WHILE HUMAN RIGHTS activists and defense officials in Israel were quick to condemn an army medic caught on video last week shooting a wounded Palestinian suspect in the head, the soldier was defended over the weekend, and even celebrated, by many on the far-right of the country’s political spectrum.
Video released on Sunday by the Israeli rights group B’Tselem, which provides cameras to Palestinians in the occupied West Bank, showed far-right activists in the city of Hebron praised the medic’s actions just minutes after the incident.
The new footage showed Israeli settlers, including Baruch Marzel, the former leader of a banned extremist group, shaking the hand of the medic as the body of his victim was carried away.
According to the Tel Aviv newspaper Haaretz, which published the video with the medic’s face blurred out, the soldier smiled as he was congratulated by Marzel, who offers free pizza to soldiers who kill Palestinians suspected of attacking Israelis.
Marzel announced on Sunday that his political party, Jewish Power, would be holding a rally in support of the medic on Tuesday at a military court in Jaffa, where a ruling to extend his detention is expected. A poster for the rally he shared on Twitter declared: “The state is stabbing the soldier from Hebron in the back. We won’t!” Beneath a crudely Photoshopped image of an Israeli soldier with a bloody knife sticking from his back, the message concluded: “Israel Needs Jewish Power.”
— ???? ???? (@marzel_ba) March 27, 2016
Marzel’s choice of imagery was no doubt inspired by the fact that the Palestinian the medic killed, Abed al-Fattah Yusri al-Sharif, was one of two young men suspected of stabbing an Israeli soldier at a checkpoint in Hebron just before the incident. The metaphor of a nation’s army being stabbed in the back by its civilian political leaders has a dark historical resonance, since it was used by the Nazis to blame Germany’s defeat in the First World War on Jewish politicians.
Elizabeth Tsurkov, an Israeli rights activist, pointed out that the local government of Beit Shemesh, a city outside Jerusalem run by far-right members of the ultra-Orthodox community, not only staged a rally in defense of the medic on Monday, it ignored an injunction against identifying him by using his name and face on a poster that called him a “national hero.”
Beit Shemesh Municipality will hold a rally in support of the Hebron executioner."For us you are the national hero" pic.twitter.com/uADQor0B6X
— Elizabeth Tsurkov (@Elizrael) March 28, 2016
A wave of support for the medic seemed to build over the weekend. Haaretz reported on Friday that about half the comments on the incident posted online in the first 24 hours after the shooting were critical of the medic. By Saturday, a poll conducted for Israel’s Channel 2 News found that 57 percent of the public said that there was no need to arrest and investigate the soldier, while just 32 percent supported his detention.
Channel 2 poll:
Should Israeli Army have detained & opened investigation against Hebron soldier?
57%: No
32%: Yes pic.twitter.com/jqMA8HdCV4— Aaron Magid (@AaronMagid) March 27, 2016
As Dahlia Scheindlin explained on the Israeli news site +972, when asked by the pollsters to consider the possibility that the wounded man might have had a bomb, “A plurality of respondents, 42 percent, described his action as ‘responsible,’ while another 24 percent said it was the natural response to the situation.”
Just 19 percent of those surveyed agreed that the medic had deviated from the army’s rules of engagement. Only 5 percent defined the shooting of the wounded suspect as murder, the crime that military police suspect him of committing.
Uri Blau, an investigative journalist who looked closely at what seems to be the medic’s Facebook page, noted with disgust that supporters of the soldier even launched a social media campaign on his behalf.
Social media campaign to release the shooting solider in #Hebron is under way. Profile photo change, videos & more pic.twitter.com/RgfDJZZhWX
— Uri Blau (@uri_blau) March 25, 2016
The wide political & public support in the Hebron shooter shouldn't be presented as a "red flag". It's a moral bankruptcy of a sick society
— Uri Blau (@uri_blau) March 27, 2016
Gregg Carlstrom, a journalist in Tel Aviv, reported on Sunday that tens of thousands of Israelis had signed a petition calling for Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu to give the medic a medal for shooting the wounded suspect.
A petition asking Bibi to give a medal to the soldier who executed a Palestinian in Hebron has ~42,000 signatures. https://t.co/VeDZVd0mod
— Gregg Carlstrom (@glcarlstrom) March 27, 2016
The text of that petition cited the excuse reportedly offered by the medic to investigators — that he was concerned the wounded suspect might have been wearing a suicide vest he was about to set off. That explanation seems at odds, however, with what can be seen in video of the minutes before the shooting recorded by a Palestinian bystander. In that footage, several soldiers, civilians, and medical workers walk very close to the wounded suspect on the pavement without showing any sign that he might be a threat to them. One soldier could even be seen nudging the suspect from his side onto his back.
As Israel’s Walla News reported, Sharif, who had already been shot and incapacitated, was so unthreatening that one soldier paused next to him to tie his shoes.
???? ???? ??????, ????? ???? ?????: ?????? ????? ???? ?????? https://t.co/j5TbIg7xVP pic.twitter.com/fiJ9hm4G3i
— ?????! ????? (@wallanews) March 27, 2016
The soldier’s case was taken up by Israel’s far-right education minister, Naftali Bennett, who echoed many of the soldier’s defenders by calling the Palestinian suspect a “terrorist” in an outraged Facebook update.
(Bennett’s use of the phrase “terrorist attack,” to describe a knife attack not on a civilian but on a soldier at a checkpoint in an occupied city, seems designed to erase the moral complexity of the situation by defining all violent resistance to Israel’s military rule over the Palestinian population as illegitimate.)
Bennett raised the issue at a tense cabinet meeting on Sunday, accusing the prime minister and senior defense officials of “deep moral confusion” for having condemned the medic. Although Netanyahu rebuked Bennett for presuming to doubt his judgment on military ethics, the prime minister made a point of also condemning any questioning of the morality of the Israel Defense Forces as “unacceptable and infuriating.”
Netanyahu’s ally Yuval Steinitz, a minister in the cabinet, staunchly defended the decision to investigate, telling reporters, “The I.D.F. is a very strong and moral army. Even in very difficult conditions of the battlefield, we are not killing prisoners of war or people that are totally paralyzed.”
The investigation into the shooting in Hebron last week follows the killing of more than a hundred other Palestinians suspected of attacking Israelis in the past six months, many of them armed only with knives, leading rights advocates to accuse Israel of giving tacit approval to extrajudicial killings.
Two weeks ago, similar but less clear video appeared to show a volunteer police officer in Jaffa shooting an incapacitated Palestinian militant who had killed an American tourist. Although Israel’s justice ministry announced that it would open an investigation into the volunteer’s behavior, Haaretz reports that no one has been summoned for questioning and no action has yet been taken.
Related:
• Israeli Rights Group Releases Video of Army Medic Executing Wounded Palestinian Suspect
• Israeli Police Officer Who Shot Wounded Palestinian Suspect Could Face Charges
• Can Soldiers Be Victims of Terrorism?
Dude is a racist murderer…Period!!! You are no better than they are if you let him slide…..
‘Extrajudicial execution’ by Israeli soldier downgraded to manslaughter by military tribunal
Published time: 1 Apr, 2016 04:48
https://www.rt.com/news/337972-extrajudicial-execution-manslaughter-israeli/
Something you will never read in the Intercept. This story from the state-operated New York Times today (“Russia Shows What Happens When Terrorists’ Families Are Targeted”):
“……..Donald J. Trump, the leading Republican presidential candidate, was widely condemned when he called for the United States to “take out the families” of terrorists. His approach — even after he clarified that he was not talking about killing the relatives — was dismissed by many as immoral and unlawful. Yet, it is the very tactic that Russia has pursued for decades……..In the conflict that began in Chechnya and has since metastasized into a loosely organized Islamic rebellion throughout the Caucasus region, Russian security services routinely arrest, torture and kill relatives, rights groups say……. The most sweeping application of the tactic came during the pacification of Chechnya, after Mr. Putin engineered the recapture of the separatist territory……..Relatives were used as “hooks” to lure in militants. If the militant did not switch sides, the family member disappeared. Chechnya had about 3,000 to 5,000 unresolved disappearances from 2000 to 2005 or so. The policy, executed by the Chechen leader, Ramzan A. Kadyrov, the scion of a prominent Chechen family that itself switched sides, broke the organized resistance……”
Tens of thousands of innocent people died in the two secessionist Chechen wars. Russia nobly ran a “democratic” referendum for the Crimea Peninsula before annexing the home of a Russia Naval base located on the peninsula. Strangely, Russian leadership never offered to hold a referendum for Chechens.
Where did “zionism” come from/ where did it originate? Answer: Europe; out of the ashes of centuries of anti-semitism and hate from London to Moscow. In “zionism” are the elements of of the greater European culture(s) around them: racism, classism, nazism, fascism, etc…When the greater culture around has labeled you the “mutt race,” inferior, sub-race, Christ killer, traitor (*see Weimar Republic and post WW1 German history), what is a possible “counter” ideology to that level of generational hatred and “racializing” of religion (*aka Christians are [pure] White Europeans and Jews, of Europe, are [mixed] White-Semites [by the way Arabs are Semites])?? Hmmm?? Any ideas on counter ideologies kiddies?? Well one “could have been” a more democratic universal one: we are ALL equals [as Jesus preached –> the covenant between JUST the Hebrews and God was made null and void: ALL are the “children of God.” But that did not happen. Instead, the victims of oppression adopted the exact and corrupt ways of their oppressors: “We are the chosen people of God,” “Israel belongs to US, not THEM,” “The Bible says this is ours so nyahhhh!” Pretty sick and absolutely NOT democratic. Funny, the ancient Hebrews did the same thing when they entered the same area. Marry these crazy beliefs with American Jim Crow and you have the modern sociopathic state of Israel. As a historian and student of history, religion, language, and culture, it seems all too obvious to me this is all about control and power, etc…Every time an American cashes a paycheck they kill a Palestinian, evict a family from their home, and prevent urgent medical care to women, children, and the elderly….Can your weed dealer do that?
To love and prefer others over one’s own self is a great practice to transcend the ego and resonate with the higher consciousness, and its sameness in others.
Mr. Mackey
Still waiting for an article on the suicide bombing in a Park in Lahore. Seventy people killed. Christians were targeted, but more Muslims than Christians died. The attack killed mostly women and children. As Greenwald said:
“……At most, you’ll hear small, clinical news stories briefly and coldly describing what happened — usually accompanied by a justifying claim from [the TTB], uncritically conveyed, about why the bombing was noble — but, even in those rare cases where such attacks are covered at all [by the Intercept], everything will be avoided that would cause you to have any visceral or emotional connection to the victims. You’ll never know anything about them — not even their names, let alone hear about their extinguished life aspirations or hear from their grieving survivors — and will therefore have no ability to feel anything for them. As a result, their existence will barely register…..” my inserts in brackets
This would be a great opportunity to connect the victims of non western violence to Intercept readers.
The case for “The Un-Intercept” keeps getting stronger.
Yea, the call of the un-Intercept keeps growing.
The 2-state solution is a fantasy to cover for occupation and oppression Even (liberal) Zionists are increasingly acknowledging this reality. (The NYT editorial board has declared that “it may already be too late.”)
The ethno-religious nationalism that is Zionism contains the seeds of the current apartheid; the occupation will never end as long as an ethno-religious Zionist state exists. Mark Braverman — a Jewish-American and psychologist — published this a few years ago, addressing his fellow American Jews on the subject of “what may be said”:
Israel cannot square the moral circle of being both “Jewish” and “democratic,” because the former requires an ethnic supermajority as well as discriminatory housing laws and allocation of resources. Nor can Israel be a liberal Western democracy when they occupy Gaza and the West Bank where Arab people are subjugated and denied the right to vote in elections that determine their own fates. As well as almost entirely denied equal protect of and due process of law.
“……Nor can Israel be a liberal Western democracy when they occupy Gaza and the West Bank where Arab people are subjugated and denied the right to vote in elections that determine their own fates…..”
How do you think Hamas was elected? The Palestinians are currently choosing not to have elections because of the ongoing disagreements between Abbas and the Hamas leadership. In fact, whenever they choose, the Palestinians can hold elections – just not in Israel because they are not Israeli citizens. Over 1.5 million Israeli Arabs do enjoy that benefit, however.
How would you have stood on American colonial rights to have representatives in Parliament?
Since they could vote in their own colony’s legislative houses, it was really irrelevant they had no representation in the government that really controlled their existence?
Oy vay!
You are not really capable of getting it, are you?
Israel BOMBED the Palestinian Parliament building. Can we talk about that elephant in the room before you rant about what Palestinian are “choosing” to “not have elections?”
Hamas and Fattah have always been competitors. Their failure to reach an agreement to rule Gaza and the West Bank together only has diminished the capability of the Palestinian people to provide a united front against Israel. That would be an important step to taking their case to the UN. That is unlikely to happen though.
You are very patient to dialogue with CS. He could learn something from you instead off ceaseless fuming.
I wrote another essay in 2001:
Perspective on The Palestinian Tragedy
“Only then will the young and old in our land realize how great was our responsibility to those miserable Arab refugees in whose towns we have settled from afar; whose homes we have inherited, whose fields we sow and harvest; the fruit of whose gardens, orchards and vineyards we gather; and in whose cities that we robbed, we put houses of education, charity and prayer.” Martin Buber, 1961
Origins
1840: Lord Ashley writes to UKs foreign secretary Lord Palmerston, his step-father, that the latter had been “chosen by God” to “return the Jews to their inheritance in the land of Promise”. Ashley, a fervent evangelical Christian, was convinced that the Scriptures were soon to be literally fulfilled.
