The U.S. government has long lavished overwhelming aid on Israel, providing cash, weapons and surveillance technology that play a crucial role in Israel’s attacks on its neighbors. But top secret documents provided by NSA whistleblower Edward Snowden shed substantial new light on how the U.S. and its partners directly enable Israel’s military assaults – such as the one on Gaza.
Over the last decade, the NSA has significantly increased the surveillance assistance it provides to its Israeli counterpart, the Israeli SIGINT National Unit (ISNU; also known as Unit 8200), including data used to monitor and target Palestinians. In many cases, the NSA and ISNU work cooperatively with the British and Canadian spy agencies, the GCHQ and CSEC.
The relationship has, on at least one occasion, entailed the covert payment of a large amount of cash to Israeli operatives. Beyond their own surveillance programs, the American and British surveillance agencies rely on U.S.-supported Arab regimes, including the Jordanian monarchy and even the Palestinian Authority Security Forces, to provide vital spying services regarding Palestinian targets.
The new documents underscore the indispensable, direct involvement of the U.S. government and its key allies in Israeli aggression against its neighbors. That covert support is squarely at odds with the posture of helpless detachment typically adopted by Obama officials and their supporters.
President Obama, in his press conference on Friday, said “it is heartbreaking to see what’s happening there,” referring to the weeks of civilian deaths in Gaza – “as if he’s just a bystander, watching it all unfold,” observed Brooklyn College Professor Corey Robin. Robin added: “Obama talks about Gaza as if it were a natural disaster, an uncontrollable biological event.”
Each time Israel attacks Gaza and massacres its trapped civilian population – at the end of 2008, in the fall of 2012, and now again this past month – the same process repeats itself in both U.S. media and government circles: the U.S. government feeds Israel the weapons it uses and steadfastly defends its aggression both publicly and at the U.N.; the U.S. Congress unanimously enacts one resolution after the next to support and enable Israel; and then American media figures pretend that the Israeli attack has nothing to do with their country, that it’s just some sort of unfortunately intractable, distant conflict between two equally intransigent foreign parties in response to which all decent Americans helplessly throw up their hands as though they bear no responsibility.
“The United States has been trying to broker peace in the Middle East for the past 20 years,” wrote the liberal commentator Kevin Drum in Mother Jones, last Tuesday. The following day, CNN reported that the Obama administration “agreed to Israel’s request to resupply it with several types of ammunition … Among the items being bought are 120mm mortar rounds and 40mm ammunition for grenade launchers.”
The new Snowden documents illustrate a crucial fact: Israeli aggression would be impossible without the constant, lavish support and protection of the U.S. government, which is anything but a neutral, peace-brokering party in these attacks. And the relationship between the NSA and its partners on the one hand, and the Israeli spying agency on the other, is at the center of that enabling.

Tally of UN Vote on July 22, 2014 to investigate violations of international law in West Bank and Gaza (Credit: Ken Roth, Human Rights Watch)
Last September, the Guardian revealed that the NSA “routinely shares raw intelligence data with Israel without first sifting it to remove information about US citizens.” The paper published the full top secret Memoranadum of Understanding between the two agencies governing that sharing. But the NSA/ISNU relationship extends far beyond that.
One newly disclosed top secret NSA document, dated April 13, 2013 and published today by the Intercept, recounts that the “NSA maintains a far-reaching technical and analytic relationship with the Israeli SIGINT National Unit (ISNU) sharing information on access, intercept, targeting, language, analysis and reporting.”
Specifically, “this SIGINT relationship has increasingly been the catalyst for a broader intelligence relationship between the United States and Israel.” Moreover, “NSA’s cyber partnerships expanded beyond ISNU to include Israeli Defense Intelligence’s [Special Operation Division] SOD and Mossad.”
Under this expanded cooperation, the Americans and Israelis work together to gain access to “geographic targets [that] include the countries of North Africa, the Middle East, the Persian Gulf, South Asia, and the Islamic republics of the former Soviet Union.” It also includes “a dedicated communications line between NSA and ISNU [that] supports the exchange of raw material, as well as daily analytic and technical correspondence.”
The relationship has provided Israel with ample support for both intelligence and surveillance: “The Israeli side enjoys the benefits of expanded geographic access to world-class NSA cryptanalytic and SIGINT engineering expertise, and also gains controlled access to advanced U.S. technology and equipment via accommodation buys and foreign military sales.” Among Israel’s priorities for the cooperation are what the NSA calls “Palestinian terrorism.”
The cooperation between the NSA and ISNU began decades ago. A top secret agreement between the two agencies from July 1999 recounts that the first formal intelligence-sharing agreement was entered into in 1968 between U.S. President Lyndon Johnson and Israeli Prime Minister Levi Eshkol, and informally began in the 1950s. But the relationship has grown rapidly in the last decade.
In 2003 and 2004, the Israelis were pressuring the NSA to agree to a massively expanded intelligence-sharing relationship called “Gladiator.” As part of that process, Israel wanted the Americans to pay hundreds of millions of dollars to fund Israeli activities. The specific proposed “Gladiator” agreement appears never to have been consummated, derailed by Israeli demands that the U.S. bear the full cost, but documents in the Snowden archive pertaining to those negotiations contain what appear to be two receipts for one or more payments of $500,000 in cash to Israeli officials for unspecified purposes:


The surveillance-sharing relationship with Israel has expanded to include the NSA’s British and Canadian counterparts, GCHQ and CSEC, both of which actively participate in feeding the Israelis selected communications data they have collected. Several documents from early 2009, at the height of the Israeli attack on Gaza called “Cast Lead” that left more than 1,000 people dead, detail some of this cooperation.
One top secret 2009 GCHQ project named “YESTERNIGHT” involved “Ruffle,” the British agency’s code name for ISNU. According to the document, the project involved a “trilateral (GCHQ, NSA and Third Party RUFFLE) targeting exchange agreement covering respective COMSAT accesses.” One of the “specific intelligence topics” shared between the parties was “Palestinians”, although the GCHQ document states that “due to the sensitivities” of Israeli involvement, that particular program does not include direct targeting of Palestinians and Israelis themselves. Another GCHQ document from February, 2009, describes “a quadrilateral meeting for RUFFLE, NSA, CSEC and GCHQ.”
The British agency noted in early 2009 that it had been spying on emails and telephone numbers specifically requested by ISNU, “and they have thanked us many times over.”
The NSA and GCHQ receive intelligence about the Palestinians from many sources. The agencies have even succeeded in inducing the U.S.-supported Palestinian Authority Security Forces (PASF) to provide them with surveillance and intelligence about other Arab groups in the region. One July 2008 GCHQ document states:

Jordan also feeds surveillance data about the Palestinians to the NSA. One classified NSA document from 2013 describes how “NSA’s partnership with EWD [the Jordanian Electronic Warfare Directorate] is a well established, long-standing and trusted relationship dating back to the early 1980’s.” Specifically, the two agencies “cooperate on high-priority SIGINT targets of mutual interest” that includes the Palestinian Security Forces.
The document continues: “EWD provides high-interest, unique collection on targets of mutual interest, such as the Palestinian Security Forces; EWD is the sole contributor to a large body of NSA’s reporting on this target.”

But even as the NSA and its partners are directed by political branches to feed the Israelis surveillance data and technology, they constantly characterize Israel as a threat – both to their own national security and more generally to regional peace. In stark contrast to the public statements about Israel made by American and British officials, the Snowden archive is replete with discussions of the Israelis as a menace rather than an ally.
NSA documents previously published by the Guardian stated that “one of NSA’s biggest threats is actually from friendly intelligence services, like Israel.” Another notes that the National Intelligence Estimate ranked Israel as “the third most aggressive intelligence service against the U.S.”
British officials have a similar view of the Israelis, describing them as a “very real threat to regional stability.” One top secret GCHQ planning document from 2008 notes that “policy makers remain deeply concerned over the potential threat that Israel poses to a peaceful resolution of the Iran problem, and to some of Israel’s less desirable activities in the region.” Moreover, “Israel’s thinking on the long-term threat offered by Iran to its fundamental foreign policy strategy of armed deterrence may create very real threats to regional stability in 2009.”

The NSA’s 2007 Strategic Mission List, identifying priorities for surveillance targeting, repeatedly identifies Israel as one of the leading threats in a diverse range of areas, including: “Combating the threat of development of weapons of mass destruction” and “delivery methods (particularly ballistic and nuclear-capable cruise missiles).” The “focus area” for that concern is “WMD and missile proliferation activities,” and one of the leading threats is listed as “Israel (cruise missiles).”
The NSA internal discussion from that document regarding “Mastering Cyberspace and Preventing an Attack on U.S. Critical Information Systems” includes a subheading on “FIS [financial/banking system] threats.” The nations identified as the leading FIS threats include India, North Korea, Cuba and Israel. Similarly, Israel appears on the list of countries believed by the NSA to be “Enabling EW (producers/proliferators).”
Another section of the threat assessment document is entitled “Foreign Intelligence, Conterintelligence; Denial & Deception Activities: Countering Foreign Intelligence Threats.” It is defined as “Espionage/intelligence collection operations and manipulation/influence operations conducted by foreign intelligence services directed against U.S. government, military, science & technology and Intelligence Community.” The countries posing the greatest threat: “China, Russia, Cuba, Israel, Iran, Pakistan, North Korea, France, Venezuela, and South Korea.”
Asked about its cooperative relationship with Israel, an NSA spokesperson told the Intercept: “We are not going to comment on specific intelligence activities and relationships. The fact that intelligence services sometimes cooperate in a lawful and appropriate manner mutually strengthens the security of both nations. Whenever NSA shares intelligence information or technology, we comply with all applicable laws and rules.” A GCHQ official refused to comment on the record beyond the agency’s standard boilerplate claiming its activities are legal and subject to “rigorous oversight.”
Legal or not, the NSA’s extensive, multi-level cooperation with Israeli military and intelligence agencies is part of a broader American policy that actively supports and enables Israeli aggression and militarism. Every Israeli action in Gaza has U.S. fingerprints all over it. Many Americans may wish that the Israeli attack on Gaza were a matter of no special relevance or concern to them, but it is their own government that centrally enables this violence.
Andrew Fishman provided additional reporting for this article


Hillary Clinton lets her views be known as to who’s responsible for the killing of hundreds and wounding of thousands of civilians in Gaza. According to her, it’s not Israel’s fault. Gee, I wonder why she says that? Any ideas?
In the section below she completely leaves out the relevant precipitating events that led up to the Hamas rocket attacks, i.e., the murdering of two Palestinian teenagers by Israeli snipers, the murdering and rampaging of the Israeli army through the West Bank, the crippling economic siege in Gaza, etc. She didn’t mention any of those things — any one of which by itself would have warranted retaliation by any other country on earth provided the victims weren’t Palestinian. She also goes so far as to suggest that people’s emotional response to the massacre of the Palestinian people may be clouding their judgment.
In the last paragraph she provides the obligatory ‘mistakes may have been’ but without saying that it may have been Israel who made them. Instead, she says “we’ve made them” too. Like, It’s cool, we mess up, too. I’m not saying you did….you may not have…but if you did. So who knows? Probably you didn’t… so, no worries, don’t get mad. Clinton further implies that it doesn’t matter anyway because Israel has “democratic” “values” (just like us!) in “conflict” situations, so there you have it. There’s nothing left to discuss. Are we done here? And then…surprise! Hamas did it! Sorry, did I ruin it for you? Actually, she says so twice so it must be true.
What a horrid woman. Oh, and the piece was written by Jeffrey Goldberg. Surprise!
http://m.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2014/08/hillary-clinton-failure-to-help-syrian-rebels-led-to-the-rise-of-isis/375832/#
* Sorry, she said that Hamas is responsible three times, not two. I don’t know about you, but that additional 3rd assertion cinches it for me.
Seattle City Council Member, Kshama Sawant, writes a letter to Obama and congress condemning the violence in Gaza. She closes her letter with,
http://sawant.seattle.gov/draft-letter-condemning-continued-violence-in-gaza/
LEFT: Nazi poster calls for “1 people, 1 state, 1 leader”
RIGHT: Israelis hold sign with exact same words last night
https://twitter.com/davidsheen/status/498371275190845441
Amazing. There have been other instances of this, no? Tee shirts and the like…
It shows how disengaged from their past Israeli youth have become.
“And what rough beast, its hour come round at last,
Slouches towards Bethlehem to be born?”
W.B. Yeats
The person behind the sign is Israeli rapper, Yoav Eliasi aka The Shadow:
Inside Israel’s Pro-War Nationalist Camp
http://therealnews.com/t2/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=31&Itemid=74&jumival=12191
Yes, thanks. That’s it. I read about that guy. Scary.
>”Israeli rapper Yoav Eliasi, who calls himself…the Shadow.”
How aptly named! How terribly frightening! Will Jewish American Zionists finally see the light?
Precisely.
This is the best history lesson regarding Zionist control of Israel as it pertains to the current state of affairs between Israel and their human conquests the Palestinians:
“The Ring of Power – Palestine Israel [20 29] ”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FnW_vO0VeI0&list=PLB27102B532501E72&index=20
It is my sincere hope that after watching this part (20) of whole Ring of Power film, people will watch the whole thing (29 parts) which is available at the link provided.
To love, truth, peace, and light.
American Exceptionalism: There have been
huge demonstrations in support of Gaza in
Paris and London but only comparatively small demonstrations in the US. Few Americans question the official narrative
while the French even broke the law to demonstrate.
@ larry:
Well….there is this: ” Anti-Israeli demo held in New York City”
http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2014/08/10/374728/antiisraeli-demo-held-in-new-york-city/
It is a beginning…although the USG is doing everything to keep it out of US media outlets.
Here is an interesting twist on “defensive measures”. According to a Hamas spokesman, Hamas is not happy that their demand for Israel ending the blockade of Gaza and releasing prisoners is not being met.
“…….Ihab al-Ghussein, the Islamist organisation’s deputy information minister, said that “if on [Sunday] we have no response to our demands, our defensive measures will be intensified”……”
Hamas may have invented a euphemism for “escalation” – increasing defensive measures. It’s quite good.
A state of siege in an occupied territory
is an act of war and those affected have a right to resist. Israel is bound by international law to protect the people of an occupied territory. Putting them on a “diet” , not allowing them to travel outside the prison, and destroying their homes is not protecting them.
There is NO occupation of Gaza.
According to the new Israeli definition of “occupation”. Why can’t the people of Gaza leave the prison if there is no occupation.
You’re fucking disgusting Craig. You’ve the personality of a holocaust denier.
AtheistinChief
“…….You’re fucking disgusting Craig. You’ve the personality of a holocaust denier…..”
It’s fairly obvious that the Holocaust was well documented. The occupation of Gaza was also well documented. In 2005, Israel pulled out of Gaza including about 10,000 settlers. Israel left the affairs of Gaza to the Palestinians.
Would you prefer that a lie stand for political reasons, Atheist?
“A Hideous Atrocity”: Noam Chomsky on Israel’s Assault on Gaza & U.S. Support for the Occupation
http://www.democracynow.org/2014/8/7/a_hideous_atrocity_noam_chomsky_on
In addition to the above, Human Rights Watch and Amnesty International also consider Gaza to be occupied.
Wikileaks: Ban Ki-Moon Worked with Israel to Undermine UN Report
The General Secretary of United Nations (UN) Ban Ki-Moon collaborated in secret with Israel and the United States to weaken the effects of a Board of Inquiry’s report accusing Israel of human rights violations in Gaza in Dec. 2008 – Jan. 2009.
http://telesurtv.net/english/news/Wikileaks-Ban-Ki-Moon-Worked-with-Israel-to-Undermine-UN-Report-20140809-0020.html
https://wikileaks.org/plusd/cables/09USUNNEWYORK468_a.html#efmAwLA68BANBfpBgRBxw
https://wikileaks.org/plusd/cables/09USUNNEWYORK460_a.html#efmAkyAsYAskA0O
UN’s Ban Ki-moon is a partner in Israel’s crimes
The Electronic Intifada – 8 August 2014
http://electronicintifada.net/content/uns-ban-ki-moon-partner-israels-crimes/13716
It has been universally understood since its founding that the UN is run by the US. The UN leadership must be approved of by the US. In 1996 the Clinton Administrartion vetoed a second term for Boutros Boutros Ghali
because he was not following orders to the letter. Ban ki Moon can do as he is told or resign. The whole world knows what an inquiry by the UN means .
But Larry, the UN still produced the Goldstone report – and in record time (about six months). The US does have considerable amount of influence at the UN (like veto power), but ultimately, the US cannot control every study or decision by the UN.
According to Wikipedia “……On 1 April 2011, Goldstone retracted his claim that it was Israeli government policy to deliberately target citizens, saying “While the investigations published by the Israeli military and recognized in the U.N. committee’s report have established the validity of some incidents that we investigated in cases involving individual soldiers, they also indicate that civilians were not intentionally targeted as a matter of policy.”[14]……”
That retraction was huge for Israel. Interestingly enough, the Sri Lankan government hid behind Operation Cast Lead as they crushed the Tamil Tigers killing thousands. Where is the “Goldstone” report on that conflict?
Thanks.
Everyone knows the Goldstone report was later redacted.
Retracted, not redacted and by the author, Larry…….by the author – Goldstone – who’s name the report was released in. Again, where is the UN sponsored “Goldstone” report on the slaughter of the Tamil Tigers and civilians by the Sri Lankan government? The obvious answer is: why should you (or anyone else) give a flying fuck about that?
But you correctly maintain “…The whole world knows what an inquiry by the UN means….”. It generally means selective focus on the IP conflict (just like the hard left).
Thanks.
In the earlier version Goldstone said civilians were targeted by Israel. Under pressure from the US and Israel he reversed that claim. We have seen with our own eyes that Israel has targeted civilians in the latest massacre so in this case it is Israel against the world.
Again Tujays, thank you for all your pertinent and precise contributions.
You’re welcome. And, thank you!
“150 + International Legal Experts: Israel Has Committed War Crimes … Should be Referred to the International Criminal Court”
http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2014/08/150-international-legal-experts-israel-committed-war-crimes-referred-international-criminal-court.html
People need to come to terms with the fact that the both the U.S. and Israel and its citizens are all directly responsible for the crimes being committed against the Palestinian people. Even though I wasn’t involved in the policy decision to send bombs to Israel, and even though I didn’t condone it, those facts don’t absolve me from responsibility. While not directly complicit, by virtue of being a U.S. citizen, I have to assume responsibility for my country’s actions. Also, while I can’t undue the atrocities that were committed, rather than take part in hand-wringing, I can acknowledge my country’s culpability and work to remedy the ongoing violations with the intent of ending them. In addition, I can also help to gain recompense for the victims for the horrible suffering the Palestinian people have endured for the past 66-years — which wouldn’t have occurred were it not for direct U.S. support.
For decades now, the U.S. has been sending its assassins overseas into various regions for the purpose upsetting the balance of power in order to satisfy America’s selfish ends. Not only covertly, but overtly — the last major incursions in that regard being Vietnam and Iraq. While it may be satisfying to blame the CIA, Nixon, Reagan, Bush, etc., it by no means diminishes the collective responsibility of the American people. For too long, the U.S. citizenry has been content in blaming others for what they’re collectively responsible for, whether intentional or not.
It’s true that many marched and spoke out against U.S. involvement in Vietnam and Iraq, and that there’re many identifiable figures in government who orchestrated those invasions and who enabled their perpetuation. At the same time, however, there was a polarization within the public that was pro- and anti-war. During the Vietnam era, the pro-war people would use phrases such as ‘America, Love it or Leave it’ while bemoaning the fact that we had to ‘fight with one hand tied behind our back’ due the ant-war sentiment infecting the media and permeating the rest of American culture. This, they claimed, was ultimately responsible for the formulation of policy which was a loosing strategy. That really happened. To this day there’re many people who still feel that we could’ve won Vietnam and that it was a mistake to pull out. Hence, the Rambo movies.
During the Iraq fiascos, there was invariably a lot of jingoistic bluster and riveting action-packed bravado that was splashed across the CNN banners on a nightly basis, e.g., ‘Shock and Awe’. It was our time to make up for what happened in Vietnam. This time we would collectively ‘get some’ without any apology. We were going to kick ass and show the world what’s up. America, goddamn it…you bet. This was no better exemplified than by Thomas Friedman when he was interviewed by Charlie Rose, “We needed to go over there, basically, and take out a very big stick right in the heart of that world and burst that bubble”. While he ostensibly meant to relate his comment as some sort of sick and twisted payback for 9/11, it was also just as much a visceral delayed knee-jerk reaction along the lines of, no more ‘fighting with one hand tied behind our back’. While that may be debatable in some quarters, I do remember the mood at the time and there were those who suffered from Vietnam Comeuppance Syndrome.
The fact that there was or wasn’t any sort of justifiable pretense for the last Iraq invasion (Bush jr.) was a secondary issue. What was important — for the collective benefit of Americans — was that they got to redeem themselves by reasserting America’s dominance in the world by the use of force. At it’s core, the Iraq war was driven by America’s collective Napoleon complex. That’s not do to say that the conniving architects didn’t play a major role. Of they course they did. Because WE LET THEM.
People who want to absolve themselves or others because they feel they weren’t directly responsible for the ongoing egregious crimes committed by the U.S. and Israel need to reevaluate that perspective. People who aren’t doing anything to raise awareness of the U.S. and Israeli crimes against humanity are responsible by proxy. They’re also further enabling the continuation of the misery experienced by the Palestinian people by virtue of their silence. I don’t mean to lecture, I’m just stating what I believe to be fact.
As the recent American Conservative article points out, there were precursors which led up to the rise of Nazism. Those precursors involved the German public’s willingness to absolve themselves because they weren’t themselves condoning a fascist or racist agenda; they were above that, so they let it happen. It was this type of detachment that effectively gave them permission to not involve themselves in speaking out to raise the collective awareness of what was going on in their midst. This failure was born of moral cowardice and ignorance which enabled the malignancy to fester and grow. How could it not? If there’s not any resistance, then the tumor will take over. It’s nature’s way.
In terms of collective moral blinders, we’re at the same cross-roads in history that facilitated the ascent of Nazism in Germany. As U.S. and Israeli citizens, we either choose to get involved or we don’t. There’s no middle ground. We also have a moral obligation as world citizens to speak out; which, of course, many are. What we do as individuals determines what is manifest collectively. Our choice as to whether we help or ignore the plight of the Palestinian’s will determine whether we’ve moved beyond the moral cowardice of the type that enabled the birth to the ugly regime that was characterized by fascistic racism.
As the saying goes, history doesn’t repeat itself, but it sometimes rhymes. Given the current sentiment that’s being overtly expressed in Israel, I would say a more apropos and up-to-date musical analogy would be to say that events today are being ‘sampled’ from the past. How the song ends will be determined by what each of us does today. If we act with moral courage, then our actions in the moment will help those who’ve suffered tremendously through the years. At the same time, we’ll have salvaged our humanity in the process. Freeing Palestine is also about freeing ourselves from moral cowardice so that we don’t repeat past mistakes.
Rather than focus on who’s worthy to be absolved from responsibility, we should just acknowledge that we’re all ultimately responsible. We all need to do our part to put a stop to the barbaric insanity of the never-ending cycle of occupation, oppression, and slaughter. I’m really grateful that Glenn is here with us providing the exposure that’s desperately needed. Always keep in your mind that everything we do is important and consequential. Everything.
If you hate this country so much as to condemn it why are you still here ? Nothing is stopping you from going to Gaza or any other country of your choosing so you should immigrate to where ever you think is so great, and then you can bash this country all you want ! So in short THIS IS THE USA LOVE IT OR GET THE FU@K OUT no one is stopping you ! Don’t have the money? Don’t worry, I and patriots like me will gladly buy a one way ticket to the country of your choosing as long as you never come back !
You can’t be for real. Your comment too perfectly encapsulates the moronic “love it or leave it” attitude I described above. Your expressed stupidity is too over the top to be believed.
The top ten belligerents of WWI of a century ago remain the largest and most prolific arms exporters in the world. The only new addition to the group is Israel, hovering around number seven depending on what source referenced.
War is big business and it isn’t limited to traditional materiel. Another war, the chemical war wages on. Whether it is psychotropic pharmaceuticals, Mansanto’s Round Up, or cornering Afghanistan’s illicit opium trade, the big pharm and the military-industrial complex continue to enjoy a cozy relationship of ill-gotten profits while the every day citizen is culled by slaughter or by chemical lobotomies, or similar, that render human beings as “helpless” addicts or numbed out robotrons.
I do not think it is intentional, but the development of smart phones and their prolific use further mesmerize an increasingly made-stupid population. A mass hypnotism is underway such that the Bill of Rights are to be supplanted on the mindset of idealistic youth by twerking hips and egg-throwing brats.
It is one of those “uncomfortable” topics but a Hollywood is heavily pro-Zion any way you slice it. And being pro-Zion is supporting an apartheid Israel. So forget about mass media-infotainment being a bastion of free thought.
And if Americans do not understand the Bill of Rights, are we really living in a democracy? Nope.
Hitler cornered the pharm-chemical, munitions, and propaganda industries and in doing so was able to perform a mass indoctrination that was the most regrettable ever to be conceived by man. I just don’t think humanity is being as bright-eyed about a systemic betrayal of humanity, even if it is somehow unintentional. The effect and result will ultimately be the same.
It is good to remember that up to 40% of the adult male population of Iran is addicted to opium and that any psychological-based warfare on Iran would exploit such a reality.
The modern man may view the legalization of marijuana as a positive development, but I assure you that the potency and abuse of marijuana is having a profound and deleterious effect on teenagers and young adults. It is one thing to chew a coca leaf and quite another to snort a line of coke. And I would think that smoking a joint made with a few marijuana leaves is vastly more sane that vaporizing a gram of hydroponically-produced THC that just happens to encrust a flower bud.
Whether it is a new generation of Iranians to be poisoned by tainted opium or American youth becoming stupefied, the chemical wars wage on. And, at the apex of such technology- whether it is hydroponics, pesticides, or uranium-tipped bullets, a rather telling connection can be made to Israel and Israeli scientists who, not coincidentally, take full advantage of corporate spying facilitated, perhaps, unwittingly, by the NSA and other security apparatus operators.
One need only reference the filing of patents, and by whom, in the last dozen years, to see an alarming trend. Israel is one of the largest manufacturers of armaments and hydroponic technology as well as one of the largest manufacturers per capita of generic pharmaceuticals. The latter being dumped unto the American consumer via Obamacare and their inflated pricing schemes represent a hidden tax to bilk the American consumer out of billions of dollars in ill-gotten profits all for the goal of entrenching apartheid Zionists.
Anti-Semitism is obviously a horrendous development anywhere it takes root. But being anti-Zionist is not being anti-Semitic. Norman Finkelstein and Noam Chomsky, two prominent scholars are not Zionists, but are certainly Jewish and pro-Semitic. As am I.
“Photographer Momen Fayez. Israeli airstrikes cost him his legs in 2008 and his home 2 wks ago.”
https://twitter.com/malsaafin/status/498049150512922625/photo/1
Perhaps this is an opportune moment to read and reconsider this erudite work of Joseph Massad, The last of the Semites, initially published by Al Jazeera, then removed, and finally re-published.
It is Israel’s claims that it represents and speaks for all Jews that are the most anti-Semitic claims of all.
http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/2013/05/2013521184814703958.html
Jewish Voice for Peace – Mission Statement:
Please read the balance of their statement. It is rational, humane, kind.
https://www.jewishvoiceforpeace.org/news
Our criticism of Israel would have more effect if we cleaned up our own act. http://goo.gl/wYVrk5
I just changed my mind. Israelis are worse than the Nazis. Fuck these people.
http://www.alternet.org/world/evidence-emerges-israeli-shoot-cripple-policy-occupied-west-bank
No, Chief, not Israelis. You must mean Zionists I believe. Among Israelis there are kind, sensitive people who embrace peace and understanding. At bare minimum 1000 of those are Palestinians who have been arrested by the Zionists and imprisoned. It is important to distinguish between Israelis and Zionists, just as it important to distinguish between Jews and Zionists. Yes, many Zionists are Jewish but not all, and not all Jews are Zionists; and not all Israelis are Jewish or Zionist.
If we are to effectively fight racism, antisemitism of all kinds, we must be scrupulously clear concerning our terminology. There is too much hate in this world and humans are inclined more often than not, to fall into it far too easily.
Israel cracks down on dissent
http://972mag.com/israel-cracks-down-on-dissent/95139/
See this 1990 NYT article related to the “break the bones strategy”:
“The proposal was prompted by testimony in recent courts-martial of several soldiers charged with beating Palestinians and breaking their bones. The soldiers have testified that they were simply following orders, and many Israelis have been saying they believe the men are being abandoned by the army’s top commanders.”
“At the start of the uprising, Mr. Rabin attracted wide attention when he said that Israeli soldiers would use ”force, might and beatings” to quash the Palestinian revolt.”
“…Col. Yehuda Meir…is being court-martialed for reportedly ordering his troops to arrest Arabs and then break their arms and legs.”
“Soldiers testifying at Colonel Meir’s trial said Mr. Rabin and other senior commanders told them privately that beatings should be used to punish Arabs known to be troublemakers.”
“Lieut. Eldad Ben-Moshe, a company commander under Colonel Meir, testified in April that he was told by Colonel Meir to ‘break the arms and legs’ of Arabs ‘because the detention camps are full.'”
“Early this month another officer, identified only as Lieut. Col. Zvi, testified that in January 1988, Mr. Rabin ‘told me to lash into them forcefully and beat them,’ without restricting the beatings in any way.”
http://www.nytimes.com/1990/07/12/world/israel-declines-to-study-rabin-tie-to-beatings.html
Also, go to time 9:00 in this 10-minute video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMOtFy09ZmI&feature=youtu.be
Full documentary:
Occupation 101
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_LGogkbjpRw&index=1&list=PLD6D247076445907C
Again, thank you Tujays. Yes, the cruelty is unmitigated sadism. As one of Jewish heritage I am so deeply shamed by the fact that this crime is repeated unendingly by people to whom I am related. How can any sentient being condone it, advocate it, shriek obscenities in defense of it? My pet animals, dogs, cats, are more humane than these humans known as Zionists!
And how is it this film is not included in the History and Current Events curriculum of every high school student in the world, especially the Western world? The UN has had near 70 years to address these crimes and has miserably, cynically, hypocritically, CRIMINALLY failed to live up to its own founding charter’s stated purposes:
All the intellectualizing in the universe cannot make one dent in the cover provided those who committed and keep on committing this crime against humanity. Some say the UN is the global governance arm of the Elite. I say proof is in the pudding, and this pudding is putrid rot! That is proof enough for me! It is long past time the criminal banking Elites are exposed for the obscenely cruel criminals they are, for they are behind these crimes against humanity, for they create the conditions in which such crimes are made manifest, and they control the votes in Congress. Such power is absolute and corrupt to the core.
http://www.un.org/en/documents/charter/chapter1.shtml
Israel find’s itself in yet another crisis caused by its policy of land theft and oppression, so it again resorts to the ‘break the bones strategy’ — only this time with bullets instead of rocks and clubs:
Sinking Ship
The attack on the Gaza relief flotilla jeopardizes Israel itself.
By JOHN J. MEARSHEIMER – August 1, 2010
http://www.theamericanconservative.com/articles/sinking-ship/
I was going to copy-and-paste highlights from this article but I was unable to so because every part of it is excellent. Consequently, I couldn’t bring myself to butcher it. I highly recommend reading it in its entirety:
What Gaza Has Revealed
Israel’s latest war brought its increasingly fascist politics before a global audience.
By SCOTT MCCONNELL – August 6, 2014
http://www.theamericanconservative.com/articles/what-gaza-has-revealed/
Thank you Tujays. Yes, this is a refreshingly open-minded summary.
I will risk copy/pasting this first paragraph in order to point out that the rise of Nazism in Germany was aided in no small way by the global economic depression. When people are economically insecure they are easily convinced that one group or another is responsible for their difficulties. They rationalize that everything was fine until so and so did such and such. We see an example to day in America, where blame is laid upon undocumented immigrants for the economic woes many are experiencing at present. When minds are consumed by insecurity and with the inability to maintain financially, fear is the result, and it’s even encouraged, and fear is easily exploited on the macro and micro levels. Those in power are well aware of this and have no compunction about exploiting it to suit their unenlightened self-interests.
It is clear – USA and Israel are ONE entity and not 2 “independend” States !
De-Development definition/coined by Sara Roy
“A deliberate systematic and progressive dismemberment of an indigenous economy by a dominant one; where economic and by extension societal potential is not only distorted but denied.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sara_Roy
Palestinian suicide homes are ramming themselves in to peaceful Israeli bulldozers..
Attention IDF “soldiers” aka Baby Killers:
The ‘Nuremberg Principles’ are a set of guidelines used to determine what constitutes war crimes. Principle IV states that a person is not relieved from responsibility under international law simply because they were following orders. Therefore, anyone in the IDF who knowingly takes part in the murder or harming of civilians is committing a war crime. Also, there is no Statute of Limitations for war crimes or crimes against humanity.
* * *
“Some were afraid of going into the Gaza Strip and dying, some might have been afraid to say ‘We’re afraid.’ Some need a place that can contain the fear,” said Gila Sela, the head of Natal’s hotline. “When everyone are such great heroes, you need a place to unwind.”
https://twitter.com/RaniaKhalek/status/497755777546088448/photo/1
While perhaps shocking, I don’t think that “Israeli aggression would be impossible without the constant, lavish support and protection of the U.S. government” and allied intelligence services. Instead, I believe that this cooperation actually provides an element of strategic depth for Israel that allows her to be more restrained. Without all manner of material and intelligence support, Israel would be hard-pressed not to simply destroy her enemies, instead of what she does now, which is to “mow the lawn”.
Call it genocide and invoke sanctions, but she’d have to do what it took to survive if she were not receiving the ample assistance she receives. Something to consider.
Remember her behavior from prior to 1973, when she did not have a superpower backer. She was much more aggressive.
“In the words of Jeffrey Burton Russell,
The essence of evil is abuse of a sentient being, a being that can feel pain. It is the pain that matters. Evil is grasped by the mind immediately and immediately felt by the emotions; it is sensed as hurt deliberately inflicted. The existence of evil requires no further proof: I am; therefore I suffer evil.
The definition implies two things: One, that every human being suffers evil. Two, every human being inflicts evil. Thus, the essence of the human condition is in how we live with our evil.
Of necessity, then, evil has two faces – one is individual, the other is collective. That we as individuals will and do commit evil is unavoidable. Our efforts not to do evil, however, need the support of a collective, i.e. a society that not only recognizes evil but condemns it.”
—————————————————
“Racism ascribes negative definition on the basis of biology. In reality, however, the differences are not clear. This is why anti-Semitism can be cultural in one instance, religious in another, and racial in yet another. Further confusing matters is the fact that ethnocentrism is universal. Members of practically every culture regard their way of life as superior to that of their neighbours.”
Exerts from: Racism, Anti-Semitism and the Concept of Evil
https://www.umass.edu/judaic/anniversaryvolume/articles/08-B1-Lester.pdf
-Rowan-
To extend this (or a slightly different) point further in my own words:
It could also be the case that somebody who was anti-semetic could at the same time be against the killing of civilians (even if in self defence). Therefor you could object to Israeli occupation but the stupidity that is racism is either a primary or secondary issue (depending on the severity of the racist views in question).
Not hiring someone because they are gay for example is not the same as killing someone because they are gay (although both due to homophobia perhaps).
I am aware it is a hell of allot more complicated than that… but to hear people calling the Guardian anti-semitic (and some commenters here whose posts I have followed) has meant I am trying to understand the differences between racism and anti-semitism.
The above pdf was useful but I’m sure there is bundles of writing on this subject which I am unaware of.
-Rowan-
How can I game this?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JDuFndNrJo0
La Vita è Bella – Translated Game Rules(Roberto Benigni)
“Noam Chomsky offers background on how this zone of misery came into being, with withering words for those he labels perpetrators.”
Noam Chomsky – Gaza in Crisis
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=4fqr297Gviw#t=1252
De-Development
Israeli policy 1967. url timed link [otherwise same as above]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=4fqr297Gviw#t=1988
I agree with the first paragraph. Good post. Killing is a lot better than maiming. Maiming is what the Israelis seem to be aiming for these days, the heartless motherf*cking bastards.
Anti-Semitism does exist though. Jews are one group, when they are not around, almost anybody from any race or creed has the potential to make a joke about them. I’ve heard such slights from unexpected mouths, and in the presence of polite company, from people who would never utter a negative word about other races. The Washington pundit class and their love affair with Israel, does not extend to everybody on the street, I’m afraid. And I think that kinda sucks.
And I for one don’t see how Israel helps with that situation. Israel makes a demand, and all the politicians vote one way. How does that make the average citizen feel towards Israel? How does it make the average citizen feel, who equate local Jews with Israelis.
It’s messed up for sure.
It certainly exists and even the Jokes are dangerous…although when a jewish person tells the Jokes it feels safer to laugh if the joke is funny. However after this “war” is over it may take on a less deep seated position. Certainly in Britain from my experience the middle class are most horrified by racism in “joke form” unlike working/upper. Some of these Jokes and “names” are actually deep within our culture.
At the time of the IRA in London (before I can remember) it said on some pubs:
NO BLACKS
NO DOGS
NO IRISH
http://irishistory.blogspot.co.uk/2013/07/no-blacks-no-dogs-no-irish.html
I certainly feel quite comfortable making and laughing at Irish jokes for example.
Although…. I do know one very good Jewish Joke which is funny not only because of the stereotype element but the nuts and bolts of the Joke double meaning etc that is “humour/wit”
Any way I’m no J.B Russell (as you all know) but I think you can see where I’m going with this line of enquiry.
$$$$$$$ Anti- Semantics $$$$$$$
ps I will not tell the Joke but it involves a Taxi and a Bus and Jewish child coming home from school…
OH f$$k it I’ll finish the joke.
He [child] returns from school running behind the school bus. He is excited to tell his dad on return as to how much he saved.
Punch line:
You silly boy you should have run behind a taxi you would have saved more money.
Sorry for any offence caused.. None meant I assure you.
-Rowan-
The french call us Rosbif’s.
Did hear about the Irishman that tried to blow up a bus?
Burnt his lips on the exhaust pipe..
A joke inspired by conflict…Yet Irish people are not all stupid.
If you replaced Irishman with Jihadi it would not work so well. But with Jewish Guy it would fall flat on its face.
Did you hear. Only typo?
I meant ££££ lobster ££££
Oh and I didn’t use bold on the dollar signs, so I think we are safe mona..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JeYq2QC13vA
Worzel
What those in our government are doing has everything to do with their continuing in power and wealth and almost nothing at all to do with the reasons they were elected to office. Their own wealth, power, and longevity, have been made the defining reason behind their ability to do what they were elected to do. They say they must have it all before they can help anyone. RIGHT! Folks, as long as we have rulers we are going to be subjugated to their insane wills, so let us get rid of all of these heinous SOB’s, and rule ourselves. Animal Farm showed that we can do no worse than to recreate our present situation, but just maybe we can improve it!
As U.S. Airstrikes in Iraq Begin, Will Military Intervention Escalate Growing Crisis?
“The role of the U.S. now, with increasing military involvement back in Iraq, returning to Iraq, is going to put the U.S. in a situation where it’s widely going to be blamed for the continuing rise of sectarianism.
“And in the region more broadly, it’s going to be pointed out what hypocrisy it is, where the United States is arming Israel to kill Palestinians in Gaza. The language that President Obama used, that there are innocent people facing violations on a massive scale, that describes the situation of Palestinian civilians in Gaza. And yet, rather than providing humanitarian aid, demanding that Israel open the gates of Gaza, that it open the border crossings, the United States instead is sending more weapons and more money to buy more weapons and more ammunition for those Israeli attacks. So, the question of how the U.S. is going to be blamed for this is even wider because of the simultaneous crisis underway in Gaza…
“This halt in the fighting, this ceasefire, even if it lasted the three days, which it barely did by a moment, was not going to work unless the siege of Gaza could be lifted.
“There is no way that there’s going to be a permanent ceasefire while Gaza remains completely surrounded by a wall that is backed by the armed force of the Israeli military; where the skies are controlled by the Israeli Air Force; while the waters, the coastal waters, are controlled by the Israeli Navy, who prohibit the fishermen from going any more than two kilometers out; while nothing is allowed in for rebuilding; when Israel can bomb the power plant, the sewage treatment plants and expect people to simply stop fighting and wait for negotiations, as if that’s going to work.
“We saw this the last time, after the eight-day Israeli assault on Gaza in November of 2012, when the ceasefire that was negotiated by Hillary Clinton at that time said that within 24 hours of the ceasefire there should begin implementation of lifting the siege. It never happened. So, not surprisingly, Palestinians — and this is not only Hamas, this is across the board, every political faction — and, we should note, the United Nations are calling very clearly for an end to the siege of Gaza. Without that, no temporary ceasefire is going to work.”
— Phyllis Bennis
http://www.democracynow.org/2014/8/8/as_us_air_strikes_in_iraq?autostart=true
I heard an iteration of this story on NPR this morning, but can’t find it on their Morning Edition line up. Not sure if it was removed.
Academic rebuked for expressing sympathy for Gaza victims
That incident was also mentioned in a Real News broadcast. It added:
“His students complained to the dean, who responded saying that the professor’s expression of sympathy with the Gaza victims deeply hurt the students and that the professor will be reprimanded.”
Inside Israel’s Pro-War Nationalist Camp
http://therealnews.com/t2/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=31&Itemid=74&jumival=12191
From the transcript one could make a strong connection between lack of self-awareness and the willingness to do cruelty. In this snippet for evidence, Tarachansky is the reporter:
[snip]
For all people, especially those of Jewish heritage, who wrestle against their forced association with Zionist Israeli brutality and the old antisemitism it arouses.
RABBI MICHAEL LERNER: I’m a rabbi in mourning for a Judaism being murdered by Israel…the brutal Gaza assault requires Jews worldwide to be honest.
[snip]
http://www.tikkun.org/nextgen/mourning-for-a-judaism-being-murdered-by-israel
I feel Rabbi Lerner’s pain, believe me I do, and I am grateful for a prominent rabbi who speaks out as he is doing. May G-d bless and keep him.
But I utterly reject the notion that anti-semitism is “caused” by Israeli misconduct or by support for that misconduct among some Jews outside Israel. Anti-semitism is a fundamentally irrational phenomenon. It has no cause and needs no cause.
Anyone who hates Jews because of the actions of some Jews is a bigot, just like anyone who hates Muslims because of the actions of some Muslims is a bigot. It is the bigot, and nobody else, who is responsible for his or her prejudice. Full stop.
>”Anyone who hates Jews because of the actions of some Jews is a bigot”
Of course that’s true. The problem is that the majority of Jews, American and UK Jews especially, have been solidly supportive of Israeli policy wrt the Palestinians. American Jews have been victims of this policy due to being characterized as ‘self-hating’ when they voice opinions that differ from US/Israeli propaganda – including the conflation of criticism of Israeli and US State Policy with Juden Hass, when in fact they are separate issues.
But that conflation is engendering a new antisemitism against Jews, as Rabbi Lerner points out. I see, as one of Jewish descent, our job is to help separate the two and firmly establish that nowhere in honest Judaism is savagery and sadism regarded as holy, or even scripturally applicable to the present.
Those stories in the Torah of conquest and decimation of every human, animal, and orchard refer to a time in prehistory when roaming tribes attacked Judah without provocation. Certainly they do not refer to the Palestinians of today who have been dispossessed and imprisoned counter to the beseeching of God that to please him, to know the sacred, Jews have only to act in the world with humility, kindness, doing good deeds that ameliorate the devastatingly sad and often vile effects of humans struggling with the very condition of being human and pitifully fallible. I believe we are obligated as Jews, cultural, religious, ethnic, to begin the healing process by putting an end to the intellectual dishonesty ingrained upon our psyches through the guilt of ‘not remembering’. Using the Torah today as rationale for genocide is, and should be recognized as, an atrocity to all humans beings and an abomination and insult to the very God Judaism is purported to worship.
Please read this article about and even a book or two by Elmer Berger, “an antiwar libertarian and a principled critic of Jewish nationalism.” You may find in the rabbi’s position strong intellectual support for your own principled rethinking of Zionism.
http://www.theamericanconservative.com/articles/jews-against-israel/
From Wikipedia, the text of the Balfour Declaration:
Once it had become clear that this intention was not to be realized, Einstein a (cultural) Zionist, castigated the Zionist State for creating the untenable situation in Palestine, that in which the indigenous population was to be removed to make room for a nationalistic state that was and is inherently dangerous to the peace and stability of the Middle East and ironically, to the ‘national home of the Jewish people’.
Thank you for your thoughtful response. I wonder, though, if it’s completely true that “the majority of Jews, American and UK Jews especially, have been solidly supportive of Israeli policy wrt the Palestinians.” As I understand it, the majority of American Jews (I know nothing of UK Jews) favor a “two-state solution” to the I/P dilemma, to include a fully sovereign Palestinian state. Clearly, that is not Israel’s policy.
I think a lot more American Jews would oppose Israel’s policies re Palestinians if they knew what those policies actually were. To put it another way, I think many American Jews would oppose Israel’s persecution of Palestinians if they clearly understood that Israel does, in fact, persecute Palestinians. But we live in (as Peter Beinart has aptly said) a “cocoon,” and in that cocoon, the Israelis are the “good guys” — peace-loving kibbutzniks surrounded by a vast, angry sea of hate-crazed Arabs.
>”I think a lot more American Jews would oppose Israel’s policies re Palestinians if they knew what those policies actually were.”
I agree. I do think the truth is complicated and obscured from the people. The MSM does not do anything that could interfere with or harm the interests of the Elites. So that leaves it up to us – the Jews, Jewish atheists and really all good people who wish for peace – to explain it clearly, with the history at our finger tips.
As for UK Jews – yes you are correct, they are more apt to be supportive of peaces and are better informed as to ME history, especially concerning the duplicitous intentions the British brought there. I misspoke probably due to the fact that I grew up in England during a time when antisemitism was still quite virulent, before the 60s, so I may be too influenced by that experience.
If it is of any meaning for you, my grandfather was a non-Zionist reform rabbi who told me that Jerusalem is state of mind, not a place, not a worldly city. A state of mind, Gator, I’m sure you know, can be carried anywhere and everywhere. It is entirely up to us.
Thank you so much for your kindness to me.
“Justice For Palestine” by Steve B.I.K.O.
https://itun.es/i6gK75j
Netanyahu asks US for help to avoid War Crime charges.
http://nypost.com/2014/08/06/netanyahu-asks-us-to-help-israel-avoid-war-crime-charges/
Supporting link posted earlier:
“US lawmaker: Israel committed no war crime”
http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2014/08/08/374486/us-lawmaker-israel-simply-defended/
“The delegation of US lawmakers met with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu who asked them to help the Tel Aviv regime avoid charges of war crimes against Palestinians at the International Criminal Court (ICC).”
I find it disgusting.
Are you kidding me….We have ENOUGH going on as it is with the common people complaining about the new world order. The Jews asked for there Wars and there pain…. Its been following them sense the beginning of time….! They rejected there Christ!! They were treated like shit in his name.. He was treated like shit to… They like it!! They want it!! They ask for it!! And then in the business world the take over and push people around and treat others the way they get treated…!! And the Russians and the Germans are alike when it comes to war and power…. The Jews want it and over do it. People Hate the Jews.. Israel asked for there problems…They are just Jews!!! All of them and Palestine should not be there..And They have a right to fight the Israelites. And then look what the Israelites are doing to there own people. And here people complain about the Russians doing there own thing so they shot down a plain, While selling stock short. Helping muslims. They are doing what is best for them…And We Americans send troops off to get beheaded in the middle east!! I would rather sale my soul to the beast than to see my son get beheaded in some third world country!! I WOULD RATHER SEE HIM KILL THAN TO SEE HIM HEADLESS!! IF I HAD A SON I WOULD RAISE HIM TO BE A SATANIST!! AND KILL KILL KILL!!! AND FIGHT TO HIS DEATH!!
How did this comment get past the moderator? Is the moderator on an extended bathroom break with a bad case of dysentery?
