Those who most loudly denounce Fake News are typically those most aggressively disseminating it.
The phrase “Fake News” has exploded in usage since the election, but the term is similar to other malleable political labels such as “terrorism” and “hate speech”; because the phrase lacks any clear definition, it is essentially useless except as an instrument of propaganda and censorship. The most important fact to realize about this new term: Those who most loudly denounce Fake News are typically those most aggressively disseminating it.
One of the most egregious examples was the recent Washington Post article hyping a new anonymous group and its disgusting blacklist of supposedly pro-Russia news outlets — a shameful article mindlessly spread by countless journalists who love to decry Fake News, despite the Post article itself being centrally based on Fake News. (The Post this week finally added a lame editor’s note acknowledging these critiques; the Post editors absurdly claimed that they did not mean to “vouch for the validity” of the blacklist even though the article’s key claims were based on doing exactly that).
Now we have an even more compelling example. Back in October, when WikiLeaks was releasing emails from the John Podesta archive, Clinton campaign officials and their media spokespeople adopted a strategy of outright lying to the public, claiming — with no basis whatsoever — that the emails were doctored or fabricated and thus should be ignored. That lie — and that is what it was: a claim made with knowledge of its falsity or reckless disregard for its truth — was most aggressively amplified by MSNBC personalities such as Joy Ann Reid and Malcolm Nance, The Atlantic’s David Frum, and Newsweek’s Kurt Eichenwald.
Clinton camp chief strategist @benensonj: "I've seen things" in Wikileaks emails "that aren't authentic" #ThisWeek https://t.co/LPQJBfACqz
— This Week (@ThisWeekABC) October 23, 2016
That the emails in the Wikileaks archive were doctored or faked — and thus should be disregarded — was classic Fake News, spread not by Macedonian teenagers or Kremlin operatives but by established news outlets such as MSNBC, The Atlantic, and Newsweek. And, by design, this Fake News spread like wildfire all over the internet, hungrily clicked and shared by tens of thousands of people eager to believe it was true. As a result of this deliberate disinformation campaign, anyone reporting on the contents of the emails was instantly met with claims that the documents in the archive had been proven fake.
The most damaging such claim came from MSNBC’s intelligence analyst Malcolm Nance. As I documented on October 11, he tweeted what he — for some bizarre reason — labeled an “Official Warning.” It decreed: “#PodestaEmails are already proving to be riddled with obvious forgeries & #blackpropaganda not even professionally done.” That tweet was re-tweeted by more than 4,000 people. It was vested with added credibility by Clinton-supporting journalists like Reid and Frum (“expert to take seriously”).
All of that, in turn, led to an article in something called the “Daily News Bin” with the headline: “MSNBC intelligence expert: WikiLeaks is releasing falsified emails not really from Hillary Clinton.” This classic fake news product — citing Nance and Reid among others — was shared more than 40,000 times on Facebook alone.
Official Warning: #PodestaEmails are already proving to be riddled with obvious forgeries & #blackpropaganda not even professionally done. https://t.co/UuJZrurHAA
— Malcolm Nance (@MalcolmNance) October 7, 2016
Joe, Malcolm Nance & other experts have validated these emails have been forged & altered by Russia before passing them off to Wikileaks! https://t.co/gZ7rVQ6JJp
— VLB (@BickiDoodle) October 27, 2016
The media (@ABC, @CBSNews, @NBCNews and @PBS) must heed Malcolm Nance: "You should have ZERO CONFIDENCE in the contents" of Wikileaks dumps!
— Thomas Gordon (@EarthOrb) October 23, 2016
Joy now discussing WikiLeaks with security expert Malcolm Nance who says we can have zero confidence in authenticity of documents. #AMJoy
— LaurenBaratzLogsted (@LaurenBaratzL) October 22, 2016
From the start, it was obvious that it was this accusation from Clinton supporters — not the WikiLeaks documents — that was a complete fraud, perpetrated on the public as deliberate disinformation. With regard to the claim about the Podesta emails, now we know exactly who created it in the first instance: a hard-core Clinton fanatic.
When Nance — MSNBC’s “intelligence analyst” — issued his “Official Warning,” he linked to a tweet that warned: “Please be skeptical of alleged #PodestaEmails. Trumpists are dirtying docs.” That tweet, in turn, linked to a tweet from an anonymous account calling itself “The Omnivore,” which had posted an obviously fake transcript purporting to be a Hillary Clinton speech to Goldman Sachs. Even though that fake document was never published by WikiLeaks, that was the entire basis for the MSNBC-inspired claim that some of the WikiLeaks documents were doctored.
But the person who created that forged Goldman Sachs transcript was not a “Trumpist” at all; he was a devoted supporter of Hillary Clinton. In the Daily Beast, the person behind the anonymous “The Omnivore” account unmasks himself as “Marco Chacon,” a self-professed creator of “viral fake news” whose targets were Sanders and Trump supporters (he specialized in blatantly fake anti-Clinton frauds with the goal of tricking her opponents into citing them, so that they would be discredited). When he wasn’t posting fabricated news accounts designed to make Clinton’s opponents look bad, his account looked like any other standard pro-Clinton account: numerous negative items about Sanders and then Trump, with links to many Clinton-defending articles.
In his Daily Beast article, published on November 21, Chacon describes how he manufactured the forged Goldman Sachs speech transcript. He says he did it prior to learning that the WikiLeaks releases of Podesta emails contained actual Clinton speech excerpts to Wall Street banks. But once he realized WikiLeaks had published actual Clinton transcripts, Chacon began trying to lure people he disliked — Clinton critics — into believing that his forged speeches were real, so that he could prove they were gullible and dumb.
Sadly for Chacon, however, the people who ended up getting fooled by his Fake News items were the nation’s most prominent Clinton supporters, including supposed experts and journalists from MSNBC who used his obvious fakes to try to convince the world that the WikiLeaks archive had been compromised and thus should be ignored. That it was pro-Clinton journalists who spread his Fake News as real now horrifies even Chacon:
The tweet went super-viral. It started an almost trending — but still going today — hashtag #bucketoflosers. A tweet declaring it a bad forgery was picked up by Malcolm Nance, an intelligence analyst for MSNBC among others, who tweeted to be wary of the WikiLeaks release . …
That did not stop Nance, who with a firm intelligence background should have been able to easily spot the fake with “(chaos)” actually written in the side bar and “((makes air quotes))” written before the “bucket of losers” piece in the completely comical so-called transcript, from referencing the document and saying: “Official Warning: #PodestaEmails are already proving to be riddled with obvious forgeries & #blackpropaganda not even professionally done.” …
At the end of the day, did this change anything? I don’t know. I think I inadvertently hurt WikiLeaks, which I’m not proud of — but I’m not too sorry about either. I suspect that some people came to realize that they were believing in fake things.
That last sentence — that as a result of his fraud, “some people came to realize that they were believing in fake things” — is false, at least insofar as it applies to people like Eichenwald, Frum, Nance, and Reid. Even though it was clear from the start to any rational and honest person that there was zero evidence that any of the WikiLeaks documents were doctored, and even though (as Chacon himself says) nobody minimally informed (let alone supposed “intelligence experts”) should have been fooled by his blatant Fake News, none of the journalists who lied to the public about these WikiLeaks documents have even once acknowledged what they did.
Their Fake News tweets — warning people to view the WikiLeaks documents as fake — remain posted, with no subsequent retraction or acknowledgment of the falsehoods that they spread about the WikiLeaks archive. That includes MSNBC segments that spread this accusation.
Indeed, not only should it have been blatantly obvious that Chacon’s anonymously posted document did not impugn the WikiLeaks archive, but also the slightest research would have revealed that the person who manufactured the forgery was a Clinton supporter, not a “Trumpist” or a Kremlin operative. Indeed, one of the Clinton-criticizing journalists who Chacon tried to trick, Michael Tracey, said exactly this at the time. But because his facts contradicted the MSNBC/Newsweek political agenda, they were ignored in favor of the lie that the WikiLeaks archive had been compromised and doctored:
FYI: one of the accounts (@OmnivoreBlog) that circulated a fake HRC speech transcript is a pro-Clinton troll spreading disinformation. pic.twitter.com/HZ3UBm9pk8
— Michael Tracey (@mtracey) October 11, 2016
I will be shocked if any of them now acknowledge this even with Chacon’s confession. That’s because MSNBC has repeatedly proven that it tolerates Fake News and outright lies from its personalities as long as those lies are in service of the right candidate (when Democrats were smearing Jill Stein as a Kremlin stooge, Reid’s program aired Nance’s lie to MSNBC viewers that Stein had previously hosted her own show on RT: an utter fabrication that MSNBC, to this day, has never corrected or even acknowledged despite multiple requests from FAIR).
On Reid's show, Malcolm Nance falsely claimed Jill Stein hosted an RT show, & they just refuse to correct/retract it. How is that allowed? https://t.co/FKb5J0HDKF
— Glenn Greenwald (@ggreenwald) October 19, 2016
Every day, literally, you can turn on MSNBC and hear various people so righteously lamenting the spread of “Fake News.” Yet MSNBC itself not only spreads Fake News but refuses to correct it when it is exposed. How do they have any credibility to denounce Fake News? They do not.
That journalists and “experts” outright lied to the public this way in order to help their favorite candidate is obviously dangerous. This was most powerfully pointed out — ironically — by Marty Baron, executive editor of the Washington Post, who told the New York Times’s Jim Rutenberg: “If you have a society where people can’t agree on basic facts, how do you have a functioning democracy?”
Exactly: If you have prominent journalists telling the public to trust an anonymous group with a false McCarthyite blacklist, or telling it to ignore informative documents on the grounds that they are fake when there is zero reason to believe that they are fake, that is a direct threat to democracy. In the case of the Podesta emails, these lies were perpetrated by the very factions that have taken to most loudly victimizing themselves over the spread of Fake News.
But the problem here goes way beyond mere hypocrisy. Complaints about Fake News are typically accompanied by calls for “solutions” that involve censorship and suppression, either by the government or tech giants such as Facebook. But until there is a clear definition of “Fake News,” and until it’s recognized that Fake News is being aggressively spread by the very people most loudly complaining about it, the dangers posed by these solutions will be at least as great as the problem itself.
Note: The article was lightly edited to reflect the correct date of the Daily Beast article: November 21.
That my side, the left, is calling others on the left “Russian stooges” or the equivalent terrifies me. I spent much of my life being sickened by the right claiming anyone who is liberal as a “Marxist” or “Communist”, and now to hear this same mindless jingoism from what should be the enlightened side just sucks the hope out of me.
Donna Brazile promoted that lie, too.
It astounds me anyone thinks you’re an actual progressive, Glenn. You are the most obvious false-flag right winger I’ve ever seen.
How many national journalists are on the CIA payroll?
Nobody is buying the lefty drivel..except other lefties. Huwhite Identity Politics are here to stay . . Minorities have been playing identity politics since the 60’s. All this butthurt propaganda is Not having any real effect.. everybody is going to independent sites like Daily stormer and Breitbart for their news .mainstream corporate media has lost . TheElection of Mr Trump was facilitated by these sites. That’s why all the frenzy in lefty/mainstream media. Fash is now in fashion. Tahoe still under the globalist spell are doomed to be left behind by History. It’s the under 20 Americans that will in their lifetimes see the rise of nationalism and identity politics into total mainstream . 2024 will see a Ultra nationalist alt_right candidate run for office.
White people have been playing identify politics since the 60’s too.
The 1860’s.
No wait. White Supremacy goes back way longer than that.
White Supremacy IS here to stay. The question is how much longer it will remain mainstream politics on the American right before it goes back to being something conservatives deny being.
When did the CIA replace the term “Conspiracy Theory” with “Fake News” and started blaming the Russians because shwillary didn’t win?
Perhaps this editorial is fake?? Who do you believe in a room full of liars??? Wikileaks??? Fox News??? For the believers, no proof is necessary….for the skeptics, no proof is enough…
Ont thing is sure. Trump was not elected because of “fake news”. Malcom X said “I am for Truth, no matter who tells it.” I ascribe to that. From the true facts presented to us, those for which there are few who would deny, we know:
1. If the US Presidential election was rigged, it was rigged as the result of true facts presented to the voters. Does anyone deny this? Certainly the CIA does not.
2. The US Democratic Primary election was definitely rigged. We have ample evidence, direct factual evidence of the conversations of those conspiring to rig the Democratic Party nomination.
And no one needs to know about the recount, or the count, or the lack of one.
The Intercept appears to be one of the few news sites left to get real news.
Seema Sapra December 12 2016, 9:57 a.m.
“Something is definitely going on vis-a-vis Trump and the US deep State.”
What is going on is quite obvious —- The Biggest Organized Pre-Innauguration Propaganda Smear ever seen in the USA .—–
It began with Sanders ( he was made an offer he could not refuse ) .
Jill Stein was made to see the errors of her ways .
Trump will probably “see the light” after he wakes up with the horse’s head in
his bed .
BTW : I did note participate in the perverse perpetuation ( aka US Election ) of the lesser of two evils so don’t go beating the ” He’s a Trump/Clinton ” supporter . To me they only difference between the two was the pants they wore .