Until recently, the history of ancient Palestine has been ignored and silenced by biblical studies whose object of interest has been ancient Israel conceived and presented as the taproot of Western civilization. Biblical studies have been dominated by Christian theologys focus on the history of ancient Israel as revealed in the Hebrew Bible. This is because Christianity is conceived of as a religion based on revelation through history. Thus, “ancient Israel is the domain of Religion or Theology and not of history. The “ancient Israel” of biblical studies is a scholarly construct based on misreading of biblical traditions and divorced from historical reality (emphasis added).
Recent archeological studies, for example, show that pork was not consumed by most of the ancient peoples of Palestine. Pig prohibition was not unique to the Israelites and was a sensible reaction to the large amounts of scarce water needed to raise them. In the book of Joshua, entire Canaanite villages are eradicated by a victorious Israelite army of tribes that had been freed from slavery in Egypt to march in and conquer the land. Except, thats not how it happened. All the latest evidence indicates no swift invasion around 1250-1225 B.C.E., the time attributed to Israelite settlement in Canaan. “It is difficult to tell an Israelite from a Canaanite because the Israelites and the Canaanites were one and the same people.”4 Complete study of the Dead Sea Scrolls clearly showed that over the course of centuries the stories of the Bible had been intentionally reworkedupdated, many scholars speculated, to reflect current concerns.
Nevertheless, “it was some shock to realize that the narratives in Deuteronomy 7.1-11, 9.1-5, 11.8-9, 23.31-32 and 20.16-18 present “ethnic cleansing” as not only legitimate, but as required by the deity”.11
Last half of 19th century: “According to the German theory, people of common descent.should form one common state. Pan-Germanism was based on the idea that all persons if the German race, blood or descent, wherever they lived or to whatever state they belonged, owe their primary loyalty to Germany and should become citizens of the German state, their true homeland”. Analogous assumptions informed the distinctive Zionist approach to the Jewish Question. In effect this analysis duplicated the reasoning of anti-Semitism.2 In fact, in 1867 many of Austrias Jews were the most ardent representatives of the Anschluss idea.
1896: Zionism-the Herzl plan, responded to European mal-treatment of Jews (in part stimulated by the new nationalism) and called for a Jewish state. The Jews should recognize that they were not a religious group merely, but a true nation waiting to be reborn. His idea startled Jewry and shocked many Jews. Jewry as a whole was not converted to Zionism until the atrocious Nazi attempt at genocide.1 Once it became a serious enterprise, Zionism became patently a colonial enterprise. The time was the 1890s, the heyday of European imperialism; Africa partitioned and Kipling urging the Americans “to take up the White Mans burden” in the newly acquired Philippines.
In 1903, the British Foreign Secretary told the Zionists that Britain was prepared to discuss a suitable site in East Africa “for the establishment of a Jewish colony or settlement, on terms which will enable the members to observe their national customs”.1 This was “the Uganda offer” in which the Ugandans had no apparent role. Argentina was also posited, again, I suspect without asking the Argentineans
Targeting Palestine
British Foreign Secretary Balfour (of the Declaration) introduced an Aliens Bill in 1905 to control immigration; the Bill was directed against the flood of Jews from Eastern Europe. (The Jewish population in the UK expanded from 65,000 in 1880 to 300,000 by 1914).1 There was also up to the end of WWI a strong Jewish anti-Zionist position. In the June 1917 NYT Henry Moskowitz described the curse of nationalism which hung over the world as its most terrible war raged “in which the idea of domination has given certain nations a form of megalomania”. He had no wish for the Jews to join the game and argued against Jewish nationalism; instead, Jews needed a revival of the Hebraic spirit which gave birth to Israels vision, to Davids psalms, to Spinozas God. Quite apart from injustice in Palestine itself Jewish nationalism was a direct threat to assimilated Jews everywhere.1
Furious political warfare finally led to Balfours declaration , 2 November 1917: “Her Majestys governmentfavorsa national home for the Jewish people, and will use its best efforts (for this objective), it being clearly understood that nothingmay prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine”. It was inspired by high idealism and cynical calculation.1 One historian wondered whether “Lloyd George and Balfour merely took their knowledge of Palestine from the Bible, which in this respect happened to be out of date”.1 The Declaration stored up trouble for the future, as did the contradictory promises of independence made to Arabs in 1916-1917 who were urged to and did rebel against the Ottoman Turks. Not everyone was deluded. Lord Curzon pointed out that the half million Arabs in the proposed home “will not be content either to be expropriated for Jewish immigrants or to act as mere hewers of wood and drawers of water for them”. 1
As for the US, one of President Wilsons 14 points addressed “nationalities now under Turkish rule (Syrians, Jordanians, Palestinians)” who were to be “assured an undoubted security of life and an absolutely unmolested opportunity of autonomous development”.1 In the 1948 presidential election year, President Truman hastily recognized the newly declared State of Israel. Truman, like his predecessor and successor, was happier for Jews to enter Palestine,than for renewed Jewish immigration to America on the scale known before 1914.1
The standard Zionist position is that they showed up in Palestine to reclaim their ancestral homeland in the late 19th century. Jews bought land and started building up a Jewish community there. They were met with increasingly violent opposition from Palestinian Arabs, presumably stemming from the Arabs inherent anti-Semitism. The Zionists were then forced to defend themselves and in one form or another, this same situation continues up to today. The problem with this explanation is that it is simply not true (emphasis added).”
What really happened was that the Zionist movement executed a complete dispossession of the indigenous Arab population so that Israel could be a wholly Jewish state. In short, Zionism was based on a colonialist world-view that the rights of indigenous inhabitants didnt matter. The Arabs opposition was not anti-Semitism but based on fear of the dispossession of their people which eventuated. The mythic “land without people for a people without land” was already home to 700,000 Palestinians in 1919.7
Israels Statehood and Palestinian Expulsion, 1948
The UN with strong US backing proposed partition of Palestine in November 1947. The Palestinians rejected the plan because , while the population of the Jewish state was to be [only half Jewish] with Jews owning less than 10% of the Jewish state land area, the Jews were to be established as the ruling body.7
In April, 1948, a month before the declaration of statehood, Jewish soldiers slaughtered in a cold and premeditated fashion (250) civilians at Deir Yassin. According to the former director of the Israeli army archives, in almost every occupied Arab village, acts which are defined as war crimes, such as murders, massacres, and rapes were committed. Every skirmish ended in a massacre of Arabs. Consequently, the Arabs fled.7
When the UN accepted the partition resolution in 1947, Jews constituted 32% of the population and owned 5.6% of the land. By 1949, largely as a result of paramilitary operations such as the Haganah, Irgun, and Stern gang, Israel controlled 80% of Palestine and 770,000 non-Jews had been expelled from their country. (Faisal Bodi writing in The Manchester Guardian, January 3, 2001).
Israel has negated the right of refugee return that has been affirmed by UN General Assembly resolution 194 since December 11,1948 and reaffirmed 28 times.7 Under Section 11 of UNGAR194, Palestinians not wishing to return home should be paid just and equitable compensation. In November 1967, UN Security Council Resolution 242 called for the withdrawal of Israeli forces from the Occupied Territories and a just settlement of the refugee problem. On December 22, 2000, Human Rights Watch called on Israeli and Palestinian leaders engaged in final status negotiations to uphold the right of return for Palestinian refugees who should be allowed to choose: 1) returning to their country of origin; 2) integrating into a country of asylum; or 3) resettling in a third country. http://www.hrw.org/press/2000/12/isrpac1222.htm
On September 17, 1948, Count Folke Bernadotte, of Sweden, who had saved thousands of Jews from destruction by the Nazi , and now the Mediator appointed by the UN General Assembly, was assassinated by the Israelis.Muitiple references
The Israeli/Arab Wars
The 1956 coordinated attack on Suez by Israel, Great Britain and France was neither, as first claimed by the Israel, a preventive war nor a retaliatory raid, but a well planned attempt to expand into the whole of the Sinai Peninsula and the Gaza strip. Menachem Begin leader of the Herut (later Likud) party and later Prime Minister spoke before the the Israeli parliament in October 1955: “I deeply believe in launching preventive war against the Arab states without further hesitation. By doing so, we can annihilate Arab power, and secondly, expand our territory (emphasis added).8
Israel was the aggressor in the 1967 war. After the war, in violation of international law, Israel confiscated over 52% of the West Bank and 30% of the Gaza Strip for military use and for settlement of Jewish colonists (400,000 at latest count, 70,000 of which moved in since the start of the Oslo process. see below). Vast settlements housing nearly 200,000 colonists have been built on confiscated Palestinian land around East Jerusalem. From 1967 to 1982, Israel demolished 1,338 Palestinian homes on the West Bank and detained 300,000 Palestinians without trial. All Jewish settlements in the Occupied Territories since 1967 violate the Geneva Conventions of 1949 (Article 49) which Israel signed.7+others Israel continues to violate UN Security Council resolution 242 which has been accepted by the Palestinians.
The October 1973 war (Yom Kippur) resulted from Israels refusal to swap land (back to the 1967 bordersUNSCR 242) for peace. With diplomatic settlement blocked, Egypts president Sadat chose war. The Gulf States chose the oil embargo. Egypts performance forced a cease fire based on UNSCR 338: 1) implementation of UNSCR 242; 2) Negotiations for peace; 3) just settlement of the Palestinian Problem.8 Sadat went to Jerusalem in November 1977. Egypt made peace for return of its land with the condition that there be justice for the Palestinians under UN Resolutions 242 and 338. Israel has paid lip service to the conditions. But the negotiations were called off because of Israels inflexibility.8
This moved President Carter to call Sadat and Begin to Camp David. Both Camp David I and II failed to provide just relief for the Palestinians. Israel complicated matters seriously by placing Jewish settlements on confiscated Arab lands in the Occupied Territories and transferring Jews to become permanent residents. In so doing Israel violated the 1907 Hague Convention on Laws and Customs of War on Land, and the 4th Geneva Convention of 1949 Relative to the Protection of Civilian persons in Time of War.8
In The Washington Post on November 26, 2000, President Carter writes that the underlying reason for the failure of diplomacy and continued violence has been that Israeli leaders continue to “create facts” by building settlements in occupied territory. He continues that these settlements directly violate the Camp David accords which agreed to the pre-1967 borders.
The Intifadas and the “Peace Process”
Abba Eban, the former UN Representative from Israel, wrote in the New York Times of November 9, 1986: “The Palestinians live without a right to vote or be elected, without controlover the conditions of their lives, exposed to restraints and punishments that could be applied if they were Jews. It is a bleak, tense, disgruntled existencethis condition can not long endure without explosion.”9 And so it did explode with the first intifada in December 1987. Young Palestinians rose in protest, not with arms but with stones, knowing full well that they could not compete with Israeli bullets and more sophisticated weapons supplied by the United States. In the first three years 892 Palestinian men, women and children were killed by Israeli soldiers and settlers, while the number of wounded is estimated to be over 106,000.
Yasser Arafat appeared before the UN meeting at Geneva in December 1988 and outlined Palestinian proposals for a permanent solution to the conflict. These included: 1) convening a peace conference under UN auspices; 2) UN assuming administration of the West Bank and Gaza pending final settlement; 3) PLO condemned all forms of terrorist activities, including state-terrorism; and, 4) PLO accepts Security Council resolutions 242 and 338 (even though the Israel and not the PLO was the subject of those resolutions).9 This abandoned once and for all the long nurtured Palestinian dream of a democratic and secular state in all of Palestine.
The settlement question took on new urgency from 1989 on as events in Eastern Europe and the Soviet Union produced a flood of Soviet Jewish emigrants. Most wanted to go to the US but Washington imposed preventive immigration quotas.9
Through it all horrifying massacres occurred. One was that at the Haram Ash-Sharif and Al-Aqsa Mosque in October 1990. This pre-saged the massacre on September 28, 2000 when Israeli soldiers fired on a crowd on the sacred square above the Wailing Wall from which stones had been thrown. This massacre set off Intifada II. Relevant to both massacres is the similar clash between Moslems and fanatical Zionists in September 1928. Consequently an investigation committee was formed under the League of Nations in January 1930 which heard the claims of both parties and concluded:
“To the Moslems belongs the sole ownership of, and the sole proprietary right to, the Western Wallan integral part of the Haram Ash-Sharif area, which is a Waqf [pious foundation] property.”
“To the Moslems also belongs the ownership of the pavement in front of the Wall and the adjacent Moroccan Quarter in as much as the latter was made a “Waqf”, being dedicated to charitable purposes”
This verdict gave Jews the unhindered right to place near the Wall the Table on which the Ark containing the Scrolls of the Law could stand and be read on certain specified occasions. No restriction was placed on individual Jews performing their usual devotions at the Wall. In 1982 when I visited the Haram Ash-Sharif I found it surrounded by Israeli property; indeed, modern apartment buildings for absentee Jews to view the Wall during visits faced the Wall.
Only when Zionism is being evaluated are normal rules of morality suspended. Whatever the pangs of conscience one might have about the expulsion of the Palestinians and destruction of their villages, the Bible is called on to salve it. Zionism, a program originally despised by Orthodox Judaism as anti-religious and by Reform Judaism as contrary to the mission of Judaism is now at the core of the Jewish credo. And credulous Christians allow themselves to be sucked into the vortex. Nevertheless, I continue to be impressed by the number of distinguished writings by Orthodox and more liberal Jews that deplore the Zionist project and the horror it has inflicted on the Palestinian people.