Could be the moderator thought it a good example of what we’re up against! ;)
Oh that’s good to know. Because for a minute there I was in the grip of an existential panic. I couldn’t tell if The Moderator just took an incredibly laissez faire attitude towards everything anybody writes in this comments section… or if maybe He didn’t exist at all.
Jefferson, like most of the founding fathers, was openly anti-Semite. He espoused keeping the Jews out of America; &, definitely out of our banking system. He predicted the dire consequences, should we not.
(Welcome, to modern America!)
However he, like many Christian politicians then & since, worked both privately & publicly to restore the Jews to the Biblical State of Israel. They believe it will bring about the Second Coming of Christ.
Since this is hardly a ‘universal religious belief’, it is an open & blatant violation of the First Amendment’s so-called Separation Clause.
Where is the ACLU?
Thomas Jefferson worked hard to get the Jews back to Israel? Whah?
Prove it. Let’s see the document. Otherwise you are fabricating hatred where none existed.
“Facts All US Citizens Need to Know About Israel and Palestine”
http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2014/07/facts-us-citizens-need-know-israel-palestine.html
“Gaza (along with the West Bank and East Jerusalem) is occupied Palestinian territory under international law, determined by the vast majority of the world, as well as the highest court in the world, the UN’s International Court of Justice. Gaza cannot commit aggression against Israel, since Israel is in constant and continual commission of illegal aggression against Palestine by occupying it (illegally and sadistically blockading it and frequently committing terrorism against its civilians, including by targeting them with chemical weapons provided by US taxpayers – see “Rain of Fire” by Human Rights Watch). As documented by Amnesty Int’l, Human Rights Watch, and many others, Israel intentionally targets and murders civilians, including children, en masse.”
This is absolutely disgusting:
“US lawmaker: Israel committed no war crime”
http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2014/08/08/374486/us-lawmaker-israel-simply-defended/
{“There are some in the international community who want to investigate the Israelis for the war crime of simply defending themselves,” Representative Steve Israel, who was in Tel Aviv with a group of other US lawmakers, told the New York Post by phone.
The delegation of US lawmakers met with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu who asked them to help the Tel Aviv regime to avoid charges of war crimes against Palestinians at the International Criminal Court (ICC).”}
So decrees the totalitarian US Security State in collusion with the Israeli Mossad. There is no difference between the two governments – the Zionists rule.
“Americans live in oligarchy: Analyst”
http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2014/08/07/374431/americans-live-in-oligarchy/
“Press TV: So why do we not see any movement against the current system which is in place in the US?
Fetzer: Well it is principally because the media is so controlled and dominated. The CIA and big corporations absolutely have the last word on what Americans hear. They are not going to get the truth about any significant event. They are not getting the truth about the Middle East. They are not getting the truth about Ukraine. They are certainly not getting the truth about Israel in Gaza, and it is a disgusting situation and it is very difficult to appreciate how we are going to be able to restore democracy in the United States, but I can assure you it is not alive and well.
Press TV: Is this about one man such as Obama or is this a much more widespread issue?
Fetzer: Yes it is much more widespread. You are absolutely correct. A massive NSA surveillance enables this intelligence agency, where all of its raw data goes directly to Tel Aviv, to know all kinds of personal information about every member of Congress, every member of the Judiciary, every prominent politician in the country.
I am quite convinced that a number of recent decisions from the Supreme Court would have come out completely differently. We are not members of court being subjected to pressure based upon the kind of information the NSA has obtained. We must abolish the NSA, destroy all of its database, and that would be a giant step forward toward restoring some symbols of democracy in the United Sates.”
Here we go again….Truce talks failed because the Palestinian Hamas demanded that the block aid be lifted and Israel refused.
“Israel resumes pounding Gaza Strip after truce expiry”
http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2014/08/08/374499/israel-resumes-pounding-gaza-strip/
The damn Nazi Central Bankers want war and conflict everywhere…Israel, Iraq, Syria, Afghanistan, and Ukraine. They want it all. All the information on all of the people on planet Earth, all of the land (and land resources) and complete slavery of all of humanity.
“…….Here we go again….Truce talks failed because the Palestinian Hamas demanded that the block aid be lifted and Israel refused……”
Quite correct. It failed when Hamas started launching rockets into Israel after the truce expired. Hamas is playing on international criticism of the war in Gaza and the blockade to gamble with more Palestinian lives. The political stakes are high: Israel doesn’t want to give in to Hamas and end the blockade (without Hamas disarming), and Hamas doesn’t want to come away from the negotiations with the blockade still in place – so the war must continue.
It’s a war of wills – except that ordinary Palestinians pay the price.
One side has a reasonable demand (stop a criminal and genocidal blockade.) Now, consider the other side’s demand. Would it make sense to ask Israel to disarm? That’s absurd.
Or think about this. Which is more beligerent against Israel, Gaza or the West Bank? Clearly, it’s Gaza. They do get heavily bombed every couple years and are criminally blockaded, but at least they don’t have troops inside their territory or ever-expanding settlements. It’s pretty easy for us to criticize certain methods of resistance, but it’s not us who are there experiencing the effects.
Jose
There is NO genocidal blockade, Jose. It’s just meant to limit the arms to Hamas.
Does it really matter if Hamas disarms? Israel has no desire to incorporate Gaza into greater Israel so if Hamas disarms, so what? Israel pulled out of Gaza. Hamas has done very little damage over the years to Israel, and their rockets just send Israelis to bomb shelters. They rarely kill anyone. If Hamas disarms, how will that harm the resistance since the armed resistance has failed for over half of a century anyway.
It’s time that Hamas puts down the pea shooters and use international pressure to force a solution. Some say it won’t work, but it’s the last best chance they have. Starting up this conflict again will just ensure even more Palestinians die. That’s all.
I just explained my reading to you. If Hamas, and Gaza generally, disarms, it could easily become like the West Bank or worse. Namely, Israel would move in with settlements and military control.
It sounds weird, but I actually agree with Lyra1, and with CraigSummers. Per Lyra1, I agree that Israel has committed war crimes and the US is complicit because we financed them, and not for the first time. Per CraigSummers, I agree that Hamas has to put down the pea shooters and leverage all the international sympathy they’ve garnered this far for the Palestinian people (a lot), before they squander it. They can’t win by force, and they know it. If they keep on, the tide will turn against them.
I don’t believe Israel will ever be found guilty of those war crimes, because if I have my facts right, only one man has ever been convicted by the ICC, and he was a Joseph Kony kind of guy from Nigeria. I really can’t believe the State of Israel will be number 2.
I believe the Palestinian people have Obama’s sympathy when he says it’s time for them to join the international community — they ought to listen up.
No Craig Summers. You are,once again, attempting to insert a justification for the criminal actions of the State of Israel. There is no war between the State of Israel and the Palestinian people. The Palestinian people ,whether in Gaza or on the West Bank, are herded into apartheid camps maintained by the State of Israel. They are captive people since 1948. In Gaza, there is presently no way out. The State of Israel is exterminating the Palestinians. There are no “political stakes” to justify the extended and repeated massacre of a population of people.
Israel is committing International crimes and the US is complicit.
I didn’t justify anything. I just made an observation based on an opinion that more Palestinians will die because Hamas is gambling with their lives that they can negotiate an end to the blockade without disarming (which is why there is a blockade in the first place).
Thanks.
To add to our thinking on academic freedom and all, I have found two verified quoted from Mr. Jefferson :
“…enlighten the people generally, and tyranny and oppressions of body & mind will vanish like evil spirits at the dawn of day. ” (from a letter to Pierre S. DuPont de Nemours, 1816)
and “bigotry is the disease of ignorance, of morbid minds; enthusiasm of the free and buoyant. education & free discussion are the antidotes of both. we are destined to be a barrier against the returns of ignorance and barbarism.” (from a letter to my man John Adams, also 1816)
“That would be a good idea”
~Mahatma Gandhi
On being asked what he thought of modern civilisation.
We knew the world would not be the same. A few people laughed, a few people cried. Most people were silent. I remembered the line from the Hindu scripture, the Bhagavad-Gita; Vishnu is trying to persuade the Prince that he should do his duty, and to impress him, takes on his multi-armed form and says, ‘Now I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds.’ I suppose we all thought that, one way or another.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26YLehuMydo
The accents of the Israeli team
Amer Zahr
August 6th, 2014
American journalists seem to have a much easier time having conversations with Israeli officials than they do with their Palestinian counterparts. The reason is obvious. All of Israel’s official mouthpieces speak perfect unaccented English. And why wouldn’t they? After all, they are not from Israel.
Peter Lerner is the foreign press spokesperson for the Israel Defense Forces. He was born in London in 1973.
Dore Gold is a diplomat who has served in many Israeli governments. He was once Israel’s ambassador to the United Nations. He is currently the president of an Israeli think tank in Jerusalem. He was born in Connecticut.
Mark Regev is the official spokesman of the Netanyahu government. In 1960, he was born in Australia, where he grew up and finished college.
Michael Oren was most recently Israel’s ambassador to the United States. He was born in upstate New York. He earned his MA and PhD from Princeton University in New Jersey.
Micky Rosenfeld is the Israeli police spokesperson to the foreign press. He speaks English flawlessly. That’s because he is English.
Ron Dermer is Israel’s current ambassador to the United States of America. He has been all over CNN in recent weeks. He attended the University of Pennsylvania before moving to Israel is his twenties. He was born in 1971 in Miami Beach.
In any case, this is the cast of characters acting as Israel’s cheerleaders to the American public. Justifying racial supremacy, ethnic cleansing, and indiscriminate bombing campaigns definitely sounds better when it’s done in an accent we can all relate to. But I’m sure every American listening to them still wonders why all these Israelis sound like the next door neighbor. Why wouldn’t they? They are, after all, foreigners in the land of Israel. Foreign colonist settlers.
http://www.civilarab.com/the-accents-of-the-israeli-team/
@ Tujays It’s more than that. The Israeli team are sophisticated, accomplished debaters. And they have a manual, with very effective talking points (the 117 page Israel Project’s Global Language Dictionary) that pretty much enables them to squirm out of any really tough question, with aplomb. I have seen a bunch of the Hamas spokespeople and they are woefully inadequate to the task, by comparison. Some of them completely suck. They get emotional and inarticulate and gesticulate; it doesn’t come off well. I’m not suggesting they don’t have good reason to be upset, but it doesn’t help them in the arenas of PR and public perception, and those arenas are becoming such important factors in this conflict. James Zogby is a thoughtful, intelligent man, but not nearly as aggressive a debater as Dermer or Regev. He’s a bit too gentle. Hamas and/or the PA need to put a help wanted ad out on Craigslist for an effective spokesperson.
This news site won’t change anything unless they disclose the names of people involved in these activities.
Boycott Jewish businesses,work as mimimal as possible and talk constantly about Israel owning and exploiting America. Less work means less taxes into the U S kitty to finance Israel
“Israel killed his entire family and left him with a serious head injury. No one knows his name. (v @Jonny_Hallam)”
https://twitter.com/RaniaKhalek/status/497477995561766913/photo/1
“Maha is 7. Mum is dead. She’s paralysed from neck down. DRs say she needs to get out of gaza for treatment. Please RT”
https://twitter.com/JonDonnison/status/497239966951284736/photo/1
An old slogan with new meaning – NEVER, NEVER, NEVER FORGET!
Heartbroken.
I think I saw this girl in an earlier photo. Her hair was down, and she was in the neck brace, and she was smiling, and the caption said that she had been paralyzed. And I remember thinking, my God, why is she smiling? She must not realize what’s happened to her yet – she’s not thinking how different the rest of her life will be after this. She’s probably just happy to be safe in a hospital with relatives that love her.
Well, if it is the same girl and I think it is, judging from the look on her face, she’s starting to get it. Poor, poor thing. Poor child.
“the thought of my little ones burning”
“in the glow of their donald duck light”
Free Palestine
Trojan Horse (terror horse)
Roger Waters “The tide is turning”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66nqhVtq6xo
Billy AKA Pink
ps tear down the wall
still hoarse :-)
-Rowan-
@ Che Wilhelmina
“Listed below is every word in my corpus. After word 100 or so, this list is not necessarily accurate because some of the texts in my corpus overused certain words (for example, “species” should probably not be as high as it is, but my corpus included The Origin of Species which makes frequent use of the word “species”).
the of to and a in that is i it for as with you on was be he this not have are at if but by from his or they an which we all said one had will my s so has their more there no what were when would your her can been she out who some do about me up new x him other them time than t into like only now its then may any how could mr two our very these end first just people after get also even most should return over such many see well know much struct good before same long way because make those think?”
unknown source
http://www.autoblog.com/2014/05/18/british-military-gps-navigation-quantum-compass/
Algy x
sorry wrong link…
http://tessella.com/coverage/new-scientist-motion-sensors-track-troops-gps-cuts/#.U-PubOBFv8s
think missing soldiers
R
Despite Israel’s and the United States efforts, Gaza will never be defeated.
http://gaza-life-goes-on.tumblr.com/
Nobody wants Gaza defeated. We will defeat Hamas
Yes, it will
“I am a Palestinian Arab. I was Born in Jerusalem. Palestine is my homeland but I cannot return there”.
“I am an American Jew. I was born in USA. Israel is not my homeland but I can “return” there”.
http://mig-biscuit.blogspot.com/2012/11/i-am-palestinian-arab-i-was-born-in.html
very good comment!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eOTNAe3j7Bs
The post that didn’t make it had a link that must have been off topic.
But generally it invited any one in london to demonstrate tomorrow . .
Google is your friend
WG
Israel vs Palestine – feat. DAM & Norman Finkelst…: http://youtu.be/U3by9FoEFB8
Palestinian suicide homes are ramming themselves in to peaceful Israeli bulldozers.. From above ‘news’
Israel will never stop oppressing the Palestinian people until the US government forces them to, which they can easily do.
“Ahram English posted the following video showing an emotional Palestinian official holding the charred body of baby killed in Gaza by an Israeli airstrike.”
— Rania Khalek on November 15, 2012
http://english.ahram.org.eg/NewsContentMulti/58140/Multimedia.aspx
The above was comment number “666”.
Rape culture and misogyny in the holy land:
http://muftah.org/israels-war-gazas-women-bodies/#.U-PXlKhbu8r
more:
http://www.maannews.net/eng/ViewDetails.aspx?ID=717908
Deputy Speaker of Israeli Knesset Calls for Expulsion and Jewish Reoccupation of Gaza (video w/ transcript)
Max Blumenthal tells Paul Jay that Moshe Feiglin’s program is part of a growing incitement to genocide against Palestinians – August 7, 2014
“And today he published a piece in Yedioth Ahronoth, which is the main newspaper in Israel, pretty much calling for genocide in the Gaza Strip, or at least justifying it. He’s basically making the case that there are no civilians in the Gaza Strip because they elected Hamas as Germans elected Hitler. This is the same rationale that Osama bin Laden used to justify the 9/11 attacks and the indiscriminate slaughter of Americans, because they had elected governments which had attacked the Middle East, which had attacked Muslim nations.
“So you’re hearing this from mainstream figures, not just from crazy old Feiglin, who’s willing winning lots of fans and followers with this kind of rhetoric, who’s really keeping up a public profile.
“Ayelet Shaked is another figure who’s called for genocide. She is a rising star in the Jewish Home Party, which is the third most popular party in Israel, a senior partner in Netanyahu’s governing coalition. She called for exterminating Palestinian mothers to prevent them from giving birth to, quote-unquote, “little snakes”.”
http://therealnews.com/t2/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=31&Itemid=74&jumival=12201
They could try Obama’s communication approach: “We’d like to ethnically cleanse some folks.”
Palestinians returning home find Israeli troops left faeces and venomous graffiti
Ahmed Owedat also found soldiers had thrown his TVs, fridge, and computers from upstairs windows and slashed furniture
Harriet Sherwood in Burij — The Guardian, Thursday 7 August 2014 12.21 EDT
“When Ahmed Owedat returned to his home 18 days after Israeli soldiers took it over in the middle of the night, he was greeted with an overpowering stench.
“He picked through the wreckage of his possessions thrown from upstairs windows to find that the departing troops had left a number of messages. One came from piles of faeces on his tiled floors and in wastepaper baskets, and a plastic bottle filled with urine.
“If that was not clear enough, the words “Fuck Hamas” had been carved into a concrete wall in the staircase. “Burn Gaza down” and “Good Arab = dead Arab” were engraved on a coffee table. The star of David was drawn in blue in a bedroom…”
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/07/palestinians-return-home-israeli-troops-faeces-graffiti?CMP=twt_gu
Seem to be being filtered. Happy to read
??? ???
it was arabic… Shame said good day… Get some more Character(s) TI
£££ £££
$$$ $$$
Test:the number of spaces was deleted…
“A Hideous Atrocity”: Noam Chomsky on Israel’s Assault on Gaza & U.S. Support for the Occupation
NOAM CHOMSKY: It’s a hideous atrocity, sadistic, vicious, murderous, totally without any credible pretext. It’s another one of the periodic Israeli exercises in what they delicately call “mowing the lawn.” That means shooting fish in the pond, to make sure that the animals stay quiet in the cage that you’ve constructed for them…
JUAN GONZÁLEZ: [W]hat’s your assessment of the impact on the already abysmal relationship that exists between the United States government and the Arab and Muslim world? I’m thinking especially of all the young Muslims and Arabs around the world who maybe had not been exposed to prior atrocities in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.
NOAM CHOMSKY: Well, first of all, we have to distinguish between the Muslim and Arab populations and their governments — striking difference. The governments are mostly dictatorships. And when you read in the press that the Arabs support us on so-and-so, what is meant is the dictators support us, not the populations. The dictatorships are moderately supportive of what the U.S. and Israel are doing….
[Egypt and Saudi Arabia] tended to prefer radical Islam to the danger of secular nationalism and democracy….they hate Hamas. They have no interest in the Palestinians
AMY GOODMAN: That’s President Obama yesterday. Noam Chomsky, can you respond?
NOAM CHOMSKY: Well, as always, for all states and all political leaderships, we have to distinguish rhetoric from action. Any political leader can produce lovely rhetoric, even Hitler, Stalin, whoever you want.
What we ask is: What are they doing? So exactly what does Obama suggest or carry out as a means to achieve the goal of ending the US-backed Israeli siege, blockade of Gaza, which is creating this situation? What has it done in the past? What does it propose to do in the future?
There are plenty of things the U.S. can do to implement what Obama talked about. In fact, when the U.S. gives orders, Israel obeys. That’s happened over and over again.
http://www.democracynow.org/2014/8/7/a_hideous_atrocity_noam_chomsky_on
Academic discourse and I/P.
http://www.salon.com/2014/08/07/return_of_the_blacklist_cowardice_and_censorship_at_the_university_of_illinois/
Very interesting, Thankyou
-Rowan-
Published on Sep 25, 2013
A great night at the proms with Nigel Kennedy and The Palestine Strings performing on Friday 23 August 2013. The ‘Live’ audio broadcast on BBC Radio 3 was uncensored. The Video version, broadcast at a later date, was shown without the comment Nigel Kennedy made about Apartheid in Israel. This Youtube version
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yh25YnzHdjU
Notice Nigel K is wearing an Australian shirt…. (4.00 mins in)
Accent a bit like mine ;-)
not sure where the comment is.. as usual
Academic discourse? A guy went on Twitter to fantasize about necklaces made from the teeth of Palestinian children, and to describe anti-semitism as “honorable.” So a university decided not to hire him. Boo hoo.
Should universities be screening their applicants based on what they say on their twitter accounts? If so, who makes those judgments and by what criterion?
Tujays –
Excellent points. And thinks for your reply tome below. I’m glad you’re optimistic. I’m not sure I’m quite as optimistic as you, but I do hope and pray that academic freedom will prevail. It is vital for our country. We must remember what Thomas Jefferson said: “An educated citizenry is a vital requisite for our survival as a free people.”
hi Tujays –
First attempt seems to have failed. Anyway, those are excellent questions. And thinks for your reply below on academic freedom. I’m glad you’re optimistic. I don’t know if I’m quite so optimistic, but I certainly hope and pray academic freedom will prevail. Our nation depends on it. after all, one Thomas Jefferson said: “An educated citizenry is a vital requisite for our survival as a free people.”
’nuff said.
Whoops! According to the Monticello website, that’s not a “real” quote from TJ, but is a paraphrase of his views. I’ll keep looking…
I don’t think a university or any other prospective employer is obligated to hire someone who makes a public ass of himself. The fellow in question is either a bigot, a fool, or both. The university had every right to decide it would be better off with someone else teaching its students.
There are many people (including myself) who don’t think Salaita’s an “ass”, “fool”, or “bigot” as you suggest he is. His views are political and are very much in agreement with the growing consensus that it’s the Israeli leaders and their shills who are the evil-doers by sanctioning Israel’s illegal occupation of Palestine and its heinous policy of oppressing the indigenous people in a humiliating system of apartheid. The fact that Palestinians civilians are slaughter when attempting to resist occupation is a further testament to Israel’s maliciousness.
There’re two views on the I/P conflict that are in opposition, each side claiming to be correct. You’re advocating that the university be allowed to screen-out applicants who don’t hold your views. By doing so, you’re effectively silencing divergent political discourse within an academic institution which is counter to what the educational system is about.
Universities are places where divergent political views are studied and debated in an intellectual framework for the purpose of cultivating a new generation of thinkers and leaders in order to further evolve society for the better, i.e., changing the status quo. By barring those who you disagree with from entering academia you are shutting down dissent and debate. In so doing, you’re also stifling the educational process in contravention to its mandate.
Tujays, it’s not about my views, and you appear to have no idea what my views are. I am a part of the “growing consensus” to which you refer. I despise Israel. But tweeting blood libels and offering justifications for anti-semitism are not the same thing as condemning Israel. Not by a long shot.
A university is not obligated to hire a person who publicly peddles nonsense. It can decline to staff its faculty with flat earthers, Holocaust deniers, Klansmen, homophobes, Islamophobes, etc. Mr. Salaita is free to spout whatever he wants, but the University of Illinois is equally free to say, “not here, and not on our dollar.”
Gator90: Regardless of your stated allegiances, your definition of what constitutes “blood libels”, “anti-semitism”, or “nonsense” are at odds with many rational and intelligent people who feel otherwise. While your views happen to be in line with those of the University of Illinois, that doesn’t automatically make you and UI right. There’s another side to the debate that needs to be aired in ALL forums, especially schools.
By disallowing academics into universities who have dissenting views, you are inhibiting free and open discourse on controversial topics such as this. ‘Argument’ is an important feature in education. Real learning is accomplished not through the implantation of someone else’s thoughts and ideas, but to come to ‘understanding’ through the use logic and reason. Debate plays a vital role in that regard. It’s endemic to academic culture — it’s the fuel that enables it to thrive for the purpose of advancing knowledge.
If any of the people who “feel otherwise” are in charge of hiring faculty at a university, they are free to hire Mr. Salaita. Just as UI was free to decline to do so.
You’re missing the point. The hiring standards for a university shouldn’t be determined by one’s personal political views.
Steve Salaita also said this: “By eagerly conflating Jewishness and Israel, Zionists are partly responsible when people say antisemitic shit in response to Israeli terror.”
— Steven Salaita (@stevesalaita) July 18, 2014
Don’t you rather agree with him? Or have you fallen off the wagon so soon?
Another sample of his twittering – https://twitter.com/stevesalaita/status/495422920039346176
No, I don’t agree with him. Everyone is responsible for their own thought processes and their own rhetoric. It’s never your fault if I’m a bigot.
Yes, I agree with you. The exception I make is that the term antisemitism has been used as a cover to deflect valid criticism of Israeli abuse of Palestinians. As such, I read Salaita’s comment differently from the way you do. It is essential that we discriminate between real antisemitism and that other antisemitism deliberately invoked and intended to deflect truth.
I keep in mind, as you do, “Everyone is responsible for their own thought processes and their own rhetoric.”, and add to your idea that Israel, its citizens, and its supporters are bound by the same precept, and that it applies most specifically to the actions thoughts and rhetoric produce. Actions are the most obvious and either ameliorating or destructive evidence of one’s own thoughts. As such, I believe the Zionists need to review their thought processes, their rhetoric, and we Americans should be encouraging that sort of self-reflection.
Our governments won’t do that. So it is we, the people of goodwill and honest
intentions, who must begin and maintain a revolution in thinking that produces goodness in action in the world.
Here’s the tweet you refer to. I am hard pressed to find it antisemitic.
“At this point, if Netanyahu appeared on TV with a necklace made from the teeth of Palestinian children, would anybody be surprised? #Gaza”
— Steven Salaita (@stevesalaita) July 20, 2014
There is a long and ugly history of Jews being accused of using the blood or body parts of gentile children in religious rituals. It should be possible to furiously condemn Israel’s actions without resorting to blood libel.
I also referred to a tweet in which Mr. Salaita described anti-semitism as “honorable.”
Remember Gator90, that Netanyahu referred to the images of dead and horribly mutilated and dying children as the Palastinian promotion of their “telegenically dead.” Can one human be (based on that statement) more insensitive, or more despicably anti-human than Netanyahu?
It was a despicable statement by a despicable person — no argument there.
One of signatories of the letter petitioning of Phyllis M. Wise: “We demand corrective action on the scandalous firing of Palestinian-American professor, Dr. Steven Salaita”
I am in mourning too. I just don’t see what it has to do with Mr. Salaita. I would also point out that he was not “fired”; the university decided not to hire him. There is a difference.
It has to do with consequences of one’s actions. Just as the world was horrified by the discovery the Nazi death camps and the millions who suffered and/or died in them, so it is horrified by the brute force, the vile cruelty and the unequal military capacities between Israel and the Gaza Strip, such that to call criticism of it antisemitism creates a newer, worse anti-Jewish sentiment.
It is out of humanitarian motives that I try to look beyond the angry words and seek the motive of the speaker. He, as am I and you no doubt, is horrified by the sadism Zionism has brought with the Jewish migration to Palestine and its creation of a Jewish homeland, that deals death to those who lived there for centuries.
Let’s begin to separate the wheat from the chaff and forge a better route cultivated through compassion and understanding. Shalom.
Hi Gator90 –
re: academic discourse – see what Tujays and I had to say further down the thread.
I KNOW in my heart you support the 1st Amendment and such – so remember, protecting speech we agree with is easy. Defending even the right of speech we don’t agree with is hard.
I must agree with Tujays reply to you below. It’s not just academia, either. Would you want your employer basing their decisions which impact your career on your tweets, facebook posts, or even TI comments? There have been quite some instances of employers wanting prospective employees’ passwords to their social media accounts. Do you also agree with that? Call me whatever, but I surely don’t!
Of course Mr. Salaita has the right to free speech. He does not have the right to be given a job.
Suppose someone seeking a professorship tweets, “Nothing delights me more than a dead Palestinian child. Another future terrorist eliminated!” Is it really an offense to free speech if the university decides another candidate might be more suitable?
Hi Gator90 –
Thanks for the replies. I must respectfully disagree. It can get scary when such employment decisions are made in response to one’s views – or social media posts, etc. You indicated below you read the article Coram linked to. Blacklists have happened and can happen again.
There are certain some views I find repugnant. Racist views always earn my wrath. But would I want someone blacklisted for work because of them? Hard as it is, I have to answer no. This is especially important in academia, which Tujays, and I, have tried to point out should be a place where a multitude of ideas are expressed.
I must also wonder if students are really so fragile that opposing views are dangerous to them. Further, if faculty cannot be free to express various views, how can students be free to do so?
Of course we are concerned about our kids – our students. Educators should always be mindful of the effect they can have on students (in our defense, if people are asked to list a role model or mentor other than a parent, many times it’s a teacher). That doesn’t mean I want to have diverse views banished from academia. Far from it; that sort of discourse is what leads to critical thinking.
I remember in the First Ladies program on Eleanor Roosevelt on C-Span, the story was one of her mentors insisted that she learn to argue both sides of issues she cared about. I’m sure that practice helped to shape her wonderful communicative skills. How many of us would/could do as much? Just maybe more us should be doing that – and what better place to begin the exercise but academia?
Also, universities act in loco parentis and thus are different from many other employers. I don’t really care if the person who delivers my newspaper is a bigot; I do care if the person teaching my kids is.
Great article; thanks Coram!
Hey Gator 90 -did you read it? It really looks at some important ramifications of the issue. My favorite quote:
“By not protesting this instance, we are opening ourselves up to a world in which these kinds of denials of employment will be acceptable. What use, then, will social media be but to be a platform for the most mild forms of expression and banality with regard to controversial subjects?”
Yes, I did read it. And I think the point raised in the quote is valid. But the University of Illinois is entitled to concern itself with its reputation and educational mission rather than with promoting uninhibited social-media expression.
Cease fire at TI?
A point I liked
$$$$$$no State has any god given right to exist so keep your “that is antisemitic” crap to yourself.£££££££
I’m interested in any of you well read individuals out there on… “the next 100 years”. I know that G.Friedman is a $$$$… But how close is this to what the rest of the “intelligence” community think.
If Turkey are so important geopolitically could they help bring an end to Israeli occupation…
I do mean diplomatically if they are (as above) so important..
Just a question…
Thanks in advance.
-Rowan-
P.s I have read/own the book.
PPS i didn’t buy it, it was a gift.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Next-100-Years-George-Friedman/dp/0749007435
http://wikileaks.org/gifiles/docs/51/5130793_re-g2-s2-israel-egypt-pna-egypt-israel-delaying-expanding.html
Aunt sally
The $$$$ (4444 without shift) wrote in answer to a question:
“Nor does Hamas abide by cease-fires”
On 11/1/11 9:00 AM, George Friedman wrote:
“Roosters don’t lay eggs.”
Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
see above link
This comment is my first hopefully I will not be moderated into nonexistence as had happen to me on The Guardian. There I can blog ‘hello’ and said message pops up ,’awaiting moderation from The Moderator quote unquote or something to that . Is it just me or my computer while here that each letter typed takes a second each,and any movement within or around The//Intercept takes a very delayed time? I am on the same page as the typical soul here minus the trolls whose job is to counterbalance and confuse,be it NSA,or some good old boy with a Fox News ballcap. I would think The //Intercept would be heavily monitored by those Monitors that exist. I could see Israel having a direct feed on this site
That said and in regards to this article,will Obama announce sometime that he is sorry to have misstated the U.S.’s position on Israel and Hamas. I know of The //Intercept via The Guardian via NYT via a year ago in the exposure of Mr. Snowden’s revelations. I believe I was the first to comment on that Grardian article. I stated to Ed that I for one am proud of him,and considered that maybe there is a god out there.
I have hated Netanyahooo before a year ago and his group while not forming an anti opinion of the lowly folks both in Israel ,the world,and especially here in my town. But I am evolving. I do my best to know which businesses are Jewish owned or run and boycott them. Tis very difficult to buy liquor or beer in non Jewish establlishments. My autoparts buy hy ere,an independent is pretty open or rather completely open in stories about goings on in the Jewish sector here. This area is predominately Christian,and of that group heavy Baptist. The Baptists push belief in god or should I say God,as in just one,and a middle man between God and the folk,named J C for short. Anyone not of that persuasion is assumed to upon death to not only not enter heaven but goes to hell. With the exception of Jews. I used to attend such a group and building as I had no choice. The church I went to never lambasted the Jews,heck we might have even had a fundraiser right after Lottie Moon and all the missionary gigs. Tithing was expected and the folks were cautioned that shorting of this ten percent would possibly result in fierce reprisal from God or JC or at least Mother Mary. Then there was always the revival usually in the summer in a tent. More collections .
My guess is that Fox,ABC,NBC,and those others will nothave this story. My blogging is the best I can do in the possibility that maybe one sentence can be informative or at least entertaining to already informed readers,the readers of The //Intercept. That said,I am guessing that not all realize that even American jews can and do enter the Israeli military. As per my auto parts guy,his fifteen year old son had to miss camp this year. This camp for Jewish youths is in America,and has Jewish military always there to perhaps offer security and to show an example of civic ness.
Be aware,and boycott
rcdcac
@Tujays and JLocke – re: the ugly racism that’s bubbling over in Israel – here’s more:
http://www.richardsilverstein.com/2012/12/20/jerusalem-posts-self-censorship-protects-israeli-racism/
From Rabbi Ovadia Yosef:
The Goyim were only created to serve us. If that wasn’t the case they [Goyim] would have no place in the world.
…Jews earn eternal life in the days of the messiah. Goyim don’t. Like all people, they must die. But they earn long life. Why? Think about someone’s donkey. If it dies, he loses it, the money. The same with a servant [ or “the one who serves you”]. You also lose money [when he dies]. That’s why Goyim are given long life so they may work well for the Jews.
…Why do Goyim exist? So that they work [for Jews]. They thresh, they plant, they harvest, while we [Jews] sit like effendi and eat [our fill]. That’s why Goyim were created.
Apparently, 800,000 Israelis attended this influential rabbi’s funeral (did I actually get those numbers right?)
More importantly, Israeli/Jewish attitudes like these explain why Arab life is so cheap. Plus also, how come no one ever told me I was a donkey?
Donkeys are cool, they have very large penises. Imagine being hung like a donkey, you’d be famous, there’d be documentaries about you.
Except that his party was the only religious party that supported the peace process and also regularly gets numerous Arab votes in the elections.
War kills civilians, always has-always will.
The only way to stop it is for one side to win.
Darwin’s natural selection in geopolitical application.
If GG is correct about complicity then each of us individually are complicit for we enable as we pay our taxes.
Solution: stop enabling by withholding taxes. Cajones required.
We may not be able to stop the killing, but a sure way of reducing it is to cut off all arms sales and impose harsh economic penalties.
We may not be able to stop the killing, but a sure way to reduce is to cut off all arms deliveries and sales, and impose harsh economic penalties.
Perhaps there will come a time in the not to distant future where I can attempt to make Jokes (at TI).. you know: When Palestine is FREE. When we can say “Don’t mention the War” on a thread like this.
Due to UNIT 9900 perhaps to get to this “future” we ought to arm HAMAS with the “funniest Joke in the world”
Mein Hund bekam keine Nase. Wie kommt er zu riechen. Schrecklich
Unfortunately you have to watch the whole clip….. Your country needs you!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q9XJeL2MNpw
Stop providing them weapons and bring them in front of the Int. Court for war crimes.
http://www.sgoal.org/Bring-Israel-in-front-of-the-International-Criminal-Court-for-war-crimes
Meanwhile, the Bush/Obama legacy in Iraq is being realized:
http://www.spiked-online.com/newsite/article/why-isnt-anyone-talking-about-the-nightmare-in-northern-iraq/15540
http://www.newyorker.com/news/daily-comment/friend-flees-horror-isis
Israel was conceived in terror and it literally continues to this day. It amazes me how willing people are to close their eyes to the horrible injustice that’s ravaged the lives of thousands of Palestinians for 66-years now. The cavalier dismissals made by our corrupt US politicians of the plight of a besieged people living under the humiliating racist system of apartheid is shameful.
All the evil ugliness that it is contained in Israel is 100% reflected in the US in the form of opportunism that can only be explained by extreme cowardice and immorality. However, the US is also racist since “otherness”is required in order to prevent shame or guilt to creep in — which we can’t have, lest we be compelled to act morally and ethically. On the other hand, as Americans, this comes natural to us since our nation was also founded in the genocide of a native population and built from the labor of Africans that we imported to outright own as our property.
The pathetic kowtowing of Obama, Kerry, Boxer, Warren, Reid, and Sanders to the Israel lobby is revolting. I can’t imagine them sleeping at night without without taking fistfuls of sleeping pills. If they can sleep without overdose-levels of medication then that’s scary to me. That America has made it this far with such a monumental moral deficit is mind-boggling. It’s almost magical, wouldn’t you say?
“The IDF finally had to open up and publish that Israeli generals received direct instructions from Ben-Gurion during the War of Independence to kill civilians, or line them up against the wall and shoot them, in order to help to encourage the exodus, that in fact resulted, of 700,000 Palestinians, who were driven out of their—left their homes, and their towns and villages were destroyed. This was terror, even within not just the terrorist groups, the pre-state terrorists, but this is within the military, the Israeli military, that fought the War of Independence.”
— Henry Siegman
http://www.democracynow.org/2014/7/30/henry_siegman_leading_voice_of_us
The problem should always be traced to its source — the bombardment came to a stop when Obama condemned it.
Russia will not allow a NATO missile base in the Ukraine.
What aggression? Really, over 3,000 rockets aimed at civilian targets land in Tel Aviv after Israel withdrew from Gaza in 2005? They shoot rockets that they surround with children. Israel is just supposed to take a constant barrage of rockets (that were coming into Israel regularly for months before this offensive?). Is it ok that Hamas builds tunnels with concrete that came from Israel as aid to the people instead of building schools and hospitals? Why is it ok for everyone else to defend themselves, but when Jews do its aggression. Should we just sit there and die? This was not aggression, it was self defense. Shame on you for even using the word aggression, its naive and deplorable.
I saw that Glenn had this post up from another site. Glad I saw the post and glad that Glenn has posted on this important topic.
I thought I would reminisce a bit here about the topic of Israel. A long time ago in a venue that Mr. Greenwald no longer reports for, I was asked if I thought Israel “had a right to exist”. I always smile at that old “gottcha”. The fact was then, as it remains now, that of course Israel has no right to exist. But then no State has any god given right to exist so keep your “that is antisemitic” crap to yourself.
The people of Palestine have a right to exist and they have a right to the property and lives that the “Great State of Israel” has stolen from them in the decades long slow-mo genocide. The Europeans
Well that comment ended poorly with this new Windows 8.1 box doing as it damn well pleased. Apparently the NSA knew I was going to blame the Europeans and the US for most of the trouble in the middle east since they have been meddling there since oil was first discovered and there would be no fascist Israel without all that meddling. So, since 8.1 seems to send a “post the damn comment” signal randomly I’ll stop here. No doubt pleasing the hell out of the old regulars. Bye now.
Would it not be more succinct to consider the right to self defense?
With respect to who has the right to property and lives, is not the evolutionary dogma of natural selection applicable?
Just wondering.
This has been discussed below in other comments. You mean the right to self-defense of Gaza or Israel? And no, I don’t believe their rights are equivalent in that regard.
Well, who knows if the right to self defense is equivalent between Israel and Palestine, but you have to be a complete idiot if you think that they aren’t going to react the same way. Of course, Hamas knows that.
Israel is reacting at the same moral level as a street-criminal firing a 50 caliber machine-gun at his victims who’re shooting a bb-gun at him in response to just having had their family members murdered, beaten, robbed, kidnapped, and vandalized by him. It’s understandable why he would do this because he’s a criminal. However, it’s not right of course.
If he weren’t such a criminal he would do the morally correct thing and not kill anymore people and make reparations. You know…stop being a thug and become an honest member of society. As it is, though, people like you give him permission to continue his life of crime which includes killing his victims whenever they shoot a bb-gun at him in response to being victimized. It’s hard to come up with something more perverse than that.
I’d say that the right not to be occupied takes precedence over a right to self defense from the occupied.
The Last And First Temptation Of Israel
“What is one to make of the fact that the deputy speaker of the Knesset has called for ethnic cleansing in Gaza?
“He’s not an obscure blogger for the Times of Israel. He is a luminary of the Likud – a man who got 23 percent of the vote in a contest for the Likud Party leadership. He was appointed to his current high position by Benjamin Netanyahu…”
http://dish.andrewsullivan.com/2014/08/05/the-last-and-first-temptation-of-israel/
One can discern from this type of “representative” particularly when directly appointed by the Prime Minister, that the Likud Party, the Knesset, and the State of Israel, are the same as the Nazi’s of antiquity, more commonly referred to today as Zionists.
See also: http://www.intifada-palestine.com/2014/08/concentrate-exterminate-israel-parliament-deputy-speakers-gaza-genocide-plan/
Full letter to Netanyahu is documented and a link to his twitter account is provided.
Mohammed Abu Khdeir was the boy who was forced to drink gasoline and then set on fire while still alive.
“17 year old Nassr Abu Khdeir, cousin of Muhammad, was kidnapped tonight from his home by undercover Israeli police.”
https://twitter.com/dancohen3000/status/497145284506292224/photo/1
May he not suffer intolerably. This makes me sick.
University of Illinois fires professor Steven Salaita after Gaza massacre tweets
Submitted by Ali Abunimah on Wed, 08/06/2014 – 17:35
“Steven Salaita was fired from his position as associate professor in the American Indian Studies program at the University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign (UIUC) apparently over views critical of Israel, especially its current massacre in Gaza.
“Meanwhile, Cary Nelson, former president of the American Association of University Professors (AAUP), who has publicly supported the university’s decision to remove Salaita, gave frank comments to The Electronic Intifada revealing the extent of his own pro-Israel views…”
http://electronicintifada.net/blogs/ali-abunimah/university-illinois-fires-professor-steven-salaita-after-gaza-massacre-tweets
Hi Tujays –
Thanks for the link. This is not the first I’ve heard of problems in academia stemming from pro-Palestinian views. This fellow Salaita may not be the most likable character, but academic freedom is way too important to let go off into some sunset.
This raises appoint I’d like to make. Disclaimer: I’m a retired college prof and pro-union. I feel we must be very vigilant now about preserving academic freedom. I notice all around that teacher tenure is under attack, teachers’ use of social media is increasingly monitored and regulated by schools, and there are moves to weaken public sector unions, including those of teachers. These developments do not bode well in my opinion for academic freedom.
Lest anyone doubt, I firmly believe that academic freedom, especially at the college level, is crucial to our democracy. Students need to be exposed to various viewpoints, and need to be able to express their own (with civility, I would hope). We need citizens who can look at, evaluate, and negotiate between views.
End of rant.
Hi, feline. I wouldn’t call it a “rant”. You raised some valid and important concerns. Having the media controlled by a special interest group is bad enough, but having their tentacles reach into academia where it should be a safe-harbor for ideas is beyond the pale, as you alluded to. It’ll be interesting to watch this battle unfold. I’m almost certain that academic freedom will win out, but I’m hoping the discussion will be parlayed in some way to other sectors such as media and government.
While the Israeli lobby is being exposed to a minor extent in the media, I think that if the corrupting influence in academia is exposed, then it may become easier and possibly more acceptable to transfer those open standards and ideals to media. I’m not really sure if that’s possible in this context, or how any of it would actually play itself out in real life since I just started thinking about it. However, one thing I think is to safe to say is, the more sunlight the better…it has a way of spreading. We got a ways to go with the government, though. That shit’s locked up pretty tight with money right now. I’m not sure what the answer to that is. Maybe during this next battle a key will be presented in some form or another. Exciting times…
“A soldier sits in Abed Abu Srour’s home during a night raid in Aida Refugee Camp.
When asked about his work, the soldier said he was not proud of what he did.
When asked about the AIda, he assumed that all the refugees had voluntarily come to the camp.
He echoed familiar logic;
“God gave us this land.””
— at Aida Refugee camp, Bethlehem
“Stunning @kellylynn194 photo of night raid in Aida camp – just another Israeli home invasion”
https://twitter.com/MaxBlumenthal/status/497153302832742400/photo/1
Does this look like a Mossad internet troll Twitter account to you?
https://twitter.com/MarkMark250
Interesting article just posted at Press TV.
“Israel identified as top spying threat to US in new NSA document”
http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2014/08/06/374311/us-sees-israel-as-top-spying-threat/
“In an interview with Press TV on Sunday, US (a)ctivist and commentator Mark Glenn said that Israel is America’s “most dangerous enemy” that spies on US officials to “control” and blackmail them, forcing American politicians to “bow” before the regime in Tel Aviv.
“Israel spies on our elected officials and uses that information against them, particularly information that is embarrassing or possibly even incriminating,” said Glenn, a writer and co-founder of the Crescent and Cross Solidarity Movement.”
.ir is the Internet country code top-level domain (ccTLD) for Iran. Hardly an objective source. Moreover there’s nothing interesting about it, it’s just a short summary of the information presented above, and If that wasn’t enough it also contains a soundbite from one Mark Glenn who is apparently an old-school anti-semite (Jews control the world etc etc).
That you call it interesting is indicative of your level of intelligence.
@ GC:
The fact that you have a problem with foreign press outlets that don’t cater to your Zionist/Nazi Pro-Israeli views is indicative of your obvious prejudices toward those of other than Semite ethnicity and makes you, thereby, a hypocrite of the highest order.
You are a fucking idiot my friend. Iran is a theocracy, people are killed or sent to prison for saying the wrong thing there. Not exactly an inviting place for free press.
And please stop parroting the idiotic “Zionist/Nazi” line. Prove it or get the fuck out of here.
When I see national legislators in other countries in action I realize more than ever how bankrupt the US congress is in moral leadership. I saw this originally at electronicintifada.com
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=keS-LDl_ewA
{“Senator David Norris” Israel bombs first and weeps later”. }
If not for the accent this man could have taken the words out of my own mouth. I applaud him and condemn our self-serving US politicians – bought or blackmailed, into serving the dark, evil Zionist/Nazi forces that control Israel and our own US Government.
Thanks for posting larry.
Goddamn. That’s really amazing to watch. If only….
Meanwhile, in Gaza, the ICRC President Peter Maurer is looking at this:
“ICRC President Peter Maurer in Gaza – shocked by human suffering”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2xbP4g26mhc#t=99
Do those women and children look like combatants?
Jody Rudoren is a sick, sick, sick, sick individual
https://twitter.com/MaxBlumenthal/status/497121853995876352
Disgusting excuse for a human being.
US Citizens should be looking at the military actions of their Washington DC Government carefully. Briefly stated, the US initiated a coup with an essentially Nazi mercenary force, to overthrow the elected Ukrainian President in February of 2014. Since that time, the US, backed by NATO forces, has been instrumental in establishing and maintaining a regime there which appears to be intent upon exterminating the local Ukrainian population. Why? Well there are different theories but the most concise explanation is that Ukraine is a strategic location for the establishment of a US Nuclear Missile Base. Great way to keep that war machine rolling. Meanwhile, the US population is informed by the MSM that Russia is the aggressor in the Ukraine and NATO forces are required to protect the citizens. Of course, much has been written about these events by many alternative media sites and I would encourage people to read about them and formulate their own opinions. At the following link is a picture of Ukraine today which looks very similar to the Gaza .
“UN: Scared of the way military operations conducted in E. Ukraine”
http://rt.com/news/178384-un-ukraine-refugees-humanitarian/
This is another modern day picture of western war crimes committed in unnecessary aggressive assaults by US politicians acting on behalf of the Nazi “elite” international central bankers.
C’mon, you must be insane or on vodka…
Why don’t you link to an authoritative web site, not one that is a mouthpiece for Putin?
These claims rank right up there with Hitler’s claim that Poland started WWII. What else would one expect from a web site that is a propaganda arm of Putin’s Russia?
You are delusional
The Palestinian Authority is back in as the chief negotiator with Israel for a peace settlement. The assault was meant to reverse the election results and punish the people for choosing Hamas. 3400 Palestinians dead, 16000 wounded, and billions in destruction since the election of Hamas in 2007.
It’s disappointing to see Greenwald is just another Jew-hating European. How many more millions of them do they have to kill before he and his ilk will be satisfied?
It’s more than disappointing – it’s a massacre of innocent people whose lives mean nothing to the Zionists and decent people everywhere are in mourning over this baseless assault. Zionists are making Jews unsafe again in Europe. They are monsters who have nothing to do with Judaism or God. Genocide is a crime against humanity. Committing that crime earns a very bad reputation for Zionists. You might appeal to them to renounce their savagery and emulate human beings – doing that would go a long way to improving the way they’re viewed.
Wolf Blitzer, I love the banner “wolf challenges outrageous claims in conflict”.. after a few minutes of the usual: “why doesn’t Hamas recognize Israel” he moves on to Moishe Feiglin, who is demanding “tent encampments” in Sinai for the Palestinians, at least for the Palestinians he doesn’t want shot
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=upbaZnhKlBc&list=UUqVeMUffsoeo9idMRcse0lQ
I guess this is Wolf’s attempt at looking balanced, He couldn’t just question the idea of an Israeli minister suggesting 21st century concentration camps, …without being equally demanding that Hamas recognize this same government, a government that doesn’t give them a vote, that imprisons them without charge or trial, that shells them, causing thousands of deaths.
So, says Wolf, on the one hand an Israeli government minister is promoting the idea of concentration camps, the entire expulsion of the population…but to be fair, the leading Palestinian resistance group doesn’t endorse such a government…so it’s six of one, half a dozen of the other!!!