It occurred to me reading some of this that the US might have been involved in trying to influence a few elections around the world. When that didn’t work we just wiped out the current leader. Why the outrage?
If you actually get out there and participate in newsworthy happenings, you will quickly come away with the conviction that the MSM simply makes things up. They don’t even pretend anymore. I could cite meeting after meeting, march after march, speech after speech where not only was their coverage biased, but bore zero evidence of even being about the same thing I saw. They just lie.
Putin? I like him. He heads a Christian God fearing country of mostly white people. I can name at least 15 countries that are FAR worse…some our ALLIES!
Lol Chirstian and God fearing are some of your criteria? There are extreme human rights violations that happen there every day.
How about this?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_journalists_killed_in_Russia
Go back to your alt right message board. Don’t post this crap here.
Yes. Two of thee worst Cucked Countries under the hell of the One World Cabal are England And Germany. How ironic.. spoke to a very old fellow in 1989 who fought the Nazis many years ago who told me this: believe me if we Britons fighting would have been shown what London looks like now we would have laid down our rifles..imagine if he was alive today to see the state of his beloved England he would cry like a baby.
I know for a fact the FBI has been investigating the Russian Mafia FSB/KGB influence in the media massaging political figures in America since 2008.
Much of what has been reported about Russian propaganda and fake news is true and was intend to put Donald Trump in office. Look no further than Alex Jones and Wayne Madsen and you’ll see two paid hacks-disinformation moles on Russia’s payroll.
Madsen was RT.com’s, Russia Today’s on-air real time host for several years in D.C. Jones and madsen both were recruited during the Ukraine Revolution, together they were Team Trump, the Kremlin’s electioneering program to install Donald Trump as President.
Let’s look at the heart of a very real conspiracy to murder America. The first links are to former Attorney General Ed Meese, Jeff Sessions and Tea Party leaders who want America returned to pre-civil war days.
They want to have a peaceful civil war without the gunplay with Putin standing in as their enforcer as they split spoils and loot from a divided America. They virtually own government in the Red States which are Mafia States with no law and order with dozens of extra-judicial killings a year. Now what do you not get from this Glenn?
Famous KGB defector Anatoliy Golitsyn wrote about and predicted this situation in “New Lies for Old” and “The Perestroika Deception.” Golitsyn has a history providing 94% accurate assessments concerning Russian Communist strategy in his memos to the CIA since 1961.
He was the sole analyst to accurately forecast the Fake collapse and breakup of the Soviet Union and their return as a Mafia State like Putin’s Russia today.
I’ve followed the trail of the group who established the Mafia State in Alabama and Florida for the KGB and if Trump is sworn in there will be a civil war in America. It is not about being a democrat or republican is about all things American.
Where is the evidence for those wild claims?
The reich-wingers and their sycophants in the media trying to discredit anyone who disproves lies are no different from Vladimir Putin’s thugs.
Your doublespeak is grade A.
the msm wallstreet wmd Fake News makers called out by an observer with common sense
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UP77G_9-PMQ
worth a view (3m)
Thanks, again!
The Clinton’s have benefited from false and fabricated stories for decades. Those right wing produced false and/or fabricated “body count” type stories over the years have muddied the water and shielded Bill and Hillary from serious public scrutiny into the very real accumulated evidence of their greed and deception.
Nice one and from the Martens we also find as the source of some fake news:
http://wallstreetonparade.com/2016/12/whos-behind-propornots-blacklist-of-news-websites/
PropOrNot’s Twitter page provides a “tell” that its report may simply be a hodgepodge compilation of other people’s research that was used to arrive at its dangerous assertion that critical thinkers across America are a clandestine network of Russian propaganda experts. Its Tweet on November 7 indicates that the research of Peter Pomerantsev, a Senior Fellow at the Legatum Institute in London, who has also been cooperating on research with the Information Warfare Project of the Center for European Policy Analysis (CEPA) in Washington, D.C, inspired its efforts.
According to SourceWatch, the Legatum Institute “is a right-wing think tank promoting ‘free markets, free minds, and free peoples.’ ” SourceWatch adds that the Legatum Institute “is a project founded and funded by the Legatum Group, a private investment group based in Dubai.” According to the Internet Archive known as the Wayback Machine, the Center for European Policy Analysis previously indicated it was an affiliate of the National Center for Policy Analysis (NCPA). We can see why they might want to remove that affiliation now that the Koch brothers have been exposed as funders of a very real network of interrelated websites and nonprofits. According to Desmog, NCPA has received millions of dollars in funding from right wing billionaires like the Koch brothers and their related trusts along with the Lynde and Harry Bradley Foundation, the Sarah Scaife Foundation (heir to the Mellon fortune) along with corporations like ExxonMobil.
good job on exposing the lies of the corporate media keep it coming
Free speech is the best antiseptic. We often hear praise for free speech but seldom see it clearly work its magic.
The Internet is a great tool for free speech. But it can also promote free speech that deliberately or unintentionally spreads falsehoods. But with open Internet access, advocates and critics can investigate, question, source and cleanse the falsehoods from the truth.
Government and partisan attacks on “fake news” want to shut off free speech by asserting only “they” can recognize truth from falsehood. Highly dangerous line of thinking.
Trump, Brexit and other recent election surprises (to some) happen because supposed media “filters” for truth repeatedly proved themselves highly partisan. Media whores is totally apt. So, don’t believe everything on the Internet. Those Nigerian princes won’t be sending you any checks.
Equally, when well coiffed news readers tell you stories, don’t believe them either w/o fact checking yourself. The mere choice of what is “news” (think NPR) and selective editing of events is more common than total fabrication, but totally fake news does happen. Thanks Glenn and the Intercept crew for your heroic work!
The term “fake news” isn’t nearly as vacuous or contrived as you suggest. When one regularly encounters such “news” as Pizzagate, or the US invasion of TX, or birtherism, or “vaccines cause autism” etc etc, I dare say it’s so pervasive that it can’t be simply dismissed as a term of propaganda.
There is, actually, fake news. it’s everywhere.
Yes. This is an excellent example.
If you read the comment section of this article, you have to wonder about the people reading this article.
Awesome reporting, Glenn. ^5
This should end in court. Every part has to show the evidence of which side is really posting the so called fake news. Im with Alex Jones but if wants to end this war he has to do it. There is no way he will end up to end the crap.
George Soros is behind with all this. He has spent millions of dollars to create all of this and he will not give up so easily.
Thanks for your leading the way and this channel for sharing important information we wont get elsewhere. We need to build the movement to Shut off corporate owned MainStreamMedia… and build and support alternative media… to OCCUPY THE MEDIA! * please view our channel and POST YOUR OWN RECOMMENDATIONS FOR ALTERNATIVE MEDIA (Big or Small) https://youtu.be/d2xnms84N3c?
You need look no further than the very alt-media blacklist being circulated by PropOrNot. Many of those 200 ‘Russian disinformation’ sites are actually some of the best news/commentary on the internet.
From the many of these commentators I learned that if a news story is against their political party and damaging towards their political candidate or opposite their ideology…its automatically “Fake News”. Thus furthering the reverberations inside their echo chambers.
Please disregard the word ‘the’ from the beginning of the first sentence.
jeremy scahill [email protected]
“The difference between what @theintercept does & what partisan dingbats do: we judge the powerful on their actions, not party affiliation.”
“If you have a society where people can’t agree on basic facts, how do you have a functioning democracy?”
This question assumes, of course, that the aim of people who generate fake news is to promote — rather than undermine — a functioning society, regardless of political form. Considerable evidence suggests that’s not their aim.
That said, the continuing promotion of the US as a “democracy” is grating because that was never intended. Apart from small city states with populations which may literally meet like a town hall to weigh and decide the issues of the day, democracy per se has never existed in the real world of state management. It simply doesn’t scale.
This particular republic is not a “democracy” because it does not derive its authority from individual persons but rather from the individual states which authorized delegation of powers to the federal government to begin with. Individual people had nothing to do with that, apart from state legislators who debated the merit of adoption before voting as representatives of the people who did elect them directly.
Which brings us once again back to the original question, with the following modification to render it relevant: “If you have a society where people can’t agree on basic facts, how do you have a functioning republic?”
More to the point, how can a society function politically when the most fundamental and basic facts of its very structure are constantly propagandized to be something they are not and never were?
Are we ready for Democracy? Have we ever been ready? Critical Thinking has been taught and discussed ad nauseam, but so many of us are still guided by what is essentially gossip.
Is there any hope?
“Critical Thinking has been taught and discussed ad nauseam”
No it hasn’t.
It is FAKE , if it is NOT TRUE, or it is a LIE or WRONG. Simple, no?
That Glenn Greenwald thinks that what Hillary Clinton’s campaign did in response to the Wikileaks leaking of Democratic emails is nauseating and definitely stops me from contributing to his filmmaking efforts. It makes me wonder if he has become a Russian Agent as it has become very obvious that Julian Assange is bought and paid for with Russian gold. Sorry Glenn I find very disturbing the “fake news” issue but I also find just as disturbing your take on it. Julian Assange can go to prison, I don’t support his being left out of culpability because I believe his being used by the Russians to skewer American democracy and electing Trump is far more disturbing and damaging to AMerica.
Nope, none of that.
Considering the obvious responsibility the media has to report the truth in service to the citizenry, is there a basis for legal action to be brought against the offending media outlets? If not, ‘there-oughtta-be-a-law’!!! Thanks Glen for what you do so well.
No matter who doctored them, the point is they can be doctored and should not be taken at face value
Excellent article, the instantaneous reporting nature of news cycles is making it hard to ever understand what is really going on, I appreciate the well-thought out analysis of The Intercept.
LOL AND SHE WAS JUST GIVING A SPEECH ABOUT FAKE NEWS. HOW STUPID.
” until there is a clear definition of fake news…….”
i believe such is impossible. who decides? the msm? government burocrats? a double super secret ‘words & language’ court?
the result will be censorship in some form. guaranteed.
and what about satire & snark. would ‘the onion’ website shutter.
would the president be immune? bucketfuls of fake news are given to the msm regularly? domestic propaganda is a burgeoning enterprise.
obama lies so often that is nose stretches across the potomac.
the good news is that the web calls out lies & liars, and dissects shoddy journalism.
Censorship is even occurring here.
Look for The Truth … in the LATEST column.
Official Government Documentation is even being censored.
We have to rely on our own judgement..Thats where the heart of the problem lays..We have ceased to be critical thinkers..
“” until there is a clear definition of fake news…….”
i believe such is impossible. who decides?”
Guessing that was Glenn’s underlying point.
We need to take ownership, with a careful dose of skepticism, critical thinking, filtering and fact checking. This is modeled by many we are reading now, like Glenn. We need to build the movement to Shut off corporate owned MainStreamMedia… and build and support alternative media… to OCCUPY THE MEDIA! * please view our channel and POST YOUR OWN RECOMMENDATIONS FOR ALTERNATIVE MEDIA (Big or Small) https://youtu.be/d2xnms84N3c?
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-12-09/joe-scarborough-%E2%80%98hillary-clinton-cost-hillary-clinton-election%E2%80%99-not-fake-news
“Joe Scarborough dropped an epic dose of truth on Hillary and her disaffected, snowflake supporters this morning after Clinton herself took to the stage yesterday to blame “fake news” for her stunning loss. Apparently not a buyer of the “fake news” excuse, Scarborough blasted Hillary, and democrats in general, saying that “Hillary Clinton cost Hillary Clinton the election.”
“When you look at this ‘fake news,’ and you see what happened up at Harvard and you hear everybody writing articles saying millennials cost Hillary Clinton the election, and dogs with three legs cost Hillary Clinton the election, and comets passing in the night– Hillary Clinton cost Hillary Clinton the election. Hillary Clinton’s campaign staff cost Hillary Clinton the election.”
“Listen, if you care about Democrats digging out of the hole that they have put themselves in now, you’ve got to ask yourself; what have Democrats done to so offend Americans that they only have 11 governorships, they’ve lost control of the Senate, they’ve lost control of the House, they lost 900 legislative seats over the past six years?”
“It wasn’t fake news. It was something much, much bigger.”
Meanwhile, Joe’s deflated co-host, Mika Brzezinski, could only muster this response: “Ugh, I don’t think people are ready to hear that, Joe.”
Hillary never denied the email where she spoke of droning Julian A. was fake. Now all of a sudden they’re fake, made-up emails. OK if you say so.. Why kill a person telling a lie.. You know Hillary only kills people with the goods on her.. who know all her dirty deeds.
i believe that is true.
Here, I’ll make Joy feel better so she dismisses this all as Whitey’s fault.
Maybe Trump can still make her Ambassador to the Congo, permanently #AmbassadorHarambe
what an excellent, insightful piece. very helpful in logically sorting out this dangerous trend.
Much thanks.
Hillary Edmunds’ tirade against a vast, RW conspiracy back in the 90s was followed a decade later by her attending a NetRoots convention in Vegas, which proved that there actually is a vast LW conspiracy in America.
