▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄ ⟶
(update below)
A BRAZILIAN STATE JUDGE ordered mobile phone operators to block nationwide the extremely popular WhatsApp chat service for 72 hours, a move that will have widespread international reverberations for the increasingly contentious debate over encryption and online privacy. The ruling, issued on April 26, became public on Monday when it was served on mobile service providers. It took effect the same day at 2 p.m. local time (1 p.m. ET); as of that time, people in Brazil who tried to use the service could not connect, nor could they send or receive any messages. Failure to comply will subject the service providers to a fine of 500,000 reals per day ($142,000 per day).
WhatsApp is the most-used app in Brazil, a country of 200 million people (it is now owned by Facebook, the country’s second-most used app). An estimated 91 percent of Brazilian mobile users nationwide — more than 100 million individuals — use WhatsApp to communicate with one another for free (it has 900 million active daily users around the world). Brazilians spent this morning, in the hours before the block took effect, frantically sending each other messages on WhatsApp warning that the service was going down for three days.
This ruling comes from the same judge, Marcel Maia Montalvão, of a small town in Sergipe state, who two months ago ordered Facebook’s vice president for Latin America, Diego Dzodan, to be detained over WhatsApp’s failure to cooperate with a subpoena issued as part of a criminal investigation. The judge said the arrest was justified by Facebook’s “repeatedly failing to comply with judicial orders” in a drug-trafficking case. Pursuant to that order, Dzodan was arrested by federal police and held in custody for a full day, until an appellate court overturned the order.
Afterward, the Facebook executive insisted that “the way that information is encrypted from one cellphone to another, there is no information stored that could be handed over to authorities.” WhatsApp similarly said: “WhatsApp cannot provide information we do not have.” According to Folha de São Paulo, Brazil’s largest newspaper, Monday’s ruling ordering the shutdown of WhatsApp stems from the same case.
The extraordinary orders reflect what is becoming a global controversy over the fight of technology companies to offer their users “end-to-end” encryption. That service, which has become quite in demand in the wake of reporting from the archive provided by Edward Snowden, ensures that only the users — but not the company itself — can access the content they are sharing. The post-Snowden fixation of tech companies to demonstrate a genuine commitment to protect the privacy of their users (motivated by business self-interest) has driven a wedge between the once-fully collaborative Silicon Valley and U.S. government surveillance state partners, creating a protracted and bitter public PR war that culminated last month in the Apple/FBI fight over access to iPhones.
As a result of its encryption protections, the position of WhatsApp in response to subpoenas has been that it is incapable of turning over users’ communications because the encryption not only keeps governments and non-state actors out but also the company itself. Over the past several years, numerous countries have begun enacting laws to bar companies from using any encryption that they cannot circumvent, and the Obama administration has been debating whether to support legislation that would allow only the use of encryption to which government agencies have backdoor access (in the 1990s, the Clinton administration used the Oklahoma City bombing to argue for a similar law, but it was blocked by a coalition of privacy advocates from both parties in Congress).
THIS IS NOT the first time WhatsApp service has been interrupted in Brazil. Last December, in a separate case, a lower court judge in São Paulo state ordered service providers to block the app for 48 hours as retribution for its failure to cooperate in a criminal investigation. An appeals court overturned the ruling but only after hours of service outage, invoking “constitutional principles” to say that “it does not seem reasonable that millions of users are affected because of the inertia of a company.”
In many ways, Brazil — with huge numbers of internet users and a growing online population of young people — is a key battleground for the global struggle for internet freedom. The Wall Street Journal called Brazil “the social media capital of the universe.” In January, after the last WhatsApp shutdown, two analysts from the Brazil-based Igarapé Institute, Robert Muggah and Nathan Thompson, wrote in the New York Times, “The country has one of the fastest growing populations of internet users in the world. Online tools like Facebook, Twitter and WhatsApp are used not only to express opinions; they are an affordable alternative to exorbitantly priced Brazilian telecom providers.”
In a country with turbulent political conflicts and a highly engaged online population, the debate over internet freedom has become very prominent. Along with Germany, the Brazilian government, in the wake of the Snowden revelations, was the most vocal in denouncing the U.S. for excessive NSA surveillance (Brazil was a key target for such spying). In 2014, the government enacted what it claimed was a law to protect internet freedom, “Marco Civil da Internet,” that did provide some privacy protections but also granted new surveillance powers to the government. Just last month, the government demanded, and received, a new draconian anti-terrorism law that provided it with extreme new law enforcement powers (causing ex-President Lula da Silva to break with his party, which controls the government, by telling The Intercept in an interview that he opposes the new law).