I think Blitzer challenged Feiglin pretty effectively. I think he was hard enough on Feiglin. I don’t think Feiglin managed to weasel out of anything. The Hamas spokesman, however, jeez. A joke (the Hamas guy).
I’ve been trying to catch up on this Feiglin guy:
-“But the recent barrage of belligerent and dehumanizing comments about Palestinians remains striking. They come not in a lawmaker’s moment of weakness or in a message from some internationally condemned group of fringe activists, but in essays from elected leaders of a country that touts itself as a uniquely advanced First World state in the Middle East.
On Thursday, Feiglin declared on his Facebook page, “Our soldiers are the only innocents in Gaza. Under no circumstances should they be killed because of false morality that prefers to protect enemy civilians. One hair on the head of an Israeli soldier is more precious than the entire Gazan populace, which elected the Hamas and supports and encourages anyone who murders Israelis.””
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/07/25/israel-far-right-gaza-moshe-feiglin_n_5621667.html
The rightwing parliamentarians in Israel seem to be at least as far out there as the rightwing congress members in America, who are on CNN every other week calling for someone to be assassinated or drone bomber, or in the case of McCain, calling for yet another country to be bombed.
@JLocke “One hair on the head of an Israeli soldier…” Yup, that’s not a very nice or reasonable thing to say. I’m sure you’re also up on your Ayelet Shaked, so I won’t bore you. These are elected officials saying this stuff. Is it any wonder these pro war mobs keep materializing at protests and beating up the peaceniks? The forces of extremism, nationalism, intolerance and racism are at an all-time frightening high in Israel right now. It’s scary over over there. The Palestinians aren’t the only people I’m worried about.
” I’m sure you’re also up on your Ayelet Shaked, so I won’t bore you.”
I missed hearing about that actually, yeah it’s more of the same, but now I more fully understand the Turkish government’s comments comparing the Israeli govenment to Hitler’s:
Erdogan – “(Israelis) have no conscience, no honour, no pride. Those who condemn Hitler day and night have surpassed Hitler in barbarism.”
I’m not sure they’ve surpassed Hitler (Erdogan is in election rhetoric mode) but that Shaked sure is ugly:
Shaked – “Behind every terrorist stand dozens of men and women, without whom he could not engage in terrorism. They are all enemy combatants, and their blood shall be on all their heads. Now this also includes the mothers of the martyrs, who send them to hell with flowers and kisses. They should follow their sons, nothing would be more just. They should go, as should the physical homes in which they raised the snakes. Otherwise, more little snakes will be raised there.”
http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/why-im-on-the-brink-of-burning-my-israeli-passport-9600165.html
Yes, that is a wild exaggeration from Erdogan, but he’s not wrong to suggest the analogy, because the Islamophobia from Shaked and Feiglin and others is so alarming and extreme. Comparisons to pre WWII Germany are inevitable. Same kind of mood of simmering intolerance and anger, and demonizing the enemy by dehumanizing them (suggesting they aren’t even human).
I’m really tired of following this. It’s draining. I pray something good comes out of it for the Palestinians. And I hope we’re not all watching a future re-run of this war in 2/3 years. And paying for it again.
Elections are coming up; I hope Hamas goes away. But the preliminary analyses I’ve read suggest that this war has only strengthened support for Hamas among the Palestinian people.
Yeesh, the more I read about this LIkud Knesset member the yuckier it gets:
-“Feiglin, who has said that Arabs are “a gang of bandits,” then offered his own military strategy. The Israeli government, he said, should cut off electricity to Gaza so that its hospitals would be paralysed. “The blood of a dialysis patient in Gaza,” he said, “is not redder than the blood of our IDF [Israel armed forces] soldiers who will, God forbid, need to enter [Gaza].””
http://therealnews.com/t2/component/content/article/132-more-blog-posts-from-vijay-prashad/2129-pounding-gaza-with-impunity-
No country would put up with an enemy sworn to its destruction, firing rockets into its territory and not respond. How many civilians did the US kill during the invastions of Iraq and Afganistan; how many during drone strikes. Did we warn people to get out of the way? When the commander of Hamas’ terrorists was warned that his house was targeted he put his entire family on the roof. UNRWA knew about the weapons cache in their facilities and said and did nothing. Those who accuse Israel of genocide would never put up with themselves – they just cant stand Jews standing up for themselves for the first time since 144 C.E.
Of the 3,000 plus rockets fired by Hamas from Gaza the Israeli Iron Dome defensive system was used to “kill” only several hundred. Why? Because the system instantly calculates where the warhead will impact. If it will impact an unpopulated area they don’t use munitions to intercept it. The same calculations reveal exactly where the rocket was fired from, and that point is now a target that is distributed to the battlefield management system for assignment to a weapon system. The launch site may be a home, a field, a UN facility, whatever. If it was used to launch a warhead towards Israel it becomes a target. It’s physics folks. Ballistic trajectories and recursive fits. The IDF doesn’t light a fuse and put their fingers in their ears like Hamas.
“UN chief: Gaza deaths and destruction shame world”
AP foreign, Wednesday August 6 2014
http://www.theguardian.com/world/feedarticle/11477887
UNITED NATIONS (AP)
Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon says “the massive deaths and destruction in Gaza have shocked and shamed the world” and is demanding an end to “the senseless cycle of suffering” in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.
“We will build again, but this must be the last time to rebuild,” the U.N. chief told the General Assembly Wednesday. “This must stop now. We must go back to the negotiating table.”
Ban said the U.N. understands Israel’s right to defend itself from Hamas rockets but “the horror that was unleashed on the people of Gaza” raises serious questions about respect for international law that requires a distinction between civilians and combatants and proportionality.
U.N. human rights chief Navi Pillay told the assembly that “any attacks in violation of these principles …. may amount to war crimes.”
End of article
Again:
“UN chief: Gaza deaths and destruction shame world”
The UN allowed hamas to store rockets in its buildings and did not stop hamas from firing from next to its schools. Had Gaza been demilitarized these wars would never have happened. Had Hama’s used its cement for homes not tunnels their would be less suffering in Gaza. BTW what happened to Tue Gazans who were anti hamas– Hama’s killed them their own without a trial
This is what Israel is saying in response to the UN War Crimes Probe:
“Israel should not cooperate with UN war crimes probe: Officials”
http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2014/08/06/374286/israel-should-not-work-with-un-probe/
They showed what they think of the UN when they bombed UN facilities, repeatedly.
This comment might post twice.
This is what Israel is saying in response to the UN War Crimes probe:
“Israel should not cooperate with UN war crimes probe: Officials”
See: http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2014/08/06/374286/israel-should-not-work-with-un-probe/
It seems that we haven’t learned anything from history. In plain 21st century, and we are seeing the indiscriminate killing of innocent Palestinian civilians by Israelis, and the world standing by idly and doing nothing. I am quite dismayed for the future of humanity.
The U.S. A. President, Senators, Congressmen/-women and state officials
1. You are representing the U.S.A but not as a servant to Israel, so that you fulfill their “Crazy criminal wishes”.
2. You know better than anybody else that Israel is so called the State of mentally disordered Jews in the World.
3. This is based on the American Psychological Association (APA) studies in the 30s; more than 90% of the mentally disordered patients in U.S.A. Psychiatric Hospitals were JEWs.
Those Jews and their follows ended in so called Israel / Occupied Palestine.
In Common Words, Israeli Jews are mentally disordered and Israel is so called a State of a CRAZY JEWs.
The mentally disordered JEWs in Israel are running a State that is nothing but stray, abandoned, unscrupulous etc. with your full support.
The Western World is been dictated by a mentally disordered JEWs; Shame and disgrace to them especially the U.N, U.S.A. and Co.
4. Please do not Fall so cheap and so disgraceful, you are representing the U.S.A.
Kenneth Roth from Human Rights Watch and former U.N. special rapporteur on human rights in occupied Palestinian, John Dugard, are on Democracy Now this morning. The transcript isn’t out yet but the video can be seen at their site.
Debunking Israel’s self-defense argument
“The rockets fired by Palestinian factions from Gaza must be construed as acts of resistance of an occupied people and an assertion of its recognized right to self-determination.”
— John Dugard
Debunking Israel’s self-defense argument
http://america.aljazeera.com/opinions/2014/7/gaza-israel-internationalpoliticsunicc.html
Also from today’s show:
Rim Banna and Kari Bremnes – Ya Lel Ma Atwalak – This never ending night
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yxYTRJ5w2I0
I think more and more people are starting to question the premise that the oppressor has the right of aggressive self-defense. Others are realizing that Palestinians do have a right of self-defense. Among prominent US commentators, I suspect Chris Hedges is the first one to explicitly say that. Noam Chomsky has talked about the double-standard as well.
“Others are realizing that Palestinians do have a right of self-defense.”
I think that the reason that people haven’t yet fully come to terms with that is because they deny or are ignorant of the fact that the Palestinian people suffer greatly under occupation. No people would allow that. Unfortunately, Israel has been incredibly successful in making themselves out to be the victims and the Palestinians to be the barbarians. The world has finally seen with their own eyes the reality of the situation. Both Israel and the US need to go to The Hague to answer for the crimes they’ve committed all these years
“Both Israel and the US need to go to The Hague to answer for the crimes they’ve committed all these years”
Absolutely concur.
As Palestinians Go To ICC, Human Rights Watch Alleges Israeli War Crimes for Shooting Fleeing Gazans
KENNETH ROTH: Well, you know, despite the Israeli ambassador’s claim that Israel deserves the Nobel Peace Prize for its extraordinary restraint and its extraordinary care to spare civilian lives, Human Rights Watch has seen from the ground, based on our investigations in Gaza, that that’s anything but the case. And no matter how many times the Israeli military spokesmen scream, “Human shields! Human shields!” most of the people being killed in Gaza are being killed because Israel is paying insufficient care to saving civilian lives. There’s been case after case in which Israel has used the wrong weaponry or has shot at people with many civilians around. And these, in our view, are war crimes.
http://www.democracynow.org/2014/8/6/as_palestinians_visit_icc_human_rights?autostart=true
A side note to the unmitigated violence of Zionist Israel.
“Altogether national hatred is something peculiar. You will always find it strongest and most violent where there is the lowest degree of culture.”
– Johann Wolfgang von Goethe
Tujays, thank you for posting images of the horrifically injured children and their mothers, some of whom are dead. These images should be tweeted continually to keep these crimes fresh in the world’s consciousness, until the Palestinians are made whole and their land restored to them.
Israel gave them Gaza in 2005, forcebily removed thousands of Israelis. And the response was rockeyst from hamas not peace, henceforth they sealed their borders. Why should Israel open its border to allow weapons into an aggressive nemesis
Zionists stole the land owned by the Palestinians through terrorism and savagely cruel sadism and wanton murder, sometimes if whole families but for one member left alive to suffer the memory the rest of his/her life.
And you find them, the Zionists, to be generous? A warped sense of right and wrong, a moral morass leading to the avid support of evil. Is that what and how you teach your children?
Absolutely. A picture is worth a thousand words.
Can Israel Claim Self-Defense Against the Territory It Occupies? Int’l Jurist John Dugard Says No
JOHN DUGARD: I hold the prosecutor of the International Criminal Court partly responsible for the fact that no proceedings have been initiated against Israel and Hamas before the International Criminal Court…
I think it’s clear that, in terms of the 1973 Convention on Apartheid, Israel’s policies and practices in the occupied Palestinian territory are tantamount to apartheid.
…it’s very important for Israel that it should portray itself as the victim in the present conflict. And President Obama and both houses of Congress have endorsed the view that Israel acts in self-defense. But as I see the situation, it is very different. Gaza is an occupied territory. It’s part of the occupied Palestinian territory…
So given the fact that Gaza is an occupied territory, it means that Israel’s present assault on Gaza is simply a way of enforcing the continuation of the occupation, and the response of the Palestinian militants should be seen as the response of an occupied people that wishes to resist the occupation. It has taken this resistance into Israel itself, but it still remains resistance.
I think it would be very helpful to see the occupation of Gaza in the same context as one might see, for instance, the occupation of, shall we say, Netherlands during the Second World War by Germany. It’s an occupied territory, and if Israel uses force against the occupied territory, it’s not acting in self-defense. It’s acting as an occupying power.
I think it’s important to realize that under the Rome Statute, a state which assists, aids or abets a state in the commission of an international crime is also guilty. And I suspect that one of the reasons why the United States is opposed to Palestine joining the International Criminal Court is that inevitably its own complicity in these crimes will become an issue.
http://www.democracynow.org/2014/8/6/can_israel_claim_self_defense_against
Another excellent post.
Palestine is occupied by Israel. The facts speak for themselves.
Israel is an apartheid state and they have committed crimes against the their Palestinian captives.
They must be properly investigated and held accountable for those crimes by International tribunal.
Thanks for posting.
@ Tujays I looked at your earlier post of the child who was found alive (but family killed) on Twitter. Images like these are not getting any easier to look at. Then I moused down a little and clicked on this:
https://twitter.com/answerallman/status/496434993586245632
It’s a 2009 interview between Norman Finkelstein and Adam Holm, a pro-Zionist journalist, and it’s kind of amazing to watch. The more agitated Holm gets, the calmer, more unflappable, implacable and lucid Finkelstein becomes. It’s like Holm snorted a line of cocaine before the interview and Finkelstein popped a Quaalude. And Finkelstein wins. I would pay $100 to see Finkelstein square off against Mark Regev in a debate.
Great interview, thanks for posting it.
Interviewer: What do you think the international community should do about Israel…how should the case of Israel be handled?
Finkelstein: There’s a very simple way to handle it: they should enforce the law.
I hope that at some point in the near future someone stops what you are doing. I get that at some level you think what you are doing provides some kind of service, but in reality you’re just a run of the mill traitor. Shame on you!
More good news this morning: UK MPs demand end to Israeli restrictions on Palestinian land
https://news.yahoo.com/uk-mps-demand-end-israeli-restrictions-palestinian-land-002407512.html
Jumping for Joy!
Horse from shouting FREE PALESTINE!
Some times it takes a Tory to get the ball rolling (in UK)
-Rowan-
>Jumping for Joy!
Horse from shouting FREE PALESTINE!
Sounds like an equestrian event :), but I’m with you Rowan, also very hoarse.
Thought I might have misspelt whores.
Not a time for jokes… Certainly was not on purpose. Ask General Hercules, got into trouble with pubic interest…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vg09kWkrxIE
Heh!
Humor is a gift that helps us to stand strong while enduring the unendurable.
Just backing you up Glen.
US supplies Israel with bombs amid Gaza blitz
31 Jul 2014 00:34
http://www.aljazeera.com/news/middleeast/2014/07/us-supplies-israel-with-bombs-amid-gaza-blitz-2014730233016747143.html
“The United States has allowed Israel, waging an offensive in the Gaza Strip, to tap a local US arms stockpile in the past week to resupply it with grenades and mortar rounds, Rear Admiral John Kirby, the Pentagon’s press secretary, has said.”
“The munitions were located inside Israel… for US use that Israel can also access in emergency situations.”
“Washington allowed Israel to access the strategic stockpile to resupply itself with 40mm grenades and 120mm mortar rounds to deplete older stocks that would eventually need to be refreshed.”
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2014/08/01/congress-approves-bill-to-replenish-israel-iron-dome-missile-defense/
August 01, 2014
“…At a White House news conference earlier Friday, the president (Obama) reiterated his support for Israel’s right to self-defense while urging greater protection for Palestinian civilians.”…
Barak Obamas’ strategy of saying one thing to the public, while doing another horrific thing behind the scenes is starting to resemble Merkel, Musharraf, and Cameron… Snakes speak with forked tongues.
“The relationship has, on at least one occasion, entailed the covert payment of a large amount of cash to Israeli operatives. Beyond their own surveillance programs, the American and British surveillance agencies rely on U.S.-supported Arab regimes, including the Jordanian monarchy and even the Palestinian Authority Security Forces, to provide vital spying services regarding Palestinian targets.”
And WHAT KIND OF “Palestinian targets” do you suspect all of those groups are willing to cooperate in identifying? Talk about a stupid “report.”
And the problem is? If USA had not helped Israel while arab oil nations pump in millions of dollars into Hamas they could not launch all these rockets, Israel would be exterminated.
Thank you for this.
Yet more made up crap from Greenwald. It is sad if anyone would take this nonsense seriously.
to James –
Sorry I could not reply directly to your reply to my post farther down. I appreciate the thought you so obviously put into it. You certainly have given me lots to think about. Free will is something Christians also believe in – and something that could also be thought about and discussed at length. Your analogies and conclusions that life encompasses so many different facets – there must be some truth to that (if I remember Leo Buscaglia has said something similar!). I’m reminded of a Christian song (hope no one minds just a mere snippet from) sung by Barbara Mandrell – there was a line: “If I never had a problem, I would never know that God could solve them.” – sounds very close to your thoughts :-)
Anyway – it would be nice if we humans could find a way, after so many centuries to stop using wars and violence to solve problems.
Peace to you , also —- and I’m certainly praying for it for the Gazans.
Glen, your post reinforces Israeli ‘aggression’ while the reality isn’t clear cut. Obviously arguments are made the other way, that Israel acts in self defense / responds to provocation. It is irresponsible of you to assume either position in an article which should be a matter of fact.
You’ve incorporated the Snowden docs to prove your point but the straight facts do not validate your views. This premise is completely subjective, and you’re muddling the facts with your opinion.
All Israel has to do is lose once. Their opposition can lose a million times. Sorry, I hold no great love for Israel’s opposition but of course seeing the innocent hurt bothers me. Still, my allegiance is to the Jewish state and I might add if Glenn Greenwald and his partner were to take up residence in any Muslim state he is so quick to defend he would not last two seconds. He would be jailed or killed or both. He should think on that and what these poor religious states would do to him or anyone who dissents!
Lady Warsi is the first British official to resign in protest over Gaza. With Carter, Kucinich, an Irish politician, and numerous others condemning Israel, the tide is finally turning.
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/aug/05/sayeeda-warsi-departure-david-cameron-resignation-gaza#comment-39071657
It’s just a shame that her resignation won’t achieve anything. Resignations never seem to, in British politics.
The Palestinians voted in Hamas to power now they suffer the consequences, hamas and only hamas is to blame for the killings in Gaza.
It’s very sad and heart wrenching but it’s there own terrorist government who uses them as human shields.
“Israeli aggression would be impossible without the constant, lavish support and protection of the U.S. government,”
Whoa, hang on there. Israeli Aggression?! Israel is only defending itself against a barrage of rockets being indiscriminately launched at their civilian population. If the rockets aren’t launched, Israel would not be stepping in to stop it.
I don’t think you understand the situation in the Middle East at all. The Arab talks about their land being stolen like a white man in Martha’s Vineyard complaining about a black man “stealing his lands” by legitimately buying a property in that neighbourhood.
Israel was formed by UN Resolution. The Arab peoples of the region violently objected, declared war and lost. In the course of the war they lost lands. People were displaced on both sides. The world has a way of dealing with refugees in times of conflict. As did the some 800,000 Jews who were expelled by Arab countries in 1948. Refugees get absorbed and move on with their lives. That’s why you don’t read about Serbian or Albanian refugee camp. No where else are their multigenerational refugees like in Gaza or the West bank. Why? Because no neighbouring country would take them in, since this creates a persistent protest against the existence of a Israel. So why did the 800,000 Jewish refugees go? They were absorbed into Israel, the only safe haven they have. In fact that was why it was created. Is there any discussion for their “right to return”? Not on your life. The Arabs are quite happy to have confiscated their property and have no will to return those assets. In any case, given Arab/Muslim prejudice against Jews what kind of life would they be returning to? Which leads us to thinking about what kind of Palestine Hamas and Fatah intend to build? Will it be culturally diverse, with equal rights to health care, education and political participation, free of legalised discrimination or will Koran 9:29 be implemented with zeal, consigning all minorities to being second class citizens? Abbas has already said that no Jews will be allowed to live in his Palestine and he’s considered a relative moderate. So what kind of society will Hamas build? Well maybe we can get a steer from ISIS. Recent events in Mosul give your readers a good understanding of what a Hamas’ utopia will look like. It is said that Lenin talked about the concept of “Useful Idiots”. Many of your readers are being cynically manipulated.
Your hearts are in the right place but you’ve been deceived into backing the wrong side. Hamas does not intend to build a benign humanitarian society.
MUST WATCH Chris Hedges speech on Gaza:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x21pph7_chris-hedges-speech-about-gaza_news
Nothing is ever as you believe it to be. The relationship between Isr & US are thought to be strained. They are ideologically, but not when it comes to mutual “targets”.
The feds stated today, they feel there is another leak, post Snowden. We have a new whistleblower?
While I appreciate the facts provided by this article, the antisemitic and accusatory tone of it against Israel is disgusting. Israel is surrounded by an ideology hell bent on its destruction, and you call Israel the aggressor? Get real!
Gaza Calling: All out on Saturday 9 August Day of Rage
As we face the full might of Israel’s military arsenal, funded and supplied by the United States and European Union, we call on civil society and people of conscience throughout the world to pressure governments to sanction Israel and implement a comprehensive arms embargo immediately.
Take to the streets on Saturday 9 August with a united demand for sanctions on Israel.
Take action this Saturday
1. Make boycotts, divestments and sanctions the main message at every protest around the world. Take banners and placards calling for sanction on Israel to every protest. Tweet them using the hashtag #GazaDayofRage. Email us your pictures and action details to GazaDayofRage@gmail.com.
2. While news of all the mass protests outside Israel’s embassies around the world have given us hope, after weeks of protests, we urge you to intensify your actions. Occupy Israeli embassies, challenge Israeli officials (and others) supporting the current aggression against Gaza whenever they appear in public and stage sit-in in government buildings.
3. Boycott all Israeli products and take action against corporations profiting from Israel’s system of colonialism, occupation and apartheid. March to boycott targets in your city and educate the public about companies complicit in Israel’s ongoing military assault and illegal siege of Gaza.
4. Palestinian trade unions are calling on our brothers and sisters in the trade union movement internationally to stop handling goods imported from or exported to Israel. The trade union movement has a proud history of direct action against Apartheid in South Africa, the Congress of South African Trade Unions has joined us in the call for direct action to end Israel’s impunity.
http://www.bdsmovement.net/2014/gaza-calling-all-out-on-saturday-9-august-day-of-rage-12423
Ok Glenn, I’m with you; the USA is a major enabler and contributor to Israel’s crimes against humanity in Gaza. However, we need a clearer analysis of the causes and reasons for this; it seems that you are positing an all-evil, all-seeing NSA with its tentacles of surveillance reaching everything and everywhere, a voracious monster with no modus operandi or oversight from government or special interests. I think it’s a bit insincere to ignore any examination of the mechanisms of “American democracy” that produce this situation. What’s your take? Are you with Chomsky, that the Israel Lobby isn’t really a big factor; it’s just the big bad wolf of US Empire up to its usual trickes, or are you with Mearsheimer and Walt that the driver of most of US Middle East policy is this loose association of loyalists to a foreign flag? I don’t even say “dual loyalty” any more, as it has become abundantly clear that although they pay lip service to America’s interests, mainly trying to convince people that they are identical to Israel’s own interests, these folks are not Americans, they are tribalists.
Once again..Arthur Silber thrusts the saber of truth through the heart of beast of insanity. And it bears repeating..
http://powerofnarrative.blogspot.com/
Bless him. Please help him to help us understand the brutality of insanity.
I agree Chronicle. That’s a compelling argument advanced by the author:
“……..That is what Israel is doing in Gaza: it is engaged in a program of extermination [even as the population in Gaza grows]. Minimal decency and intellectual honesty should compel us to speak the truth about this matter.
At least the cattle were actually diseased, or at least some of them were. What is the disease carried by the Palestinians [Hamas]? It’s very simple: their conviction that they, too, have a right to exist.
For that, they must be destroyed…..” My brackets
Beautiful summary of the IP conflict in six sentences. Wow, Chronicle. I think you solved a century of conflict with that link.
Thanks.
Gaza child found alive four days after Israel murdered his family
https://twitter.com/HamdoDelic/status/496808579580829696/photo/1
@Craig Summers: “Extermination”?! You ought to read a little more about modern urban warfare. Urban warfare of this nature inevitably results in civilian deaths.
Particularly when Hamas’ combatants are encouraging civilians to act as human shields. In WW2, the Allies killed many civilians and there was no cry of “Extermination” or “Genocide.” So why apply those kinds of terms here. No political leader should lightly take their people into war, for precisely this reason, he is sentencing some of his civilians to death. Hamas has decided to escalate things since the tragic revenge killing of the Palestiinian teenager. They have taken their people into a war.
Civilian deaths even though not a specific target of the Israelis is inevitable. To expect otherwise is to be ignorant of the nature of war.
To make exaggerated claims of “extermination” is to also synonymously accuse Israel of Genocide. Hardly.
If you wanted to see extermination look over your shoulder at ISIS, they are building a society that Hamas would admire and aspire to. I love their attitude toward ethnic and cultural diversity. Not. Israel has a 20% Muslim minority. I don’t see them trading in their Israeli citizenships to show solidarity with their Arab counterparts on the West Bank or in Gaza.
In Israel no one uses a gun to tell them how they should vote. Look at the way Hamas took power. They shot their way in, told Fatah to get the hell out of Dodge. Then they legitimized their regime with an “election” where they were the only ones who had guns.
You sympathize with the Palestinians at your own peril as their portrayal of “gaining back their land” is like saying every Native American ought to lay claim to all of North America to the exclusion of all other Americans. Hardly a recipe for justice and world peace.
I thought this part was rather insightful:
I don’t think people sit around in a room planning stuff like this out loud (or who knows), but that’s effectively how things play out in practice. It makes you think what the irrational ongoing embargo against Cuba is about.
Apropo of this, hundreds are getting slaughtered in Eastern Ukraine, and there seem to be some people who hope that Russia will invade for “humanitarian” reasons.
You write as though you are unaware that the hundreds being slaughtered in Eastern Ukraine are being slaughtered by the Kiev fascists who are supported by the U.S. and the EU.
So, because Israel has the ability to defend itself against Hamas rockets, it should not respond? When they do, they’re aggressors. I too detest the killing of innocents but to do nothing only invites more from Hamas. The people need to rid their land of Hamas, that’s the first step. This entire article about intelligence sharing and blaming the U.S. is incredibly naive. Of course the U.S. and its allies share intelligence…and when its beneficial, they share it with non-allies. Israel spies om the U.S. and the U.S. spies on Israel. That;s not news. And, blaming the U.S. for every ill in the world makes you sound like worthless Obama.
Is it really still appropriate to redact the names of people involved in apparently criminal “intelligence” activities, such as the receipts for money up above? I question the policy; I think it’s time we knew who they are.
@SenatorBoxer filibusters live coverage of Abu Khdeir hearing w/incoherent pro-Israel rant.
https://twitter.com/RaniaKhalek/status/496636325345640448
Even as Michael Oren pretends he can’t hear question about Israel spying on Kerry, he responds to it:
https://twitter.com/MaxBlumenthal/status/496605691092537344
@SenatorBoxer filibusters live coverage of Abu Khdeir hearing w/incoherent pro-Israel rant.
https://twitter.com/RaniaKhalek/status/496636325345640448
Even as Michael Oren pretends he can’t hear question about Israel spying on Kerry, he responds to it:
https://twitter.com/MaxBlumenthal/status/496605691092537344
“But even as the NSA and its partners are directed by political branches to feed the Israelis surveillance data and technology, they constantly characterize Israel as a threat – both to their own national security and more generally to regional peace. In stark contrast to the public statements about Israel made by American and British officials, the Snowden archive is replete with discussions of the Israelis as a menace rather than an ally.“
Exactly. They are a menace. But we have to pretend otherwise out of fear of their likely false flag reprisals. And the politicians also cater to Jewish money and are afraid that money will dry up if they crack down on Israel. Even though, Israel is CLEARLY acting aggressively, and CLEARLY expanding their territory at the cost of the indigenous peoples.
The Symington and Glenn acts/amendments clearly state that the USA isn’t to give military aid to any country who is a nuclear power who has refused to sign the Nuclear Non-proliferation Treaty. Why is Israel exempt from this? At first, there was a policy of ambiguity — where nobody could really say they knew for certain that Israel had nukes. Now, however, with whistleblowers like Vanunu inside Israel, we have NO DOUBT. So why are we still ignoring our own laws and pretending that Israel doesn’t have nukes?
A new cartoon about the imbalance of Western-bought military power used against the people of Gaza, http://www.wintersretouching.com/MyBlog/?p=1009
“Israeli aggression”? Hamas has been bombing Israel for several years now. Recently they began an all-out assault on the nation. Yet you seem to come to the conclusion that Israel is the aggressor. I have not read any of your previous writings but I wonder if you have also lambasted the United States for its unwarranted, non-proved invasion, occupation, and destruction of a foreign nation which was in no way a threat to the US. Have you written about the wars crimes committed by the GW Bush and his administration? Have you ever denounced the 100,000+ innocent civilians that the US has killed? Have you seen the day to day slaughter in Syria that the news never seems to lead with?
“The U.S. government has long lavished overwhelming aid on Israel, providing cash, weapons and surveillance technology that play a crucial role IN ISRAEL’S ATTACKS ON ITS NEIGHBORS.” Wow! You make it sound as if Israel just goes around attacking all of her neighbors! They are in defense of their own nation. And they are being attacked on their borders, unlike the US which invaded a sovereign nation 8,000 miles away that, again, was not a threat to the US.
It’s plain to see that your coming from an anti-Israel position. It’s not even worth making people aware of such uninformed and unbiased journalism (but then, there is not too much of that anyway).
“I have not read any of your previous writings…”
Obviously.
EU (especially Germany) is American slave.
USA real government are synagogue guys. This means that EU should also help Jewish nation to rise and burn Palestine.
Really embarrassing how folks seem to think that prefacing absurd comments with something like that gives them some sort of license to then rant about things already written about.
So newbbish of them. ;-}
And what do you think Israel has been doing in Gaza? Dropping flowers?
I’m not sure you know what “all-out assault” means.
Israel is the aggressor, evidently. See, the people who are under occupation and blockade can’t be the aggressors, by definition. Blockades are an act of war.
LOL. You really should check before making a fool of yourself.
Next stop for Lee ought to be the Family Research Council’s posts on marriage equality. There he can drop a comment — wondering with implied criticism — whether they have ever said boo about abortion. Doing so would demonstrate just as much political acumen as he has evinced here.
What do mean “blockade”? Israel has a border with an entity ruled by a group whose charter calls for Israel’s literal destruction. Do you expect Israel to keep that border completely open? It is open for the transfer of food and medicines as well as, until recently, building materials. Now that it has been shown that the building materials were not used to build, houses, schools, hospitals etc. but were used to construct attack tunnels, you can expect the border to be more not less closed. Oh and by the way, why does no one ever talk of the Egyptian border? The Egyptians know how to deal with the Palestinians which is why their border is hermetically sealed. No food, no medicine, just locked and bolted.
You obviously have never lived under constant bombardment with rockets, or tunnels dug under your house so you could be kidnapped. Hama’s began this war by firing rockets and refused multiple cease fires. And broke the bothers by firing rockets. If you are fine with a terrorist group using its people to fight a war then you are as guilty as the terrorist who forces its civilians to be human sheulds without letting them flee for their life
Trouble about Israel it simply labels any criticism of any kind as anti semitism or anti israel then the killing of Kids and of their own people the so called kidnapped kids as an excuse to attack gaza. what good well researched journalism finds rarely gets published. You too are biased! so is everyone! S.
You’re commenting from a position of ignorance. You should educate yourself before inserting yourself into the conversation.
Lee, you’ve never read Buchanan’s “Whose War?” where he establishes the United States was pushed into Iraq largely by Israeli-loyalists here in the OSP who helped advance the false WMD claims?
I’m afraid you are among the uninformed ones here. Tell me, who said this, “…it matters little which individuals or parties govern in the Zionist state because the very establishment and existence of the state itself is to be condemned and to be deplored.”
Netanyahu?
You’re not thinking clearly, Summers. Why would Bibi say that?
Google the statement, and the answer will appear topmost of the search list.
Sorry seer. I was just be sarcastic. The truth of the matter is that I had no idea.
Surely, beyond your sarcasm, you find it of interest that a community of authentically religious Jews, living in Palestine since before Zionism appeared there, were and still are deeply critical and opposed to the establishment of the Zion State of Israel.
When you consider that Zionists, who are not spiritually realized or even rudimentally informed, repeat the mantra that God gave them the land and compare that position with the one of authentic Jews, you cannot continue to forward the lie that underlies the crimes Zionists commit fully expectant they will never be called to account for them.
Otherwise, you must admit that Israel was established, not so much as a peaceful refuge from the atrocities of European anti-semitism, but as a dangerously nationalistic state committed to regional hegemony at any cost to human decency, their own and that of others.
“……Surely, beyond your sarcasm, you find it of interest that a community of authentically religious Jews, living in Palestine since before Zionism appeared there, were and still are deeply critical and opposed to the establishment of the Zion State of Israel…..”
There have always been Jews opposed to Zionism, but they don’t have a monopoly on what is right or wrong – and either do you. And what the fuck is an authentic Jew? You mean anyone that does support Jewish nationalism is not authentic?
“……you cannot continue to forward the lie that underlies the crimes Zionists commit fully expectant they will never be called to account for them…..Otherwise, you must admit that Israel was established, not so much as a peaceful refuge from the atrocities of European anti-semitism, but as a dangerously nationalistic state committed to regional hegemony at any cost to human decency, their own and that of others…..”
Zionism “….. is a nationalist movement of Jews and Jewish culture that supports the creation of a Jewish homeland in the territory defined as the Land of Israel…..”. It was established in part because of centuries of antisemitism. However, there is nothing inherently racist or violent about Zionism. And as far as I can tell, Israel is committed to regional “survival”, not hegemony. Jewish nationalism is certainly no more dangerous than any other nationalism. Look at Russia and Ukraine, for example. Jews weren’t exactly welcomed into the neighborhood with open arms, you know.
The Palestinians bore the brunt of Jews returning to Jerusalem. No one can doubt that. Jewish immigrants with their eyes squarely on the prize certainly would never get away with that now just like European colonization of America, Australia, New Zealand and Canada could not take place today. In addition, there are many other examples like China (Tibet), Turkey (genocide followed by stealing half of Armenia in the 1920s) and Russia (Crimea) wouldn’t get away with annexing land that is not theirs. Well, maybe Russia?
Regardless, Israel isn’t going away so that has always been a lost cause for terrorists like Hamas and Hezbollah. And your selective demonization and delegitimization of Israel just reinforces the idea that it’s politically motivated.
Thanks seer
@Summers
>”…what the fuck is an authentic Jew? You mean anyone that does support Jewish nationalism is not authentic?”
Not at all. Just that they should be up front about their nationalism, a condition most peaceful people find to be dangerous and a precursor to war after war. And when Zion Nationalists cry antisemitism when people criticize their politics, they themselves are guilty of conflating Judaism with Nationalism. So to that I make a sharp distinction between the practice of Judaism and the practice of Zionism. They are not the same, Summers and they are so far different from each other as to be exclusive, one of the other.
The Authentic Jews of Iran have no problem living peacefully there.
They too oppose the Zionist State because it exacerbates the remaining seeds of antisemitism everywhere. Zionist Israel is a state found in terror and all manner of crime.
Authentic Judaism is a deep and honorable religious practice. Too often Cultural Jews are not religious, or they give lip service only to what Authentic Judaism prescribes, indeed what all religions and humanist philosophies do – “O mortal, what is good;? and what does the Lord require of you ?but to do justice, and to love kindness,? and to walk humbly with your God?” Micah 6:8
>”your selective demonization and delegitimization of Israel just reinforces the idea that it’s politically motivated.”
No, not in the least. My entire motivation is humanitarian. I wish to see Palestine restored to the Palestinians, and for Jews, Christians, Muslims, and atheists to live together in peace as was imagined by Einstein when he briefly supported the Zionist movement, believing it would return Jewish Semites to their place of origin to fit in with the local population. Instead they terrorized and killed the locals, stole their land and still steal it, contrary to the rules the British had promised to the Palestinians. And now they, the Zionists of Israel, wish to exterminate them, the Palestinian Semites.
Yes, Summers, I oppose the political, nationalist motives of Zionism and its State of Israel with every cell of my body. If I did not I could live with myself. The bifurcation would cut me in two.
“…….And when Zion Nationalists cry antisemitism when people criticize their politics, they themselves are guilty of conflating Judaism with Nationalism…..”
They don’t cry anti-Semitism when people criticize their policies (or they shouldn’t). They cry anti-Semitism when people conflate Zionism and racism, or accuse Israel of running US foreign policy, or say that Jews control world banking or poison our wells. That’s bigotry. However, it’s perfectly reasonable to criticize settlements in the West Bank. They are denying Palestinians their right to self determination.
“…….The Authentic Jews of Iran have no problem living peacefully there……”
Yes, peacefully so long as they make no waves. Considering that the President of Iran (Ahmadinejad) chaired the Holocaust Denial forum in Tehran, do you think it would have been wise to take a stand – or lay low so they would not be imprisoned or executed? This was state sanctioned anti-Semitism and hate directed at all Jews including the “authentic” Jews. The Jews in Iran must stay quiet to live in “peace”.
“…….They too oppose the Zionist State because it exacerbates the remaining seeds of antisemitism everywhere….”
Well, that’s anti-Semitism i.e., collective punishment of Jews (who may not even be Zionist) for the policies of Israel.
“…….Instead they terrorized and killed the locals, stole their land and still steal it, contrary to the rules the British had promised to the Palestinians…..”
You are rewriting history, seer. The Jews immigrated peacefully and bought land legally. Yes, they had the most powerful ally in the world in Britain, but who wouldn’t take advantage of that? The Arabs revolted (naturally) against the goals of Zionism, but they are the ones that fought the immigration and settlement of Palestine by Jews. Thus the Palestinians revolted and terrorized the Jews – not visa versa. In addition, the appointed Grand Mufti of Jerusalem rallied support against Zionism which led to violence against Jews like the Hebron Massacre. He aligned with Germany in WWII and supported the extermination of the Jews. Every step of the way, Arabs fought Jewish goals. I’m not saying I blame them, but it was not quite as you state it.
“……Yes, Summers, I oppose the political, nationalist motives of Zionism and its State of Israel with every cell of my body. If I did not I could live with myself. The bifurcation would cut me in two…..”
Well, interestingly enough, Jews are just like everyone else – the same aspirations, motives, disagreements and hatreds. Some Jews are atheist, religious, cultural and nationalistic. Regardless, Israel is a done deal. There is no turning back, or possibilities of a one state solution. The best available ending is that the Palestinians realize their dream of self determination.
Thanks.
> Zionist Israel is a state found in terror – should be ‘founded’
>If I did not I could live with myself – could *not* live with myself
>”You are rewriting history, seer. The Jews immigrated peacefully and bought land legally. Yes, they had the most powerful ally in the world in Britain, but who wouldn’t take advantage of that?”
You are the one rewriting history – Jews already lived in Palestine, peacefully with the other Palestinians. When the Zionists arrived that is when the problems began. They terrorized the Arab Palestinians; killed them; stole their land; bulldozed hundreds of years old olive groves; destroyed the peace in the land.
They are hateful warmongers who have no relation to Judaism except by accident of birth.
They know nothing of the sacred. They make me ashamed of my own heritage. My grandparents did not fight the Nazis for this outcome. My father did not risk his life in the French Resistance for this outcome. I have not been a defender of Jews from the raw stupidity of European and American antisemitism for this outcome. All that previous generations of European Jews fought against and fought for to achieve emancipation and assimilation into civilized culture, was not for this outcome.
Zionists are not in my bloodline. They are not Jews in any sense that honors those who suffered and died in the holocaust. They are monsters, and they deserve to see justice fall heavy on their heads in The Hague.
“……You are the one rewriting history…..When the Zionists arrived that is when the problems began. They terrorized the Arab Palestinians; killed them; stole their land; bulldozed hundreds of years old olive groves; destroyed the peace in the land….”
You are going to need to cite some evidence for that.
This boy lost all his family and both his eyes. Plastic surgeons at Shifa reconstructed his face,but he won’t see it
https://twitter.com/Belalmd12/status/496430418984312832/photo/1
Lee stop lying about the events. You should become informed prior to engaging in intelligent discussions. The facts are that immediately after Hamas and Fatah came to an agreement, the Apartheid State of Israel immediately made preparation to slaughter the Gazans. They whined and cried foul, for losing their convenient enemy to a coalition government. Nutanyahoo himself is on record, prior to invasion, that he intended to destroy Hamas. The mysterious and unfortunate demise of the three innocent Isreali youths were immediately pinned on Hamas without any proof whatsoever as a means to gain public support for the previously planned aggression. They then started bombing Gaza as a result of there false flag event. It was only then did Hamas indiscriminately showered the Apartheid State of Israel with rockets. The Apartheid State of Israel started this war. Any other form of propaganda that says otherwise is definitively a lie.
“……It’s plain to see that your coming from an anti-Israel position……”
Jesus. Ya think?
Sad to say but the first casualty in war is the truth. I venture to say maybe the truth is thrown under the bus before war. How can we know, sitting comfortably in our secure homes, exactly where the blame belongs. We can NOT trust our own press or government to tell us the truth so we must clumsily trudge on trying to make sense of it all. I’m not anti-Israel or anti-Palestine but the sheer disparity in the body count begs some serious questions. When the USA resupplies tank and mortar rounds to Israel when Israel said from the outset that their strikes were precision, it doesn’t ring true. Those are NOT precision weapons.
The combined US Iraeli intelligence apparatus does one thing – saves lives. It has thwarted countless terrorist plots to kill innocent civilians not only in Isreal, but in Europe, Africa, and Asia. Not only were lives saved, but reactionary millitary responses were avoided as well. It is the job of the NSA to create a security profile of all countries, not just Israel. Read what the secret NSA reports say about Germany or France – it ain’t a pretty picture. I reject characterizing Israel as the aggressor. It has faced endless violence from Arabs cloaked as pan arabism, jihadism, and terrorism, yet it alone in the middle east acts with regard to human rights. While Sryia, Iraq, and Egypt burn, Israel thrives. While the arab world rots in a pit of medevilsm and economic decay, Israel and her friends rise. Even Gaza has grown from 300,000 to over 1.8 million since 1967 a six fold increase. Under Egypt it’s population was stagnent. I have hope that the next time Gazans get to vote, if they will ever get to vote, they will choose something other than a corrupt Mafia like Hamas run by fat cats sitting in fancy hotels in Qatar who make billions off of the suffering of their brethren at home.
Stephen Mendelson, please correct yourself.
The combined US Iraeli intelligence apparatus saves lives it think are important. The rest it brutally obliterates.
When Europeans come to Palestine and forcibly displace 800,000 people from their homes, a reasonably intelligent and prudent person would call those Europeans ‘the aggressor.’ I understand that, once you have achieved your goals, you would want violence by both sides to stop, but that’s not how war works.
The Palestine Papers(I invite you to do an internet search for them) reveals that Abbas and the Palestinian authority are nothing but toads to Israeli/Western interests.
It’s easy to display ‘democratic’ displays when one is the biggest welfare democracy in the world.
Your BS is so incredibly distorted at this point, it is not credible. Three teenagers were kidnapped and killed. That is a criminal act, and Israel’s only casualty on it’s own land. Thousands of Palestinians continue to be killed, mostly women and children. Six U.N. schools have been hit-are every one of them an “accident?” Bullshit. I know I don’t have to live under constant threat, but there are other ways to handle this. Because these people democratically elected Hamas, their people are being terrorized? Defending this behavior undermines the legitimacy of both the Israeli and U.S. governments. They are human beings, not animals. This genocide will most definitely turn the tide of public opinion.
In fact all backwards movements in Arabic world are supported silently by Mossad and CIA… Dont try to fools us, that you supports Takfiris in Syria, Iraq , that you standing under so called ‘Arab Spring’, anti Kadafi coup etc….
@Stephen Mendelson:
“The combined US Iraeli intelligence apparatus does one thing – saves lives. It has thwarted countless terrorist plots to kill innocent civilians not only in Isreal, but in Europe, Africa, and Asia.”
Oh really??? Where is your statistical data? Maybe you are discussing the “terrorists” noted in the targeted “No Recognized Terrorist Group Affiliation” delineated in the following article – “Barack Obama’s Secret Terrorist-Tracking System, by the Numbers”:
https://firstlook.org/theintercept/article/2014/08/05/watch-commander/
From my perspective, the ” US Israeli Intelligence Apparatus” are the terrorists.
Where is your evidence that the combined US Israeli intelligence apparatus doesn’t save lives…since you’re all about statistical data.
Reject the aggressor label all you want, but in this case that’s exactly what they are. Invasion planned the moment Fatah and Hamas formed coalition government. Nutanyahoo found his reason after the mysterious death of their youths. The Apartheid State of Israel through its false flag incident began bombing. This is what caused the retaliation by Hamas. Those are the facts of this case, any other propaganda is a lie .
Let’s qualify that headline:
U.S. Voters are a Key Party to Every Israeli Attack.
If you live and vote within Stasiland’s borders, you, along with every Tom, Dick, and Jane you see on the street — those self-proclaimed innocent bystanders — are non-uniformed combatants.
Our species knows this, despite the 5% of it who keep their heads securely planted up their you know what. But how long will that impunity last? Hint: not forever, like everything else.
The tide is definitely turning.
“Red Cross denounces Israel for Gaza destruction”
http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2014/08/05/374158/icrc-blasts-israel-for-gaza-destruction/
“The International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC) has strongly denounced the Israeli forces for leaving a massive trail of destruction in civilian sites across the besieged Gaza Strip.”
One other item of note:
“History to judge UN ugly silence on Israel brutalities: Iran doctors”
http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2014/08/05/374153/history-to-judge-un-silence-on-gaza/
“The silence of international organizations and their ineffective responses in the face of this cruelty towards children, women and the defenseless civilians of Gaza will be remembered in history and judged by generations to come.”
http://english.alarabiya.net/en/News/world/2014/08/05/Britain-s-Baroness-Warsi-quits-over-Gaza-policy-.html
thousands of channels on US tv, but only on Democracy Now, do you hear someone mention this important point:
Norman Finklestein – “Israel claims there were 12 tunnels that had passed through its border. There were many more tunnels between Gaza and Egypt. The first thing Sisi did when he came into power in Egypt was seal the tunnels. Did he have to destroy all of Gaza to seal the tunnels? Israel couldn’t have done the same thing—seal the tunnels on its side of the border, exactly what Sisi did in Egypt? What did the Hamas have? It had spoons. It had shovels. You’re telling me that Israel didn’t have the earth-moving equipment to build a wall that went deeper than the tunnels? ”
http://www.democracynow.org/2014/8/5/ceasefire_after_gaza_assault_leaves_1800?autostart=true
second good point:
Finklestein -“I mean, there are so many weirdnesses about this conflict. Israel blows everything up. Nobody even talks about Israel paying reparations. It’s just taken as a matter of fact that the international community rebuilds after Israel destroys. It’s just a schnorrer state, “schnorrer” being the Yiddish for a sponger. We destroy, they pay. Nobody even discusses the possibility maybe Israel should pay reparations for its death and destruction in Gaza. “
Sure NSA and GCHQ love us, Snowden should be imprisoned without trial and kept naked like Bradley Manning. This is real democracy.
Snowden is a liar and a propagandist, in fact he didn’t steal anything, and NSA statements about the hunt for him, capturing journalists – it’s all a joke.
There is no such organization as NSA, and do not be paranoid, buy a new phone with fingerprint scanner.
223 years of the democratic-republican party democtatorship.
Sure NSA and GCHQ love us, Snowden should be imprisoned without trial and kept naked like Bradley Manning. This is real democracy.
Snowden is a liar and a propagandist, in fact he didn’t steal anything, and NSA statements about the hunt for him, capturing journalists – it’s all a joke.
There is no such organization as NSA, and do not be paranoid, buy a new phone with fingerprint scanner.
America carpet bombed Europe in WW2 and killed 40 million civilians.
No one here will ever pay reperations for that either.
American “democracy” is held in place by terrorist strikes against civilians abroad.
