuse, just the reason. My bad. I’ve apologized to the General. I didn’t notice your reply until after. Thanks to you, too.
Dear Zelda,
Thanks for the agents in charge of ass-troturfing this comment section but I can’t see givin’ them gold stars.
There was a collapse in datamine #3h and the canary in datamine #5 suddenly started hallucinating, so the operatives had to do something to keep busy.
No shit, spies don’t like to be spied upon. Hackers don’t like to be hacked. Journalists who publish secret sources and methods protect their own sources and methods. Guess everyone is just a hypocrite.
Or, perhaps, organizations from the NSA to Wikileaks usually promote collaboration and openness on the inside while protecting information from outsiders. That’s why they’re vulnerable to the insider threat.
I used to catch lizard like you when I was a youngin’.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nPlBBLc6vno
I was kind and let them go. You…?
I’m sorry Titowan, but you’ve mistaken this filthy cockroach for a lizard.
Thanks for the correction, brudda. I’m too kind too often because I’m a ‘liberal’. You won’t catch one of the roaches ever sayin’ that noise up in my grill. Bad news.
Liberal traitors dehumanize their protectors but humanize terrorists.
TITONWAN- “People of the Mountains”- Lakota. Not ‘Titowan’ which means “Too much grease and hair products used by on of the Jackson Five”. (Although grease is a good way of healing gunshot or knife wounds if your poor)
Dear Zelda,
I have a kind of personal problem. You know those pictures that the GCHQ has been routing over here?
Well, some of them are having a peculiar, even shameful effect on me. It’s extremely disorienting. I’m having a hard time getting my work done. Zelda, can you help me?
Dear THX1138,
Increase your meds.
Nice, I went on to ask a question of Zelda, but she already knew what I was doing and sent me a preemptive answer…… She wrote, “No, we are not watching what you are doing, however we may be sending someone around later to update you on what you are doing wrong.”…
Having worked at a company where the exact same culture of paranoia, snitching and secrecy was in place, bringing it out to discussion produced no results, in fact, it exacerbated the problem and led to several people quitting, myself included. This happened, of course, because the people in charge had no interest in keeping the team united. Their idea was: “if they’re fighting internally, they won’t rally up against us”. So they were always playing a game of pitting people against each other, spreading rumors and disinformation, and making sure employees were never standing on firm ground. Kind of like Cold War tactics for corporate environments. In reality, a company with such a culture can’t function normally, the only way to do so is to fire management, which is impossible to do when management coincides with ownership. So my advice is much better: quit that job ASAP!
Her name is prudence.
Clearly, her name is prudence.
But, she does give good advice.
Dear Zelda
Sung to the tune of Dear Abby by John Prine
sorry stuffed up by omitting Johns name in my original post
Sung to the tune of Dear Abby by
Dear Zelda Dear Zelda
Well I never thought
That me and my girlfriend would ever get caught
We were talking via webcam just shooting the breeze
With her hair up in curlers and her pants to her knees
Signed @ yahoo
@yahoo @yahoo
you have no complaint
you are what you are and you ain’t what you ain’t
So listen up buster and listen up good
Stop wishing for bad luck and keep your hands of your wood
Signed Dear Zelda
Thanks, Peter. I needed that.
You could not make it up. . .
“Surveillance tends to sow suspicion and unease among the people who are being surveilled. Is anyone listening? Who might be the spy among us? What trouble might I get into with the things I say? These questions can eat away at the core of human relations – trust. And this is true even at the agency that is conducting the surveillance.”– quoted text
———————
Zelda could have kept it simple and said: No shit Sherlock.
Either this is a farce or Kafka, Orwell, and Huxley were raised from the dead, got drunk on moonshine, unleashed a million monkeys and got them busy typing. edited the magnum opus and arrived at THIS. So freaking insane it’s hilarious.
—————–
Are we absolutely sure someone isn’t pulling are leg?
“…our leg. ” A monkey just tugged on mine…
——
Dear Zelda, If we’re very very good can we please have an edit button?
Minion and Citizen Sane and the other folks writing to Zelda–I’m enjoying it and admiring it. Humor and farce are methods of resistance. Learned this from the work of Gene Sharp, saw it deployed with effect in Milosevic’s Serbia in the 1990s.
Thanks for posting Mr. Maass. MM is an outstanding commenter. Her heart’s in the right place… er the ‘correct’ place. The word ‘right’ is gettin’ raped right now.
Thanks for your response to one of my favorite souls.
Ridicule is a strong weapon.
Mr. Maass,
Excellent article.
You knocked this one right out of the park.
Just finished a piece on the genre of pressed works in the 1600s. This excluded official and religious authors, but letters from the devil were quite popular among the common volk. Not uncommon for a friend to have another’s letter printed and passed about before even asking permission! Songs were VERY popular and of course a good dialogue has been throwing a clog in the works since we invented cogs.
“Pulling our leg?”
When dealing with government , only one adage comes to mind.
“Don’t piss down my leg, and tell me it’s raining.”
Silly @Citizen … that’s why the asshats are handing out umbrellas and diapers. Attention Captain McAlexander. Batton down the hatches, there’s a shitstorm on the horizon.
Funny.
These days, it feels like it’s raining shit, and I have lost my hat.
Nah! DLTBGYD. It’s not you – it’s them. They got butthurt when Snowden rained on their parade. They’ve been so busy listening to our every brain fart they never felt so much as a the flutter of a butterfly’s wing during their colonoscopy. They’ve been on an Imodium IV drip ever since. In fact, they’re cheeks are clenched so tight they’ll need a bowel resection before this is over. And, their prostates don’t look so hot, either. They don’t even know what they don’t know… and they know it! I look forward to the day when they do. The anticipation of this inevitability is as delicious as it is maddening. I hope you have better days soon.
The Peter Maass column brings up a point that I’ve wanted to see addressed on a more fundamental level.
In my opinion, the massive worldwide spying operation, along with the vast amount of data being collected and stored on billions of people, is by itself the perfect method to destroy all trust that we hold with each other. Trust is undermined when laws are ignored or broken, and by repeated lies told by those in powerful positions, and when agencies work in secret and unfettered by any legitimate oversight.
However, it goes much deeper than that.
Let me pose a question to ask of any person in a position of authority today.
“How can I, as a rational thinking person look at you, (insert who you will – President, Senator, Congressmen, Supreme Court Justice, Governor, Military commander, etc.) and have any assurance or trust that you haven’t already been, or potentially will be coerced, blackmailed, or manipulated by the secret information being held about you?”
To illustrate how deep the rabbit hole goes, follow that up with this question.
“Even if you are as pure as an angel from heaven, how can you prove that fact to me if the information about you is withheld and kept secret?
It gets worse.
“What person could I trust to speak for your personal integrity, if that person also has the potential to be blackmailed or coerced by the information being held on them as well?”
Knowing what we do about the extensive capability of the system to evade security measures to unlock and collect vast amounts of personal data, we can also assume it has the inherent capability to manufacture, or manipulate that data to whatever means the enablers of that system so desire.
With that, more questions come to mind.
“What documents could you provide to prove your innocence, if the documents or data can be manipulated at will, or if the person providing those documents can be coerced? If the information about you is secret, and if someone makes false claims against you, how can you prove it otherwise?”
I think you can see how dangerous this truly is.
As long as personal information is being collected and stored in secret searchable databases (both here and abroad), it has the potential to destroy basic trust in people and institutions everywhere on the globe. The destruction of trust is built into the very DNA of this beast, and as Maass shows in his column, it is developing within the agencies themselves. What government official or agency worker can now feel secure, knowing that potential career ending information could be used against them at any point in time? How could any individual trust their government, knowing that their elected officials could be compromised? On a personal level, what trust could an individual have that their own personal information won’t be used against them as well?
“Trust us,” they’ll say, but does that even work anymore?
A great monster has been unleashed upon the world, and it feeds on suspicion and works to destroy the very foundation that holds nations, institutions, communities and families together. That foundation is based on trust, and once trust is destroyed, then all else will collapse into ruin. Unfortunately, history provides us with copious examples of exactly that.
This is the same problem as with the ticking-time-bomb/torture scenario.
If you are going to torture information(B) about a bomb out of someone(B) based on other information(A) that he(B) has this information(B), how do you know that the information(A) used to justify torture(B) is not also based on a tortured(A), but false confession? The chain of false confessions can be daisy-chained back erroneously indefinitely.
@what … very, very well stated. Thanks.
Trust does not always have to be built on a foundation of truth.
“When they have learnt to obey, they will believe what I tell them.” M
“Slavery was abolished on January 31, 1865″ … Tell that to the nitwits at the NSA. Except in their case, they just love the cookies at the plantation. Keep pickin’ cotton, boys and girls. This is gunna hurt you more than it hurts us …
breaking trust amongst citizens makes insurrection very difficult………
Peter Maass tweeted: “Karl Bode’s story about my story is better than my story”
http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20140307/09003026480/nsa-has-internal-office-advice-columnist-yes-shes-inconsistent-hypocrite-too.shtml
Well fuck me a runnin’!
Whoever thought that the NSA was a faceless, tasteless bureaucratic government agency obviously had never asked Zelda………….
The Intercept needs a “Like” button.
Ditto!
Waste of time making one for the NSA or GCHQ though !
And a dislike button
Ha, ha, ha .. that’s funny!
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA…HOHOHOHOHOHOHO…HEEHEHEHEHEHEHE…HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
OMG. If ever there was living proof the entire NSA apparatus model is based on it’s Howdy Doody Time ..this is it. With Congressional puppetry, Koko the clown Clapper, corporate peanut galleries and Commander Alexander leading a cast of zany, madcap, 50’s cartoon characters in a Ringling Brothers DOJ Greatest Show on Earth extravaganza of biblical proportions!
sheeezus, don’t these buffoons get tired of looking like the biggest schmucks on the face of the planet?
D-I-T-T-O !!!
This is sadly humorous. These desk jockeys are most likely making enormous salaries, compared to the average American, yet they whine like kindergartners over workplace camaraderie restrictions. The total lack of professionalism is glaring.
Totally.
Dear All,
You should be ashamed of yourselves. Except you Craig Summers and you Nate. A gold star will go in your folders! But the rest of you need to accept the fact that protecting you is a very stressful and thankless job. We are the real heros and the lack of support you people have shown is disgraceful. But don’t think that it will stop us. As President Bush said, the government’s number one job is to protect you and we WILL protect you whether you want it or not.
Sincerely, Zelda
Zelda,
Glad to see someone with a sense of humor!
Thanks for the correction, brudda. I’m too kind too often because I’m a ‘liberal’. You won’t catch one of the roaches ever sayin’ that noise up in my grill. Bad news.
Ahh delicious irony. Delicious hypocrisy. Thanks for the much needed chuckle about this most serious issue.