And now, as The Intercept reported last week, a new cybercrime bill on the verge of being enacted could codify internet-shutdown powers of the type the state judge imposed on Monday. In a Facebook post, Ronaldo Lemos, founding director of the Institute of Technology and Society of Rio de Janeiro and an architect of Brazil’s landmark 2014 Marco Civil internet legislation, wrote: “Tomorrow, the Cybercrime CPI will vote on a proposal to make this type of block lawful. If the CPI proposal goes forward, this will be the new normal in the country. Every week we would have news of sites and services that are blocked, as it is in Saudi Arabia and North Korea.”
It is stunning to watch a single judge instantly shut down a primary means of online communication for the world’s fifth-largest country. The two security experts in the NYT wrote of the first WhatsApp shutdown: “The judge’s action was reckless and represents a potentially longer-term threat to the freedoms of Brazilians.” But there is no question that is just a sign of what is to come for countries far from Brazil: There will undoubtedly be similar battles in numerous countries around the world over what rights companies have to offer privacy protections to their users.
UPDATE: WhatsApp is functioning again in Brazil. Hours after an emergency appeal was rejected early Tuesday morning, an appellate court upheld WhatsApp’s appeal and overturned the original order at around 2:15 p.m. local time (1:15 p.m. ET).
Esta es una mierda de reportaje de uno de los “mijitos ricos” de los Estados Unidos y que jamás va a entender lo que el gobierno ha intentado al someter al gigante a una sanción nacional.
La libertad se la pueden meter en el culo, simplemente porque estos son asuntos de CRIMINALIDAD DE MAYOR CUANTIA en la Whatsapp se ha negado a OBEDECER como órden judicial.
Lo que este periodista norteamericano hace es desmembrar asuntos que pertecen a la JUSTICIA ORDINARIA para defender el concepto de LIBERTAD en vacío.
Aún viviendo en Brasil se pueden meter las patas, tal como lo hace este periodista que se cree el hoyo del mundo simplemente porqye ha sido elegido por un ex-agente de la CIA que ya ha jugado sucio incriminando a líderes tales como Putin con falsas imputaciones como parte de la guerra psicológica financiada por el Departamento de Estado.
Esta prensa de investigación no es TAN independiente como se precia de ser. Aún mantiene sus páginas en inglés dando preferencial apoyo a los lectores del imperio. Jamás la prensa de investigación se ha dedicado a reforzar los mecanismos de las fuerzas del poder tal y como lo hacen desde estas páginas.
Se han cerrado a dilucidar asuntos de la mayor emergencia, simplemente porque las emergencias son las que impone Washington con todos sus periodistas supremacistas.
Periodista de investigación
Miembro de la Unión de periodistas de Noruega
Freedom is very important.
And one of the areas of freedom is freedom from terrorism, freedom from drug cartels and so on. So the security agencies do have a legitimate need to
pry. It is not that they are nosy, they need it to do their job.
What is needed is a middle path, which restricts access to issues like terrorism and drug trafficking. And leaves 99.999% of the population unaffected.
Better yet, eliminate all spying for anything but court-approved investigations of ongoing criminal conspiracy.
Y’know, warrants, evidence, actual crimes, that sort of thing.
Completely off topic. Just watched Mr Greenwald on Al Jazeera “The Stream”. Have never seen him so relaxed, so happy, so smiley! Just hope this happiness doesn’t take the edge out of his writings. Ok, selfish.
Link!
http://stream.aljazeera.com/story/201605022314-0025202
Sure. Whatsapp is back in Brasil. It stayed off the air for a few hours and even though I am its user, I was not affected. For the simple reason, that I have alternative ways to communicate with others. However, ah must say the whole circus was staged NOT to protect the 90 Million Brasilian users interest, but…but…but the OLIGOPOLY of the phone companies and the Cable TV operators!
Many Brasilians are aware Whatsapp (and other similar applications) are threat to the phone companies and Netflix is almost wiping out the Cable Networks. Look at the number of cable TV users canceling their subscriptions and you get the BIG PICTURE.
Why are they trying to restrict the usage of Internet? i.e. After you use certain hours of usage, you got to pay more!?
In short, our “privatized” Telecoms have not innovated nor invested ANYTHING, but want to piss their customers off by charging more for the low quality services they provide.
We are going back to the 60’s!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
P.S: Ah must say the “Oligopoly” suffers from Marketing Myopia which may or may not be cured in the short or long run!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
the profiteering mode of social democratic development and maintenance for life support and comfort, is a virus.
Wealth and poverty exist in evil types of governance.
In a good operating environment, life support and comfort become more and more common and affordable to cover 100% of the population before wealth is allowed.
And it is not capitalism that is the problem – It is the CURRENCY SYSTEM of PRINT-TO-LOAN-TO-PRICE-TO-OWN creation and distribution method. And it is evil.
100 million Brazilian??? Thats almost a Gazillion…..