The Allies* carpet bombed, not just America
And they did pay actually, Marshall plan
Yes, Germany and other fascist nations were SO innocent last century…
Kunstler is normally quite sane, but Finklestein he’s not
http://kunstler.com/clusterfuck-nation/all-hell/
Reparations? The United States will pay.
http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2014/07/israel-gaza-united-states-assistance-unrwa
Seems fair, because the US also paid for the ammunition. In God We Trust, but the devil is to pay.
Make the ones who profit from the manufacture and sales of arms pay for the death and destruction they’ve havocked upon the world. The taxpayers of the US are already in debt to the tune of 104% of GDP.
That’s a dangerous idea. Imagine if paying reparations for the damage you cause became a well-accepted principle. How do you even being to put a dollar figure on the complete collapse of Iraq, for example?
@JLocke Finkelstein makes a really relevant point. I haven’t seen any kind of intelligent, rigorous analysis of what kind of credible threat the tunnels actually posed towards Israel, in the MSM. Or any kind of analysis regarding the methods the IDF employed to destroy them. I have read copiously, but I haven’t seen anything like that.
Dennis Kucinich – “With Gaza’s land mass shrinking due to Israeli military action, it’s about time someone asked: What is the end game? Three weeks ago, Moshe Feiglin, deputy speaker of the Knesset, called for Gaza to “become part of sovereign Israel and will be populated by Jews. This will also serve to ease the housing crisis in Israel.””
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/aug/05/gaza-buffer-zone-dennis-kucinich
Yes Dennis Kucinich, he ran for president of the US, and for many people on the left, he represented real change, not the phony slogan of Obama. But now I guess we have to take it as a glimmer of hope that at least a left leaning paper, in the UK is willing to air his question “what is the end game”
>”What is the end game?” *Dennis ‘re-districteded’ Kucinich
Well, if I had to judge by the ‘Support Israel’ signs in many of his (ex) constituents yards, right at the foot of the Cross, the end game is ‘the end times’!
Yeah, it’s a wonder he was able to represent that district as long as he did. Once the gerrymanderers lumped him with Kaptur the writing was on the wall. Those fuckers couldn’t draw a fair district if their lives depended on it.
I have respected and followed Mr Kucinich for some time now. He has been relatively quiet since he retired from Congress as the Ohio Representative in Jan 2013. He did promise at that time, that he would continue his efforts outside of Congress. It is good to see him coming out strong and hard on this issue.
All part of the Land-thieves attempt to steal the oil and gas off the coast of Gaza.
“The rats are underneath the piles. The jew is underneath the lot.”
(T. S. Eliot)
Can you all please all stop with your fucking Anti-Semitic sayings? T S Eliot was STUPID for saying this! This isn’t about Jews or Arabs but it has always been about racist aggressors who try to dehumanize people using their apartheid regimes! What will make you understand??
J
To the purveyor of Juden Hass, hp – lest you forget: Jesus was a Jew!
Eff off, goosestepper.
Question: Netanyahu cried out,and O. B. parroted. “Its Our Land”, “its our territory”. That the rockets are falling on. Is this not at such late date, still a deliberate false statement?
The Israel Nit, Netanyahu as prim minister, and head of there 90% terrorist military State, stated over and over: “Its Our Land”, “its our Territory”. That the rockets are falling on. Then used this false “land Right’s” statement, to win, the collective, distressed world charge. To be tried for WAR CRIMES. With his Officers, for killing: babes, children, women and men. In the Sio killing cage, Gaza games of 2014.
And now for trials following the passed booked, German SS. trials, after world War II. And for there winning of there justly deserved punishment.
Also the pressing work of the democratic world body is needed to lobby and work through Law. For the Borders of Palestine and modern day Israel of 1948, be clearly mapped out as international recognized land boundaries. So the above past repeated mistake will not happen again, and again, and again. With Statement’s. Its’ our land and territory, Shalom.
At last, a British politician showing courage in the face of UK’s abject submission to Zionist evil.
Lady Warsi resigns over UK’s ‘morally reprehensible’ stance on Gaza
[snip]
[snip]
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/aug/05/lady-warsi-resigns-government-gaza-stance
-“Britain’s first Muslim cabinet minister resigns over Gaza policy
…Chancellor George Osborne immediately hit back, saying her decision was “unnecessary” and insisting that ministers were committed to working to secure peace in the region. ”
http://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/uk/britain-s-first-muslim-cabinet-minister-resigns-over-gaza-policy-1.1887921
That is hilarious, the phrase “working to secure peace”, in the context of arming Israel and abstaining from efforts at the UN.
Well, I guess if all the Palestinians are dead, “peace” might be secured.
Another development towards the good. From your link JLocke.
@ seer:
This is excellent. It does appear, overall, in view of other recent developments, that the tide is turning from the approval and justification of Israel’s actions to one of international condemnation. Ultimately, I want to see Israel on trial for war crimes.
“The Tory peer said that, having now stood down, she wanted to “speak more freely” on the issue and her first demand after handing in her resignation letter was for the UK to introduce an arms embargo against Israel.”
“Legal or not, the NSA’s extensive, multi-level cooperation with Israeli military and intelligence agencies is part of a broader American policy that actively supports and enables Israeli aggression and militarism. Every Israeli action in Gaza has U.S. fingerprints all over it. Many Americans may wish that the Israeli attack on Gaza were a matter of no special relevance or concern to them, but it is their own government that centrally enables this violence.”
That right there is the whole ballgame. The US is allowing Israel to repeat exactly what it did to the Native Americans hundreds of years ago and continues to do so today.
At the beginning of war activities nobody thinks about the future. And in the future everybody knows about the past. So it is endless. P.S.
One very positive development toward justice.
“Palestinian FM to sue Israel at ICC over war crimes in Gaza”
http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2014/08/05/374126/palestine-sues-israel-for-war-crimes/
“Palestinian Foreign Minister Riad al-Malki is pushing for a war crimes case at the International Criminal Court (ICC) against Israel due to the Zionist regime’s brutal aggression of the besieged Gaza Strip.
“Everything that has happened in the last 28 days is clear evidence of war crimes committed by Israel, amounting to crimes against humanity,” al- Malki told reporters after meeting prosecutors at the ICC on Tuesday.
“There is no difficulty for us to show or build the case. Evidence is there … Israel is in clear violation of international law,” he added. “
“Al-Malki has also asked the UN to end what he called Israel’s impunity, saying Tel Aviv must be held accountable for its crimes in Gaza.”
Is it possible for them to end-run the US veto of UN resolutions? I wonder why it is they didn’t do this after Cast Lead where several documented war crimes were id’d by the UN. Just for show, maybe.
That is certainly a possibility, but it would be subverting the purpose of the ICC.
Substituting ‘purpose of’ for the highlighted text ‘problem with’ is more accurate imho, but the author is essentially correct.
” To begin with, is the question of access, which is limited to states. Back in 2009, the PA tried to adhere to the Rome Statute, which is the treaty governing the ICC, and was rebuffed by the prosecutor who turned the issue over to the Security Council, claiming a lack of authority to determine whether the PA represented a ‘state.’ ”
Maybe there should be an ICC (International Civil Court) for non-members who can file a class action against Israel. I think monetary penalties would be much easier. A huge judgement would have greater impact than any show trial of individuals. Also easier from the standpoint of the plaintiff who would have a lower bar than a criminal trial.
Doesn’t matter what you call it:
*if I were one of the 186 countries in the whole wide world not a permanent member of the Security Council, I would say something.
From the provided link, as Mr. Falk points out:
“Perhaps, the climate of opinion has evolved to the point where there would be an impulse to investigate the charges against Israel even if procedural obstacles preventing the case from being carried to completion. Any serious attempt to investigate the criminal accountability of Israeli political and military leaders would add legitimacy to the Palestinian struggle, and might have a positive spillover effect on the global solidarity movement and the intensifying BDS campaign.”
That would be a political tangent, and for legal types it’s sacrilegious to circumvent procedure. All their ducks must be lined up before any shot is fired.
There is serious pressure on the UN from the Non-Aligned Movement (NAM). Here is the lead article on the meeting that was held yesterday in Tehran.
http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2014/08/04/374039/nam-palestine-meeting-tehran-gaza/
BTW Egypt is a NAM member and they have agreed to work with Iran in opening the Rafah crossing for delivery of humanitarian aid and evacuation of the wounded. LInk to follow.
“Iran, Egypt agree to cooperate on Gaza situation”
http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2014/08/05/374107/iran-egypt-to-cooperate-on-gaza-crisis/
Egypt really needs to reconcile with Palestinians, and they seem to recognize that.
Lyra, I don’t hold much hope that Palestinians will find much support from Egypt. The world is going have to come together and insist Israel is prosecuted for war crimes. But Egypt is complicit too.
A must read from Joseph Massad –
http://electronicintifada.net/content/egypts-propagandists-and-gaza-massacre/13662
Lyra1 –
Thanks for that link. It’s a small glimmer of hope for those suffering people of Gaza. Help and relief can’t come to them soon enough so I hope this will really help their situation.
Obama and Netanyahu are birds of a feather — they’re both remorseless baby killers!
”Obama talks about Gaza as if it were a natural disaster, an uncontrollable biological event.”
Interestingly, that is how quite a few Germans, including recently the President Joachim Gauck, speak about their unpleasant history. I have heard the Nazi era refered to as “a black cloud that passed over us”…..
There’s an app for that.
http://www.engadget.com/2014/08/04/google-pulls-gaza-themed-app/?ncid=rrs_truncated
How about an app for coming up with solutions to the conflict. The geo-politicians don’t seem to be doing such a great job.
Worth a read.
the funny thing is that Israel is not even grateful. It disparages american officials, its spies on them, it steals USA military secrets. And Americans bleat and keep giving. Amazing.
I dunno, this whole article, once you get past the hysterical tone, is one big HO-HUM.
Ok, so America supports Israeli intel. Ok, so Israel gets a leg up on its enemies.
Understood that now Israel’s military capabilities are enhanced.
Big Fat, So What?
Israel doesn’t “attack other countries”. It responds to attack by other countries.
Greenwald’s unfortunate misapplication of Snowden’s very real contribution against the NSA’s improper spying ON ITS OWN CITIZENS, as somehow conflated with what the NSA SHOULD be doing with the intel, engaging in overseas activity, assisting our allies.
It is hard for me to pillory Israel for it military actions.
Perhaps they are going over the top in response at times, but that is a whole other less significant issue.
“Perhaps they are going over the top in response at times” They are psychopathic monsters.
“Perhaps they are going over the top in response at times, but that is a whole other less significant issue.”
I’m sure the issue is quite significant to the thousands of dead, maimed and mourning.
I’m glad YOU have no problem having the blood of innocents on your hands without an overriding national interest, but understand that some of us do. Ideally, you could go over there on your own dime and satisfy your blood lust and leave the rest of us out of it, but that’s not realistic under the present regime. So, please excuse the ‘hysterical’ tone of complaints while you get what you want
“Perhaps they are going over the top in response at times, but…”
BUT! That’s all you cons can ever say.
Perhaps they are going over the top in response at times, but that is a whole other less significant issue.
Did you have to study very long to get that advanced degree in understatement?
Shocking Photos Of Destruction In Gaza As Thousands Return Home During Truce
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/07/26/gaza-destruction-photos_n_5623908.html
And that was posted on Juy 26th, more than a week’s worth of “over the top” ago.
I would post a link to pics of the dead, but I can’t stomach the inhumanity.
Do Palestinians kill Israelis in a more humane manner?
Yes, to threaten genocide of the Palestinians whose land the Zionists stole and continue to steal, certainly is going over the top. But nothing at all to be concerned about. What an honorable, I dunno, inhuman idiot you are!
http://electronicintifada.net/content/israels-incremental-genocide-gaza-ghetto/13562
***
FREE AMERICA
DIRECT DEMOCRACY
” Every Israeli action in Gaza has U.S. fingerprints all over it. Many Americans may wish that the Israeli attack on Gaza were a matter of no special relevance or concern to them, but it is their own government that centrally enables this violence.”
This says it all. If the USG were really so shocked and appalled at Israel for bombing that school, it would not have approved resupplying them with weapons and ammunitions without hesitation. And here we have a Congress who can’t seem to do anything positive or constructive for American citizens, and who drag their feet to help Americans who’ve been wiped out in horrible and man-made disasters , but who take 30 minutes to dispense millions in military aid to Israel upon request. I’m insulted.
Speak up John Poppycook!
The readers’ editor on… averting accusations of antisemitism
Guardian reporters, writers and editors must be more vigilant about the language they use when writing about Jews or Israel
Chris Elliott
The Guardian, Sunday 6 November 2011 19.00 GMT
The Guardian has always had a strong commitment to reporting on the Middle East. That means a lot of news reporting, as well as comment and analysis, on the Israel-Palestine situation. It is one of the world’s most contested conflicts, in which thousands of people have died or have been displaced. As a newspaper the Guardian has been critical of all sides, but it is seen as being especially critical of the Israeli government and its actions. And that has led to complaints that the Guardian, in print or online, is carrying material that either lapses into language resonant of antisemitism or is, by its nature, antisemitic.
It also leads to the much more rare allegation of Islamophobia. In this column I intend to address the former rather than the latter, because recently there has been a preponderance of such complaints.
This is not a fresh concern. It is a particularly sensitive issue for a core of the Guardian’s Jewish readers because CP Scott held strong Zionist sympathies, as did WP Crozier, who came after him as editor. In the Guardian’s archives is a letter of thanks from the first president of Israel, Chaim Weizmann, thanking Scott for his help in securing the Balfour declaration, the 1917 statement by the British government approving the creation of a Jewish national home in Palestine.
A shift in attitudes came after the 1967 Arab-Israeli war, as Daphna Baram outlines in her book Disenchantment: The Guardian and Israel, published in 2004. So, it’s not new. But there has been an increase in complaints of antisemitism within the last few months.
As the web has widened the debate, so it has also enabled more opportunities for articles and comments to be questioned. Individuals and organisations monitoring the Guardian’s coverage examine the language in articles – and the comments posted underneath them online – as closely as the facts.
For antisemitism can be subtle as well as obvious. Three times in the last nine months I have upheld complaints against language within articles that I agreed could be read as antisemitic. The words were replaced and the articles footnoted to reflect the fact. These included references to Israel/US “global domination” and the term “slavish” to describe the US relationship with Israel; and, in an article on a lost tribe of Mallorcan Jews, what I regarded as a gratuitous reference to “the island’s wealthier families”.
Two weeks ago a columnist used the term “the chosen” in an item on the release of Gilad Shalit, which brought more than 40 complaints to the Guardian, and an apology from the columnist the following week. “Chosenness”, in Jewish theology, tends to refer to the sense in which Jews are “burdened” by religious responsibilities; it has never meant that the Jews are better than anyone else. Historically it has been antisemites, not Jews, who have read “chosen” as code for Jewish supremacism.
One reader wrote of the column: “The despicable antisemitic tone of this rant is beyond reason or decency.”
An important feature of the Guardian online is that the comment threads are post-moderated: a team of moderators check almost half a million comments a month posted on the site for language that breaches the community guidelines across a whole range of issues – not just antisemitism. They are experienced in spotting the kind of language long associated with antisemitic tropes such as Jews having too much power and control, or being clannish and secretive, or the role of Jews in finance and the media.
Newspapers have to be aware that some examples involve coded references. They need to ask themselves, for example, if the word Zionist is being used as a synonym for Jew.
I have been careful to say that these examples may be read as antisemitic because I don’t believe their appearance in the Guardian was the result of deliberate acts of antisemitism: they were inadvertent. But that does not lessen the injury to some readers or to our reputation. The Guardian should not be oppressed by criticism – some of the language used by our critics is abusive and intimidatory – or retreat into self-censorship. But reporters, writers and editors must be more vigilant to ensure our voice in the debate is not diminished because our reputation has been tarnished.
$$$$$$Anti-Semantics$$$$$$
That’s some pukeacious groveling Eliott has going there. I am so, so glad Glenn no longer posts there, and that I (we) are free from the absurd moderation standards at CiF.
Language is important is all. If anti Israeli sentiments are made weather purposefully or not. We must all as opposed to screaming or hurling language try to watch what we say here. Although coming from me that won’t go down to well.
This was your second post to me.
Your first said (from memory) we are on the same side worzel.
To which I didn’t reply.
So I will now.
We always were and always will be. Keep up the good work
££££££Rowan££££££
Oh and weather ‘grovelling’ Elliot is cock or not he writes for an established broad sheet. Not all commenters are as well read as you.
‘Grovelling’ as word for example I think was too strong.
IMHO.
*a cock
P.s
I have Nothing against Mr Cook. Would just be interested what his take is on this ‘story’.
Thanks.
-Rowan-
“…….That’s some pukeacious groveling Eliott has going there. I am so, so glad Glenn no longer posts there, and that I (we) are free from the absurd moderation standards at CiF…..”
You standards go a little overboard on occasion, Mona.
“…….I have learned that the Jewish voting bloc’s control of U.S. policy on Israel dates back to the 1948 establishment of the Jewish State (on violent terms unfair to indigenous Arabs)……..”
I love the “control” part Mona. But don’t worry, you’ll never get any objection from Mic or DocHollywood on that.
In which case you “love” a fact. As my material from the Jewish Virtual Library on the Jewish-American voting bloc demonstrates.
Yes, Craig. You are strongly averse to myriad facts. So you’d like the CiF mod bunker who wouldn’t permit links to, or quotes from, Max Blumenthal articles. The truth about Zionist Israel is deeply unpleasant for you, and not abided by the CiF nannies.
“…….You are strongly averse to myriad facts. So you’d like the CiF mod bunker who wouldn’t permit links to, or quotes from, Max Blumenthal articles. The truth about Zionist Israel is deeply unpleasant for you, and not abided by the CiF nannies……”
You are stating that Jews “controlled” the US in 1948. The US was the strongest country in the world coming off of a brutal world war in which the US defeated Japan and helped defeat Germany. Jews were murdered by the millions in WWII.
It’s clear that world sympathy led by the west helped support the creation of Israel. No one can doubt that. The new Israeli state was not strong, however and certainly did NOT control the US government. In fact, the US government showed little interest in Israel until the 1967 Six days war – and for geopolitical reasons not because of some strong Jewish lobby. AIPAC is a strong lobby, but the US government doesn’t move in lock-step with AIPAC (think Iran, for example) . I have never been able to understand your obsession with AIPAC running US foreign policy or wealthy Jewish donors running the Republican Party. It makes no sense to me. None.
Here is a link to Chomsky who comments on the the book by M&W. I am an admirer of Chomsky although I certainly don’t agree with everything (or most things) he says. He has this one right though.
http://libcom.org/library/israel-lobby-noam-chomsky
Thanks.
Why must it be repeated ad nauseam that the Balfour Declaration was the “British government approving the creation of a Jewish national home in Palestine”. The Balfour Declaration was disputed by many within the government who not only felt that Britain must not renege on its promises of independence to the Arabs but presciently saw what has come about. Unfortunately, Balfour prevailed. However, the Declaration actually reads: “His Majesty’s government view with favour the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, and will use their best endeavours to facilitate the achievement of this object, IT BEING CLEARLY UNDERSTOOD THAT NOTHING SHALL BE DONE WHICH MAY PREJUDICE THE CIVIL AND RELIGIOUS RIGHTS of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country.” Now, how anyone could refer to the 93% of the population in Palestine at the time as the non-Jewish communities is beyond me, but it is clear that Zionists were at work in the wording of the Declaration and that this pattern never ended. And if you hold up the Balfour Declaration as a legal document, then you must also hold up the rest of the document, which was scandalously ignored by the Zionists. Another pattern repeated non-stop for nearly a century.
As for “our voice in the debate”. I think it is time that other voices in the debate are heard, because critical voices have been silent and silence for far too long. In Britain there is, for example, a storm of (organized) outrage whenever Israel is criticized – the BBC has been a willing victim of that. In Germany, when the courageous head of the Jewish Museum invited critical voices for lectures or debates, she received what she herself has described as ‘a pogrom’ of hate mail and outrage. In Germany Philo-Semitism is rampant, although one would imagine the opposite as criticism of Israeli policies and the Occupation is constantly cast as “a wave of antisemitism sweeping the country!”
Just out of interest, how do you view the comments in any pro-Israeli /neo-Zionist newspaper or website and the hate spewed at critics or Arabs or Jews who mildly criticize Israel.?
It would be more productive if people like you spent less time picking at sentences that might possibly indicate that the writer is possibly antisemitic and address the problems of blatant racism amongst Jews towards Arabs – and quite frankly, racism against anyone by anyone.
The line “They need to ask themselves, for example, if the word Zionist is being used as a synonym for Jew.” Ok. We can ask that question and be sure that we know who is a nationalist, racist, extremist, lobbying Zionist – I personally leave quite a bit of room for Zionists who never intended the Arabs to be expelled from Palestine and who were elbowed aside by more aggressive and racist forms of Zionism. Again, it seems to me that more Jews should be spending their time worrying about Zionism and its questionable history and not ONLY those who confuse Zionism with Judaism or Jews per se. This seems to me to be the best way in which antisemitism will be named when it is real and rabid.
Antisemitism is racism and should be viewed as such. I hope the day will come, where it is no longer separated from racism and people are sensitized to racism and supremacism anywhere.
Greenwald had a special arrangement in the Guardian comment section, but I soon learned that commenting anywhere else on the site was a waste of time. All someone had to do was complain to the moderator, and posts would be erased. Even under a Greenwald article In one famous incident, an entire comment section of 3000 posts was removed. The Guardian moderators are so sensitive to the threats of the British legal environment and of being accused of anti-semitism that they value banality over diversity of opinions.
-“Zionist is being used as a synonym for Jew”
That is hilarious, moderators filtering out the word “zionist” as they skim the thousands of posts and deleting ones where they think the writer could have used the word Jew.
why wait till “zionism” pops up, moderators, just imagine that whatever the commentor wrote means something else that some loud lobby group, or the government doesn’t like, and erase it anyway.
That from my experience was the Guardian comment policy.
I understand that there has to be a line on obscenity, spamming, robots, sabotage etc, But I prefer that if you disagree with someone, you argue with them. otherwise, the comment section is not really a comment section if all you are seeing are the comments the site wants you to see.
Moderators pollute almost any comment section there is, with their capricious decisions. Salon.com recently has been infected with this disease. Huffpo is a joke. The Canadian Broadcasting Corporation website’s moderators are ridiculously overzealous and incompetent with it, but I don’t have to join Facebook, like I would have to on Huffenpuff.
The Sun newspapers in Canada have banned me through Disqus, whilst I can still comment through Disqus on other sites.
“our reputation has been tarnished.” Hilarious. Fucking monsters.
History repeats itself and sometimes like musical chairs
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2715466/Israeli-official-calls-concentration-camps-Gaza-conquest-entire-Gaza-Strip-annihilation-fighting-forces-supporters.html#ixzz39UIq2YQe
I hope this article will become prima facie evidence in an official war crimes tribunal. Onward…to the Hague. NOW.
How about a war crimes trial for the “defense department” and during ww2 ?
America carpet bombed Europe and killed 40 million civilians there.
America is a country kept in place by terrorizing and murder all over the planet.
1 Trillion dollars a year go to the terrorist US military warfare queens.
Yes, and the fascists in Europe were SUCH a sympathetic bunch. Maybe Germany would consider war reps for their bombing of British cities, eh, CARL???
Unfortunately, I accidently posted below – somewhere!
In the last four articles published at the Guardian concerning Israel, only one has mentioned Hamas, the internationally recognized terrorist organization with a racist, antisemitic charter that calls for the destruction of Israel (two times but unrelated to their charter) . It’s the height of poor and cowardly journalism to neglect the role of Hamas in this war. Hamas has stated on numerous occasions, they will never recognize the Jewish state. No one can deny this simple truth and it’s the Achilles heel of supporters of the Palestinians. There simply is no answer to the terrorist organization that seeks a temporary truce, but never peace.
The murderers who kidnapped the Israeli teens are identified members of Hamas. They sometimes have been referred to as rebels i.e., rogue murderers who work outside of Hamas leadership – allowing a convenient denial by the terrorist organization that never condemned the kidnapping or murder of the teens. In fact, the kidnapping was praised by Hamas leadership. Hamas was certainly in a desperate situation in Gaza isolated without support from the usual allies so a war could serve a purpose for Hamas.
Hamas diverted a significant amount of precious financial resources to construct an elaborate tunnel complex designed to penetrate the borders of Israel and kidnap or kill IDF soldiers. The money could have been spent to better the lives of civilians that mistakenly elected the terrorist organization to power. If perpetual war is what the Islamic terrorist want, then why not at least construct some bomb shelters so civilians who just have an interest in raising a family and working might not become fodder for Hamas’s political game to end the embargo. The answer is self explanatory.
It’s the height of irresponsible “journalism” to ignore the role of Hamas in the current war – or even the broken cease fire. Even if Hamas had killed the soldiers a little before the cease fire officially began, they irresponsibly risked the brokered cease fire which was agreed to by all parties for humanitarian reasons. Shortly after the IDF was attacked, the truce faltered leading to more Palestinian deaths (always the Palestinians pay). It’s clear that the primary motive for Hamas is using Palestinian children as collateral for securing the end to the blockade. By ignoring the irresponsible actions of Hamas, the Intercept – the fringe left – willingly advances this narrative in service to Hamas.
No. It isn’t evidence of sloppy journalism; it’s a promising sign that the world is done with the bullshit and diversionary tactics that Israel has used for decades to deflect attention from its crimes.
I didn’t say sloppy journalism. It’s “adversarial” journalism which is too say that omitting any mention of Hamas is not inadvertent. In other words, this kind of “journalism” advances a political point of view.
No shit, Craig. That is what makes it worthwhile.
“…….That is what makes it worthwhile……”
It certainly can be worthwhile, but a Fox News approach also has its disadvantages. Of course, even Fox Neds has more credibility than the Intercept – at least right now.
“even Fox Neds [News?] has more credibility than the Intercept “
CraigSummers – that a seemingly well read poster as yourself would even suggest comparability in credibility between Fox and the Intercept regarding what they report is evidence of the severe disconnect between reality and fantasy in the world today.
Talk about false equivalencies.
““There are two ways to be fooled. One is to believe what isn’t true; the other is to refuse to believe what is true.”
Søren Kierkegaard
“……CraigSummers – that a seemingly well read poster as yourself would even suggest comparability in credibility between Fox and the Intercept regarding what they report is evidence of the severe disconnect between reality and fantasy in the world today……”
Good to see you back
I’ve read enough Greenwald to understand that he politicizes what’s happening in the world more than Fox News, MSNBC and al Jazeera. Fox News (etc.) at least provides a counterpoint. Greenwald’s journalism style is more like a debate. He essentially takes a position like he would if he was arguing before the Supreme Court.
Maybe the Intercept will change and we will be able to read both sides of an issue at some point in the future. Certainly, my criticism would be toned down, but I’m not holding my breath.
Thanks.
@CraigSummers – again – sorry – regarding your earlier post:
I didn’t know the kidnappers/killers of the three Israeli teens had ever been caught or identified. I had not read that. Can you cite your source? I also did not know that Hamas leadership had endorsed the kidnappings/killings – what I read was that they publicly disavowed any knowledge of them. Again, Can you cite your source, please. Thanks
Aw, whatsamadder Craig? The entire West’s corporate news not enough foryah? You want EVERBODY in lockstep?
I’ll look Dabney, but I won’t be able to get to it awhile.
Thanks.
Pete
For once, I enjoyed your response
Thanks.
Dabney
According to Wikipedia:
“……. Hamas political chief Khaled Meshal said he can neither confirm nor deny the kidnapping of the three Israelis, but congratulated the abductors…….BBC reporter Jon Donnison says police spokesman Micky Rosenfeld told him the abductors were a lone cell operating affiliated with Hamas but not operating under its leadership.[89] Al-Monitor has reported that the kidnappers were once Hamas-related branch that had gone rogue.[90]…….”
According to JTA, the leader of the terrorist cell which kidnapped the teens was caught in Jordan, but the other two remain free. I thought they were all caught.
“……..A West Bank man said to be the leader of the terrorist cell that kidnapped and killed three Israeli teenagers in June was arrested…..Hussam Kawasme of Hebron was apprehended while attempting to flee to Jordan under a false identity with the help of his family, Ynet reported. Kawasme reportedly admitted to serving as the leader of the cell that perpetrated the murders of Gilad Shaar, Naftali Fraenkel and Eyal Yifrach. Kawasme said that funding for the attack, which he used to buy weapons, came from Hamas in Gaza. In his interrogation, Kawasme said he helped bury the bodies on a plot of land he had purchased two months prior to the murders. He then helped the two men who drove the car and shot the teens hide……Security forces are still searching for the two men — Kawasme’s brother, Marwan, and Omar Abu Aysha. Marwan Kawasme, who is active in Hamas, was freed in the Gilad Shalit prisoner exchange and deported to Gaza, The Times of Israel reported……”
Thanks
” Fox News (etc.) at least provides a counterpoint.”
Again, a false equivalency, in that Greenwald’s reporting is from a single individual, while Fox News, et .al are from many.
And as I understand journalism, it’s not about the, again, false equivalence of offering a “counter-point” on issues of fact – that’s not “fair and balanced,” that’s journalistic equivocation.
Finally, my critique of your comment wasn’t about whether any source of information “politicizes” what is provided – because that is almost always in the eye of the beholder.
What I was specifically addressing what the idea that you find what Fox News publishes to be more credible (i.e., factual) than what The Intercept and Glenn Greenwald publishes in the first place – and now with your additional comment that it is due to the lack of offering a counterpoint to facts and evidence which makes your stance, in my view, even more implausible.
In the end I would hope that The Intercept does not change from this fact based, adversarial, “this is what happened” reporting stance that you so strongly disapprove of – because in doing that they would become nothing more than another fish in the sea of government/corporate shills that water-down the news at the expense of presenting reality, or at least the best information possible at the time, to its audience.
““We live in a world where unfortunately the distinction between true and false appears to become increasingly blurred by manipulation of facts, by exploitation of uncritical minds, and by the pollution of the language.”
~ Arne Tiselius
“……In the end I would hope that The Intercept does not change from this fact based, adversarial, “this is what happened” reporting stance that you so strongly disapprove of – because in doing that they would become nothing more than another fish in the sea of government/corporate shills that water-down the news at the expense of presenting reality, or at least the best information possible at the time, to its audience…..”
Come on sillyputty. Speak about running for office and voting for yourself. That’s ridiculous. And I never said I disapprove of this kind of reporting, OK?
Suggesting that everyone else (Fox or al Jazeera etc.) who reports a story is just an opinion while Greenwald is “facts based” is arrogant and wrong-headed. Greenwald reports half truths as much as any other “journalist”. He reports what he wants the reader to hear – just like any other news outlet. That IS adversarial journalism – pressing a point of view. Omitting the other side of the story is exactly what Greenwald advocates (by example).
For example, when the NSA story first came out and Greenwald implied that collecting bulk metadata was a violation of the Fourth Amendment, he neglected to report that two federal judges ruled collecting metadata was legal. Greenwald – of all things – is well read so this was no oversight just like omitting Hamas from his stories on the IP conflict was not an oversight – but calculated.
So what you really mean to say sillyputty is that you agree with Greenwald politically – which makes Greenwald “fact based” in your opinion. Greenwald may report some facts as do all journalist, but he has a long record of reporting half-truths – and promoting a political point of view. I am not opposed to that idea, but you should be as skeptical about what Greenwald reports as any other journalist with a political agenda – like Fox, al Jazeera and the Jerusalem Post.
“……Again, a false equivalency, in that Greenwald’s reporting is from a single individual, while Fox News, et .al are from many…..”
Yes, and some of “many” at Fox News is providing a counter point – even if it’s just for show in many instances. Don’t advertise yourself as a news site if you aren’t one. Call yourself a blog.
Thanks.
“So what you really mean to say sillyputty is that you agree with Greenwald politically”
No, I am apolitical in this case, in that facts and the best evidence available determine my worldview. What Greenwald’s, or any other reporters political views are mean nothing to me.
But rather than let you continue to move the goal-posts even further – lets go back to your initial assertion that Fox News is comparable in credibility with what Mr. Greenwald reports.
I still say it isn’t so, based on years of comparing coverages and reporting of the two.
If you can provide specific instances that show Mr. Greenwald has been untruthful and provide evidence to back those claims up (something you have not done thus far), that would be helpful – otherwise I’ll stand by this position – not because of who Mr. Greenwald (or any other reporter/agency is) but rather because the evidence makes it the only tenable position given the information that has been provided thus far.
“To be persuasive, we must be believable; to be believable, we must be credible; to be credible, we must be truthful.”
– Edward R. Murrow
Thanks for your response.
Speak about moving the goal post. I said “half truths” in which I provided an example. Indeed, ignoring Hamas (in four articles) in a war taking place in Gaza is exactly what I’m talking about. Credibility doesn’t necessarily mean outright lying.
In an interview or discussion between Greenwald and Bill Keller of the New York Times, Keller says exactly what I believe about adversarial journalism:
“…….The thing is, once you have publicly declared your “subjective assumptions and political values,” it’s human nature to want to defend them, and it becomes tempting to omit or minimize facts, or frame the argument, in ways that support your declared viewpoint. And some readers, knowing that you write from the left or right, will view your reporting with justified suspicion…..”
Keller is entirely correct. That sums up why the credibility of journalists like Greenwald is diminished by adversarial journalism. This of course is true for Fox News as well. You should be skeptical of Fox News and the JP and Greenwald etc.
Thanks
” You should be skeptical of Fox News and the JP and Greenwald etc.
Well, now you’ve completely removed your goal-posts from the field; which is fine as they have moved so much.
With regards to the quoted comment above – as I noted in my comments, it is facts and the best evidence that matters to me (there is no such thing as a “half-truth” by the way, it’s either true or it isn’t.)
That has been, and will continue to be, my position with regards to what is actually being reported on from whatever source – not what isn’t or what is may need to be reported on.
““Seldom, very seldom, does complete truth belong to any human disclosure; seldom can it happen that something is not a little disguised or a little mistaken.”
Jane Austen, Emma
Thanks SillyPutty
So “if you’re not with us you’re against us, with the terrorists.” Is that you, George W. Bush?
Sorry I’m so slow getting back to you. I was painting……
You know who else was accused of wasteful expenditure? The African National Congress.
In all seriousness, it’s exactly like that. Let’s say we’re discussing the Apartheid regime of South Africa, and someone points out that we shouldn’t ignore the role of the African National Congress in all the violence in South Africa. That role exists (indeed, the ANC was a US-designated terrorist organization), but that’s absolutely the wrong way to look at the issue.
Exactly. Some members of the ANC did do truly heinous things. (Necklacing comes to mind.) Some were out-and-out terrorists.
So gracious yes, let’s retain focus on the sins and insufficiencies of the oppressed people, and ignore that apartheid behind the curtain. And if the Western world labels the oppressed’s resistance as “terrorists,” then that’s EVEN BETTER to divert attention from the Western monstrosity behind that fluttering curtain.
(And let’s also forget that the State of Israel was born in Jewish Terrorism. That Yitzhak Shamir innovated the letter bomb, killed hundreds, and was rewarded with being elected as one of two terrorist prime ministers — the other being Menachem Begin.)
It’s a historical fact that Jewish terrorism is the cradle of Israel. One must be really ignorant not to know this. Why do the US glorify the kind of terrorism that takes the land form it’s inhabitants, and condemns Palestinians for trying to make an end to their imprisonment ? Is there no end to US hypocrisy. God help us if the targets in Gaza were found by US military intelligence!!!! Pleas US don’t ever come to our help!!!
I found the Craig Summers of the Apartheid era, in this 1987 letter to the New York Times. It’s exactly the same type of discourse, isn’t it?
It’s a good article and Nelson Mandela provided a good ending to the story. None the less, Israel isn’t Apartheid South Africa and Meshal isn’t Mandela. Mandela was driven by his hatred of a radical segregationist system that could not survive by changing the core laws and hatred which kept it in place. Hamas has an underlying religious-based philosophy that opposes a Jewish state anywhere on Islamic holy land. In fact, it is Hamas that is the racist organization with a racist, antisemitic core philosophy that needs to change (their charter).
Can Hamas change? Of course – and they can start by disowning their racist charter and disarming (the way to peace).
“…….Let’s say we’re discussing the Apartheid regime of South Africa……”
Sorry, there is no comparison between Israel and South Africa so it’s a non starter in any discussion about Israel. This the simply the propaganda of the left. By comparing Israel with the worst regimes of the twentieth century, the far left (aligned with the far right) hopes to mobilize actions like the BDS campaign against Israel. These are the same folks who state Zionism equals racism; label Zionist as Jewish “supremacist” and don’t support a Jewish state i.e., support the one state solution. The idea behind the comparison of Israel and apartheid South Africa has important ramifications. Fortunately, the idea never has caught on – but that doesn’t keep people from trying to advance a lie for political purposes.
The reason that sanctions have failed thus far against Israel is because of Palestinian Arab and Arab resistance to the state of Israel – like the 1967 and 1973 wars. The 1948 war also saw Arab armies attempt to remove Israel by force. The PLO had a long history of resistance in which the main thrust was removing Israel entirely. Obviously, there were no settlements before the 1967 war. Until recently, the PLO did not support the two state solution. Hamas still supports that political position.
Hamas opposed the Oslo Accords and they oppose a lasting peace with Israel although, they say that they are willing to sign a long term truce. Although, Hamas is NOT the ISIS, they are – none the less – an Islamists organization with a similar fundamentalist philosophy. Israel has always been able to paint Hamas as radical which is why Israel retains strong support not only from the west, but by Arab regional dictators that see the Islamists as a threat.
Interestingly enough, the true terrorist, Assad, has been also able to paint the Islamists as the “real” threat posed to regional stability. This only helps Israel (IMO). Al-Sissi supports the blockade whereas Morsi did not. These are not the best of times for Islamists.
Thanks Jose
I don’t care if you think Apartheid South Africa was much worse. That’s not the point. In conflicts like these, what history record, regardless of outcome, is who was abusing who, not who was the better administrator of funds, or who had better targeting technology.
I am all for history recording who is the abuser. I just oppose lies like Israel is similar to apartheid South Africa.
“These are the same folks who state Zionism equals racism; label Zionist as Jewish “supremacist” and don’t support a Jewish state i.e., support the one state solution.”
You have three different groups all mashed up there. It is especially worrying that you think that being anti-Zionist is inherently anti-Semitic. One is opposition to a movement within the Jewish faith that has shown extreme tendencies. The other is racism. The two are not equivalent.
“…..It is especially worrying that you think that being anti-Zionist is inherently anti-Semitic…..”
I didn’t say that. I specifically said that “…..These are the same folks who state Zionism equals racism…..” although I did not say it was antisemitic in my post. I do believe it is however. The EU interprets that phrase as antisemitic.
“…….Denying the Jewish people their right to self-determination, e.g., by claiming that the existence of a State of Israel is a racist endeavor…..”.
So I really have no idea what you are saying.
Thanks.
Israel (Ludic party) and Hamas are almost identical twins, and as terrorists, the differences
between them are negligible.
Don’t you ever hold off and stare at your drivel a moment or two before clicking ‘Post Comment’?
“The Fringe Left” In Photos:Worldwide Protest Against Israeli Attack On Gaza
For the last few weeks, I have barely slept with the knowledge of what is going on in the Gaza strip. There must be hundreds of photos in this album all from different places. This gives me hope.
Wow, thanks Kitt. Now if only we could shine every one of those photos on the Capitol building, notwithstanding shoving it in US MSM talking heads faces.
“[Hamas] charter that calls for the destruction of Israel” — CS
Given how Israeli has treated the Palestinians you can hardly blame them. In any case, the charter was written over 25-years ago and Hamas has since modified it’s views:
Hamas Foreign Minister: We Accept Two-State Solution With ’67 Borders
“Look, we said, frankly, we accept the state and ’67 borders. This was mentioned many times and we repeated many times,” said Hamad….I think Hamas shows a lot of flexibility. We became more pragmatic, more realistic. Hamas is ready to go more and more for political solutions. Hamas could be a good player in making peace in this region, but don’t use sticks against him, and punishment against Hamas,” Hamad said, referring to the sanctions imposed after Hamas won a decisive majority in the Palestinian Parliament in 2006.
http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2011/05/24/136403918/hamas-foreign-minister-we-accept-two-state-solution-with-67-borders
However, the same cannot be said for the Likud party:
The Hateful Likud Charter Calls for Destruction of Any Palestinian State
By Jonathan Weiler
“There have been some updates to the platform more recently, reflecting Israel’s withdrawal of settlements from Gaza in 2005. But the Likud Party has *never* in its statements of principles, accepted a Palestinian State.”
http://www.juancole.com/2014/08/charter-destruction-palestinian.html
In response to that drek, Craig, I post the following from a Gazan woman who lost 9 members of her family, from being bombed by their oppressor and occupier in their open air prison called the Gaza Strip (my emphasis):
——————————-
Never ask me about peace again
Tears flowed until my body ran dry of them when I received a telephone call on Aug. 3, informing me that my family had been targeted by two F-16 missiles in the city of Rafah. Such was the fate of our family in a war that still continues, with every family in the Gaza Strip receiving its share of sorrow and pain.
My father’s brother, Ismail al-Ghoul, 60, was not a member of Hamas. His wife, Khadra, 62, was not a militant of Hamas. Their sons, Wael, 35, and Mohammed, 32, were not combatants for Hamas. Their daughters, Hanadi, 28, and Asmaa, 22, were not operatives for Hamas, nor were my cousin Wael’s children, Ismail, 11, Malak, 5, and baby Mustafa, only 24 days old, members of Islamic Jihad, the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine or Fatah. Yet, they all died in the Israeli shelling that targeted their home at 6:20 a.m. on Sunday morning.
Their house was located in the Yibna neighborhood of the Rafah refugee camp. It was one story with a roof made of thin asbestos that did not require two F-16 missiles to destroy. Would someone please inform Israel that refugee camp houses can be destroyed, and their occupants killed, with only a small bomb, and that it needn’t spend billions to blow them into oblivion?
If it is Hamas that you hate, let me tell you that the people you are killing have nothing to do with Hamas. They are women, children, men and senior citizens whose only concern was for the war to end, so they can return to their lives and daily routines. But let me assure you that you have now created thousands — no, millions — of Hamas loyalists, for we all become Hamas if Hamas, to you, is women, children and innocent families. If Hamas, in your eyes, is ordinary civilians and families, then I am Hamas, they are Hamas and we are all Hamas.
Throughout the war, we thought that the worst had passed, that this was the pivotal moment when matters would improve, that they would stop there. Yet, that real moment of pain, of extreme fear, was always followed by something even worse.
Now I understood why the photographs of corpses were so important, not only for international public opinion, but for us, the families, in search for an opportunity to bid farewell to our loved ones, so treacherously killed. What were they doing in those last moments? What did they look like after their death?
I discovered the photos of my dead relatives on social networking sites. The bodies of my cousin’s children were stored in an ice cream freezer. Rafah’s Abu Yousef al-Najjar Hospital was closed after being shelled by Israeli tanks, and the Kuwaiti Hospital that we visited just a day earlier had become an alternate venue, where this freezer was the only option available.
Al-Najjar’s director, Abdullah Shehadeh, told Al-Monitor, “We decided to move the patients when shells hit the main gate. Some patients, out of fear, ran out, despite the gravity of the security situation. We are now working out of this ill-equipped hospital.”
The Emirati Red Crescent Maternity Hospital, west of Rafah, has been transformed into a large container for corpses, with fruit and vegetable freezers filled with dozens of bodies.
I saw corpses on the floor, some with nametags on their chests, while others remained unknown. We held our noses, for the stench was unbearable, as flies filled the air.
Ibrahim Hamad, 27, removed his five-year-old son’s shroud-wrapped body from a vegetable freezer. Fighting back tears, he told Al-Monitor, “He died as a result of a reconnaissance drone missile attack. His body has been here since yesterday. The dangerous situation prevented me from coming to take him any sooner.”
I thank God that my relatives were quickly buried, and that my cousins Mustafa, Malak and Ismail did not remain long in a freezer, lest their bodies freeze, and their souls now rest in peace, leaving us with nothing but the silence of death and bodies forever trapped in the postures of their passing.
On the fifth day of the war, when I went to write my Rafah report about the shelling of the Ghannam family, I stopped by to visit my cousin’s house. I saw my relatives and we took photographs together. During the war, my cousin Wael’s wife had given birth to twins, Mustafa and Ibrahim, who were like two tiny angels, harbingers of hope and joy.
How could I have known that this would be our last meeting? I wish I had stayed longer and talked to them some more. Hanadi, Asmaa, my uncle and his wife laughed as they joked about the twist of fate that brought us together in the middle of a war, at a time when Israeli occupation forces had not yet begun perpetrating their wanton war crimes against Rafah.
Endings are so strange, as are living moments that suddenly become relegated to the past. We will never see them again, and the pictures that I took of the twins are now so precious, as one of them, Mustafa, was killed, while the other, Ibrahim, remained alive.
I wonder how they could differentiate between them, for they looked so much alike. Who identified them when their father died and their mother lay wounded in intensive care? Who was Mustafa, and who was Ibrahim? It was as if they had merged upon one twin’s death.
In the photos taken after their death, my family looked so peaceful, asleep with their eyes closed. None of them were disfigured or burned, unlike hundreds of dead children and civilians that US-made weapons killed before them. We wondered if they died in pain. What happened when the missile, carrying tons of explosives, impacted their modest house and exploded, creating air pressure so fierce that their internal organs burst? Their suffering was perhaps lessened by the fact that they were sleeping.
I didn’t see them when I went to Rafah on Aug. 2. I wrote about the death of the Ayad Abu Taha family, which was targeted by warplanes, and saw the corpse of Rizk Abu Taha, one year old, when it arrived at the Kuwaiti Hospital.
I observed him at length. He looked alive. One could see that he had been playing when he died, dressed in his pink pants. How could he be at such peace? The bodies of war victims look so different from how they appear on television. They are so real, so substantial, suddenly there before you, without any newscast introductions, music or slogans.
Bodies lay everywhere, and it was if everything in life had been to prepare us for this moment. Suddenly, the dead left their personal lives behind: their cell phones, homes, clothes, perfumes and daily chores. Most importantly, they left the fear of war behind.
Distances in the small Gaza Strip have grown larger, distances and time expanding as a result of the fear and death that shrank the life expectancy of the populace. We were unable to join the family for the funerals. My uncle, Ahmad al-Ghoul, later told me over the phone, “Because of the inherent danger, our goodbyes to them lasted mere seconds. Malak’s eyes laid open, as if to ask, ‘What wrong did I commit?’”
I was born in 1982, in that same house in Rafah’s refugee camp, where the family’s large household expanded. I grew up there, and everything else grew with us: the first intifada, the resistance, my nearby school that I walked to every day. There, I saw my first-ever book library. There, I remember seeing my grandfather fall asleep as he listened to the BBC. And there, I laid eyes on the first Israeli soldier in my life, striking my grandfather to force him to erase the national slogans that adorned the walls of our refugee camp home.
Now, the house and its future memories have been laid to waste, its children taken to early graves. Homes and recollections bombed into oblivion, their inhabitants homeless and lost, just as their camp always had been. Never ask me about peace again.
Devastating. The destruction, the countless lives lost, the individual tragedies…repeated so may times over. Netanyahu and Obama are fucking insane. The atrocities will not go unavenged. The injustice and suffering is too great. The world is now starting to understand all the years of suffering the Palestinian people have endured. What other nation in the world exists with 66 years of oppression, besiegement, slaughter? This will not end well for Israel and the US if they insist on pursuing this madness. They’ll be lucky if they make it to court.
I am devastated by your writing and can only mourn with you the loss of your family and deeply regret my country’s part in this slaughter.
Where is this “Jewish State?” What are it’s borders?
Also, since Hamas is not a nation, nor the leaders of a nation, why is it so important to have them “recognize” the “Jewish State?”
Also, what about Israel reciprocating some recognition? Say, why not make Israel acknowledge the right of return of Palestinian refugees in accordance with international law and that the West Bank and Gaza are occupied territories?
So, how about these things, Craig?
“Also, since Hamas is not a nation, nor the leaders of a nation, why is it so important to have them “recognize” the “Jewish State?””