When Ariel Sharon guarded by about 1000 Israeli police strode into Jerusalems Haram al-Sharif (the “Noble Sanctuary”) on September 28, 2000, the area had been sealed off before, during and after his visit, scarcely ensuring freedom of access. The next day the Israeli army shot eight Palestinians dead some of whom had been hurling stones at police. The world news media ignored that international law entitles the natives of a place under military occupationwhich East Jerusalem has been since 1967to resist by any means possible. All European countries had their resistance fighters during WWII who are lauded as heroes not as terrorists. The Israeli human rights organization Btselem confirmed eye-witness reports that stones were aimed at the armada of Israeli police whose presence on the Aqso precinct was a provocation. The police did not use tear gas to stop the stone throwing but immediately opened fire with rubber-covered bullets which kill at close range. (Amira Hass, correspondent for Haaretrz (Tel Aviv) in the Palestinian Territories as reprinted in Le Monde Diplomatique, November 2000). Thus, Intifada II began.
The Intifada I with its remarkable self-discipline and courage was an indigenous uprising, including, in fact, highly organized non-violent resistance in addition to more spontaneous stone throwing. It was neither initiated nor controlled by the PLO leadership in exileindicating that Arafat no longer spoke for the Palestinian people. Thus, it came as a surprise when Arafat joined Prime Minister Rabin in signing the September 1993 Oslo Accords.
Francis Boyle, Professor of International Law, Illinois State University. was Legal Advisor to the Palestinian delegation during the 1991-1993 peace negotiations. He was asked by the Palestinian Peace Team what was the closest historical analogue to the Israeli peace offer. He reported: “A bantustan, they are offering you a bantustan, akin to those forced by the apartheid Afrikaaner regime on its black people”. The Palestinian delegation rejected this proposal. But the Israeli government took this proposal and opened up a secret (to almost all the leadership of the Palestinian people let alone the people themselves) channel of negotiations. This Bantustan proposal became the Oslo Agreement.
And what of this vaunted “peace process”? The miserable condition of the Palestinians and loss of life has become much worse since the signing. 110,000 Jews lived in illegal settlements in Gaza and the West Bank before Oslo. This number has increased to 195,000, not including more than 150,000 Jews who have since taken up residence in Arab East Jerusalem.12
These settlements, more appropriately labeled “colonies”, whose presence even the US had always considered a violation of international lawincreased more rapidly under Ehud Barak than under right-wing Benjamin Netanyahu. Moreover the settlements were linked with permanent, multi-lane highways running through Palestinian lands, orchards and homes confiscated for the purpose. 13 These settlements make the Palestinian part of Gaza and the West Bank (now only 22% of pre-1948 Palestine) into a bantusan of 15 cantons in a sea of Israeli occupation and settlement. Thus Palestinians have been crushed into 64% of the 22%.
NOW
Thus far, in Intifada II 350 Palestinians have been killed and 14,000 wounded.14 Forensic experts of the U.S. based Physicians for Human Rights reported that the Israeli army “has used live ammunition and rubber bullets excessively and inappropriately to control demonstrators, and that based on the numbers of head and thigh injuries, soldiers appear to be shooting to inflict harm and not in self-defense”.
United Nations Commissioner for Human Rights Mary Robinson visited Israel/Palestine during the Fall of 2000 and reported that Israel is guilty of “excessive use of force” against the Palestinians and called for a halt to the construction of Jewish colonies in the Occupied Territories. A third of the 2000 Palestinians killed have been children (1995 UNICEF report). Since September 2000, over 100 Palestinian children have been killed with special aiming at the head (Jordan Times, 14 December).
For seven years, Arafat has been signing peace agreements with Israel which gave away hope for a viable statehood. Camp David was meant to be the last but Arafat seems, at last, to have woken up to what he has signed away. Now the hope of refugees has been put on the table. It appears that Arafat is more interested in being ruler of a Palestinian State, whatever its condition, than in continuing to seek a just solution to the Palestinian-Israeli conflict.13
Young Palestinians have had enough, and despite Arafats feeble efforts to control them, have taken to the streets to throw stones and fire slingshots at Israeli Merkavas and Cobras.12 Why is it that more Israelis do not realizeas some already havethat a policy of brutality against Arabs in a part of the world containing 300 million Arabs and 1.2 billion Muslims, will not make the Jewish state more secure?12
Israel’s A mild-mannered refugee born in Haifa, Palestine simply states: “Anyone who signs [away the right of return] will be killed by the Palestinian street”. London Financial Times, January 6/7, 2001 own historians have in recent years documented that the Palestinians were expelled. This truth underpins the guarantees given to Palestinians of their right to return by the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, the Geneva Convention of 1949 (signed by Israel), and UN General Assembly resolution 194 made December 11,1948 and reaffirmed 28 times. Any abrogation of these guarantees would set a disastrous precedent in international human rights law, and provide a clear signal that ethnic cleansers who expel civilians from their homes, steal their property, and prevent refugees returning for long enough can expect to have their illegal territorial conquests blessed with international legitimacy. In the event, the civilized world will find the price of peace too costly.
Through it all, since 1967, the US has disbursed more that $200 billion dollars in unconditional financial and military aid to Israel, while offering blanket political support.12 This aid continues at the level of $ 5 billion per year and more. This obsequiousness to Israels illegal and morally bankrupt behavior is insufferable. It must be changed by a better informed public blitzing the media, the Congress and the President with reasoned calls for a new policy. This policy should rein in Israel and impose a settlement based on: 1) removing Israeli colonies from the Occupied Territories of the West Bank and Gaza; 2) releasing West Bank water to the Palestinian inhabitants; 3) inviting refugees to return to their stolen property or to have reasonable compensation; and, 4) dividing sovereignty in Jerusalem.
References and Bibliography
(other than those identified in the text)
1. Wheatcroft G., “The Controversy of Zion”, Sinclair-Stevenson, London 1996
2. Whitelam K.W., “The Invention of Ancient Israel and the silencing of Palestinian History”, Routledge, London, 1996.
3. Davies P.R., “In Search of Ancient Israel”, Journal for the Study of the Old Testament, 1992.
4. Marcus, A.D., “The View from Nebo, How Archeology is rewriting the Bible and Reshaping the Middle East”, Little, Brown, Boston, 2000.
5. Hans Kohn quoted in “Image and Reality of the Israel-Palestine Conflict”, N. Finkelstein. Verso, NYC and London, 1995.
6. Said E.W., “The Politics of Dispossession, The Struggle for Palestinian Self-Determination, 1969-1994. Vintage Books, NYC, 1995
7. “The Origin of the Palestine-Israel Conflict”, 3rd edition, published by Jews for justice in the Middle East, PO Box 14561, Berkeley, CA 94712 ******
8. Khouri, F.J., “The Arab-Israeli Dilemma”, Syracuse University Press, NY, 1985
9. Hadawi, S., “Bitter Harvest, a modern history of Palestine”, 4th Edition, Olive Branch Press, NYC, 1991
10. Finklestein N.G., Image and Reality of the Israel-Palestine Conflict. Verso, London, NYC, 1995
11. Roman Catholic priest Michael Prior, “Confronting the Bibles Ethnic Cleansing in Palestine”, in The Link, Volume 33, No.5, Americans for Middle East Understanding, Inc., NY, December, 2000. *******
12. Said, E., “Palestinians under Siege”, London Review of Books, 14 December 2000.
13. Shalom A.R., and S.R., “Turmoil in Palestine: The Basic Context”, http://home.mindspring.com/~fontenelles/shalom.htm *********
14. Khalidi R.I., “The New Parameters of Reconciliation”, NYTimes, December 27,2000 *********
15. Richburg, K.B., Washington Post Foreign Service, November 30, 2000. Page A01. ***********
Gach! I don’t “dialogue” with Craig. More often than not I now ignore him. On occasion I rebut some particular claim of his for the readership, or link to old comments explaining that I don’t generally reply to him.
His constant whataboutery and other fallacious nonsense has been old for a long time. Replying to him encourages him and thus annoys much of the readership. So I don’t often do it.
“……More often than not I now ignore him. On occasion I rebut some particular claim of his for the readership….”
Which means I rarely hear from you which is great.
“……You are very patient to dialogue with CS. He could learn something from you instead off ceaseless fuming……”
I have yet to see a reply to my response to your first (long winded) post?
Palestinians have every right to use force against the IDF, and all illegal squatters invading, and defiling their lands. Most of these “so-called” knife attacks are not attacks, but “set-ups’ by the IDF and settlers in order to justify maiming, and killing Palestinian youth. Israel has no moral compass, and by way of opinions of the populace it has never had any respect for human rights, or any moral compass to speak of. The reason there is so much vitriol and anger at Israel has nothing to do with Judaism, but everything to do with Zionism, and every violent action it undertakes against anyone who is not a Zionist. Furthermore, Israel cannot respect, or obey international law, or even human rights since its main benefactor being the US gives it cover at the UN.
Aggrieved
Regardless of whether the offer of peace by the Israelis at Camp David was fair or not, there was no justification by Arafat to initiate the second Intifada. No one was forcing Arafat to say yes to the offer by Israel. There was no reason for Arafat to sign a bad deal that can never be reversed. Getting the right deal is important. That is why people negotiate.
Instead, Arafat ordered the start of the second Intifada leading to the death of 4500 Palestinians and 1000 Israelis. The death toll was more than the combined death toll of Operation Protective Edge and Operation Cast Lead. While you may believe that “international law entitles the natives of a place under military occupation-which East Jerusalem has been since 1967-to resist by any means possible”, this particular act by the former Nobel Peace Prize winner created a huge distrust of Palestinians (and resulted in the deaths of a lot of people – Palestinians and Jews). This really detrimental decision by Arafat damaged the Palestinian cause more than any other.
“…….This Bantustan proposal became the Oslo Agreement……”
It is irrelevant whether you believe Oslo is a Bantustan proposal or not. Arafat acting as the official leader and negotiator for the Palestinian people signed the agreement which allowed some flexibility on the final borders to incorporate Israeli settlements into Israel. Arafat signed the agreement and won a Nobel Prize. Arafat didn’t suddenly wake up at Camp David. He was under pressure from Hamas and supporters of the Palestinians to not sign. And that is OK, only he chose war instead – and that was not OK.
“…….It is also utterly offensive for Mr. Zuckerman to posit that Israel as been restraining itself. When Ariel Sharon guarded by about 1000 Israeli police strode into Jerusalem’s Haram al-Sharif (the “Noble Sanctuary”) on September 28, 2000, the area had been sealed off before, during and after his visit, scarcely ensuring freedom of access…..”
Sharon obtained permission for the visit from Arafat. The Temple Mount is also the holiest site in Judaism. During the occupation by Jordan until 1967, Jews were not allowed to visit the Temple Mount. Additionally, there never was any attempt by Jordan to create a Palestinian state up until 1967 when the territory was lost in the Six Days War.
“……..Palestinians are guaranteed their right to return by the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, the Geneva Convention of 1949 (signed by Israel), and UN General Assembly resolution 194 made December 11,1948 and reaffirmed 28 times. Any abrogation of these guarantees would set a disastrous precedent for international human rights law. It would provide a clear signal that ethnic cleansers who expel civilians from their homes, steal their property, and prevent refugees returning for long enough can expect to have their illegal territorial conquests blessed with international legitimacy……”
While you state in your conclusions:
“……3. inviting refugees to return to their stolen property or to have reasonable compensation……”
Just compensation should be a part of any solution. There will be no return of the refugees to Israel unless there is a one state solution. That is the only way a two state solution can work.
“Regardless of whether the offer of peace by the Israelis at Camp David was fair or not…”
In other words, you have a blatant double standard. You justify Israeli violence but ANYTHING the Palestinians do will earn your condemnation.
Thank you for putting your racism on display. Like we really needed half a dozen paragraphs of tripe to notice that.
There is no difference at all between Apartheid Israel and the former South African Apartheid. Israel kills Palestinians the same way Apartheid South African used to kill black people. Both regimes are racists and murderers. Boycott defeated Apartheid South Africa and it will defeat the Zionist-racist Apartheid Israel.
Snuff videos
The Israeli military has been murdering Palestinians for years, with both official and popular support and wild encouragement, and it is not infrequently captured on video. When videos of these murders go viral in Israel they are celebrated as fantastic “snuff videos.” That’s what Israeli academic at Ben-Gurion University of the Negev, ?Neve Gordon, calls ?visual recordings of the IDF shootings of Arabs, including that of the shooting of Asraa Zidan Tawfik Abed, a 30-year-old Palestinian mother who was not about to attack anyone.
Writes Gordon:
Gordon address the ? “Orgies of Feeling” this fare generates among Israelis.
As is well known, such orgies of feeling, in which one’s tribe is continually depicted as the heroic and noble victim being harmed by the villainous Other, are often a large component of fascist movements. Israel is very far along the fascist path, more so than virtually any other self-described Western democracy.
Gee, Craig Summers had nothing to say about this particular comment, Mona. How odd, right?
A few years ago Craig would deny facts and/or demand I prove my statements and arguments. He ceased that after not too long. Other Zionists have learned the same lesson: challenging me in this area is often an occasion for me to do a fact dump they find exceedingly unpalatable.