Im brazilian and I totally support the judge action. No service can be above law. The way whatapps is used to today its a lot easier for bad people to get together and make bad things. I dont agree with any company that provide a way for these kinds of things to happen. Its time to try go get a mid term in terms of privacy and national security.
Uh,from whom does Brazil need national security?Only the zionists,I would posit,as it was their attempt to put a settler as ambassador that preceded this whole Dilma episode.
But not from its neighbors,so the NS angle is bogus,and a fear bargaining chip to keep citizens like you on the govts side in repression of your freedoms.
It’s the same in America,where fear has hit grand slams instead of striking out as it used to,when we were more educated and civilized.
Living in Argentina and having to use Whatsapp almost exclusively to communicate with family abd friends has always made me nervous. It’s impossible to trust Facebook or Zuckerberg’s ethics. But on reading that Facebook had “rebelled” against the Brazilian courts and reading the claims that Whatsapp is end-to-end encrypted, I found myself breathing a sign of relief.
And my own sign of relief pulled me up short. I’d like to hear what Edward Snowden thinks about the possibility that the Brazilian quilombo is just political theater to make Facebook and Whatsapp appear to be the good guys, get people to relax and start being explicit with personal information again.
If I ran a monstrous transnational corporations famed for incursions on privacy and discovered that users were no longer sharing the personal content my company depended on scooping up to turn a profit, and this self-censorship was due to public distrust in my corporate business ethics, I might orchestrate exactly what happened in Brazil down to the arrest of my regional capo.
Just saying.
As an American with a Brazilian wife, I am appalled at the arrogance of this judge to single handily shut down the main form of communication for not only Brazil, but the ability for me to text and communicate with my wife. This is definitely BS and goes completely against our God given right to freedom of speech.
Firstly: there is no God
That is part of the reason why there is no right to Freedom of Speech in Brasil – the laws of USA _do not_ apply to other countries!
The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits..
Albert Einstein-
Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.
Albert Einstein
We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them.
Albert Einstein
That’s shame!
I use Signal and had no problem.
It’s time to move to Signal, Brasil! now translated also in Portuguese, using gender-friendly language, done with caring. It is decentralized technology, open source, amazing.
https://whispersystems.org/
Simple solution (just 4 steps):
Instal Orbot (tor proxy), run it, setup Settings->Select apps->What’s up and give the finger to your censors.
This is bullshit we should have the absolute right to feel free to say or do WHATEVER we want that’s what freedom of speech/FREEDOM is all about. We shouldn’t have to worry about big brother in our business/lives! They already have way too much power as it is and all you sheep following to the slaughter are in for a real treat when they start enforcing other nonsensical demands…..
Just baby steps towards communism you’ll see!!!!
It is not only “privacy protection” there but also the protection of possible criminal activities thanks to end-to-end encryption provided by for-profit companies. Pedophiles among meny must be really happy to stock all their nauseous content on their non-hackable iPhone, thanks to Apple top notch encryption they are protecting evidence of their crimes from the authorities (i.e. until the usual 0 day hack enabling to access a device until the exploited bug is patched).
Leaving aside the whole global eavesdropping and SIGINT of the five eyes and usual suspects, legal authorities, wherever they are, should obviously be able to access any data from suspected criminals with the relevant and lawful subpoenas from a judge, applying the law, hence why wherever these services exist authorities will probably have no other choice than to ban them or to force them to allow a lawful (in-house and handled by the service operator if needed) access to the data. Whatsapp should better be ready to revert their end-to-end encryption for that day…
You obviously have no clue as to what encryption is about. If the tech companies are forced to put a backdoor into their hardware and software, you can kiss your secure banking operations goodbye because, apart from the government, criminals will also be able to access your precious info. Banking is just 1 example. There is a whole host of other security services that will become useless.
So we will all be thrown back into the stone age. With encryption there is no halfway, or compromise: it is either on or off, 0 or 1.
And even with those backdoors, criminals will be able to carry on with their other activities anyway, like they always have.
A lot of countries foolishly opted for freedom, which allows people to communicate as they see fit, or to encrypt their communications if they so choose. Fortunately, Brazil is in the process of dismantling its democracy, and unlike the US which is saddled with its First Amendment, will be free to rewrite their constitution.
Once they revoke the right to privacy, there will be no safe place for a pedophile (except working for the government agency doing the surveillance – but no pedophile is likely to seek a job that involves spying on young children).
Duce, when are you going to get your own late-night cable show?
Baaahaaaaa!
I think that protection from government snooping on communication on the one hand and personal digital storage devices on the other are two separate questions, not a single emotional one as you have stated.