Agree. I’ve always gotten the impression that Israel didn’t care what others thought of them, so why should they get so hysterical over Hamas not recognizing them? Hamas’s stubborn refusal to acknowledge Israel’s right to exist is ultimately meaningless given that Hamas can’t beat the US-funded & -equipped Israeli military and it cannot destroy Israel. It can’t even harm many of its citizens. By Israel’s own count, there were only about 3000 Hamas fighters to begin with, so surely, after reducing Gaza to rubble, they must almost all be dead by now. If someone told me I didn’t have a right to exist, I’d just tell them to bugger off.
“…….Also, since Hamas is not a nation, nor the leaders of a nation, why is it so important to have them “recognize” the “Jewish State?”…..”
Well, it’s political, Mona. They know Hamas (and Abbas) will not do it. Even you won’t. This is a huge propaganda campaign being waged on both sides and that demand is a big part of it.
“……why not make Israel acknowledge the right of return of Palestinian refugees in accordance with international law and that the West Bank and Gaza are occupied territories?…..”
That might be the ideal solution, but it’s not going to happen. The refugees will have to be a part of any final settlement like compensation, but they will never be allowed to return to their homes in Israel (at least not this century).
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/timstanley/100196562/the-guardian-speaks-up-for-paedophiles-flirts-with-anti-semitism-and-jumps-on-every-crazy-leftist-bandwagon-in-sight-what-happened-to-quality-control/
The grauniad seems to be singled out so wanted you all to read this. Craig you to.
Poppycock
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2011/nov/06/averting-accusations-of-antisemitism-guardian
A world without any moral compass. That’s far left thinking for sure. I only read the first part of the story, but will finish it later.
Thanks Franky.
Let’s run down those examples:
#1 Paedophile community and child abusing community overlap but are not equivalent nor is one a subset of the other.
#2 Speculative piece on the possible purposes of anti-communist propaganda in an area where communism has no basis. No support for communism or lamentations of its demise as alleged, only a call for historical accuracy.
#3 An analysis of how the Guardian attempts to avoid using language associated with anti-Semitic sentiments being spun as some form of admission by a third party.
#4 The accusation here is fallacious, attempting to dismiss allegations against a specific political party simply because those allegations are also raised by anti-Semites. There is nothing inherently racist about the cartoon. Any allegation that has any truth value is going to be leveled by both political opponents and racists. This does not render the two groups equivalent.
#5 I’m failing to see the source of complaint. Is the telegraph’s problem simply that the Guardian didn’t join them in condemnation?
#6 Opposing the policies of the Catholic Church from the safety of England is somehow radical now? I guess the gunpowder treason had more impact than has previously been reported.
#7 Lamenting the lack of concern over hygiene is now radical? So I can stop taking showers and people won’t look at me askance? Oh, right, hygiene is all superficial status markers these days and we can’t have anyone reminding people of why it is practiced or urging people to practice it more when it is more meaningful…
The impression I get from all of this is that the Telegraph either doesn’t want certain topics discussed and analyzed or is trying to drive readers away from the Guardian. Following the money suggests the latter.
Analysis result: propaganda in hopes of capturing more readers.
head-line > /advertising_lies; content > /dev/null;
No, they weren’t. You aren’t well read. “Israeli police official refutes claim that Hamas kidnapped Israeli teens” http://www.dailydot.com/politics/israel-gaza-kidnap-false-inaccurate/
This fact – I have already read it in several reputable news outlets both inside and outside Israel – leads to the question, is Chris Summer sloppy, addled, or an outright and willful fabricator and liar?
How short minded of you, did you forget 3 days shy of a month prior to these kidnappings Palestinian kids were used as target practice by the IDF. By SOLDIERS http://youtu.be/CaibEqx2m_k Don’t take my word for it take former IDF’s testimonies. Take your pick http://www.breakingthesilence.org.il/testimonies/videos/84876
There must be a phrase that describes blatant anti-antisemitism. Something like “ridiculous, stomach-turning, Zionist propaganda”; horsesh-t hasbara; or let’s blame the victim”. Something along those lines.
You know, something to absolve Israel from its obvious genocide.
The problem is that the modern radical anti-israeli terrorist organisation Hamas began as welfare branch of the Muslim Brotherhood and was invited toGaza after 1967 by the Israelis to weaken Al Fatah. Modern Hamas is an israeli creation.
Meanwhile this self created demon has totally run out of control, but gives Israel a comfortable alibi not to negoziate with the Palestinians, but to go on filling their occupied land with jewish settlers.
“The murderers who kidnapped the Israeli teens are identified members of Hamas. They sometimes have been referred to as rebels i.e., rogue murderers who work outside of Hamas leadership – allowing a convenient denial by the terrorist organization that never condemned the kidnapping or murder of the teens.”
This is Israeli propaganda, pure and simple. There is nothing linking Hamas leadership to the kidnappings and substantial reason to believe they were not involved.
See http://www.buzzfeed.com/sheerafrenkel/israeli-intelligence-officers-doubt-hamas-involvement-in-inc
I didn’t know the kidnappers/killers of the three Israeli teens had ever been caught or identified. I had not read that. Can you cite your source? I also did not know that Hamas leadership had endorsed the kidnappings/killings – what I read was that they publicly disavowed any knowledge of them. Again, Can you cite your source, please. Thanks
“What has been happening over the years is a
predictable routine of foreign visitation from
the head of the Israeli government. The Israeli
puppeteer travels to Washington. The Israeli
puppeteer meets with the puppet in the White
House, and then moves down Pennsylvania
Avenue, and meets with the puppets in Congress.
And then takes back billions of taxpayer
dollars.”
-Ralph Nader
“You can’t have an Israel policy other than
what AIPAC gives you around here. I have
followed them mostly in the main, but I have
also resisted signing certain letters from time
to time, to give the poor President a chance. I
can tell you no President takes office I don’t
care whether it is a Republican or a
Democrat….that all of a sudden AIPAC will
tell him exactly what the policy is….”
– Senator Ernst Hollings
” If I were an Arab leader, I would never sign an agreement with Israel. It is normal; we have taken their country. It is true God promised it to us, but how could that interest them? Our God is not theirs. There has been Anti – Semitism, the Nazis, Hitler, Auschwitz, but was that their fault ? They see but one thing: we have come and we have stolen their country. Why would they accept that?” -David Ben Gurion (the first Israeli Prime Minister)
“The Palestinians” would be crushed like grasshoppers … heads smashed against the boulders and walls.”
-Yitzhak Shamir in 1988
“We have to kill all the Palestinians unless they are resigned to live here as slaves.”
-Chairman Heilbrun of the Committee for the Re-election of General Shlomo Lahat, the mayor of Tel Aviv, October 1983
“We must use terror, assassination, intimidation, land confiscation, and the cutting of all social services to rid the Galilee of its Arab population.” -Israel Koenig, “The Koenig Memorandum”
Ben-Gurion thought in this point as Jabotinski. And in this point, as Jabotinski, Ben-Gurion at least was honest. So was the once “new historian” and now cynical-zionist Benny Morris. Ten years ago, in his famous Haaretz-interview, Morris regretted that Ben-Gurion did not expell all Palestinians, but stopped ethnic cleansing half way. That’s Machiavellian thinking at it’s ugliest: the cruelties have to be made at the beginning…
We are complicit in these war crimes….The US Congress needs to stop supporting Israel to the tune of billions of dollars per year- and the American people need to wake up and realize that we are being bamboozled….Personally, I don’t want my tax dollars being spent killing innocent civilians and children.
So the political and intelligence arms of the U.S. government are singing different tunes about Israel eh? Not surprised.
Its pretty obvious , at least to me, that nothing will be done by this president or aeven the next neocon republican to put these agencies on a leash..In fact..they are getting used to the limelight and we are all but desensitized.
It would be great to expose the Bank of International Settlements (BIS)that has made much of the havoc we see both geopolitically in wars and Finance, financing both sides of conflicts..They are the final authority of all the central banks..Immune..by treaty..to liability..Lately their names have become known..They dread the light..I’d say…they are fair game..
Do a great piece and please make sure everyone in the Middle East gets a copy ..In fact..make sure the Brics get it and especially below the Equator..like Argentina, Cuba, venezuela etc..and maybe some cages will get rattled enough to make some change when Jihadists and Jibaros request a little talk with them.
Jewish Lobby v Israel Lobby
Below, many commenters have been discussing whether the pro-Israel-no-matter-what grip on American politicians results from a movement better labeled as the Jewish Lobby, or as the Israel Lobby. I fall on Gator’s side here in opting for the latter, as I will explain, but I can also see why “Jewish Lobby” is not an obviously wrong choice.
From the Jewish Virtual Library (a very Zionist site), my emphasis:
Having just read John Judis’ book, Genesis: Truman, American Jews, and the Origins of the Arab/Israeli Conflict,, I have learned that the Jewish voting bloc’s control of U.S. policy on Israel dates back to the 1948 establishment of the Jewish State (on violent terms unfair to indigenous Arabs).
Truman was greatly resistant to recognizing the State of Israel — and felt doing so could be laying groundwork for WWIII — but, against his better judgment, finally did so. And he did so because he needed to retain the Jewish-American vote for the Democratic Party, especially in New York.
After all,Truman resignedly noted, there was not (then) an Arab voting bloc in the U.S., so there would be no political penalty for unjustly siding against them.
With the above reality in mind, I can see some justification for the phrase “Jewish Lobby,” but ultimately reject it. For two reasons: 1. Since 1948, there has arisen in America a bloc of born again, Xtian Zionist voters, and 2. Increasing numbers of American Jews have explicitly disaffiliated and renounced the Israel Lobby.
So, while I can see why electoral realities might cause some to believe at issue is a “Jewish Lobby,” for the reasons I have stated, I find that Israel Lobby is narrower, and thus more accurate.
Israel:(izraHELL)
1) Created 4 million+ Refugees
2) Holds World’s record for UN Violations at 69+
3) Murdered more innocent civilians per capita than any other country 50,000+
4) Imprisoned more civilians per cap 250,000+
5) Rendered more civilians Handicapped per cap 50,000+
6) Demolished more homes than any other country 60,000+,
7) Outlawed marriage to Non-Jews
8) DESTROYED 350+ Christian Churches & Mosques
9) 6 Wars in 60 years
10) 254 km of Apartheid Wall
11) 562 Check Points
12) Ethnically cleansed 531 villages
13)Lavon Affair
False Flag Attack, Date: July 1954 – Oct 1954. Perpetrators: Israeli Secret Service Blamed on Egypt Caused by Mossad…
The Lavon Affair refers to a failed Israeli false flag operation conducted in Egypt in the Summer of 1954. A group of Egyptian Jews were recruited by Israeli military intelligence to plant bombs inside Egyptian, American and British-owned targets.
Israel finally admitted the attack 51 years later in 2005. It completely escaped any blame in the West.
14) U.S.S. Liberty ATTACK
False Flag Attack (Another)…Tried to get America to attack Egypt…
On Thursday 8 June 1967, Israeli air and naval forces attacked America’s most advanced spy ship, the U.S.S. Liberty, killing 34 of its crew and wounding 174.
Forty five years on, thanks to the complicity of the mainstream media, the cover up ordered by President Johnson is still in place.
15)Western media adamantly refuses to report anything critical of Israel…
Gordon Duff, Senior Editor at Veterans Today, observed that “America learned, long ago with the infamous Jonathan Pollard case, that secrets going to Israel end up in the hands of America’s enemies.” (SOLD TO AMERICA’s ENEMIES)…
According to Duff, “America’s most vital Cold War defence information, nuclear technology, air defence systems, classified weapons and even NATO defence plans in case of a Soviet invasion of Western Europe, all went to Russia as part of an arrangement between the Soviets and Israel. Pollard is doing life in prison for this.” Why is the American public generally unaware of Israel’s theft of U S military secrets? The Western media adamantly refuses to report anything critical of Israel.
More Info at: DailyStormer. c0m
“Truman was greatly resistant to recognizing the State of Israel — and felt doing so could be laying groundwork for WWIII — but, against his better judgment, finally did so. And he did so because he needed to retain the Jewish-American vote for the Democratic Party, especially in New York.”
This is pure bullshit as is your conflation of the Israel lobby with American Christian Zionists. American policy makers had been working diligently for more than a decade to establish a “Jewish State” in Palestine. Concordantly, President Truman was firmly committed to the goal of establishing as Jewish state in Palestine as can be evidenced by an October 28, 1946 communique to King Saud of Saudi Arabia wherein President Truman informed the king that he believes “that a national home for the Jewish people should be established in Palestine.”
The term “Israel Lobby” has always been understood by academics to mean a confederation consisting of Jewish-American secular and religious groups. Political references to “American Christian Zionism” date back to the late seventies when America’s Christian right leadership was courted by Israeli policy makers as potential political allies; chief among these were Billy Graham and Jerry Farwell. This was a deliberate attempt to exploit anti-Muslim sentiment among American conservative Christians that had reached a feverish pitch in the wake of the OPEC embargo of 1973. Initially, Jewish-American leaders were opposed to Israel forming an alliance with America’s Christian-Right as they were understood to be a loose knit collection of reactionary religious elements whose common concern centered around the preservation of social norms and traditional values. It was only when social and economic fears merged that the loose knit reactionary fabric of America’s Christian right coalesced into a tight-knit political front. From that point forward, America’s “Christian-Right” was perceived as a viable political force whose heightened animus could be harnessed by select members of its leadership to the political benefit of Israel. One must remember that, in the aftermath of the six day war of 1967, the leadership of America’s mainline Protestant and Catholic churches were largely sympathetic to the Palestinians. So much so, that religious scholars like Rev. Franklin H. Littell were tasked to formulate an Israeli-First ideology wherein pro Palestinian sentiment was cast as a form of antisemitism.
Yes, Judis covers that memo- — and others — in Genesis. But by that, Truman did not mean an exclusively Jewish state in which Arabs were banished. He was trying to find either a partition plan both would accept, or a plan for a single state for both peoples; a homeland for both, with equal rights for all.
He did not favor the partition plan the Zionists demanded. And he certainly did not favor the ethnic cleansing and land grab of 1948 that led to the State of Israel. But, he eventually recognized that entity for reasons of sheer, craven, political necessity.
To quote from a review of Genesis in the NYT:
Truman did not stand his ground; for reasons of party politics he embraced that which he found inequitable, and even dangerous. And the world — but especially the Palestinians — has been paying the price for his caving to the Lobby ever since.
Finally, In highly recommend you read Genesis. It could further disabuse you of some of your erroneous notions.
“Yes, Judis covers that memo- — and others — in Genesis. But by that, Truman did not mean an exclusively Jewish state in which Arabs were banished. He was trying to find either a partition plan both would accept, or a plan for a single state for both peoples; a homeland for both, with equal rights for all.”
Truman did not win the presidency in 1944 election, Roosevelt did. Roosevelt was firmly committed to the ongoing effort of establishing a Jewish State in Palestine. So much so that Saudi King Ibn Saud felt the need to repeatedly express his public opposition to Roosevelt’s support for the Balfour declaration beginning in 1943. it was because of the Saudi’s concerns, that Roosevelt felt the need to be duplicitous in his dealings with them. While initially making the case for the establishment of a Jewish state during his face-to-face with Saud in a 1945 trip to Great Bitter Lake in the Suez Canal, he ultimately felt the need to mask his intentions upon seeing the vehemence of the king’s reaction. Shortly after that meeting, Roosevelt is on record as having provided assurances to American Jewish leader Stephen Wise that his administration supported unrestricted immigration to Palestine and a future Jewish state. Upon Roosevelt’s death, Truman was forced to adopt Roosevelt’s strategy of providing duplicitous assurances to “Arabists” while formulating a Doctrine that would be broad enough to allow for the establishment of the Jewish state. Again, on October 28, 1946 an official communique was addressed to King Saud of Saudi Arabia wherein President Truman informed the king that he believes “that a national home for the Jewish people should be established in Palestine.” After Britain passed control of Palestine to the United Nations in 1947, it immediately proposed to partition Palestine into two states, one for an Arab majority and one for the Jewish minority. Even though Truman was advised that his support of the UN partition plan might require American military intervention, he decided to act in accord with Roosevelt’s express commitment to American Jews who were a major constituency in the Democratic Party.
It is true that, in 1943, Roosevelt was advised by Wallace Murray, head of the US State Department Near East Division, that the Saudi King might look favorably upon a binational state that would effectively deny Jews the exclusively Jewish homeland promised by the Balfour Declaration, he rejected that proposal. Murray’s proposal was fueled by the perception that the establishment of a Jewish state in Palestine would alienate much of the Arab world at a time when the Russians were looking to gain a foothold in oil rich regions. This view would be echoed by the acting head of the US State Department Near East Division, Loy Henderson, when Truman became president in 1945. Henderson was convinced that Russian actions in Turkey and Greece did not bode well for Palestine at a time when British control was waning. By 1946, Truman shared Henderson’s concerns as he set to the task of formulating a doctrine that would best facilitate Russian containment while advancing American interests in said oil rich regions.
It is also true that, after hearing the declaration that the UN intended to partition Palestine, Truman briefly endorsed a plan that would have established the Jewish state as a United Nations trusteeship, rather than as an autonomous entity. However, historians generally hold the view that Truman’s endorsement was an honest mistake that resulted from confusion related to an aberrant policy-making process.
No.
Truman decided, for obvious reasons, that the U.S. was a bit weary of committing its military (something he’d soon forget on Korea), and so ruled out having America compel a more just division on Palestine. He was angry and frustrated with the Israel Lobby at home, and caved to this pressure, believing in doing so he was being unjust to Arabs and also setting the scene for WWIII. But deploying American troops was not a move he was then willing to make, however wrong he felt the Zionists were vis-a-vis indigenous Arabs in Palestine.
In any event, you appear to have abandoned your original error in citing a 1946 Truman memo as standing for proposition for which it does not, so, this is good.
Oh, and Wilhelmina, about your peculiar idea that academia has always considered the Israel Lobby to be constituted solely of secular and religious Jews. Perhaps you are aware of two prominent academics named Stephen Walt and John Mearsheimer?
You see, they, well Wilhelmina, they… wrote the fucking book on The Israel Lobby, in a tome titled, oddly enough, The Israel Lobby.
This is how Publishers Weekly reviews it in part, my emphasis:
Always happy to help.
“Oh, and Wilhelmina, about your peculiar idea that academia has always considered the Israel Lobby to be constituted solely of secular and religious Jews. Perhaps you are aware of two prominent academics named Stephen Walt and John Mearsheimer?”
The fact that these two authors are described as “notorious” for attempting to advance “their explosive claims about the malign influence of the pro-Israel lobby on the U.S. government” does not speak well for their reliability as a quoted source. In making such expansive assertions, such individuals routinely blur distinctions and/or conflate terms that will aide them in inflating their claims. Before you further endeavor to blur the distinction between that which is traditionally referred to as the Israel (Jewish) Lobby and the American Christian Zionists, in service to your ideological bias, here is a 2013 study written by Samuel Mohr wherein the distinction between the two groups is clearly delineated in keeping with conventional scholarship.
Understanding American Christian Zionism: Case Studies of
Christians United for Israel and Christian Friends of Israeli
Communities
Journal of Politics & International Studies, Vol. 9, Summer 2013 ISSN 2047-7651 287
By Samuel Mohr
http://www.polis.leeds.ac.uk/assets/files/students/student-journal/sum-13/130930-sum13-mohr.pdf
You do realize those two are well published Harvard Professors? I would reasonably assume they are more reliable and balanced than most journalist you could quote. As to Mr. Mohr’s paper, It looks like I have a morning of reading ahead of me.
Wilhelmina spouts more codswollop with:
Yes, the shrieks from the usual suspects that Mearsheimer and Walt are antisemites is sound reason to doubt that, as academics in a relevant field writing a book titled The Israel Lobby, they would know what constitute parts comprise the lobby.
Uh-huh.
OMG HARVARD!!!! Why didn’t you say so before? Oh wait.., Alan Dershowitz was a professor at Harvard for forty six years. By your metric, his views and methods of argumentation must be considered sacrosanct. Have you read the Case for Israel? Or, the Case for Peace? There are a lot of pages in those books so they must be given greater weight, right? Surely his views should be held in higher regard than Chomsky of Finkelstein.., right?
In a 2006 paper entitled The Israel Lobby and US Foreign Policy, Mearsheimer and Walt are careful to provide a unique definition of the term “Israel Lobby”:
“We use ‘the lobby’ as a convenient short-hand term for the loose coalition of individuals and organizations that actively work to shape U.S. foreign policy in a pro-Israel direction. Our use of this term is not meant to suggest that ‘the lobby’ is a unified movement with a central leadership or that individuals within it do not disagree on certain issues. The lobby is not a cabal or conspiracy, and its activities are essentially consistent with the interest-group tradition that has long governed American political life.” (Israel Lobby; pg 40-41)
The reason that the authors felt compelled to provide this definition was to draw a clear distinction between their intended use of the term “Israel Lobby” and that which was traditionally used by scholars. After asserting that “Jewish-Americans have formed an impressive array of organizations to influence American foreign policy…” in unquestioning compliance with the goals expressed by Israel’s leadership, they concluded their expansive redefinition of the term “Israel Lobby” with the following:
“The lobby also includes prominent Christian evangelicals like Gary Bauer, Jerry Falwell, Ralph Reed and Pat Robertson, as well as Dick Armey and Tom DeLay, former majority leaders in the House of Representatives. These “Christian Zionists” believe Israel’s rebirth is part of Biblical prophecy, support its expansionist agenda and think pressuring Israel is contrary to God’s will. In addition, the lobby also draws support from neoconservative gentiles such as John Bolton, the late Wall Street Journal editor Robert Bartley, former Secretary of Education William Bennett, former UN Ambassador Jeanne Kirkpatrick and columnist George Will.”
The inclusion of “Christian Zionists” was no accident or casual aside; such conflations are consciously calculated to uncritically expand the traditional definition of the term “Israel Lobby” as a predicate to illustrating the degree to which American political culture and public opinion are held sway by the collective efforts of pro-Israel American Jews and Christians, and wherein AIPAC “forms the core of the lobby’s influence in Congress.” In having accepting this broadly expansive definition of “Israel Lobby”, many readers have committed themselves to the task of advancing a logical fallacy: Israel has a disproportionate degree of influence in the shaping of US foreign policy. Absent the clear distinctions that a proper understanding of history imposes upon us, such claims tend to be accepted all too readily as fact when proffered by those who boast an Ivy League pedigree.
Mearsheimer and Walt’s expansive definition of “Israel Lobby” has been seized upon those harboring either a latent anti-Jewish or anti-Israel bias as the lens by which the history of the “Jewish State” is now viewed and reinterpreted – as is clearly evident in Mona’s case.
Now, now, Wilhelmina, let’s stay on point, ok? You originally claimed:
This was supposed to chastise me for including Xtian Zionists under the rubric of The Israel Lobby; why, says you, your purported academics would not do such a thing!
So, ok, I cite the two academics who wrote T*H*E* book on The Israel Lobby, and who include Xtian Zionists within that category.
You, now, ought to simply concede error.
For the few intrepid souls who read this exchange between Mona and myself, I offer the following caveats:
I engaged Mona in this debate for the purpose of demonstrating the degree to which she will employ dishonest tactics in support of her false assertion that the term “Israel Lobby” is not synonymous with “Jewish lobby.” In support of this position she wrote:
“Having just read John Judis’ book, Genesis: Truman, American Jews, and the Origins of the Arab/Israeli Conflict, I have learned that the Jewish voting bloc’s control of U.S. policy on Israel dates back to the 1948 establishment of the Jewish State (on violent terms unfair to indigenous Arabs).”
She then went on to assert that the term “Jewish lobby” is ill applied when describing the influence of “the Jewish voting bloc’s control of U.S. policy on Israel” in 1948 and that the term “Israel Lobby” is a more accurate term to describe the events of that day. In support of that position, she argued that:
1. Since 1948, there has arisen in America a bloc of born again, Xtian Zionist voters, and
2. Increasing numbers of American Jews have explicitly disaffiliated and renounced the Israel Lobby.
Yet she offers no evidence that American “Christian Zionists” were capable of influencing American foreign policy in any significant way at that time. When confronted with the fact the American “Christian Zionists” did not become a viable political force until thirty years later, she felt the need to cite a Publishers Weekly review of a book written by Stephen Walt and John Mearsheimer that allegedly supports her thesis; yet, she has failed to provide a single citation by the authors themselves. To the contrary: when presented with a 2006 paper that was authored by Walt and Mearsheimer in which they clearly define how they intentionally expanded the term to include the rising influence of American Christian Zionists from the late seventies forward she responds with, “So, ok, I cite the two academics who wrote T*H*E* book on The Israel Lobby, and who include Xtian Zionists within that category.” In the doing, she has once again demonstrated her utter contempt for the truth by once again attempting to cite a source that lends no credence to her arguments.
Here is a complete list of the the American Christian Zionist bloc that was cited by Stephen Walt and John Mearsheimer:
Gary Bauer – A Ronald Reagan appointee (1980)
Rev Jerry Falwell – Launched the Moral Majority political action committee in 1979
Ralph Reed – Hired by Pat Robertson as director of the Christian Coalition in Virginia in 1989
Pat Robertson – Began his activism by serving as the president of the Council for National Policyin 1981.
Dick Armey – Only came to National prominence in 1985 as member of the House of Representatives
Tom DeLay – Only came to National prominence in 1984 when he won a seat in the House of Representatives.
John Bolton – Only came to National prominence in 2001 as a Bush appointee
Robert Bartley – Wall Street Journal editor who reportedly became affiliated with Neoconservative William Crystal in 1972
William Bennett – 1981 Appointee of Ronald Reagan
Jeanne Kirkpatrick – Rose to prominence in 1980s as a Foreign policy adviser to Ronald Reagan
George Will – Altogether questionable
This is why I have characterized the online activity of Mona and her various alters as akin to that of a fairground, dunk-tank clown.
Wilhelmina spews more densely packed bilge:
Wilhelmina reverts to this “Mona is dishonest!” schtick whenever (which is often) she realizes the impossibility of countering my facts.
In their book titled …wait for it, Wilhelmina ….HOLD ON TO YOUR HAT, DEAR GIRL…
T*H*E I*S*R*A*E*L L*O*B*B*Y
Yup, academics Walt and Mearsheimer list all those scads of Zionist Xtian groups in this book because these Xtians are a constituent part of the U.S. Israel Lobby. You know, the subject of their book.
For that reason (the Xtians in the Lobby), and also because many Jews do not support Zionism per se and/or as it is recently practiced in Israel, I refer to the pro-Israel lock on our political bodies as coming *not from “the Jewish Lobby,” but rather, from the Israel Lobby.
I’m always offering facts and logic like that, which confuses Wilhelmina greatly; not understanding, she eventually erupts into shrieking fits about my purported dishonesty.
Sometime I’ll get her started again on the subject of pornography, and then — hooo boy! — we’ll be in for a wang-dang doodle of a good time!
“Wilhelmina reverts to this “Mona is dishonest!” schtick whenever (which is often) she realizes the impossibility of countering my facts.”
There you have it folks, I will let you be the judge. But, don’t go away. We are at the stage where Mona usually conjures up one of her sockpuppets to create the illusion of support. So stick around and enjoy the antics. Remember.., her behavior is fairly representative of the hive in general.
While we are waiting for her to respond I will ask you to ponder a simple observation: have you ever noticed that Mona ceaselessly endeavors to engage in revisionist history that, by its very nature, is intended to undermine or abnegate traditional values. Isn’t this the very essence of cultural Marxism?
Oh, and FYI, the reference to pornography stems directly from a discussion between Mona and me concerning the rape allegations against Assange. It was her position that a man does not need the conscious consent of a woman to engage in sex with her. To the contrary, she argued that women find pleasure in being waken up by a man who initiates intercourse while the woman is unconscious and thus unable to give consent. Even more comical, she actually elicited the aide of one of her sockpuppets to create the illusion of solidarity and support for her unique “feminist” perspective. It was a hoot. Let me know if you are interested and I will direct you to the Guardian article thread wherein that conversation took place.
Wowzer. Wilhelmina has left us for worlds unknown (but I suspect they have convents):
A cultural Marxist, now am I! And as such, I undermine and abnegate traditional values. Minkoff Sisters, ya see that? Par-teh!
But, I guess Wilhelmina’s right, tho — that I’m kinda down with various sex thingies — cuz then she squeaks:
Close. But not quite.
See, our Wilhelmina is shocked and aghast at the notion that gay mens uses some pronography! Why, the poor dear verily clutch-ed her pearls and groped for yon fainting couch when this she did learn.
The immediate occasion for our fair damsel’s distress was reading that Glenn Greenwald had once held an ownership interest in a gay pron distributions venture.
Her prune face alternating between ashen and deep scarlet, Wilhelmina demanded immediate and public repentance from Sinner Greenwald. She banged her Bible and righteously thundered against his sin against chastity, and would leave him no peace in the CiF comments section. She was the veritable scourge of heaven, she was.
I, of course, bullied her mercilessly over this Comstockian foolishness, thus sending her whining to the CiF mod team, sniffling and demanding they uphold her honor.
Ah yes, Good times, good times.
In any event. As I have demonstrated, it is not correct to refer to the pro-Israel movement in America as the “Jewish Lobby”; more accurately, is “the Israel Lobby.” For all of the reasons I have set forth in the thread above, and at which reasons Wilhelmina has tilted at in utter futility.
Nite, nite, Wilhelmina. Don’t think any impure thoughts now, y’here?
Thank you Mona!
There you have it folks. If Glenn Greenwald’s “biggest fan” and most ardent apologist is so enamored of her own capacity for dishonest rhetoric that she would repeat the same lie over and over in the face of irrefutable proof to the contrary, then what does that say about the veracity of Glenn Greenwald? Do you actually believe that he is unaware of the fact that his most ardent supporters are using numerous alters to generate an endless stream of sophistry and scripted dialogue for illusion sake? Look at the way she bares her teeth when she is cornered and exposed. Notice how she didn’t bother to deny the fact that she endorsed rape as a normal behavior, but instead chose to go on the offensive by resorting to argumentum ad hominem. This is the true nature of those who comprise Glenn Greenwald’s most inner circle. What type of man surrounds himself with this type of individual?
Wilhelmina continues her fanciful flights with:
This thread has been about The Israel Lobby (no, really, that *is how it started). What it is, and who constitutes it. Wilhelmina is having a sad because the definitive book on the topic demonstrates her position to be flat-out wrong.
Alas, she cannot counter the reality that it is incorrect to refer to the pro-Israel movement in America as the “Jewish Lobby”; more accurately, it is “the Israel Lobby.” For all of the reasons I have set forth in the thread above (the presence of Xtian Zionists, as well as the rejection of the Lobby by significant numbers of Jews).
Ca suffit, Wilhelmenia!
”If Glenn Greenwald’s “biggest fan” and most ardent apologist is so enamored of her own capacity for dishonest rhetoric that she would repeat the same lie over and over in the face of irrefutable proof to the contrary, then what does that say about the veracity of Glenn Greenwald?.”
Absolutely nothing.
Wilhelmina, this is probably the most blatant false-equivalency I’ve ever read – and the fact that it is the summation to your argument says much more about you than it does about either Mona or Greenwald.
A BBC interviewer, coupled with a clever decipher of Mark Regev’s lying, team up to totally kick sadist Mark Regev around the block and over the cliff . She almost had him actually crying. Not because he is caught lying about the slaughter of babies and other civilians, but because his bull shit is flying right back down his own throat no matter how hard he tries to fling it at her and all who were listening and watching.
When you have to justify the killing of children, you have done something very wrong, are pursuing a very bad and very likely an ultimately losing strategy.
Israel is losing because the Palestinians are willing to take the casualties. Israel is losing the goodwill of the world very rapidly, and their position in US politics is more precarious than ever before.
Israel is very bad for Jews.
Notice how there are no facts and just emotion.
As for the Hamas rockets has anyone mentioned that these horrible weapons have killed 17 Israelis over 5 years? More Israelis probably die from chocking on a falafel or from slipping in the shower or drown at the beach. They should declare war on beaches and falafel! The terror attacks by suicide numbers? Some think its thousands but alas its perhaps 100 since the founding of Israel. Again, more Israelis probably died in the last 10 years from texting and yabbering on cell phone while driving than from “terrorists”. Really, Glen et all–some basic numbers would put things in perspective and force these ghouls to contort themeselves to justify for killing over 300 children in one month.
As a former us navy tech that did some work for the NSA. I would suggest that we need to be very cautious publishing this type of specific information.
Well written piece thank you for reporting . The Arab Jewish Christian conflict will end when the last of the religions fall silent to the logic of science. Jesus said G.d is within. I think that means we don’t need a structural order or interpreter for a connection to our universe.
I’d like to personally invite Israelites to move here to NM we have plenty of room and lots of bombs to guard.
LE
According to polling in Israel reported by NBC, Netanyahu’s support in Israel has dropped from 82% to 62% overnight since the withdrawal from Gaza. 73% think the assault on Gaza will not deter Hamas from firing rockets.
Netanyahu will now face intense pressure from the right which means 80% of the country now.
There’s something that doesn’t seem right about that withdrawal of ground troops. Was it strategic? Did they meet more resistance than anticipated? Is it PR?
I think the establishments of both Israel and the US have been surprised that truth in social media has subverted MSM propaganda in even the small way it has. Perhaps this has something to do with it – more resistance than anticipated, as you say.
This is (as I’m sure you know) why an open internet is so important, and why the corrupted powerful hate it.
For psychological health, the American and Israeli establishments (and probably all their allies) need to fully admit that they are acting out of PRAGMATISM – as they see it – and not PRINCIPLE. And they need to admit that they are encouraging in their respective populations the same precise message that pragmatism TRUMPS principle.
It is insulting to listeners’ intelligence to claim American/Israeli actions are morally based – as the establishments of both nations claim, at the same time as asserting that it’s basically impractical to act otherwise. An example lately is Obama saying ‘we’ tortured people, which is against our values, he agrees, but ‘we’ should be excused because, well, ‘stress’ or something. Another example is saying what great ‘democracies’ Israel and America are, founded on virtuous values, while simultaneously proving that point absurd by demonstrating they are both functionally and non-democratically subservient to and corrupted by reactionary, military and corporate domination.
Greed, cruelty, indifference are not taboo in Western culture any more: they are promoted as largely ‘sensible,’ it seems to me, even while there is often an accompanying suggestion that one shouldn’t sound too politically incorrect about it – but notice the overall message is that everything is strategic, hence pragmatism trumps principles*. Having divested of principles even as something to which people should aspire, the establishment then has the temerity to claim its pragmatism is also moral, almost implying everyone decent would be identically atrocious in the same circumstances.
Which is to say I wish people could be honest, and really look at this ‘honor and integrity’ matter. Then we could discuss whether it actually IS more practical to be entirely strategic while ‘losing our soul’ in the process. Doubtless the realpolitik response would be ‘It is impractical to look at that, for philosophy means nothing in the real world.’ But, at least in my opinion, a lack of character to one’s philosophy is self-evident flirtation with sociopathic mental patterns, and to pretend to be moral merely as a pretense (while behaving unethically) is a serious and detrimental state of denial, further psychologically polluting cultures like the US and Israel.
*I’m not sure how concerted the messaging is nowadays, it seems almost unconscious.
Great comment. I think you dug deep and got to the core. To support Israel in its current manifestation requires a large dose of sociopathy; or at least an extreme form of self-delusion. The degree to which one supports the actions of Israel is the degree to which one has forfeited their principles. It is the antithesis of strength: it is weakness borne of ignorance and opportunistic cruelty.
I’d just like to add that Obama gets around the moral quandary of ‘we’ tortured people by saying that we tortured “folks”. The moral dilemma is resolved because after the torture was completed they wrapped the “folks” in cozy blankets and gave them milk and cookies. Obama effectively gave ‘us’ permission to deny moral culpability because ‘we’ gave the torture victims (I mean, folks) warm-fuzzies. That’s worth something, right? Obama is expert in using agitprop devices. I wouldn’t say that Obama is immoral. I think it would more accurate to characterize him as a amoral, unprincipled opportunist without a vestige of anything that could be considered a spine. How DOES Michelle deal? Another quandary…
Obama seems remarkably like a blank slate most of the time, although he is a gifted actor (at least in the role of ‘nice guy liberal just trying to do his best’), but he has a submissiveness toward The Powerful that is almost cringeworthy.
He submits to reactionary, military and corporate domination like Anastasia Steele to Christian Grey, and only when society is outspoken in its insistence for years and years (same-sex marriage, for example) does he pretend to support any basic dissent against the status quo at all.
He is malleable, if you are powerful enough! Even as he exhibits sociopathic patterns, he cares deeply, narcissistically perhaps, how he is perceived, and the un-ignorable revulsion of many of the American people regarding Israel’s actions is in my opinion what finally made him express what amounts to mere timid doubt about the gruesome assaults he’s enabling. Not unless there is a super-strong wave of dissent from the people will he actually listen to them (remember the public option?), and even then if the establishment can mitigate that dissent through PR he will return to subservience to the corporatist, militarist status quo in an instant.
Basically I think he submits without integrity to what he PERCEIVES as powerful, and only what is truly dominant or mighty does he accord power to. Unless the public can rally itself comprehensively and unrelentingly for extended periods of time for their needs, he feels free to ignore them since the media always prefers establishment norms to any kind of change and will support him in preserving them.
Michelle I don’t know about, but she must have seen this tendency of his before now.
Yes, I agree. As I said, he’s an “amoral, unprincipled opportunist”.
That does indeed sum it up very well.
How very pathetic that he appeared such a champion of virtue, and what a savage betrayal. He’s made an absolute mockery of liberals’ good intentions.
@Cindy
Yes, indeed. I have to admit that he had me fooled.
Obama, The Actor
The actor is self-conscious; he believes
he’s not convincing so
he looks into a mirror and he sees
someone there he doesn’t know.
He walks into the world with half a smile
where he looks for recognition:
some personality he could be for just awhile
he prepares for extradition.
Finally he says to himself, “be not afraid
deception is the actor’s trade.”
It would probably take Freud to understand the kind of people we have in high government office today but it occurs to me that the word “folks” is something you use to refer to people who are close to you, related to you, or part of your community. He may be using that word here to imply that the people who were tortured were not really enemies and therefore they were not mistreated out of feelings of enmity on our part but its just something that happened accidently like a misunderstanding at a family gathering.
Yes, he is using the word ‘folks’ to (he hopes) indicate how he personally doesn’t consider the torture victims subhuman – this he hopes will distinguish him in a flattering light from the Bush administration which was as obviously and unabashedly prejudiced as Fox News. But it is as ridiculous as saying ‘we droned some folks,’ and ‘I ordered night raids on some folks,’ which he will studiously avoid saying as it interferes with his ‘nice intelligent liberal guy’ persona and reveals him as equally cynical and sociopathic as the reactionaries from whom he pretends to differ.
It came across very weird because he’s trying to appear both status quo and non-corrupt, which is ultimately impossible.
one comment I am missing besides the strong Israel lobby is: could it be that the US is being pressured to help Israel because, if not, Israel would have to resort to using their atomic powers if their neighbors become too dangerous? Since Israel became an atomic power they have made it very clear that they will take care of their own security with their own means and not be deterred by any one… an acted accordingly….and because nobody wants an atomic mess in the ME… they get the support they want.
But how long can they survive being surrounded by arch enemies?
in northern ireland it seems as if a generation can grow up during peacetime that peace may hold but when we perpetrators and abetters over several generations we create more and more people militant and hostile toward us. why do we let israel drag us through the mud? we need some hard thinking to design a foreign policy that pursues the interests of the PEOPLE of the USA (not defense contractors and the energy industry). israel can do without our welfare and we can do without uncritical attachment to an israel nearly as much a terrorist state as any of the others in the region.
The only other conflict which was anything like this one was the Northern Ireland and UK conflict. For years and years the British would not negotiate with Sinn Fein or the IRA because they considered them to be terrorist organizations. Atrocities had been committed on both sides but by far the worst were committed by the UK. In the end they had to sit down together at the negotiating table. This is exactly what Israel refuses to do with Hamas. They want to choose the opposing sides negotiators which is ridiculous. Peace will never be achieved that way. Israel has to face its enemy and deal with reality as it is not as they would like it. They are saying all the things the British said about Sinn Fein — they’re barbarians… they’re not even human beings… they’re murderers… we won’t negotiate with terrorists.
The US played a key role in resolving that conflict when the Clinton administration was willing to recognize Sinn Fein as a legitimate representative of the people of Northern Ireland. This was about the most honorable thing the US government has done in my lifetime that I can recall. After Clinton met Gerry Adams at the White House it was not long before the British agreed to negotiate with him. This is what has to happen in the Middle East.
The significant difference between the Irish conflict is that there was no lobby for either side that begins to approach the power of the Israel Lobby, led by but not exclusively AIPAC, and the network of pro-Israel think tanks that control Congress and ALL the conversation and messaging on Capitol Hill relating to the Israel-Palestine conflict as well of the media that covers it.
People have to stop being afraid of AIPAC. It is spoken of with quasi-religious reverence as though it were all powerful. All it took was one senator to stand up to Joseph McCarthy and his committee folded. The place to start is with demanding an end to military aid to Israel. The government of Israel lavishes its citizens with all kinds of entitlements like universal health care and subsidized housing while we foot the bill for their military.
There are other conflicts like this one, which did not end well, like the conflict between European settlers and the indigenous people of the US and Canada. Those are basically extinct peoples & cultures, and the few descendants that remain live with depression, alcoholism and the possibility of suicide.
It supprises me how Jews vs Arabs most of this commenting has been when the fight is Israel (20+% Arab) against Hamas. It also supprises me how they call it ethnic cleansing when the IDF has slightly higher than 20% Arab serving in this, and they arent cleansing (though no one disputes they could).
Thank you for posting something intelligent and productive to the conversation.
Remember, abstention votes are basically “No” votes.
Apparently David Gregory, Mr. Aider & Abettor, is looking for a new job.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/08/04/david-gregory-cnn-meet-the-press_n_5647142.html
I understand that the networks are looking for ratings. Can you imagine what would happen to their goddamn ratings if they gave a primetime show to Glenn Greenwald? That would be a paradigm shift on tv. I don’t think anybody would watch anything else.
They don’t want ratings. They want to control the news AND have ratings. And that war is lost.
Couldn’t help but notice all of the countries that voted “Yes” are either poor or pre-dominantly Muslim.
You mean non-European (other than South Korea and Japan, etc). Most of the non-Muslim countries that voted “Yes” are richer than most of the European countries. China and Brazil are not really poor countries.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(nominal)
You seem to know what you’re talking about, you got to be US-American?
Let’s see: China, Brazil, Russia, India: Oops, they are in the top-ten, Mex ico 14 of the world by GDP. Try again. Or, perhaps the muslims rule them secretly. Didn’t know that.
A much more plausible way to look at it is that all European countries abstained because they are afraid to upset the US, as usual.
The European countries also have powerful Jewish lobbies, not nearly as strong as in the US, but strong enough to use their influence and wealth in influencing governments and parliaments on Israel’s behalf.
Does Russia not have a vote? Why does its name not figure?
Is China poor … or predominately Muslim?
China is a powerful atheist country.
The U.S. collusion with Israel, i.e., its sharing of intelligence including intelligence on American citizens, its
constantly repeated vetoing by the U.S. of any criticism of Israel, using the hard earned money of American taxpayers to pay for Israel’s enormous military while making cuts in Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, veterans benefits, psychiatric and other medical care for veterans, U.S. willingness to slash funds for students lunches, and many other needed social programs all point quite clearly to a disturbingly unbalanced relationship with Israel, a supposed client state. The rest of the world, being much better informed than Americans, who get only daily propaganda from U.S. print and electronic media, sees with a certain bewilderment a former great nation gone literally mad. The U.S. congress is too cowardly and too self-serving to accomplish anything, but somehow the U.S. must break out of the hold that Israel has on its policies, morals, and principles.
Congratulations Mr. Greenwald!
This article hit the mark. The International law community.
See: “US a key party to every war crime by Israel: Grossman”
http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2014/08/04/374036/us-key-party-to-israel-war-crimes/
“An international lawyer says the recent disclosures that the US is directly enabling Israel’s military assaults on Gaza vividly proves Washington’s complicity in every war crime committed by Tel Aviv.”
Thank you.
Given that the US is an accomplice, shouldn’t it recuse itself when voting on Israel-related resolutions at the UN? (I know, it would be funny if it weren’t tragic.)
Such recusal is for when you are asked to sit in judgment on matters of law in a courtroom, not when voting on policy matters in an international forum like the U.N. We are ironically adopting the role of the former Soviet Union, exercising our veto on behalf of our proxy state as it perpetrates outrages. Every refugee center that is shelled indiscriminately without consequences to Israel is a blow against the legitimacy of the U.N., which has always been shaky at best; what will it take to exhaust the patience of our leaders? And will that patience be exhausted before the rest of the world finally turns against us in revulsion? Will we never divert from this self-destructive course? My god, it’s depressing.
@ jose:
Given that the US and Israel are complicit in war crimes involving numerous cases of mass genocide; both countries should be considered for demotion to “observer” status. No vote at all.
Why are the names blacked out? Name and shame them, Glenn. Name and shame them. Until YOU publish the full truth, we’re not going to get the truth.
Well, I do wish they could be named and shamed, but if they were named and shamed, I think they could also easily be targeted by retribution from some Muslim extremist.
I’m also disappointed to see the names blacked out. These people are criminals and the public and the world should know their names.
Oh Please. Glenn is not in the business of outing people. He is in the business of shining a light on illegal government activities, so that the public can be more aware of what their govt is up to when they vote.
What do you want with the names anyway? A witch-hunt?
Because, AtheistInChief, I want to know who in the US gave Israel the dough that the ‘Finnance Maneger’ of Israel signed for. And I have every damn right to know. I’m an American and it’s my government doing this in my name.
Furthermore, I want to know who received it. You call that receipt sheet an official document of the Israeli Government? Where’s the government letterhead? What department? How do we know this wasn’t a bribe?
I’m not saying that this was an official document of any government. You may have a right to know. But the govt. also has a right to request non-disclosure due to security reasons of it’s employees. I don’t see how that is an invalid request. You are asking Glenn to reveal names of employees of covert agents. Since when has that been legal?
Go change the law on revealing the names of intelligence agency employees and then make the request. Before you do that, it’s a ridiculous request.
I personally don’t understand why the names of the agents are important. You already know what governments are involved. So call your representative about that. What are you going to do with names. It’s childish.
Watch the video below to see how US tax dollars are spent:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=N7lcNjTRSn4
It is time to setup an international organisation (and website-) to counter the nazi jews.
And I do not mean an ultra right one adoring Hitler and stuff, but an objective news gathering
and influential organisation. Things have gone way too far now.
Skip the Holocaustlessons at school, cause they are just being used for “loving jews”
Jews can get away with anything….others can not.
But who is willing to take the lead?
That’s good, because an ultra right never showed up at doorsteps of functions with “Sozialisten” printed on the napkins. Any more than you would show up at one with “Tee-partei” on them. But progressive leftists did show up on that “Sozialisten” welcome mat in droves, including Margaret Sanger–and stayed to clean up.
We do hear that chastened Obamafreaks are now trying to convince the world that ~O~ really isn’t a leftie in the same way their publically embarrassed antecedents attempted to convince the world the Hitler wasn’t. The more things change, the more they remain the same.
Honestly, la plaza, does that guitarron play nothing but that stupid song? Hitler was a leftist, so Obama is a fascist? THAT is the oldest joke in the playbook.
1917, US Federal Reserve Class B Banker hands Lenin a million dollar check for winning the Russian Monopoly Game and then comes home crowing to the NYTs about what great DEMOCRATS the Bolsheviki will make. He was just buying AIC the bids to build the canals from Baku to St. Petro. He couldn’t care less that money might have helped to build the Cheka.
So take you con-claim democracy is always to blame and spin the wheel, sucka, you be one BORING mucker rucker.
I must admit, even after following this story for so long, I’m taken aback by headlines like this:
-“Israeli official calls for concentration camps…”
-“Moshe Feiglin, Deputy Speaker of the Israeli Knesset and member of Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s ruling Likud Party, posted the inflammatory message on his Facebook page at the weekend.
