Leading American politicians of both major parties appear to share an extreme reluctance to openly criticize the human rights abuses of Saudi Arabia, a U.S. ally that has ramped up executions of its own citizens, led a coalition bombing effort in Yemen that has killed thousands of civilians, and supported Sunni extremist groups throughout war-torn Syria.
Given the news this week that Saudi-led forces bombed a wedding party in Yemen, killing scores of civilians, as well as the decision by the Saudi government to behead and then crucify Ali Mohammed al-Nimr, the nephew of a government critic arrested as a teenager, I attempted to talk about the Saudi Arabian human rights record to a number of politicians at the Washington Ideas Forum, an event hosted by The Atlantic and the Aspen Institute to discuss “this year’s most pressing issues and ideas of consequence.”
Most were uninterested in commenting.
Former Republican presidential nominee Mitt Romney smiled and repeatedly said, “Nice to see you,” when I asked if he had any concerns about the Saudi-led bombing campaign in Yemen.
I found Sen. Chris Coons, D-Del., as he was getting out of his car. “As the co-founder of the Human Rights Caucus in the Senate, I do think we need to pay attention to human rights all over the world, regardless of where human rights violations arise,” he said.
I asked if he would comment specifically on Saudi Arabia. Coons ignored me and continued walking into the building, even though a staff member accompanying him had just informed the senator that he had “plenty of time” before his speech. The staff member offered to exchange contact information for a lengthier comment later. I emailed and did not hear back.
Sen. Mark Warner, D-Va., stopped briefly to chat. “Obviously I’m concerned in particular with some of the indiscriminate bombing in Yemen and, as we think about the increasing responsibilities that all of the Gulf states have in the challenge against ISIL, it shows that one, they need to step up and they need to step up with more focus than the kind of indiscriminate bombing, frankly.”
I asked Warner if that meant there needed to be a pause in the bombing in Yemen. “That’s the comment I’ve made,” Warner replied, turning to leave the building.
Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., spent the most time discussing the issue with me. But his answers were perplexing.
“They may be bombing civilians, which is actually not true,” McCain said, when asked about civilian casualties in Yemen.
“Civilians aren’t dying?” I asked.
“No, they’re not,” the senator replied. “Oh, I’m sure civilians die in war. Not nearly as many as the Houthis have executed,” McCain continued, referring to the Shiite militia waging an insurgency against the Sunni government in Yemen.
Asked about the recent reports of Saudi forces bombing a wedding party in Yemen, McCain said, “I’m sure in wars terrible things happen and the Houthis however are an extremist group backed by the Iranians who are slaughtering Yemenis.”
The U.N. High Commissioner for Human Rights has reported that more than 2,300 civilians have been killed in the Yemen conflict, and that both Houthi rebels and the Saudi-led forces share responsibility for the deaths. The UNHCHR spokesperson has told reporters, however, that the Saudi-led bombing campaign has caused most of the deaths.
I tried to ask McCain, who serves as chairman of the International Republican Institute, a U.S. government-backed human rights and democracy promotion nonprofit, if he had an opinion on the spate of executions in Saudi Arabia, which have averaged at a rate of one execution every two days.
“Of course I have always stood for human rights and will continue to keep standing for human rights,” he said.
Photo Caption: Saudi army artillery fire shells toward Yemen from a post close to the Saudi-Yemeni border.
Please sign this petition to save Ali Mohammed Al Nimr from crucifixion. http://wh.gov/iQiCR
#bringourtroopshome Did you speak with Rand Paul? I’ve heard him (thankfully, though one isn’t enough) calling out Saudi Arabia for human rights abuses and on other issues. #standwithrand
I can see why it’s more complicated for the United States to maintain strong ties with the Saudis…They do buy an obscene amount of Boom boom from the Americans…. And thus the endless Saudi sorties terrorizing civilians in Sanaa.