You are implying that no encryption should be allowed on a hard drive on your pc, for example. Why? What legitimate purpose is served by banning people from having private information. Terrorism! Nonsense, just an excuse.
without strong encryption, thieves will rob your business. They will worm their way into influence in spy outfits and steal contract negotiations, contract details, customer databases, customers, bank records, then rob your customers….
get serious. If you are a business owner using low grade encryption, have your bankruptcy papers ready and make sure your lawyers are paid when you get hit with a class action lawsuit.
Uh yeah, no.
Authorities can and do ferret out pedophiles and other criminals without forcing private companies to sell insecure phones. If that makes their jobs harder, such is the price of living in a country that respects civil liberties.
The Fourth Amendment almost certainly causes some criminals to go uncaught. That’s a price the Founders were willing to pay, and any person who values civil liberties will also be willing to pay it.
I want to try this app
What’s missing here, it seems to me, is some acknowledgement of the current Turkish government’s cutting-edge activities in this domain (viz., spitefully and childishly taking down Facebook, Twitter, YouTube, etc., for periods of time) during the past couple of years. It seems it’s in this way that Turkey aspires to be recognized internationally — in terms of innovation — as a cultural force to be reckoned with.
The increasingly erratic Erdogan is routinely banning these online services for all the wrong reasons: for “insult to his person” or because he is trying to cover up some false flag operation of the Turkish secret services, some weapon shipment to Syria rebels/Al Nusra front aka Al Qaeda in Syria or tringy to silence reports on his weird business dealing -reportedly- trafficking oil from Syria with Daesh/IS: it was not exactly done to enforce a democratically credible/valid judicial order like in this case where the judge need access to a suspected criminal data in a drug case.
Whatsapp folks are just acting funny. Every Whatsapp account is part of a hidden group that includes NSA. So all messages get copied to the right people. Obviously, all other countries, including Brazil, would be indignant that they are left out.
lol any link to this beyond basic conspiracies?
Those whom wish to remain in power throughout history see the people talking as “The people may be talking about removing us from power or worse”, so if we cannot keep them from talking let’s know what they are talking about and who is doing what type of talking.
Then came the modern age with newspapers, movies, radio, TV, cable, the internet people etc., and people are talking all over the place, so the only thing for power to do was buy it all and do all the talking for everybody. And they knew the benefit of starting to talk to the masses when they are young so they took over education. The key with education is to tell the young what we the powerful only want them to hear and as byproducts; just teach them what they need in order to serve power in the job market, dam that critical thinking, and in order to be poorly educated lets place students in debt for that schooling in the trillions of dollars.
There are far too many idiot talk radio hosts among the more than 90% right wing market share, which serve as the sycophant mouthpieces of the corporatocracy. One of the moron hosts was blasting out over the radio that since schools have limited budgets they should forgo art and music.
Of course they want to shut down the arts because art, music and theater are what ignite the spirit of revolution in the oppressed. Of course they want to totally control the internet or if they can’t just shut it down. But when they try and take the pride and joy of this generation’s internet information highway away they will quickly find out there will be unprecedented ramifications, because this generation is not going to just make up songs of symbolism like the Twelve Days of Christmas they will all out revolt.
personal human development is 100% dependent upon the arts and are the primary acitivity for independence, decision making, sense of self, personal power, and direction in life.
republicans, being regimented wife trainers, prefer slaves because with slaves, you dont even have to train them, just threaten them.
@Fellow Citizen and Barabbas:
Fellow Citizen: I really think you have some great points. Yes, TPTB always want to know what “the masses” are saying.” Gotta try to hang on to that power, I suppose. And as far as education, I’m not sure telling the young only what they wanted them to know but I think you’re on target with: ” just teach them what they need in order to serve power in the job market, dam that critical thinking, and in order to be poorly educated lets place students in debt for that schooling in the trillions of dollars.” I know from my years as an educator that it was increasingly – “get them job/career ready” oriented. And there was more and more reliance on computer/online instruction —- sometimes good, but sometimes the students really didn’t care for it. My own take is that type of instruction isn’t the best for every student, and shouldn’t be over-relied on. And don’t get me started on student debt. My Mom attended TUITION FREE Normal School (teacher training). That’s the sort of investment we should be making in our society! And I cannot help but mention the Mom’s dream was to have free colleges around for students to attend.
And FC and Barabbas –
I am TOTALLY with you about the arts. Totally. They are so important – for human development, yes —- and for learning too (gotta know how to count to do music correctly, for example!).
I’d like to humbly submit this link from my blog about the arts, society, and why the arts can be “subversive”….
http://observergal.blogspot.com/2015/07/creative-nonconformity.html
Boa noite,
Por gentileza, deem uma olhada nesta reportagem sobre a Rede Globo.