Dear Zelda,
Here I am, cooped up in a chilly attic, alone, wearing clammy headphones and listening to the theater couple in apartment 3G. I’ve been doing this every night for two weeks now, nothing but a thermos of bad coffee with me, while my subjects are living a wonderful life, having parties, making love, playing the piano. I sit here, envious, bored, getting back pains from this chair. Sometimes I cry, listening to these others. What can I do?
Sincerely,
Winston Smith
– – –
Dear Winston,
Why, this is shocking. You’d think we were the Stasi or something. You should inform your controller about Operation Constant Nightlight, which s/he obviously hasn’t been briefed on. The operatives on live surveillance are in comfy cubicles at Ft. Meade, plenty of hot coffee and donuts, a yoga room right down the hall, and they’re more productive: each one can eavesdrop on 20 such couples.
Time for your controller to join the 21st Century. A good man like yourself deserves better working conditions.
Zelda
For a mind-boggling history of MI5: http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/adamcurtis/posts/BUGGER. You can’t make this stuff up.
The employees of the Ministry of Truth being encouraged to seek out someone who is ostensibly on their side:
It seems to me Zelda is a useful early warning system for people who might be thinking of “leaving the reservation”; who might be getting disillusioned with the whole sordid business.
Oh the irony! I am sure that submissions submitted to Zelda are done by e-mail, do you think any of these rocket scientists have figured out any complaint they make is surely tracked to them and stuffed in their file, they have privacy concerns after all.
Hopefully, No Such Agency is on the eve of its own self destruction. Poor bastards don’t even know who they are really working for. Pretty sure that it isn’t us or other citizens of the world, that’s for sure. Like any master/slave situation, in an authoritarian context, these folks have no choice but to continue doing their job, or face starvation or worse. I’m pretty sure there are lots of folks inside who have serious doubts about the work they are doing. They just can’t, at this time, do anything about it. They’ll continue on like blind beasts doing what they do best, but just not really doing much good for the world. Best of luck to them, we shouldn’t condemn them personally, just what they are doing. Poor misguided souls that they are, one should take pity on them all. Of course, when peace becomes economically viable, instead of war and preparations for war, this will all become totally unnecessary. Trust will return, people will share and the world will be great, just won’t happen in my lifetime or maybe another thousand lifetimes. But if it does not happen, we as a species won’t be here to comment on it. Where would the need for terrorism exist if $16 Trillion of our debt had been used to improve the world, instead of destroying it???
An absolutely AWESOME statement Larry! Fricken’ eh!
Sobering. And spot on. SMDH
I think The Intercept should start its own column spoofing Ask Zelda. How about “A Room With a Polyp”?
How about “Dear Crabby?”
Or maybe “Ask Edward”?
I hear he needs a job.
Russia already has an advice columnist, Olga Volkhyerselv, also known as Dear Olga.
Edward is probably what Vlad will surrender in exchange for Crimea, and that’s plenty value for his work as a bargaining chip.
OUCH! That just killed my buzz.
South by Southwest Interactive – Ask Zelda!
Das Internet, das nichts vergisst: Die Google-Vertreter fordern von Eltern, das Gespräch über Datenhaltbarkeit noch vor dem über “Bienen und Blümchen” zu führen. Aber natürlich bedauere man, dass das Video einer 15-Jährigen beim Erbrechen nun für immer auf YouTube steht. Cohen wartet auf den “Aha-Moment”, wenn Gesellschaften die Sünden der Vergangenheit (z.B. Peinlichkeiten, die späterer Politiker heute einmal als Teenager online stellt) entspannter sehen.
The Internet does not forget anything: The Google representative call on parents to make the call via data durability even before about “bees and flowers”. But of course, we regret that the video of a 15-year-old is now on YouTube forever in vomiting. Cohen waiting for the “aha moment” when companies see the sins of the past (eg embarrassment, the politicians later today once presents as a teenager online) relaxed.
http://www.sueddeutsche.de/digital/internet-konferenz-sxsw-tech-treffen-im-schatten-von-snowdens-enthuellungen-1.1906989#scribbleReload
I’m sure this can be improved upon, but see if it comes closer to the meaning:
The Internet does not forget anything: The Google representative calls on parents to initiate a conversation about data longevity even before the conversation about “the birds and the bees”. But of course, we regret that the video of a vomiting 15-year-old is now on YouTube forever. Cohen is waiting for the “aha moment” when companies take a more relaxed/lenient/forgiving view of the sins of the past (for example, the embarrassing episode that the future politician posts online today as a teenager).
Thanks for the translation. Now I get it. Sad but true commentary on the age in which we live. Losing ones internet virginity and all the possible STD’s it carries. How to put a condom on that?
Pete Maass
So, um, did The Intercept give the U.S. government a chance to identify how publishing this story might harm national security? The mind giggles at how such a conversation might have gone.
Is having … tee hee.
Here’s a thought; if you applied for a higher clearance don’t be surprised to find a permanent scope up your life’s butt.
Just pretend you’re The Truman Show and every new surveillance technique can now be practiced — on you.
You also should be suspicious of anyone saying, “Trust me.”
Honestly, we are here from the government and we are hear to help you………..
Got Colonoscopies? I wonder what that graphic would look like? A smiling brown cyclops?
This almost seems like parody, except the advice seekers seem so bland, so banal. A true parody should be more ludicrous. Can I play too?
– – –
Dear Zelda,
I should be enjoying myself; my intelligence committee is enjoying an all-expenses junket at the Ritz. Trouble is, I can’t sleep at night. Senator Grumpy snores badly in the next room, and that’s when he’s not yelling “you kids get off my bed.” Senator Princess, on the other side, has parties going all night, it’s 3 am and I can hear him singing “Whatever Lola Wants” loud as anything, and the other guys in there are singing along, badly. Meanwhile, Senator Pallbearer across the hall won’t tip the bellboys — or gives them only a copy of Ayn Rand — and between him and Princess they’re avoiding this floor so I can’t get any room service! And now I find a French microphone planted under the picture of Nicolas Sarkozy in my bathroom! What can I do to get some peace of mind?
Sen. “Jefferson Smith”
– – –
Dear Mr. Smith,
You could find another room.
Coram, if this ain’t a parody we’re in even more trouble than I dreamed, and THAT is saying something.
Howdy Doody Time on the Starship Enterprise with Sponge Bob Square Pants as Captain Wonderful (with Zelda ever at his elbow) as national policy…nope, nothing to worry about here.
[Cheery wave to the Seeing Eye …]
Ah, MM, good to see you here. But who could forget NSA’s Information Dominance Center. It looked like they were trying for Capt. Kirk’s command deck but only got as far as deep Cardassian territory.
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/sep/15/nsa-mind-keith-alexander-star-trek
That wasn’t really parody either.
Dear Mr. Smith,
First world problems. Sheesh!
Mr. Summers tells us:
However, Mr. Snowden no longer lives in a state that recently killed more than 100,000 people in illegal invasion based on incompetent and faked intelligence after having helped enforce a blockade that seriously damaged an entire generation of children. He no longer lives in a state that uses cell phone meta data to plan assassinations of its enemies in foreign countries, creating more enemies by killing the innocent.
He still lives in a state that collects all the data on its citizens that it is technically capable of doing and can get away with. He currently lives in a country whose leader was clever enough to annex the Crimea without firing a shot or even a hellfire missile from a drone, after the country it belongs to deposed its legal, but corrupt government, possibly with some help from the country he no longer lives in. That country, the one he no longer lives in, despite its huge intelligence capabilities, apparently had no idea what was about to happen.
Yes, Craig, he changed countries, but not everything changed, and not every thing that changed, changed for the worse.
Mike
“……. He currently lives in a country whose leader was clever enough to annex the Crimea without firing a shot or even a hellfire missile from a drone, after the country it belongs to deposed its legal, but corrupt government, possibly with some help from the country he no longer lives in…….”
So if you invade and occupy a country and don’t kill anyone, you are clever? That’s what I call a true sell out to Russian imperialism even as the Russian government supports and arms a dictator responsible for initiating a civil war that has killed tens of thousands of unarmed civilians. Indeed, Putin’s Russia provides the much needed veto at the UN to prevent this body from doing anything. Assad has been charged with war crimes by AI, Human Rights watch and the UN for targeting and murdering civilians even using chemical weapons. Putin has blood on his hands, but apparently, he is too “clever” for you to notice.
Yesterday, Greenwald had the temerity to quote a writer who said the US was interfering with Russian “interests” in Ukraine. And you did exactly the same thing, my friend. The disenfranchised people in Ukraine surely had to have been provoked by the west or Ukrainian Nazis. It sure as fuck could not have been dissatisfaction with the Russian puppet that rejected closer economic ties to the Europe. Ukrainians have a long history under the repressive Soviet empire. Apparently, that warrants no sympathy from you. And surely, you accused the Russian government, Iran or Syria of provoking the protests against Mubarak before his overthrow? Maybe you will post a link for me where you did? Or were protests, civil liberties and democracy suddenly important to you in Egypt? And of course, that was entirely the fault of the US.
No matter what the situation, the fault always lies with the US. First of all, you are a classic sellout to the truth, Mike. Second, you are anti American to the core. Third, you oppose US imperialism, but give a green light to Russian aggression. Russia is welcome to overthrow whoever they want – and you will protect them with lies about US complicity, or interference in someone else’s “sphere of influence”.
Your position is gutless whataboutery, Mike. None of what the US has done means a single thing to the invasion by the Russian army. At the very least, you are a sellout to democracy, human rights and civil liberties. You provide cover for a “clever” thug – but you are certainly not alone on this site and your position would be more than welcome at the Guardian.
Thanks.
Why, yes, that is much more clever than killing a lot of people because it mutes the backlash. Apparently you are confusing these two things:
1. calling something clever
2. calling it good, or agreeing with it.
Until you gain the mental acuity to make such distinctions, you will always be a knee jerk “patriot” with no ability understand what happens in the world.
Just too damned much irony in the comments today…
@CraigSummers @Nate @abbadabba
Tell you what, CraigSummers, Nate and abbadabba, you three exchange your emails and write to each other as much as you want to, cc admin@nsa.gov, and leave us alone here.
Do I know you? Name doesn’t ring a bell.
Ask abbadabba … send him all your effing emails and stop asking your stupid questions here …
I don’t read abbadabba’s incoherent rants, I ignore him. That’s what you do when you encounter somebody like him. Now, you don’t have that excuse with me. If don’t like my “stupid” questions, don’t read my posts. Or at least respond to the topic at hand. It is simple as that. Maybe you feel more comfortable in a political safe haven that never challenges your own values and beliefs? If so, you’re definitely not the first, and I have come to accept that.
And by “effing emails” I assume you mean comments? If not, I think you’ve got the wrong guy…
I think that Rumpletiltskin is a vigilante “moderator”. Of course, vigilantism is how the KKK worked to intimidate people. Are you black Nate? I’m freckled (at least when I was young).
I wonder if it would be fair game to target suspected NSA malcontents by putting scandalous stories about them on Facebook a la JTRIG’s “Art of online deception” doctrine… What would Alexander say?
