If the Democratic nominee were chosen by those who showed up in the streets of Philadelphia to protest the convention, there would be one uncontested winner. “The people want Bernie,” read a sign at a rally Sunday that drew the same enamored crowds that turned out for the Vermont senator along the primary trail. The sign summed up the general sentiment of the crowd, as the rally grew into the thousands and began marching from City Hall in 93-degree weather. As the DNC kicked off, downtown Philadelphia was all about Bernie.
Hillary Clinton’s name and image showed up mostly in signs and chants saying “Never Hillary,” “Warlord,” and “Hell no, DNC, we won’t vote for Hillary.” Last week’s DNC email leaks and the ensuing party scandal spilled into the streets, leaving Bernie supporters bitter and upset, and prompting calls for a “DemExit” from the party. Using the same slogans seen at the Republican convention in Cleveland, some Bernie supporters sported “Hillary for Prison” shirts.
Of course, it won’t be the crowds in Philadelphia — largely white, as was the case on the campaign trail — that determine the nominee. But the number of protesters claiming they will always be with Sanders, and the growing chorus of those considering a switch to the Green Party’s Jill Stein, should be cause for concern for a party that’s losing legitimacy with many supporters. On Sunday, a group of “Black Men for Bernie” carried a DNC coffin. On Monday night, a candlelight vigil will mourn “the death of democracy.”
As protesters made clear on Sunday, and then again at another pro-Sanders rally on Monday morning, they won’t vote for Clinton just to avoid a Trump presidency, and the Democratic Party better not take their vote for granted.
That’s a position that has been met with ire and ridicule by many Clinton supporters and party loyalists, accusing Sanders die-hards of blind privilege and blaming them for a potential Trump victory. But many of those showing up in Philadelphia are not interested in “voting for the lesser of two evils,” as several people defined their options.
Anthony Crosby, 24, protesting the nomination of Hillary Clinton at the Democratic National Convention, July 25, 2016.
Photo: Alice Speri
“If your conscience lies elsewhere, you need to vote that way,” said Jeremy Thompson, a computer engineer from New Hampshire who took a Megabus to Philadelphia for the day, after the event transportation company Rally Bus canceled dozens of booked trips at the last minute. “Right now we have organized political parties that are ignoring the masses. If you vote the Democratic bill just because you think you have to oppose Trump, then you’re encouraging the Democratic Party to repeat the same horrific maneuvers they did this year and repeating the process of signing over our democracy out of fear.”
Thompson said he was “horrified” at the prospect of a Trump presidency — but that he won’t blame himself if that happens. That’s on the Democratic Party, he said.
“People might write in Bernie, they might write in Mickey Mouse, or they might vote for Jill Stein, but they’re not going to vote for Hillary just because the Democratic Party has engineered a situation where that’s their only choice,” he added.
While protesters at Monday morning’s rally agreed on their candidate of choice — some even holding out hope for an improbable reversal on the convention floor — there was less consensus on what to do next.
Some added “Or Jill” to old Vote Bernie signs, and many lifelong Democrats said this election cycle has left them irreparably disillusioned with a party that fails to reflect their values.
“If the Democratic Party is going to be corrupt, I’ll leave the Democratic Party and join a new party,” said 24-year-old Anthony Crosby, who had planned the trip from Colorado before Sanders endorsed Clinton and held a sign saying “We’re still with you Bernie.”
“I was a little upset he endorsed Hillary, but he didn’t concede. He didn’t drop out, and I’m not going to give up on him.” Crosby said he believes a Clinton or Trump presidency would be “equally bad.”
“I think they’re about the same. Hillary is just as bad, she gets away with a lot of stuff that is above the law,” he said. “I’m not going to vote for someone I don’t believe in.”
Caitlin Codini traveled from Seattle to protest at the Democratic National Convention.
Photo: Alice Speri
But others at the rally, as fervent in their support for Sanders, wouldn’t go that far, and many said they simply “don’t know” what they’ll do in November.
“That’s a terrifying thing for me to think about,” said Caitlin Codini, who crowdfunded her trip from Seattle. “I’ve always said that I would support Hillary Clinton for those two seconds in that voting booth if it came down to it, but I’m hoping it doesn’t come down to that, because I really don’t want to do it.”