Abraços,
Marcus.
http://www.viomundo.com.br/denuncias/os-13-pontos-que-david-miranda-deveria-ter-mencionado-em-sua-polemica-com-joao-roberto-marinho-e-que-esta-devendo-aos-leitores-do-guardian.html
Miami – FL U.S.A
May 2nd, 2016
In fact, Brazil is currently led by a legit communist dissident from Bulgaria, commonly known as Dilma Vana Rusev, who was physically trained at Cuba’s Jungle in mid 60’s under of the utmost repressive, depressive and undemocratic dictatorship regime ever in Latin America’s history.
Since Rusev’s truly symphatizes to any terrorist, communist and socialist countries, included Cuba’s Castro and Venezuela’s Maduro dictarorship, in which they’ll be making this event as an excuse it to censorship the Brazilian tax payers, who are indeed outraged and surely opposed to her version of proletariat socialism regime.
In resume, any socialist in today’s world would defy this “practice” as “democracy” by alleged shut them up for their own benefit.
I’d know by fact, that Dilma Vana Rusev has indeed use it the same level of democracy back in late 60’s and early 70’s in a local financial institutions robbery at gun point, fully accompanied with her own lovely criminal former husband, and or perhaps when she’s had literally blew out a local Brazilian military compound in search for weapons a ammo, in order to provide it the necessary tools as leader of her own urban guerrilla, shredding in pieces a Brazilian Army, also known worldwide as Mario K. Fillo with a massive 10 kilograms of TNT.
All Legitimate local tools against the invading SchoolofAmericas trainees!
When the Chinese shutdown cellular communications during the umbrella revolution they moved to a mesh networking technology incorporated in an app call firechat.
http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLldFDw51acDMoSNKX8n_b7Pjv0ud85v2-
Uncontrolled communication is a big threat in any group whose activities need to be managed for the benefit of the owners of the group. This applies to small groups just as well as entire nations and cults that span across borders.
So, if you are ruling a country you need to know not just what jihadi people are scheming, but also what the rest of the people are telling each other. This gives you a good handle on eliminating noise in the communication that can be injected by other countries and groups, and which can derail the entire group.
This is a long established practice known to kings and emperors that is usually passed down through mentoring. If you let your subjects communicate freely very soon they will find a new king. Our big corporations have close connection to royalty and elites, and so you will find them functioning in exactly the same manner with close watch on their employees.
Therefore, every country needs to know what their people are communicating to each other, and it is not necessarily a sinister thing.
Unless you are a disguised Kim Jong-un, you can only be joking. Not even a paranoid Fidel Castor would be so obtuse in attempting to defend this absurd blockage.
I agree wholeheartedly.
Uncontrolled communication is a big threat in any group…
WRONG.
Uncontrolled communication is a big threat in a society where the people are played off against each other in competition for life support.
I got that from my relationship with G&J.
Threat to whom?
Group ownership is important and needs to be protected. It’s more important than the group.
i always figured you for a Libertarian, much like myself.
Group ownership is meaningless if the group is a survival group.
Think, brother.
There are very few evil people on the planet. Evil is a creation of the operating environment.
peace out.
My whatsapp has been working fine all day. I’m in Brazil. I havent gotten any messages from anybody either saying it would be off……When is this supposed to start?
The weird thing is — having a blackout over Brazil’s awful censorship bills might have been exactly what WhatsApp should have done to get attention on the issue.
There will always be pros and cons of blocking service like Whatsapp. From message security perspective, most of the current messengers are focusing on encryption. Encryption is important for transferring the message over the air. But how about protecting the messages/conversations on the user’s device itself (smartphones, tablets etc). There are new age messenger applications like Serkit Messenger which focuses on protecting user chat messages on the device (Android and iOS link below) itself.
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=im.serkit&hl=en
https://itunes.apple.com/app/id1094142111
Israel will be along shortly
For a few years now — especially given the Internet’s role in exposing the carnage and misery Israel imposed on Palestinians during the 51-day bombardment of Gaza in ’14 — I’ve been waiting for Israel do something like this. It will. Because, by it’s metrics, it “has to.”
During that bombardment, the videos and pictures that both Gazans and international medical personnel were uploading to Twitter aroused the whole world’s to outrage. Indeed, the liberal Zionist magazine, Forward, posted a piece titled: Israel Has a New Worst Enemy — Twitter.
In addition to all the bodies — including those of Palestinian children, and the rubblized remains of vast neighborhoods, the revolting behavior of Israelis was on display. As The Forward put it:
Then there are the constant videos of Israeli police and soldiers executing or arresting Arabs, including children. Videos of terrified 8, 10 and 12-year-olds, some leaving prison after being tortured — these have to be intolerable to Israel. So, it’s going to have to stop.