He lays out a detailed plan for the destruction of Gaza – which includes shipping its residents across the world – in a letter he addressed to the Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu.”
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2715466/Israeli-official-calls-concentration-camps-Gaza-conquest-entire-Gaza-Strip-annihilation-fighting-forces-supporters.html
My first thought was…isn’t that a bit redundant? isn’t Gaza essentially already one big concentration camp? imprisonment, executions, starvation, now disease, but nevertheless, I know there has been this element in the Israeli government for some time, I’m glad its getting some sunlight now in the English language press.
I wonder if concentration camps are what Obama is thinking of when he says He shares values with Israel?
Obama – “America’s commitment to Israel’s security flows from a deeper place — and that’s the values we share. As two people who struggled to win our freedom against overwhelming odds, we understand that preserving the security for which our forefathers — and foremothers — fought must be the work of every generation. As two vibrant democracies, we recognize that the liberties and freedoms we cherish must be constantly nurtured.”
http://berkleycenter.georgetown.edu/resources/quotes/barack-obama-on-us-israeli-shared-values
Remember that old Gershwin song?
…” You say Gitmo. I say Gaza concentration camp….let’s call the whole thing off!!!”
gotta love those shared values.
I was looking up this guy, Feiglin. He’s been acused of “representing the Nazis” in the Knesset, after his concentration camp idea, I think I can understand why.
-“Acting Knesset Speaker Moshe Feiglin ousted, one by one, three Arab Knesset Members from the Knesset on Sunday after they called Israeli soldiers “murderers.” The action was caught on the YouTube below. The audio is in Hebrew, but the visible anger of the Arab MKs and the reaction by MK Feiglin are worth 1,000 words. MK Ibrahim Sarsur started the action by citing Palestinian Authority Arabs who were “murdered” by IDF “heroes.” Feiglin pointed his arm at him and told him to leave the podium after repeating his accusation”
http://www.jewishpress.com/news/breaking-news/feiglin-expels-arab-mks-who-call-idf-soldiers-murderers-video/2014/08/04/
Ah, guards bustling out the elected representatives of the few Arabs that do get to vote in Israel! More shared values!!
No fear that fascist Feiglin will become PM. That’s only for fluent English speakers since keeping Congress in its corner is Israel’s #1 priority.
Obama is such a great politician, isn’t he? Silver tongue, like Clinton’s. I’m beginning to think George W. Bush has more moral character than Obama and Clinton combined. At least Bush didn’t realize what his actions would do. Obama is fully aware of the ramifications of his actions and speeches, as was Clinton when he killed 500,000 Iraqis through a goddamn embargo.
Don’t phrase it like that. Bush had a clear idea of what he expected his actions to do. That expectation was based on lunacy and ignorance, and not a little hubris and arrogance; but wasn’t simply an ignorant mistake. It was a purposeful, considered, and deliberate course of action.
C’mon. Bush was an idiot. He had no earthly idea what he was getting into. He thought the Iraqis would put rose petals on the road for him after he got rid of Saddam. He didn’t know what a Sunni or a Shiite was. He probably still doesn’t know what de-baathification means. I’m not sure you can attribute the same sort of mental negligence to Obama. Not only does he know exactly what he’s doing, he knows if it’s right or wrong, and he still does it.
@JLocke
Wow, just, wow.
Max Blumenthal is in Israel and he reports via twitter that Jewish nationalists are marching towards occupied Silwan which is an Arab neighborhood on the outskirts Jerusalem. Watch the video below and you’ll get sense of what a ethnocentric fascist “menace” and “threat” looks like.
Contrary to the lies spewed from Israeli apologists and their shills, Israel is not a democracy. It’s a racist ethnocracy that relies on apartheid to maintain their oppression over the indigenous Palestinian population who were ethnically cleansed from their land.
Israel is one big lie which the world is now waking up to. Their brutality and racist pedigree is now on open display as manifest by the slaughter of innocent civilians and their right-wing neo-Nazi like chanting mobs. What is arguably more disturbing, however, is the US enabling of this insanity. Brian Eno was correct when he said that giving money to Israel is “Like Sending Money to the Klan”. It’s worse than that though, because the US also provides them with weaponry, intelligence, and a subservient media with which to disseminate their propaganda.
Inside Israel’s Pro-War Nationalist Camp
http://therealnews.com/t2/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=31&Itemid=74&jumival=12191
Haaretz – “U.S., UN condemn attack on UN school; Rocket sirens sound in greater Tel Aviv area”
http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/1.608548
Haaretz does have a difficult job here balancing those two stories in the headlines.
Yes on the one hand Israel has slaughtered almost two thousand people now and is finally being condemned by America…but on the other hand…
There ARE very loud sirens going off near Tel Aviv!!!! (or is it a car’s anti-theft alarm????) Hey! hearing loss is no joking matter!!! (Why else do you think Netenyahu and Kerry want “quiet” in the occupied territories??
Some people seem to be under the impression that if Hamas has in fact hidden weapons in a UNRWA school (which has not been demonstrated) this justifies shelling the school. I’m quite sure there are civilized ways to go about making sure UNRWA schools are not being used for that purpose.
The MSM implies this and people just repeat what they hear. They don’t have to think. At times like this you realize what a propaganda machine is.
A “stopthewarcoalition” handy guide:
Israel explains to the media the killing of civilians in Gaza
We haven’t heard reports of deaths, will check into it.
The people were killed, but by a faulty Palestinian rocket/bomb.
Ok we killed them, but they were terrorists.
Ok they were civilians, but they were being used as human shields.
Ok there were no fighters in the area, so it was our mistake. But we kill civilians by accident, they do it on purpose.
Ok we kill far more civilians than they do, but look at how terrible other countries are.
Why are you still talking about Israel? Are you some kind of anti-Semite?
Repeat from step 1. Test this against the next interview you hear or watch by Mark Regev or any other spokesperson for Israel.
http://stopwar.org.uk/news/at-last-israel-tells-the-truth-about-why-there-s-so-much-bloodshed-in-gaza
That, and the booby-trapped toasters. Also, don’t you know all cement that enters Gaza has been used to build tunnels?
Not only cement, Israel has at least in the past, had to ban pasta:
– “However, an incident occured last week at a crossing into the Gaza Strip that gave a very different impression to a senior observer. When Senator John Kerry visited the Strip, he learned that many trucks loaded with pasta were not permitted in. When the chairman of the Senate Foreign Affairs Committee inquired as to the reason for the delay, he was told by United Nations aid officials that “Israel does not define pasta as part of humanitarian aid – only rice shipments.” ”
http://blog.foreignpolicy.com/posts/2009/02/25/israel_denied_pasta_to_gaza
But Israel doesn’t intentionally ban things like pasta, whereas Hamas deliberately uses chocolate eclairs against diabetic israeli civilians.
Chomsky on BDS, one state, two states, what supporting Israel means, etc. This was recorded long before the latest crisis.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0t7w_Dtrv0
Until the lobbies – munitions, banking, Israeli and others – are utterly crushed there will never be a satisfactory solution to the problem described in this article. The ruling class must be dispossessed unapologetically. It can be no other way if Americans are ever to recover control of their government and experience the chance at authentic democracy. One sees the pernicious effect of corruption particularly well when ownership of our institutions truly belongs to foreign governments and large corporations as it does today. This ownership must be wrested from these filth at all costs.
Just to shove down the throat of all you Israeli sockpuppets, shills and propaganda slugs…eat this you scumbags…
http://tinyurl.com/kmsgz8q
@ chronicle:
Seconded.
I can’t look too long, I get too choked up. I have a 3 month old daughter.
Does Israel think it EVER deserves peace from the relatives of all the children’s lives it is taking?
I know myself if it were my kid they would have to kill me to stop me from seeking revenge.
This one is priceless: Mark Steel explains how we misunderstand Israel.
http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/comment/how-silly-of-me-to-assume-it-was-israeli-bombs-causing-all-the-damage-in-gaza-9640905.html
How does Michael Oren know about those booby trapped toasters? I bet it was NSA that told him.
The booby-trapped toasters narrative has to be the sorriest excuse concocted yet. It’s an insult to everyone’s intelligence.
I hate to say it but, having just watched Glenn Greenwald’s formidable interview on all this @ Huff Post, I fear he will by now have become, overnight, a prospective target not just of the CIA/NSA & GCHQ, etc. but also, vindictively, of Mossad — and especially because, unlike some 85% or 95% of Israel’s population who support and advocate the de facto genocide going down right now in Gaza, he is a righteous and honorable jew. In other words, then, just the kind of jew commonly branded a self-hating anti-semitic jew by rabid chauvinist nazionists in Izzis4rael?. —– The problem for the USA and Israel (also, come to that, for the UK and other of the 5 Eyes countries) is that, ever more, by always standing on principle; by virtue of his manifest erudition; and in virtue of his unparalleled rhetorical skills, Greenwald with his high-profile mass-media presence has earned for himself (and continues to do so ever more with all of the even half-intelligent) a credibility and moral authority unrivaled by presidents, prime-ministers, and all their political cronies: Obama, Kerry, Hillary, Netanyahweh, Camoron, Merkel, Hollande, etc.. —- Both America and Israel were born by the gun, and the way things are going both will likely perish by the gun. I hope and trust that, in the meantime, Greenwald will know how to stay well out of harm’s way — and to beware of vindictive, heavily disguised Mossad agents dispatched to Rio and perhaps to any number of foreign locations where he is scheduled to speak. — My sincere apologies for this paranoia, which after all might not be so paranoid.
I’m paranoid about his safety too. But I think what will save him is precisely his high profile stature. It would be too blatant and raw a display of the inherent savagery and barbarism of all these governments that publicly portray themselves as civilized.
Here’s the link: Greenwald on HuffPost Live
Glenn is relatively high profile, and of course nakedly outspoken, but there is nothing to be gained by trying to close him down in whatever ways the power structures might dream up. There are many who are now boldly speaking out. Those numbers will grow and so will the secrets be uncovered. Also, as Glenn noted towards the end of that interview, what we are seeing on twitter and other social media about the barbaric acts of Israel is nothing like we’ve been able to see in real time before. That is going to continue and it is going to grow and grow in effect.
Thanks for posting the link, Kitt. It was an excellent interview.
Your concerns are legitimate but Mr. Greenwald has probably weighed the risks carefully. There is a point at which even the threat of death does not override the cause for justice. It is precisely this cognitive decision on his part which is worthy of respect.
I wish him safety and best outcomes for his concentrated endeavors.
Is a life spent cowering in fear really worth living?
“Security is mostly a superstition. It does not exist in nature, nor do the children of men as a whole experience it. Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. Life is either a daring adventure, or nothing.”
— Helen Keller, The Open Door (1957).
So much thanks for these lines of Helen Keller. Yeah, right on.
@ Paul E. “Marbux” Merrell, J.D.:
“Is a life spent cowering in fear really worth living?”
In my humble opinion; no.
A life spent cowering in fear is a wasted effort of the soul journey and results only in spirit deprivation.
Thanks.
This should be interesting:
-“Sophie Tal, 23, is a history student at the Hebrew University of Jerusalem. She has two brothers and a boyfriend serving in the Israeli army and explains why she thinks hospitals and UN shelters are legitimate targets for Israeli rockets.”
http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/world-28630442
Israel has killed well over 300 kids in a month. Guess who the White House called “barbaric?”
https://twitter.com/MaxBlumenthal/status/496160882187988992
Kol hakavod, USA! One of the best uses our tax dollars have ever been put to, if you ask me. And as to the sharing of intelligence data, it doesn’t bother me nearly as much as the collecting of it in the first place. I’d trust Mossad and Shin Bet with it way before I would the NSA or CIA.
Typo?
> One newly disclosed top secret NSA document, dated April 13, 2013 . . .
The link immediately following goes to a document dated April 19.
OK, this is funny,
-“The toll Gaza’s war takes on mental health
We want Israel to win, but thoughts of wounded Palestinians keep us up at night. We blame Hamas, but know they were Israeli shells. What’s driving us mad and how do we cope? This British psychiatrist explains.”
http://www.haaretz.com/jewish-world/jewish-world-opinions/.premium-1.608704
The Israeli massacre of civilians in Gaza is taking a toll. on…..Israeli mental health (poor dears)
It is one of a series of articles including one by Joseph Stalin entitled “I’m the victim here!!”
I remember that article by Stalin. What I don’t remember is if he had psychiatrists to help him cope.
You know how I know that Israel doesn’t really care about the welfare of civilians as they claim, beyond the atrocities that are being committed? If they did care, a simple thing they could do is allow some of the people of Gaza to cross into Israel, and take them in as refugees, at least temporarily. If security is a concern, something they could easily do is take in children, their mothers, the elderly and the disabled.
Reality is that Israel is a country that has about 50,000 asylum seekers (called “infiltrators” in Israel), and only about 200 people have been granted refugee status in the last half century. The Israeli government wants to expel the rest. I can name poor countries that have granted refugee status to tens or hundreds of thousands of foreigners for humanitarian reasons that aren’t nearly as bad as what people are experiencing in Gaza.
When Israel allowed Palestinians to freely travel into Israel (mostly for work) thousands of Israelis lost their lives to suicide bombers and other forms of murderous attack, so they stopped allowing palestinians to enter without being rigorously searched and identified, and they certainly didnt allow them to freely immigrate. Seems pretty sensible to me. Now why should it be israel , whom the representative palistinian “governments” have sworn to destroy, who accepts these immigrants ? Eygypt shares a border with gaza. Why have they closed that border and why dont they accept any palestinian immigrants? The fact is that over 60 years NO arab country has accepted ANY palestinian immigrants. Why is that ? Instead palestinians have been killed in large quantities by arab governments. 40,000 by Jordan when Yassar Arafat tried to take over. Israel on the other hand has accepted 800,000 or so refugees from arab lands (jews , almost all of whom have been expelled from almost every arab country).
Thousands of Israelis lost their lives? Really? Source? Actually more like around 100 in 30 years.
As for the feared Hammas rockets–they have killed 17 people in 5 years. More Israelis die from chocking on Falafel or slipping in the tub than from “terror” attacks.
Thousands……well according to Wikipedia (while not error free, certainly a much better source than a guy who posts on a website) there have been 804 fatalities resulting from suicide bombings in Israel between 1989 and 2008.
Should one bother checking the rest of your numbers?
Couldn’t resist, I’m weak.
So, according to mr burns – citing nothing in support – “NO arab country has accepted ANY palestinian immigrants”.
I guess mr burns better get over to Wikipedia to do some editing and submitting, because they are under the mistaken belief that Jordan has 1,951,603 Palestinian refugees, Syria 472,109 and Lebanon 425,640.
Again, why the ceaseless blotting out of names of individuals personally involved in and responsible for these crimes? It’s as if GG/Intercept believe that the good “folks” in Maryland or Washington deserve a pass because they’re merely mid- or low-level instead of senior figures.
Take names, publish them, hold feet to the fire.
Couldn’t agree more with the author(s). Recently screened the film Charlie Wilson’s War for a second time to review another case of Israel getting involved in arms distribution. In that case it was channeling captured Soviet arms to the mujaheddin, including Bin Ladin, with CIA assistance. Gunboat Diplomacy or power projection always seems to come back to haunt the nations that try and get away with it. As John Lennon advised, “Instant Karma’s gonna get you Gonna knock you right in the head…”
Somebody sure knows how to stir up the inflammatory troll syndrome…
I understand that’s not any goal of this piece, Mr. Glenn, but it also convinces your analysis hit home.
The case for the prosecution. On point here inasmuch as aiding and abetting can bring in more defendants, beyond the principal ones.
http://www.salon.com/2014/08/04/they_were_war_crimes_the_specific_legal_case_for_international_charges_against_israel/
@coram nobis:
In my opinion, this is very important post. These war crimes are Internationally recognized. Unfortunately, many of the people commenting on this thread choose to overlook the simple facts. Israel is committing war crimes and the United States is acting in clear collusion. What more needs to be said?
The Israelis are frustrated now because they fully expected all Palestinians to be gone by this time. After making life unbearable in Gaza they don’t understand
why the Palestinians don’t just leave. I think this is the reason why they are talking
about concentration camps and genocide
in the knesset. The only thing standing in
their way now is Obama’s broken heart and
he’ll be gone in two years.
– “The Israelis are frustrated”
Can you blame them!!..listen, It all stems from America with its slavery problem, by all rights if the Blacks in America had wanted their rights, they should have gone to Africa, there were plenty of countries with Blacks already! While there’s only one America!!
By giving citizenship to Blacks, even ones that had lived for generations in America, America’s example only encourages others to fight for thier freedom
That is why Palestinians who have lived for generations in what is now Israel, and in Gaza and the West Bank, have gotten it in their heads that they have rights…instead of peacefully relocating somewhere else that is Muslim or Christian and letting Jewish immigrants from London and New York have their land!!!
Same goes for South Africa. White South Africans didn’t ask Black South Africans to be born in South Africa! Instead of demanding the vote in the country in which they live, why didn’t they go to one of the many countries that were already ruled by blacks!!!
Instead they listened to this guy:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nW_JuwG67PE
I truly hope this is sarcasm, but considering the level of insanity that Zionists regularly exhibit, it is hard to tell parody from reality…
Yes, he’s kidding. Most of his comments are this way. :D
Oh good.
Nearly all Gazans just can’t leave, because Israel and its accomplice, Egypt, won’t let them. So they are trapped. Israel understands PR matters, so I’m not sure what the strategy can possibly be. Certainly not a huge humanitarian crisis. They don’t want a 1-state solution, a 2-state solution or a 3-state solution. That’s why commentators in Israel are openly talking about forced relocation (ethnic cleansing) and even genocide.
I understand what you are saying. What the Israelis want is for the international community to step in and begin evacuations.
I suppose. Egypt could theoretically start taking in people as refugees, but I don’t believe they want that. If things get really bad, other countries might start to offer asylum to Gazans, and maybe that’s the end game. Venezuela already said it’s willing to take care of Gazan orphans.
In 1982 after the the siege of Beirut, thousands of PLO adherents were evacuated to Tunisia. Maybe Israel is hoping this will be the solution again. Hell of a way to go about it, though. And unlikely to be ultimately successful now any more than it was then.
This is why you have the deputy speaker of the knesset and other Israeli MP’s talking about genocide. It’s meant to spur the international community into action. As much to say, “Get these people out of here or we ‘re going to commit genocide.” This is the first time the world has been given such notice. It makes Israel the most moral nation in the world.
After reading Greenwald’s article, I realized I had to choose which narrative was more accurate: belief in Santa Clause, belief in vampires, belief in ghosts, or belief that that there may have been a tiny speck of neutrality in his presentation. Since I don’t have a microscope that powerful, that leaves the first three as more likely.
Try this article for some sanity:
http://www.strategypage.com/qnd/israel/articles/20140801.aspx
Great article Dave! Although it is missing a couple of things, which I may have missed. First, there is no attribution, so who wrote it? I find knowing who the author of an article is helpful in being able to do a little critical analysis. Also, there are no sources cited. None. Again, there is a generally accepted notion among journalists – so I’m told – that is is important to back up claims made – particularly true when dealing with historical events – with a source of some kind, Otherwise, it could all be, you know, like just made up, right? Kinda like stories that promote belief in vampires, ghosts etc.
Another thing occured to me…On the BDS movement. In light of Israel’s bombing of a University in Gaza, what if any effect does this have on those that are opposed to BDS. Will we still have to hear Israeli spokespeople talk about how immoral it is for the BDS movement to target schools?
July 23 (Bloomberg) –- Palestinian BDS Movement Co-Founder Omar Barghouti discusses launching his campaign for the most effective, non-violent ways to support Gaza through boycotts, divestment and sanctions against Israel. He speaks to Mark Barton on Bloomberg Television’s “Countdown.” (Source: Bloomberg)
http://www.bloomberg.com/video/everyone-in-gaza-supports-bds-movement-barghouti-V7loF89qRJK954Jh~TyflA.html
The issue is not what Israel has done for us, but what they will do for us in the future. Israel is an unsinkable US aircraft carrier in a sea of jihadists. The day is coming when that asset will be of enormous value to us.
Definitely agree, this is one of the most logical posts I’ve seen on this subject.
Great analogy, since an air craft carrier is NOT a defensive weapon, but a weapon used to project war. So, support for Israel is support for the US in perpetual war.
The NSA surveillance program initiated by President Reagan, our GE sponsored president, was conducted as in this case with great secrecy. How can voters vote intelligently for political candidates when this type of information is private. How can Edward Snowden be called a traitor for telling the truth. Glen Greenwald’s work is consistent with earlier muckrakers that exposed blatant government corporate abuses as in “The Octopus” and “The Jungle.” This work helps explain why President Obama vetoed UN criticism of the Jewish settlements on land that is part of Palestine. Jon Stewart ‘s talk on our generous gifts of armaments is fueling war as in this case explains a lot. What has been exposed by the truth might need further investigating and exposure. “Truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth” is good.
The reason the US leans over backwards to assist the Israeli rogue state is that they are being blackmailed. The Israeli’s have been playing with nuclear weapons since the early 1970’s. They sold nucs to PW Botha back then to keep the blacks in check in South Africa. During that period and into the present era they have had virtually no visa restrictions and free passage into the US and other UN allied nations. They used this access to plant remote controlled nuclear bombs in all the major cities of the western nations. The still maintain the remote control of these hidden bombs. No matter what good intentions a western leader might entertain when they gain office and seek to exercise their newly found influence they are immediately informed of the Israeli hidden bombs and the blackmail continues. There can be no other reason why leader after leader all cave-in hen they assume office. This is the real problem that the Israeli Jews seem unstoppable. It is hard to wrap your heads around this but that’s whats going on and there is no stopping the heartless Jews of Israel and their agents in the US congress and the AIPAC-JDL monsters in the dual citizen Jewish enclaves of the Western world. They will win this easily just as they have for the past 60 plus years. They are not human. They never make mistakes and they will stop at nothing to exercise their power. Consider yourselves all blackmailed. Checkmate.
As a Canadian I am very disappointed in our governments strong stance of one side is not very Canadian. We should be pushing for peace not violence, we were once regarded as great peacekeepers and we should be trying to broker a real peace process. The problem is brokering a real truce would mean Israel having to probably return some of the land it has taken since 1947, and Israel won’t like it but if they truly want to attempt peace this should be attempted.
Peace
NYT – JERUSALEM — Minutes after Israel began a unilateral and partial cease-fire in Gaza on Monday, the air force struck a house in the Shati refugee camp in Gaza City, killing a girl, 8, and wounding at least 29 others.
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/05/world/middleeast/israel-gaza.html?_r=0
I think “cease-fire” will have to be added as a new chapter next to “terrorism” in Obama’s/Netenyahu’s co-written upcoming new book: “how to make no sense whatsoever while spinning madly” released by neo-con press!!
…no , hold on there is precedent for this…I found a article from the NYT in the early days of WWII:
“Despite the advance of Panzer brigades across Europe, Hitler’s declared unilateral and partial ceasefire, has been confirmed! Not a single German shot has been fired anywhere except where there were, well, Germans shooting!!!”
“But even as the NSA and its partners are directed by political branches to feed the Israelis surveillance data and technology, they constantly characterize Israel as a threat – both to their own national security and more generally to regional peace”
What is consistently missing to explain this paradox is, the ‘Christian Dominion’ belief in literal Armageddon which rules at the Pentagon, backed by too many politicians and cohorts in DC to possibly begin to explain here, including Hillary Clinton, it’s not only right-wing nut jobs. Ever wonder how it is Hillary never met a conflict she did not like? Try googling ‘hillary clinton, doug coe’ after you’ve watched this video (beginning at minute 10:45)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N-a7AYQblig
^ “the prevalence in the military of “Dominionism,” the radical Evangelical Christian theology that anticipates the imminent return of Jesus Christ, and why the fight for religious freedom within the military may be all that stands between us and global nuclear destruction” (‘Young Turks’ promo)
The video explains quite a bit more; Hitler controlled Germany with 8% of his military dedicated NAZIs. The present day USA military is estimated at 28-35% extreme Christian right wing personalities, especially concentrated in the Air Force, and special operations commanders at the Pentagon, essentially people who embrace ‘pre-millennial’ literal Armageddon theology.
And yeah, they have custody of the world’s most lethal arsenal, and feed the conflict in the middle east with tears of joy at prayer meetings, seeing themselves as ‘God’s new chosen’ while anticipating blowing up the world to see the return of Jesus.
Think that’s far fetched? Like I heard a Black woman comedian (I don’t recall her name) “Denial ain’t just a river in Egypt”
I’ve said it here before: “God’s chosen is a dumb idea”
http://ronaldthomaswest.com/2013/05/14/gods-chosen-a-dumb-idea/
^ A sort of ‘nutshell’ version of events
Yup….A really dumb idea.
A really popular dumb idea. Everyone thinks god is on their side.
That segment of the Christian community is cannon fodder for the Jewish lobby.
Actually, that section of the Christian community is a pillar of practical Zionism, insures funds and military assistance to Israel, and is a point among the spears behind the push for ‘Greater Israel.’ Why? It’s in their theology AND the Israeli’s milk any source of practical support, no matter how depraved or alien to their long term interest
@ Ronald Thomas West:
Glad that you keep trying to expose the Christian Zionists/Nazi’s. I commend your efforts.
You mean the shills that have taught Evangelical Christians that Jews are the chosen ones when Christ so clearly calls them murderers of the prophets (matthew 23:27-35) and children of the devil (john 8:44-48) – Evangelical Christians have been Judaized. They are no longer Christians because they do not understand the words of the Savior.
@ Heidi
So, you believe you are a ‘new Jew’ like mental whack-job (and super-zionist) Ann Coulter? I wrote ‘God’s Chosen is a Dumb Idea” to describe criminal mentalities such as that, it’s worth a read ;)
But perhaps more important for you to know (I’m not holding my breath you’ll be in love with this) is:
The Five Gospels: The Search for the Authentic Words of Jesus. New York: MacMillan Publishing Company, 1993.
“For Paul, the Christ was to be understood as a dying/rising lord, symbolized in baptism (buried with him, raised with him), of the type he knew from the hellenistic [Greek] mystery religions. In Paul’s theological scheme, Jesus the man played no essential role.”
“Eighty-two percent of the words ascribed to Jesus in the gospels were not actually spoken by him, according to the Jesus Seminar.” Page 5
“The church appears to smother the historical Jesus by superimposing this heavenly figure on him in the creed: Jesus is displaced by the Christ, as the so-called Apostle’s Creed makes evident.” Page 7
“The first step is to understand the diminished role the Gospel of John plays in the search for the Jesus of history. The two pictures painted by John and the synoptic [Matthew, Mark, Luke] gospels cannot both be historically accurate.” Page 10
“The Fellows of the Seminar were unable to find a single saying [in John] they could with certainty trace back to the historical Jesus.” Page 10
“The words attributed to Jesus in the Fourth Gospel.. ..are the creation of the evangelist for the most part..” Page 10
“Words borrowed from the fund of common lore or the Greek scriptures are often put on the lips of Jesus.” Page 22
“The evangelists frequently attribute their own statements to Jesus.” Page 23
“We know that the evangelists not infrequently ascribed Christian words to Jesus-they made him talk like a Christian, when, in fact, he was only the precursor of the movement that was to take him as its cultic hero.” Page 29
“Jesus rarely makes pronouncements or speaks about himself in the first person. Jesus makes no claim to be the Anointed, the messiah.” Page 32
“Jesus taught that the last will be first and the first will be last. He admonished his followers to be servants of everyone. He urged humility as the cardinal virtue by both word and example. Given these terms, it is difficult to imagine Jesus making claims for himself-I am the son of God, I am the expected One, the Anointed-unless, of course, he thought that nothing he said applied to himself.” Page 33
“I never said most of the things I said.” -Yogi Berra
It’s “My daddy says” shite like this that makes me avoid church people.
Didn’t help that the church bells that made my mother mad were forged for Hitler. I’m not shitting you, Daily Mail would love to learn their location, but it’s mine to play wit. Beside the White Friar’s Black Lagoon where once I’d sit inside a topless Cistercian choir tower begging time to take me away from my 1970s malaise. “Those were the days….”
That’s how confident I am GCHQ can’t figure out my shite. Oh, yeah, they cover for Dacre, too!
Today, Evangelicals have use of the building, built to code as prescribed by NS diatribes. I got video, but it’s so frapping creepy I don’t want to show it around.
You are wrong. Everyone with credibility knows the Christian Zionist are cannon fodder/useful idiots.
Just as useful as people of the Jewish religion. Religion itself is a spiritual control mechanism. When you couple it with political and economic control the end result is total control which is the ultimate Zionist/Nazi objective.
There is no “Jewish lobby.”
@ Gator90:
Exactly. People of the Jewish faith just get blamed for it.
There is no “Jewish lobby.” – Gator90
The American Israel Public Affairs Committee (AIPAC)
Pro-Israel Political Action Committees (PACs)
Conference of Presidents of Major American Jewish Organizations
The American Israel Education Foundation (AIEF)
The Washington Institute for Near East Policy (WINEP)
Anti-Defamation League (ADL)
International Fellowship of Christians and Jews (aka Stand for Israel)
Christians United for Israel (CUFI)
Simon Wiesenthal Center
The Israel Project
Friends of the Israeli Defense Forces (FIDF)
Hadassah (Women’s Zionist Organization of America)
America’s Voices in Israel (AVI)
The Jewish Agency for Israel
Stand with Us
Emergency Committee for Israel (ECI)
Jewish Community Relations Councils, Jewish Federations,Hillels
Organizations that target students and youth:
Hillel
Birthright
David Project
Amcha Initiative
Young Israel
Jewish Council for Public Affairs
Jewish National Federation (JNF)
Zionist Organiation of America (ZOA)
American Jewish Committee (AJC)
World Jewish Congress
Friends of Aish Hatorah
Chabad
Republican Jewish Coalition
National Jewish Democratic Council
Foundation for Defense of Democracies
JINSA
Saban Center at Brookings
Center for Security Policy, neo-con brain center
Foreign Policy Initiative (PNAC 2.0)
MEMRI
1 BlackRock US $3,560 trillion
2 UBS Switzerland $2,280 trillion
3 Allianz Germany $2,213 trillion
4 Vanguard Group US $2,080 trillion
5 State Street Global Advisors (SSgA) US $1,908
6 PIMCO (Pacific Investment Management Company) US $1,820 trillion
7 Fidelity Investments US $1,576 trillion
8 AXA Group France $1,393 trillion
9 JPMorgan Asset Management US $1,347 trillion
10 Credit Suisse Switzerland $1,279 trillion
11 BNY Mellon Asset Management US $1,299 trillion
12 HSBC UK $1,230 trillion
13 Deutsche Bank Germany $1,227 trillion
These are the controllers.
Sure there are all of these lobbies but they do not constitute a ‘Jewish’ lobby. Neither does ‘J Street’ (opposed to these groups agenda) constitute a ‘Jewish’ lobby. ‘Zionist lobby’ might fit your list but Jews do not neatly fit, there is too much diversity. ‘Jewish lobby’ cannot conflate Tikkun Olam and the Hasidics in the West Bank, it just doesn’t work, they are largely mutually exclusive philosophies on a political (lobby) level. And how do the Christian Zionists incorporated into AIPAC meet the ‘Jewish lobby’ criteria? Because they consider themselves ‘New Jews’?
Btw, the video link posted in the original comment feature a prominent Jew, Mikey Weinstein, who is perhaps radical right Christian Zionism’s (and by extension, AIPAC’s) most dangerous opponent
‘Jewish lobby’ is a simplistic, inaccurate term, perhaps best personified by anti-Semitic personalities who hold fantasies of Illuminati.
DSP, you have too much time on your hands.
With that said, of course there are organizations, consisting largely or wholly of Jews, that lobby for US support of Israel. Most Jews, however, are not members of these organizations. The organizations’ members comprise a very small fraction of the American Jewish population. These groups do not represent or speak for all Jews by any stretch of the imagination. To insist on using the term “Jewish lobby” in the face of these fairly obvious facts is, well, weird.
Nobody said the “Jewish lobby” represents all Jews. There is no single “environmental lobby,” “Catholic lobby” or for that matter “defense lobby” either. But there is a definite general class of lobbyists that purport to do their lobbying in support of Israel (whatever that means to them), and I see no problem referring to them collectively as “the Jewish lobby.” Maybe you’d prefer “the Israel lobby.” Either terms works for me.
@ liberalrob
Jews and Israel are distinct things. The 70+ percent of American Jews that believe a Palestinian state should be based on the pre-1967 borders (J Street poll) can hardly be defined as part of the ‘Jewish lobby’ as many people would interpret the term in pro-aggressive sense of Israeli policy. It is simplistic and misleading to use the general term “Jewish” in regards to ‘lobby’ & ‘Israel’ because the term “Jewish” is altogether too disparate to jam into one mold and portray a community’s ideas and differences accurately. It is this error or negative communication phenomena lends power to stereotype (my opinion)
@liberalrob:
“Israel lobby” has the virtue of accurately referring to the focus of the lobby’s endeavors. “Jewish lobby” is accurate only in that it identifies the religious affiliation of many (though by no means all) of the individuals comprising the lobby.
Suppose some Americans started forming organizations to oppose US aid to Israel, and many, but not all, of the people in these groups were Arab-American Muslims. Would you call this the “Islamic lobby”? Would you refer to Christian groups lobbying for abortion restrictions as the “Christian lobby”? Of course you wouldn’t. So how is this different?
According to Wikipedia ‘Jewish Lobby’ is an alternate name for ‘Zionist Lobby’, or ‘Israel Lobby’.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel_lobby_in_the_United_States
Trust wikipedia at your peril
http://ronaldthomaswest.com/2014/04/05/intelligence-agencies-wikipedia-2/
^ Sort of like trusting the CIA world facts book on Syria ;)
Well shit, if Wikipedia says so… Who am I to argue with Wikipedia?
This is a perfect companion piece to Chris Hedges’ blog in TruthDig today. Glenn provides the documentation and governmental background while Chris gets to the actual heart of Israel’s actions and the reasons behind them. Please, please read this VERY important piece: http://www.truthdig.com/report/page2/why_israel_lies_20140803
As Hedges writes: “Israel engages in the kinds of jaw-dropping lies that characterize despotic and totalitarian regimes. It does not deform the truth; it inverts it. It routinely paints a picture for the outside world that is diametrically opposed to reality. And all of us reporters who have covered the occupied territories have run into Israel’s Alice-in-Wonderland narratives, which we dutifully insert into our stories—required under the rules of American journalism—although we know they are untrue.”
THANK YOU Glenn Greenwald and Chris Hedges for fearlessly speaking truth to power!!
You know, I sometimes wonder if our biggest relative advantage in the Western world thus far has been the particular type of Theory Of Mind that springs from a Christian-dominant mindset. The shadow side to “love your enemy” is “know your enemy”, as it’s impossible to truly understand something that you hate. And while I think Hedges makes some interesting points here, he doesn’t seem to see that he falls right back into the same kind of dualistic thinking he describes. When he thinks people need to see The Truth, he thinks they need to see His Point Of View. This kind of thinking drives me crazy, because it shuts down productive debate. I recently saw Sam Harris refused to debate Scott Atran, because he thinks Atran is dishonest in his views. Nothing I have seen about Atran leads me to believe he is dishonest, nothing I have seen about Harris leads me to believe he lies about other people – so I assume this is a case of “Your views and perspective make so little sense to me, that the only explanation that does make sense is that you must be lying or speaking in bad faith”. Like the old face-vase illusion, or dancer illusion – look, if you don’t see a face here, you must be crazy. I think we do this all the time, because the slice of subjective reality we can ‘see’ is so limited, and we don’t take other people’s word for it that there is more out there. (I don’t think Greenwald particularly does this – he gives the impression of someone who argues one side but usually knows quite well how the other side thinks. Unless he feels particularly uncharitably towards them. I will not look to him for insightful analysis on British Lords anytime soon.)
I think another mistake has been stealing the Palestinians land with all the illegal settlements and holding these people in a giant prison. In fact I think this whole war is about an intended land grab by the
israel’s. American tax dollars funding it to the tune of 10 million a day while our infrastructure rots unattended. I am amazed how many of my fellow Americans swallow the propaganda pumped out of the corporate press.
How can I possibly process the content of this article when it was released at the same time as a NYTimes profile wherein Glenn is being smooched by fuzzy dogs? Was this deliberate manipulation on the part of Greenwald? Perhaps, but if so, it backfired, because the field of squee is so huge that I now want to snuggle everyone referenced in this entire article. C’mere Glenn, Corey Robin, Obama, Netanyahu, Snowden, Ken Roth, Andrew Fishman, Kevin Drum, Lior Mizrahi, President Lyndon Johnson and Israeli Prime Minister Levi Eshkol, in no particular order, there needs to be a group hug right about now.
I’m confused about the 2007 Strategic Mission List – is this a document that has been released, or no? I think what exactly led to the things discussed in this article (Israel as a leading FIS threat, etc.) are important. I’d need some context on that before I can comment.
As to the ‘throwing up of the hands’ in regard to Israel Palestine. Well (I feel like I’m at confession or something… slides open wooden door…) I have to say I get it. It is nice to take a moral high ground stance, or, if that’s not possible, at least a ‘tut tut, people in that culturally foreign and very far away place need to learn to get along’ removed stance. But the situation of Israel is like one of those ethical conundrums they give you about throwing people in front of trolleys – no answer will let you go home feeling good about yourself. It’s either “Yes, the Israeli’s have to accept some death and destruction of their people for the sake of living up to a democratic ideal”, or, “Yes, the Palestinians have to accept some oppression and death and destruction for the sake of Israeli safety”. Who wants to point a finger and say “You – I choose death for you. Woo hoo, glad that’s done, now, how about that new Kardashian app, huh? Maybe we should debate whether or not it’s right for them to be famous. Now there’s a good moral conundrum. I mean, what do they do for a living, really, huh, am I right or am I right? But then again, what with the free market… ok, this might be a long talk, so, which side do you…”
Would that I could rip out every tree I bought for Israel in 1949 with my bare hands.
Israel makes Germany seem like gentlemen. All aid should be stopped. The Kool-aid narratives we are supposed to swallow is insulting and gut- wrenching. I weep for the Palestinians and our choice of friends. As a retired RN,wish I were there to help in Gaza
It’s been a long time since the USG (not US citizens) did anything out of goodness so I
think it can be taken for granted that Israel
is needed for strategic reasons. As for the
general population our relationship with
Israel is so enmeshed in religious absurdities as to make a rational approach
to the I/P conflict impossible.
If you google Max Blumenthal on YouTube
you can find a video of a conference he attended hosted by the Rev. James Haggie
having to do with American/Israeli relations. It’s quite an eye opener.
There is nothing special about Israel. Their own ancient history (Exodus 15:14) disputes their claim to Palestine which they invaded during old biblical times when that land was know as Palestina.
It has been the intent of Zionist before WW I to claim all of that land for “Jews only.”
Nor would the United States be interested in it all except for Middle East oil; “our oil.”
Obama is just another complicit president passing through nor will the next president be any different when it comes to the rights of the Palestinians.
Israel controls the American government and most of our Congress are too stupid to see it.
I thought it was Philistia but it doesn’t really matter. The fact is that our major ally in the region with whom we have longstanding ties is engaging in ethnic cleansing and possibly war crimes. Our capacity for moral suasion stands on shaky ground at best thanks to our own ignominious recent history, and in fact seems increasingly ironic and ineffectual. We intervened in Kosovo because of crap like this, when it was the loathed Milosevic-led Yugoslavia doing the cleansing, but we can’t seem to bring ourselves to do it when it’s our ally on the other side.
I think the Israeli far right is in need of a lesson on just what their situation is. Netanyahu is alleged to have said that we are not to question him again when it comes to dealing with the Palestinians. If true, that’s an amazing thing to say to the nation that has supported and helped guarantee your nation’s existence amidst a sea of enemies who you claim would like nothing better than to extirpate it (and you individually). “Biting the hand that feeds you” is not a recipe for success, I would think.
But the subjects of this reporting will most likely never make it into the mainstream media and so the American public will remain ignorant, ill informed, and manipulated into believing that the US is an innocent bystander in the gruesome deaths of 10’s of 1000’s of civilians including women and children. America has got to be one of the most propagandized populations in the world nowadays.
Two pages! haha and super gay Glen said the Snowden material on Israel wouldn’t be what we thought… Jews and money isn’t what he thought we’d expect? hahaha. Politicians lying? hypocrites? The weapons are made in merica? hahaha this is all crap even for a homo in the jungle I expected better. No wonder the CIA doesn’t bother to send someone down there to cut your dick sucking throat. You’re someones tool or part of some bs.
Ola Glenn, como vai rapaz? Faz tempo, desde os dias de Salon.
Liked your article – your premise about allies having a part or being complicit in Israel’s aggression against its enemies states the obvious.
It seems you assume partnering with an ally is improper whether it is sharing intelligence or supplying munitions – not sure why these actions bother you.
So just what exactly is it that Israel has done for us? I mean except for taking our money.
The issue of Israel’s creation and survival is not important to the United States so much as it is important to the dominant political parties in the United States. Constant references to Israel, the Holocaust, security, and “America’s ally in the Middle East” are ways of keeping a strategic bloc of high median income voters fearful and susceptible to appeals for political support. This configuration was foreshadowed during the Wilson presidency – see Brandeis, Untermeyer, Balfour – but Harry Truman permanently tied America’s destiny to that of Israel in return for the New York electoral college vote and cash in 1948.
Israel wears the target that will pass to the US once Israel ceases to exist – so say some.
Others say supporting Israel puts God on our side – “…he who blesses Israel I will bless…” thus says the Lord (paraphrased).
Maybe one might speculate Israel provides strategic advantage or excuse to US for intervention to protect our ally and sustain the MIC of Eisenhower’s warning – economic stimulation.
Pick your poison
Israel was a critical regional ally in the Cold War. Its service as a convenient destination for the persecuted Jews of Europe (and the Soviet Union) after WWII was also important. And until the Israeli far-right became as unhinged as our own, it seemed like it was on the way to a more-or-less peaceful resolution of this whole sordid affair. All that’s been scuppered now, though. Heckuva job, Bibi.
Also, some if not all of this has to be laid at the feet of the Bush Administration. One more idiotic policy decision among the many they made was to refuse to recognize Hamas as the duly-elected government of the Palestinian Territories. That gave Israel license to do the same. Like everything else those idiots did, that’s worked out well.
Hmm, this article, what comes to mind for me is what I understand to be the overriding reason America stockpiles weapons in Israel.. and the reason it is rarely talked about on TV (if ever).
America considers Israel to be its staging area, in the event of a major military struggle in the Middle East. That is the number one reason why American bombs and bullets are stored there. As powerful as the Israeli lobby is, first and foremost, America looks after itself first.(just like any other country).
You will find weapons stockpiled in Germany and Japan too. What do they get out of it? reasurance that nearby powers (such as China/Russia) will be detered from a military attack. perhaps like what is happening in Ukraine.
Specifically, America has strategically valued its freedom of passage through the Suez canal, and access to all the oil in the area.
I mention all this, merely to point out that any honest discussion about what is happening in Gaza, and to Palestine, and to America’s military support of Israel, both in bullets and intelligence, must factor in America’s longstanding consensus position among the military planners that job one for America is keeping Israel as a reliable staging ground for a US troop buildup in preparation for a war against the potential adversaries such as Russia or Iran
consider:
-“Israel is not, of course, situated in some geographical backwater, but at the junction of paramount American interests. Its prominence on the eastern Mediterranean littoral, at the nexus of North Africa and Southwest Asia, has enabled the United States to minimize its military deployments in the area. In the Persian Gulf, by contrast, the absence of a dependable and sturdy ally like Israel has impelled the United States to commit hundreds of thousands of troops and trillions of dollars. Secretary of State Alexander M. Haig’s observation 30 years ago still resonates today: “Israel is the largest American aircraft carrier in the world that cannot be sunk, does not carry even one American soldier, and is located in a critical region for American national security.” ”
http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2011/04/25/the_ultimate_ally?page=0,0#sthash.s3RAvoXG.dpbs
In these terms, in the terms of America’s government, in the eyes of successive American presidents, including Obama, all the blown up schools, all the dead Palestinains, all the lip service given to the values of human rights and self determination and justice and peace,…these are merely public relations files that need to be handled so as to not endanger America’s strategic plans for Israel and the Middle East
And that goes for the UK as well, that is why after weeks of bombardment in Gaza, thousands of casualties later, we get this laughable story…Britain is going to have a look to see if any of the armaments it gave to Israel have been used:
-“Campaigners are most worried about £42m of arms export licences granted to 130 British companies, including two supplying components for the Hermes drone and one selling components for Israel’s main battle tank.”
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/04/uk-government-reviews-arms-sales-israel-gaza
Don’t worry, Britain!, just before they cross the border into Gaza, all the British parts pop off the Israeli drones and tanks (it’s only momentum that allows them to complete their missions!!!)
Good logic – liked your input
Israel as a US ammo dump? Where is the proof of this? Are there confirmed sitings of heavy US military shipping drawing from/replenishing this dump during the two Iraq wars?
What I have observed over the years are efforts to exaggerate how important Israel is to the US. Whenever I hear of something such as this, that is the first thing I think of.
War Reserves Stock Allies-Israel
War Reserves Stock Allies-Israel also known as War Reserve Stockpile Ammunition-Israel or simply WRSA-I was established in the 1990s and is maintained by the United States European Command.[2] It is one of the US’ biggest War Reserves, located within Israel.[3] Initially the WRSA-I stock had $100 million,[4] however prior to Operation Protective Edge had nearly $1 billion dollars worth of reserves,[5] with authorization to increase this up to $1.2 billion.[6] The stock includes ammunition, smart bombs, missiles, military vehicles and a military hospital with 500 beds, all spread around the country in 6 different locations.[7]
When needed, Israel can request to access the WRSA-I stock, which would then need to be approved by the US congress.[8] One such example is during Operation Protective Edge, the US authorized Israel to access 120mm mortar rounds and 40mm grenade launcher ammunition,[9] which were some of the older items in the stock, which would need to be replaced soon there after anyway.[10]
It is common knowledge among educated people.
Well, most common knowledge among people who think they are educated is seriously flawed.
So is it a real US ammo dump, or is its only purpose to boost Israel’s actual access to munitions well beyond the huge amounts that are common knowledge among educated people? Getting permission from the US Congress to use it is a given. There are only a handful who would ever vote no.
It is both.
Now we can mention the “Gorilla in the room” which is…
Does the US store nuclear munitions in Israel?
How much of the Israeli nuclear arsenal was attained from the United States?
Those are the real questions when a country seems pointed to ethnic cleansing with no seeming recourse.
Here’s one citation; the supply was ostensibly an emergency supply.
http://www.smh.com.au/world/us-restocks-israel-with-ammunition-as-it-condemns-attack-on-united-nations-school-20140731-zyv3w.html
However, they seem to be rotating the stock.
MIke Sulzer – “Israel as a US ammo dump? Where is the proof of this? … efforts to exaggerate how important Israel is to the US.”
Hi, Mike, well it’s been in the news this past week, Obama giving Netanyahu permission to dip into it, so I didn’t think I needed to put a link to that…try “google”
on your second point, I guess my point is that what is left unsaid about America’s real motivations explains WHY you may hear about how important Israel is to the US. in other terms, for example, instead you may hear about “Shared values” and all that crap. (Tell the dead Palestinians about those shared values)
And I find it notable that reporters/commentators on tv are loathe to talk about it in terms that you will find in “Foreign Policy” magazine, as I quoted, but it is nevertheless on those terms that the American government, from WWII onward has operated.
I agree. Had Israeli been a mere weapons dump, we would have staged for Desert Storm much more easily than using Saudi space.
Our relationship is, imo, based more on the need to control US Christians and, as an added attraction as a test bed for development of future weapons.
In either case, it is an un-holy alliance that portends nothing good for the world. One way or the other, it must stop NOW.
-“I agree. Had Israeli been a mere weapons dump, we would have staged for Desert Storm much more easily than using Saudi space. ”
Things aren’t always easy. In every US military attack in the Middle East, concern is raised about Israel being openly part of offensive operations (for ex. Israeli troops joining the “coalition of the willing” next to the ten guys from Poland or the British troops)
…and staging the Iraq attacks from Israel? looking at a map there seems to be the problem there of getting troops and planes out of Israel, past countries such as Jordan, to Iraq.