Is it any surprise that an Apartheid regime has a military that is thoroughly steeped in racism, and a ‘citizenry’ who regard the ethnic group that actually makes up the majority of the legal population as less than human? As I’ve heard stated, the goal of the BDS movement is not just to free the Refugees and the Palestinians from the oppression of Apartheid, it is also to rescue the Jewish ‘majority’ from the damage the need to see the violence and terrorism that is part and parcel of running an Apartheid regime as not just justified, but moral is doing to them.
The thing that’s really galling is that Israelis will turn around and say, “But it’s Palestinian society that celebrates murderers!”
My degree isn’t in history, but I’m reasonably sure the same sort of violent hypocrisy went on in Germany in the 1930’s. The irony of that isn’t even funny.
Even giving the medic and all those sympathetic Israelis a benefit of the doubt they might just somehow believe it a “mercy killing,” it’s still plain ol’ murder of a helpless suspect no longer a threat.
The badge of EVERY United States law officer ever to train in Israel is now suspect.
“…….The badge of EVERY United States law officer ever to train in Israel is now suspect……”
Completely idiotic.
Says the resident (evil) Zionist.
Only 5% of those polled considered it murder, so yes much of Israel seems not only “completely idiotic” but actually heinous in their Zionist rationalizations. US police officers of any kind that have been subjected to what’s obviously pervasive thinking there, but specifically because of law enforcement training, should have their career reviewed outside their chain of command and then be continually observed for signs of any personal above-the-law fascism. We have enough of that shit in OUR country already, barely lifted a finger yet to overcome a history full of it, without importing Israel’s even more brutal racist and genocidal Zionist methods. To what goal anyway, make us more like them?
Get a grip hypocrite.
“Most Israelis say…”
Somebody point me to any evidence in this article that can back up that click bait headline.
There are right wing people in EVERY population.
Pointing out a few examples of right wing Israeli bs does NOT justify saying most Israelis support the bs. Robert Mackey your work sucks and it should be clearly labeled as an opinion blog.
I’m sure The Intercept would have called each of the 8.1 million residents of Israel had they the time and the space to publish each answer.
The author cites and links to the Israel TV 2 poll of 57% of Israelis who don’t think the medic should even be investigated.
And in Israel, they are the ruling coalition; the Jewish population at large has been moving ever-further to the far right for some time now. Many are calling Israel essentially now fascist – and I mean liberal Zionist Jews included.
The evidence for all this is overwhelming, and I’ve cited tons of it often. I will again if you like.
Just yesterday Israel’s Chief Rabbi announced that non-Jews should not be allowed to live in Israel.
“…..And in Israel, they are the ruling coalition; the Jewish population at large has been moving ever-further to the far right for some time now…..”
They say the same thing for the US and European populations. These things don’t happen in a vacuum. You mention that Israelis have been moving to the right for some time now? Does that happen to coincide with the second Intifada by any chance? Or Israel removing settlements from Gaza only to have a terrorist organization elected to power? Or having three teenagers kidnapped and murdered by Hamas? Or that Palestinians are regularly knifing Jews?
Actions have consequences…….
https://theintercept.com/2016/03/18/brazil-is-engulfed-by-ruling-class-corruption-and-a-dangerous-subversion-of-democracy/?comments=1#comment-212423
Israel bears responsibility for *everything* which occurs in the Occupied Territories and in Gaza. Try as they might the Israeli government cannot wash their hands of this culpability.
As the military occupier colonial whip master, Israel is the real government of Gaza and the West Bank.
Israel controls even the finances of the PA.
Gaza is NOT an autonomous nation.
Israeli soldiers and Mossad agents swarm both regions.
Gaza is strangled by a total land, air and water siege. The siege is one of the oldest forms of warfare in history. When you wage war upon a region, it is entirely to be expected that there will a warlike reaction.
As we learn from modern anti-colonial history. And as the right to resist occupation is enshrined in International Law.
1/Israel was instrumental in the creation of Hamas. They were to be used as a foil against Fatah.
Once again Israeli interference must be taken into account whenever we consider Palestinian affairs.
“”Hamas, to my great regret, is Israel’s creation,” says Mr. Cohen, a Tunisian-born Jew who worked in Gaza for more than two decades. Responsible for religious affairs in the region until 1994,”
“Instead of trying to curb Gaza’s Islamists from the outset, says Mr. Cohen, Israel for years tolerated and, in some cases, encouraged them as a counterweight to the secular nationalists of the Palestine Liberation Organization and its dominant faction, Yasser Arafat’s Fatah. Israel cooperated with a crippled, half-blind cleric named Sheikh Ahmed Yassin, even as he was laying the foundations for what would become Hamas. Sheikh Yassin continues to inspire militants today;”
http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB123275572295011847
http://thehigherlearning.com/2014/08/10/liberators-or-terrorists-the-origins-and-history-of-israel-and-hamas/
2/Israel had absolutely no right to be colonizing the Gaza Strip. All their actions in Gaza were illegal.
3/Israel scorch earthed Gaza upon leaving it.
4/Israel then tried to organize a coup against Hamas after Hamas won the Gazan elections.
5/It is blatantly false that Israel’s actions are “defensive”.
They are offensive and colonial. They have been from the very outset. 1948 onwards.
6/What has become the dominant position in Israeli politics is the ultra-Zionist position of Eretz Israel. Again, Eretz Israel has been a Zionist project and position from the beginning.
This can be clearly seen from the Likud Charter which completely rejects ANY two-state solution.
http://www.juancole.com/2014/08/charter-destruction-palestinian.html
Which involves the complete expulsion of the indigenous Palestinian inhabitants.
7/New Gas reserves have been found in the Seas off the Gazan coast.
This material economic reason informs Israeli Gazan policy.
The Israelis both want to exploit these gas reserves themselves. And to deny the Gazans this natural resource.
“…….Israel bears responsibility for *everything* which occurs in the Occupied Territories and in Gaza. Try as they might the Israeli government cannot wash their hands of this culpability……”
Take the case below. Would you like the IDF to arrest the Hamas leadership and put them on trial?
“…….The armed wing of Palestinian militant group Hamas executed one of the group’s leading commanders after allegations surfaced of gay sex and theft, it has been revealed……….Izz al-Din al-Qassam Brigades shot Mahmoud Ishtiwi, 34, three times in the chest after they had detained him for a year, The New York Times reported on Tuesday…….”
The IDF does have a working relationship with Abbas, but not Hamas in Gaza. Hamas is responsible for controlling the Gaza strip. They are the most powerful military and they are the government. When Hamas operatives kidnap and murder three Israeli children that is the responsibility of Hamas.
“……Gaza is strangled by a total land, air and water siege. The siege is one of the oldest forms of warfare in history. When you wage war upon a region, it is entirely to be expected that there will a warlike reaction…..”
The blockade is because Hamas continues to fire rockets into Israel.
“……As we learn from modern anti-colonial history. And as the right to resist occupation is enshrined in International Law…..”
They can resist all they want – only far more Palestinians die than Israelis. During Operation Cast Lead, the Palestinian to Israeli death ratio reached 100:1.
“……1/Israel was instrumental in the creation of Hamas. They were to be used as a foil against Fatah…….”
Before they morphed into Hamas, they existed in Gaza as an offshoot of the Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood. So it’s false that Israel created Hamas. Hamas created Hamas (including their anti-Semitic charter). Because they helped fund them as a counter to the PLO is irrelevant. The Muslim Brotherhood has been around a long time in the Middle East – well before Israel was created.
“……2/Israel had absolutely no right to be colonizing the Gaza Strip. All their actions in Gaza were illegal…..”
They are not colonizing the Gaza strip. They pulled their settlements out of Gaza before Hamas was elected. The independence given to Gazans was rewarded by electing an internationally recognized terrorist organization with a (unrealistic) goal of defeating Israel.
“…..3/Israel scorch earthed Gaza upon leaving it…..”
Only in response to the thousands of rockets launched by Hamas into Israel.
“……4/Israel then tried to organize a coup against Hamas after Hamas won the Gazan elections…..”
That was an unfortunate failure by the Mossad – for the people living in Gaza.
“……5/It is blatantly false that Israel’s actions are “defensive”. They are offensive and colonial. They have been from the very outset. 1948 onwards…..”
You are fucked up on your history. Israel accepted the partition. The Palestinians rejected it with violence in 1947. Some Israeli actions have been offensive however like the expelling of the Palestinians before the Arab invasion in 1948.
“……6/What has become the dominant position in Israeli politics is the ultra-Zionist position of Eretz Israel. Again, Eretz Israel has been a Zionist project and position from the beginning…..”
I don’t think all Israelis were interested in greater Israel, but some certainly have been and that narrative seems to be more dominant now. Netanyahu has already stated there will be no two state solution while he is in office. They need to get rid of him.
“…….Which involves the complete expulsion of the indigenous Palestinian inhabitants……”
That is pure bullshit. The Palestinian population keeps increasing.
“……7/New Gas reserves have been found in the Seas off the Gazan coast.
This material economic reason informs Israeli Gazan policy……The Israelis both want to exploit these gas reserves themselves. And to deny the Gazans this natural resource…..”
I don’t know anything about that, but I might do some research since you view of the conflict cannot be trusted.
Thanks.
“Actions have consequences”
This is an utterly despicable piece of morally reptilian Lady Macbeth handwashing.
No two Israelis ever meet without a dead Palestinian lying between them.
Tel Aviv is a military colonial government. The military colonial government formulates and carries out policies and hence bears responsibility for ALL that occurs in Israel and the Occupied Territories.
“Does that happen to coincide with the second Intifada by any chance?”
Geez, the more Israel obsconds Palestinian land and wants to wipe them off the face of the planet, the more the Palestinians respond with violence and the more land Israel obsconds and the more they want to wipe Palestinians off the face of the planet.
Great rationalization there.
At least get it right phineas
The second Intifada came after an offer of peace from Israel. Over five thousand people died because Arafat decided to revert to terrorism. Simple as that.
Was that one of those offers of peace that kept them locked up in their “ghetto”?
Not the point. Arafat had the option to politely refuse the offer – just not to start a war where 5500 people died. However at the time, there was not an embargo on Gaza.
>>>”Actions have consequences”
And armed resistance by native populations to the military forces of occupation and colonization is wholly LEGAL under International Law.
The wanton murder of native populations by military occupying forces is a war crime which IDF skinheads commit as a matter of routine practice and policy.
The psychopathology of a people in a state of permanent religiously fanatical war
>>>”Actions have consequences”
Given your hilarious inability to view the simple causal relation between military colonialism and native resistance, when this trite little truism comes from your mouth, it might even viewed as a major empirical and ethical breakthrough.
Zionist ultra-nationalists have a sickening habit of adopting a posture of self-pity and self-righteousness when confronted with clear evidence of their crimes.
Mr Summers, when you see a wounded and incapacitated man shot in cold blood by a IDF medic (!!!) do you feel anything that could possibly be described as human morality?
Do you think that you are helping the Zionist colonial cause at all by your engaging in constant apologetics and atrocity denialism?
Or you simply confirming what the overwhelming majority of humanity already thinks? (The overwhelming majority of national state governments and people who support and recognize Palestinan Statehood, self-determination and basic human rights) That Israel commits war criminal atrocities routinely and that their apologists are moral reprobates who view the blood on their hands and don’t bat an eyelid.
100 percent of the Jews who support the theft of Palestine and the genocide against Palestinians are immoral scum, of course they enjoy victimizing another Palestinian.
Aipac is an International form of the American KKK
just proves that mankind is a brutal animal. with the Jewish history of persecution and murder, one would think they would be more empathetic. the fact that they are just as nefarious and vicious as anyone, deprives them forever of their claims of innocence and victimization.
Israel is a murderous terrorist state and so are country’s that support and trade with them.
Those polls indicate that not unlike to US, Israeli society is a society of control, brainwashed in believing that, what their government is doing has anything to do with security, patriotism or interest of Israeli society and not support for unspeakable lust for power and greed of Jewish oligarchs who run this statelet on behave of American Jewish diaspora ,blood thirsty neocons and delusional evangelicals.
Couldn’t have said it better myself, but with the addition that the Israeli state has the benefit of a, mainly, ethnically homogenous population to strengthen the propaganda.
I guess it would be the video of the Israeli soldier as he just decides to take a few steps forward and nonchalantly put a bullet into the top of the head of an injured, unarmed man, that shines a different light on Steinitz’s claim that, “…we are not killing prisoners of war, or people that are totally paralyzed.” Video will do that.
Equally chilling as the execution itself, though, is the casual, business-as-usual atmosphere that pervades the macabre scene as people go about their business while a suspect (or whatever his designation–how about unarmed?) is lying on the ground, incapacitated.
I think that atmosphere is simply the natural product of familiarity: They know this drill. They’ve done it so many times, they could do it in their sleep. I’ll bet it would numb us to know the truth–like it’s already done to them.
While bombing and murdering children at the non-jewish lands of gaza and the west bank, like the children playing soccer in gaza would not have been known except for the foreign journalist who witnessed the terrorist attacked against non-combative non-threatening children and these were not military targets either but when do you see such deliberate genocide in the news as terrorist attacks by the jewry? It seems the non-jews are ignorant of the fact that the jewry are instilled by their rabbies and their jewish upbringing/culture that they are the only humans on planet eart and any non-jew is worst and an animal/dog. If you are ignorant of this fact, do not believe me do your own research. Disgusting is short.