“And I also don’t want Donald Trump to be president,” she added.
Codini had attached a “still” sign to her Feel the Bern poster. But asked whether Sanders himself was still “feeling the Bern,” she seemed more uncertain. “God, I hope so.”
Mass Outrage Clinton’s Democratic VP Kaine announces suffocating illegal alien plan
It appears Democratic Virginia Sen. Tim Kaine wants to waste as little time as possible before reaching deep into tax payer pockets relating to open borders.
Kaine was named the vice presidential candidate of presumptive Democratic presidential nominee Hillary Clinton over the weekend.
A few days later, he’s proclaimed his priority for the first 100 days of the Clinton administration — gives citizenship across the board to every single illegal immigrant in the United States–12 to 25 plus foreign nationals–and it would cost taxpayers uncomprehensible amount of money.
That’s according to The Washington Times, which reported that “a new Clinton administration would pursue a bill to legalize illegal immigrants in ‘the first 100 days’ of her occupancy, vice presidential candidate Tim Kaine told Spanish-language network Telemundo in an interview Monday, presenting a deep contrast with Republicans.”
The cost of such a plan has been analyzed previously by The Heritage Foundation, a conservative think tank that concluded in a 2013 study that blanket legalization would cost tax payers approximately $6.3 TRILLION DOLLARS.
GOD HELP US! OBama has already added to the NATIONAL DEBT half of the rising $19 TRILLION DOLLARS.
Think you know everything about the dark history of the CLINTON’ CARTEL? https://assets.donaldjtrump.com/ClintonFacts.pdf
Illegal Immigration Lowers Wages For Competing American Workers By An Estimated $99 To $118 Billion A Year. “Economic theory predicts that immigration will redistribute income by lowering the wages of competing American workers and increasing the wages of complementary American workers as well as profits for business owners and other “users” of immigrant labor… Although the net benefits to natives from illegal immigrants are small, there is a sizable redistribution effect. Illegal immigration reduces the wage of native workers by an estimated $99 to $118 billion a year, and generates a gain for businesses and other users of immigrants of $107 to $128 billion.” (George Borjas, “Immigration and The American Worker,” Center For Immigration Studies, 4/13)
W-a-t-c-h Hillary’s America: The Secret History of The Democratic Party on U-Tube.
I supported Bernie & I know 60 others that did and MOST of us would vote for Hillary Clinton. Half will vote for another candidate. If Trump also wants to increas minimum wage then it’s a no brainer.
He said he wants to raise it to a livable standard. But they don’t want to show that. He also is against TPP and NAFTA which Hillary loves along with her running mate Kaine. Trump has some good policies go watch his convention speech, don’t listen to media. I like you liked Bernie but can NEVER vote for someone willing to rig my vote and who knows where the money I gave to Bernie really went through the DNC. Trump is a loud mouth but he is not a snake in the grass like Hillary. I want them all fired and maybe 4 years in Washington he will get rid of them all.
Sanders is trying to bring authenticity and trustworthiness in a party that represents campaign donors and Wall Street bankers more than the lower and middle classes. Washington representatives often live in a bubble while lobbyists write legislation and corporate interests are sold as the public interest.
It’s #Demexit, not “sexit”, what a freudian slip. You said, “the crowds in Philadelphia, largely white, as was the case on the campaign trail…” shows you don’t actually know what the hell happened on the campaign trail, you probably saw a 2015 Kansas rally on TV and decided then and there you knew all about it.
I expect better from The Intercept.
It’s not that people don’t like Hillary. This article fails to mention the undemocratic procedural issues in the whole nomination and election process – beyond what was revealed in the hack – at the heart of why people are so outraged.
It’s more than that a good amount of people don’t like her nor support her for key reasons. She is a backer for the TPP, NAFTA both trade deals bad for the working class and developing countries. She is also not trust worthy and the most dangerous candidate running so far… There is more than enough reasons not to vote for her all you have to do is a google search look up her background none of it is good…. And i am just scratching the surface party unity in the DNC will never happen between the establishment and the progressives i will say this however.. Trump yes he is bad but he is way less militant than Hillary would be.