Interesting choice of words. ‘Fair Game’ is what Scientology calls it when they target people using similar tactics.
What strikes me most about the Dear Zelda article is how those in charge of the NSA are threatened by any sign of Friendship or even just Comraderie among the people who work for them.
The creation of such a toxic work environment feeds the creation of this toxic country some of us get to live in which feeds out its toxic model as the one to follow in the world beyond it.
What kind of creeps those who have come up with this system must be!
I suppose it’s an example of the tangential stuff to come out of the Snowden revelations, not just the utterly-utter stuff, and I imagine the banality is something future historians will reflect on, at least in footnotes. Still, it’s kind of sad that Edward Snowden sacrificed himself for THIS?
Ian Fleming wept.
How exactly are officials at the National Security Agency ‘training’ theirs workers in ways of oppression NOT relevant?
Familiar with The Stasi? You know they collected dossiers on the population too.
Well, of course. See my “Dear Zelda” parody on the attic sequence. For that matter, coram nobis recommends “The Lives of Others”, making allowances for the then-technology. It is set in 1984 after all, in East Berlin of the day.
Great film, and also relevant.
I thought that too. I also question the critical thinking of the employee’s who are buying into this bullshit. It is one thing if you are working for minimal wage and jobs are few and far between in some communities, it is another thing if you have marketable IT skills. And yes the mind of our government is a very disturbing place. They acknowledge in this article that the spying and mistrust is bad for the “company” and yet they fail to see how it is toxic for the country.
I can’t keep everything straight, Between the JD and the Senate, the FBI and the CIA, the NSA personnel and their supervisors, everybody is investigating/surveilling somebody else, or considering the possibility. Who’s investigating the White House? Does the WH know if its offices or telephones or computers are bugged, and if so, by whom?
I sure hope a lot of those folks at the NSA see this article. A story like this is a lot more likely to strike a chord with them than any story questioning the effectiveness of their domestic spying activities. People easily rationalize and advocate authoritarian positions toward others and only really question it when they get caught under the wheels of the machine themselves.
This reminds me of how most people in the “land of the free” champion being “tough on crime” right up until they suddenly find themselves part of the largest per capita incarceration system on the planet (probably for a petty non-violent drug offense).
Great point Dave! Lack of empathy seems to be the overwhelming characteristic of police state advocates. Finally they’ll be able to put themselves in the place of the rest of us. Or at least they would if they didn’t think they were so much superior to the rest of us.
Dave, really good point about people inside institutions like this not understanding the impact of what they do until they are targets themselves.
When you or your family become a terrorist target, you’ll understand the impact of what you do, traitor.
“When you or your family become a terrorist target, you’ll understand the impact of what you do, traitor.”
And when you are arrested for suspicion of holding dissenting opinions, when your kids are being beaten by the police, when your wife gets felt up by some perv with a badge you might understand the impact of your pissing on the constitution and turning a once great country into a Soviet style police state, traitor.
Who argued for arresting people for holding dissenting opinions?
Male TSA screeners aren’t allowed to pat down females, if that’s what you were referring to, but what do you propose, no screening? When the TSA itself proposed allowing small pocket knives on airplanes, stewardesses and passengers freaked out, and the prohibition stayed.
The only you have to fear,is fear itself.sheesh,you are one scared rabbit.
said FDR in the middle of a bank panic, one day before declaring a “bank holiday” and calling for a special session of Congress that would pass the Emergency Banking Act, which allows only Federal Reserve-approved banks to operate in the United States.
You are one scared rabbit.The only thing you have to fear is fear itself.
Surveillance targets, of course.
They give up a hell of a lot more privacy than you do, in order to get and keep their security clearance, even going through a polygraph test.
Troll away you trolling river. ( of S***)
Peter, thank you for bringing this to light. Oppression can beget nothing other than itself.
“Even if you’re not doing anything wrong, you’re being watched and recorded. …it’s getting to the point where you don’t have to have done anything wrong, you simply have to eventually fall under suspicion from somebody, even by a wrong call, and then they can use this system to go back in time and scrutinize every decision you’ve ever made, every friend you’ve ever discussed something with, and attack you on that basis, to sort of derive suspicion from an innocent life and paint anyone in the context of a wrongdoer” – Edward Snowden
What a fascinating and well written article.
I enjoyed it on many levels.
Thank you Mr Maass.
..
There does seem to be a problem (many have noted it) with posts showing up. Some of my replies to other posters seem to never have been.
Nothing of substance was lost.
However, I am going to hold my breath till I turn blue unless they show.
Perhaps there is no cure for the summertime blues but Nate is Nattering away, naturally.
You may actually see some of your comments materializing after you hold your breath, although I’d advise against assuming post hoc ergo propter hoc in this instance. A couple of my comments took a long time to show up. Might be a bit of overload on the servers. None of my comments has been permanently lost.
James, sometimes there’s a delay due to moderation but posts should get published relatively promptly. Give a shout if you continue to face problems or delays.
Cheers.
Thanks for that, Mr Maass.
It appears “replies” are my problem. If I just post a comment, well that appears within a very short time.
But some replies seem not to appear at all.
Perhaps I have made some mistake in the user name or my email but I think that unlikely .
I am glad you are working at the Intercept and Ilook forward (not backwards) to more of your writting.
Regards Jimmy.
Have you tried refreshing the page after you post a comment? The page does not seem to refresh automatically.
Thanks for the suggestions and info.
Yes I do refresh quite often.
Some of my replies (on other articles) failed to appear. Some took hours to appear.
No biggie but still.
Thanks again and I have noticed that after your posts, no one has told you to pull your head A word in your shell like, it is because you are a positive person.
Cheers.
Hahahahahahahaha! Something light-hearted for a change yet infused with deeper connotation.
I loved the article….especially the innuendos. Keep up the good work!
Test, test
Gee, I wonder how “Silenced in SID and Zelda feel about the “Insider Threat Program, an unprecedented government-wide crackdown under which millions of federal bureaucrats and contractors must watch out for “high-risk persons or behaviors” among co-workers. Those who fail to report them could face penalties, including criminal charges.”
http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2013/07/09/v-print/196211/linchpin-for-obamas-plan-to-predict.html
The link doesn’t seem to be working. Maybe try this URL:
http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2013/06/20/194513/obamas-crackdown-views-leaks-as.html
I love the headline: “Obama’s crackdown views leaks as aiding enemies of U.S.” I guess if you interpret “aiding” as giving them reason to point and laugh then there might be a kernel of truth in his assertion. Otherwise, it’s just hearsay. Nice try though.
Snowden kinda showed why it’s necessary, didn’t he. And even if you think he was justified, what if he had been a Russian spy instead, and just quietly sold the stolen data to Russia?
By the way, one of the first NSA “whistleblowers,” Russ Tice, first became disgruntled after his attempt to accuse a coworker of spying for China was rebuffed by his bosses.
Mike Rogers and others of his mentality think Snowden was a Russian spy. I imagine all of them also think that the Tooth Fairy is real. Sorry, my mistake, some of them think the Easter Bunny is real. They don’t have any evidence for any of these beliefs but, heck, that doesn’t stop them.
You seem to have a tendency for thinking your imaginings are plausible. You might want to get some help for that.
I’ve listened to Russell Tice speak about his years with the NSA and their many attempts to smear him so we, the public, wouldn’t believe what he says about the unlawful and unConstitutional programs they were running while he was employed. Their smears, of which yours is one, no longer get any traction. You might want to take your imaginings and smears to Faux (Fox) news. If you throw a tantrum while uttering your nonsense, they likely will listen. Good luck.
Did I imagine this Slate article on Russ Tice?
http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/2006/01/the_professional_paranoid.html
“In 2001, while he was working for the Defense Intelligence Agency, Tice became convinced that an Asian-American woman he was working with was a Chinese spy. He reported his suspicions and was told they were unfounded. When he transferred to NSA the following year, he continued to report his concerns to DIA. Learning of his persistence, NSA administered the psychiatric evaluations, which led to what is known as “red badge” status, or suspension of security clearance, a stigma that in Tice’s secretive business can be professionally debilitating.”
You may want to read the full article before using it as support for your repeated smears. The title of the article should give you a clue that you are barking up the wrong tree or, more likely, spitting in the wind. The Slate article (2006) title is “Why NSA whistle-blower Russel Tice may be right”.
I’ve viewed multiple interviews that he has given to news magazines and TV programs. In all of them, he comes across as a sensible and rational man who clearly knows what he is talking about. His revelations on the NSA programs he witnessed in 2004 – 2006 fully mesh with the programs revealed by other whistle blowers, Snowden, Binney, Drake, and others.
I suggest you take a remedial course in reading comprehension. There are courses in elementary school that will help you better understand what you read.
So is it a smear that he snitched on a coworker or isn’t it?
this link worked for me…
http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2013/07/09/196211/linchpin-for-obamas-plan-to-predict.html
“Experts: Obama’s plan to predict future leakers unproven, unlikely to work”
“…even the government’s top scientific advisers have questioned these techniques. Those experts say that trying to predict future acts through behavioral monitoring is unproven and could result in illegal ethnic and racial profiling and privacy violations.”
— WOW! That’s kinda rich, don’tcha think?
“We are back to the needle-in-a-haystack problem,” said Fienberg, the Carnegie Mellon professor.
“We have not found any silver bullets,” said Deanna Caputo, principal behavioral psychologist at MITRE Corp., a nonprofit company working on insider threat efforts for U.S. defense, intelligence and law enforcement agencies. “We don’t have actually any really good profiles or pictures of a bad guy, a good guy gone bad or even the bad guy walking in to do bad things from the very beginning.”
After reading this post from 9 months ago – fast forward to today, if I had to venture a guess, I would say that Obama’s entire methodology and implementation points to chain yanking by the NSA. And the budget required to feed this level of paranoia and try to capture one more Manning out of the thousands upon thousand of employees is mind-blowing. What a waste! Maybe if they had nothing to hide they wouldn’t have to spy on each other only to discover that they’re all failing to produce any meaningful work product. I’m slowly coming to the conclusion that all this “busy work” is just a ruse to ensure federal job security and avoid massive layoffs – that would be a epic fail for his administration, and legacy {cough}.
Thank you a million times! I adore this. The Mother of All Ironies. If only there were some EVIL ENEMY threatening to infiltrate and destroy the NSA, so the employees could be persuaded that surveillance was for their own good, to save their jobs and their lives, to save the NSA.
I especially enjoyed the advice to “watch what you say and do, lock your screen when you step away from your workstation, and keep fodder for wagging tongues (your Viagra stash, photos of your wild-and-crazy girls’ weekend in Atlantic City) at home or out of sight.”
Except there is no “at home or out of sight” for those of us who don’t work at the NSA. We can’t lock our screens when we step away from the computer. The NSA is all about intrusion into every possible part of our personal lives.
And the advice for Yahoo, Microsoft, et al.: “If you are put in the ‘unwilling snitch’ position, I would advise telling [the government] that you’re not comfortable with the role and to please not ask that of you.”