Jordan quietly granting overfly, base rights to US planes is one thing, but letting troops invade from Israel? That would be asking a lot from the monarchy.
Dam good to see you, Bill.
Yeah, Israel is no ‘mere’ weapons’ dump. … and, lord knows, there are some u.s. ‘Christians’ who believe the one&only road to the Second Coming runs through Israel!
*don’t mind me, I was just reading, slack-jawed, at the suggestion of some long-ago Foreign Policy-type ‘strategic’ value by killing all those poor people! … if that is so, we desperately need some new strategic planners.
You could simply google “u.s. ammunition gaza” and get a whole bunch of citations and images. I suppose this story will do for starters.
http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/us-confirms-it-resupplied-israel-weapons-during-gaza-conflict-1459128
I suppose that’s one method of inventory management.
And how about this image?
http://images.smh.com.au/2014/07/31/5640011/1406778101272.jpg-620×349.jpg
You’ll notice that the round is fixed, that is, that the projectile and the cartridge are ready-made. Field artillery ammunition tends to separate the fuze, projectile and propellant, so this appears to be a tank round, I’m guessing 105mm. The yellow diamonds are a standard U.S. marking, indicating that it’s a beehive antipersonnel round; the fuze can be rotated so it will burst at a set distance downrange in a spray of flechettes. Your tax dollars in action!
Israel is not really very useful as a staging area for wars in the Middle East. It wasn’t used at all in the Iraq war. The US has the fire power to establish a beachhead anywhere it needs to launch an invasion.
Israel is more useful as a demonstration of the efficacy of US armaments. Oil producing countries in the region, especially Saudi Arabia, sell their oil for dollars and then use them to buy American weapons. However, the US now has taken the initiative of launching its own wars to show off its arsenal and in addition, Israel has been undermining this model by building up its own arms industry, in some cases undercutting the US. So it is a less valuable strategic ally than formerly – hence the references in NSA documents to Israel as a potential adversary. There is an underlying tension developing between the Israeli and US administrations, which is evident if you follow the news – even if they don’t admit it publicly.
However, it’s a big world, and the strategy which has worked so well in the Middle East appears to have great promise in Africa, another resource rich region. It may even be possible to translate the model to the former Soviet Republics. So I think there will be plenty of business for everybody, and there is no need for close allies to squabble in such an unseemly fashion, especially since Israel is too small to make a big dint in global US arms sales.
Benito – “Israel has been undermining this model by building up its own arms industry, in some cases undercutting the US”
Good point Benito, but doesn’t all you’ve learned make you wish you had another crack at the Ehepia campaign??
For those that don’t know, the “Ehepia campaign” was the lesser known cousin to the “Ethiopian campaign”!!! ;)
The Italians won the Ethiopian campaign…
It wasn’t needed for that, as we already had adequate staging facilities much closer to hand in Kuwait and Saudi Arabia.
“I don’t like violence, Tom. I’m a businessman. Blood is bad for business.” -The Godfather
Strategic international relationships tend to remain stable (immovable) because national interests remain similar even when (or especially when) various parties change political leadership.
When a “rogue” regime (or indigenous political movement) threatens this stability, it must be eliminated — with an invasion as in Iraq, with a coup as in Egypt while Morsi was in power, and with active opposition when political opposition looks viable (wahabis in SA, ISUS in Syria/Iraq.)
Stifling political dissent in foreign regimes helps maintain an appearance of stability while actually fueling nationalist (and religious) opposition. People without a voice in their own destiny target and attack their (perceived) oppressors. Thus a smoldering war against the oppressed — otherwise known as the “war on terror” — develops, targeting indigenous political opposition.
From this perspective, from the perspective of an imperial power devoted to the maintenance of the status quo — cooperation among “friendly” regimes (especially among their State police services) makes good sense. Identify and isolate dissident movements in key States, marginalize and assassinate dissident leadership, and empower and arm compliant regimes. (with the added bonus of kickbacks of US taxpayers’ money to US defense industries supplying weapons and support in material and training.)
But what happens to countries where there’s no viable political opposition? (See Central American death squads and drug gangs.)
When States disallow or subvert viable and realistic political opposition, various foreseeable consequences follow.
Dissident politicval groups like Al-qaeda, religious nationalists (Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt, Ruhollah Khomeini in Iraq), ISUS, Hamas, the Taliban (in Pakistan) and desperate refugees fleeing the tyranny of war inevitably follow. This dynamic strengthens the police agencies in these compliant states — which generates more resistance which generates more overt repression which further strengthens police agencies … etc.
Chaos becomes the enemy and political orthodoxy becomes the demand. Stability at any cost!
Worse, the police agencies in our sponsoring “democracies” (like Britain, the US and Israel) increase their own domestic power and inevitably turn that power against their own citizens which opportunistic politicians parlay into greater power for themselves.
What happens next should be obvious.
Yes, but what of state sponsored terror? Each one of the groups you named has, at some point in time, received funding and/or training from western powers. For the sake of plausible deniability, the US routinely funnels aid through third-party intelligence agencies such as the Mossad, ISI, Mukhabarat, and Savak (to name a few), front companies, and/or NGOs.
Thsi is one of the most outstanding take-downs of the myriad Israeli spokespeople on tv news:
-“What a refreshing change from that tired old thinking that always blames murder on the murderer. Mister Drome, once a spokesman for the Israeli government, said the Israelis were “lured into a trap, now Hamas sheds crocodile tears about the dead”.
If only more of us understood bombed schools in this way. We always rush to judge some poor kid in an American town who mows down his classmates, without even pausing to consider the dead kids probably tricked him into it, and now to make it worse their parents are all pretending to cry.”
http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/comment/how-silly-of-me-to-assume-it-was-israeli-bombs-causing-all-the-damage-in-gaza-9640905.html
This is a dangerously stupid comment. By your logic, a bullying child deserves to murdered?
He is using parody to illustrate the bankruptcy of the position taken by apologists for Israeli aggression.
The misspelling of “Finnancial Maneger” is interesting. The internet says you’re most likely to find it happening in Indian subcontinent, especially Pakistan. I’d also note that a critical laptop associated with Iran’s nuclear program was stolen from Iran in mid-2004 and quickly came to American hands.
Rampant speculation–
Nothing very surprising here. I would be surprised if the NSA, Israel, Canada, Britain, France, Germany, etc. did not share intelligence and surveillance in many areas. Also not a surprise, is that Israel does not behave as an American puppet. They make their own decisions and thus frustrate their supporters.
Israel will be the US’s puppet when it’s needed. Don’t doubt it. It was identified as a strategic asset long ago and the arrangements in place are in accordance with that position. Of course corporatocracy states work together, a la Operation Condor. It’s just a fact. There’s nothing to be ‘not surprised’ about.
The US gov’t is Israel’s puppet. Have you not seen the ENTIRE congress rise and give Netanyahu a standing ovation? Do you not know how many Jews and Crypto’s/Marrano’s/Conversos are in the gov’t, business, banking, and media?
How else would they BRAINWASH the ENTIRE US populations?
Great work from Mr. Greenwald and of course, Mr. Snowden. Thank you for calling ’em out when no one else will.
Without dwelling long on this or that “ism”
When viewed through a historical prism,
It seems fair to relate
That the Israeli State
Will be seen as an Oasis of Freedom in a Desert of Despotism.
As an Island of Hope in a Sea of Despair.
As an Oasis of Democracy in a Desert of Tyranny.
As an Island of Modernity in a Medieval Sea.
As an Island of Enlightenment in a Sea of Ignorance.
As an Island of Reason in a Sea of Irrationality.
As an Island of Prosperity in a Sea of Envy.
As an Oasis of Mental Health in a Desert of Psychoses.
As an Oasis of Success in a Desert of Failure.
And any current attitudes to the contrary will reside, as ‘t were, in the dust bin of history.
Selah
The children & grandchildren of the Jews who underwent the Holocaust reread history & are now carrying out the same atrocities to those Arabs deemed inferior the way the Nazis carried them out against the Jews deemed inferior. Before long Israel will surpass nazi Germany, if it has not already done so.
It’s the exact conclusion half of the media leads you to believe; the calculated anti-thesis in anticipation of a predetermined synthesis.
In reality both historical instances were/are intentionally caused 100% by r1b’s and their stolen intel apparatus.
It is not going down in history as a crime committed by Jews accompanied by the statement “see everybody does it” (actually nobody does it but r1b’s), rather it’s going down in history as another crime being 100% orchestrated and committed by r1b all by themselves as usual and trying to blame it on someone else…. as usual.
The Founding Fathers of Israel were Bolshevik-Communists.
They Bolshevik-Communists murdered over 60 Million Christians in Russia and surrounding European countries.
The National Socialists of Germany were fighting against these people. Don’t believe the Jewish media and entertainment industry – they’ve been lying for years.
Just look at slavery – they put out the movie ‘Roots’ claiming it was based on a true story – however, the author of the book was sued for taking whole pieces of story from another book that was a work of fiction.
They lie.
Titus 1:14 “Not giving heed to Jewish Fables and commandments of men that turn from the TRUTH”
How can they become like the “Nazis” when the Founding Fathers of Israel were Bolshevik-Communists.
The Bolshevik-Communists murdered over 60 MILLION Christians in Russia and other European countries.
Call them what they are, Communists.
At this point, I think Israel’s intentions with respect to Gaza, specifically, and the “Two State Solution,” generally, are well defined and well understood. I don’t know how anyone could argue honestly, or in good faith, otherwise. That this agenda is so very clear is gut-grinding enough, but to grasp the extent to which the U.S. is up to its eyeballs in supporting and facilitating Israel’s aspirations makes me seethe. The best analysis I’ve read on this cozy US-Israel relationship was provided by @billmon1. I appreciate that he put it in storify form:
Given this, I’m not precisely sure where my leverage is as an American citizen. In isolation, doubtless, not much. But, it does clarify for me that I might have to engage in some less-than-desirable-under-normal-conditions alliances to amplify the little leverage I have. That does speak to me in terms of where my limited campaign donations are going to go, and where my energy will be placed in a voting booth. An otherwise strong set of preferences for US domestic policy has just been pushed to the bottom of my priority list.
Not. In. My. Name.
Technical note for anyone who wants to search a twitter feed of their own or someone else.
https://twitter.com/search-advanced
It beats any brute-force method I’ve tried instead.
If that make the Big Gov’t dues-promoting and tribute-advocating progressive left feel better.
If you’re an example of a practicing Christian – no wonder the world is fucked!
Also worth a look is @billmon1’s analysis of the current conflict.
The Doomsday Machine
I’d sooner he reopen the Whiskey Bar, but until he can be convinced, I’ll take whatever he offers.
Oh! Dear, Dear! How must I apologize on behalf of my ungovernable democratically elected government?!
What is with the commenters who cannot take a breath without excusing themselves, entering extreme denial of their own culpability and duplicity in these international war crimes of their own nation-state. and otherwise babble on and on about how the US is not responsible for what Israel does?
What does it take to awaken a victim of a self-inflicted coma?
This is nothing new. The Jewish lobby’s influence goes back decades. As the Jewish intellectual Irving Kristol wrote in 1973,
I forgot to close a tag in my comment. The above post should read like this:
This is nothing new. The Jewish lobby’s influence goes back decades. As the Jewish intellectual Irving Kristol wrote in 1973,
Irving Kristol is Bill Kristol’s father. The Jewish lobby’s evangelical, conservative, Democrat and Republican cronies are a problem too in the American political scene but ultimately a side show.
Source:
http://mondoweiss.net/2007/05/30_years_ago_ne.html
There is no “Jewish lobby.” There is a group of Americans, many but certainly not all of whom are Jewish, who lobby the US government to assist Israel in various ways. Their agenda is not concerned with Jews in general, but rather with a very specific set of foreign policy issues. Most American Jews are not members of the “lobby” and contribute nothing to it. And it certainly does not speak for all American Jews, let alone all Jews worldwide. I’m a Jew and it ain’t my lobby.
http://www.presstv.com/detail/2013/12/25/341807/israel-suppressing-report-on-911-role/
Great publication! I look forward everyday to what is next and am constantly checking the page for new stories. I will say that until a few months ago I believe Israel was as a country, militarily responsible and decent….little did I know. What they have been doing this month and the innocent people they have killed is genocide. It is awful that they can do this to people with impunity and call it preemptive action. Its pure and simple evil and the US, our country, my country is enabling them to do this. What kills me is when the cameras are on our government officials will sound the horns and condemn Israel’s actions and blah blah blah, its all lip service because we are providing the intelligence and weapons. How two faced the Obama administration is, its so frustrating.
Although I am sympathetic to your comment, some care is warranted when using the word “genocide” to describe the current situation. Overuse of the word debases it’s value.
Uhm, Genocide is not genocide unless it is genocide against the Israelis?
Genocide has a very specific meaning – the intent and action to destroy an entire ethnic or religious group. It seems that Israel has done a poor job if that was their goal.
So when its policy is to maintain the economy of Gaza in the brink of collapse, what do you call that?
Maybe the Nazis did not intend to commit genocide, since they did feed the inhabitants of the Warsaw Ghetto.
I understand what you’re saying
Just because we (the United States) supply weapons and intelligence to Israel doesn’t mean that we are causing them to do what they are doing. The US is trying to broker a peace deal where Hamas in Gaza stops firing rockets at Israel and building tunnels into Israel and in return Israel withdraws its forces.
The mistake that Israel is making is that it is allowing too many civilian causalities. But it is within its rights to defend itself against Hamas. We have struggled with that ourselves in our battles with Al Qaeda. When they hide in areas with lots of civilians it is difficult to get them without hurting civilians.
I do not recognize that right, and no decent person should, and I’ll tell you why. If Israel stops oppressing people, and then it gets attacked for no reason, that’s when they have the right of self-defense in the sense you mean it. Meanwhile, Gazans have a right of self-defense as any oppressed people would, and I see no way to refute this.
@Jose – For many decades, Israel did exactly what you recommend. They only responded to direct, large scale attacks, 1948, 1967, 1973,… this approach did not lead to peace. I am not saying that the current approach is any better.
That is saying “for many years I was ignorant of Israeli genocidal policies against the Palestinians and still am therefore it didn’t happen.”
I do agree that you are still ignorant. :)
It’s been non-stop colonialism since 1947. That’s the reality. There’s something called the “1948 Palestinian Exodus.” The right term for it is ethnic cleansing. The 1967 war was what’s now called a “pre-emptive” attack by Israel, and its purpose what clearly expansionism.
I totally agree with you Jose
Israel is ALLOWING too many civilian causalities?!! what a joke…
israel is KILLING civilians and don’t worry’ your israeli friends admit it and say: “we know children are getting killed, but hey, our kids can’t go to kindergarten, it’s totally fair, an eye for an eye…”
sorry but FUC… You ALL ZIONIST murdering PIGS…
Defend means killing childs, ? am sorry babys Right?
You sound like u are are falling for the Zionist propaganda. Let’s look at the facts: zionists are told “shoot to kill”. That’s their motto. The USA gives ammunition to support this motto.
No, Israel has no right to use force to maintain an illegal occupation.
The hope is for the world to recognize Israel’s right to exist as a state from the sea to the river. But that would only happen if the Palestinians fall in line with Egypt and Jordan who are being threatened and bribed by the US and UK to remain quiet in spite of Israel brutality’s toward the Palestinians . Poor Israel! They know that their democratic country was established by the people who abused them. And those people did not have the courage to offer them land in Germany, France or England, Poland, Hungary, Russia, etc. and give them arms to kill the very people who killed them. The Israelis are still fighting for authenticity in a foreign land so that’s why they have to biannually “mow the Palestinian grass”.
Israel has created the “Hamas problem” itself by keeping the Palestinians in a ghetto & stopping them from developing into a full-fledged nation. Israel’s obsession with Hamas is in no proportion of damage & brutal killing it is inflicting on innocent people, including children. No country, not even that “holier-than-thou” country Israel, has the right to bomb UN safe havens & hospitals.
Israel is quickly becoming a clone of Hitler’s Germany, if it has not already surpassed it.
I find it extraordinary that the Palestinians have no rights to defend themselves against: land-grabbing, illegal occupation, random and constant use of drones, missiles, filling in of fresh-water wells, denied the importation of medical supplies. Israel has used white phosphorous, cluster bombs, indiscriminate bombing of hospitals, schools and UN buildings. You can see what they are doing if you search the internet – those dismembered children were conceived and born and loved in the same way that most of us were, yet the Israelis consider them to be sub-human, not worth the shedding of tears at their suffering. Consider how very few Israelis have died against the almost 2,000 Palestinians dead in this one-sided war – the third such onslaught by Israel in the past seven years. They are vandals and barbarians. Totally uncivilised, and their plans are to wipe out Gaza and whatever number are left are to be moved to a concentration camp. This according to their deputy speaker of the Knesset.
Person wrote:
“Just because we (the United States) supply weapons and intelligence to Israel doesn’t mean that we are causing them to do what they are doing. The US is trying to broker a peace deal where Hamas in Gaza stops firing rockets at Israel and building tunnels into Israel and in return Israel withdraws its forces.”
~~~~~~
Let me help you with your wordage…. I think you meant: [and in return Israel stops the wanton killing, war crimes, and the savagery of its attacks on a trapped and helpless civilian population]
~~~~~~
Person continues the propaganda: “The mistake that Israel is making is that it is allowing too many civilian causalities. But it is within its rights to defend itself against Hamas. ..snip”
~~~~~
I think you meant: [The mistake that Israel is making is that it is PURPOSELY CAUSING too many civilian causalities, and that Hamas has a right to defend itself]
~~~~~
Person goes on:
“We have struggled with that ourselves in our battles with Al Qaeda. When they hide in areas with lots of civilians it is difficult to get them without hurting civilians.”
~~~~~
I think you meant: It’s a really tough job killing people we don’t know by remote control. We struggle with it like the bully struggles to keep from beating up on the weak… that is to say, not at all.
You are welcome.
It is interesting how much Jew hatred exceeds fear of Islam in the mindset of so many in the West
It is obvious that those who are defending the so called Palestinians have very conveniently ignored the following:
1. A two states solution was on the table by the UN in 1947 which was utterly refused by ALL the Arabs whose publicly declared intention was to EXTERMINATE the Jews
2. Israel had to fight to survive Arab aggression and terror in 1948; 1956; 1967; 1973; 1982 etc
3 Israel returned every square inch of Sinai to Egypt (territory THREE times bigger than Israel) over a piece of paper that Morsi was going to overturn
5 Hamas Charter is to EXTERMINATE all Jews
6 The very so called Palestinians many of you are so heart broken over were the ones who were so happy at the HOLOCAUST of 3000 Americans on 911 they celebrated throwing sweets at each other
7 The hatred of many comments of Israel & Jews also ignore the FACT that the IDF uses missiles to shield its people from Hamas indiscriminate rocket attacks while Hamas uses its people to shield their missiles
8 Last but not least NEVER in the history of warfare has any nation attempted to reduce civilian collateral damage as Israel while Hamas does its utmost to put its civilians in harm’s way to solicit the sympathy of Jew haters such as many of you
IQ al Rassooli
Kafir & Proud!
I do not hate Jews, nor fear Islam. Sorry to destroy your narrative.
It is amazing how incompetent Israel is at their attempts to: “reduce civilian collateral damage” as you put it. By which I’m guessing you are referring to the mass slaughter of men women and children. Let me help you, you ignorant and biased fool. Israel is a country that is committing war crimes. I don’t give a flying fuck what the predominant religion or race of that country is. Now do you get it? No, of course not.
Keep trotting out that same shit and pretending it is not redolent of the ugly bias in that brainbox full of steamed cheese atop your shoulders.
Actually,other than the beginning of our incursion,there have been no attacks on AlciaDA by US in Afghanistan,our main enemy being the Taliban,and Iraq had absolutely no AlCIAda before our attack,and look at it now,baby,we’ve come a long way,and Israel has also,as they created Hamas,as a divide and conquer apparatus against the secular PLO,and look at those fruits .And to call the instigators of all this stupid idiotic nonsense intellectuals is certainly a reach too far.
oopx…. my reply not aimed at you
Yep and 911 Happened Just the Way Your Government TOLD You It Did UNSA UNSA UNSA UNSA
Yep & 911 Happened Just the Way Your Government TOLD You It Did
UNSA UNSA UNSA
Israel good, Arabs bad. And the big book of Folktales tells me the end is nigh! Oh really?
What is it that blind, hegemonic, supporters of this “fake state” don’t understand?
Israel is ruthless, rascist and will not stop until they ethnically cleanse Palestinians from their land, which Israel thieved from them.
Do note, Christian Zionists, particularly, that Israel have no place for you, either. Unless you are in their exclusive club, you are deemed inhuman and treated accordingly.
A rogue state which should NOT be receiving ANY support and dismantlement of their WMD cache before they wreck humanity.
Another plateful of bigotry unchallenged at the latest far left wing hate site – or is that far right? Where are you DocH? Or are you just too fearful to alienate political allies?
Mr. Greenwald
“…….. The NSA and GCHQ receive intelligence about the Palestinians from many sources. The agencies have even succeeded in inducing the U.S.-supported Palestinian Authority Security Forces (PASF) to provide them with surveillance and intelligence about other Arab groups in the region……..Jordan also feeds surveillance data about the Palestinians to the NSA. One classified NSA document from 2013 describes how “NSA’s partnership with EWD [the Jordanian Electronic Warfare Directorate] is a well established, long-standing and trusted relationship dating back to the early 1980’s.” Specifically, the two agencies “cooperate on high-priority SIGINT targets of mutual interest” that includes the Palestinian Security Forces……“EWD provides high-interest, unique collection on targets of mutual interest, such as the Palestinian Security Forces; EWD is the sole contributor to a large body of NSA’s reporting on this target.”
A politically-motivated article timed to coincide with the current conflict in Gaza. The overall message is that the US is complicit in the war in Gaza because we supply weapons and munitions to the Israeli government. In addition, the article seeks to undermine US support for Israel and politically embarrass (or worse) the Palestinian Authority and Jordan governments for cooperating with the US. This release of this information could empower Hamas – as will any settlement in this conflict that ends the embargo (except one which coincides with the disarming of Hamas).
US-Israel intelligence cooperation is a real shocker, Mr. Greenwald. A recent publication verified a joint venture by Israel and US intelligence agencies which temporarily disabled the Iranian nuclear program using a computer virus called “Stuxnet”. The US and Israel are suspected in the murder of Iranian nuclear scientists working on the Iranian nuclear program (speculative, but who would be surprised?). There is nothing earth shattering about US-Israel intelligence and military cooperation. The US has been arming Israel essentially since the Yom Kippur War in 1973. The US brokered peace between Israel and Egypt in 1979 and has been arming both countries since that time.
The timing of this publication is exquisite and (probably) rushed to coincide with the ongoing war in Gaza – a war in which the international community has witnessed Israel’s brutal assault on Gaza and on the Hamas terror network. Hamas has used a large amount of capital to construct an elaborate tunnel system into Israel, ostensibly to bypass the crowded Israeli streets to markets on weekends. Some of the finances could have been spent on Palestinians living in Gaza – possibly even for a bomb shelter. Hamas has vowed to continue fighting until the blockade is lifted – or the last Palestinian in Gaza is killed (whichever comes first).
The US has nothing to gain politically by the war in Gaza. The Obama administration yesterday condemned the shelling of the UN school which left 10 people dead:
The State Department issued a statement Sunday condemning Israel’s “disgraceful” shelling of a United Nations school sheltering civilians in Gaza…….”The United States is appalled by today’s disgraceful shelling outside an UNRWA school in Rafah sheltering some 3,000 displaced persons, in which ten more Palestinian civilians were tragically killed,”……..Psaki continues: “UN facilities, especially those sheltering civilians, must be protected, and must not be used as bases from which to launch attacks. The suspicion that militants are operating nearby does not justify strikes that put at risk the lives of so many innocent civilians.”………”
Finally, it’s laughable that you publish information by US intelligence which calls Israel one of the greatest threats to “…… “Espionage/intelligence collection operations and manipulation/influence operations conducted by foreign intelligence services directed against U.S. government, military, science & technology and Intelligence Community.”…..”
Indeed, didn’t the Intercept publish how the US spies on friends like Germany? That is just one of many jobs of intelligence agencies. Remember Jonathon Pollard? Notice how France is also on the list.
Gee, Craig,
Since when are real reporters in the biz of sparing people and governments the embarrassment of their lies and deceit? Greenwald doesn’t work for the inept mainstream press or the lame Washington press corp — where reporters get up every morning and think how best to kiss the government’s ass. And this article is no surprise at all. If our government will spy on its own senators, it will surely help an ally spy on its enemies in a far off land where life is cheap. I expected nothing less was going on between the US and Israel — so no shocker there.
Besides providing services to friends in that part of the world, we also get things in return. Has everyone forgotten that the US farmed out extraordinary rendition (torture) to Egypt before and after 9/11? That’s right folks, in the 90s Bill Clinton approved the transfer of terror suspects to be tortured Egypt, a government we later condemned in the uprising in 2011. All proof that we don’t stand for anything anymore and we’ve lost the sense of decency that was the hallmark of the Greatest Generation. The game is over for us, we just don’t know it yet. In another ten years we will be even more morally, educationally and financially bankrupt — taking orders from the Asia Pacific rim.
Spare us the prophecies; we can see US deterioration anytime we open a newspaper (official propaganda sheet) or flick on the idiot box (official televised propaganda).
Tell us the details about how the ignorantly named “greatest generation” (that would be our founding generation for you ignoramouses) that gave us the US national insecurity cults that now rule US foreign policy on behalf of Wall Street psychopaths/sociopaths – tell us about how this generation was so brilliantly benevolent and innocent and had nothing to do with the stupidest historical blunder ever committed – the Cold War – how was all this wonderful angelic generation so manifest and where do you find all the evidence – as opposed to your Tom Brokaw TV-ignorance inspired assertions?
Insecurity;How is it the most overaggressive and military strong nations in the world are now the most insecure?
I also read the news today;Half minute to decipher everything(wapo,nyts) they had to say,which was nada.Oh,they had a story on GG at the NYTs how he’s not really internet connected in the jungle or some rot or another.Behind their paywall I would imagine,as they go belly up in self destruction for Eretz Israel.
Walter,
No prophecies here, pretty obvious that the loan shark owns you when you need quick cash for your rent because you blew all your wad at the blackjack table. And we already are bowing to an Asian dictator.
And yes, the Greatest Generation wasn’t perfect, but they didn’t lie and deceive us AS MUCH as our leaders do now. You could count on them to tell the truth at least SOME of the time, and PROFIT wasn’t the ONLY thing we cared about.
During the Depression we TRIED to get people back to work, now we just blame the jobless. The Greatest Generation at least prosecuted securities fraud SOME of the time and TRIED to regulate the banks from doing stupid things. Our current generations says “let em’ eat cake.”
IKE ay least TRIED to slow down the war machine and FDR was working on universal healthcare in the “Second Bill of Rights.” Now we have a president who can only write health care law for the benefit of the medical industrial complex.
There was a time when how well your workers were paid was a good reflection on business and captains of industry, now American business hates the worker. Now it seems that how much money you hide off shore and how much loss you can hide off-the-books is a reflection of of success. Pretty fucking sad!
And I don’t even own a TV, I threw it away after the Reagan funeral, seriously!
In the last four articles published at the Guardian concerning Israel, only one has mentioned Hamas, the internationally recognized terrorist organization with a racist, antisemitic charter that calls for the destruction of Israel (two times but unrelated to their charter) . It’s the height of poor and cowardly journalism to neglect the role of Hamas in this war. Hamas has stated on numerous occasions, they will never recognize the Jewish state. No one can deny this simple truth and it’s the Achilles heel of supporters of the Palestinians. There simply is no answer to the terrorist organization that seeks a temporary truce, but never peace.
The murderers who kidnapped the Israeli teens are identified members of Hamas. They sometimes have been referred to as rebels i.e., rogue murderers who work outside of Hamas leadership – allowing a convenient denial by the terrorist organization that never condemned the kidnapping or murder of the teens. In fact, the kidnapping was praised by Hamas leadership. Hamas was certainly in a desperate situation in Gaza isolated without support from the usual allies so a war could serve a purpose for Hamas.
Hamas diverted a significant amount of precious financial resources to construct an elaborate tunnel complex designed to penetrate the borders of Israel and kidnap or kill IDF soldiers. The money could have been spent to better the lives of civilians that mistakenly elected the terrorist organization to power. If perpetual war is what the Islamic terrorist want, then why not at least construct some bomb shelters so civilians who just have an interest in raising a family and working might not become fodder for Hamas’s political game to end the embargo. The answer is self explanatory.
It’s the height of irresponsible “journalism” to ignore the role of Hamas in the current war – or even the broken cease fire. Even if Hamas had killed the soldiers a little before the cease fire officially began, they irresponsibly risked the brokered cease fire which was agreed to by all parties for humanitarian reasons. Shortly after the IDF was attacked, the truce faltered leading to more Palestinian deaths (always the Palestinians pay). It’s clear that the primary motive for Hamas is using Palestinian children as collateral for securing the end to the blockade. By ignoring the irresponsible actions of Hamas, the Intercept – the fringe left – willingly advances this narrative in service to Hamas.
thank you.
as a completely non-religious Jew who finds Israel’s conduct abhorrent and outrageous, but also finds abhorrent the conduct of extremist Muslims in the Middle East–and who worries at the failure to distinguish between Palestinian citizens and extremist anti-Jewish elements throughout the Middle East, today meaning for example Iran, who is by all accounts directly responsible for much of Hamas’s military ordinance–I can say one thing: the comments on this page certainly prove that Israelis are wrong to worry that anti-Jewish sentiment is alive and well in the world.
Why wouldn’t they just stand down and allow free economic traffic into Gaza and even the “right of return” Palestinians demand? After all, it’s entirely crazy to think that taking such actions might endanger the people who were (wrongly in my opinion, but it is what it is) given that land by the world because they were being outright exterminated, and not for shooting rockets at civilians, but simply for living. Entirely crazy, and when I am tempted to suggest that Israel should indeed follow this course which is recommended as so obvious by the people here anxious to side with organizations that have direct ties to the actual German Nazis (read up Middle East/Nazi history–it is amazing) and indulging in hate-filled rhetoric about Israel and sanctimony about Palestinian victims, I can’t help but wonder: when you come out essentially agreeing with people who do, actively do, demand the destruction of Israel, are you surprised that Israel responds as if that is what you want?
this situation is not black and white. moderate Arab leaders, who are not “just” allied with the US, and some of whom are not allies much at all, see this, and it is shameful that so few here see it that way.
here’s a thought experiment: suppose the Islamic State grows in power and territory, and (as it would like to do) wraps in several other current countries, and even Gaza and maybe the West Bank, with its anti-women “caliphate” and expulsion of Christians? The Islamic State loves your anti-Israel invective. At this point, many on this page read as if their response to such events would be to sign up on the IS side of the battle. I hope at least a few will think carefully about that. It may well be coming.
Thanks, thank you
It’s a complex conflict without an easy solution. That aside, The far left aligns with the far right in their goal to terminate the “Jewish state”. In the world of the fringe left, Hamas terrorists are the freedom fighters, and Israel is Nazi Germany. An article published in the Intercept by Greenwald compared Goebbels and Netanyahu. Need I say more? These are Topsy Turvy times in the world of the hard left which kowtows to Islamists. Can they not remember who bore the brunt of the Iranian revolution?
On the other hand, Israel needs to solve the problem of settling the West Bank. The Palestinians are being denied their right to self determination.
Thanks.
Who are the chief U.S. players, non governmental, instrumental in shaping U.S.-Israel policy in general and intelligence cooperation specifically. American politicians fear a backlash – via a phone call from an American with close ties with Israel – if they offend Israel in any way. The fact the U.S. provides raw (unfiltered) intelligence with an understanding that Israel will self-regulate when the data includes intelligence on Americans and politicians exemplifies the theory there are secret controllers involved here and that the U.S. is willing to be subservient to Israel. Another example is American media has spun Israel in a positive light during the slaughtering of innocent civilians. And at the same time that children are dying and UN facilities are being bombed, the U.S. Congress approves $250 million for Israel’s Iron Dome system.
Who are the secret American controllers of the Beltway marionettes operating in secrecy, soiling our credibility and using our tax dollars. Who does Netanyahu call when he is unhappy with the President or the Secretary of State and wants then to follow his lead? A strong dose of daylight followed by more daylight is needed here.
Lloyd Blankfein, Koch Brothers, Jamie Dimon, Bill Gares, Waren Buffett – here’s another short list: http://13bankers.com/title/
The evidence is all over the internet. All we have to do is a little reading and searching. It is no secret except to tv addicts and others who refuse to do a little civic homework.
Spot on, WJS. Now, consolidate and put it in front of the 75% of Americans that get their news from TV. “Pop!” goes that idea: 90% of American media is controlled by 6 corporations who are content that the evidence is scattered across the internet. Is it hopeless?
Enough of describing the problems! Get the eggheads together and suggest actionable solutions. Change begins with 1. knowing where we want to be, not where we’ve been, 2. solutions and 3. action.
Chris Hedges:
“The lesson of the Holocaust is not that Jews are special. It is not that Jews are unique. It is not that Jews are eternal victims. The lesson of the Holocaust is that when you have the capacity to halt genocide, and you do not, no matter who carries out that genocide or who it is directed against, you are culpable. And we are very culpable …”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sy9XRvvLAW0#t=362
Man, that was brilliant. Thanks for posting.
Ah yes, as usual Israel is the whipping boy. No mention is made of Hamas’ using 600,000 tons of cement for its tunnels into Israel while it was complaining that Israel would not let it import cement; wonder what it would have built if allowed to bring cement in. When Israel left in 2007, it gave to Hamas green houses worth many millions and school,etc; Hamas said we don’t want things from the Jews and destroyed them. By the way, why not mention the charter of Hamas which states it must destroy IsraelThe interesting question is why is the left so vicious against Israel. Is it because Israel is modern, democratic and western oriented and does not kvetch and claim to be a victim, like its neighbors. yes, the Us helps Israel;you do that with friends and allies. It is unfortunate that civilians are killed; but it does happen in a war and please be honest to ask Hamas about its practices of using civilians. What would Gaza be like if Hamas had worked to develop the country, and say it wanted peace with Israel, as Israel has since 1948, instead of building tunnels and obtaining rockets. The people of Gaza suffer because of the policies and practices of Hamas. By the way, your language ‘israeli aggression”, etc, makes obvious your left wing bias against Israel. Hummus yes, Hamas no
Your entire comment is boilerplate so I’m keeping this reply to just one point. Your reference to the charter about “destroying Israel” has not been in the charter since 2006. I wonder how many times you’ve been told about that, or even have read it yourself but have continued to propagate the lie anyway.
The Likud Charter states that there will never be a Palestinian state, so they are just as bad as Hamas. As for the greenhouses, they were not all destroyed, there was some damage, but the Palestinians used them and then when it came time to export their harvest, Israel closed the Karni crossing. The people of Gaza suffer because of the policies and practices of the state of Israel – no more no less.
You leave other that the crossing was closed due to rockers from Gaza.
Really? Where do these figures come from? Let’s say you need a ton of cement for every foot of tunnel (I think I’m being conservative.) That would mean they’ve constructed 114 miles of tunnels, or about 6 times the entire length of Gaza.
Where’s the evidence that multiple such tunnels exist? Where’s the evidence that these tunnels have been used to kill civilians? Surely, if you’re going to construct hundreds of these tunnels, each one must have some purpose.
These are just unsubstantiated talking points, aren’t they?
oh crap, gonna go pedantic on you here…
(as an aside: LOVE the jews, done GREAT progressive resistance work for HUNDREDS of years in the us of a; zionists ? fuck’em with a backwards pineapple, WORSE than nazis, as they have NO EXCUSES for their immorality, having suffered as they are making others suffer now…)
firstly, WHAT other options do the palestinians have but to tunnel ? drones ? yeah, right…
secondly, i guess the tunnels prob come in all sizes, but let’s say a typical one is 6’wide by 6′ tall and uses 4″ thick concrete (prob thicker on the ceiling, but let’s keep it simple)… that would be about 8CF of CONCRETE (NOT ‘cement’, which is only ONE constituent of concrete) per linear foot of tunnel… concrete weighs about 150 lbs per CF, and cement makes up approx 10-15% of that weight, so say 10-12 lbs per cf, so if there is approx 8 CF of concrete per lineal foot, that would be approx 8 X 10 or 12 = 80 to 96 lbs of cement per lineal foot of tunnel…
at 600 000 tons X 2000 = 1 200 000 000 lbs of cement divided by 100 (rounding up the 96 to account for waste/etc) = 1 200 000 lineal feet of tunnels = 227 miles of tunnels potentially…
hell, wouldn’t it just be cheaper to treat them as human beings ? ? ?
oops , guess i should have used a calculator instead of my fingers and toes…
10-15% of 150 lbs is not ’10-12′, but ’15-22′, so you can break out the calculator from there, the point remains…
“Left wing”? Thanks for clearing that up. Trolls have been assuring me for the past year that Mr. Greenwald is a secret right wing libertarian who takes his marching orders from the Cato Institute.
Nope, he is a left leaning civil libertarian.
Not a whole libertarian, but some very important parts of one.
I see you finally covered the signatures that gave the identity of the receiver of half a million. Someone probably screen grabbed it.
“Over the last decade, the NSA has significantly increased the surveillance assistance it provides to its Israeli counterpart, the Israeli SIGINT National Unit (ISNU; also known as Unit 8200), including data used to monitor and target Palestinians. ”
Israel has greatly benefited from the 9/11 attacks and it’s time the truth comes out. Look up dancing Israelis on 9/11, it all makes sense now. Great work Glenn.
@ Chris:
It is really nice to see that someone has grasped the larger picture. 9/11 = Inside job.
Israeli aggression? Excuse me, but what are those Hamas rocket attacks and Hamas built elaborate tunnels about? Israel has been defending itself. Whatever help the United States (which the radical Islamists call “Big Satan”) has provided to Israel (which the radical Islamists call “Little Satan”) has been in service of the GOOD.
The right of self-defense of the oppressor is not what you think it is. It’s equivalent to the right of self-defense of the Apartheid government of South Africa, or the right of self-defense of the Nazis against the Warsaw Ghetto. Basically, the right way to exercise self-defense in such instances is to stop oppressing people. If that doesn’t work, then you come up with alternatives.
Yes, those Palestinian children whose bodies are piling up in front of your hateful face are so dangerous.. as are the hospitals, U.N. workers, Doctors, and sleeping families murdered by your friends in Israel.. defending itself? You live in an alternative universe. The facts refute your ugly propaganda. How do you live with the hypocrisy of your position? Do you have a conscience? Are you just another sociopathic knee-jerk Israel-firster? Don’t bother to answer, the truth about you is obvious.
quote”Whatever help the United States (which the radical Islamists call “Big Satan”) has provided to Israel (which the radical Islamists call “Little Satan”) has been in service of the GOOD.”quote
Bahahahahahahahahahahah …hohohohohohoh…hahhahahaha!
Israeli definition of GOOD=http://www.google.com/search?q=gaza+jpg+dead+children&nord=1&tbm=isch&imgil=KhQGdRmeXpZqaM%253A%253B3S2qT6rLuw5npM%253Bhttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fwww.dailymail.co.uk%25252Fnews%25252Farticle-2698150%25252FExodus-40-000-civilians-forced-leave-homes-300-dead-Israel-vows-significantly-widen-ground-offensive-Gaza.html&source=iu&usg=__VXr-McHoCb0FN_lM5OGInHC9uBg%3D&sa=X&ei=arXfU6fMNIeeyASBn4CIDg&ved=0CCUQ9QEwAw&biw=1120&bih=582#facrc=_&imgdii=_&imgrc=KhQGdRmeXpZqaM%253A%3B3S2qT6rLuw5npM%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fi.dailymail.co.uk%252Fi%252Fpix%252F2014%252F07%252F19%252Farticle-2698150-1FCBFB5700000578-566_964x672.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.dailymail.co.uk%252Fnews%252Farticle-2698150%252FExodus-40-000-civilians-forced-leave-homes-300-dead-Israel-vows-significantly-widen-ground-offensive-Gaza.html%3B964%3B672
Spare me you scumbag.
Tujays –
the NDTV video is shocking. this is unconscionable behaviour. if UN Security Council cannot act, we must find another forum to hold Israel and its accomplices accountable for these war crimes.
enough is enough.
Congress is going to be upset about this; how are they supposed to earn points with AIPAC if they don’t get to publicly vote for the funding?
Looking at the larger picture, Congress seems to have outlived its usefulness. Laws can more effectively be implemented as Executive Orders and covert payments provide much more flexibility than publicly voted budgets. It could be argued that Congressional committees provide an oversight function in accordance with the Constitution. However, the past year has revealed that officials simply lie to those committees, without consequence, and then spy on them – so the oversight only exists in theory.
So Congress is a bit like the Roman Senate after the end of the Republic – continuing to exist long after it had lost any political relevance. So they may be upset, but they won’t get too upset. That might jeopardize their ongoing ceremonial role as the representatives of the people and comfortable sinecures.
Perhaps that’s a bit harsh, since it’s possible that private funding of congressional political campaigns provides a useful feedback mechanism for the government when it sets its policy priorities. After all, a government that loses the support of its moneyed elite soon loses its legitimacy.
hmmm, maybe my previous assessment of you was perhaps a little premature, as it appears here you just might be a master of satirical assassination vs a scumbag murderer idolizing prick. On the other hand.., I must have had a current lapse in judgement. Never mind. Fuck you.
I thought that I posted this before, but it didn’t show up.
Alison Weir, NOT the British historian with the same name, has been an important supporter of Palestine since 2000. She went there alone and spent time with the people. She has done an extensive job of documenting the Israel destruction of the place and the people and how it is covered up by the US media.
She runs an org and a web site
If Americans Knew: What Every American Should Know about I/P
the link
http://www.ifamericansknew.org/
it looks like the data, for example, killed children, has not been updated after the slaughter this month
here is an excellent presentation she made – she started going there in about 2000 and spent time with the Palestinians and saw the destruction of their land and murder of their people
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_-UwcVP_k2Y&feature=youtu.be
and she wrote a book
“AGAINST OUR BETTER JUDGEMENT: The hidden history of how the U.S. was used to create Israel”
Thanks, Don – that looks like a great link. I’ll check it out in more detail a bit later.
Absolutely the US and sells arms, intelligence, and technology to Israel (just as Israel sells arms, technology, and intelligence to the US) and both Israel and the US uses what they get to defend themselves from attacks from extremist Muslims (such as Hamas, Al Qaeda, Islamic Jihad, Hezbollah, etc). Why is the author apparently outraged by this? Also, why doens’t the author bring up the fact that the US also provides Palestinians directly )and indirectly though funding other aid organizations such as the United Nations) with millions, if not billions of dollars in aid, which Hamas particularly has diverted towards building tunnels into Israel and buying rockets that are specifically meant for shelling, abducting, and otherwise terrorising Israelis who have the audacity to live within a couple dozen kilometers of Gaza.
The U.S. also has ongoing intelligence arrangements with Jordan, Saudi Arabia and other Arab governments. And from what I saw when I was still in the government, the U.S. probably receives more intelligence from Israel and some of the friendly Arab governments than it gives in turn. Oh, yes, we also have close ties with Canada, the UK, Australia, New Zealand, France and many other countries. As someone else wrote, this article is politically motivated. I also would add that it is out of context and smacks of the kind of hyperventilating and editorialization that mars so much of the British press, especially the Guardian, which has a long history of antipathy toward Israel.
Why should I believe who so ever? Read Zacharia 12.
Thanks Glenn.
After hearing your interview on emoprog, and your description there of warnings about writing about Israel, I can only say, please stay safe.
GG writes “but it is their own government that centrally enables this violence.” Of course, the violence has nothing to do with the genocidal maniacs, a.k.a. Arabs, firing thousands of rockets.
Why can’t those darn Jews behave the way they used to?. Lining up properly to go into the “showers”. Such uppity people…
That is not the question people are asking. The question people are asking is “Why do the Israelis want the Palestinians to walk into the showers? Have they learned nothing?”
The question of course was always how many showers does one take?
1906:
“Startling reports of the condition and future of Russia’s 6,000,000 Jews….”
query.nytimes.com/mem/archive-free/pdf?res=F50A16FF3A5A12738DDDAC0A94DB405B868CF1D3
1921:
_”BEGS AMERICA SAVE 6,000,000 IN RUSSIA”_
query.nytimes.com/mem/archive-free/pdf?res=F60A12FA3C551A738DDDA90A94DF405B818EF1D3
1938:
_”PERSECUTED JEWS SEEN ON INCREASE; Dr. Kahn Returns With Report of Rise in Europe of Those Deprived of Rights 6,000,000 VICTIMS NOTED 25,000 Refugees Said to Be in Need–Rumania Menaces 800,000 With Anti-Semitism”_
select.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=F10D17FB385415768FDDA00894D9405B888FF1D3
1943:
“Of these 6,000,000 Jews almost a third have already been….”
encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQ30DEqxVkcWDL2Y_6B_q_dZ6VScgpaArhoyF-MycmGJrb4Kstp
Elsewhere, others report 236 references to 6,000,000 Jews prior to the Nuremberg Trial announcement. What’s the fixation, before the Nuremberg trials, with 6,000,000?
But Palestine has nothing to do with persecuting the Jews in Europe.
Nothing in your list of persecution of Jews can explain or justify, why Israel is doing the same against the Palestinians. Is this Israel’s entitlement for ‘Revenge’?
If it was revenge, why choose the the Palestinians to massacre and steal their land? Wouldn’t make more sense to declare war on Germany? Or this is not possible because Germany now is a cash cow for the Israelis?
VAN, you bring a new perspective to the comments section.
La plaza is not posting to express concern about the persecution of Jews in Europe. He is a troll who has been banned here multiple times and is now returned under a different moniker.
His quotes are all found at Holocaust denial sites and places such as the neo-Nazi Stormfront. His purpose is to promote a conspiracy theory about the # 6,000,000; as if “they” had been plotting before WWII to perpetuate hoaxes using this same figure.
If his posting volume gets as excessive as it always has done before, he’ll be banned again.
In the meantime: Please don’t feed the trolls!
He is a loony tunes conspiracy freak, and no doubt beleives he;s citig the same number if Jewish victims
Mona, you’ve never been known here to be adept at quantitative analysis. You were quoting SPLC before I directed your attention to a series of Harpers articles that questioned the propirety of respecting that organization; you never referenced SPLC again. You thought Luke Rudkowski’s We Are Change was an organization that had nothing to do with trutherism before it was illustrated to you that was the raison d’être of its founding.
In short you are a personal growth-stunted, wilfully ignorant, rabid groupie (who even once claimed to have a black velvet painting with Glenn’s image affixed over Christ’s).
You had a little trouble, we recall, getting on this site for over a month after the excessive posting you did–foremost in your mind for some reason. Your Tor excuse doesn’t cut it–why would you use Tor to access The Intercept everyone and their grandmother knows you post at, when you could have simply logged on using an ordinary protocol?
deborah’s posts lasted all of three before effectively criticizing the founding editor you worship.
Serial liars lie serially,I wish people would wake up to that reality,and question every thing they spew,no matter if its written in stone,and worshipped like the golden calf.The suffering of Jews in Europe has everything to do with Palestinians suffering in Palestine,btw.The Palestinians had nothing to do with that persecution,yes.
The genocidal maniacs you refer to have so far killed 3 people with their rockets. One of them died from a heart attack while running away, not from being hit. There are drive-by shootings that are more genocidal than this.
Great Journalism – I just wanted to take this opportunity to share some things I have read and heard over the years. If you look at the Israeli controlled network of roads, checkpoints, settlements and military installations in the west bank you can see it is being actively broken up into Gaza sized enclaves. Scholars in the field and activist academics like Chomsky cite documents showing an Israeli plan to break up the west bank into enclaves of cheap labour and a permanent buffer against aggression from the east. The military strategic thinking is that the 67 border leaves Israel too vulnerable and this school of thought appears to have become dominant in the military. The military also has such status in Israel that it appears to have gone rogue. I think the last incursion into Lebanon was probably not authorised by the political class before it happened and I think this may apply to many actions in Gaza. The military has a kind of independence through various rules of engagement. Also with approval ratings in the 80% range atrocity is fuel for zionist politics that it needs, a vicious cycle likely to undermine even zionist objectives. If there is to be a two state peace it requires intimate and ongoing international engagement, once US politics has been turned or perhaps without it.