MUST SEE – Assange’s exclusive interview talking about the the most damaging emails that the press has only begun to talk about: donor spreadsheets
http://www.democracynow.org/2016/7/25/exclusive_wikileaks_julian_assange_on_releasing
Big Spreadsheet of All Things
Worksheet: DNC
Top 25 Amounts By Full Name
select sum(amount) as total_amount, full_name
from dnc group by full_name order by total_amount desc
limit 25;
$532,200.00;”Laufer, Marsha”
$504,800.00;”Laufer, Henry”
$333,000.00;”Eychaner, Fred”
$308,600.00;”Simons, James”
$234,000.00;”Lefebvre, Dale”
$200,000.00;”Richard Milanovich”
$191,900.00;”Underwood, Alicia”
$178,200.00;”Berns, Justin”
$177,300.00;”Rollins, Ruth”
$177,200.00;”Potarazu, Sreedhar”
$173,400.00;”Merck, Friedrike”
$155,000.00;”Whitney, Kate”
$148,200.00;”Snowdon, Edward”
$148,200.00;”Kaempfer, Jw”
$142,400.00;”Bittel, Stephen”
$142,400.00;”Rose, Adam”
$140,850.00;”Boskind, Paul”
$138,799.33;”Bastian, Bruce”
$136,600.00;”Lowe, Christopher”
$135,510.00;”Tobias, Andrew”
$133,600.00;”Orange, Wendy”
$133,300.00;”Lewis, Leslie”
$132,400.00;”Pishevar, Shervin”
$132,400.00;”Logothetis, Nicholas”
$132,200.00;”Scheide, Mary (Judith)”
$148,200.00;”Snowdon, Edward”’
Really?
Order a platoon of patriots to look it up for yourself. I am sure the budget will cover the expense.
It’s gratifying to see so much principled dismissal of corrupt media and establishment memes.
Sanders supporters have been accused of childish idealism for wanting the everyday effective socialism most civilized nations in the West already enjoy. This is disgusting.
Please join the visionary Jill Stein of the Green Party, all of you! She is for all that Bernie stood for, and also far more – including proactive peace, 100% transition to renewables by 2030, and the unequivocal end of institutionalized racism.
Trump has started to lead Hillary in the polls, so that’s quite reassuring. I know some folks will be disappointed, but this is a democracy so the majority will prevail. If we can continue like this then come November we can start building the Trump Wall that our border folks desperately need.
Trump’s unfavourability numbers are famous but Clinton is fast catching up. In the latest CNN survey, Trump was viewed unfavourably by 59%, Clinton by 55%. They are the two least popular presidential candidates in living memory.
Clinton remains overwhelming favorite for the presidency at odds of 1.44, equating to a 70% chance. I don’t think you know what you are talking about Hercules..
Wake up! Hilliary is going to lose!
http://edition.cnn.com/2016/07/25/politics/donald-trump-hillary-clinton-poll/index.html
It’s up to 68% now,
And she’s trailing Trump in the polls by 14 points.
Trump’s Wall promises to spare Mexicans and any number of other Latin Americans
US guns & ammo, US drug dollars, and US rapists & pedophiles. Culturally speaking, it will also surely help ghettoize the US on the model of Israel vis-a-vis the Middle East. #BringItOn, say I.
Wouldn’t that be great?
Or do you have a problem, Useless?
The vast Pacific ocean and the massive continental mass of Asia in one direction and the treacherous Atlantic ocean along with continental barrier of North African in the other direction, still were not barriers sufficient enough to prevent the Israelis from infiltrating America to subvert our politics for their own selfish ends. And you believe a mere wall will solve an immigration issue?
FYI, most illegal immigrants from South of the border arrive here by plane, not by foot. Also most Zionists in the US are loyal to Israel not America.
Mexico is paying for the wall, so we get it free. That’s called the art of the deal.
What’s your problem?