Calling all scriptwriters! I’ve got an idea for a play/movie: the workgroup of Silenced in SID as a microcosm of America. Do you think any of our top politicians studied “The Crucible” in high school literature class?
@Tortoiseshell: “If only there were some EVIL ENEMY threatening to infiltrate and destroy the NSA, so the employees could be persuaded that surveillance was for their own good, to save their jobs and their lives, to save the NSA”.
We, the American public, are the Evil enemy that threatens the NSA.
Since we are the enemy, they must increase their secrecy and internal “witch hunting” so no more Snowdens expose what they are doing. Obama agrees with them – he has spoken eloquently on the need to stop any and all governmental leaks. In his and the DOJ’s way of thinking, there are no good leaks, only bad ones.
His first line of defense, which didn’t stop Snowden, was to destroy the lives of all whistleblowers so that anyone new who observed governmental evils would keep their mouth shut. Since the first line of defense failed, the NSA, CIA, DOJ, and Obama now want to double down and be proactive re any potential leakers. The outside experts say “Won’t work”. They will do it anyway since it spends more taxpayer money for more employees, contractors, buildings, and equipment. I wonder how the “huntees” and the “witch hunters”, in sharing the same workspaces, will adapt to one another? I guess we will have to wait and see.
In a post Snowden world, where fear, paranoia and mistrust are now burning like a wildfire at Fort Meade, this spying on the spies will only increase.
The irony is choking. Will they gain some empathy as a result? No.
This had to happen. Someone has started a Twitter account, Ask Zelda anything. @Ask_Zelda.
William Owen ?@Bill_Owen 21m
@Ask_Zelda If I find an NSA listening device in my office, should I, report it, smash it, or leave in place cause I have nothing to hide?
Ask Zelda! ?@Ask_Zelda 19m
@Bill_Owen C’mon, Bill. You leave it in place. Naturally.
William Owen
11:21 AM – 7 Mar 2014 · Details
Reply to @Ask_Zelda
William Owen ?@Bill_Owen 2m
@Ask_Zelda That’s exactly what I thought. Thx. “Surveillance is freedom” as the slogan goes!
I am getting really hot for Zelda.
I think the NSA ate my comment. Or do you folks play heavy-handed with comment moderation?
Seems like they are still working some of the bugs out and it may take awhile for it to show up.
Calling “Zelda” out for an advice-off! I’m surprised no one has questioned “Zelda’s” version of her own identity and bona fides. I do.
This is the funniest article I’ve read in at least a month. No one is as hilarious as someone whose view is obstructed by the polyps in his/her own colon.
Thanks for the imagery.
Thanks for letting me re-eat yesterday’s taco.
“The NSA’s own advice columnist explores the ways in which pervasive surveillance can erode freedom of expression and social cohesion by making it difficult for people to have faith in the privacy of their communications.”
This also exposes the institutional arrogance of pretty much everyone, from the local cops to James Clapper, in the “keeping us safe” racket. Can anything better illustrate the gap that these people see as existing between them and the common people? Zelda’s whole life has been dedicated to destroying the privacy of the common people but she’s worried that doing that to tax feeding parasite NSA employees could erode freedom of expression and cohesion and maybe hurt morale.
What a bunch of psychopaths.
Somebody’s got blood on their hands releasing this superduper secret document. Why, it’s almost porno-spying! Hannah Arendt was right about the banality of evil.
Do I understand right — that Zelda advocates the activity and role of anonymous whistleblowers, at least within the confines of the NSA?
Yes, that was one of the things that struck me about Zelda’s columns. She recognizes the importance of privacy and anonymity but only, it seems, at the NSA. Which is unfortunate and, it would seem, hypocritical.
“She recognizes the importance of privacy and anonymity but only, it seems, at the NSA. Which is unfortunate and, it would seem, hypocritical.”
Seem?
Members of the inner party may turn their telescreens off for up to 30 minutes.
One rule for the elites and another for the proles and outer party members.
It’s facile to call this hypocrisy, a term that masks identification of a deeper pathology. This story illustrate all-too-well a pervasive distinction: in-group empathy vs. out-group dehumanization. The attitude against an out-group is worse than mere apathy; it does not acknowledge the humanity of the other. Downgrading an enemy or an opponent, terms which at least acknowledge common humanity and retain the possibility of respect, to the status of a mere target is to turn the animate into the inanimate, to close off any opportunity for moral reflection. We have seen this already before in the astonishment that the spies express that someone might be offended at intrusions into their privacy. This is not hypocrisy so much as a position on the spectrum of sociopathy. It is also, most unfortunately, also on the spectrum of dehumanization that marks the beginning of the paths toward oppression, warfare, and genocide.
Thats a really great post Eric! I see this mentality all the time with local cops. Part of the problem, as I’m sure it was with NSA before Snowden exposed them, is that people are always flattering them and calling them heros. Like local cops, they probably never hear anyone condemn or even question what they are doing.
Thanks for this — but then, I do wish you’d made this point more acutely and less obliquely in the article as, it almost goes without saying, it sounds an exquisitely dissonant chord.
Yes, I see what you’re saying, but that’s why comments are a great backstop, where anything I’ve written can be queried and I have a chance, albeit in comments rather in the story, to expand/strengthen/clarify. Always hard to get every word, every intonation, exactly as it needs to be.
Pleased that you acknowledge the value of relevant comments and that you (and other Intercept writers) take the time to participate—as you deem appropriate and as time allows.
You kill the poem by dissecting it, Geoff. We all were having such a delicious wince.
This story is art. It conveys truth in a way that penetrates all rationalizations to the contrary.
And educates a few of us who value a more scientific and clinical reasoning to rationalize the persona’s in the drama triangle. For me, it added welcome context to the greater drama unfolding. Otherwise some might just call them mean girls and walk off in a huff. Today I learned something I didn’t know before. Thanks @ Eric. I had to look up the word facile. Like.
“Zelda” says: “the best solution is to keep your behavior above reproach…., watch what you say and do… and keep fodder for wagging tongues (your Viagra stash, photos of your wild-and-crazy girls’ weekend in Atlantic City) at home or out of sight”
This only allows them to pick and choose precisely who they want to “extract”, if everyone is hiding their “photos of wild-and-crazy girls weekend” then they simply target and find the exact individuals “photos” they want to “remove”. From personal experience if someone doesn’t have “the photos”, they will just make them up sometimes not even informing the person.
The moment you have to modify your natural behavior that you know is perfectly acceptable, there’s evidence of someone “stealing your rights” for illegal reasons. Immediately there is knowledge of a “beneficiary” of the situation.
Unfortunately what they’re doing is studying phenotypical behavior of a particular ethnicity and then aligning it with what is acceptable, thereby subtly incriminating everyone else’s behavior which allows that ethnicity to conglomerate and control the agency… and they’re well aware of it.
“Silenced in SID” says: “There is also an unspoken belief that he will move people to different desks to break up what he perceives as people becoming too “chummy.” (It’s been done under the guise of “creating teams.”)”
This seems to apply universally to everything they do, even on an international level. They have everyone’s school years information in front of them and they seem to always end up “just happening to arrange everyone in just the right way”(obvious predetermined outcome). It sure is coincidental how the beneficiary is always the exact same entity 100% of the time.
Mr. Maass
“……..An NSA official, writing under the pen name “Zelda,” has actually served at the agency as a Dear Abby for spies. Her “Ask Zelda!” columns, distributed on the agency’s intranet and accessible only to those with the proper security clearance, are among the documents leaked by NSA whistleblower Edward Snowden…….”
There is certainly some delicious irony in this article, but there is also more than a little irony for Mr. Snowden who is under the protectorate of Vladimir Putin, a former KGB officer in the USSR. The Soviet spy agency was hardly in the business of promoting free speech. Snowden wanted to reveal the extent of US spying in the world. Indeed, he wanted Americans to know the extent of the NSA’s assault on civil liberties in America. Instead, he is witnessing first-hand the violation of Ukrainian dignity and sovereignty with the invasion by the Russian military – ordered – by the same person who welcomed the pro-liberty advocate with open arms.
Snowden now lives in what has been described as a Mafia state. Journalists are beaten or even killed. Putin’s political opponents are jailed and worse. Rock bands are imprisoned for political protests. The invasion of the Ukraine was a natural outgrowth of a leader who bullies opponents to obtain what he desires. Now when it really matters and democracy is under assault, Mr. Snowden is not only powerless to reveal any related documents, but he chose Russia because he fully understood that Mr. Putin was only too happy for the anti-American publicity that he generated. Putin was no threat to turn him back over to the American authorities. Snowden chose Russia. Putin relished the attention then just as he relishes it now in Ukraine. If Putin can stick a needle in the eye of America, he will happily make the sacrifice that world condemnation brings.
For Mr. Snowden, it must be a little unsettling to sacrifice so much for democracy on the one hand and then sit idly by while your new country violates a democracy next door. There is also some “delicious” irony in his choice of places to live.
What does Zelda have to do with Snowden? Are you saying that he should have written to her for advice on what to do?
“Dear Zelda, I am struggling with my conscience, having found evidence of violations of the law by superiors…”
You’re a liar, Craig, and you know it. Snowden did not choose Russia. In fact, while he was stuck at the Moscow airport, he desperately tried to request asylum from 21 countries. A few granted it, but it was impossible for him to get to any of them.
From the beginning he suggested that Iceland would be his preferred choice. He also was willing to go through an extradition process in Hong Kong. It was only after he found that he would be detained during the proceedings, without access to a computer, that he decided to flee Hong Kong. It was Julian Assange’s idea to seek asylum in Ecuador. He got his friend, Fidel Narvaez, from the Ecuadorian consulate in London, to issue him a “diplomatic pass” (which, as it turned out, was invalid and unauthorized). Of course he had to fly through some place like Russia in order to avoid capture. What was a viable alternative route in your view?
Always happy to hear from you Jose
“…….You’re a liar, Craig, and you know it. Snowden did not choose Russia. In fact, while he was stuck at the Moscow airport, he desperately tried to request asylum from 21 countries. A few granted it, but it was impossible for him to get to any of them……”
Snowden flew to Hong Kong for the same reason as Russia – for protection. Of course, he released documents about spying on universities in Honk Kong and other places to generate anger.
Snowden clearly chose Russia for the same reason. He knew it was a safe place to go for the reasons I pointed out. Snowden had this well planned out. He chose Russia. Simple as that.
Thanks for your response.
Argument by assertion is not the most effective way to carry out historical revisionism. Again, it wasn’t even Snowden’s idea to use Russia as a scale in his itinerary.
More here.
And yes, if Russia is the only country in the world that can effectively offer him asylum, it is still better than the alternative.
“……More here….”
Think our WikiLeaks friend will return to Sweden to answer questions about assaulting a couple of women?
“…….. And yes, if Russia is the only country in the world that can effectively offer him asylum, it is still better than the alternative…..”
You are beginning to come around. Snowden’s IQ is off the charts. He planned this quite well.