I assure you, Israel is going to try very hard to follow in the Brazilian judge’s footsteps.
i think israel is already there. They keep 2 sets of books. Their censorship is adhoc – being a small place. No need for terrorist legislation since they already branded palestinians as such and are currently at war against them. And given that the IDF also acts as a secret police force, they really don’t need any legislation at all. Israel seems to exist in a persistent state of martial law.
I would like to see TI offer another interface that groups issues in a way the world can see themselves building or falling, gaining or losing. The world needs some goalposts.
Mona, I’m amazed at the chip on your shoulder you have towards Israel. I did not expect to see you posting on this article about Israel but sure enough, here you are.
If you want justice for Gazan’s we need to see an end to this sort of thing which will only happen when Hamas and the PA are removed from power and a civilised government is elected. Until then Israel is dealing with monsters and Gazan’s will continue to suffer.
Victim blame much?
All resistance movements do that during war. The French Resistance held the best “tribunals” it could, and killed collaborators and/or informants.
As for the “chip on my shoulder,” it’s outrage. As a U.S. taxpayer I fund this ongoing atrocity.
Four-fifths of our Senate just voted to *increase military aid to Israel from $3 billion to $4 billion, annually. American infrastructure is crumbling, we can’t pay for enough public defenders for the millions of poor we charge with crimes, millions of us are uninsured, and to go to college here for most means being saddled with oppressive debt. But… send more billions to Israel to help it kill and oppress people!
And how revolting of you to suggest that the death and destruction, as well as land theft, that Israel has been inflicting on its victims — Palestinians — won’t end until the victims behave with each other as you think they should.
i would really like a list of books for recommended reading from you.
TYIA
We all want to see the Palestinians suffering end, that I think is our common ground. While Israel isn’t without blame we need to not overlook the actions of the PA and Hamas. The fact that you post anti Israel comments on a news article which is completely unrelated to Israel or Palestine proves to me and other readers that you are more interested in demonising Israel than helping Palestinians.
We all want to see the Palestinians suffering end…
We?
Pray tell, how would do that?
My point is integrally related to the topic of this piece. Perhaps you should have read it more carefully, for it is not merely about the situation in Brazil. Indeed, these were the concluding sentences:
As I documented in my first comment, Israel and Zionists are deeply concerned about how Internet freedom is undermining their ability to control the narrative. For years I’ve been saying Israel is going to “have to” adopt policies to control online access and behavior in Israel and in the territories it so brutally occupies.
That you don’t like this point is, well, beside the point.
“We all want to see the Palestinians suffering end, that I think is our common ground. ”
Haven’t seen much interest in this from Israel.
As usual with the Israel lobby, you turn the argument around, blaming Hamas & the PA for the Palestinians’ suffering & calling for their removal from power.
The fact of the matter is that by international standards Israel is sitting on stolen land (Westbank & Golan Heights) & is keeping the Gazans in an open air prison & choking them off the way the Nazis did with the Jews in Warsaw.
Time to remove Netanyahu & his gang?
Mona – Yes, harming children is beyond the pale of decency. I even think it is morally wrong to murder Jewish children who live in Israel or the West Bank. Do you?
Oh Gator, FFS, you know I believe that is morally wrong. What’s with the gratuitous inquiry?
Oh I’m sorry, I thought that sort of thing presented a complex dilemma for you. Have you changed your position again?
Gator: My position has never changed. Oppressed people often commit atrocities. The atrocities are wrong, but I’m ambivalent about the extent of moral condemnation I feel is properly directed at them.
The ANC did some heinous things, and the rightwing fascists, including those in the U.S., played those up for all it was worth, in order to discredit the justice of the ANC’s cause. At the end of the day, the ANC wouldn’t have existed and been mobilized with some members willing and able to commit atrocities if the apartheid regime had not been oppressing them.
If I infer correctly, you are hesitant to condemn the atrocities of the oppressed because you see that as giving aid and comfort to the oppressor. I get that.
On the other hand, your reticence could also be construed as de-valuing the lives of children (and adult civilians) based on your disapproval of their government’s policies.
Many on the “pro-Israel” side clearly, and wrongly, value the lives of Jewish children over those of Palestinian children. This is in part because they associate the Jewish children with what they perceive as the “right side” of the dispute. Aren’t you doing the same, from the other side? And, I hasten to add, I agree with you concerning which side is in the wrong in the larger picture. But does that matter when assigning value to the lives of children? Should it?
As I’ve stated before, this is not a situation where the terrorists are attacking children because they are Jewish per se. Or, to whatever extent they are, it’s because their oppressor is Jewish.
Palestinians aren’t motivated by heinous bullshit like the Aryan Brotherhood is when the latter goes on one of their rampages and shoot blacks and Jews (as well as Asians). That makes a difference in the level of opprobrium properly directed at Palestinians.