It might be helpful if those berating us for our bad vibes and being personally responsible for the forthcoming Fourth Reich, actually admitted that, “Yeah, what the DNC did was really shitty,” or “Yeah, we’re going to get rid of things like Superdelegates and make sute it never happens again,” or “Yeah, she’s really flawed and I’ll be there with you to help fix her later, but in the meantime please, please, vote for her.”
Mostly it’s like, “You $%*)’s are the problem, not my weak candidate…” Goes a long way toward reconciliation (not), much less gives a lot of confidence that when she does get elected, anyone will see our concerns more valid then than now.
Humility doesn’t feel like the Clinton supporter sweet spot. Mostly the rest of us are supposed to shut up and step in lockstep, no matter what they feed us.
Slick Hillary ~
Just follow her trail
What difference does it make?
Too corrupt for jail
The protesters are right, LOCK HER UP. Sanders got screwed.
“If the Democratic nominee were chosen by those who showed up in the streets of Philadelphia to protest the convention, there would be one uncontested winner.”
But it wasn’t. The nominee was chosen by the millions of voters who preferred Hillary over Bernie. There is one uncontested winner, and her name is Hillary Clinton.
I have personally requested Donald Trump not to chuck all the crooked people over the wall, but I doubt he will listen. That fellow is quite a determined brat.
Matt, your “uncontested winner” “won” the primary because of active voter suppression by her campaign and the DNC. Because of that there is no way of knowing whether Democrats preferred Hillary over Bernie, and your claim is false.
Either way do you really think it would have made any difference?
Yes, it would have given Bernie the ammunition to fight a Clinton nomination by the DNC.
What is the difference between Clinton and Bernie?
By his own admission and repeated assertion there is none.
Protesting at either corporate convention is reassuring to
the owners of the fake U$A because it means more
energy and attention is being wasted
instead of organizing for a real opposition party.
The corporatists should be shunned, but the protesters are telling them
how important they think they are.
This is one reason Bernie Sanders is not to be trusted.
with all the baggage around clinton, the smartest thing the dnc can do, and the best thing for america imho, is step aside for bernie.
nothing wrong with taking the high road in a contest
A for me mortifying and potentially catastrophic moment came early on in my medical career when, in 1884-85, I encouraged a colleague of mine, one Ernst Fleischl von Marxow by name, to employ cocaine as an antidote to the morphine [< = heroin] to which he had by then long been habituated. I was then forced to concede in an 1887 mea culpa essay that this had soon enough resulted in a "rapid physical and moral deterioration, hallucinatory states of agitation similar to delirium tremens, a chronic persecution mania, characterized in my experience by the hallucination of small animals moving in the skin, and cocaine addiction in place of morphine addiction — these were the sad results of trying to cast out the Devil by Beelzebub". I confidently predict that a vote against Trump with a vote for Hillary will eventually produce a not dissimilar result. Thus, a vote for Jill Stein or for Gary Johnson — who might do better to affiliate just for this 2016 election, just so as to rout the long-prevailing two party dictatorship — would likely make a great deal of sense.
That’s funny and true Siggy. Good to see Freud still learning from his mistakes.
This situation applies to me. I have another point to make.
As a resident of California, I don’t even live in a “Swing State!”
My vote in the primary got “lost in the mail,” my vote in the general will be largely unheard because my state is considered a done deal.
All this means is that I will be voting third party as my conscious directs me, and free from this ridiculous “a third party vote is a vote for Trump” guilt trip.
I do like Jill, but Gary Johnson is the only third party candidate on all 50 ballots! It is a little disappointing that his name isn’t mentioned once in this article.
Gary Johnson is reheated GOP policies and a Climate Denier. Have fun voting for him and enjoy a totally deregulated economy and accelerated demise of the environment.
Rus, your opinions about him are totally irrelevant to the idea that ALL candidates, including ALL third party candidates should have their voices heard.
If we are to act as the free country we claim to be, we need to give candidates other than those brought forward by the elephant and the ass due consideration. You may not agree with Libertarian policies, but as I said above, as the only 3rd party candidate on all 50 states’ ballots, his is a voice worth hearing.