I don’t give a fuck who’s Palestinian and who’s Jewish (who has control over such things?)…
Does anyone else see a problem with a MEDIC shooting the wounded?
He was following the rules engagement that Israeli officials ordered. Is it murder? From a morality standpoint I say yes, From a legal standpoint absolutely not. It is always murder when you kill take the life of another human being and is not in self defense. Combat troops are trained to murder that is their job. The Israeli occupation is illegal but the Israeli government are the criminals that should be held accountable not the soldier who doesn’t even have a choice about joining the military. http://mondoweiss.net/2016/03/top-israeli-officials-who-issued-directive-to-execute-palestinians-hang-hebron-killer-out-to-dry/
The IDF lied then when they claimed it was contrary to their standards of conduct.
“Just following orders” didn’t work as a defense for the Nazis at the Nuremburg trials, but it is OK for Israelis when they do their reprisal killings. Perpetually portraying themselves as victims and defining every threat as existential makes that acceptable in this case or so they would have us believe.
Wow, it sounds like ur in bed with a killer v Israel phucking the world thru subjugation of palestine and acts akin to red gin demonic possession
Recognize the state of israel for what it is, as did Germany in the 30’s.
Please!! Germany in the 30’s didn’t recognize shit! That was their problem. They couldn’t recognize shit!
Minion politicians or government lap dog media told you?
When’s netenyahos next Congress visit?
Contrasting the above story, with a recent op-ed in Ynet News, is quite productive. The author is CEO of an investment firm based in Tel Aviv and NYC: BDS is an existential threat. The guy urgently declares that Israelis must take BDS seriously, and identifies five camps whom he feels are not handling it properly.
My favorite of his five:
Treating the Palestinians justly, then, is not an option. No, he ends up endorsing …a PR campaign! Because the hasbara brigades haven’t already been marshaled and seen spewing all over the Internet.
The Internet is. Unless and until Zionists can censor the Internet, and especially social media, they will continue to lose to the BDS movement. And/or, they are going to have to render it impossible for pictures and videos from Israel and the occupied territories to end up on Youtube , Twitter and Facebook.
For some time I’ve felt this last is what they must try to do. Otherwise, stories and images documenting Zionist crimes and viciousness will continue to be written, and the videos will continue to be seen by millions. Freedom of speech and the press simply cannot co-exist in Israel with ending the BDS movement.
I predict it will be severely curtailed.
“…….The BDS movement is not about helping us to become better versions of ourselves. It is the invention of enemies committed to our destruction……”
Completely true. The BDS campaign has nothing to do with treating the Palestinians justly in the sense that they would have a state of their own. It is about replacing a Jewish majority state with a single Palestinian Arab majority state (or two Palestinian states – one Jewless).
That is unpalatable to most Israeli Jews.
Craig,
I want to know how your brain works. That’s it. That’s all I want to know.
1. You say you don’t want a 1 state solution with Arab Majority.
2. But then you want a two state solution. But everytime you build a new settlement, you’re denying the Palestinians at a chance of a State.
3. So then there remains the Israeli Apartheid solution with Palestinian Bantustans.
Either you want an Apartheid State, or you are against settlements. Which is it? And are you willing to ask settlers to move out so Palestinians can have a state? Or do you think that this is just going to go on and on forever, over the shot heads of Palestinians?
In the long run, Apartheid is not going to happen, if you want friends in this world.
I have always opposed the settlements and I have always supported the Oslo Accords. World opinion is strongly against Israel. I believe that the Israelis are going to have to remove most if not all of their settlements from the West Bank so the Palestinians are given their right to self determination – exactly like their Jewish neighbors.
The BDS is not about a two state solution so I oppose it. I am not opposed to the US applying (some) pressure on Israel. When it comes to Israel, I am not opposed to the Bernie Sanders approach (or the Donald Trump approach – more neutral). I just don’t support any of Sander’s other policies.
I hope that clarifies things a little for you.
By the way, you don’t have a conflict that last as long as the IP conflict without racism – on both sides. You really have to put on your blinders to just assign racism to one side. There is a ton of evidence that indicates there is Palestinian and Israeli (Jewish) racism and hatred (as anyone should expect).
“By the way, you don’t have a conflict that last as long as the IP conflict without racism – on both sides.”
It’s not racism, perr se’, although it tdoes akes dehumanization to accomplish, it’s colonial expansion. The Zionists want all of “Greater Israel” re-established as a Jewish state. The Palestinians are in the way.
Despite their rhetoric of a Jewish homeland, which isn’t to be dismissed – see prior sentence – the establishment of Israel was the last vestige on European colonialism in the form of European population expansion and extraction of resources. It is the bastard brotjher to European hegemony in the Americas and Australia.
The Europeans in the Americas and Autralia wanted the land and what was under it and the indigenous populations were in the way. Can no one see the distnct parallels, the congruent butchery, the same marginalization and “final solution” between Gaza and the Weat Bank and American Indian reservations? Hell, the Palestinians have been forced to use the same tactics as American Indians, and are reviled just as fiercely for it.
In actual fact, the Israeli-Palestinian conflict hasn’t lasted that long, considering the Palestinians, if things continue, probably won’t last another generation and it took almost 400 yrs to finish the job for all of North America.
“……Despite their rhetoric of a Jewish homeland, which isn’t to be dismissed – see prior sentence – the establishment of Israel was the last vestige on European colonialism in the form of European population expansion and extraction of resources. It is the bastard brotjher to European hegemony in the Americas and Australia……”
Your ignorance is irritating. Jewish immigration to Palestine was not colonialism – and there are major differences. First of all, Europeans were not returning to North America, New Zealand, Australia and so on. Jerusalem is and was the holiest city in Judaism with a long history of Jewish settlement (Land of Israel). Although Palestinian Arabs far outnumbered the amount of Jews in Palestinian when immigration began in the late 1800s, there were Jews living in Palestine and throughout the Middle East (for thousands of years).
Secondly, Europeans were motivated by expansion. Jews were motivated by centuries of anti-Jewish bigotry and pogroms (you know, like Jews being accused of dominating cultures, business etc.). Anti-Jewish pogroms and racism were common in eastern Europe especially in Russia where much of the immigration originated. Hundreds of thousands of Jews were killed in Russia in the early 1920s. Jews were long second class citizens under Islamic rule as well. Jews were motivated by creating a homeland for the Jewish people.
Third of all, Jewish people did not claim Palestine in the name of one of the era’s great powers like Britain or France. They did ride the coattails of the great powers to obtain their goal of a homeland through the British Mandate in Palestine, but no immigrant got off the boat and stuck a British flag in the ground claiming it for Britain.
Fourth, they didn’t slaughter the natives like the colonial powers in the various locations around the world. They immigrated peacefully and obtained land mostly by buying from absentee land owners. There were no slaughters of the native population to obtain the land (although there was clearly tension interspersed with some violence). There was no ethnic cleansing prior to the war of Independence.
The attempt to compare Zionism and colonialism is simply a way to delegitimize the Jewish State.
“Your ignorance is irritating.”
And your shallow contrarianism which too often opens with statements such as this is why i rarely ever finish anything you have to say.
It’s too early for this.
You don’t have to be racist to oppose someone kicking you off the land your family has farmed for centuries or to do the kicking if you want the land for yourself.
Considering the quanitiy of your responses the only thing left to say to you is :get a job”.
Yes, that’s Craig.
But he’s been forced to significantly modify his Zionist narrative, forced by myself and others posting many facts and direct quotes of Zionists like Herzl and Jabotinsky. Now, he’s at “both sides are racist” and Zionists “rode the coattails” of European colonialists.
In the beginning, Jewish Israelis were not, to hear him tell it, significantly racist, and no whiff of colonialism was around their project. Craig is edging toward the only intellectually honest (but not ultimately persuasive) argument for the crimes of Zionism — i.e., that the pogroms and Holocaust justify it all.
Getting Americans to understand the racism inherent in Zionism — that it exists and is now pervasive — is half the battle. For decades it’s been saintly, suffering Jews v. savage, barbaric Palestinians. Even Craig cannot now maintain that fiction, at least not in this space.
Mona
“……But he’s been forced to significantly modify his Zionist narrative, forced by myself and others posting many facts and direct quotes of Zionists like Herzl and Jabotinsky. Now, he’s at “both sides are racist” and Zionists “rode the coattails” of European colonialists……”
That’s a fabrication on your part Mona. I have always supported the two state solution – and if you believe for a moment that you are the first to call Israelis racists, you are living in a dream world. Try UN resolution 3379 passed in 1975 which equated Zionism to racism. This has been a common tactic of the illiberal radical left long before you became one. I have posted against people who are obsessed by Israel as you well before I met you online. Such is your arrogance.
“…..In the beginning, Jewish Israelis were not, to hear him tell it, significantly racist, and no whiff of colonialism was around their project. Craig is edging toward the only intellectually honest (but not ultimately persuasive) argument for the crimes of Zionism — i.e., that the pogroms and Holocaust justify it all……”
Those are more lies Mona. I have always held the position that Racism is a natural result of being in a state of war since the Jewish people declared independence. Racism is a two way street. I still have the polls which indicate that Muslims hold racist views toward Jews – even in Indonesia. And I still hold the belief that there is no colonialism at all associated with Zionism – something you can dispute if you like.
“……Getting Americans to understand the racism inherent in Zionism — that it exists and is now pervasive — is half the battle. For decades it’s been saintly, suffering Jews v. savage, barbaric Palestinians. Even Craig cannot now maintain that fiction, at least not in this space…..”
Another predictable lie Mona, but that is all required in the anti-Israeli narrative that is pressed so hard by the radical left: Zionism is racism; Israel is an ethno-supremacist state; Israel is an apartheid state in the mold of South Africa; Jews control the US; Israel is no democracy etc.
By the way, if you haven’t already, you might want to read Phineas’s handywork. But I can certainly see why you might agree with him/her.
Thanks Mona.
https://theintercept.com/2016/03/18/brazil-is-engulfed-by-ruling-class-corruption-and-a-dangerous-subversion-of-democracy/?comments=1#comment-212423
I rarely comment here because, lots of times, my minds not into it. But I do read the comments regularly and have seen your point and have been interested in what many peopel do have to say. I do learn from them, and have admired your positions and tneacity. But craig has never been one of them, because he’s just as I said and ideological too.
I had hoped to hear from you vis a vis the cultural contributions, but alas, all I got was craig. Whatever he said to nme above, I never got passed “ignornace is irritating”. If it was and I am, why the next 5 paragraphs.
And fiurther down, I nevem eant to imply an anti-Jewish position, just that, I think, any ethnic group that dominates demographcially the cultural institutions of a society can’t be making small contributions by a few select intellectuals, and that if 3% of the population makes up over 50% of the people in these institutions, that needs to be explained, if only for its statistical significance.
I don’t deny the conflict has racial aspects, but they aren’t necessary to understand it, I think. Whether Palestinian Jews were racist to Palestinian Christians and Palestinian Muslims and pagans , and vice versa, since the Diaspora, I have no clue one way or another.
But is is obvious that since hte advent of Zionism, if I understand correctly, the Jews of Palestine then Israel have been attemtping to dominate the political and territorily landscape and they have dome it mainly by force and dehumanization of non-Jews there.
Of course that is racist, but a land grab is a land grab and you don’t need to be racist to want that, but it sure helps to justify it.
It can be nothing but a fantasy, a fairy tale advocated to avoid the reality of the de facto 1-state, apartheid state. Aside from the fact that Netanyahu and the rest of the rightwing in power in Israel don’t want it — and will never permit it — there’s not enough land left for a Palestinian State.
BDS is growing so strong Israel is panicking, and Zionist throughout the West are doing all they can to make promoting BDS illegal. That won’t work, not even in France where it is now effectively illegal to publicly advocate BDS.
Things are going to get very, very ugly for Israel, in terms of world opinion, and as the op-ed I linked to shows, there will be — there already is — economic harm. Of course, Israel is also going to continue to commit atrocities against Palestinians; the summer of ’14 will be repeated. Knife attacks and other resistance violence will also continue.
At some point nothing can happen but for Israel to end the apartheid and become a democracy in which all, including all in the occupied territories, can vote. In all likelihood, there will have to be UN personnel present as this transition happens, because the blood rage on both sides is and will be fierce. Negotiating a common governmental scheme is going to be extremely fraught.
It’s going to get much worse until it gets better. But the apartheid and occupation will end. There just is no conceivable alternative.
The first part is true. Whether Israelis become a better version of themselves is no one’s business but theirs. The second part results from a poorly constructed dichotomy, and I can’t believe neither the author nor you realize that.
Fair enough Jose. It’s difficult to get the entire meaning of what he says without reading the entire essay. My main point is that the BDS is not supportable because the ultimate goal is wrong (IMO).
Mona,
Nothing change: an essay of mine published in 2001:
Antidote for US Media Offal
(Following article is in response to “A Failed Peace Process” by Mortimer Zuckerman published in The US News and World Report on January 29, 2001)
Mortimer Zuckerman in his USA Today editorial 0f 1/29/01, “A failed peace process”, 1/29/01, flogs familiar odious notions on the so-called “peace process”. (1) “Arafat has misled and incited the mass of Palestinian people”. (2) “The Barak offer was breathtaking”. (3) “Most horrible is the Palestinian Practice of exploiting children as human shields”. (4) Golda Mier: “We will have peace with the Arabs when they love their children more than they hate us.” (5) What other country with such overwhelming might would restrain itself to degree Israel has?” (6) “Israel has been pressured [by US] to give more land in exchange for failed Palestinian promises.” (7) and more.