A similar standard applies to assessing blame vis-a-vis Zionist motives for adopting ethno-religious uber-nationalism and ethnic supremacy. It was and is still wrong, but adopted for reasons far more sympathetic than those of the German Nazis.
backfire, overreach, please!
By whom?
The zionists are definitely the nexus of all our terrorism problems,as the instigators(with Western assistance)of the whole ME destabilization scheme.
And they are anti the current Brazilian govt for that govts standing up for Palestinians,and giving the Israelis the not welcome sign,when they tried to force a settler crud ambassador on them.And since that time,this stuff all started,or at least US interest.
I don’t see anything about the ongoing coup mentioned in this article or in the comments. To what extent is the WhatsApp ban a backhanded way of keeping people from discussing the coup? Much as the Egyptian military did in Mubarak’s last days, and after overthrowing the Morsi government.
Today in Brazil there’s a hearing about the impeachment process. Nice time to censor public discusison.
Also, how does a state judge (or is he just a town judge) have jurisdiction over the entire country? Obviously Brazilian law is somewhat different than US law.
how does a state judge (or is he just a town judge) have jurisdiction over the entire country?
I was wondering the very same thing. So in Brasil you can rule the country or hold it hostage from your office in the boondocks, or a treehouse? remarkable.
Interesting times we live in. Interesting that some elites continue to believe they can corrupt or stymie the sharing of information among human beings. They will try, they will have some limited success(es), but in the end they will ultimately fail.
I wonder how, as presumably well educated and “worldly” the “elites” of the world are, they don’t comprehend that the tighter they squeeze their collective fist, the more the sand slips through and around their fingers. And at some point, their status as “elites” loses legitimacy and then not all the private security, money and status will save them from what comes next.
* * * Which is not to agree with everything Justice Hugo Black did or said in his life (briefly joining Klan), nor necessarily with his judicial philosophy and/or some of his holdings (not believing in a ‘right to privacy’ in Griswold, or writing for majority in Korematsu, or his belief in death penalty to name a few).
But he was an interesting and important jurist and broadly speaking a free speech (written and spoken not conduct as speech) absolutist.
the tighter they squeeze their collective fist, the more the sand slips through and around their fingers
greed is a squeeze.
And at some point, their status as “elites” loses legitimacy and then not all the private security, money and status will save them from what comes next.
Elites create poverty to push us to object to poverty and comfort to worship and wish for wealth as an escape from our humble and modest state.
freedom of speech is a matter of OWNERSHIP OF SELF which is a matter of ownership of privacy.
free and clear is wallstreet’s fear.
The vision of George Orwell was highly accurate – authoritarian governments controlled by small minorities will obsess over monitoring the general public, and will attempt to create technologies to aid in that effort – such as Orwell’s two-way television, the modern analogue being a hacked smart phone with remotely controlled video and microphone.
https://www.philzimmermann.com/EN/essays/WhyIWrotePGP.html
Phil Zimmerman: “If we do nothing, new technologies will give the government new automatic surveillance capabilities that Stalin could never have dreamed of. The only way to hold the line on privacy in the information age is strong cryptography.”
i asked an acquaintence about that many years ago and she laffed. She had worked with (not for) a very large operating system company in the u.s. She told me that listening (no cams at that time) in was not a problem for them.
She was a driver writer and chip programmer in assembler.
I have no faith what-so-ever in the word of any tech company especially those such as Apple, Facebook or Microsoft which all were more than happy to cooperate in illegal government spying when it was secret and suddenly saw the light after Snowden.
I presume that authority everywhere will move to make it illegal to install encryption on your phone – those caught using it will be treated as terrorists or pedophiles.
The large transnational tech corporations just want money money money and they will get it any way possible by cooperating with gov or offering encryption doesn’t matter – whatever makes money.
I have thought all along that only encryption which comes from an independent source which I can install myself and verify would really be trustworthy – but as I say if products of that sort become available authority will simply outlaw it.
Look, us hoi polli are way behind entrenched fanciest power they have AI to use against us and they can keep it for themselves for a long time before someone could hack in or obtain it. Soon unemployment will be 60-70% world wide and the means of protecting yourself eliminated.
For the 2/3rds of the human population with no reliable access to clean water dystopia is now – it will be now for more and more people and there is absolutely no force on earth strong enough to stop them.
Dystonia is well established and there is nothing in the way of it progressing to 90% of the human population.
Products of that sort are now and long have been widely available in the free/open source software world. Since the source code is available whenever you want it, you may either verify its trustworthiness yourself or, if you don’t have the necessary skills, rely upon others whom you trust to do so.
There would be no way that these tools, having been developed and distributed widely, literally for decades, could be effectively outlawed.
Let me know what you want to do (email, instant messaging, secure voice calls, etc.) and what hardware you’d like to use and I’ll point you toward some possibilities.
i think you’re onto something.