Here in Canada, we have the tar-sands don’t we? Additionally, what Muslim women choose to wear’s a hot topic in Canada. Personally ladies have to decide for themselves…but you’d think with such spicy issues in Canada right now and an election just around the corner the PM would be listening to potential voters and would at least give the appearance of challenging Saudi Arabia on their dismal human rights record. Oh right, Stephen Harper is our current PM. All Hail the Mad Saudi King
When this american empire falls I hope the likes of McCain and his likes will be brought to justice for their responsible and ignorant actions . It’s only fair.
Sadly, McCain nor any other American war monger will ever be brought to justice. As well as the true War Criminals of the Bush administrations. “Fair” has nothing to do with anything as those with the power all have nails in the soles of their boots.
If Saudi Arabia and others, are perplexed by the condemnation of slaughtering civilians in a wedding party, please do not be surprised. A country that has never recognized nor practiced civil liberties and human rights and home, is truly ill-positioned to recognize its own violations of the same, elsewhere. They just have no awareness. Period.
This is precisely why Saudi Arabia is the ideal nation used by the members of the so-called coalition to bomb Yemen. Saudia would have absolutely no scrupples. And sure enough, it has none. And if ordered to wipe out the entire nation, Houthi or not, they would do so gleefully and have absolutely no problems doing it.
Without a culture and tradition of respect for civil liberties and human rights that serve as a restraining force in some societies, it would be naive to expect anything better from this country.
Actually the Saudi leaders do not need any outside encouragement outside of maintaining their absolute control of their subjects and their hatred and fear of Iran. A bit like the big corporate leaders in the USA really.
Thank you, Mr. Fang, for capturing the prevailing tendency of government leaders and policy makers to use a lot of words to say as little as possible, obscuring rather than clarifying the issues they are supposed to be addressing and, always, covering their asses by avoiding even the suggestion of their personal accountability for the messes that they have helped to create.
Just as the Emperor was really wearing no clothes, the media’s “talking heads” aren’t really saying anything worth listening to. Total despair seems the only appropriate response.
McCain says he’s standing for human rights…zombies the lot of them
Much like Saudi Arabia, the US also executes (sometimes innocent) people and drops bombs on weddings. Although the US does the latter using drones which is much more fancier.
Opened another newspaper and the first thing I saw was that the US bombed a hospital run by Medecins Sans Frontieres in Kunduz, Afghanistan. Apparently the only hospital in the region able to handle major injuries. Think that beats wedding; then again, the wedding was on purpose and this was collateral damage (or so they say).
WHO determines and defines US foreign policy? Who ever it is, their enforcer is biggest stinking turd in the cesspool ..Samantha Powers…
http://www.mintpressnews.com/how-america-helped-saudi-arabia-block-a-human-rights-inquiry-in-yemen/210049/
I don’t know how this stinking cunt can look in the mirror. Or how people around her stand the stench.
If only we could find a way to marry the respect of Human Rights to increased wealth and self-importance they’d all be doing a sharp about turn as we speak, knocking each other to the ground in their fight to answer your questions.
It’s so utterly nauseating. But, good for you Lee Fang for having a strong stomach. The tragedy is, I doubt they even realize just how fatuous and morally/ethically criminal they are. One wonders what exactly makes them tick. I have come to realize that this much lauded ego-driven myth of “survival of the fittest” actually means development of a dangerous mega parasite, in human form. I’m sure there must be a Kafkaesque story in there somewhere.
‘our’ (sic) society has become a giant machine selecting for and rewarding psychopaths…
works very well…
…for the psychopaths !
The Kafkaesque story is that the people in this country keep voting for “their” side, thinking somehow “their” rulers (wouldn’t dare call them leaders) will change things.What makes them tick? What makes anyone want power? This train runs on one track and even if the best of the lot, Bernie Sanders or Rand Paul (choose your side), is the engineer, nothing will change. Consider not voting.