She knows what she is doing. Her lies multiply like rabbits on coke.
Election 2016 is NOT over.
Pizzagate is NOT “fake news”… it’s SCARY news of a criminal international “pizza” trafficking network.
HOW BIG? Ask Hillary Clinton and the Clinton Foundation.
PIZZA PARTIES + HILLARY + WIKILEAKS + HERSHEY COMPANY + CLINTON FOUNDATION + STATE DEPT = International PIZZA Trafficking
https://voat.co/v/pizzagate/1476079
https://voat.co/v/pizzagate/1457249
There appears to be a war going on within the Deep State in America over Trump’s election. Before the election, there was visible CIA support for Hillary.
Hillary was the CIA/ deep state candidate and she very surprisingly lost.
Part of the deep state is rattled by Trump’s win and is worried that he might go after some of them. By going after the Clintons for example.
So the false CIA claims about Russia hacking or even true CIA claims and threats of investigations are now being used to rattle Trump. It is to eventually tame him. Or there is a blackmail strategy going on. These claims could be a response to the Podesta expose and the allegations about a pedophilia scandal in the Democratic party. I read recent tweets suggesting Alefantis might be running a CIA op. Who knows?
But the deep State needs to tame Trump and make him less powerful by de-legitimizing his Presidency.
Something is definitely going on vis-a-vis Trump and the US deep State.
Whats amazing is that their hubris is giving Trump plenty of ammo in retaliation once POTUS in siccing the FCC on these obvious foreign terrorists media orgs.
Clueless,or divide and conquer?Both.
>>> Something is definitely going on vis-a-vis Trump and the US deep State. <<<
HERE IT IS… I caca you not!
Pizzagate is NOT “fake news”… it’s SCARY news of a criminal international “pizza” trafficking network.
HOW BIG? Ask Hillary Clinton and the Clinton Foundation.
PIZZA PARTIES + HILLARY + WIKILEAKS + HERSHEY COMPANY + CLINTON FOUNDATION + STATE DEPT = International PIZZA Trafficking
https://voat.co/v/pizzagate/1476079
https://voat.co/v/pizzagate/1457249
If you want the Truth… look in the “LATEST” column of comments.
“Something is definitely going on vis-a-vis Trump and the US deep State.”
What is going on is quite obvious —- The Biggest Organized Pre-Innauguration Propaganda Smear ever seen in the USA .—–
It began with Sanders ( he was made an offer he could not refuse ) .
Jill Stein was made to see the errors of her ways .
Trump will probably “see the light” after he wakes up with with the horse’s head in his bed .
The Dem mainstream, DNC and most delusional Democrats, are bed wetting whining babies, who refuse to face reality, the reality of which is that they went for a coronation of the worst possible candidate in Hillary Clinton, and she and their corrupt rigging plan were soundly trounced by Donny Tiny Hands (h/t Jimmy Dore, TYT).
Prof David Michael Green very precisely described on Jimmy Dore’s YouTube show the problem with the Democrats, and how Bill Clinton, Obama, and to some extent Hillary, are killing the party, and have done more damage to the working class than Reagan. They are so limited in their thiing, or intelligence, or both, that they want to blame the messengers who expose how corrupt and hopeless their party is, rather than FIX THEIR DAMN PARTY.
They did fix their party. And just about everything else. That’s their problem.
The campaign figured all they had to do was undermine Bernie’s campaign, engage thugs to violently harass the opposition in the streets , and turn up the juice on their custom-wired vibrator of the leftist press to stimulate a rising crescendo of delectable orgasms for loyal voters who would be driven to delirious climax with the coronation of Hillary Clinton.
What could possibly go wrong? It was a 100% “sure thing”. Everyone said so.
The problem is that the battery in their little torpedo blew up just as the endorphins were really kicking in hard. Which now leaves them with two problems:
1. how to get over hyperventilating, and…
2. how to pull the damn thing out.
Nice work. I propose the adjective “McCarthyite” to describe a (fake) witch hunt is itself fake, as the witches he was hunting were in fact, real.
Just as a simple observation, it’s remarkable to see this piece being promoted by Breitbart on its Facebook page. I don’t mean this to discredit or take anything away from this insightful column but it is startling to see. I suppose it fits into Breitbart’s Pro-Trump narrative.
Thank you! Thank you! Thank you!
Nowadays, it’s best to check fake msm articles against a more trustworthy source like Breitbart.
They were the one who got it right.
OverTheHill is the very essence of FAKE!!!
Thank you for dissecting this, Glenn. Insightful as usual.
If there’s one constant between the Trumpist Right and the Greenwaldian Left, it is nauseating respect and admiration for the Putin dictatorship.
You read the whole article and that’s what you deducted?
Hey Terry,
I certainly identify with the left, but I don’t necessarily admire Putin’s Administration/Dictatorship/Government/etc. as much I’m not gonna believe that he’s the devil, just because Hillary Clinton and her hawkish faction tell me that’s what I should do. I’d rather give them the benefit of the doubt. If I perceive an enemy of the US right now, it’s an unchecked government that carries on its activities in secrecy and allowing some very shady very rich and powerful people and entities to do seemingly whatever they want. It’s time for more transparency in our government and I no longer accept the ‘national security’ excuse as a legitimation for secrecy. That secrecy will be our downfall.
Thanks for your thoughts Terry.
Nickel Wood
Please post a link where GG has expressed respect and admiration for Putin. I’d like to read it.
Assange warned us this would be happening. Just because Hillary lost does not mean it will be the end of the war on free speech – if anything it will intensify. https://freedomfromconscience.wordpress.com/2016/09/15/232/ We better get the word out now. Share The Intercept article far and wide. Notice how many shares the fake article received?
Fake news in the MSM is not limited to politics, obviously. It is astonishingly pervasive in business reporting. The New York Times has engaged in it shamelessly, particularly since the economic crisis began. The latest example, by Jack Ewing, is laughably full of propaganda:
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/07/business/international/ecb-europe-interest-rates-bonds-italy.html?ref=economy
The New York Times itself is shamelessly and laughably full of propaganda.
We have entered an era where there are few, if any, honest reporters in the mainstream media. (and an honest reporter still has to satisfy his/her editor)
The “alternate” press or the observations of regular people is how the truth comes out these days. And that is why the evil left is in a full court press to suppress any alt-news.
The #FakeNews mainstream media was wrong about the election. Independent #RealNews was right. https://jonathansdocs.com/2016/10/18/donald-trump-judges-evil-as-the-world-watches-in-anticipation/
One logical thing to do is to block nonsense websites like msn/msnbc/yahoo/news.yahoo and their associated websites in different countries. Save on Internet data usage. Save your eyes from strain and give your brain a break from inanity by blocking these trashy websites.
If you don’t know how to block domains, or IP addresses, on your computer operating system, it is time to learn. You’ll see how useful that is. This will not affect access to your hotmail or yahoo mail.
I am surprised frankly, that I see no mention of Chris Matthews, one of the worst Clinton supporters who nightly spoke over every voice, called Sanders a fool, in so many words, and tried in every way possible to get Hillary elected, no matter what he had to say, whether fully true or NOT! The man single handedly ruined the MSNBC line up of reporting, if anyone was hoping for any truth at all. There was nothing but misleading words and innuendo pointed at Sanders, and very little discussion of his history of utter loyalty to the American Middle and Working Class citizens. All at the same time, Clinton was talked up as if she had been a saint and had never failed in supporting the Working Class of this nation. What exactly HAS SHE DONE that supports the very poorest of families in our nation? Not that I support ANY republican thug who’s done everything they could to destroy the Working Class families. I don’t. But it is the loss of reality that is so maddening. The loss of any grip on what these BLUE DOGS like Clinton and Matthews have now done to our national debate. We need to support the JOBS and that means we cannot support any legislation that undermines those very JOBS or those CORPORATE THUG BOARDS of DIRECTORS who refuse to let Patriotism be their guide.
Men and Women of the Working Class need to wake up and STAND UNITED under one decision to fight for their JOBS. Speaking Out. Voicing to the Republicans that we all recognize the Republicans have LIED and DESTROYED our nation’s future. When will these people understand there is power when we unite? The Republicans have split the nation in two. Let us UNITE and fight them together!
The Republicans under Trump are trying to unite US,it is the demoncrats and the MSM that divide US.
They have gone postal over Trump and America First.
Indeed. The new slogan will be One Country, One People, One Leader (Ein Land, Ein Volk, Ein Führer). I put the original version in because you probably have never heard it before,
Will you clowns stop already?There is no part of America stolen by outside powers as Germany pre ww2,and our neighbors are friendly.
Trump was the peace candidate,btw,she was the warmonger.
America is made of many peoples,and America first will help all of them.
^^^ This is why aliens won’t talk to us. So many people think their political gang is angelic and the other political gang is corrupt.
Politicians are not here to save us. How many times in your life has a politician made anything better for us? You’ll die of old age before you see it, yet are so indoctrinated that you cannot tell reality from fiction.
Reality from fiction?I said Trump was going to win and he did.
It is fiction to think anything from HRC would have helped US,I’ll give you that,and Trump has already paid dividends for American workers,some thing the demoncrats failed at in 8 years.
Trump an angel?No,of course not,but he is an American patriot for America,a most refreshing thing in a world of ziotraitors.
I know some marijuana legislation passed, so let me ask you, “What are you smoking?” Donald J. Trump could be construed as the anti-christ if you were so inclined to believe in such things.
I think the MSM and its drive for ratings and profitability to support the Corporate Nation are egregious. Capitalism has proffered the destruction of truth that is supported by fact. News divisions at media conglomerates should not be driven by $$$, but by substantiated fact.
Unless we are educated about how to filter through the maze of propaganda spread daily, we will more than likely see more Trumps whose loose relationship with the truth, honor, and ethics will ultimately give way to our demise.
United in fascism….awesome.
Some of you idiots have watched one too many episodes of “The Americans” and find Russians under every bed, around every corner, behind every door, behind the curtain pulling the strings, and controlling our minds with propaganda from the frigid frozen tundra, but to what ends ? If we are to believe our own countries propaganda and BS, Russia is a country so poor it can barely feed its own citizens, does nothing but sit around eating caviar and drinking vodka , is run by gangsters in dirty leather jackets transporting sex slaves all over the world, and is miraculously the villain in just about EVERY American movie these days.
Every one of those descriptions of Russia and Trump come from zion.
The trotskyite scum are still fighting the bolshevik revolution they lost to Stalin.
Hellary’s backers and loser wmd fake media warmongers now taking their dog and pony show to the brits in their push for war.
Russia ‘intervened to promote Trump’ – US intelligence – BBC News
PressTV-Russia fueling terror threat in UK: MI6
Russia and Assad ‘creating new generation of terrorists who will be threat to us all’, MI6 warns | The Independent
Head of MI6: Britain faces ‘fundamental threat to sovereignty from Russian meddling’
These warmonsters love war now. They dont mind amping things up to crank up the contract even if it means getting your sons and daughters killed. Look what PBS is doing – featuring women marines for combat. sick. Remember, insane Hellary favored drafting women.
i have learned something over the years about dumb people – they get dumber.
This is frightening and a good point to make to others. The UK, most prominently, the self proclaimed ‘impartial and fair’ news from the BBC is awash with this stuff at present.
As barabbas points out, this last few days has seen a massive escalation in the reporting of alleged Russian involvement in the US election, with not one shred of hard evidence being offered. It’s all ‘alleged’, ‘has claimed’, ‘ anonymous sources’ etc and not one question is asked by BBC journalists for verification to these claims.
The last time I witnessed such clear manipulation was the run up to the start of the Iraq War in late 2002-early 2003. The problem is that this time the target is not some ‘walkover’ – it’s Russia.
Journalism in the UK is seriously prompting and leading our citizens down a very dangerous path.
And who owns the media here,Britain and Europe?
Israel.
The nexus of our crisis,since 1948.
i really hope the Brexit Supporters (and all others) understand this and realise that American war defence contractor interests are running a WMD styled scam again – as i see it.
The background for this is that failure of the cash recirculation in the US to support asset valuations for having shipped out the good paying jobs. So now wallstreet is trying to print as much retail credit as possible and banking on Trump to get jobs going. Prior to Trump, their solution was larger wars. Always the money.
Thank you, Glenn Greenwald. Keep up the professionalism in journalism.
Why no mention of the Smith Mundt act?
(Cuz Glenn doesn’t want you to know)
Why did you not capitalize the word, “act”?
Because you’re a little green man from outer space.
Why would Glenn not want anyone to know that the government, led by the Obama Administration, is no longer restricted by law from creating propaganda for domestic audiences? It would bolster is point.
In the news this morning, the CIA is conceding the election to the FSB. This marks the long decline of the CIA, from an organization which could effect regime change at will anywhere in the world to one which can’t even control the outcome of a US presidential election. Fortunately, its admission of failure also marks the first step on the road to recovery. Under Mr. Obama, the CIA became caught up in the game of drones, which is admittedly distracting, and lost focus on intelligence.