His diatribe fails on all counts. He castigates President Arafat for inciting the second Intifada. His aim is wide of its mark; the target should be the succession of Israeli governments that repaid Arafat’s conciliatory offers with aggression. Observers both in Israel and Palestine agree that, since Olso, Arafat has been signing peace agreements with Israel which gave away hope for a viable statehood. The Palestinians did and continue to offer a generous compromise peace plan that includes recognition of Israel on 78% of Palestinian land (Israel within the Green Line) and implementation of United Nations resolutions 194, 242, and 338. So much for “generous offers” from Tel Aviv.
Camp David was meant to be the final surrender but Arafat seems, at last, to have woken up to what he has signed away. Now the hope of refugees has been put on the table. It appears that Arafat is more interested in being ruler of a Palestinian State, whatever its condition, than in continuing to seek a just solution to the Palestinian-Israeli conflict. Young Palestinians have had enough, and despite Arafat’s feeble efforts to control them, have taken to the streets to throw stones and fire slingshots at Israeli Merkavas and Cobras.
Francis Boyle, Professor of International Law, Illinois State University. was Legal Advisor to the Palestinian delegation during the 1991-1993 peace negotiations. He was asked by the Palestinian Peace Team what was the closest historical analogue to the Israeli peace offer. He reported: “A bantustan, they are offering you a bantustan, akin to those forced by the apartheid Afrikaaner regime on its black people”. The Palestinian delegation rejected this proposal. But the Israeli government took this proposal and opened up a secret (to almost all the leadership of the Palestinian people let alone the people themselves) channel of negotiations. This Bantustan proposal became the Oslo Agreement.
It is utterly offensive for Zuckerman to suggest (with reference to the malignant Golda Mier of “There are no Palestinians”) that Palestinian children are purposely being used as sacrifices. The Israeli Human Rights group B’Tselem found that from January 1988 to end of November 1998, at least 28 children under 17 years-of-age, of whom 13 were under the age of 13 were killed by rubber-coated steel bullets. According to a London Times report of 17 October 2000, stone throwing youths in Ramallah watched, stunned, as men and boys at the barricades collapsed with small bullet holes in their chests, testicles, arms and hips. These wounds were inflicted by holIow-nosed “Dum-dum” bullets, first manufactured the late 19th century and outlawed by the 1899 Hague Convention.
United Nations Commissioner for Human Rights Mary Robinson visited Israel/Palestine during the Fall of 2000 and reported that Israel is guilty of “excessive use of force” against the Palestinians and called for a halt to the construction of Jewish colonies in the Occupied Territories. A third of the 2000 Palestinians killed have been children (1995 UNICEF report). Since September 2000, over 100 Palestinian children have been killed with special aiming at the head (Jordan Times, 14 December).
Mr. Zuckerman should instead pity the children of Israeli colonists in the West Bank and Gaza who are regularly driven, under military escort, from home to school; the homes and schools and connecting roads are all placed on land confiscated by destroying Palestinian orchards, homes, and farms. These children are endangered by the lawful right of occupied indigenous peoples to oppose their subjugation.
It is also utterly offensive for Mr. Zuckerman to posit that Israel as been restraining itself. When Ariel Sharon guarded by about 1000 Israeli police strode into Jerusalem’s Haram al-Sharif (the “Noble Sanctuary”) on September 28, 2000, the area had been sealed off before, during and after his visit, scarcely ensuring freedom of access. The next day the Israeli army shot eight Palestinians dead some of whom had been hurling stones at police. The world news media ignored that international law entitles the natives of a place under military occupation-which East Jerusalem has been since 1967-to resist by any means possible. All European countries had their resistance fighters during WWII who are lauded as heroes not as terrorists. The Israeli human rights organization B’tselem confirmed eye-witness reports that stones were aimed at the armada of Israeli police whose presence on the Aqso precinct was a provocation. The police did not use tear gas to stop the stone throwing but immediately opened fire with rubber-covered bullets which kill at close range. (Amira Hass, correspondent for Haaretrz (Tel Aviv) in the Palestinian Territories as reprinted in Le Monde Diplomatique, November 2000). Thus, Intifada II began.
Palestinians are guaranteed their right to return by the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, the Geneva Convention of 1949 (signed by Israel), and UN General Assembly resolution 194 made December 11,1948 and reaffirmed 28 times. Any abrogation of these guarantees would set a disastrous precedent for international human rights law. It would provide a clear signal that ethnic cleansers who expel civilians from their homes, steal their property, and prevent refugees returning for long enough can expect to have their illegal territorial conquests blessed with international legitimacy. In the event, the civilized world will find that price for peace too costly.
Mr. Zuckerman should reflect on the article in the NEW YORK REVIEW OF BOOKS of February 8, 2001 by Henry Siegman, Senior Fellow at the Council on Foreign Relations and formerly Executive Director of the American Jewish Congress. Mr. Siegman writes about the recent statement by Israel’s Acting Foreign Minister Shlomo Ben-Ami which is: ” the most honest and important insight into the fifty-year-old conflict between Israel and the Palestinians ever expressed by any Jewish leader”.
As reported by Akiva Eldar in Ha’aretz on November 28, 2000, the statement was made by Ben-Ami in the course of a Cabinet debate over a document prepared by the prime minister’s office which purported to catalog a long list of Palestinian transgressions. Ben-Ami opposed the distribution of the document on the ground that no one in the West would be surprised that a people under occupation fails to honor agreements with its occupier:
“Accusations made by a well-established society about how a people it is oppressing is breaking rules to attain its rights do not have much credence.” This is the first acknowledgment by an Israeli leader that Palestinians are a people under occupation who are struggling for their legitimate rights.
Mr. Siegman emphasizes: “the simple truth that this state [Israel] came at a terrible cost to the Palestinian people…. that [Israeli] occupiers have no political or moral right to set the ground rules for a people that is struggling to get out from under an occupation.”
Avi Shlaim declares in the London Review of Books. 25 January 2001, that “it was Ehud barak, following in his predecessor’s footsteps, who undermined them [the Olso Accords]….What is at stake in this conflict is not Israel’s security, let alone its existence, but its 1967 colonial conquests. Under General Barak’s leadership the Israeli Army is waging a colonial war…it is savage, senseless and directed in the main against the long-suffering civilian population….Arafat has been calling for the peace of the brave ever since the first Oslo Accord was signed. Seven years on he is confronted by an opponent…determined to impose the peace of the bully.”
My own conclusion, after long months of reading about the history of the Palestine/Israel conflict, are essentially the same as those presented by an editorial in the January/February 2001 issue of TIKKUN, the Jewish Journal of Critique of Politics, Culture & Society:
US policy should rein in Israel and impose a settlement based on:
1. removing Israeli colonies from the Occupied Territories of the West Bank and Gaza;
2. releasing West Bank water to the Palestinian inhabitants;
3. inviting refugees to return to their stolen property or to have reasonable compensation;
4. dividing sovereignty in Jerusalem.
Finally, I have asked Mr. Zuckerman to banish the poisonous thoughts that impelled him to write such a malignantly inaccurate editorial.
Excellent analysis! You were quite a few years ahead of me in figuring out, and being able to intelligently argue for, the truth.
Gee, looked kinda like murder (to me), what with the guy just layin’ there and all… and the whole scene just looked so darn cool, calm and collected, like the soldier(s) was, were just… takin’ care of (kill the savages, kill ’em all; no questions asked, literally) business. Lots of indigenous people have been shot off, blasted into extinction and extermination if not forced into pens, ghettos, and a poverty the simple concept of displacement could not begin to even dream of. So interesting that “State-Ness” enables fratricide, infanticide, matricide, genocide; if not into ovens and concentration camps, inexorably toward some more subtly efficient and legerdemain justified politically explainable… means and – pun and double entendres not intended – ends.
Best, and they offered the guy free pizza! I hope with pork sausage and prawns.
How to save Israel:
https://youtu.be/S4nQJH294f0?t=9m33s
These zionist likuds (ZL’s) must be all that and a bag of chips. Forget that protesters accuse them of running the Goebbels propaganda method to label the Palestinians as terrorists. Nonsense! If in their heart of hearts theZL’s really believe that everything they do is for the good of the Palestinians, then where is the shock and amazement that the Palestinians aren’t showering them with flowers and offerings? Perhaps if the ZL’s could simply explain to the Palestinians that they got it al wrong, that it’s just a big misunderstanding, they could break out the peace pipe and everyone could enjoy that universal goal of friendship. After all, friendship is something that you have to work for and earn, if that’s what you want.
Josef Stalin said “Those who cast the votes decide nothing. Those who count the votes decide everything.” And who knows if he ever really said it, but you get the point.
Those who answer the polls decide nothing. Those that take the polls decide everything.
No matter where you go there is a Fox Non News around to misrepresent whatever needs misrepresenting.
In the first place, we should bear in mind that the right wing group given the spotlight in this article is not representative of the entire Israeli population, much less of all Jews. At the same time, we must also recognize that the US government and its military are matching the worst of the Israelis deed-for-deed, whether it be illegal detainment, the torture of prisoners, carrying out of assassinations, or targeting of schools and hospitals.
All that having been said, it is also true that the government of Israel, which has for decades now been embarked on a systematic program of illegal confiscation of Palestinian land, de-facto imprisonment of the entire population of Gaza, and acts of aggression against its neighbors, has the support of the majority of its population. When a US presidential candidate behaves as though these great crimes do not exist, they become guilty of complicity in them, as do ordinary US citizens who give carte blanche to the Netanyahu government and its extremist followers.
Maybe one could then argue that Nazis weren’t monsters because they were Nazis and Stalinists weren’t monsters because they were Stalinists and Maoists weren’t monsters because they were Maoists and The Khmer Rouge werem’t monsters because they were communists and the Zionists aren’t monsters because they are Zionists and Americans aren’t monsters because they are Americans, but, they were al monsters because they were all in control and control breeds monsterous atrocities.
Zionists have generally always seen Palestinians as less than human; before Israel, they referred to the indigenous population as “savages.” The father of Zionism, Theodor Herzl, pushed Zionism as part and parcel of European colonization of Africa, a project of bringing civilization to the backwards peoples of the earth.
Herzl sold a Zionist state to Britain as being a sure European ally in the Middle East. Further, he sought the endorsement of Cecil Rhodes, and explicitly likened the Zionist project to what those nice colonialists were doing in Africa.
Zionist dehumanization of Palestinians has simply become more severe and pervasive, and is seen now by the whole world. Only for that reason, and when a video makes it undeniable, is there even a charade of punishment for a Jew murdering a Palestinian.
To elaborate, just a little: the Zionist program was codified in a document known as the Balfour Memorandum; this document is cited even today by apologists for the Zionists. A curious detail is that the Memorandum asserted that in such a state all inhabitants would enjoy equal rights, regardless of their religion or ethnic heritage. Herzl and his successors have systematically disregarded that principle, scoffing at the notion even before the state of Israel came into existence.
I for one believe that the extent of the animosity of the Zionists for the Nazis results as much from the latter claiming to be the master race as from the program of extermination carried out during World War 2. There can, after all, be only one master race, one chosen people. And if it is true, that there is a master race, a chosen people, then it must follow that all other races, all other people, are inferior. It is a logical consequence of the fundamental principle of Judaism that Palestinians must be Üntermenschen.
That’s absurd. It betrays as facile a notion of the concept of “the Chosen People” vis-a-vis Jews as Islamophobes do about “jihad.” Moreover, and as in all faiths, there is and was great diversity among believing Jews, not to mention the secular ones.
It is literally true that the United States would be culturally and intellectually poorer absent many talented and brilliant Jews. Historically, Jews have been leaders among civil libertarians and those fighting against all forms of discrimination.
The tragedy of Zionism is that it has, for too many, substituted ethno-religious nationalism for the egalitarian universalism that so many magnificent Jewish minds have brought to the world, perhaps especially in the U.S. The Holocaust was a catalyst for many in this segment of Jewry to set aside principles that had heretofore made them a salt unto the Western earth, and which many of them still are.
“It is literally true that the United States would be culturally and intellectually poorer absent many talented and brilliant Jews.”
That codifies the notion of any particular individual as being “indispensible” when it has been hypothesized, if not logically and empirically shown, that any human accomplishment accredited to any individual would merely have been accomplished by another in the absence of that individual.
For example, Special and General Relativity didn’t require Albert Einstein, he just happened to come upon the principle first in light of the flow of physics in 1905.
Further, the contributions, if not actual dominance, of Jewish intellectuals doesn’t seem to be a character of being Jewish more than a reflection of the number of Jews in certain fields. For instance, although Jews make up less than 3% of the US population, they make up over, if I understand correctly, 50% of lawyers, doctors, scientists, movie directors, bankers, academics etc.
It’s hard to imagine Jews being THAT intellectually and creatively superior to any other ethnic group, so one has to wonder how they come to dominate such socially elite positions in societies where they make up such a small percent of the total population?
Where is there room for 97% of the US population in such fields , and the opportunity to contribute to making the U.S. culturally and intellectually richer, if a plurality, of not majority, of such postions are held by, and almost EVERY Jewish person holds, such a position?
What cultural and intellectual riches are we missing because the majority of our cultural and intellect is dominated by Jewish thought and experience? In this light, one could argue we are culturally and intellectially POORER because of the dominance of Jews in the fields that create our culture.