Craig — that’s nonsense, and here’s why: If Snowden had planned this really well, why did Assange have to call his friend Fidel Narvaez at 4 in the morning to ask him to urgently produce a travel document for Snowden? Why didn’t Snowden go to Russia in the first place, instead of risking being captured?
If you had to choose between Russia and jail, would you choose jail? That seems quite irrational.
“………A statement on the WikiLeaks website later said Snowden had applied for asylum in a further 20 countries, including France, Germany, Ireland, China and Cuba……”
Looks like Snowden also applied for asylum in China and Cuba (according to a link from YOUR source). So – again- democracy i.e., liberty is not real high on his wish list. Russia works. Thankfully he isn’t gay though……..
Kudos to Jose for civil and on-point responses. Compare with the troll CraigPlumbers who immediately goes off-topic, attempts to assassinate the messenger, and drags in every anti-social stereotype to smear Snowden. Every post of CraigPlumbers is to smear Snowden without addressing the irony of the article about the NSA insider threat program… clearly the sign of a small mind…. probably a NSA worker-wannabe.
Blackhole
“………Every post of CraigPlumbers is to smear Snowden without addressing the irony of the article about the NSA insider threat program… clearly the sign of a small mind…. probably a NSA worker-wannabe…..”
You are partially right which is fairly good for the typical poster around here. I did say that “……..There is certainly some delicious irony in this article….” so I did address the article. But I didn’t drag in any social stereotype at all. I just mentioned that it’s a good thing he isn’t gay living in Russia. That’s fairly obvious given what the czar Putin said.
I could never work for the NSA. Too little computer skills, but I am a peeping Tom – a different kind of spying I guess.
Thanks for your response. CraigPlumbers. Man that just cracks me up.
“Thankfully he isn’t gay though……..”
right. As you say, asshole.
Craig your a real credit to the authoritarian, totalitarian, dictatorships which you support. You clearly have something against gay people. Maybe you hate Jews too, and believe in the master race? You belong in the USA, or UK buddy, you stay there, enjoy it and keep your goose steps stomping !
“……..You belong in the USA, or UK buddy, you stay there, enjoy it and keep your goose steps stomping !….”
What are you talking about? Nice to call over 400,000,000 people bigots, but it was Putin who made disparaging anti gay remarks before the Olympics.
Putin:
“…….President Vladimir Putin said Friday that gay people have nothing to fear in Russia as long as they leave children alone…..”
Do you read the news?
A self hating Jew?His concerns are ones of Zionists,ergo.
As you know, he didn’t “choose” to live there. Your trolling has become increasingly stale. If I thought you were capable of embarrassment I would expect that you would give it a rest, but you’ve proven again and again that personal embarrassment is beyond you.
Craig, as many other commenters have learned from reading and responding to your lies on Snowden, Glenn, and others, I, too, now recognize your trolling mode-of-operation. You are not as incoherent and irrational as Abbadabba but who could be, as he was from an alternate universe of “make believe”. You, however, are from a different alternate universe where lies are truth and truth is lies. Abbadabba appears to have left our rational universe, why don’t you? You, with your constant dogma of lies, have earned a place on my list of commenters to skip over as, with you, there is nothing there there.
For the upteenth time, Snowden did choose Hong Kong – he did not choose Russia. The facts – you know what facts are, don’t you? – are that Moscow and Cuba offered connecting flights for him to get to his preferred destination of Ecuador in Latin America. Wikileaks personnel assisted him with his travel arrangements (another known fact). He ended up stranded at the Moscow airport, as you know, for 39 days because the USA revoked his passport (another fact). After 39 days, he was offered asylum in Russia for one year. There are more facts on all this but you already have seen them.
Hello Jim
“…….For the upteenth time, Snowden did choose Hong Kong – he did not choose Russia. The facts – you know what facts are, don’t you? – are that Moscow and Cuba offered connecting flights for him to get to his preferred destination of Ecuador in Latin America…….”
Let me post this one more time. The WikiLeaks website posted that Snowden had applied for asylum in twenty countries including China and Cuba. Maybe you would like to take that up with Assange?
“……..A statement on the WikiLeaks website later said Snowden had applied for asylum in a further 20 countries, including France, Germany, Ireland, China and Cuba…..”
That’s China and Cuba, OK? He applied for asylum in Russia as well where he is currently located. I am sure Mr. Snowden prefers asylum in the US, but it ain’t going to happen.
“……..Abbadabba appears to have left our rational universe, why don’t you? You, with your constant dogma of lies, have earned a place on my list of commenters to skip over as, with you, there is nothing there there……”
Here, here. I never asked you to comment. I don’t care one way or the other if you do comment on what I write. I comment to the writer of the article – not the below the line ass kissing commentators like yourself.
Thanks.
There is certainly some delicious irony in this article, but there is also more than a little irony for Mr. Snowden who is under the protectorate of Vladimir Putin,
And the third irony in this particular pile you choose to tease apart is, of course (as others have already noted), that the US government ensured he ended up in Russia when they removed his passport. There is, of course, no irony whatsoever in the fact that US decision makers were too infatuated with their own importance to realize that Putin would leap at the opportunity to thumb his nose at them. To entertain for even a moment the idea that Putin would submit to the same indignities they heaped on the Bolivian President when they forced his plane out of the air is truly astonishing.
No irony at all in their collective thought process, however, just massive incompetence, short-sightedness, hubris and stupidity. I suppose that’s why they, and their sniveling supporters continue to try to truncate the story to advantage their “version” of history to this day.
You are not an honest interlocutor. It’s a shame you draw such attention in these threads, though that is by design I’m sure. You reliably produce a more controlled and venomous version of the tantrum that two-year-olds display when they feel neglected which every parent on the planet realizes at some point should be ignored lest they be interpreted as rewarding bad behavior.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NM8vKTFbMZM
“……..And the third irony in this particular pile you choose to tease apart is, of course (as others have already noted), that the US government ensured he ended up in Russia when they removed his passport………”
Of course, no one could possibly have guessed that the US government might get upset. Snowden with an IQ of 160 (supposedly) having signed the little non disclosure documents while exposed to national security secrets could never have guessed that the US would attempt to arrest and extradite him. So where did Mr. Snowden go? Right to Hong Kong where he conveniently disclosed some secrets about US spying on universities in the Chinese “special administrative region”. Then off to Russia – safe as can be (as long as he is a good little boy – and votes for Putin).
I would call the flight to Russia where he ended well planned out. It’s very likely he knew that the US would void his passport. He also knew that most countries were not going to provide him a safe haven. Again, he isn’t stupid.
Thanks for your comment.
Don’t you have better things to do with your time than writing the really stupid paragraph at the end of your comment with a link??
Thanks for letting me know how smart Snowden is. I’m pleased that he (supposedly) has an IQ of 160. Mine is lower as I have lost a few brain cells in aging.
It appears that your superb “hindsight and analytic powers” allow you to see that Snowden ending up at the Moscow airport and 39 days later accepting asylum in Russia was well planned by him from the very start. You should ask for a promotion as your super powers are unequalled except, maybe, by the gods.
A question. Since Snowden planned all this, why do you think that he spend 39 days in the Moscow airport transit zone? A good planner, let alone a “well” planner, would have already completed his Russia asylum paperwork and, upon getting his visa, immediately been driven to his country home. Why did he, with Sarah Harrison’s (Wikileaks) assistance, apply to over 20 countries for asylum during his 39-day stay? I mean filling out all that paperwork would give any of us writer’s cramp and, according to you, was a complete waste as he already knew he was staying in Russia.
“……..A question. Since Snowden planned all this, why do you think that he spend 39 days in the Moscow airport transit zone? A good planner, let alone a “well” planner, would have already completed his Russia asylum paperwork and, upon getting his visa, immediately been driven to his country home. Why did he, with Sarah Harrison’s (Wikileaks) assistance, apply to over 20 countries for asylum during his 39-day stay? I mean filling out all that paperwork would give any of us writer’s cramp and, according to you, was a complete waste as he already knew he was staying in Russia……”
It’s unlikely that Russia was his first choice, but apparently China was one of the countries where he applied for asylum. That is a step down even by Russia’s standards. None the less, I stand by what I said. He applied to a lot of countries, but probably knew that his choices were limited. Of course, he would liked to have ended up in Iceland, but he was more than willing to settle for less liberties than who he was exposing (the US) rather than stand on principal and face trial at home. So he is in the Kremlin under constant surveillance living in a mafia state that just invaded a sovereign nation. He has become a tool of propaganda for Putin. I’m sure he is depressed over these turn of events.
Thanks.
“Don’t you have better things to do…?”
Ah, irony abounds today.
Craig, you may want to watch the live-feed of Edward Snowden’s video appearance at the South-by-Southwest Technology (SXSW) in Austin, Texas. He will be on for an hour starting at 11 AM on Central Time, Monday, March 10. You can find the live-feed link by visiting the ACLU site earlier on Monday. Since you know so much about Snowden’s evil intents, this opportunity to hear him live is one you won’t want to miss.
His session is expected to draw 1000s at SXSW and more on live-stream. It will be available later on video and will, undoubtedly, be viewed by millions more in the coming months. Just thought you would want to know.
Edward Snowden, June 2013:
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/jun/09/edward-snowden-nsa-whistleblower-surveillance
Ok, so maybe not EVERY single document was carefully evaluated.
I can see how some NSA employees may not think it’s in the public interest to have it known that even they themselves, when speaking in secret, recognize the toxic effects of privacy invasions and the existence of a system of suspicionless surveillance.
But I can’t see how anyone else could possibly think that.
Glenn – thanks for responding. You all have revealed some great stuff but this piece is grasping at straws. Sure, there may be some irony and the concept of Zelda is pretty funny, but these types of complaints exist in virtually every office environment. The only difference is that they engage in spying as a profession.
LOL. May have been unintentional but you implying something here Glenn!?
The story stands alone as something interesting but this parallel your author is trying to draw to the Section 215/Section 702 revelations is closer to contrived than illuminating.
A culture of repressive spying within the agency undermines official channels for oversight, whistle-blowing and privacy protections. It stands in direct contrast to claims from NSA officials about the integrity and culture of the agency and serves as a useful point within the debate. The rest of the advice column serves as a useful measure of prevalence.
The culture of the NSA, indicative of the level of abuse that can be expected, is one of the central portions of the underlying debate. It is in the public interest to understand this culture, in light of the other leaks.
“Grasping at straws”? No, gaspingly funny and penetrating to the heart of the matter. “Sure, there may be some irony”? Take off the anti-irony glasses, Nate. The piece is chock-full of irony. “[t]hese types of complaints exist in virtually every office environment. The only difference is that they engage in spying as a profession”? How big do the dots have to be before you can connect them, Nate?
One other point – I have no doubt that NSA hates this type of story getting out because it continues their public humiliation but my underlying point was different.