Accelerated demise of the environment? If we’re all doomed anyway then why waste money on green tech that wouldn’t survive without subsidies and overregulate coal and oil producers? Bankrupting the U.S. in order to ease your conscience while other countries continue to emit greenhouse gases, doesn’t sound logical to me. If someone comes up with an “actual alternative” that can support itself then I’m all for it. In fact maybe our money would be better spent on prize money for successful alternative’s rather then successful lobbyists.
42 million students saddled with huge education loans equals 42 million votes for Dr. Jill Stein and a win. Now, with the emails showing just how corrupt the DNC is, the chances of Jill becoming the next president of the USA is quite likely. It will be an underground movement because the corporate media will shaft her just like they did Bernie. It’s time Jill Stein; the status quo has got to go!
You are making some big assumptions. Just because there are 42 million students with debt doesn’t mean they support Jill Stein. Who isn’t on the ballot in all fifty states. Some of them will vote for Trump, some Hillary, some will go outside of the 2 party system but most will probably not vote at all.
He is also assuming that Burger King will give them time off to go to the polls.
It is that simple. The world is on the brink of an environmental melt down and these two corporatist parties are both planning to put the pedal to the metal until we drive over the brink.
So the choice is simple; choose to try and save yourself or enjoy the ride over the cliff.
The choice is obvious to see, the problem however is the systematic undermining of the education system over the past few decades has lead to a population who cannot see any other choice but the two they have been told are the only choices.
I suppose lemmings would be an apt metaphor here.
If no Bernie bee cause DNC then Jill; and it is Easy-
DNC to blame if Trump b/c Bernie was people(s) choice v Clinton©
:?)
Here’s another reason why Sanders supporters don’t want the Clinton-Wasserman Schultz liars running the party – and which also shows that, despite Sanders trying to put a good face on the rigged process by pointing to his influence on the party platform, he actually got almost nothing on major issues like clean energy, superdelegate reform, etc:
http://www.desmogblog.com/2016/07/23/democratic-party-platform-committee-fracking
Sanders should really pull a Ted Cruz for his convention speech; his supporters deserve at least that much, all things considered.
“Sanders should really pull a Ted Cruz”
He should actually use that opportunity to announce his independent run for president and walk off stage to the thundering applause of his supporters and jeers/boos from Clinton supporters.
hey idiot a thirdparty run means electing the CRAZY TRUMP as prez…wake up u bernie morons….. i dont like killary that much either but a thirdparty run or voting for other thirdpary candidates means president TRUMP! GOT THAT IDIOTS?
You could have saved three sentences by just caps locking: LOTE!
But as the article indicated the LOTE, morons and idiot insults aren’t really working any more on millions of people. That’s what you should be concerned about. When your primary argument (LOTE) is falling on deaf ears, that’s when you can do one of two things: 1) change your ways (Democratic Party), or 2) prepare for the reality you will lose a lot of elections (see also state houses, governorships, and Congress (in part)) and then try and paper that over by blaming all those who you believe are obligated to vote for you on LOTE calculus.
But here’s a newsflash, nobody in a democracy is obligated to do anything other than vote their conscience. If that doesn’t align with your triangulating LOTE theory of voting, well that’s a problem for you not the people. Could that yield some harm to those who voted against their “nominal best interest” (marginally), of course it could. But we’re getting to the point in this country where people are sick and tired of scraps and LOTE choices. And they really shouldn’t be blamed for that, the national Democratic Party (and state parties) should.
I’m willing to suffer four years of Trump to make the point that We Are Mad As Hell and we’re not going to take it any more. We’ve been given a choice between Corrupt and Corrupter, and we can’t even tell who is who. That’s not a choice. That’s not democracy. Anyone who votes Hillary because they fear Trump (or vice versa) is a pantywaist. Grow a pair and vote third party!
Agree completely, Hillary is the snake in the grass. In 4 years we hit it hard, for NOW we BERN HILLARY DOWN.
You guys think far too much of Sanders; he’s no Dennis Kucinich. Sanders obsesses on money (financial issues), which is always a bad thing, whether from the left or from the right. He’s also not great on foreign policy, he’s just not psychopathic like the rest of them. (Actually, Trump may be better on foreign policy than Sanders, because he’s so into making deals and money that he might stifle the military.)