A criminal neocon has a statement about upholding human rights?? Isn’t that some kind of oxymoron, especially coming from the head nut of war mongering neocons??
Great article, but when it comes to the Aspen Institute, the only thing anyone really needs to know is (from their Wikipedia entry):
“The Aspen Institute is largely funded by foundations such as the Carnegie Corporation, the Rockefeller Brothers Fund, the Gates Foundation, the Lumina Foundation, and the Ford Foundation,…”
Speaking of the Saudis:
http://911blogger.com/news/2015-09-27/why-saudi-ties-911-mean-us-ties-911
And an extra special recent video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u3keULhBlQc
“Gun control,” cries President Obama!
Well, they surely need gun control and the US government to stop sending guns, to that area!
Thanks!
While the Saudis (and the CIA) are funding and arming “rebels” like al Qaida in Syria, and the US, the Saudis and Gulf state monarchs brought IS into existence, and while Turkey bombs Kurds instead of IS…
… today we have the Saudis, Turks and Americans denouncing Russia for “aiding IS” by bombing the “rebels”… as if helping Assad who is fighting IS too doesn’t help in that fight.
We also have Reuters “journalists” blaming Assad for the rise of IS as if our role, and those of our “allies” is unknown to the world. Granted, the MSM has tried to keep Americans ignorant by not reporting the truth, but many have none the less become aware.
Essentially, the neolibcon cabal controlling the government and media are hell bent on deception, dishonesty and propaganda to continue our failed policies and have such a low regard for Americans that they think they can keep getting away with it.
The questions about human rights posed by Mr Fang are a significant step in exposing the bipartisan effort in misleading Americans… not just the obvious hypocrisy on human rights.
Keep up the good work Lee.
Any chance we’ll get a piece devoted to how the CIA and Saudis have “supported Sunni extremist groups throughout war-torn Syria”?
Numerous articles at TI have mentioned it, but so far, we’ve gotten no articles on the specific topic.
Thanks
Saudi Arabia is the new nazi germany and politicians everywhere in the western world are the Neville Chamberlains’ of their time…
How creepy it must be, asking serious questions and getting these deliberately ridiculous answers.
And that is why Mr. Fang continues to deliver . . . .
This is why America is hated throughout the world. We have extremist, belligerent politicians like McCain who sides with violent Sunni extremist groups just like he sides with a head chopping regime of Saudi Arabia. Thankfully this lunatic did not become President; however, Obama isn’t too far off from this either. But goes to show how ignorant our elected officials are but it is reflective of the ignorant Americans who vote these losers into power.
Sorry to say it, Lee, but you chose some of the worst war mongers to comment. They are in debt to the sellers of weapons and training of Saudi warriors in the Middle East. Expecting them to stand for human rights in a militaristic kingdom is not realistic, whether wedding parties are killed or millions starve or not.
Causing “the worst war mongers” to go on record by either not answering — (“Nice to see you”–Mitt Romney, or answering in gibberish — em>(“They may be bombing civilians, which is actually not true,” McCain said, when asked about civilian casualties in Yemen.
“Civilians aren’t dying?” I asked.
“No, they’re not,” the senator replied, is not something to be sorry about.
Meanwhile, Saudi Arabia bombs wedding in Yemen killing lots of civilians. The Dutch cry foul and administer resolution calling for investigation into civilian deaths. SA then twists it’s magic saber into Western governments sides, who then call for NO resolution or investigations. Period. Thankful SA, and Western governments proceed to immediately condemn Russia for..you got it. Killing civilians.
https://www.emptywheel.net/2015/10/02/days-after-bombing-a-wedding-party-and-squelching-un-investigation-in-yemen-saudi-arabia-worries-about-civilian-casualties/
You can’t make this shit up.
Meanwhile, the entire fucking scumbag Congress looks at the floor in total denial.
I’d spit in every one of these cockroach’s face.