Culture (Wikipedia): E.B. Tylor, “that complex whole which includes knowledge, belief, art, morals, law, custom and any other capabilities and habits acquired by man as a member of society.”[1]
Jewish people contribute significantly to our culture, but they don’t dominate our culture. So does every other group, or subgroup of people in America. Immigrants from all over the world contribute/influence to our culture while globalization continually changes or influences our culture as well.
How can you say they don’t dominate our culture when the majority of the arts and media, Hollywood, the attitudes they portray, the values they expound, the ideas they propagate and the banks that finance their projects are dominated by Jewish people?
While the legislatures may not be primarily populated by Jews, the lawyers and judges who interpret and administer the law seem to be.
The scientists, reseachers , journalists and intellectuals that interpret, philosophize upon, comment and critique and report upon, and decide what gets reported upon in our culture seem to be primarily Jewish.
Would we really be so enamored with Israel if 3% of the US population that was Jewish wasn’t so rich, well-financed and dominating of our culture? Could you see us being so enamored with China, which is much more important to our economic well-being and long -term military security, even if the percent of actual Chinese approached 3% of US population?
How about Hispanic people? 5x as many Hispanics in the US as Jews and we aren’t so gracious, forgiving or supportive of South America and Mexico, who share our hemisphere. They certainly don’t influence our culture as much as Jewish people do, despite bi-lingual signs and the popularity of Mexican food.
Is it racism, pure and simple, or are Jews, by their domimation of law, banking and media greatly influencing our culture?
I am not saying that makes us have a Jewish culture, as say, Talmudic, but it certainly forces much of our culture to have a Jewish thought about it. As much as we may seemed immersed in an ocean of liberalism and Enlightenment ideals, it can’t be argued that through the 19th and early 20th century much of liberal thought wasn’t expounded by Jews and that it doesn’t continue to the present day. Much of German philosophy and economics, European literature and art was created by Jews.
Despite being developed by Catholic Renaissance and Protestant individualists, much of the intellectual advancement of liberalism was by Jews in the 19th century, immersed in European mercantilism and the movement from agriculture to industrialization (which was financed by Jewsish bankers – the Rothchilds), again, in disproportion to their numbers.
And I am not saying it is somehow unappreciated. What I was saying, in regard to Mona’s statement, is that the 10 million or so Jews in the US have not contributed a small sprinkling of flavor to the broth of culture, but, by their very disproportion in the intellectual, business , professional and artistic classes, they are the soup the rest of swim in.
Again, it is not a Jewish culture, but it is a culture propagated, evolved, expanded and financed largely by Jewish people.
And now for a personal observation, how interesting that the only response, and critique, I’ve gotten since almost, well, ever, is by the resident contrarian.
And for the record, I’M not anti-Jewsih. I’ve just been curious, when I learned the disproportion of Jews in the major professional and elite classes, especially in regard to their population, how they manage to so consistently do that throughout history, and how anyone can think such disproportion doesn’t affect those cultures and cause resentment, especially when things tank.
They’ve been lucky. I think, here in the US, because when the banks tank the economy, while we may blame BANKERS, we don’t blame JEWS, despite almost all the responsible bankers being Jewish. They weren’t so lucky throughout the centuries in Europe, don’t you know, which may be another basis for the extreme response of Zionists to even rational critique of their extreme and self-justified barbarity.
“……And for the record, I’M not anti-Jewsih. I’ve just been curious, when I learned the disproportion of Jews in the major professional and elite classes, especially in regard to their population, how they manage to so consistently do that throughout history, and how anyone can think such disproportion doesn’t affect those cultures and cause resentment, especially when things tank……”
Yep it certainly does seem to cause resentment in your case. Try posting at Stormfront – where you will be among friends.
“Yep it certainly does seem to cause resentment in your case. Try posting at Stormfront – where you will be among friends.”
Ran out of everything but more insults this quickly, hey, craigie-poo? It’s a wonder anyone on this site ever responds to you. Oh my gad, i have something that isn’t a blowjob to say about Jews, I’m such an a-a-a-a-a-anti SEMITE!
Fair enough Phineas. I apologize. I just don’t understand how you can believe Jews are not only dominating our culture, but suppressing the culture of 97% of the people. It makes no sense – but yours was an honest question then.
Thanks.
If suppression it is, and I’m nto asyingit is necessarily an ‘agenda'< it can be explained two-fold.
Every Jewish economist, journakist, philosopher, linguist (Chomsky), etc is displacing someone from the other 97% of society – assuming, of course, inaccurately, that every other person is as
OOPS. continuing on…
….assuming, of course, inaccurately, that every other person is as qualified, solely for argument sake. But you get the point. In a “unbiased” demogrpahic, Jews shodl maek up 3% of iany fields, and ther influential opnion, commentary, etc woudl be tempered and diminished by their truly proportional representation. The disproportion is obvious.
The second way. By being so over-represented in these fields, and in the monetary center that funds these filwds, it si their ideas, atttitudes, opinions and semsibilitied that disproportionally control the dialog, who gets funded and what is disseminated.
But it is also true that Jewish intellectuals are not a monolithic block. For every Freidman there ia a Stiglitz or Krugman, for ever Kissinger there is a Chomsky, but the disproportion still leads to an over-adundance of Jewish perspective at eh expense of an Hisapnic persepctive, or Asian perspective, of, especially a Black perspective or a Muslim perspective, etc
What still needs to be explaine d is how this disproportion actaully came about. For what it is worth, the surprise for me, when I learned of it , was not that there was so many Jewish lawyers, doctors, economosts, media execs, bankers, etc, but that there were really so few Jews in the U.S.
I apologize for the typos, I usually edit , when able, but it is dark in the room, the only light is the laptop screen and I’ve not been a decent typist since I’ve started have neurological troubles. And the first part suddenly posted on its own – probably a mistyped TAB – ENTER
Now that it is mid-afternoon, craigie-poo, and my brain is a little more in gear and i’ve had my breakfast , I’ll try to address your concerns of neo-nazi-eaque KKKlanninisms.
I’m coming not from a racist presepctive, craigie-poo, but a statistical one.
It’s no great accomplishment, and nothing to admire, if intellectual and cultural accomplishments come from the ethnic group of people that, in most professional and intellectual/artistic fields, make up the majority, if not statistically ALL, of the professionals in that class.
So Jews making such accomplishments is to be expected, not “admired”. Nor, was it Jewish intellectualism that was required. As I said, Relativity would have been developed whether the guy was named Einstein or O’Brien. Physics was pointing to that at the time.
Next, there is some statistical significance to an ethnic group that composes 3% of a population holding the vast majority of positions in the vast majority of intellectual/professional fields. Noticing this is not racism, it’s, if anything, scientific. And it begs for an explanation.
There could be manhy explantions, some cponspiratorial – “those damn Jews, they get into a field and then all they hire is other Jews”, or it could simplu be Jewish culture. Jews admire intellectualism and academic accomplishment and the vast majority of Jewish families strive, if not struggle, to send their children to good universities, And as these encouraged children prosper, they are better able to afford good universities for their chidren
Perhaps other religions and ethnicities aren’t so culturally inclined. My family never had ambitions before my generation to attend college, even when given the opportunity.
I graduated 3rd in my HS class of 200 with the highest SAT scores in my HS at the time. My Catholic mother wanted me to be a garbage man. I can imagine a Jewish mother whose son graduated 50 out of 200 with a 1040 SAT score wanting her son to be a doctor. And I don’t resent that, so don’t get your yamaka in a twist.
Now, let’s suppose this vastly skewed professional class existed historically. Not only are most bankers in a small midieval country Jewiish, maybe all of them are. When the economy tanks, the unsohpisticated Catholic/Protestant peasantry don’t have the understanding to comprehend economic cycles, they blame it “on the Jews”:
Suppose not only are most doctorss in a small country Jewiish, maybe all of them are.
When a plague hits, the unsohpisticated Catholic/Protestant peasantry don’t have the understanding of diseasse, they blame it “on the Jews”.
Luckily, in the US, we’ve become more sophisticated than that,, by and large, and thankfully. Though we’ve yet to see the lack of connection to terrorism with simply being Muslim, as a society. Hopefully we won’t go the way of Germany 80 yrs ago.
But recognizing the possibility of this “it’s the Jews” explanaton occurring, even into the “sophisticated” early 20th century, doesn’t make one a Nazi. But, craigie-poo, thinking it does is why your ideas are shallow, idealogical tripe .
As for my “a-a-a-a-a-a-a-a nti-semeticsm” I have stopped reading certain websites – Information Clearinghouse for one -I liked the video journalism there, because of the rabid anti-jewish rants there and can’t stand the comment section of RT for the same. But I still read it because I like the tabloid-esque articles and I have yet to see the editors support the vile opnions of the comment section. Never been to Stormfront, is it a climatology site? I do have an interest in the weather.
“……But recognizing the possibility of this “it’s the Jews” explanaton occurring, even into the “sophisticated” early 20th century, doesn’t make one a Nazi. But, craigie-poo, thinking it does is why your ideas are shallow, idealogical tripe….”
Suggesting that Jewish people suppress the culture of 97% of the population hardly puts you in an intellectual class, or labels you as a deep thinker. You would certainly have a difficult time drumming up support for such a radical idea. I’m surprised that you mention this on a thread about the Jewish state – especially because you support the Palestinians. I’m not sure any normal person would have interpreted your post any other way than antisemitic.
Jewish people have been successful in America. That is something to be admired and I suspect it’s – in part – because of a strong work ethic ingrained in Jewish people for generations because of the constant anti-Jewish bigotry they have faced for centuries. So the answer might be cultural (and I surely don’t know for certain). Minorities don’t have it easy in the US, but Jews are not the only successful minority. Chinese Americans and Indian Americans also do disproportionately well in America facing language barriers and racism – just to name two.
Regardless, you need to do a more thorough job with your numbers. There are approximately 9,000,000 Jews (3%). Some of those are children, retired or possibly stay at home moms. Thus the number is somewhat less than 9,000,000 in the work force. There are 1.4 million lawyers alone. There must be millions of jobs in the financial, banking, engineers, doctors and other scientists and professionals. How many Jewish people actually are in your categories? I don’t know, but I doubt you do either.
Finally, I disagree that Jewish people suppress the culture of 97% of the people in America. The concept of culture is much more complicated than what you are saying. There is nothing suppressed by Jews in America. I am not the only one (hopefully) who will challenge that idea when you bring it up. Those kind of ideas have a dark history.
Thanks.
“Suggesting that Jewish people suppress the culture of 97% of the population hardly puts you in an intellectual class, or labels you as a deep thinker.”
There you go again. Maybe so,
Bit here’s one for you. Not understanding how , matheimetcially, it couldn’t not suppress the other 97% is why you probably didn’t graduate 3rd in your HS class and are even less deep a thinker than you think I am.
Have a nice day.
To put it in succinct terms, craig, so even you can understand it.
For every Jewish person in a position of influence in the intellectual, cultural, artisitc , economic, seats of power, over and above their actual representation in the general population, given that these seats are limited – which they are – means that another ethnic group and demographic is under-represented.
To not be a disproportional influence, even with their disproportional numbers, you would have to assume that any random qualified person from the other groups would think exactly like and make the exact same professional decisions or have the exact same opinions, cultural references and pre-dispositions as the Jewish person in those positions. And that is intellectually untenaable.
To iilustrate as simple math
If you have 97,000,000 red cats and 3, 000,000 white cats and 1,000,000 cats can fit in a box and you put in 670,000 white cats you can only put in 330,000 red cats, So the excess white cats above 30,000 are “suppressing” the number of red cats in the box and whatever unique cultural perspective the red cats would bring to that box.
Is that so hard to understand?
Fair enough. I get your point (I think). Jewish people have a greater amount of influence in professional jobs than the rest of the population (which I stated up top). If there are 1000 gynecologists in the US and 300 are Jewish, that leaves only 700 gynecologist jobs available for Non Jewish people who represent a much greater portion of the population. We do have a competitive society so I don’t know what you can do about that other than large scale affirmative action.
We want the best doctors, best scientist, best bankers (etc.) because society benefits. Unless it can be shown that Jews just give other Jews important positions (only because they are Jews), then the best people (ideally) end up in the various professional jobs. That is America – equality of opportunity, not equality of outcome. The National Basketball Association is about 80% African American – but that just represents equal opportunity.
I guess you think that there is too much Jewish success so things are out of whack in our culture (presumably too much influence). I hope I got that right, but I also disagree with that whole idea.
Thanks.
Yes, we do have a competitive society but humans are pretty non-distinct when it comes to abilities across genetic sub groups. As I sated in the very beginning of the discussion, Jews are not, as a group, intelectually and creatively superior to any othe r group. So what explains the disproprotionate success?
Racism in the US clearly plays a role , and Jews areunique aming non-Anglos in the US , in that they m now expderience very low forms of cultural and institutional racism, I think, at least European Jews who are culturally secular. The Hasidim in Williamsburg are certainly not sitting on the board of CBS in great numbers.
I mentioned cultural factors, and then there’s the fact that nothing succeeds liike success and once a “foothold” is established, a “genetic drift” within the profession may occur.
So, back the the beginning. This over-representation naturally reduces other ethnic influences and leaves greater opportunities for cultural comtribution to the higher represented ethnic groups as a matter of course, diminishing the noteworthiness of the contribution, at least in terms of the ehtnicity of whoever made the accomplishment.