The fact that Sanders is proactively supporting Clinton instead of running an independent campaign or running with Jill Stein should tell you all you need to know about him. Sanders is certainly a breath of fresh air compared to the rest of these assholes, but you should stop fantasizing that he’s some sort of savior; he’s clearly not.
Calling for a moratorium on natural gas is naive. There are some risk to natural gas because it is still a fossil fuel but banning it without a viable alternative won’t help us reduce emissions. This is because people will just switch back to coal which emits more carbon dioxide than natural gas.
Bogus argument; instead of building natural gas plants we can build solar arrays and wind turbines coupled to storage and distribution. The fact is, all the subsidies for fossil fuel production – including low-visibility subsidies like foreign military intervention and tax breaks for domestic fossil fuel production – should be eliminated.
The reason Hillary Clinton’s Wall Street backers don’t like this is that a solar power plant is not a guaranteed purchaser of fossil fuels over the next twenty years (it runs off sunlight), while a natural gas plant is. Current costs for a 300 MW power plant are about $300 million for gas, $700 million for solar, and $1 billion for coal – but the solar plant, unlike the coal or gas plant, does not need to be fed with fossil fuels. This turns Wall Street investments in coal and gas into worthless junk.
Not so hard to understand, is it? Nevertheless, solar is better since it’s not polluting the air and water, no foreign oil wars are needed, and it doesn’t enhance global warming.
Solar power is fine when present in a grid that has other sources as well. Otherwise, during extended periods of overcast skies you will end up not being able to post your valuable comments here.
You have no idea what you are talking about – solar doesn’t cost close to what you stated – nor does gas. I can’t speak on coal, but that sounds highly inflated just like the bs you are spewing to the world.
Sanders was haggling for free plane rides for support to Hilliary.
He is a nice fellow, on the surface.
No, he didn’t win because there were closed primaries. The system is setup, so that only candidates of the establishment can win.
Political movements always try to frame their movement as being representative of the will of the people or at least the majority. This just isn’t the case. Bernie didn’t lose because of the super delegates or because of the DNC was biased against them. Bernie lost because Clinton received more votes than him. Bernie supporters are going to have to figure out where their movement is going to go now that Bernie isn’t the nominee.
No, he didn’t win because there were closed primaries. The system is setup, so that only candidates of the establishment can win.
Simple vote for Jill
And what are they going to do after Jill doesn’t win the presidency? You have to start thinking pass the election.
No you have to do the right thing. Stop endorsing a system that does not represent you.
I’m just being realistic. Jill Stein chances of winning the presidency is slim at best. So when she doesn’t win and Trump or Hillary is president what are the Sander supporters going to do?
Realistic? Let’s flip your idea on its head and watch it play out: What will Sanders supporters do NEXT ELECTION if they just cave and vote for Hillary?
Claim that THIS TIME YOU REALLY NEED TO LISTEN TO US, OR ELSE!!!
That wouldn’t really work, would it? If the Democratic Party knows that the Left can be counted on to give up in the end and always support the centrist nominee, then there is absolutely no reason whatsoever for the D party to pay any attention to any further challenges. NONE.
Whereas: if we vote for Jill Stein, despite the fear of Trump, then the D party knows we mean business. If enough of us do it to threaten Democratic victories, then they will HAVE to deal with us.
That’s thinking to the next election, Noble Thomas.
What about the concessions that they already given the Bernie campaign. Hillary’s support for campaign finance reform, Bernie’s unprecedented influence over the committee, and a commission to reform the primary election. Isn’t this proof that you already have influence over the Democratic party.
The solution isn’t to give a madman the codes to nuclear missiles. The solution is to take the time to build a constituency within the party that represents your interests. It’s hard work, and it doesn’t happen in a cycle. Where were you for state and local elections for the last three decades? How much time and effort has Sanders put into supporting down ticket candidates that could help bring about his revolution.
The “establishment” exists because they’ve put in the decades needed to create real political strength, both inside the party and in office, from the ground up. You want change? DO THAT.