The United States will need to up its game, as it has focused exclusively on crowd pleasing offense at the expense of defense. The NSA suddenly doesn’t look so smart with its efforts to make everyone’s e-mail and other electronic communications less secure in order to make it easier to spy on them. The warnings by Mr. Snowden that others could learn to exploit these weaknesses now seem prescient.
I’d write a longer comment, but I don’t want to miss my first class of introductory Russian.
Da! … learn how to say no in Russian http://learnrussian.rt.com/speak-russian/how-say-no-russian
Team Trump responds “these are the same people who said there WMD in Iraq” … referring to U.S. Intelligence agencies!
*I continue to have High Confidence this is like shearing pigs … “there’s a whole lot of squealing, but not much fleece.” h/t rootin tootin Pootin’ a Yankee Doodle Dandy
Interesting article!
It would make one wonder if enough people have been taught what is meant with the words:
“The Reichstag is burning”
The attack on the First Amendment begins.
that’s what i see.
certain inalienable rights?
sure – the GD corporat thieves will get their elected whore to pass a law prohibiting speech in some way and then someone will be prosecuted fined and jailed for breaking that law and that person will say “you cant do that, it is a violation of the first amendment” and the pimped out whores in gov who swore an oath to protect our constitution will respond, “SO SUE US”.
new law
the INALIENABLE RIGHTS PRESERVATION ACT
As greed and corruption seek to cause persons to violate the constitutional rights of the people of the US, and as those persons may also be in positions of power, and as such greed and corruption can become so pervasive as to not be prosecuted, an attack on one person is an attack on all people and as such is tantamount to a declaration of war against the people of the United States of America and as such each and every person, bound by e pluribus unum, is bestowed the right of self defence of the country and may defend that right as s/he sees fit and shall be considered and treated as a hero for doing so.
Follow the money: “The Government Accountability Office said Mr. Obama has added hundreds of PR specialists during his tenure, costing taxpayers about $500 million per year. That’s in addition to $100 million per year spent on private-sector spinmeisters and $800 million spent annually on advertising.”
Fake news deserves to be laid at the doorsteps of all the people and media companies that served operation Mockingbird for decades, e.g., Fox, CNN, NYT, WaPo, etc.
We Americans have been so effectively indoctrinated and relentlessly propagandised for over a century that we subconsciously may not even want to escape from the Edw. Bernays maze.
OMFD, speaking of WaPo’s articles accusing journos of being Russian propagandists, WaPo has published an article complaining that Trump tweeted something nasty about a young woman and she is “still getting death threats.”
Pot? Kettle.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/this-is-what-happens-when-donald-trump-attacks-a-private-citizen-on-twitter/2016/12/08/a1380ece-bd62-11e6-91ee-1adddfe36cbe_story.html?utm_term=.decab82e1cbb
So glad you pointed to this article and the extreme threats pounding down on this woman! Things like this need investigation – just as Conway’s numerous death threats do.
We know from Project Veritas that the DNC & HRC campaign have been paying for active harassment of Trump supporters. Who really is behind these terrible threats all around?
Glenn- could you proceed with your excellent investigate journalism to expose the culprits – whoever they are?!
Project Veritas is not reliable. James O’Keefe is a clown.
Btw, Yves Smith needs funds to help her with her fight against WaPo’s inclusion of Naked Capitalism in its list of Russian propagandists/stooges. In the comments of her most recent post, someone asked her if she needed funds, and she said yes:
“Thanks so much for asking. Yes, since the Post is not backing down and we have more objects of legal attention. While our attorney is representing us pro bono, we still have to fund expenses, and things like depositions (recorder time) and expert witnesses are not cheap.”
She doesn’t seem to have a website set up for donations, but here is here contact info:
http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/contact
I missed this: She has a tip jar in the right column on her main page, or you can go straight to it here:
http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/tip-jar
@ PI
Hopefully First Look Media can contribute. It was my understanding they joined in, or otherwise financially supported Gawker in its Hulk Hogan litigation (unsuccessfully) but this anti-“Russian propaganda journalism blacklist” issue would seem to be more important and consequential to exercise of “free journalism” in both theory and practice. At least, IMHO, more important than the journalism industry’s defense of the “right” to publish sex videos of “public figures” (like washed up professional theatrical wrestlers) on the principle that those sorts of videos are in the “public interest” or otherwise “newsworthy”.
Now given Glenn’s vehement denunciation of the publication of private citizens’ purloined information from certain extra-marital dating sites, not exactly sure how that circle was squared logically, but who cares, so long as this anti-blacklist principle is advanced effectively because to lose on this one would seem way more consequential for a free press.
So, hopefully they will dig deep to defend Naked Capitalism or otherwise assist how they can.
Omidyar’s money vs. Bezos money sounds more like a fair legal fight as opposed to Bezos’ money vs. Yves Smith’s (pseudonym’s money). Although “Ms. Smith” probably has enough to cover Naked Capitalism’s filing fees, court reporter fees, and expert witness fees given her 20 years in M&A and investment banking and the fact she’s got a pro bono attorney and isn’t on the hook for out-of-pocket attorney fees.
tx
Excellent investigative journalism Mr. Greenwald. Every time I get frustrated and hopeless about the state of the press in the us, you remind me real truth reporting does exist. That it rarely occurs is depressing, but responsible authentic journalists such as yourself deserve the highest distinction. You have separated yourself from the rest. No small feat. Keep it up..we are all counting on you to report the realities of the non existent real news condition in america. I will not be satisfied until all of them crash and wither from the dead weight of their own greed and unethical motives. Take all comers Glenn!
“Progressive’s” best talent is a skill of taking their worst fault using propaganda to try to pin it on their opposition. Disgusting.
And then you have fuckers like this talking head on CNN.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7DcATG9Qy_A
the government of by and for the people and owned by the people wherein the people exercise oversight of their government as they see necessary and having suspicion of being robbed of trust did exercise exceptional oversight but who are then accused of being in possession of stolen property they own.
interesting.
when the govt seeks to hide information from the public that the public demands, then those govt people are guilty of hijacking.
This morning all European MSM are spreading fake news about secret reports of some US secret services about Russian intervention to promote Trump….. Thank you very much Wapo and NYTimes ! When is this BS going to stop.
” When is this BS going to stop”
It stopped for us in the Fall of 2001 after we deposited the TV at the dump. Haven’t had our intelligence insulted by the MSM ever since. It’s a lot more effective than complaining like a little school girl.
It’s a discrediting move to have a picture of Maddow as the main, centerfold to this article about MSNBC publishing fake news to discredit wikileaks when there is no evidence in the article that Maddow disseminated fake news. It’s seriously disappointing, and also ironic to post an article giving a seriously false impression while lambasting fake news. I’ve followed your articles since your days at Salon and have always spoke well of your work, but this is embarrassing.
Spot on, well researched piece with all the facts and data trail laid out completly, well done Glenn, that is journalism.
Unfortunatly in a macro sense this article encapsilates anoth problem. One billionaire oligarch mouthpiece media organisation, Omidyar’s intercept, brings the hammer on one billionaire oligarchs mouthpiece media organization, Bezos’s Washington Post.
How did we end up with this? Oh thats right, the establishment media in this country has been feeding us fake news for decades.
Juan Thompson.
Apparently the CIA is working for the Clintons too..
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-election-cyber-russia-idUSKBN13Z05B
More fake news, and continual falsification from the sore losers who cannot respect democracy. The pathetic warmongers that would have profited from taking America into yet another war for profit, through demonizing Russia :
Russia ‘intervened to promote Trump’ – US intelligence BBC News
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-38273933
The intello-liberal-democratic neocons are getting really desperate !
Glenn Greenwood, I admire you and believe you do important work, but I prefer your journalism over your axe grinding.
You can’t say that fake news lacks a clear definition and then immediately assert (citing no data) something as definitive as “those who most loudly denounce Fake News are typically those most aggressively disseminating it.”
You could fairly say, “those who denounce it are also guilty” or even “are perhaps equally guilty.”
But your claim, right there in the opening paragraph, feels like one guy with an axe to grind, which is less than what I’ve come to expect from you.
I have a couple of gay friends who are married and who ferociously supported Hillary. If they thought she was against gay marriage they would have dumped her at a moment’s notice. So when the WikiLeaks revelations about Hillary and gay marriage came out, I called one of them and said “so what do you think about that?”
“Oh it’s lies! The WikiLeaks are fakes! It got exposed on Twitter and MSNBC!”
The fake news that WikiLeaks were forgeries undoubtedly got Hillary more votes than she would have. People I know were pretty much split between those who were following the WikiLeaks and becoming more and more disgusted with the DNC, and those who insisted that the WikiLeaks were just fake propaganda.
Joy Reid —-> TRASH
Progressives ? Corporate Media
Wikileaks political release of the Podesta emails deserves every condemnation, which was a result of interpretation, justified because of the highly unusual timing and mode of release: throughout the entire last month before the election.
It is one thing to release secrete information as its exposure.
It is a completely different matter to use such information as part of a partisan election campaign.
It is hypocritical, and a demagoguery (‘fake news’, as it were), to call the latter a case of the former.
Real news almost always embarrasses the powerful. Why should someone running for president be able to keep secret a speech to a gathering of wealthy supporters who regularly influence public policy. The fact that you don’t like the truth revealed here does not make it false.
the speeches were dud, revealed nothing important.
They revealed Clinton is a puppet of the elite, a major cog in a network devoted to keeping the major financial institutions – those responsible for wreaking systemic havoc and entrenching inequality – in control. The fact that she was paid more than handsomely to do little more than stand and flatter this corrupt institution indicates rather obviously that GS were expecting a return on their investment. This is important, as it shows someone much more devoted to the ruling class than a statesperson should be.
Trump *is* a member of the ruling class and has shown no indication of sincerely challenging the status quo.
Under Trump’s regime, we Americans are going to be bent over and fisted by Big Business like never before.
Heck, we may end up driving ourselves to the nearest FEMA camp – oops, they don’t exist – darn fake news!
That’s just because you don’t want to work.
a fellow businessman i knew told me the secret to profitable business that depends on fisting people was having a good supply of grease.
If that’s true,why the assault on Donald Trump by the media?
Is it a mirage.or can you possibly believe,that these serial lying zioscum have our best interests at heart?
And the business of America is business,at least that was the truth before Trump,did you think he’s communist?
You think Hillary’s admission of having a “public policy” and a “private policy” is a nothing burger? This coupled with her campaign’s goal of keeping people ignorant so as to be manageable speaks volumes as to what kind of people they are. Certainly not people I want holding the levers of power in my country!
The word partisan means “a firm adherent to a party, faction, cause, or person; especially : one exhibiting blind, prejudiced, and unreasoning allegiance” (Merriam-Webster). You are misusing the word in connection with Assange, who certainly didn’t like Clinton but expressed no political preference for Trump – indeed, he didn’t expect Trump to win at all, and probably just wanted to deflate Clinton’s self-importance as much as possible before what seemed to be her inevitable coronation.
Not everyone who disliked Clinton had a partisan agenda, they just couldn’t stand her and didn’t trust her; many voted against Trump for non-partisan reasons also – repelled by his flirtations with hideously inflammatory rhetoric, for example, or his perceived bigotry. The binary thinking of “If you’re not with us you’re with the other side” is the idiocy of George W. Bush writ large in the culture, and although the media (both mainstream and much of the alternative press) would love to arrange all activism into the tidy dualist pictures they seem to be addicted to, this is definitely not going to be the case for someone as well-informed about both sides of the corrupt duopoly as Julian Assange.
That Trump’s people grafted onto WikiLeaks is no sign of Assange reciprocating an allegiance, any more than Ron Paul pointing out that Jill Stein’s foreign policy was superior meant Dr. Paul was endorsing the Green Party.
Absolute hogwash. Elections have ALWAYS been about “exposing” the candidate you want to lose. Every single election campaign in modern history has had its fair share of exposes and revelations designed to hurt a particular candidate. Do you really think what WikiLeaks was doing was any worse than the mainstream media gleefully reporting on Gloria Allred’s pathetic parade of opportunist women with unsubstantiated claims of being groped by Trump? At least the WikiLeaks emails were solid, tangible proof.
Proof for what?
The corruption and crimes of the Clintons needed to be revealed and Wikileaks did an amazing job of presenting the truth to expose the Clintons for what they are. Wikileaks should be commended for helping to prevent what would have been a catastrophe for America and the World. Just like Brexit the political elites and their criminalised mafioso governments have only themselves to blame.
Does it ever occur to you that if the Podestas of the world weren’t such vile dipshits, Wikileaks could have revealed…nothing?
You are obviously on the side of the dipshits.
Sucks to be you.
The style of this article is as beautiful as a bonsai tree carved out of jade, all facts and romps and elegance.
Best article ever.
It will be studied for decades to come.
Putting aside the impossibility of definitively acting in a manner which defies definition, Fake News is what everyone practices.
Everyone!
Sometime after 911 and long before the 2003 invasion of Iraq, a news story on the front page of the New York Times dramatically announced that police arrested a taxi driver of smuggling 24 pounds of enriched uranium, (maybe plutonium) presumably bound for Saddam Hussein.