That was essentially all I was trying to point out.
“There are 1.4 million lawyers alone.”
Okay, so tell me, are there signiticantly more that 42,000 Jewish lawyers? And that’s a high number. Factor out the now working Jews. Are there significantly more than 20,000 Jewish lawyers?
But I’m not even talking about the typical “working class” professional. Craig. I’m talking of the people of influence. The lawyers in the upper reaches of gov’t, the economists at influential think tanks, the bankers that run the Fed reserves banks and the major banks that tanked the economy and the Treasury Dept, the excutuves of TV stations and newspapers, the intellectuals in major universities. The very people, who by their power and influence over our very society are a lot more isignificant than the ethnicity of the lawyers for Home Depot, or the accountants for Starbucks.
These are the people who decide what gets on the CNN news scrolls , such as the carnage in Belgium instead of the carnage in a Yemani market or some kids with rocks pelting Israeli tanks instead of a single Israeli sadist blowing a prone Palestinian’s brains to oatmeal
“……These are the people who decide what gets on the CNN news scrolls , such as the carnage in Belgium instead of the carnage in a Yemani market or some kids with rocks pelting Israeli tanks instead of a single Israeli sadist blowing a prone Palestinian’s brains to oatmeal….”
So this is all about Jewish influence: Jews doing things to benefit Jews. I tried to step back and listen, but you are leading me into the world of Jewish conspiracy theories. This is exactly what Mona tried to say. Jews control our foreign policy and send our sons and daughters to fight and die for Israel – for Jewish interests.
Sorry I am not buying it.
Of course it is about influence, dare I call you “twit” . That was my point. Jews, by their sheer numbers in positions of influence have more of an effect on our culture than non-Jews and over and above theiri repressentation in our popualtion.
It goes directly to our support of Israel. Would our gov’t be so Israelophilic if Jews weren’t so largely over-represented in our gov’t institutions, central banks, MEDIA?
I don’t think it would, because our national security doesn;t depend in any way shape or form to the existence of Israel. If, as I have recently been discussing with a friend, rationality is whatever action enhances your goals or self-interest, our support of Israel is damn irrational.
I think that can only be explained by the cultural over-influence of American Jews.
You can chalk it up to being better, being nepotists or privileged, but whatever the reason, that reason doesn’t diminish the effect.
Again, I don’t have anything against Jews, as individuals or people, but if the over-influence of Jews, leading to an irrational support of Israel, as Israel now stands, by the US gov’t , goes against the US’s long term interests , solely to support an Israeli state, then I see it as my duty to point it out , criticize it and label it for what it is – treason.
phineas
“…….Again, I don’t have anything against Jews, as individuals or people, but if the over-influence of Jews, leading to an irrational support of Israel, as Israel now stands, by the US gov’t , goes against the US’s long term interests , solely to support an Israeli state, then I see it as my duty to point it out , criticize it and label it for what it is – treason……”
Of course, the Jews are treasonous, and I understand that this is not personal. You are simply pointing this out. Sure people may call you an anti-Jewish bigot, but people are just ignorant to the truth. Besides, the Jews are just stifling debate so their control of our foreign policies are not exposed.
You know that “blame the Jews” has a long, dark and dangerous history. That’s the basis for Zionism. I appreciate your candor, but I sincerely believe you are wrong.
By the way, Stormfront is a white supremacist site, but I suspect you already knew that.
Thanks.
Come on craig. Stop playing hte “eternal victim” card. Any citizen who puts another state’s intersts before his own is treasonous. If the Jewish advisors ando fficial in the US Gov’t, the meadia and academia are putting Israels interests above thosof the U.S they are traitors, by definition. it woudl be the same if it were Chnese advisors, Rsssia advisors, Latino advisors, etc and YOU knwo that!
Since it is obvious your goal is not to discussobjectively but to find any excuse to cry anti-Semeitism, this discussion, from my end is over.
I spent a while day and a lot of intelectual and emotional effort going aroud in circles with you.
First you decied “Jewish influence” and then after a day of your petty, obtuse wailing you finally admitted having disproportionate represenetation in certain professional elite fields creates diproportionate influence. And you did it in such a way as to present that the discussion was never about influence but anti-Semetic knee-jerking.
You are a demaigogue of the worst kind and it is no wonder you’re a pariah here, and rigthly so,
Adieu
And are Jews really any more hard-working than anyone else, craig. That sounds racist in itself, though I did concede it could be a culture that expdects, if not demands, the progeny enter into influential fields and positions.
But demanding or expecting are pointless if the doors don’t open and the offers don’t come. My Black neighbor may truly want her som to becoeme a professional and he may work hard at it, but what’s the real chance he will? and Blacks make up 3x the demographic as Jews in the US. And they sure as shit haven’t been unoppressed, if that’s a motivation
How many Chinese bankers have run the Fed, craig?
When was the last Chinese National Security advsor?
How many Indians are media company executives, determining what propaganda the US publice gets brainwashed with?
How many Chinese economsits get invited on the talking head circuit, craig?
I’m not talking solely about working class success, I’m talking about INFLUENCE.
“……I’m not talking solely about working class success, I’m talking about INFLUENCE…..”
Trust me. I understand (see my first sentence in my response above). We will have ample opportunity to discuss this in the future, but I’m done for the moment. Thanks for your patience though.
“…….I for one believe that the extent of the animosity of the Zionists for the Nazis results as much from the latter claiming to be the master race as from the program of extermination carried out during World War 2……”
That is a quote I will set aside for future use. Of course, you are feeding this information to someone who believes in too many anti-Jewish tropes as it is. Though, it is nice to lay your cards on the table so everyone can see and understand where you are coming from.
……Mona….ditto….
Mr. Mackey
“……(Bennett’s use of the phrase “terrorist attack,” to describe a knife attack not on a civilian but on a soldier at a checkpoint in an occupied city, seems designed to erase the moral complexity of the situation by defining all violent resistance to Israel’s military rule over the Palestinian population as illegitimate.)…..”
That may be as misguided as your refusing to call the Brussels terrorist attack…….a TERRORIST attack in your article “Dramatic Images of Chaos in Brussels Following Attacks on Airport and Metro”. Did you even use the word “victim” to describe the VICTIMS? And the follow-up article Mr. Mackey? You know, M-u-s-l-i-m t-e-r-r-o-r-i-s-t attack?
“……A wave of support for the medic seemed to build over the weekend. Haaretz reported on Friday that about half the comments on the incident posted online in the first 24 hours after the shooting were critical of the medic. By Saturday, a poll conducted for Israel’s Channel 2 News found that 57 percent of the public said that there was no need to arrest and investigate the soldier, while just 32 percent supported his detention…..”
Doesn’t sound like any of these polls are scientific, but WTF. Regardless, I would be interested in polls conducted in the US or even Europe (try Paris) using the same question. I doubt there would be a great deal of sympathy for the dead Palestinian considering he instigated the violence – and he was not wearing anything identifying him as a soldier. Most of the attacks by Palestinians have picked random victims including the one American killed by a Palestinian TERRORIST.
“…….The recent wave in violence that began in October 2015, in which 29 Israelis, four foreign nationals and some 190 Palestinians have been killed, with around two-thirds of Palestinians deaths occurring while attacking Israelis……”
Will some decent journalist please make Hillary Clinton address this shooting with respect to her gushing speech at AIPAC? Why is she allowed to get away with silence on this shooting after that speech?
When you see an entire category of people as subhuman you are disinclined to care or be judgmental when one of them turns up with his brains blown out.
Past time to cut Israel adrift.
I wonder how much “Jewish Power” had to pay to play the KKK playbook?
Jewish religious extremists (e.g. ALL Zionists) are even more disturbed and dangerous than Islamic religious extremists.
Oh c’mon. He’s a medic in the world’s most moral army. Stop picking on him.
And make sure this incident cannot be discussed in the University of California system, for that would surely be anti-semitism.
There was a time about 20 years ago, if someone said to me, so and so is an anti-semite, I’d go “really? Holy shit!” Nowadays, I’m not sure I have a reaction. Because apparently everyone and their mother is one.
We are not only all anti-Semitic, but anti-black, anti-Muslim and anti (any) minority. Sorry, but that just goes with being of European descent. It’s a big responsibility. Sorry to let you know this, but you are a racist (pick a minority). Plain and simple.
Aren’t most Israeli’s of European descent and aren’t Palestinians, whether Jewish, Muslim, Christian or whatever, the actual Semites?
And as for all Europeans being racist:
1: Probably no more so than any other socio-political ethnic group of humans
2: Speak for yourself
Craig,
You’re missing the forest. If you go around calling everyone a racist, when Donald Trump comes around, no one is going to care. About 15 years ago, the term anti-semite had some bite. But now people like Max Blumenthal and Glenn Greenwald and Noam Chomsky are called self-loathing and anti-semitic, simply because they dislike and report on Israeli politics, Israeli foreign policy, domestic policy, whatever. When you do that, you don’t hurt prominent Jews like Glenn, you hurt the average Jewish person.
You’re missing the forest, Craig. Israel is destroying the automatic sympathy Jews get from people. Israeli behavior is fucking toxic, and destroying any “benefit of the doubt.” These fucking people are racists, at levels that do not belong in the 21st century. It’s just too bad you can’t see it. You obviously care. But you just can’t see it.
“……There was a time about 20 years ago, if someone said to me, so and so is an anti-semite, I’d go “really? Holy shit!” Nowadays, I’m not sure I have a reaction. Because apparently everyone and their mother is one……”
After reading through this thread, it should be apparent that anti-Semitism is alive and well – just ignored.
I am the most moral Internet commenter in the history of the world and I will investigate myself if necessary to prove it.
Beware when fighting monsters you do not become a monster
I now understand how General Hercules became the person he is today. Too many hours spent fighting monsters in games on his Playstation.
israelis never lie, even when they slaughter Palestinians in Palestine they will tell everyone that it was all self defense and the thousands of mutilated women and children were “in the line of fire and didn’t evaucate their homes as ordered to” or, “it wasn’t just a hospital, it was a weapons storage facility” or, “the kids in the school were there to protect a weapons cache” or, “the ambulances were really military vehicles that just looked like ambulances” or, “those neighborhoods had terrorists in them” or, “that power station allowed the Palestinians to do bad things” or, maybe they can make up some “israeli truth” about how grocery stores are a terrorist enablement facility that supplies life support or maybe that their actions that take place after the israelis steal their land and homes is not the way to take back one’s land and homes.
But in this particular case, that Palestinian was alive when the IDF guy shot him in the head because following impact, much blood was PUMPED OUT BY A BEATING HEART. And clearly as he lie there on the pavement unable to move much at all, it is clear how afraid the IDF was that perhaps he was still a threat by a booby trap that could not under any circumstances be checked out. Of course, after the scared IDF guy killed him, he could still be booby trapped so the argument that any possible booby trap was a threat did not end with his murder.
They simply do not look at Palestinians as equal or human,they forget why Jesus died and who for only that he was a Jew or that God chose the Jewish world as a way to spread his word through Jesus.God new Jews were suffering as a people he sent his son through them to spread his word.Jesus loved all religions and people regardless yet Jews mistake his choice as meaning their better than everyone else.Humility is a bedrock of Jesus yet you will see no Humility from Israel’s leaders just arrogant.
When populations are traumatized by fear, even if the risk of harm is highly improbable, their thinking and principles seem to go out the window. You can see basically the same thing in surveys of Americans.
In that context, imagine what it must be like to live under military occupation and economic oppression imposed by a foreign power. Can we really judge people living under such conditions?
To the victims go the soils. You kind of have to. Failing to do so gives rise to nazi styled states.
correction. After another re-reading of your statement, i see a need for an amended clarification. One cannot truly judge the victims. God would tell us, “Every human being counts and is entitled to life support and habitat.” That is God’s will.
There’s a rising consensus in the United States that the policies and practices of our so-called ‘allies’ in the Middle East are utterly at odds with the democratic traditions of the United States; that includes everyone from Turkey to Israel to Saudi Arabia and the Gulf Kingdoms.
This is seen in the growing Boycott-Divest-Sanctions movement, which mainly targets Israel, but there have been many protests over ties between U.S. schools and Saudi Arabia as well.
This is why the U.S. needs to disengage militarily from the Middle East, which will save our country many billions in taxpayer dollars. We need to end the regime change and destabilization programs, and instead pursue diplomatic resolutions to the various conflicts in the region, resolutions that are in line with the democratic values we supposedly believe in – i.e. the Saudi Royal Family should step down from power and accept a transition to parliamentary democracy, as Britain did, and Israel should incorporate the West Bank and Gaza into a one-state solution, in which the Palestinian Arabs are given the same rights as any other Israeli citizen, just as South Africa did at the end of the apartheid era.
In the edX course “America’s war for the greater Middle East”, (soon to appear as a book) Andrew Bacevich convincingly makes the point that the US’ choice of allies in the region (most notably Israel and Saudi Arabia) was remarkably inept and unfortunate. We all know about AIPAC and the efforts of people like Sheldon Adelson, which have resulted in a nearly universal paralysis of our government when it comes to Israel, but the influence of Saudi Arabia is not as well appreciated. Craig Unger wrote a nice book (House of Bush, House of Saud) a few years back detailing the extraordinary degree of rapport between US and Saudi leaders going back to Reagan. In a way, the Saudis have been more successful than the Israelis, because there is little said about the massive scale of human rights abuses in, or promotion of terrorists by, that government.