What’s that giant flushing sound?
Shutting down the internet may seem a bit heavy handed, but I understand the viewpoint of the judge and the Brazilian government. They read about the NSA, gorging on data from the PRISM program and gobbling up strategic information about Brazilian oil reserves and mineral deposits, while the Tech companies won’t even throw them a few crumbs to access the communications needed for a simple criminal investigation.
However, the NSA isn’t in the charity business. So the Brazilians need to suck it up, just like the FBI, and pay some Israeli firm a million dollars to hack the information. I understand they have budget constraints and throwing the local Facebook executives in jail and torturing them until they cooperate may seem like a cheap solution. But Facebook executives are likely to say anything under torture – including faking the contents of the communications. So ultimately this is not a reliable way to extract information – as the CIA can confirm.
So Brazil should just pay the hackers and be done with it.
The internet is a threat to power. We are still in the early stages of power confronting the freedom the internet gives us. Attempts of control will continue.
The internet is NOT a threat to power it is a tool of power. Encrypted or not.
Thank you for the correction!
Agree.
gee fellas maybe it’s a tool rather than a guarantee one way or the other
If 10,000 people for example communicated over the internet (committees of correspondence) to organize an action against those in power wouldn’t the internet be seen as a threat? A communication tool to be taken down? A tool of communication power only to be in the hands of those in power? The people are not in power. The people are restless at the sneaky spying and intrusion of governments. We know by human nature that their are control freaks who want to run the world and be able to zone in on anyone. Time to draw the line in the sand else in 50 years it will be 1984.
Who needs a democracy, or a president? We live in a world of power-mad crazies. No wonder the republicans want to occupy the courts. As i recall, senatoy cruz said killing doctors offering abortions was self defence.
Can we get a revised constitution and bill of rights already?
wait a minute..
“In Ecuador, 10 people were sentenced in May 2013 to a year in prison for attempted terrorism for participating in a peaceful meeting to plan a protest.”
Isn’t Julian Assange still in the Ecuador embassy or is he now being held there?
Does not this also mean that a government, responsible for the welfare of it’s people, which does not provide a guarantee of life support for each and every citizen, is a terrorist?
HRW often just repeats narratives it hears from local opposition, which are hard to verify unless you know Spanish. Around May 2013, Ecuador did indeed sentence a number of people on “terrorism” and “sabotage” charges for participating in violent protests during the uprising (or coup attempt) of September 30, 2009. It was hardly for “participating in a peaceful meeting to plan a protest.”
Roth,a very corrupt Zionist,runs HRW.A selective opprobrium outlet.
The internet currently being,is a very strong anti govt tool,but they are working on that,believe me,principally through the old fear angle,security.
AFAIK Ecuador is just pissed because a couple of bankers who stole something like $200 million (or was it more?) can’t be extradited from the U.S. because, like, they’re bankers, and the prosecution of bankers anywhere would be a blasphemy no American sycophant could contemplate. Though the U.S. did graciously quash their attempt to sue Ecuador for seizing their stolen cash – http://www.telesurtv.net/english/news/Ecuador-Wins-Case-Against-Fugitive-Bankers-Hiding-in-the-US-20150602-0017.html . Because the U.S. can never act against the bankers, Ecuador is never going to stop annoying them with Assange, at least until the threats of international violence get ratcheted up a bit (Donald Trump, are you there?)
@Jose @Wnt
whoa. if that doesn’t take the cake and the icing too…
i’m thinking robberbanksters.org who stole what and where is it now.
this planet is in serious need of repair but i hardly expect the u.s. to lead the way.
Ideology is a cul de sac of the mind.
Ecuador is in the gunsights of neocapitalism,as are Venezuela,Brazil,Argentina and whatever social leaning govts are left in S.A.,C.A.,or the world for that matter,but its easier closer to home.
Reports from MSM are not worth the brain time to read them,usually,though yes,occasionally they can be very illuminating.Check out the Graun,and the Pearl River delta story;Amazing what them “Chicoms”can do.Hoho.
“a revised constitution and bill of rights already?”…
Why? Your Obama and liberal courts, ignore them anyway.
I can easily see Clinton or Trump – with a straight face – using Brazil’s pending laws as shining examples of good sense and privacy/security balance.
Huh !
You must be a unique kind of guy, who has it all, included the newest version of a 4G custom made crystal clear ball.
Perhaps, you should take in consideration to provide it a psycho readings free of charge !
So can I. Which is why we need to put them on notice with a strong third party vote total in the general election. Both Jill Stein and Gary Johnson getting 5 or more percent of the vote would do the trick. Heck, if it were possible, I’d love to see Jill WIN the election (I don’t agree with Libertarian Party economic philosophy, so no Gary in this instance). If it were possible, which even I admit is quite the longshot at best.