At times it’s funny though. Listening to the American administration warning Russia that Syria is a quagmire, another Afghanistan. I’m not even sure if they mean a Russian Afghanistan or an American Afghanistan. :)
Come on Americans, wake up and get real. ‘Il n’y a plus d’Amerique’ (Brel) —
Israel and Saudi Arabia have by now long been calling all the shots.
U.S. politicians won’t condemn the Saudis for the doing the same things they do? Shocking. This is what I would have expected:
“You’re right, Lee, there is a problem with Saudi strategy — they should be bombing funerals too.”
“There is solid legal precedent for killing a child who ‘should have a more responsible father.'”
Good work.
McCain must be losing it or more of it.. It reminds me of a Dave Chappelle skit with Charlie Murphy and Rick James. Rick in one instant denies grinding his feet on the couch, then in the next instant admits doing it. Cocaine is a helluva drug.
Not losing it … just crooked. Have a look at his deal for Rio Tinto, handing over one of the best copper mines in America to his corporate sponsor. Which happens to be on Apache land, but what’s changed since last century? You might as well ask a Nike sneaker if it wants to vote for Adidas.
True. They’re all crooked and slimey. Look how Mitt Romney responded to Lee Fang: “Nice to see you.” just duck dodge dive delay, etc..
Seriously, McCain is a lunatic.
The first disqualification for being a U.S. politician should be an affirmative answer to the question: “Do you want to be a politician?”
Or, look up Keating Five. If perchance you use Google, what will come up is the smiling face of John McCain. That was in the ’80s and yet the good people of Arizona have sent this crook and – sorry but the Donald is right on this one – unhero back to the Senate four or five times since, while imprisoning people whose only crime was to cross the border without a passport. Such is American politics and justice.
Yup, and since his sister married into the Morgan family (as in JP Morgan, and no, they didn’t lose all their money, etc. as their PR specialists have promoted) and since his daddy, the Admiral, was LBJ’s cover-up specialist for the U.S.S. Liberty (the pre-Tonkin Gulf op which didn’t work out), no self-respecting American patriot would have anything to do with any member of the McCain spawn.
Like most politicians, he’s a narcissistic sociopath, meaning he can never be wrong. And since bombing civilians is wrong, he believes it’s not occurring. Thus, he is still able to look at himself in the mirror and sleep at night.
Here is an article that looks at how many executions have taken place in Saudi Arabia in recent years:
http://viableopposition.blogspot.ca/2015/05/saudi-arabia-executions-will-2015-be.html
Interestingly, the Saudi regime is considered to be a Western ally even though it quite clearly breaches human rights.
Great site link, thanks!
Perhaps, if you wanted a more real answer, you might try interviewing a candidate or politician that’s NOT a Democrat or Republican, such as Jill Stein? I’m beginning to notice what almost seems to be a reluctance on the part of The Intercept to mention third parties and their candidates in political/election articles, even relatively strong parties such as the Libertarians and Greens. It’s a shame if that’s the case; you guys are usually top notch when it comes to journalism. Avoiding third party candidates is something the corporate mainstream “news” media usually does.
I’m not surprised by the Republicans acting that way, and I wouldn’t be surprised if Hillary Clinton also dodged the question, but I’m surprised Chris Coons did. He’s a fairly Socialist Democrat, who got elected by luck when Tea Party’s Christine “Not A Witch” O’Donnell won the Republican primary against a moderate who would have beaten Coons.
I’m a Libertarian, but for a story like this I’m not too bothered by them just asking people who’ve actually gotten elected to national office, as opposed to the few mayors and city council and state assembly people that your party and mine have.
“They may be bombing civilians , which is actually not true…”
There is nothing perplexing about “bomb ’em” McGoon’s response. He is a murderous psychopath, perfectly at home with the others of his ilk who rule Saudi Arabia.