Back in June, Snowden said he vetted the documents taken, seemingly setting himself apart from Chelsea Manning who snagged a huge swathe of documents. You can argue whether this piece is “legitimately” in the public interest but compared to the PRISM, Boundless Informant, Metadata, Spying on Merkel, Et al, is not the type of leak you’d associate with a whistleblower. Now, I am not saying this leak, which could be an outlier amongst the overall leaks in terms of insignificance, refutes or weakens the findings and impact of any past revelations but it calls to task some of his past claims about evaluating each document.
That’s said, it returns me to a question that you have yet to answer specifically. NSA says Snowden “accessed” 1.7 million documents. You refuted that, saying it was off by magnitudes and I believe you. So specifically, how many documents did Snowden actually take and how many of those documents did he provide to Poitras and yourself. How many of those went to the NYT, Guardian, WP, Propyblica? We know there are a least 60,000 documents just on the GCHQ end. But many are there total? And if you won’t answer this, could you please at least explain why?
Nate, you are a broken record with your repeated requests for number(s). Give us a break. Sleep on it a month (or more). I’m a numbers guy too, but asking the same question over and over again reminds me of a child constantly asking his mom “Can I have a cookie”. Even a child gives up after awhile. Why can’t you?
We don’t need to know how many documents total or in a category or which news organization or journalist has “how many”. Having a number or numbers satisfies our curiosity but really doesn’t rate in the top 100 things we need to know. You continue to state “there are at least 60,000 documents just on the GCHQ end” but this number is highly suspect as there is no proof. And we don’t really need to know. Maybe GCHQ would like to know but we don’t. Give it up and move on.
Additionally, your haranguing Snowden and also Glenn about what Snowden evaluated and revealed and what has been published, for what reason(s) is worthless “opinionating”. Snowden and Glenn and the news organizations who publish articles are much more knowledgeable and informed about the cache of Snowden documents than we are. I accept this fact. Why can’t you?
It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends on his not understanding it.
Upton Sinclair
Nate, you are a broken record with your repeated requests for number(s). Give us a break. …. Even a child gives up after awhile. — Jim Moore
I posted this above for the benefit of another particularly persistent poster, but perhaps it would have been better to save and post it here. Or maybe it has usefulness in multiple places.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NM8vKTFbMZM
Our Common ‘Tater also had a useful comment wrt some of our more persistent folks in these threads.
So is your message that if your question isn’t answered, stop asking? No thanks.
I don’t care what you think about their relevance. It is important to me (and probably others) for the previously stated reason. So don’t pretend your viewpoints and inquiries represent what we or I want to know. Also, don’t assume your body of knowledge on the matter is the same as mine. I have lots of potential questions for the NSA that I have pondered in forums since I can’t actually have them answered by NSA officials and have read the FISC opinions, NSA IG reports, judges rulings including Klayman, and read a lot of the extensive panel reports. They answered loads of questions. So, despite your depiction of me as some anti-Snowden, my inquiries go both ways. I want the entire picture and this is a piece of it.
Interesting how you then call the 60,000 document claim suspect when it has been mentioned by Guardian author Luke Harding and not refuted by Rusbridger is response to MPs http://www.theguardian.com/media/2013/dec/03/keith-vaz-alan-rusbridger-love-country-nsa
Now if this were not true, wouldn’t Luke, Glenn or Mr. Rusbridger correct the claim?
Also I LOL’d at your characterization of my comment as “worthless opinionating.” You realize this is a comments section of a website right!? Opinions tend to pop up.
Now if you want to delve into the details of PRISM, contact chaining, upstream collection, comparison of the differing federal judge opinions out of DC and NYC, interpretation of Section 215 of the PATRIOT Act, DOJ oversight, the seemingly unquestioning nature of the SSCI, the book “The Snowden Files,” past NSA abuses and the Church Committee, the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act, the falsehoods spread by Clapper, the rants of pro-NSA zealot Mike Rogers, the Independence issues of the FISC, the DOJ interpretation that opened the door for the metadata programs, the FISCs scathing critiques of NSA errors such as failing to enforce RAS on inquiries and not knowing about upstream collection’s pervasive nature, the inadequacy of the metadata program, the end of the Domestic metadata collection program in 2011, LOVEINT, the DEA’s use of “parallel construction,” the PCLOB or other panel report and their recommendations, the Amash Amendment and Sensenbrenner’s more recent effort, the inquiries from Bernie Sanders, the near absence of reporting on the matter from conservative (aside from also Libertarian) media, the comments of past NSA whistleblowers including Binney and Drake, the pathetic 60 Minutes fluff piece on the NSA where we watched some dweeb do a Rubix Cube, Americans’ indifference to the matter and the problem with arguments such as “I have nothing to hide!”, et al…
If you want to discuss any of those I am game. But sorry to break it – “Snowden’s actions and motivations” is on the list.
Because unless you want to argue my points, your engagement with me serves no purpose.
Good day!
Nate, the only entities that have a rational, supportable, defensible reason for wanting to know the actual numbers of documents in total, by category, and possessed by whom, are the government security agencies, primarily the NSA and GCHQ. Unless you work for these agencies, I expect your interest, like mine, in knowing these numbers is that you are curious. A question: what will you, an individual, learn or understand if you had all the numbers? Please describe, in detail.
Yes, opinions are key to Comments. My point is that your continual haranguing of Snowden and Glenn is best categorized as Worthless “opinionating”. I would appreciate viewing your opinions (and any supportable facts) on the important subjects you listed and say that you are familiar with.
The “numbers” (58,000 GCHQ classified documents carried by David Miranda) claim by Caroline Goode (UK MPS) and Oliver Robbins (UK Deputy Security adviser For Intelligence) are highly suspect (you should know this). Additionally, Luke Harding (Guardian reporter) and the Guardian Editor (Alan Rusbridger) are not fully convincing re the “numbers” they have divulged. I, for one, am willing to wait to see what numbers (and there are many being bandied about) are real and what numbers are out there for political, journalistic, “lets keep the NSA and GCHQ guessing”, personal reasons or ….
I ditto Jim Moore’s comments and advice to Nate. I have stopped reading what Nate writes, all I know is that he is a real pest.
@General Hercules – that just breaks my heart. Now I know you’ll actually be watching closer than ever.
@Nate “that just breaks my heart.”
abbadabba is a cardiologist by profession – let him attend to it. Don’t bother us with your quest for numbers. Go in an open field and start counting the stars. The number you get to after a year would be the same number of files that Snowden downloaded. But keep that to yourself – none of us are interested in it.
“But many are there total? ”
Says Clapper’s right hand sycophant..
Nate, having read the article twice and the comments, I can confidently state that, contrary to your personal opinion of “insignificance”, the vast majority of commenters find this article significant. Do your own counting and realize that making fun of something does, for that person, make the article significant. Ask Zelda reveals, in an NSA internal document, that the ones spying on us do not, themselves, like being spied on, And they and their co-worker spies are suffering from all the privacy related ills of being spied on that are well documented by psychologists, psychiatrists, and others who study the workings of the mind. Not being a spy and spying on others for a living, I found this article Significant and enlightening. Sorry you didn’t.
Background, in my 40 year technology focused career, I worked in over 15 offices across five states in eight organizations (two employers) and can’t remember one occasion of being spied on. I guess your experience was different.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argumentum_ad_populum. Lest you forget that these comments are almost absolutely homogenous in their content, that’s probably not a good indicator of what is significant.
Furthermore, The metadata and PRISM were significant because they created outrage and pointed out flaws that have now been reviewed and gone rough Court.
This story is significantly entertaining, I will give you that, and should make for some funny commentary, hopefully on the Daily Show and Colbert. That’s about it though.
Why do I have the feeling you are not actually sorry….and I am glad you reached enlightenment!
Yeah, taking a wild guess but I’d also conclude that my experience is different, LOL. And yes – I have worked in an environment where an unhappy employee who feels unfairly victimized, monitors people’s lunch breaks and trips to other offices. Trying to keep tabs on other people so if they are criticized, they can deflect it onto others. We also had an administrative assistant who was relaying the times people showed up to work by monitoring the elevator camera. This stuff happens and it sucks, creating a suspicion-based environment.
Maybe I don’t look as far into this as you because I’ve seen it.
Nate, per the Zelda posting above, congratulations on having a gold star added to your personnel folder. You must be proud. Having been recognized by your alphabet employer for your ?contributions? to the Intercept, I guess you will soon be promoted and will be heading over to the Faux (Fox) News site where you will find others equally erudite.
LEAVE. ..NATE…. ALONE!!!!!
Yay!! And I get congratulated by Jim. Well, I am just tickled to death by this honor. And to think you’d take time out of your busy retirement schedule, well…the tears are just rolling out my eyes!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kHmvkRoEowc
Irony-starved and obtuse; exactly what one expects from the national security apparatus. It goes with criminality in the name of security, and secrecy in furtherance of democracy. Classic.
“Innocent Bystander”.HAHA
Holy Mother of Irony. The criminals in the cuckoo’s nest spying on the other criminals who don’t like it so they contact Dear Abby. whudda thunk. I bet $1k heads are exploding exponentially on the bridge of the goodship NSA.
note to self… file under:
the Big Bang of comeuppance.
NSA = Massive Milgram experiment.
Great observation.
The phase “hitting the nail on the head” comes to mind. Now I wonder if Zelda can use the same logic to educate her superiors on how all that survelliance fucks with peoples heads regardless of those who engage in criminal activities or not.
OH, THE IRONY!
Any chance that the site will add a “Print” button so we can print copies of the articles rather than reading online? That’s often more convenient. Just sayin’.
Copy and paste what you want and then print it out. Just sayin’.
That’s what I’ve been doing at those web sites that don’t have the more convenient Print function.
As my name is Abby, I know a few things about giving advice. Bite me, Sister!
Did you see what Liberty did to her sister Justice just for looking? She’s blind, Jim.
That snake is snacking on its own tail.
Interesting. So, on some level these folks understand “privacy” when it comes to themselves… But, reading Quinn Norton’s essay about her invitation to spend a day at ODNI would suggest that this “understanding” doesn’t generalize to the rest of the human population.
As they say, read the whole thing.
And, why might this understanding not generalize? Quinn’s answer seems to be:
*** In a column titled, “Guilty Until Proven Innocent?”, Zelda responds to an NSA worker who goes by the pen name “Innocent Bystander” and who explains that a colleague has filed an anonymous complaint about their bosses, calling them “abysmal” and “idiotic.” ***
Innocent Bystander, hmmm. :)
:-) backatcha.
@Tallyho – thank you for the link… And thank you Quinn Norton for enlightening the collective perspective. You shared, “”People give up their privacy for the chance at a $.10 off coupon!” one person declared, to general agreement.”
A few years ago I was discussing something similar with a friend, a former casting assistant and who personally knows a certain twerker and her family. The discussion occurred the day after a much-debated televised performance involving a pole as a prop. In response to my question I was met with something along these lines, “What do you mean? All the kids are doing it. How is she supposed to earn a living if she doesn’t do what everyone else is doing?” Images of kids jumping off bridges in single-file flashed in my brain. Speechless is an understatement. I was definitely creeped out.