“Interesting” I thought to myself.
I followed the story.
Some time later, a small article on an inner page of the front section of the NYTimes described the suspected plutonium as actually being lead.
I haven’t googled this story. I retell it completely from memory. Today, in retrospect, I think my immediately thought should have been, “looks like someone’s trying to frame Saddam Hussein” rather than (as I recall) “uh oh. dirty bomb material.”)
Long afterwards, the Fake News story of Hussein’s attempt to acquire yellowcake uranium from Niger blazed across the our Newstopia. Even though this story was quickly denounced by Hans Blix and the AEIA as based on forged documents, the headlines blared, leaving the intended impression.
Subsequently Talking Points Memo tracked this story to a dead-end at the doors of the Italian spy agency SISMI. Later Joe Wilson would publish the “truth” in a Washington Post editorial — whereupon his wife Valerie Plame … well, everyone knows the various versions of that story.
Again, I recall this from memory.
Two points.
1. Actual Fake News isn’t about sowing facts. It’s about planting impression. In both cases, the threat Saddam Hussein posed served to justify the Iraq invasion. The facts were irrelevant which is why, I suppose, there hasn’t been a conscientious effort to uncover the sources of the pre-war disinformation campaign.
2. When an editor selects a story — any story — he/she selects a narrative … a series of cultural impressions that reinforce (or undermine) that narrative. This is especially virulent during a campaign. (Remember newstopia debunking the story of thousands of Muslims in New Jersey cheering on 911? People inclined to xenophobia remember the impression even after Trump’s memory was challenged and proved deficient.)
The impression remains long after the facts have vanished.
In this way, all news is Fake News. That was the entire premise of the Daily Show that ran for over a decade. We do not build our reality — individually or collectively — based on facts.
We humans build our reality based on manifold impressions. The media — newstopia — acts like a sort of mirror, (a grossly distorting funhouse mirror) reflecting those impressions and twisting them to various purposes — flattery, fear, anger, enthusiasm.
The more a story is reinforced from non-contingent sources (see product placements for example), the more impressionistic weight it carries; the less so, the less it contributes to the global impression.
Even though we name chocolate chip cookies by their definitive chips, really chocolate chip cookies made of sugar, flour, eggs and water. The chocolate chips, like facts in the news, are for marketing purposes rather than nutritional value.
It shouldn’t be this way, but it is.
I don’t know why anyone would expect credibility with their milk and cookies news.
Exactly the way I see it too., Milton.
I feel very lonely amongst my leftie friends.
I don’t know why anyone would expect credibility with their milk and cookies news. […]
It shouldn’t be this way, but it is.
So, because we will always be dealing with deceit in our news media, and have always dealt with it, and will likely have to continue to deal with it, we should never expect, nor seek, the truth? That’s a hella assumption, milton.
Where your analogy to chocolate chip cookies falls short, is that it’s the recipe for the cookies, where you can inspect the ingredients yourself, are readily available. WRT the sorts of news distortions we see, have seen and will continue to see, it’s a bit more complicated and I for one appreciate the fact that there are still journalists out there who make an effort to extract the truth and who expose facts so that we can make more informed decisions about what’s being presented to us in our cookies.
I’ll trust M. Nance any day of the week over J. Assange. When it comes to the “black arts”, I’ll trust Nance’s ability to see the entire playing field over what J. Assange serves up as the pure gospel.
The Pure Gospel
MSNBC Must Save Nixons Black Cousin…2008 – 2012
MSNBC Make “Snowden” a Nihilistic Bipolar Criminal…2013
MSNBC Make(Sure) Sanders Never Beats Clinton…2014-2016
“In 2016, Nance urged readers to be skeptical of Podesta emails leaked by WikiLeaks, writing that the documents were “riddled with obvious forgeries” and were black propaganda “not even professionally done” and arguing that the even if all the emails were authentic, WikiLeaks’ excerpts of the emails were posted to Twitter in a way that distorted their meaning.”
One of the unacceptable faces of capitalism is the propaganda industry, personified by Martin Sorrell and his friends. It is of course lucrative to an extraordinary extent as its practitioners offer to exonerate us from our own public acts of evil. Its not unlike the confessional except the priest requires ‘hail Marys” whilst the Propagandists wants cash
If we were really concerned to maintain a just and honorable society in the hope that others might join us and create a following large enough to form the nucleus of world government, it would be fundamental policy to ensure that PR people are rejected, cast out of society, until they change their ways.
“If we were really concerned to maintain a just and honorable society in the hope that others might join us and create a following large enough to form the nucleus of world government, …”
hmmm, world government?
> “One of the unacceptable faces of capitalism….”
Zzzz.
One of the unacceptable faces of capitalism? Name one non-capitalist country in modern history which hasn’t maintained its totalitarian, undemocratic hold on power with a huge, well oiled propaganda machine.
Name one Capitalist country in modern history which hasn’t maintained it’s totalitarian, undemocratic hold on power without a huge, well oiled propaganda machine.
The #1 source of Fake News has always been the Fox “News” Channel.
Fox is just the most obvious, but all the cable news is guilty. Calling a winner is simply impossible.
A truism- if a liberal ever accuses anyone of something illegal, immoral, unethical or just plain bad- you can be SURE the liberal has already done it himself!
All most 100% true!
Larry Craig and Danny Hastert sitting in a tree…Chris Browns Conservative Family…
I came to this article belatedly, and it is a great piece of investigative journalism. Mr. Greenwald should be commended for calling out these perpetrators of fake news, and it is up to us all to continue to aggressively call out these journalistic charlatans.
This is a true tweet!
Both can be true, but thus far we only have evidence supporting item No. 2.
And what do they mean by “interfered in?” Merely hacking and releasing emails is not interfering in an election in the manner of, say, this.
Pure genius!
With all due respect, I would like to use your logic with my taxes. Since Trump pays no taxes, then neither should I. My tax bill is a billion dollars less than Trump’s unpaid bill.
Right?
Going forward, let me ask what future acts by Putin do the following justify?
Hiroshima.
Nagasaki.
Japanese internment camps.
Lynchings during the Jim Crow era.
The theft of Native American property, culture, and lives.
The appropriation of territory through wars like the Mexican War and the Spanish American war.
The assassination of Anwar Al-alwaki and his son.
Have at it Mona.
What acts can Putin commit that you will defend by citing previous American crimes?
What past acts by Wilson, Harding, Coolidge, Hoover, Roosevelt, Truman, Eisenhower, Kennedy, Johnson, Nixon, Ford, Carter, Reagan, Bush, Clinton, Bush and Obama would a successful Hillary Clinton campaign have justified?
When Milt gets his Soviet and Russian Federation Leadership holiday season swimsuit calendar (featuring Lenin, Stalin, Malenkov, Khruschev, Brezhnev, Andropov, Chernenko, Gorbachev, Yeltsin, Putin, Medvedev, Putin) that’ll get his yule log burning.
No matter what you say, feel or think about HRC, she would have been a much better president than the orange. If only the media, including the intercept, had exposed the orange for what he is we may be living in a safer future world.
To: douchka nikolic
Did you really mean this “…living in a safer future world.”? Please, tell me this is sarcasm at its best.
If only the media, including the intercept, had exposed the orange for what he is we may be living in a safer future world.
The Intercept covered Trump heavily during the election. This isn’t a comprehensive list, but if you start with anything written by Bob Mackey in the weeks and months preceding voting day, you will see how wrong your assumption is vis-avis TI.
https://theintercept.com/staff/robertmackey/
Mahalo for taking on this issue Glenn. We were always supposed to be skeptical, consider the source, and beware of false flags, but it has gotten more intensely devious and mainstream lately. Real journalism lives here at The Intercept.
Thank God we still have profesional, REAL journalists here. I’m a Trump supporter, but still want to hold him accountable. So instead, I have to take Breitbart and NYT, and then find somewhere in the middle. But you all are pretty spot on. Keep going!
And this “fake news” agenda is a lie itself. This is about censorship, and anyone who can’t see this is being willfully deceived.
I complain quite loudly about Fake News, and am not guilty of spreading it.
Glenn should focus on reportage, and not media criticism.
On the topic of “fake news” and its purveyors, time to remind one and all of this “best of” The Onion, a hilarious bit that never gets old: TIME Announces New Version Of Magazine Aimed At Adults
Don’t worry Glenn Greenwald. No one is buying it. Have you seen the polls of how the majority of Americans do not trust the MSM anymore?! How NYT is losing 15mil a quarter! They peed on us and told us it was raining too long. It’s pee. We know it and hate them.
Glen you said “…that is a direct threat to democracy.” isn’t it more like “a direct threat to what little of a democracy we have left.”
When my wife and I bother to listen to the corporate media or politicians we simply do it so we can count the lies, identify the distractions, and figure out what new lie they are setting up.
If you love your family to avoid their indoctrination to blind patriotism, worship of consumerism, and exposure to what they should naturally repel disconnect your fool’s tube.
Will someone tell me again how HRC’s loss was all her own fault?
Secret CIA assessment says Russia was trying to help Trump win White House
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/obama-orders-review-of-russian-hacking-during-presidential-campaign/2016/12/09/31d6b300-be2a-11e6-94ac-3d324840106c_story.html?utm_campaign=pubexchange&utm_medium=referral&utm_source=huffingtonpost.com&utm_term=.cf28cae6c570
FBI dusts off its new and improved rug pulling tools, just in time for a presidential election
source? we don’t need no stinkin’ sources for that one
yoo hoo! Mooonnnaaaa
Wow, the CIA! They’ve never been accused of subterfuge or interfering in elections. Oh, wait…
I’ll let some folks in the rust belt — which she ignored, and which she lost — tell you for me. CNN’s Van Jones Speaks With Obama Voters Who Switched To Trump, my emphasis:
interesting stuff
It’s pathetic seeing someone type in a CIA evidence free anonymous sourced report and then howl with celebratory animal sounds believing they’ve nailed the God’s Fucking Truth to poke at their imaginary enemies.
How many more years do you think it will take before you might learn not to take anonymous “Intelligence sources” at their word? Do you also believe everything cops tell you in their murder reports and their torture and abuse reports?
Me? I only believe what the facts tell me. I’m an empiricist. No blinders. Grade A shit detector, this guy.
You don’t like your fav narrative getting jammed? Sorry.
There’s no intel.
There’s no sources
There’s no nuthin’
… Hell! Donald Trump didn’t actually invite Russia to hack the government did he?
What a goddamned surprise when they actually did!
and to think, I should have checked with Kitt before running off at my mouth.
Thanks for saving me.
You do realize it is completely legal (since 2012) for the Intelligence Community to release propaganda within the USA, targeting American Citizens? Regardless, Julian exists due to the failure of the MSM to fulfill their trust responsibilities in reporting truth so as to have an informed citizenry. I say thank God for WikiLeaks!
Look – a fine example of fake news.
That the corporate media felt it proper to add the projected superdelegates to the pledged tally throughout the primary campaign starting with the Iowa caucus, says so much about their misguided motives. NYT, LAT, WaPo, CNN, ABC, even NPR (who later apologized) -virtually all of the major news players, mislead and misinformed the public about how close the race actually was. And don’t forget AP’s false claim on the day before the CA primary that HRC had already “wrapped up” the nomination that all these same bogus journalists ran with, knowing it was false.
Yeah, you Putin lover. You’re intentionally ignoring the Russian connection.
Obama’s new investigation will have heads on a chopping block, so look out.
This is surprising to no one, Clinton and her camp lie and spread false news/info…she would never do that: email server, Benghazi, All the “vast” right wing conspiracies, verbally attacking all the women that accused Bill of sexual misdeeds, her bout with “pneumonia”, etc, etc, etc
Thank you Glenn for being what I deem to be the LAST real mainstream media journalist. The human race is in the midst of a devolution. We are regressing and moving backward to our reptilian brain instincts. Our culture has become base. There are millions of exceptions but not many in the media I’m afraid. Thank you for being a rebel. Thank you for speaking truth to power. Thank you for your courage. All my best mate. G
Mr. Greenwald
There is so much at stake in elections that media outlets are more than willing to promote false stories to ensure the candidate of their choice is elected. This is just one more line of evidence that discredits the “advocacy journalism” model which you continue to support. However, that is not the main story of this election (besides the election of the idiot, Trump).