Some further vague musings on the subject:
He possesses something akin to the new cloaking or invisibility technology now being developed, in which an incoming light ray is diverted around the object to be made invisible, and then reappears on the other side, going along the path it would initially seemed to have been taking. In his case, any incoming question of morality or humanity is diverted around him, to emerge unscathed and unanswered on the other side, on its original trajectory, without having interacted with McGoon at all. The physical case uses electromagnetic properties of all manner of new fangled “meta-materials”. The case at hand relies, no doubt, on the properties of quantum fluctuations in the total moral vacuum that is McGoon.
To carry these admittedly somewhat painful pseudo-physics similes even further, I can’t help noticing that his non-sequiturs, concerning the deaths or non-deaths of civilians, have a Schroedinger-cat feel to them as well, in which the civilians are simultaneously dead and not dead…
sic transit the still-born field of political psycho-physics
Sounds like John McCain shares a level of intellect and talking points with the infamous Craig Summers who has been littering comment threads here and previously at website locations where Glenn Greenwald has posted articles.
No way? CraigSummers is stalking Glenn? He’s aggressively defensive about US
Great article. It was refreshing to read something concise. You weren’t just packing words in needlessly.
And I really like how you let the comments speak for themselves, with little fluff. The point of this article is a good one, and to me the point is the total lock-step of those in the political mainstream. There are things that just won’t do to say. And whether dem or republican, from the northeast of the southwest, everyone is tight-lipped and doesn’t step out of line. It’s unfortunate, this leveling out of opinion. Guess it’s always happened. But it’s not good for the moral fabric of the country.
The definition of human rights changes over time. Right now, Saudi Arabia has been selected to oversee an influential U.N. panel on human rights – so they get to define what the term means. The U.S. Senators are merely recognizing the reality of that situation.
And the United States should not be too proud to learn from Saudi Arabia. Consider the matter of executions. Beheading is a tried and true technique which works almost every time. Just to be sure, Saudi has a two step protocol whereby the beheading is followed by a crucifixion.
Compare that to Oklahoma’s three step protocol. It consists of the executioner going to a pharmacy and picking out three drugs. Apparently there is no particular approved drug – the procedure consists of injecting the drugs, one at a time, until the desired outcome is produced – which might be hours, or even days, later. The recent planned execution of Simon Glossip was halted by the director of the Department of Corrections, to review why one of the drugs, which had never been used before, had been selected.
Surely this experimentation on human beings, using different drugs to kill them, degrades their human dignity. So why not emulate Saudi Arabia and use a proven method, with a reliable track record of killing people? The US sometimes falls into the trap of believing the human rights are historical artifacts, defined in the Constitution, but irrelevant today. So it is nice to have a Shining City on a Hill, like Saudi Arabia, to act as a beacon of human rights to a world which has lost its way.
“. . . this experimentation on human beings, using different drugs to kill them, degrades their human dignity.” Perhaps. But we are a nation of laws, and laws are quite often based on precedent. Surely the practices of the US states, most notably Oklahoma, have a firm legal footing based on the precedent established by Dr. Josef Mengele, inter alia. Although I do not personally support the death penalty or some forms of medical experimentation, I am sure that the supporters feel morally assuaged by the fact that such precedents exist.
>”Beheading is a tried and true technique which works almost every time.”
Jesus benitoe … i’m standing here beside myself.
Technology has advanced. The guillotine has a proven track record, and would generate more jobs.
@Mussolini-LOL!!!!!!!!
How dare you make me laugh on such a serious subject…..
Your sick!
@ Musssolini- LOL!!!!!
How dare make me laugh on such a serious subject……
Your a sick man? Or, is it I’m sick?
Mc Cain never ceases to amaze me. Here we have a “war hero” who got shot down as he was napalming Vietnamese villages, and I heard his rhetoric on Democracy Now this morning and all he can do is drone on about is Iran. Another embarassment for the US, but we have plenty of embarassing “heroes” and people like GWB who I will and always consider a moron.