Is the trend of over-sharing in pop culture coincidental? From social media, to sexting, to blatent sexualization in mainstream entertainment, to revenge porn – when the genie is out of the bottle victims have few to zero rights in how their image is controlled. Don’t even get me started on the stalkerazzi. In the digital age stolen privacy and ruined reputations is a google away from a life sentence. No one’s image is protected by any presumed non-disclosure agreement. In our culture some very naive, immature, insecure and ignorant people are voracious in their consumption of the spoils of privacy forfeiture. Reality TV can be unreal! And just when you’d think the depths of discretion and depravity could sink no further a new hit hits or there’s a ratings slip and a fresh supply of starry-eyed copycats and one-uppers fall in line for the casting call to take their shot in hell. If the viewing public’s shame quotient is this divided is it creepy to enjoy the inevitable degradation?
How has this fallacy perpetuated itself beyond the schoolyard fences? Who’s spoon-feeding the message that there are no boundaries in personal privacy? Which device is broadcasting it for the staggering financial rewards of the gambit? What’s the ROI on futures trading for privacy? Where are the mines? How do we harvest it? How can we export it? To where? And how can we leverage it to our political advantage? What do we call these pioneering privacy entrepreneurs – Creepers? What is the stock symbol when the shares go public – CRPZ?
My God – how did we get here? We’ve all heard the mantra “sex sells”. Is that where this started? And if we dig deep – do we point the finger at lack of parental lapses or the social classes? Cheap shot. Proliferation of pornography? Obvious scapegoat. Does the Akre ruling block any debates on the matter in MSM? Definitely. Who knows the true origin – but what I do know is that privacy’s been surreptitiously parlayed it into a commodity for sale on the open market. The fire sale is raging, targeted, and expanding to demographics comfortable in a perverse social conditioning which now shatters any illusion of just how valuable it is. What if you place your entire self-worth, principles and ambition in celebrity and wealth? You sell low and win. If you place it in authority, control, influence and wealth? You buy high and win. It’s a win-win in the marketing strategy and branding of the notion that living in glass houses is super cool. And anyone who warns you off the predatory short sale is suspicious. If you believe that then here’s a piece of candy – now come inside my shiny white van because there’s some creepy creeps in your neighborhood.
I sincerely think Quinn is a better person than me when she says, “…these agencies … aren’t filled with bad people either.” Maybe because by media standards they really believe that privacy is evolving towards extinction. That in turn their entire culture has been conditioned to believe, “When you’re an incredibly well-funded defense and intelligence community, the lack of existential threats is an existential threat. There is nothing to do but be scared of things.” So maybe boredom, over-funding, and paranoia – and in the interest of national security – it’s their job, nay, it’s their duty to protect us FROM our own privacy. Quinn graciously reminds me that we are all imperfect human beings … but with that said she also tells them, “The act of looking makes you a creepy fucker.”
So we now know we have no rights to control how our individual privacy is collected and disseminated. Our government is stripping us of those rights for our own and the greater good. So what about all those in government who make the secret, illegal, and unconstitutional surveillance of private citizens their profession – doing it in concert with other employees, officials and agencies – watching, listening and reading in gangs our every move – assigning Nielson ratings to our identity – abandoning all oaths and forsaking citizen freedoms and national democracy – rubber stamped and bankrolled by our president and administration – who all operate under the assumption that consequences for such behavior are inconsequential – because THEIR rights are protected with an assurance of a free ride in the revolving door of conciliatory reproach, impunity, redemption and retirement benefits? The stench in their air doesn’t mean they secretly devised a remotely operated olfactory drone to sniff our panties – but it does confirm, for me, that they are all the grand fucking poo-bah’s, imperial brethren, and card-carrying members of the Jeepers Creepers Fucker Club. And if we’re fortunate enough to untangle THAT freakish cat’s cradle then maybe we’ll have time left over to deal with all the “normal” creeps. SMDH
*** In a column titled, “Guilty Until Proven Innocent?”, Zelda responds to an NSA worker who goes by the pen name “Innocent Bystander” and who explains that a colleague has filed an anonymous complaint about their bosses, calling them “abysmal” and “idiotic.” ***
Innocent Bystander, hmmm. :)
Bystander was always a good contributer to discussions.
I always trusted Bystander.
Its the ones you never consider that can really spin you.
“Innocent Bystander,”.
The things that make you go HMMM.
Couldn’t agree more. Just a tongue-in-cheek tip-of-the-hat to a fine contributor over the years.
@THG, Quinn Norton is an amazing young woman. Thank you for sharing that with us. It is refreshing to see the astonishing clarity that the next generation is capable of bringing to the table.
try posting again
this article on the internal gossip columnist shows how issues of governance have been reduced to personalities
quaint issues like balance of power have long been forgotten
this shows the intellectual and moral failure of spy agencies
Glenn posted today a link to Edward Snowden’s response to EU questions. He probably had legal advice, but in any case, the post is so much more articulate than those in the government.
The first comment I wrote on Glenn’s blog, it seems like a decade ago, was Hannah Arendt’s articles on Politics of Lying. Briefly, it takes much more work to lie because at any time the house of cards can collapse so barriers have to be made and maintained. I thought that way back then, the house of lies would collapse. Now with the documents and articles, the house of cards is collapsing.
This article about the gossip columnist for NSA shows the intellectual and moral corruption of our spy agencies. You can read Snowden for the truth.
http://site.d66.nl/intveld/document/testimony_snowden/f=/vjhvekoen1ww.pdf
His writing has really gotten tight. That’s what comes of long Russian Nights!
Don, thanks for providing the link to Edward Snowden’s statement to the EU, and his response to the EU questions. His statement and responses impressed me, especially with his many examples that clearly showed the threatening effects of worldwide mass surveillance on the lives of everyone including those EU parliamentarians and reporters he was addressing. I was pleased that every fact and source he mentioned was not new news to me.
Every commenter should read this 12-page document by Edward Snowden. I would like them to read it so at least they quit misquoting what he has has said in public
Didn’t finish my posting. Working from an iPad balanced on my lap leads to accidental early posting or, in a few cases, losing a comment.
In my posting above, my proofing would have changed my last sentence to “I would like those who intentionally or inadvertently mislead others re Snowden’s stated intentions, motivations, or actions to read it. We can question everything but, at the least, we shouldn’t misquote him.
Seriously? A story about gossip in the NSA? This is the best you have to offer from the multitudes of NSA documents from Snowden? I wan the good stuff, the stuff that really matters. The stuff that shows who runs the world and how. The nasty stuff that will make me want to revolt against my government!
Ruling is like herding sheep; you release a tidbit of information that moves the sheep in the desired direction – but never tell them that the final destination is the abattoir.
What you read in The Intercept is calculated to nudge you just the right amount.
We have reached a point where the US can no longer run the world by itself – it represents a shrinking share of the world’s total output. So it is necessary to release this information about the NSA, so that other governments can institute similar programs and collectively implement policies that will help usher in the new world order. You won’t be revolting anytime soon.
Now you know how it works.
So to be clear: you believe that we (and presumably Snowden) are secretly working with the NSA as part of its plot to get people accustomed to ubiquitous surveillance so they stop resisting and the NSA can consolidate its power even further? Is that what you believe?
If you want people to revolt, why don’t you devote your efforts to persuading them to do that?
What did I write which implies that I want people to revolt? That would only leave them worse off than before.
Neither do I believe you are working with the NSA. On the other hand, these revelations will lead to a new regulatory regime where all of the surveillance is legalized and legitimized, just as happened with the warantless wiretapping. As the surveillance becomes more pervasive, the fact of its existence would eventually have become apparent to even the most muddleheaded. So the articles in The Intercept do suit the agenda of making people more familiar and therefore eventually more acclimatized to the new reality.
However, chronicling this loss of freedom is certainly a worthwhile activity and I salute you for it. I am not a pessimist in the slightest; in future millennia, these stories may contain valuable information for our remote descendants.
” On the other hand, these revelations will lead to a new regulatory regime where all of the surveillance is legalized and legitimized, just as happened with the warantless wiretapping. As the surveillance becomes more pervasive, the fact of its existence would eventually have become apparent to even the most muddleheaded.”
So it shouldn’t be reported on so no one knows (how do you ask about something that you’re unaware of?) and meanwhile have blanket surveillance. The problem with your argument is most people suspected that they were being watched–just not to the extent that has been revealed.
No doubt that some of this garbage will get rubberstamped to be legalized all in the name of stars and stripes and cherry pie, but absolutely nothing can be done when there’s no official knowledge of the program(s) in question.
Sunlight disinfects.
If Common ‘Taters’ assertion below is correct:
Then it begs the question: Who is doing the calculating?
According to Common ‘Tater, either the NSA or some entity like them is both calculating and/or nudging us along; and Glenn Greenwald is complicit, wittingly or not, in its execution.
But the question still remains unanswered – specifically who or what is doing the calculating and/or nudging?
This “New World Order” proposal is just that, a projected outcome unsupported by facts or evidence.
By all means search for some proof of these activities to share with us all, but until such a time when facts or evidence arrive to support your position, please keep this unproductive speculation to yourselves.
This “New World Order” proposal is just that, a projected outcome unsupported by facts or evidence. — Sillyputty
I would go with “forewarned is forearmed” here. I think this is demonstrably what TPTB will attempt to do, just as they have in the past,
these revelations will lead to a new regulatory regime where all of the surveillance is legalized and legitimized, just as happened with the warantless wiretapping. — ‘Tater
This is true and, if one takes Alexander’s crimped acknowledgment of pending legislation aimed at investigative journalists as fact, is already percolating (if it ever stopped). In fact, I distinctly remember making a comment much to that effect in one of Glenn’s columns (way back when) discussing the posthoc legalization giving the telecoms immunity. Something to the effect of, “This can of worms, wherein illegal activities uncovered are legalized after the fact, will not be limited to these particular lawbreakers.”
Where I disagree with our Common Spud is that I don’t necessarily believe that acclimatization will result in acquiescence. That remains to be seen and, for someone who claims to be an optimist, I think it strange that ‘Tater appears to be leaning in what most of us would consider to be a dystopian direction with most of his/her comments regarding these issues.
@Sillyputty
That is easy. Every object/individual exerts some gravitational force. Your comment is a small nudge, even if as with your gravitational pull on the Earth, it is too small to be measured. Publication of the Snowden documents is a much larger nudge. The direction and rate of speed can be determined as the vector sum of all nudges.
My comment was addressed to the previous poster, who demanded a revelation which would reveal the entire truth. But even if the entire cache of Snowden documents is published, that represents only a fraction of the entire picture of what the NSA is doing. It probably wouldn’t even address the more important issue of why the NSA does what it does. And each new revelation in turn leads to further questions. So as with scientific inquiry, there is no ultimate revelation of truth, only the incremental progress of trying to construct a pattern from an accumulation of individual facts.