First of all, WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange released information damaging to Hillary Clinton simply because he opposed her candidacy. He used the power of his position to purposely influence the results of a democratic election. The release by Assange had nothing to do with exposing the truth – and was entirely politically-motivated . As Naomi Klein said in an interview conducted by you (Naomi Klein):
“……..This is why I say I’m nervous. I’m not comfortable with anybody wielding this much power [Assange]……I am not comfortable when it’s states, but I’m also not comfortable when it’s individuals or institutions. I don’t like people making decisions based on vendettas because the message it sends is: “If you cross me, this could happen to you.” That’s a menacing message to send. …….” – Naomi Klein
You have not criticized WikiLeaks in any articles you have released for publication for Assange’s attempt to influence a US election. Second, the US intelligence community said with a high degree of confidence that the Russians hacked the DNC specifically to influence the elections toward an outcome they desired. Now German intelligence is suggesting that same possibility in the 2017 German elections. The same disinformation campaign and hacking experienced in the US is present in the Germany elections (al-Jazeera; BfV: “Russia is trying to destabilise Germany” @AJENews http://aje.io/8l78):
Russia is trying to destabilise German society with propaganda and cyber attacks ahead of the country’s general election, according to Germany’s domestic intelligence agency…….Thursday’s warning was the bluntest public claim yet from Germany’s BfV agency about Moscow’s alleged campaign of disinformation and hacking targeting Europe’s biggest economy………”There is growing evidence of attempts to influence the federal election next year,” said Hans-Georg Maassen, head of the BfV, citing “increasingly aggressive cyber……..The goal of the effort was to spread uncertainty in society; “to weaken or destabilise the Federal Republic of Germany”; to strengthen extremist groups and parties; to complicate the work of the federal government; and to influence political dialogue……”
You are ignoring the most important aspect of this past election cycle i.e., the Russian connection. Additionally, every aspect of the post-election journalism by the US media indicates advocacy journalism is potentially very dangerous to the health of democracy.
Man oh man, those Russkies–under every bed, in every newsroom, busy right now–right now!–tryin’ to get the designated hitter rule into the NL, and busy (very busy!) hiding Trump’s sex ring connection. You be tough, and keep it real, and keep an eye open, and check under your bed.
Hits or bunts?Or the double switch?I’ll take the DH,but I’m sure purists won’t.
Bud Selig in the HOF?You gotta be kidding.Another corrupt pos.
Assange thought Clinton couldn’t lose, like most people, and he had every right to throw whatever he had at the Clinton/MSM juggernaut. Everyone was already pointing out Trump’s faults, not realizing perhaps that to a certain part of the population those bullying and dismissive traits were seen as strengths.
The Deep State evidently decided Clinton was actually madder than Trump, probably due to her doubling-down on the crazy “let’s war with Russia” nonsense, and gave Donald the job (yes, I believe the election was rigged, BY THE ESTABLISHMENT, even though I happen to agree Clinton is psychotic and needed stopping) – so now he’s trying to be as conventional as his arrogance will allow so as to keep the elite sweet (the Deep State may yet throw him away, to be replaced probably by another Republican unless Clinton can convince the elite she’s not mad after all; it’s hard to predict).
The “Russia interfering with the election” canard is being kept alive by the establishment – possibly just to intimidate Trump into toeing the line – yet I’ve seen no convincing evidence of it whatsoever. But I rarely believe anything the government says, personally, whichever face it decides to wear.
Maisie (did I spell it right?)
“…..The Deep State evidently decided Clinton was actually madder than Trump, probably due to her doubling-down on the crazy “let’s war with Russia” nonsense, and gave Donald the job (yes, I believe the election was rigged,……”
I take the opposite view. There are powerful interests in the US – like oil companies, the military industrial complex, Wall Street and so on. Some people (like Mona) would include the “Israel” lobby. No one can doubt their influence to a certain extent on policy. However, my guess would be that the preference of powerful interests would be stability over uncertainty. Trump represents uncertainty at best. The election of Trump was a lot like Brexit which powerful interests certainly opposed.
The establishment could not have opposed Trump any more than they did (outside of assassinating him) which included establishment Republicans and, of course, the Democrat Party and the media (for the most part). There was intense opposition to Trump once they realized he was gaining momentum. The election of Trump was a people’s revolution directly conflicting with the establishment just like Brexit, Occupy Wall Street and the Tea Party movements. Don’t get me wrong. Trump is a nut case, but he was the vehicle used for change by the people. Bernie Sanders and Trump should actually give you some hope that change is possible just by marking a ballot. That’s democracy working (somewhat) like it was meant to. Yea, I know. Trump is a corrupt multi-billionaire who made (earned?) his money using the system. We will see what shakes out of his Presidency.
Why do I suspect you have no problem with nearly all MSM’s attempt to manipulate the election results for 18 months straight? Tell me I’m wrong…
No, I think you are right. That’s is their prerogative and right. I don’t believe it is good policy, however. And I certainly don’t believe that fake news (i.e., lying) is a legitimate part of the process.
Thanks.
If you ask me, NBC produces more fake news than any of those fake news out let’s. So far every fake news story has come from a Clinton supporter. If the Clinton campaign wanted to discredit Wikileaks. Why didn’t they release the real email transcript? I will tell you why, Wikileaks was right.
The most sensible attitude is to regard supporters of either major Party as particularly suspect, for most of them will obviously believe anything which supports them.
Everyone has an agenda, but it is the Republicans and Democrats who (often unwittingly) serve the agenda of the Deep State – America’s contribution to worldwide elite corruption, an institutionalized evil barely able to control its more megalomaniac elements (like Hillary Clinton and Michael Flynn).
What the establishment needs most of all in terms of News is to control what the populace thinks of the system itself – for if citizens’ dissatisfaction can not be directed toward one of the two parties or just plain apathy, it will be directed (rightly) at the actual oligarchy or Powers That Be behind the duopoly’s charade. Sowing distrust of all anti-establishmentarianism under a single umbrella is a path to doing this, one which seems to be underway.
Indeed, now Trump’s supporters are basking in the glow of victory, claiming a victory over the establishment just as grand as Obama fans in 2008 revelled in the false dawn of a New Age – and very few News outlets are capable of (or financed for) seeing the pathetic nature of both “successes,” most falling instead into blinkered criticism of the other side’s gullibility and corruption only.
In sum, the establishment is still firmly in control, in fact with both Obama and Trump the dreadful normalizing of a permanently at war/permanently surveilled/permanently unequal society is almost complete, the only “objectors” loud enough to be heard being those dutifully corralled into supporting the system’s Republicans or Democrats. The Deep State continues to order that the status quo be essentially unchanged, dealing with its internal factional strifes and script-deviators as they arise – confident that no one is really messing with their stuff.
So just look out for partisans, those who criticize only ‘liberal establishment’ or only ‘conservative establishment,’ and consider everything they say as potentially a lie. That’s how to deal with the worst of the problem of “fake news,” and much political talk in general, in my opinion.
Basking in the glow of victory?Who?McCain and Graham,calling for FBI investigation of their parties POTUS for Russian connections?
The victory is being denied by the Trotskyite scum illiberal zionists,who are producing massive disinfo to overturn Americas liberation from zion,and all their whores are on board.
… or as the founding fathers labeled them, FACTION. A small group promoting their own good at the expense of the common good. And usually claiming to promote the common good. Have never understood party loyalists, when it is absolutely clear the parties are only interested in promoting/protecting themselves.
It is dangerous, and Orwellian, and tyrannical.
I do not think, however, we need worry too much over it. Until and unless they activate the internet kill switch, they will have great difficulty getting the genie of truth back into its bottle.
if the news is fake and it can be seen to endanger people directly or indirectly, why does it have the right of free speech? what is the difference to crying fire in a crowded movie theater? isn’t that fake news?
Thank You Glenn. You deserve a Pulitzer hands down. We need more of you.
Excellent stuff as always, keep ’em coming!
It’s a simple, simple formula:
MSM=leftists=democrats=lying propagandists.
Pointing out the MSM’s hateful deceit is like pointing out that the sun is very hot.
Everyone knows this. Defeat them and American liberty and prosperity remains secure. Problem solved.
Great article! Last night Tucker Carlson grilled Congressman Schiff because Schiff claims there is proof the Russians are behind the Podesta email hack. Total BS propagands.
schiff is a fake a fony and a farce, what a con
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HDtvYHOY_Uc
… it’s spelt Congressman Schiff >>> pronounced Congressman Shill
ASK ANY COMPUTER SCIENCE OR ENGINEER: WikiLeaks verified authentic: Hillary’s team uses “hillaryclinton.com”, which as DKIM enabled. DKIM uses a SHA-256 cryptographic hash to create a unique ID for the content of the email. If the content were altered, the ID would not match and the email would be flagged as “Invalid” by all common email clients.
So ANYONE saying the emails were “altered” is an OUTRIGHT LIAR. The only other option is that Russia manufactured all 60,000+ emails with correct email addresses and associations AND with the correct personal phrasings and wording such that the emails are not apparent even to the people involved that they are not out and out fakes (all 60,000+).
Pizzagate is real. Somebody please investigate.
Oh, they will, but right now they’re too busy investigating ‘Russiandopegate’ because they know that a ‘true’ verdict will be an easier sell for that.
Pizzagate is pernicious, dangerous bullshit. As I explain further in comments below.
Ya know, this sex ring stuff is one thing, but why in God’s name does the suffix “-gate” have to be appended to every scandal’s name? Goddamnit. A sign of laziness and stupidity to be sure.
Yeah, it’s weird. I mean, it wasn’t the ‘Water’ scandal. If it happened now they’d call it Watergategate.
… yawn … (scratches arse)
…. hmmm, what should we call this “every scandal’s name” phenomena ???
how about NameGate or ScandalGate … i know >>> EveryScandalNameGate
… or (for you Maisie) EveryScandalNameGateGate
couldn’t have anything to do with the word investiGATE could it?
How about, no?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_scandals_with_%22-gate%22_suffix
Send all the relevant information (such as it is) to a Private Detective, if you are genuinely concerned and can afford one. Investigative reporters can only do so much in the case of such seriously libelous accusations.
Check out David Seaman on youtube.
Unfortunate name for someone regarding this subject.
I wouldn’t put anything past these serial lying criminals,including pedophilia,unlike our gullible moderator.Why does she automatically defend these creeps?
The track record of these people is filled with criminality,which leads to logical conclusions.
Come on! You’re ignoring the fact that Eichenwald’s own words were reported AS WikiLeaks’ words in Sputnik. They took the post down, sure, but you’re attacking his pointing out this flaw as if he were still claiming WL fabricated the email instead of Sputnik. He climbed down from that position within hours. Continuing to crucify him for something he corrected isn’t very new media of you.
As for the rest, well, exactly.
The closing plea against censorship and suppression I fully agree with. However, it’s important to note that this is not an isolated case: the moment this “fake news” stuff came up, we see this: http://www.computerworld.com/article/3144353/internet/facebook-said-to-create-censorship-tool-to-enter-china-again.html Cracking down on “spreading false rumors online” has been a Chinese priority since 2011, and the implementation of that and the implementation of anti fake news action in the U.S. are closely related.
I flicked on Faux this morning and Eric Bolling was given Trump credit for Carrier, Ford, and Apple.
It’s one thing to try to counter the daily lies from prez-elect, but for nobody anywhere to report the facts (include Faux, where I am looking to see how Megan Kelly comports herself) is disheartening, disgusting, and worth a revolt.
Watched the same thing on C-SPAN with Anders Fogh Rasmussen (and wrote him on FB) and some slanted crap coming from Clint Watts.
Some of the host/journalists ask good questions, but the show is styled to let people call in. Some nail it, some don’t, and others don’t get through. (I haven’t yet contacted Watts, but I will.)
Call he/her/them out whenever and wherever you see/hear it.
What else can we do?
Making a wild bet/guess here – Trump is wooing some high-ranking Dem Senator (Armed Services Committee) for Sec’y State. Takers????
HashTag Hold the Lying Liars Responsible.
oops – “was giving” or had given.
If you accept the (clearly true) thesis that having an INFORMED (as in having a clear picture of what the facts are) electorate is the foundation of democracy, then you should realize that the founding fathers of the US didn’t believe the US had, or would ever have, such a foundation.
Even without the racist bias being added to it, the whole electoral college set up was a declaration by Washington, Jefferson etc that they knew that the vast majority of the American public of the time, and as far as they could see into the future, were gullible, resistant to fact based argument, and absolutely convinced that the opposite was true. The irony is that the very mechanism they came up with as a safeguard against a President who both capitalized on that fallacy and wholeheartedly embraced it personally handed it to the candidate who embraces it most passionately.
This is a surprise to exactly nobody. They did the same thing to “discredit” Trump and anybody else they don’t like.
Is this article fake?
Found myself listening to Rush this morning.
He was railing against the Post and Times. I listened…
Still the most reliable and informative journalist writing today. Thanks Glenn.
She is still trying to pretend that “Russia” hacked the emails, as is the DNC and the various NSA, CIA et al agencies, all while actual cyber security companies who have access to the main star distribution nodes have examined the logs and proclaimed that the suggestion that “Russia” was involved is pure BS.
Security experts who actually work in the field traced the crack to Russian criminals operating within Russia, the right wing “Democrats” are trying to pretend that it was “Russian State actors” which cyber companies are saying is utter BS.
Yes, isn’t it awful that institutions who purport to be credible news sources would attempt to censor and/or suppress facts and/or opinions that do not readily comport with their own ideological bias? Now who would have the temerity to engage in such unethical behavior (MONA HOLLAND). What is it that Christians say about the mote in ones own eye?
Karl, the few days Mona Holland was off sulking were so peaceful around here. The comments were more civil, people being allowed to say what they wanted, no one telling us what we all should think about the news and about each other.