McCain’s statements reflect an exceptionally nuanced world view, and thus cannot be taken at face value by people of ordinary intellectual capacity such as the present readership. Take for example the statement “They may be bombing civilians, which is actually not true”, which appears to be logically inconsistent, even nonsensical. Yet if you view the bombing campaign in Yemen as McCain and Obama do, then it makes complete sense. For, you see, we and our allies only attack rebel combatants or terrorists, and so by definition no civilians are killed. It may be that someone who appears to be a civilian is killed, but that is only because we lack the special sense of vision that enables one to distinguish between the five year old who will grow up to be a terrorist from the one who will grow up to be a civilian. We need to leave it up to the experts like McCain, Obama, and the Saudi royal family, rather than trusting our eyes or the scribblings of biased pretenders at journalism.
Is that a nuance in your pocket, or are you just happy to see me…?
Is that a nuance in your pocket or are you just happy to see me…?
You’ve been reading Benito for too long.
“is only because we lack the special sense of vision that enables one to distinguish between the five year old who will grow up to be a terrorist from the one who will grow up to be a civilian.”
careful now! – a Saudi man was beheaded on charges of sorcery and witchcraft and Salem is not so far in our past …
Oh, no! You misunderstand me! I lay no claim to having the special kind of vision that allows a five year old to be viewed as a terrorist. I am just an ordinary guy. It takes years of study of politics or military ‘science’ (as they called ROTC back when I was in college) to develop the ability to pick out the terrorists from the civilians. One can see how far that capability has advanced. In Vietnam, for the most part, you had to be on the ground to pick them out, but now days it can be done from the air, or even using satellites. And the NSA does not even need to have visual contact, they can tell from your telephone metadata.
But to continue the train of thought you began, perhaps the witchcraft laws could be reinstated.
Picture McCain on one side of a scale, with a duck on the other. A witch! A witch!
A shallow critique of Saudi Arabia doesn’t really do much good. The criticism of al-Nimr’s bizarre execution takes a blunderbuss approach:
* It’s disgusting to crucify and display a body after execution (yeah, but I’d care a lot more about being executed than what happens to the biohazardous waste afterward!).
* It’s cruel to behead people (yeah, but with improvised methods like midazolam and KCl that leave people saying they’re on fire and taking an hour and a half to die, the U.S. doesn’t have much room to talk).
* It’s unacceptable to torture confessions out of people. (That I’ll agree with, not without noting we have some work left to do on this in the U.S. But we need stronger documentation of the torture!)
* The crimes are purely political, not criminal. (Charges like throwing Molotov cocktails at cops and possessing a machine-gun don’t jibe with that, but see above. Looking at Wikipedia, they only have one police death noted, from 4 August 2012 well after al-Nimr’s arrest. But if cops *had* been killed, the U.S. would readily have invoked a “felony murder rule” to commit an equivalent murder)
* They’re executing someone for a juvenile crime. (The U.S. did that until quite recently, including for people like a South African kid who was denied consular assistance and sentenced to death for waiting in a car as a lookout)
Bottom line: a one-sided viewpoint isn’t enough to convert someone. We need careful analysis of the entire event to get us to the point where we see whatever is the KEY abuse Saudis performed (my money is on the torture, but I don’t know!) and protest in a focused way.
Is this what happens when you lock a hundred clueless mostly old men in a chamber with no connection to reality for years on end?
Or when despots bribe a hundred of the most corrupt politicians on the planet?
Fucking worthless. All of them. And I hope McCain dies an excruciatingly painful and prolonged death.
Agreed. The US Senate is …….whatever. The Saudis get their bombs and planes from us – the keepers of the gulag of our era Guantanamo. we got the best Congress money can buy!
With “friends” like Saudi Arabia who needs enemies like Iran. The U.S. does not care about human rights. It is just a useful pretext. Minimize or ignore the crimes of your allies and maximize the crimes of your enemies. Most Americans including the media and politicians reflexively and intuitively do this without even realizing it.