So demanding that the documents be released more quickly is like demanding that scientific progress proceed more quickly. The effort to do so would be counterproductive, since if the documents are not carefully vetted and compared with other existing information, the risk of misinterpretation and confusion would increase. That is why a scientist does not publish until the test results can withstand rigorous scrutiny.
As for the new world order, it may be completely different than imagined by the neoliberals or neocons. But the world ultimately will have a new order and simply because the capability to collect and analyze data will be far greater than anything we can currently imagine, the concept of freedom as we know it today – which essentially depends on the authorities having gaps in their knowledge about who we are and what we do – will no longer exist. Neither Glenn Greenwald, nor anyone else can change that.
But I could be wrong :)
@pedinska
Everyone picks a side to root for. I just consider dystopian worlds to be more interesting.
The optimist believes we live in the best of all possible worlds. The pessimist fears this is true.
Hi, Glenn! Let me say to you, sir, “Great work! Please keep it coming! We need all the info we can get.”
Regarding this last comment of yours, I’d like to refer everyone to another recent article. Specifically the one on government agents in “The Art of Deception: Training for Online Covert Operations”.
Um, I think we’ve found one.
@Common ‘Tater
Truth and facts are synonymous. What muddles things in any dialog are posts such as yours, which rely on innuendos such as:
If you have something to say, then say it. Don’t imply , intimate, or dance rhetorically around it.
Like so many other posters, you failed to answer a direct question, in this case as to who is designing this calculating nudging that you speak of?
That new information provides for different results in scientific inquiry as well as in news reporting goes without saying – what you fail to do is to state explicitly that you think that The Intercept, via Glenn Greenwald’s reporting is somehow the biased provocateur in this case.
Greenwald’s reporting is entirely appropriate, and that is because he’s doing exactly what he’s said he would do – report the news, back it up with facts, and do it no matter who’s footing the bill.
Rather disappointing, isn’t it? So either Firstlook is treading water until Glenn’s book comes out, or they really have scraped the bottom of Snowden’s material. People were led to believe that Snowden could tap anyone as he claimed, even the president, but perhaps that was an empty claim? I hope not. I hope he got the goods, but this is not looking good.
Snowden could tap anyone as he claimed, even the president
Zelda is the real decider. She rules the NSA and the NSA rules the world. Sorry if this disappoints you; my money was on the president too.
Snowden provided the following statement to the EU parliament: “I know the good and the bad of these systems, and what they can and cannot do, and I am telling you that without getting out of my chair, I could have read the private communications of any member of this committee, as well as any ordinary citizen. I swear under penalty of perjury that this is true. “
“I swear under penalty of perjury that this is true.”
Yeah, so what? Russ Tice made even more explosive claims when he said the NSA was tapping the phones of the entire power elite in America, apparently under orders from Cheney. But without the evidence, all this will fade away like the republic has faded away.
Just in the last week, I have come across multiple examples/evidence. Look and you shall find. Multiple examples can be found on the ACLU website where the ACLU is representing citizens suing the government for invading their privacy and violating their Constitutional rights. Check out a recent filing on an alarming situation that took place at an airport in the midwest where the woman/victim wasn’t even flying anywhere – she was just there to meet someone. Frightening.
That this reaction is painfully predictable doesn’t make it any less irrational:
(1) While it may not single-handedly bring down the US empire, the fact that NSA employees themselves recognize and internally describe the toxic effects of privacy invasions and pervasive surveillance is both noteworthy and important.
(2) In the 3 weeks we’ve existed, we’ve published 3 major, elaborate Snowden reports: (1) on the NSA’s use of metadata analysis to kill innocent people by drones; (2) the targeting of visitors to the WikiLeaks website and other attempts to punish dissenters and hactivists; and (3) the use of a variety of ‘dirty tricks” to infiltrate and warp internet discourse.
The fact that Peter Maass wrote a light but substantive article on these internal discussions doesn’t remotely impede our reporting efforts, and your wilful intent to pretend that that reporting doesn’t exist – so that you can complain that you’re not being sufficiently entertained – doesn’t make that reporting disappear.
(3) The reporting has already confirmed Snowden’s claims about being able to read anyone’s emails: see here.
As usual, those who complain loudest that the reporting isn’t coming fast enough are those who are least familiar with the reporting that has been done.
(4) The accusation that the Intercept Is “treading water” until my book comes out is, truly, too dumb for words. Aside from all the major reporting we’ve done in the 3 weeks we’ve existed, and the major reporting that we’re working on and that will be published shortly, why would the editors, publishers and other journalists at the Intercept – including those who have their own set of documents – possibly go along with my master conspiratorial plan to hold all reporting until my book comes out? How would that benefit anyone, let alone all the people who would have to go along with that plan?
(5) As usual, there is a major contradiction in the “we-want-more” complaints about the reporting. You demand that we disclose the documents, but the minute one is disclosed that doesn’t sufficiently entertain you, you proclaim that there was no point to it and that there are no big revelations left.
Some people have been saying that there are no big revelations left since, literally, the second week in June. Every time, they have been proven to be embarrassingly wrong: just as you will be.
Look, I know this is your ball field, but your refs sucks and I quit. You can get someone else to paint fence for you. I’m done with pitching hay to monetize your lame arse!
1) Why not make Snowden’s EU story the STORY!
2) Most of one of the 3 stories you’d reported I’d already read where no one else goes either, at NBC’s Investigative site the moment it broke.
3) I can follow NSA news AND the UK Hacking Scandal simultaneously but YOU can’t even connect those dots. Terror Unit ignored for 5 years hacking evidence that brought to court would have exposed THEIR illegal hacking, too. Shame on you for calling the eager ill informed.
4) I’ve googled “nsa newsews” and looked for ten pages and you can’t make the grade. WHO’s bad at media management? EXCUSE me for trying to help out the hay volume.
5) I told you guys you needed levity to make thsi hard truck an easier burden to bare, and got shot out of the comment section for being cryptic. Way to kill free speech, Glenn
I seriously hope Snowpee did not give the wrong guy the right stuff. I have followed this story since you broke it and you can’t seem to stop.
I want a cat video, MEOW! That’s gonna get me a LOT of cat food ads on my lappie!
What a waste of bulleted BS. Roll off, Wild Weasel.
Love to know if you will protect Glenn from an outed squirrel, matador. Sorry I can’t find the words to say what you demand or else.
“As usual, those who complain loudest that the reporting isn’t coming fast enough are those who are least familiar with the reporting that has been done.”
Untrue. I’ve followed this story from day one. And it’s been a long time, going on nine months now, from when Snowden make the claim that he could tap anyone, even the president. I believed him then, and I still believe him. And I believe that Russ Tice is correct too, and this phone tapping is the basis of a government takeover using blackmail. But I’m somewhere between fearing that Snowden’s material won’t make the case, and that too much time is passing and people are coming to accept this new status quo.
I, too, believe that Snowden’s statement, as asserted in his written address to the EU Parliamentarians, that he could tap anyone is true and accurate. Until the NSA will allow us to view Snowden, or someone with his level security clearance, sitting at a terminal and doing what Snowden says can be done, i.e., tap anyone, even the president, we have to go with who we trust. Since June of 2013, when I started following everything Snowden related, I have yet to find anything he has said to be false. What he has said, not what some have attributed to him. He has been honest from the very start.
He has to be the most confounding person the NSA, DOJ, and GCHQ has ever proclaimed an enemy. They must have nightmares just thinking about him. I continue to hope that he stays alive and can continue to share his views. He is doing a video presentation on Monday, 3/10, at 11AM Central Time, to the South by Southwest Technology Conference (SXSW) in Texas. The Conference is expecting 10,000+ attendees. His 1-hour talk will be live-streamed with an online video to follow.
Julian speaks on Saturday and Glenn speaks on Monday (also video hookups).
JCDavis,
Snowden’s material created and is still creating a awareness about internet surveillance. I believe it will take some time for this awareness to result in concrete change and there will be some recoiling but the inevitable process has begun and won’t be reversed.
Naturally, a TI would like to see things move along more quickly. But I have no grounds for complaint. Please keep up the good work only at a sustainable pace, with your usual due diligence. Take a vacation once in awhile.
You and your colleagues have delivered quite a bit, and the results have already benefitted people you will never know. For years, my usual reaction to a gang-stalking incident was a silent thought: “Did that really just happen?”. It was hard enough to admit it to myself; describing these incidents to a relative or friend was out of the question. Now the suspicions are confirmed; my reaction is more likely to be: “Oh, you again… Saved the Nation lately? Was it dangerous? I am sooo impressed with your selfless courage and sense of duty! 007, I would like you to meet someone…”. At least I can have a laugh at them now. (Charlie Chaplin was on to something.)
But my personal satisfaction is no solace for those who have been treated, or rendered, much more roughly by the Nation’s Saviors. I want to see the goods on those who have been stalking and surveilling me since at least 2001, and I want it now! But there is a bigger picture and a limited supply of trustworthy resources. My impatience is ugly; I will wait in line.
sometimes I think that to the degree the some complain about wanting more from you–of you–is poportionate to the degree of their despair. for most, it’s the tendency to look outside ourselves e.g. the savior, the mentor, the teacher, etc. . .. for direction and and clarity–for hope. I don’t think they really intend to be so self-aborbed and insensitive, which can come off as callous and angry. sorry you and your colleagues have to bear the brunt of some of that; i don’t think it’s as personal as it comes across. .. for whatever it’s worth.
“As usual, those who complain loudest that the reporting isn’t coming fast enough are those who are least familiar with the reporting that has been done.”
Not me! I am enjoying this Chess game simply for this reason.
[7:30]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vt7XloDNcm4
How come when something is published that you aren’t excited about, that causes you to assume that nothing will be published that you will be excited about? It’s like saying, “Well shit, such and such a musician or band are coming out with some uninteresting music. I guess there is no hope of ever hearing some interesting music from anyone – ever.”
True!
I’m not excited about any of this stuff, Kitt. How could I be? What has happened to America is unspeakable–a takeover of government by neocons from the last Administration, and now we have a president who is a coward and a puppet, who even went to Bill Kristol and asked for his approval of his policies, and Krisol gave it! He congratulated Obama on becoming a born-again neocon. So unless this phony president is taken down, we will continue with this fantasy republic until we get our next puppet.
“The nasty stuff that will make me want to revolt against my government!”
oh phulllllleeeeeeese. Listen Benedict Arnold, if what has been released already didn’t do it, you’re already hopeless.
Thanks, Bloody. This point could not have been made any better.
The reason the present conditions exist is that so many need a command to action from an unchallengeable authority, one that can exist only in their stunted imagination.
And to think, this authoritarian mindset passes for that of a nation that prides itself on its freedom.
There are plenty of serious revelations for those who are accustomed to thinking in terms of political movements, ideologies etc. But fact is many, if not most, people won’t be reached in that way. they don’t care or tell themselves they won’t make a difference. So making them the object of ridicule can help in the vein of making people realise how all this spying is plain creepy (if not evil). Damn them with laughter !!