Mona Holland is the worst thing about the Intercept apart from the occasional fake news published here. The latter always gets exposed, the former not so much unfortunately.
I totally agree. However, Mona never really went away; rather she skulked around using various avatars in an attempt to generate interest in her own absence. Quite pathetic really.
Poor MSM (formerly). They suppressed, spun, and outright lied to prop up the clintons and the smarmy leftists in general that they have irretreivably lost all credibility with the American public. “The times, they are a changing” and this time for the better. The former msm is in the process of joining the dinosaurs.As the old saying goes, “when you lay down with dirty dogs, you’re bound to get fleas.”
The MSM did their best to doctor Hillary’s image, but her statements, the release of emails, the Wikileaks treasure trove of DNC and Podesta machinations prevented the propaganda from convincing enough voters. Hillary’s folks couldn’t smear enough lipstick on the plastic porcine.
Trump is raw meat. He cooked his image to represent the forgotten tradespeople, vowed to fix broken immigration mess, and railed against poorly negotiated trade agreements where the U.S. appears to be the only country not levying VATs on imported goods. His bragging transgressions regarding women in his world of groupies and sycophants were weighed against Billy Jeff Clinton’s predatory acts compounded with Hillary’s enabling damage control machine.
The Democratic party and the compliant MSM are hawking a passe, social justice, economic spoils agenda as successful as the Venezuelan Maduro gang, imposing a neo-moral paradigm upending that persecutes traditional mores, and continuing the “blame America”, appease our foes foreign policy schtick which foments chaos in the long run. Trump had one thing in common with Obama by opposing the Iraq War, but Hillary was all over the map coordinating with polls and pols.
Thank God for the internet, radio, and cable media for breaking up the hegemony of the MSM. The facts have a way of winning over PC in the end. One good thing about a Trump era is that unfettered debate will commence.
Find the Omnivore, put a bullet in his head for impersonating another for financial gain.
Let us not forget the “the chairs thrown” fake story started by a tweet from Jon Ralston at the Nevada State Democratic convention and follow-up stories from him. Problem was he wasn’t even there at the time to witness what didn’t happen. This created the “violent” bernie followers meme that spread across the country and convinced many to look for violence at the coming Philly convention. I still believe there is more to this story then what was reported.
the one word that stood out was hypocrisy! i think she would have lost even without the emails but they did serve a purpose it showed the voters the corruption on going between the democratic party and the msm! i don’t know if it was the russians or just some pimply faced kid on a laptop or desk top it showed the truth for the first time of how democrats work with help from the msm! team deplorable
Dear comment authors, Reading these comments I can almost literally see your echo chambers. There has to be room for civilized fact based dialogue. That’s the whole point of The Intercept. My only other comment is that I hope this article reaches more people
Another great expose. Thanks Glenn.
saw this after my initial post and couldn’t help but think of the collective conniptions over the “pizza gate shooter” and what dangers he portends:
http://www.timesofisrael.com/idf-map-of-hezbollah-positions-revealed-as-fabrication/
but then i’ve always given IDF statements the same level of credibility as stories of pizza parlor eyes wide shut kiddie porn parties. maybe less, actually.
That IDF map … wow. They put a bunch of identical patterns of dots all over the map, show it to every diplomat, have it in the press, and the way it is exposed is that eventually … somebody noticed the dots are the same. I mean, it’s not like there’s a free press or a guerilla press running around checking if there are really Hezbollah positions. Every single one of us is as good a fact checker as the worldwide free press will ever come up with, if given two or three months to think about it.
As for Eyes Wide Shut stories, it’s not hard at all for me to imagine that there are Franklin conspiracies and Westminster dossiers out there … the part that needs close checking is whether it’s true anyone KNOWS about them or we HEAR about them. Because the press we have telling us this stuff… it’s the press that might eventually check the dots on an IDF illustration.
The American people knew all
Along the msm was lying for Clinton. Their absurdly partisan support for her was a major liability. We aren’t stupid. Thise who think so are.
Why even argue with them over it? The Democrats will be gone after the Spring Purge anyway, so there is no use in stressing out over nothing for the next couple of months…
I am going to be laughing for at least the next four years!!! Message to everyone of you libs….SUCK IT UP!! You lost because you are losers. HAHAHAHAHA
Apparently, so will comedians audiences as they make fun of Trump week after week of the silly, crazy, stupid things he does.
Enjoy.
stupid things like enforce the laws of this great nation? stupid like not taking shit from leaders of other countries? stupid like creating jobs?stupid like hiring people in his administration that are strangers to him and qualified to fulfill their responsibilities?
does not matter if he does what he says and the country prospers you proper along with all americans! here is the difference between obama and trump, for 2 years carrier had told everyone they were moving to mexico, all trump did was make a call to carrier and the governor and they worked out a deal to keep at least 1000 jobs so families will have a great christmas, obama never gave one bit of effort or cared for 2 years and all he had to was make a call! see what i mean?
Sounds great, besides the fact Trump lied about the number of jobs, it was under a thousand, and the company is still moving some jobs over seas, and to save the 800 jobs a company worth more than a billion dollars is getting millions of dollars in tax incentives. Bravo to Trump
Everybody involved with it says it is around 1100, but whatever. Is there something about tax incentives to keep jobs in Indiana that you think is bad? I’m going to go out on a limb and guess your reason for being unhappy about it doesn’t have anything to do with economics.
Thats just what children do!…. You made butt ugly yuks about Bush for 8 yrs, why would we expect anything different now….The behavior of most left of center people has been nothing but childish.
that’s okay. Don’t feel bad. Each of them deserved it. I personally did the same for Obama too. It’s rather humorous that you would equate pointing out the truth of a politicians behavior as ‘childish’.
How very mature of you.
This is not a partisan issue,as the shrub was the exact same as Obomba,a warmongering idiot under the influence of ziocrazies.
Trump was opposed by the shrub and his crowd btw.
Wow, nice support from anti-Semitic conspiracy theorists. You’re as disgusting as David Brock.
I guarantee every one of the crummy hypocrite comedians careers are going to take a hit.
They are all mona clones,divide and conquer America haters,and I’m sure the audience clones will still flock to hear the BS from the ziowhores,whose careers are ziofunded.
Seems to me that the suckers who he roped in with his disingenuous ‘drain the swamp’ bullshit are the real losers, before he has served ao much as a single minute in office
#BlackPropagandaMatters, amirite?
as with any story, it all comes down to that recently overused term: “confirmation bias”. i only knew this was a “thing” when i saw clips of bill maher throwing a tantrum in his monologue as well as chief “comedian” bootlicker colbert throwing it in to his increasingly painful “jokes”. it seems you’d only be exposed to this and other pro-clinton nonsense if you watch pro-clinton media. anyone taking MSNBC seriosuly is too far gone to worry about and ditto for WaPo and NYT. their biases and agendas absolutely ooze from the screen as much as any goofy alex jones piece or fox news rant.
in any cased, most MSM “news” is fake. the only difference i can note from any other period is a preference for commission over omission. it used to be enough to ignore libya or syria’s cooperation with the CIA’s black sites. when that isn’t enough we’re led to believe the “syrian rebels” are a rag-tag band of home grown secular feminist heroes fighting with only their wits and TOW missiles they had lying around the house. like the A-Team if A stood for Arab.
russia “invaded” ukraine and crimea. if we hadn’t bailed out wall street in 2008/9 the economy was “doomed”. we “won” in iraq and willfully “withdrew”. warren and sanders are “progressives”. clinton was a “feminist” who “struggled” her entire life (thanks to patton oswalt and/or lena dunham for that side splitter). everything that happens in latin america occurs in a socialist vacuum and can only be fixed by dropping copies of “atlas shrugged” from the sky.
and the list goes on. all of which becomes accepted because most people are too busy with their shitty pointless lives and their horrible jobs and families to parse every article they read or every serious-faced report on CNN. maybe when this “fourth industrial revolution” happens and AI takes all their jobs they’ll finally have the free time to wade through the context of all these subjects.
There is a clear definition of ‘Fake News’ aka News Satire that most everyone understands or used to understand before it was co-opted : examples are The Onion and Andy Borowitz. The co-opting of the words ‘Fake News’ for an entirely different purpose and agenda is what is troubling.
People know that journalists and “experts” lie to further their agenda. They judge what they read by the quality of the lies that are presented. Is the author stating obvious lies that insult their intelligence? Does the author appear to be taken in by his or her own lies? Are the lies creative, or are they merely recycled talking points? The best way to judge someone is by the lies they tell. To censor fake news would be to rob the public of valuable information.
It is patently false that all people know that journalists and experts are presenting lies to further their own agendas. I believe it is admissible that these persons have a point of view, or present an argument based on verifiable facts. That is not the same as lying. The best way to judge someone is to check their facts, and test their statements and logic for coherence. What is needed now is critical journalism that presents a range of views and their genealogies, as well as options and choices for action by readers.
Benito Mussolini – As always you are right again.
Who will judge what is the fake news and what is the real news unless we the audience can read it all and decide for ourselves.
Can some journalist find Hillary in the wild and ask her why she is now advocating for censorship of news and that too in the last bastion of freedom, the USA. Some would say just like in China.
Your choice of what to believe. After the shuffle with DWS and the attacks on Bernie’s media coverage I stopped listening. . Smear tactics. I do not listen to what Hillary and company spout.
The attitude of it being a shoe in – it was her turn garbage. The E-mails – (right or wrong) were for her presidential library….planning it all out?
Trump I didn’t like either – that goes back to when he was in Atlantic City. I’m not a gambler – glamour and glitz doesn’t do it for me. Two blocks from the casinos were still the slums – but that was part of what the casinos were to be fixing and cleaning up. . .
The election of the lessor of the evils?? flip a coin . . . . .
From what I see – – it has done more damage to the parties – than would have been possible otherwise. Both parties are in shambles – dodging issues, and covering up the results.
Will the Republican winners prove what they are?.? Obstructionists??
As the Democrats scurry to cover for the “change” forced down the throats of their patrons. . .
WHO ARE THE WINNERS? January 20th 2020 . . . Will we survive? Will we recognize – the remains??
You mean change forced down voters’ throats like Obamacare? I don’t think the Republicans will be doing any of that. We shall see…
This guy gets it
Yes,that was my experience with AC also,a block from the casinos,the streets smelled of piss.
Incredible disgusting reality,but it aint Trumps fault,and the casinos are all dying because the old blue haired casino ladies are broke from the terrible economy.
The job numbers issued this month were dismal,but the MSM liars say otherwise.
A world of shite,all from neoliberalisms inherent greed..
PROPAGANDA.
call it what it really is – marxist-democrat party propaganda.
I was disappointed that Malcolm Nance got involved in this propaganda operation. I respected his truth-telling about torture during the Bush administration. Apparently the Hillary backers felt justified in saying whatever they thought would win the election, truth be damned. And now they want to complain about “fake news.”
rmwarnick–I agree with you. It seems that anyone who gets involved with the Clintons comes out looking bad. I noticed it in the 90’s and I saw it this time, esp. when Rachel Maddow practically genuflected to the Bitch Goddess and then turned her patented blend of smart observation and smug mockery on Bernie. She really turnished herself during this campaign.
But worse, I think I must have gotten tarnished some way too, because while I caved and voted for the BG, and was suitably dazed when T-rump “won”, I can’t bring my self to want to see the results overturned and Killary the Lying Machine put in over T-rump. At least with him, the Left is getting galvanized into action instead of sitting on our dead butts letting the neo libs do any damn thing they want to as we did under Obusha! I know it’s going to be horrible with T-rump but maybe we’ll get some true grit out of it.
That’s my assessment too with the addition of chris matthews shilling at hyper speed for the anointed one. Between maddow the liar and matthews the king of shills msnbc is now the gold plated example of fake news and toilet journalism.
A quote from Thomas Bernhard, Austrian author
“Day in , day out we have the feeling that we are governed by a hypocrisy-ridden and deceitful and mean government which – to top it all off – is just about the dumbest government one could imagine and we think there is nothing we can really do about it, that all we can do is look on and see how this government gets more deceitful and more hypocrisy-ridden and meaner by the day.
SEEM TO FIT………either Trump or Clinton and sadly we do seem to only look on and think there is nothing we can really do about it.
The biggest fake news of all time was ‘three skyscrapers fell down today after two of them were hit by airplanes’ – when is the most detestable lie of all time going to be denounced? Here’s the real story:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5RAEP06732qRGNmUmdWYmtTQVU/view
Oil and money is only part of it.
http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/736223/9-11-tower-Building-7-collapse-fire-conspiracy
There is NO WAY that building 7 was not wired to implode far in advance of the attack. There is NO WAY that if it was wired in accordance with the law that we would have not know about this already. There is NO WAY that building 7 went down from a “fire”. There is NO WAY that wallstreet thieves in need of a war and the WMD media are telling the truth about this whole affair.
ECOMMCON
Well, as I expected, showing you the reason for the collapse in easy to understand terms didn’t slow you down one bit. And try your ‘hot fires only bring down wooden buildings’ line on someone who hasn’t driven past the piles of rubble where a steel and concrete highway bridge was burned down by a tanker load of jet fuel.