Guess, the Egyptian ,Syrian,Jordanian( oh you forgot ,Jordan was an occupier of the West Bank from 1948-1967)) should of pushed Israel into the sea , in1948,1956, 1967,and 1973 seems to be what the left wanted. Wake up!! Israel is here to stay, Egypt,Saudi Arabia,and the gulf states have. Mr Greenwald should look at why the Obama/ Clinton admin got behind Nazi ,sympathizers Muslim Brotherhood, allies of Adolph Hitler,and threw out Gaddafi ,after he became an an ally of the west. What your seeing in the Arab religious world is similar to the USA in the 60’s, ISiS is the weather underground etc. Mr Greenwald adopts this narrative.
Just found out about Alison Weir. This is NOT the British historian with the same name.
She wrote “AGAINST OUR BETTER JUDGEMENT: The hidden history of how the U.S. was used to create Israel”
She has been working full time since 2000 to bring to light what Israel has done to the Palestinians
here is an excellent presentation which begins with what happened in 2000 – 2001 time frame and how the Israel military action has continued
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_-UwcVP_k2Y&feature=youtu.be
here is her web page
http://alisonweir.org/
Does this explain the transformation of Obama’s initial rhetoric about Israel colonization policy into servile acceptance of that policy?
“FINNANCE MANEGER”???
Funny kind of receipts. Not written by native English speaker.
What? Israel does not have the inalienable right, just like every other nation, to take whatever measures are necessary to protect the security of its people and territory? What, specifically, is it that makes Israel subject to scrutiny and treatment different from any other nation? Could it possibly be that it is the U.N. sanctioned and recognized nation-state of – dare I say it? – the Jewish People?
Nobody has the right to take “whatever measure” if those measures include creating an open air “concentration camp,” as some Knesset members have called for in Gaza, or if it includes building settlements in occupied territories and then building walls around it and building Jews only roads crisscrossing the landscape and dividing up village on purpose.
Exactly. You don’t have that right. You can do it. You have the might. You sure as hell don’t have the fucking right.
And stop taking cover under your “Jewish People” bullshit. You Israelis are giving Jews everywhere a bad name.
No sir, Israel’s actions are not how other ‘normal’ nations behave. This is how cancer establishes itself and continue to spread, often stealthily. Viewing Israel as a threat by the largest intelligence services (except Ruffle, naturally) is one more proof of the malignant nature of this entity called Israel.
Does a murdering thief have the right to defend himself?
For example, if after having robbed a series of banks, the owner of the banks located the thief and started to fire a bb-gun at the him, the bank robber is within his right to defend himself from those bb’s to ensure that he’s not injured. However, the thief is not allowed to use undo force with which to protect himself, especially in light of the crimes he committed.
The above is an unrealistic scenario because under ordinary circumstances the bank robber would’ve been arrested and have gone to a criminal court; which is where Israel belongs: the ICC.
In addition, given that Obama and the US congress supplied lethal weaponry and provided other means (intelligence) with which to carry out those crimes, they are accessories in the commission of those crimes and well aiders and abetters. As such, the US government is complicit and should be charged so that they can be brought to justice.
Thanks Glenn.
By infiltrating the White House and the Pentagon, Israel knew exactly how to use their energy and build strategic partners in belligerence and deceit.
Today French Foreign Minister Laurent Fabius says that Israel’s right to defend itself does not justify the “slaughter of civilians”. He argued also that a political sollution must be ‘imposed’ on Israel and the Palestinians, AFP reports.
Who is Unit 8200 (Israeli SIGINT National Unit)
1. In 2013, Unit 8200 purportedly intercepted a conversation between Syrian officials regarding the use of chemical weapons which the Obama administration attempted to use as justification for an armed response against Assad.
2.In 2010, Unit 8200 developed and deployed the stuxnet and flame virus against Iran in an attempt to disrupt its nuclear development program.
3. Two Israeli companies, Verint and Narus, were founded by veterans of the IDF’s cyber-warfare Unit 8200. Verint and Narus created programs which offered the NSA backdoors to all the major U.S. telecommunications and technology companies including Facebook, Microsoft, Google. In 2006, Kobi Alexander, the founder and former chairman of Verint, was named as a fugitive by the FBI on nearly three dozen charges of fraud, theft, lying, bribery, money laundering and other crimes. And two of his top associates at Comverse, Chief Financial Officer David Kreinberg and former General Counsel William F. Sorin, were also indicted in the scheme and later pleaded guilty.
4. In 1986, An Israeli wiretap company, NICE Systems, was formed by seven veterans of Unit 8200. In 2001, Employees of NICE Systems were caught posing as Art Students while engaging in espionage against various US targets including the Drug Enforcement Agency.
5. In 2004, Unit 8200 purportedly broke a sophisticated Iranian code which allowed them to secretly monitor communications between Iran and Pakistan about Iran’s nuclear-weapons program. This intelligence was passed on to the Bush administration with the intention of fomenting war against Iran.
6. In 1996, Unit 8200 was instrumental in constructing a network of special intercept antennas that were located in hilltop settlements throughout the West Bank. The network was used to intercept all cell phone calls coming from Palestinian controlled territory. The cell phone calls placed by security officers of the Palestinian Authority were monitored 24/7. Cell Phone tracking capabilities allowed Israeli Defense Forces to proactively target key individuals during periods of Palestinian unrest.
7. In 1967, the Israeli SIGINT National Unit was responsible for intercepting the communications from the USS liberty as it monitored the aftermath of Israeli preemptive attacks on Egypt from its position in international waters. Upon be discovered, the USS Liberty was targeted and sunk by Israeli Defense forces. To this day, Israel claims that the ship was misidentified as that of Egyptian registry in spite of its clear markings.
@ Wilhelmina:
Very informative and spot-on post.
Thanks.
Benjamin Netanyahu Assad.
I don’t think I have seen a massacre this bad except for the Syrian Army indiscriminately bombing and killing civilians. It is so horrific and cruel one cannot fully fathom the reality of it.
It sickens me that my tax dollars are paying for the weapons that killed these children, women and men who are innocent victims of Israeli armed forces stupefying brutality and immorality.
Where on the tube do you see Syria killing its citizens indiscriminately?Israeli TV?
Syria is fighting a US and Israeli backed insurgency,as are the Shia in Iraq.It’s all more divide and conquer which has destroyed the ME,and if you think Israelis are immune to their own depredations,you aint seen nothing yet.Samson option is coming!Seppeku by atheist monsters using religion as cover.What a bad joke on our world as OT wackos destroy the Enlightenment..
Come on Glenn, due to the US’s huge investment in buying Israel our latest military weaponry, Israel has a acquired the ability to mercilessly fight off school children hiding in UN Shelters using mortars, artillery and missiles from our latest fighter jets. I wish you or someone at New Look would do an investigation of the genesis and evolution of our unnatural affinity to support Israel, no matter what. I know a lot of it is due to the Israel lobby but it would be interesting to have it dissected as some malignant tumor that has taken over the host, which is how I view it. I would have no problem with Israel except for their inability to let go of the Palestinians and leave them be. Even then though I regard the billions given to Israel to be a subtle form of extortion and needs to stop. It may have at one time been ok due to the treaty that generated it, but it is obsolete and simply amounts to a tax rebate of $500 a year to every Israeli citizen. Foolish and stupid.
Oh and I don’t agree with their warmongering about Iran either, which you may recall AIPAC recently was engaged in.
It may be a naive dream to expect our politicians to stop kissing Israel’s ass but one can hope.
Very interesting read Glenn, though I can’t quite grasp why Israel is so important to the US? How do they contribute to US interests, do they give the US greater access to the arab world? To protect oil interests? The legacy from WW2? Are they key to how the world perceive the US? Or what?
” I can’t quite grasp why Israel is so important to the US? ”
That’s the essence of the con. It isn’t. See mythology created by AIPAC, political contributions etc.
Obama and the US government are directly responsible for this. Israel would not be able to commit these war crimes without US backing:
NDTV reports from Rafah in South Gaza
Published on Aug 3, 2014
“The war in Gaza has taken on a new intensity, and as NDTV reaches Rafah, where the conflict is most intense, we see ghost towns and a long empty road which had seen heavy bombardment from the east. Israel had attacked Rafah, breaking the ceasefire, claiming that Hamas had kidnapped one of its soldiers. But yesterday Israel said the solider might be dead. Yet, as we found, Rafah continues to be under heavy attack, and the targets are young children, women, entire families, even a UN shelter.”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=N7lcNjTRSn4
Ordinarily I wouldn’t give a trigger warning with the above video because I think it’s immensely important that people witness what bombs do to a person’s body. People need to be so shocked and appalled that it rattles the core of their humanity in a way that forces them to wake up and demand that this slaughter be stopped.
However, it occurred to me that some of you may not watch the video unless I say it contains disturbing images. So, be warned, it’s hideous. Everybody, please contact the WH and your representatives and demand that they put a stop to Israel’s aggression so that what you see in the video doesn’t continue. And it will if we don’t speak out. Thank you.
Call the President:
PHONE NUMBERS
Comments: 202-456-1111
Switchboard: 202-456-1414
http://www.whitehouse.gov/contact/write-or-call
Gahh, you’d have to have a heart of stone to watch that video without crying. The mobs in Israel chanting, “No more school in Gaza – all the children are dead,” and “Gaza is a cemetery,” should be forced to watch it. Except they will never see these images because it’s considered too “controversial” to even air the NAMES of dead Palestinian children on TV, let alone images of their corpses. A nice whitewash. So wrong. So horrible.
I never paid attention to the last two wars in Gaza – I was too busy buying stuff on eBay. Besides, the MSM never really conveys a visceral sense of the reality of what these wars mean for the people and children of Gaza. Not like this video. But I’m looking now, and I’m reading, a lot, and I can’t help thinking, this has happened twice before in the last few years, and I never even noticed.
Yeah, a lot of people haven’t noticed. I didn’t start paying attention until relatively recently myself. A big part of the reason why this is so is because of the pro-Israeli bias in the mainstream media. Almost never would you see a Palestinian on television giving their side of the conflict. Whereas, the Israeli government was represented almost exclusively. However, that’s starting to change now thanks to social media and work by journalists like Glenn Greenwald, Max Blumenthal, Ali Abunimah, Rania Khalek, Rula Jebreal, and Ayman Mohyeldin. There’s still a ways to go, though. Although, I’m optimistic that majority of people will ultimately understand the injustice perpetrated on the Palestinian people by Israel and the US. Hopefully this will happen sooner rather than later.
John Stewart did a piece recently on the US
arming every country in the ME with high
tech weaponry. Many of these countries have ties to the Taliban and ISIS. This is how the US works for peace in the ME.
The only country the US is not arming is
Iran. The less democratic a country is the
more weapons they get.
Indeed and conversely, America stamps out/overthrows/undermines nascent democracies wherever they can be found.
Just read “Legacy of Ashes” on the history of the CIA. This is so true.
RT has already picked this up. They usually come out first with TI material but they were really quick this time.
http://rt.com/news/177716-us-israel-funding-aggression/
They hate each other so deeply, those two. I was told, it is never the person but only the action you can judge. I fail again and again as it is much easier to condemn a person than to condemn my own action.
The US government proclaims unanimity with Israel and its illegal occupation/siege and feeds it ammo/intelligence to kill 1,700 Palestinians and wounding 9,000 more. Simultaneously, the US rightly regards Israel to be a “menace” and a “threat”. That makes Israel incredibly evil and ingenious and the US incredibly evil and corrupt. Both are self-destructive.
@ Tujays:
You will be interested in following the NAM meeting in Tehran. They have already urged UN backing of humanity efforts to evacuate hospitals. Egypt is a NAM member.
See: “Iran after trial of Israeli criminals: Official”
http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2014/08/04/373965/iran-seeks-trial-of-israeli-criminals/
Also: “NAM Palestine meeting opens in Tehran”
http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2014/08/04/373967/nam-palestine-meeting-opens-in-tehran/
It has not yet happened that an Establishment news magazine has examined the existence and machinations of the American Israel Lobby. But in the UK, they have covered the lobby in Britain: the Dispatches news magazine aired an episode titled Inside Britain’s Israel Lobby 2009.
It is simply an amazing, and most, most enlightening piece of investigative journalism. (The Guardian’s editor Alan Rusbridger is interviewed about the lobby’s attempts to shape how the paper covers Israel and the Palestinians. Also reported is how the BBC was bullied by the lobby into canceling plans to air a charity appeal for Palestinian children.)
Until we have a U.S. version of this program, here is the fine one from the UK: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lby-BP5xVRI
Thanks, Mona. Also, a related and insightful article to read if you haven’t already:
AIPAC Is the Only Explanation for America’s Morally Bankrupt Israel Policy
“This Orwellian situation is eloquent testimony to the continued political clout of AIPAC (American Israel Public Affairs Committee) and the other hardline elements of the Israel lobby. There is no other plausible explanation for the supine behavior of the U.S. Congress–including some of its most “progressive” members–or the shallow hypocrisy of the Obama administration, especially those officials known for their purported commitment to human rights.”
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/stephen-m-walt/aipac-americas-israel-policy_b_5607883.html
Thanks, Tujays. Yet another article GC ought to read.
Always AIPAC isn’t it? Is it because its members are Jews? Because there are organizations such as Christians United for Israel which are no less powerful or influential.
And why is it another article I ought to read? It’s just regurgitated material from Walt’s book. If he were a physicist he would’ve been labeled a crank. Unfortunately political science does not require empirical evidence.
No, but certainly very often, considering they are consistently ranked as one of the most powerful lobby groups in the U.S.
No. It is is because they are, far and away, one of the most powerful U.S. lobby groups, and unquestionably the largest constituent group of the Israel Lobby.
Had you placed a period after “Israel” I’d agree, for that sentence would be true. But you continued with the absurd claim that the Xtian Zionist organization is equally powerful and influential.
Christians United for Israel is a member of the Israel Lobby, aka the Zionist Lobby, aka the Jewish Lobby. Nobody is saying the Zionist Lobby is exclusively Jews or Jewish.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel_lobby_in_the_United_States
Oh an one more question, lobbies are often at odds with each other (e.g. tech vs hollywood, or tech vs cable industry). What’s stopping you from creating an anti Israel lobby? I’m sure there won’t be a shortage of oil billionaires willing to bankroll it. If the Israeli lobby is so terrible and corrosive, start your own instead of whining.
We’re on it! It has started to grow online, in venues like this, and elsewhere. Organizations such as CAIR grow stronger every day, ad the BDS movement is taking college campuses by storm all over the U.S.
But getting to the point where we’d be large enough to pay off politicians as effectively as AIPAC et al., well, that’s gonna take a lot of work.
Still no numbers comparing the Israel lobby and others Mona? BSD is a failure. Taking campuses by storm my ass it is. It was established 9 years ago and did exactly nothing to improve Palestinian lives.
Moreover, while BDS’s methods are non violent, one of its goals is the de-facto destruction of Israel which is violent, therefore I seriously doubt it will gain any mainstream acceptance.
I don’t mind a boycott or divestments, it’s all good, but only if the goal is a two state solution. BDS’s fantasy land – Yugoslavia in the Middle East – vision is absurd and violent and this I cannot get behind.
Already told you, Virtually everybody ranks them in top 10 — as does the site from whence my quote is taken.
They are a huge, if not the hugest, force in the U.S. on matters pertaining to the Middle East: http://www.powerbase.info/index.php/American_Israel_Public_Affairs_Committee
As for your prattle about BDS, it is simply wrong.
Which part of it is wrong? That they changed jack shit in 9 years, or that objective number 3 of their charter is an indirect call to the destruction of Israel?
Also, I have to point out that you are rude, condescending and logically challenged. “Virtually everybody” is not a number, I hope that they at least teach that in law school.
By many accounts — sources pro and anti — BDS hit a tipping point in 2014. It is causing global businesses and academics to boycott and divest from Israel, and the BDS movement sweeping over U.S. campuses has Zionists deeply concerned that the pro-Palestinian view has become so normal at university, that future leaders will be receptive to it.
Here’s just one link: http://972mag.com/israel-crosses-the-tipping-point-becomes-an-economic-liability/87298/
There is much, much more reading on this topic available online.
There’s a name for this sort of thing. It’s called myopia. It only had a tipping point if you live in a leftist echo chamber. That BDS will never gain true mainstream acceptance – and thus will never achieve its goals – is a bet I’m willing to take, and I don’t even gamble.
From the horse’s mouth:
In practical terms this means the destruction of Israel and thus the movement will never gain acceptance beyond a small cabal of fringe lunatics. This is in fact unfortunate because without this part it could actually make a difference (I’d join for example).
Even Left-Wing Politicians Can’t Quit Israel
“And as Ellison’s frank comments suggest, lawmakers have to worry about alienating Jewish constituents before November’s midterm elections. For example, a recently leaked memo from Georgia Democratic Senate candidate Michelle Nunn’s campaign was explicit in tying a pro-Israel message to support from Jewish voters and fundraisers.”
“[Activists] look at Congress as hopeless. Moving Congress or moving the administration is hopeless,” said Kevin Martin, executive director of Peace Action, an anti-war group. “That’s why there’s a shift to [the BDS movement] rather than…trying to influence congressional or administrative policy on Israel.”
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/07/30/even-left-wing-congressmen-can-t-quit-israel.html
Clinton, Edwards Will Square Off At Aipac Tonight
“New York is the ATM for American politicians. Large amounts of money come from the Jewish community,” he said. “If you’re running for president and you want dollars from that group, you need to show that you’re interested in the issue that matters most to them.”
http://www.nysun.com/national/clinton-edwards-will-square-off-at-aipac-tonight/47843/
Hmmm…. from 2007? An interesting read anyway. I liked John Edwards because he did focus on poverty. that may have been just for show, but still, not many politicians would even come close to making that a priority.
The article does give a bit of “color background” as the influence of AIPAC is discussed.
Do you believe the article to be accurate for 2007 and, if so, do you think things have changed in any way?
Hi Tujays –
Do I believe the article accurate for 2007? Yes, I don’t know of any reason to believe it’s not factual. Do I think things have changed? Going by the way the members of Congress have behaved during this crisis, I’d say no. As I said the article is good for fleshing out come background.
Why I posted, if you’re curious, with no other context, it sounded as though it were a current article – which surprised me as I was sure Mr. Edwards’ political career was over. Just a thought: if we do link to non-current articles (I probably need to remember this myself!) it might be nice to give a heads up that it is dated. Doesn’t mean such an articles doesn’t have value; that kind of heads up just helps in getting one’s bearings while reading it. :-)
In behind the scenes , the U.S, and British intelligence agencies designate Israel a menace and threat to regional peace?
I don’t think the newyork times and the washingtonpost would report this even if the NSA wanted to make it public.
The middle east is a tragedy. John Bertotto
The whole middle east is a tragedy.The global warming issue will take care of it.When fighting for our own survival becomes a reality , the middle east will learn how to get along. John Bertotto
For those of us who know how Israel uses deception and false flag operations to engage ”friends” and enemies this is welcome documentation. I’m very pleased that Glenn made note of the distrust NSA, CGHQ, CSEC and EWD have towards Israel. This is not common knowledge among the people and is very important. Israel has manipulated the hell out of the American, British and Canadian people and some of the political class over decades of false flag and propagandistic operations.
Thank you for this Glenn
At least our intelligence agencies seem to have a very healthy attitude in this context.
The ammunition you mention — does that include the pallet-loads of pukey-green white phosphorus rounds we see in those pictures of Israeli 155mm artillery batteries firing? The flechettes they’re picking out of walls in Gaza, the ones that come in olive-drab-green rounds with yellow diamonds, the Beehive rounds?
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/israelgaza-conflict-israeli-military-using-flechette-rounds-in-gaza-strip-9617480.html
Oh, and 40mm rounds for grenade launchers. That’s a very low-velocity, low-range round used for close-in missions, for whatever that’s worth. Interesting.
Oh, and another mystery. The US is sharing this stuff with Israeli intelligence, so why this controversy about their monitoring the Secretary of State’s communications?
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/03/israel-spied-kerry-peace-effort-report
Maybe Kerry’s out of the loop? This doesn’t question this story, which is an eye-watering bit of news, but it does add a layer of bizarre to it, don’t it?
Congrats on a new and enormous scoop — and more questions they need to answer.
Oh, and this 1968 intelligence-sharing agreement hyperlinked above. This followed by one year, more or less, the Israeli naval and air attack on the US intelligence ship USS Liberty. This is truly bizarre.
The thing that never ceases to AMAZE me about the insane idiocy on which ALLLL this killing and strife rests — is that you got some group of people saying that “God gave them the land”. Oh really? What complete utter horsecrap. God did NOT come down and give anyone any land, ever!! Now maybe you got some seriously deluded groups of people saying that.. maybe you got that same group passing down WORD OF MAN in some ancient text and believing they’re the chosen ones — based on centuries of some group mass delusion. But I repeat –God did NOT come down and give anyone any land, ever!! Anyone that believes he / she / ‘it’ (God) did is just as deluded. PS — for all you flamers that gonna start — emails are set to auto delete. LOL So. FLAME ON!
Well, me as a Muslim I attest to God giving the land of Israel to the “Children of Israel” more then 3000 years ago. Not directly off course because a Creator can not fit in its creation that would be absurd (Like Steve Jobs going inside an IPhone) . It was done through Moses. Now after arriving in the land they started causing corruption (just like today). Even on their way to the Land they started worshiping Idols. They started killing prophets and forgot their promise they made to God. As a last resort God sent the Massiah (Jesus) that he promise to the Jews but they were so much lost in this world that they did not accept him and tried to kill him but God raised him to himself. Jews thought they were promised a kingdom in this earth but God was talking about a kingdom in the next world. Temple was destroyed there after and all the Jews were kicked out of Israel. After 2000 years they have went back and started doing the same thing that cause them to be kick out at the first place. Yes they will get their Kingdom on this earth but before that they will kill 90% of the world population and Temple will be rebuild. Anti Christ will be born in Israel and Jesus will come back and there will a fight against Him and Anti Christ and his army (70,000 Jews) all will be killed. That is the story if anybody wanted to know.
This is NOT the story James. Please take the religious bullshit some other place. Here we want to talk about the real world, not about what God intended, wanted, or whether he could insert himself into Israel or an iPhone or what his PLAN for Moses was. Nobody wants to hear about whether God promised something on earth or in the next world. Seems to me his promises are total bullshit. The only people who can keep promises it seems, are people with better weapons. If God or praying to god could solve this crisis, what on earth are all the Muslims doing but praying?
I don’t want to pick on the religious, but what you wrote above is patently absurd, and quite offensive. Don’t come back and tell me that it’s part of God’s fucking plan for which all these Palestinian children had to die. Don’t tell me that. I don’t care who’s coming back, Christ or the anti-Christ. Let him come some other fucking place. There is no reason for a single Palestinian child to die, because of your God’s ridiculous, morally repugnant, and unholy fucking plan.
Dear AthiestinChief –
I generally value your comments, but I really found this reply to James just a bit outside the line. You seem to dismiss any talk of religion as “not about the real world.” I happen to be a Christian and I have found that my faith is what helps me get through in the real world. Not only that, but trying to understand different points of view, religiously or otherwise helps us understand motivations and contexts of today’s problems.
You bring up the problem o suffering. I’m not sure I have a good answer for that. It’s something that even as a Christian I struggle with. I often wonder why people suffer and why aren’t prayers answered. I wish I had an answer, but I do still believe in God, or a Supreme Being, or a Great Spirit, or Allah, or “something bigger, ” Supreme Cosmic Force – I firmly believe in something “MORE.”
Personally, I have seen prayers answered and have experienced some, as a buddy of mine calls them, “happy coincidences.”
All that said, I conclude that I don’t fully understand why these bad things happen or are allowed to happen. Maybe indeed someday, I/we won’t be seeing through a glass darkly anymore. Until then, my strategy is to pray and to muddle through as best I can.
This world is a test for human being. You can call night a suffering if you compare it to the day. but we would be dead without the night. If there was no pain we would never know if we are hurt. If we did not how to cry (as a child) we would not get milk and die of hunger. There would be no world if there were no earthquakes. How can we live without the fire? yet it burns. Perfect example of how human support to act are Palestine. They suffer, they cry and beat their chest and then they bury the dead and move on hoping life will be better tomorrow. Our Prophet (PBUH) said “when you see the end of world coming and if you are planting a tree, finish planting it.”.Love, Happiness, hate and all the other good and bad of this life are part of this life without any of them life would not be possible or practical. Common confusion is about free will and God Plan. We are 100% free to make choice about which path we choose but does not mean we can choose to be anybody we want. A person is assigned to earn $100 in his life time he can choose to make that money either by stealing or working hard for it. Both are not the same. God’s plan is to give him a $100 and it is up to him how he collect it. Thanks for defending even though my comments were little out of place and out of context. Peace.
I did not say it being a Plan. People have a choice and free will to what they do or don’t. If you can see the the future does not mean you are one planing the future. Obama could easily choose to end all this today, Natanyahu could do the same. Fox News has to choice to report the truth and they have this choice every second of the day 24/7. No a single child has to die not just Palestine but any where in the world because of such injustice. What God can or cant do it none of your or my business this would is our test not his. Only thing i tried to point out is that those nukes Israel is holding are not just for Muslims Nations but for everybody. One day public opinion will change and world will turn against Israel but they are not the one to sit ideally by. The way they are treating Palestine they can do to anybody. It needs to stop and only people can do it, because all the governments have already sold themselves to the highest bidder.
My apologies James. I got carried away. What can I say. It’s the intensity of the impotence of the frustration that’s displayed in my language.
As a Muslim, I totally disagree. The Quran is God’s revelation. If you look at God’s revelation there is no land given to the Children of Israel. God also strongly condemns those who cause mass destruction such as with all of the modern weapons in the military e.g. There is [a kind of] man whose views on the life of this world may please you [Prophet], he even calls on God to witness what is in his heart, yet he is the bitterest of opponents.
2:205 When he leaves, he sets out to spread corruption in the land, destroying crops and live-stock- God does not like corruption.
2:206 When he is told, ‘Beware of God,’ his arrogance leads him to sin. Hell is enough for him: a dreadful resting place.
2:207 But there is also a kind of man who gives his life away to please God, and God is most compassionate to His servants.
Study the Quran and what you are saying is not in there. If you are in any way referring to the Hadith – the Hadith are not God’s revelation, God said obey the Messenger and the Messengers duty was to deliver the Message, not write down so called Hadith which are more like hearsay. The anti-christ as I recall is not mentioned in the Quran but in Hadith. God swt said He would preserve the Quran which is firstly a recitation in Quranic Arabic, with an incredibly intricate structure that would be very difficult to maintain etc. God never said write down the Hadith. The Hadith include punishments like stoning. The Quran does not. The Quran includes other punishments and these Hadith go against the Quran.
I am not getting into a religious debate. I want to put this down since you seem to want to “attest” to God giving something. God swt will judge between us our differences on the Last Day.
In general, considering some of the other comments on here: This whole conflict is also not about religion. If most Jews became atheists, the atrocities would still go on. This is about Zionism – it’s so popular and trendy to blame religion for everything. This means people do not deal with the real issues and rabid nationalism is not dealt with.
I thought,by their actions,that they already were atheists of the Adolf or Uncle Joe variety,as no God would countenance their actions ,other than a bogus one.
” “We [Allah] gave the persecuted people [the Jews] dominion over the eastern and western lands which We had blessed [the east and west banks of the Jordan River]. Thus your Lord’s gracious word was fulfilled for the Israelites,” – Quran 28:5-6. My thought are bases on this Aya and rest are my personal options. What you said still stands its ground.
Why always derail the conversation to religious beliefs!
Just for clarification, the Children of Israel were allowed to settle in a land but there is no mention that they would create a nation state that would be called “Israel” with specific borders etc.
Agree 100%.
“The new Snowden documents illustrate a crucial fact: Israeli aggression would be impossible without the constant, lavish support and protection of the U.S. government(.)”
How much longer must we listen to the b/s spewed by israel and its enablers about israel’s alleged superior science and vaaaaast contributions to world economy? Israel’s own economy is a disaster, its genocidal army depends on the US tax payers’ largesse, its best educated/smartest people are a steady stream of humanity emigrating; most to Germany….
According to archeologists Finkelstein/Silberman’s “Bible Unearthed” biblical Israel (of David, Solomon, Moses, et al) never existed as anything more than an underpopulated land of illiterate pagan goatherders. The reason the religion is called Judaism, not Israelism, is b/c it was invented around 700BC in Judea, first as a pagan, polytheistic cult, that gradually around 100 BC evolved into a monotheistic religion that has survived into the present b/c of massive proselytising (Shlomo Sand “The Invention of the Jewish people”), i.e., conversion of pagans living around the Mediterranean basin and beyond. In effect, there is nothing unique about Judaism: it is just another religion invented by the rich and powerful to exert their power over useful idiots, such as the present day muslim, christian and jewish unsophisticated naifs and fanatics to do their masters’ bidding.
Present day Israel is a fraud. Israel of the Antiquities never existed, Judea was never an independent, self-governing entity, but rather a colony trampled by just about every power in the region: Egyptians, Sumerians, Persians, Hittites, Greeks, Romans. Judea is where the cult/religion was invented and practiced as one of many in the region.
Not until the world Jewry learns to separate its personal religious choice from the physical reality of their citizenship, nothing will change, beyond the escalating self-tarnishing of their faith that gradually is being equated with the cult of Naziism. Unfair, yes. But that’s what happens when a religion is equated with a secular presence: just like in Iran, S.Arabia or any other fanatical religious state.
Time for the US to withdraw its props and let the ME warmonger learn to stand like the rest of humanity, or fall under the weight of its own barbaric stupidity.
Please separate yourself from your current location and return your property ASAP to its rightful owner.
Interesting, if an overly intolerant idea. What the world has given to the rabid zionists in an effort to make up for the horror of Jewish lives lost during WW2, the world may have to take away until/unless the israelis learn how to live in peace with the rest of humanity, and like their forefathers, learn how to make their own living, rather than depend on handout$, theft, and genocide to expand their notion of israeli property. Perhaps now’s the time to re-establish an international mandate, while the israelis learn the principles of democratic self-determination and peaceful coexistence. And, no, spraying “Arabs to the gas chambers” graffitti on the wall that surrounds ghetto-israel, is not the way to go. Whatever next for the Palestinians in their own land: green armbands with the Crescent Moon and Star? Time is running out for israel to learn to live and let live and worship without defacing its own sacred beliefs and traditions. Or the fate of the Nazi contagion that has defaced Germany will spread to israel. Zionists as the ultimate antisemites?
One of the reason the Snowden leaks are important, is the potential for governments to abuse what should be private information. Now the tables are turned and Glenn Greenwald is abusing Snowden documents by selectively releasing tidbits at politically sensitive moments and towards causes which seem personal.
This part is critical:
The American public needs to be made aware of this; that their government officials are lying to them about how glorious and wonderful “the only democracy” is.
In private, they know what we all do, to wit: that Israel is a an aggressor and a menace to both the Palestinians and to regional peace.
So why then, one must wonder, do our elected officials — knowing the menace that Israel is — lavish it with money and diplomatic cover?
Answer: $$$THE ISRAEL LOBBY$$$
Because of this pernicious cancer in our body politics, the U.S. supports Israel in matters against our own interest, that are murderous to Palestinians, and which militate against regional peace.
It goes all the way back to 1948, when Harry Truman was very distressed by pressure from Zionists at home and abroad, who eventually extorted him onto recognizing the State of Israel against his better judgement.
Truman feared that by doing so he and the world were laying the groundwork for WWIII — but he had to keep the Zionist vote. There was no significant Arab voting block in the U.S. at the time, as he wryly noted.
And so it has usually gone with the U.S. government ever since: placating the Israel Lobby no matter what. (But privately snarling at the Zionists, as Truman most certainly did.) It wold be magnificent if Snowden documents can bring this ugly reality to the light of the American public.
For more on Zionism, Israel and Harry Truman, I highly recommend John Judis’ book here: http://www.amazon.com/Genesis-American-Origins-Israeli-Conflict/dp/0374161097
I find it interesting that you decided to embellish the words “The Israel lobby” with dollar signs and all caps. If it weren’t a play on that old “Jews controls all the banks” chestnut it’d be just plain childish. As it is, it’s offensive.
” If it weren’t a play on that old “Jews controls all the banks” chestnut it’d be just plain childish.”
It isn’t. It specifically states “lobby,” as in paying for votes.
“As it is, it’s offensive.”
No, it’s unequevically accurate. Thinking otherwise is offensive.
” The corporations don’t have to lobby the government anymore. They are the government.”
Jim Hightower
So first you add a comment of your own, then mix in mine and call it inaccurate. I think there’s a name for this kind of rhetorical device… Strawman
In your tedious insistence on finding antisemitism everywhere, you do indeed ignore that I, and Silly Putty, are talking about a lobby.
Indeed, Business Pundit ranks the Israel Lobby among the 10 Most Powerful in the U.S., right up their with Big Oil.:
And again, this lobby and its $$ explains why U.S. officials trip all over themselves to say nice and supportive things about Israel in public, while in private they admit it is a terrible menace.
We have a lobby in the U.S. that is so powerful it extorts our officials into adopting policies in favor of a foreign country, even if doing so is unjust and/or runs counter to U.S. interests.
Oh Mona, you must be a terrible lawyer, being unfamiliar with basic logic…
I was referring specifically to your $$$THE ISRAEL LOBBY$$$ line. It is the offensive part because it is an obvious (if not particularly clever – that’s why it’s obvious) play on an old antisemitic conspiracy theory.
I suggest that you take a look at this website and educate yourself.
No, for this is not a conspiracy of any sort. It is an unfortunate fact, wide open and documented, for all to see.
Once again you’re attempting to worm your way out of being held responsible for your own arguments. The conspiracy theory being that Jews control all the world’s banking and finance interests (even ignoring for a second that “Jews” are not a single monolithic entity), not that there exists a pro Israel lobby.
GC flies off the rails with:
I’ve said not a word about silly conspiracy theories in which Jews control the world through banks & etc.
That’s the strawman you’ve interjected here. Has nothing to do with me or my arguments.
I am discussing the widely known phenomenon of the American Israel Lobby. The same lobby Glenn writes about in this other article — of the many in which he has addressed the topic. This one is about the lobby going after Obama hammer and tongs: http://www.salon.com/2011/05/22/israel_48/
Mona at least have the spine to stand behind your statements. If they are false or offensive admit it and move on.
Once again, the phrase $$$THE ISRAEL LOBBY$$$ with the dollar signs and all caps is an obvious nod to THAT conspiracy theory. It’s no strawman.
The fact that you keep trying to paint it as some innocent and pure comment relating to the Israeli lobby merely underscores that you know exactly what you meant and really don’t like being called out on it.
Frankly it’s a little bit disgusting, if not unexpected.
GC becomes overwrought:
This is your brain on Zionism, GC. It isn’t uncommon for the Zionist-deluded to imagine people saying things other than what they clearly said. Or to deny a manifest fact.
It’s a Lobby. The Israel Lobby. And it’s $$$ buys American politicians. See Tujay’s comment here: https://firstlook.org/theintercept/2014/08/04/cash-weapons-surveillance/#comment-63930 -and the one of his below it in that thread.
Keep digging Mona. Now you’ve added one more ad hominem to the growing list. Shameful. You should be disbarred for incompetence.
Sillyputty gets it. Well said.
GC, you are a fool, and Mona just kicked your ass. I thought I would let you know what any fool should be able to see, but apparently you are a special kind of fool. Go lick you wounds and come back after contemplating your navel for at least 24 hours.
@GC – Apparently my mis-italicizing has confused what are very simple points.
Hoping to clarify:
Where you say “If it weren’t a play on that old “Jews controls all the banks” chestnut it’d be just plain childish,”I respond with:
“It isn’t [a play on anything] It specifically states “lobby,” as in paying for votes.”
You then go on to say “As it is, it’s offensive,”to which I respond with:
“No, it’s unequevically accurate. Thinking otherwise is offensive.”
So it is you, GC, that is constructing straw-men where non exist, as well as conflating a country, Israel, with a culture, Jewish, in order to try to discredit an easily verifiable argument.
““Now that I have you thoroughly confused, let me pause to hear your own dismayed cry.”
Ray Bradbury, Zen in the Art of Writing
I understand your intent and I can still read, there’s no need for a play-by-play, the tool John Kelly’s remarks notwithstanding. The way Mona’s argument was presented however – the capital letters and the dollar signs – is clearly a play on that conspiracy theory.
Furthermore when Mona mentions the Israeli lobby, it’s always AIPAC, the Jewish organization that’s part of that lobby that she speaks of, not any of the others, so I’m not the one conflating Jews and Israel.
This would be because Mona knows what she is talking about, that is, how the powerful force known as AIPAC works. It is the umbrella organization that represents dozens of Zioist Jewish organization:
You are welcome.
No, this story’s implications are far more profound than that. It suggests that a) Israeli and US intelligence at some level, maybe SIGINT, maybe more, have fused into a single entity and b) either other US agencies/policymakers still think Israel is in an intelligence threat, or else that’s the cover story. The only question remaining is whether this, er, matrix governs both countries’ security establishments or represent a joint-powers power that’s still growing.
You seem unaware of the stranglehold this lobby and its dollars has on our political discussions and politicians. I suggest you read Stephen Walt and John Mearsheimer’s book, The Israel Lobby, which Glenn Greenwald discusses here: http://www.salon.com/2011/09/18/friedman_14/
Just as reality has a well-known liberal bias, I guess it is also is biased toward what hardcore Zionists would deem to be “antisemitic.”
Oh my, Mona, you are full of logical fallacies today. This comment is an example of the best known and most widely used fallacy on the political left, it’s called (drum roll please) ad hominem.
GC: the facts I recite may be deeply unpleasant to you. But they are the facts nevertheless. Hand-waving, vacuous misdirection about fallacies doesn’t change those facts.
Do read both the book, and Greenwald’s article about it and the authors, the latter which I linked to above.
This isn’t vacuous or misdirection. You used ad hominem to attack me. Simple as that. No amount of wiggling will get scot free here.
I am familiar with the book and I disagree with it. It’s predicated on the premise that Israel wanted and pushed for the war in Iraq, which is false. If it has no foundation to stand on, the entire argument collapses.
The profitable and mutually beneficial relationship between the countries’ arms industries explain the support Israel receives much better than a lobby.
Well, no. As the Amazon description of the book states:
And as Glenn’s above revelations show, in private U.S. officials will state the truth: that Israel is a menace. They won’t say these things publicly, or act on them, because of the Israel Lobby’s influence and $$$ in U.S. politics.
The book has been widely discussed, now in mainstream, Establishment circles. Whatever else is true, the books influence and arguments have not collapsed.
They also stated more than once that France is a menace too. Why won’t they say these things publicly? Is this the nefarious meddling and the monied interests of the French lobby?
Seriously the bar for social science arguments is so low. No proof or calculations needed to promote one’s conjectures. All that’s needed is to write a book. Bam! Now we have a theory.
GC makes my point for me:
There is no French Lobby. And I, for one, would be delighted if we treated France as we do Israel, in terms of public support for its foreign policy positions (including at the UN) and foreign military aid. As it is, we often reject and distance ourselves from France.
But, zut alors, there is no French Lobby, while in contrast, the U.S. Israel Lobby rivals Big Oil and Big Finance for control of our body politic. So, the U.S. kisses Israel’s ass.
You argument was that even though in private U.S. officials claim Israel is a menace they are prevented from saying that publicly because of the Israeli lobby, correct?
France is also referred to as a menace, privately, by U.S. officials. If there is no French lobby, why won’t those officials say that publicly?
I don’t see how that observation makes your point for you.
Also you forgot a bunch of lobbies in your list, like big Pharma, health insurance, Hollywood, various agri business lobbies (why is pizza considered a vegetable? why are American supermarkets full of corn byproducts?), Monsanto and friends, and many many others.
There was no ad hominem attack. Mona calls you a Zionist; if you find that offensive, then maybe you should read what you are writing.
Also, I’m not sure where you get that writing “$$$THE ISRAEL LOBBY$$$” like so is anti-Semitic. You might have a leg to stand on if she had written it as “$$$THE JEWISH LOBBY$$$” – but most of us here understand that not all Jews are Israel-Firsters and Zionists as well.
shadedmagus:
Why are y’all so bloody literal minded? Don’t they teach children to look for meaning in text nowadays? Mona uses “Zionist” as an ad hominem because to her it does not mean “person who believes Jews should have a state”, no, to her it means “evil child murdering racist bigot”. Ever heard of the phrase it’s the thought that counts?
Same goes for the phrase with the dollar signs. It’s not the literal meaning of it that’s offensive, it’s the implication – the dollar signs in particular – that hints at an age old conspiracy theory.
I’d be delighted if the U.S. directed the contempt at Israel that some officials have directed at France. If we were quite willing to reject Israel’s foreign policy positions as we often do with France.
But, we have no French Lobby, much less one in the Top Ten, up there with Big Pharma, Tech, Big Finance and Big Oil. Yup, Israel Lobby is right up and snug with those guys in power and influence, on behalf of a foreign country.
And also the cable lobby (dying net neutrality, Comact buying TWC, etc) and the Cuban lobby and many others.
How about numbers? Give us the numbers that prove the Israel lobby is so powerful. Show me the money Mona.
* Comcast
Mona, I just did a search on Google for; “Israeli Lobby” and then “AIPAC” and in both cases – No results found. Man, everyone is talking about it all over the internet but Google doesn’t return any results.
Here Mona, I little help for you: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/in-the-loop/wp/2014/05/14/which-foreign-countries-spent-the-most-to-influence-u-s-politics/
Clearly Israel is not the only one. And of course that still doesn’t include the Cuban [exiles] lobby and many others.
Show me, Mona, that the pro Israel lobby spends more than anyone else. You too Señor Paul Fleischer, show me the money.
Man, Someone doesn’t read all the way through their references…….
I read it.
Paul: You searched incorrectly, then. When I use the search term “Israel Lobby,” Google returns 30,900,000 hits.
AIPAC yields 886,000 results.
Sanofi-Aventis, BNP Paribas, Total…France has lobbies, but they don’t blip well on the tech radar. A relation made a film about that French whore ripping off Burzynski with the FDA’s help, or however he spells it.
Oh,and GC? The problem with your WaPo article is that it reports on money spent by foreign countries to lobby in the U.S.
Do you not understand what the AIPAC acronym stands for? American Israel Public Affairs Committee.
It is a domestic lobbying group, albeit lobbying on behalf of a foreign country.
Mona,
I’m surprised that you didn’t see the humor in my post.
The “helpless bystander” meme is unshakable with hardcore Team Blue partisans. Many of them still ludicrously frame Obama’s Libyan adventure as a NATO treaty obligation that he was helpless to avoid. You can’t even have a coherent conversation with people like that. I don’t even try to discuss Gaza with those people.
As if the above isn’t frightening enough, it is more frightening that it will most likely stay right here and be read and circulated by a few. And those few of us who disseminate it will be called, Jew haters, anti-semite’s, bigots, liars, wussies, f*gs, and those other words they turn to when they don’t know how to reply to truth.
And the most recent disgusting item I have learned. MEDIA MATTERS of America who I have given tons of air time to on my various radio/tv outlets (now retired) over the years are now in bed with the Bibi’s making sweet snuggles with the child killers. I mean people really buy into this “chosen” crap. What incredible marketing. Like Cedric, The Great Entertainer. I am Jack Jett, The Great Chosen Anti-Semitic F*g Wussie!
The ridiculousness is nauseating seeing our government fund and supply blood shed it could stop. They used the 72 hour cease fire to reload on US ammunition. Jon Stewart said it best “We cannot be Israel’s rehab sponsor and its drug dealer!” http://t.co/zWWf4RWgfu“
Now what? Fuck Israel, no? I rest my epitome of an intellectual case…
Treason Revealed. Treason Revealed. Treason Revealed. Treason Revealed. Treason Revealed.
Justice is Demanded by Humanity. Justice is Demanded by Humanity. Justice is Demanded by Humanity.
Governmental Fraud Revealed. Governmental Fraud Revealed. Governmental Fraud Revealed.
The Dark Mask has been removed. The Dark Mask has been removed.
Each Individual must take responsibility to hold these criminals to account for their actions.
Each Individual must take responsibility to hold these criminals to account for their actions.
The fiction, the illusion, the deception, the lies are now revealed to Humanity.
Humanity has renounced all deceptive contracts with these corporate governments because they are a Fiction and a Fraud.
The Inhumanity must STOP.
Action begins NOW.
I have not left this cave for days now, it has become my last refuge in my total despair. I have only the music of the waterfall to comfort me now. I can no longer live under the control of the Federation, but there is no other place to go. My last hope is that with my death I may pass into the world of my dream, and know peace at last.</em<
The sleep is still in my eyes
The dream is still in my head
I heave a sigh and sadly smile
And lie a while in bed
I wish that it might come to pass
Not fade like all my dreams
Just think of what my life might be
In a world like I have seen
I don’t think I can carry on
Carry on this cold and empty life
Oh no!
My spirits are low in the depths of despair
My lifeblood spills over…
“And whoever shall exalt himself shall be abased: and he that shall humble himself shall be exalted.” {Matthew 23:12}
“God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble.” {Jas. 4:6}
“The destinies of men are subject to immutable laws that must fulfill themselves. But man has it in his power to shape his fate, according as his behavior exposes him to the influence of benevolent or of destructive forces.” # 15 Image, I-Ching
“Only through having the courage to marshal one’s armies against oneself, will something forceful really be achieved.” # 15 Line 6, I-Ching
Attention all Planets of the Solar Federation
Attention all Planets of the Solar Federation
Attention all Planets of the Solar Federation
We have assumed control
We have assumed control
We have assumed control
I wonder what intelligence the NSA enabled Israel to get about those hundreds of Gazan children, now dead.
That is to say, with all of this spying and with all of Israel’s claims about precision targeting, the killings have been wildly indiscriminate. Not to mention the fact that Israel is just now discovering the Terror Tunnels.
The US could put an end to the Israeli Gaza offensive just as quickly as Russia could put an end to the Ukraine uprising. Foreign posturing is so thick with hypocrisy it’s nauseating.
Does it require a Snowden-type disclosure to blow apart the reality distortion field built up around Ukraine also? As anyone can see by sizing up the UN voting results inserted above, the rest of the world “got” what comes as a thunder strike in the minds of so many upon reading Glenn’s article. What we have here is a nation of citizens who have abdicated their political obligation to humanity to act responsibly by delivering their treasure and monstrous weapons of violence into the hands of fiends acting with impunity.
Shhh;The USA started the whole mess by supporting the overthrow of an elected government,but don’t let facts sway your storytelling.Russia has shown admirable restraint to NATO provocations.
Flight 17;It’s obvious by now that our boys did the deed,hence the silence from the US and it’s serial liars.
You mean the Joooish government of Ukraine did it. Look at the US’s government, all branches, look at the banking and business, along with the media – they are heavily Joooish, especially when the jooooos only make up 2% of the US’s population. They want the US to take the blame so the rest of the world will do to us what happened to Germany, Britain and the rest of Europe at the end of WWI and WWII. They are the destroyers – and wherever they go they bring destruction. Does no one remember how many joooos came into the USA after WWI and WWII?
You ugly hate monger. You are a huge part of the world’s problems.
Yes like an army of invading rats.Actually rats would be preferable.
I thought the Russians shot down the Malaysian plane, while selling the stock short, because they helped the Chechen Muslims.
If there was a Ukrainian fighter-bomber tailing the passenger plane as reported, then that makes me wonder whether Kiev wasn’t using the passenger plane as a giant human shield to hide behind as it went in to take out the anti-air position. And I also find it entirely troublesome that the plane was diverted INTO the battle area by Ukrainian air traffic control. The flight had been diverted out of that area for the previous dozen or so flights, and then suddenly someone ordered it back into that area mid-flight. With a fighter-bomber reportedly on its tail too. But we’re told to blame Russia by the MAGICIANS who don’t want you to focus on what the other hand is doing.