I’m not giving anything to Trump, how dare you. And by the way, don’t you have a bit more confidence in your AWESOME HERSTORY-MAKING CANDIDATE. Nobody pees their pants like Democrats imagining they can’t count on the Left.
And who the fuck are you to try to guess my political background? Get lost you fucking bag of cliched bullshit. I was never going to vote for Hillary; with Sanders there was at least a chance I would vote for a Democrat. I haven’t voted for a Democratic presidential candidate since the 80s, although I sheepishly must admit I tried hard to vote for Kerry in 2004 (thankfully the registrar in the Democrat-controlled county “lost” my registration — they weren’t taking any chances you see. I’m really glad to keep the blot off my record; I knew what a shit candidate that guy was and here I was going to vote for him anyway! Lesser of 2 evils could work on me still in my 30s. Not no more).
Your tired arguments are trotted out every 4 years. Take it to salon and slate and the guardian and the NYT and NPR and MSNBC and Daily Kos and HuffPo — oh wait, you are nothing special at those joints, are you?
You will not find many people who read this site doing anything but laughing bitterly at your dopey ideas about the inherent preferability of the Democratic Party.
We of the Left will be taken seriously at the precise moment you lose an election because of us and not a minute before. You had a chance to do it a nice way by picking Sanders. You didn’t. Too bad.
Maybe you will win anyway, Hillary is going full tilt neo-Con what with Kaine and getting Bloomberg to speak and talk of those RUSSKIES behind everything.. Move to the left? Ha. No, I’m not seeing this move to the left of which you speak.
Actually, Clinton is far more likely to start a nuclear war than Trump. Clinton is a full on war monger who, in addition to voting for the Iraq War II and being instrumental in destroying Libya, wants to implement a no-fly zone in Syria. Really? With Russian planes flying there? Meanwhile Trump only wants to do business with Russia, not make war with it.
You people who make Trump out to be the devil while ignoring how evil Clinton is are totally clueless. You focus on the (very successful) persuasion techniques that come out Trumps asshole/mouth instead of focusing on what he’s likely to do or not do as president. Yeah, he’s a real piece of crap, but so’s Clinton and Trump is clearly not as bad on the issue of war & peace.
You’re totally full of it, see Vic’s response to you. These two gangs are not legitimate political parties, the system is totally corrupt, and a mere two parties and a winner-take-all system does not begin to represent most of the people. What we need is proportional representation, removal of all private campaign financing, and required TV time for all candidates. Those three things would make the current major parties into very minor ones.
You’ve got it wrong. It’s what are we going to do in the future if we just keep supporting ever more right wing Democrats. Clinton is by far the farthest right Democrat to be nominated for president in my lifetime. It’s well worth losing this and a few other elections in order to build a movement that would dump this entire corrupt, immoral, and unrepresentative system. YOU are the one not looking to the future.
YOU have to start thinking past the next four years. Voting third party is a strongest statement we could make about how disappointed, disenfranchised, and disgusted we are with the system. A massive number of people need to say, We’ve lost in faith in both the Democrats AND the Republicans and until there are substantive changes, we will not support them with our votes.
They always get people to vote for the lesser of evils — though in this case, Clinton is no less evil than Trump, just a different type of evil — because they successfully scare people every four years. Trump Bush, McCain, Whoever is the “worst ever” and we have to defeat him by voting Democrat or the world will end! And most people are too stupid and/or cowardly to be willing to lose a battle or two in order to win the war, so to speak, so they vote Democratic.
So I totally agree, we SHOULD be willing to lose a few elections in order to build a movement to eventually throw the bums out, but most people aren’t willing to do that
Say, did you read that email about the DNC getting together with a Hillary SuperPAC to hire people to counter Bernie Sanders supporters in online forums? Here it is:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CoAFk7LUEAAwK0d.jpg
Utter bullshit! The system is totally rigged, Clinton was anointed about two years ago, if not longer. Sanders got virtually no media coverage, while the corporate media was falling all over each other promoting Clinton. Not to even mention the super delegates who would have given Clinton the nomination if she somehow managed to blow the nomination by elected delegates. You are either clueless or a Clinton propagandist.