Not expecting this to make any difference, but do you know why even in preliterate, prescience times, nobody was building fireplaces on different levels that shared a single flue? I’ll give you a hint, anybody that did saw them burn and collapse as soon as someone lit a fire in two or more of those fireplaces. Now, there were a few geniuses who figured out how to turn such a thing into a furnace capable of reaching the temperatures needed to make molten steel, but it doesn’t take that sort of out of the box thinking to realize that burning file cabinets who’s smoke and hot gases are going up the same stairwells or elevator shafts act as if they were fireplaces sharing the same flue.
the flue? really? hot air rising going out blown out windows because the firedoors melted? really? are you that guy in vegas with the magic act that can turn a whole pencil into a broken pencil?
be serious! your flue theory ONLY WORKS WITH WOOD BUILDINGS.
Matt Taibbi has been asking these people, for years, WHY go to all that trouble with building 7? What agenda is possibly satisfied by that specific, purported machination?
ecommcon
The purpose of pulling the buildings was so Larry Silverstein would get billions in insurance dough to rebuild his skyscrapers and increase his wealth.
All 3 came down on their own footprint,a most impossible accidental happening,and all three were full of asbestos,which of course NYC breathed,and probably made the buildings subject to rehab for big dough in asbestos removal.
If it looks,and feels like Controlled Demolition,it was.
Why do some go out of their way to defend serial lying crooks who made big dough out of the crime of the century?(so far)
Hillary & Democrats & our newsmedia were the worst perveyors of fake news. The entire American news media, TV & print were a thousand times anti-Trump. What more did she want? biggest news? Trump can never win, repeated, by Establishment Republi cans too cowardly to ever do anythihg. Biggest fake news is yet to come, with Democrats & liberals & anti-liberatarians of any side, devoted to defeat any human being for president.
Hey Hillary, is this the “fake news” you want Congress to “take action on”???
It’s amazing how consistently perfect Glenn Greenwald’s articles are. Also, the last paragraph is especially scary. The ill-defined “solutions” that require monitoring the flow of information from the state and/or giant corporations can’t be a good thing.
Yep. Clinton campaign lies and says Russia hacked their emails. BTW, Podesta’s password was “runner456″. How hard is that?
And then agitates for clamp-down and suppression of any news outlet that criticizes Clinton campaign. Because it’s Fake News!
What liars. Trump no better. And Stein is a ridiculous narcissist patsy. Just like Clinton and Trump. We’re fucked at present.
In fact, almost all of his passwords were like that, 123Runner, Runner1234, etc; its so laughable that the so-called “security experts” wrote some stupid letter claiming ‘only the greatest and most nefarious minds at the tippy top of the evil kremlin could possibly pull of the heist of century.’ I mean c’mon, Clinton’s State Dept and Google handed Russia millions of dollars of equipment and training in cybersecurity, but the reality is a lone neckbeard could have used basic cold-reading techniques on Pederastas social media to ferret out his passwords. And the way he was caught by a simple phishing technique is just embarrassing. We don’t need to invoke dark powers of the kremlin to explain how pizza boy got his shit hacked.
HIllary Clinton outright lying about the news.. about wikileaks.. about Democrat corruption.
Say it isn’t so..
Heh.
Thanks Glenn for further documenting the essential similarity between Clinton and Trump. At least in Clinton’s case, we see that the attempts to discredit actual information were unsuccessful.
The democrat fake news campaign continues. I quote from the lead article in the current issue of The New Yorker: “Stein’s demands for a recount reflect the same narcissism as her candidacy, whose primary function was to help Trump win.” No shit, they want us to believe that Stein ran to help Trump! If they are right, then I get a get-out-of-jail-free card for having voted Green again in 2016. But seriously, can the democrat rank and file really be so clueless that they overlook the fundamental narcissism and corruption of their own candidate and the organization that paved the way for her nomination? I guess so!
I suppose it is a point of irony that in Steins letter to WI officials requesting a recount, she cited Clinton supporter talking reports about Russian hacking of election machinery.
I have been shocked and dissapointed by the Clinton campaign’s willingness to flat-out lie. And even more disillusioned by Clinton supporters’ eagerness to belive these lies and promulgate them.
I’m done with the Democratic Party.
There are more than two parties. If the Democrats continue their self-destructive course, I can see the Greens gaining power.
I voted for Jill Stein. I’m over her too after this bogus recount vote campaign. Carrying water for the Clinton campaign. Can’t figure out why, after Stein opposed Clinton so strongly in the election. I am guessing it’s a PR stunt to win donations and liberal Democrat approval for the Greens. No thanks. Stein is as much a craven narcissist sell-out as Hillary.
Agreed. She was constantly railing against HRC’s corruption and general crumbiness….I can’t imagine why she agreed to be the surrogate for requesting recounts. Honestly, based on what we know about how the Clintons operate, they have dirt on her she doesn’t want out.
The Green Party is in no meaningful way a political party. They have 86 office holders COUNTRY WIDE, mostly at the level of school board type positions.
Every four years, they use the presidential election as a way to scam some money and get some publicity. That’s all this recount ever was – keep Jill Stein in the spotlight a little longer.
You guys are too sensitive. Stay tuned for details, I imagine.
People were “done” with Bernie because he stumped for HRC. Now you’re done with Stein? What about Lessig’s idea to establish an Electors Trust? https://medium.com/@lessig/the-electors-trust-7af58d87c2bd#.fjg140l5g
The biggest problem that I see is that we are back where we started: many of us couldn’t abide a Clinton WH and now we’re stuck with a habitual/psychopathic liar unfit for the job he was elected to serve.
Mobilize, vocalize, criticize, get active.
truth to power…
Julian Assange
Glenn Greenwald
Jeremy Scahill
Keith Olberman
Ed Schultz
Dylan Ratigan
Melissa Harris
Al Sharpton
Ayman Mohyeldin
Rick Sanchez
Rula Jebreal
the real news is msnbc prefers ALT-REAL.
that list is a start, but no way melissa harris should be on there…
Please add Cenk Uyghur and Jimmy Dore to that list.
ok. i was trying to be specific to msnbc but hey, Edward Snowden as well.
tx
@art guerilla
melissa is on there for her her fearless attitude and willingness for self sacrificing
Uhm… how could you forget Brian Williams, the all-time poster child of fake news and current MSNBC anchor?
Barabbas–great list. And thanks for including Melissa Harris Perry. Love that woman. But why not Amy Goodman? With out her, I’d be COMPLETELY crazy now instead of just half way.
sure. ok. Amy Goodman, truth to power, a real champion of equal rights.
The last paragraph is the most important. The call for both private and government action with the possibility of punishment to fake-news “offenders”. I would not be surprised if we see Congress attempt to re-start HUAC at some level.
From another angle, Robert Parry calls the whole fake news hysteria a war on journalistic skepticism. I would also add that however forged, fake news ends up serving as a hammer to squash dissent and even simple skepticism on events and policies as told by the establishment mass media.
In fact, it seems that given everything we know about how the powerful and governments have manipulated information and outright lied, one would think that pundits of all sorts and anybody in the major media (including outlets like the NYTimes and Washington Post) would have some sense of skepticism or sense of incredulity. You would think that liberals would especially have fine tuned these senses given the lies and propaganda that resulted in the invasion and resulting disaster of Iraq. Guess not.
Given how so many approved of the disastrous Iraq war (and the disastrous Libya war), and how many refused to hold Bush accountable, it’s no surprise. Time for some new guard’s.
Glenn Greenwald, the author of this article, was one of the loudest and most dangerous proponents for war in Iraq. Mr. Greenwald spread the fake news as justification for war, and now he claims to have the high ground. F**** off, Glenn.
Due to the shady source nobody could trust they were real. Much like that ignorant medical letter and Clinton’s health. Pure, badly done, fake.
I rarely object to Glenn’s critiques, but this one seems off base. Glenn details news outlets playing the role of stenographer, rather than fact-checking baseless claims. This is a problem that Glenn has fairly criticized mainstream media for in the past, but this is distinctly different from fake news.
Is there really confusion of what fake news is? Articles about “professional protesters” where the outlet photographed coach buses and reported that Soros is funding protests is fake news, deliberately designed by the author to mislead the reader. I feel like the examples in this article are simply very poor reporting
When media promulgated Clinton II’s “public positions,” was that fake news?
good one!
i couldnt tell which face was fake so i figured they both were.
It is all disinformation. Reporters in the mainstream no longer take a story and get to the bottom of the truth. They just let the surface information play against one another. Greenwald does a good job at getting to the core of it here. The key is that the core never expands to average American households, so the disinformation is played back and forth and the division goes on within the American people who are no longer able to see true right from wrong as the mainstream continues its propaganda campaign leading towards division. That is the why in all likelihood that may in the future allow for untold and unnecessary suffering.
“Complaints about Fake News are typically accompanied by calls for “solutions” that involve censorship and suppression, either by the government or tech giants such as Facebook.”
Glenn, like this? >> https://theintercept.com/2016/11/10/facebook-im-begging-you-please-make-yourself-better/
Hmmm, I wonder if MediaMatters will do a story on this. Lol.
It was so ridiculous how every time someone claimed that Wikileaks documents were Russian forged or doctored or modified in any way, I never saw one reporter/newscaster/etc every ask the person to provide one example. Probably because they knew they were real and if they were doctored at all, anyone who had sent those emails could have easily supplied the ‘real’ version or specifically pointed out anything inaccurate and they never did.
In other words, basic common sense
the “news” that wikileaks emails were forged or doctored was the REAL FAKE NEWS from the lyin wallstreet WMD MEDIA.
Absolutely right. There is type of “news story” that plays off the lack of proof. Hillary Clinton as revealed by Wikileaks blamed the Russians for anti-fracking protests. So I searched for anything related to this and found a NYTimes article about how Romanian pro-frackers supporters accused the Russians being behind anti-fracking protests.
The article admitted that not one person accusing the Russians had any proof of Russian involvement. But the entire article gives credence to the charges: “Russian Money Suspected Behind Fracking Protests”. Over and over in the article, the Times quoted people making admitted unsubstantiated charges without themselves ever bothering to investigate.
The whole issue of fracking became not about fracking pro or con, but about unproven accusations about Russians backing anti-fracking protests–which is what Clinton did also in her accusations in a paid speech.
https://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/01/world/russian-money-suspected-behind-fracking-protests.html?_r=0
Speaking of people manufacturing things, Jenna McLaughlin has a new piece up here on Clapper trying to manufacture some faux empathy – he calls it “training guidelines” – to “teach whistleblower rights”.
Heh.
Great article. I’ve been wondering if the “pizzagate” nonsense started from the Clinton camp as an attempt to discredit Wikileaks? It seems like something that they would do to muddy the waters for their benefit, but it’s also the same kind of crap that the guys on 4chan and places like that constantly do to try to troll everyone, so I’m not sure. Unfortunately, the fact that Team Clinton spent over $6 million on an internet troll army means that they’ll always be suspects when stuff like this happens.
This doesn’t appear to be a team effort, it was a lone idiot who thought trolling was an effective tool rather than carelessly rolled dice. While the “emails are fake” theme being supported by major media outlets gave a crutch to her left-leaning support and kept Stein from taking anything resembling a meaningful number of votes from her, that was dumb luck on his part. Had it instead circulated in the dark alleys of repeatedly forwarded emails, retweets and Facebook posts, it could have simply been believed by the gullible and dismissed for what it was by the rest. That’s more or less how “pizzagate” turned out – a few idiots believed it, while most people just ignored it as obvious trolling until they were surprised by the election result and looking for something other than the DNC to blame.
To any future historians sailing their insulated space landers into the Steam Sea to read this stuff, who wonder, what were they thinking? … answer: they weren’t, nobody was, case closed, move on.
Pizzagate is post election news(or rumor),not pre.
And people who believe the worst about bad people are not idiots,just logic believers.
Fake news is a spin to try and deflect in advance the crimes committed, such as:
1) The violent plants the DNC put at Trump rallies to try and say Trump had violence at his rallies – – look at the O’Keefe tapes to see this. Those who funded the violent rally in Chicago and all the operatives for this, should be in prison and tried under the Espionage Act . Creamer will flip like a street hooker to whom paid him? Who funded his group & who runs them?
2) #Pizzagate
3) Corzine
4) Louis Lerner and who helped her destroy hard drives and who gave the first order to stop funding the Tea Party
5) Illicit money to Iran, namely $150 billion and the lies told here. Negotiating with terrorists
6) Bypassing Senate on immigration and climate change
7) Open border secrets
8) Benghazi, who ordered the stand-down orders & how many times; the cover-up that it was a terror attack and not a video
9) unsealing of college transcripts
10) who ordered the destruction of the ‘potential terrorist’ database?
11) Voter fraud
Glenn, Glenn, Glenn… you’re getting carried away. This is the sort of thing that could use some editing. I mean, I skim a lot of stuff fast, and rants are one color, news another, agents provocateur a third, boasting spooks a fourth, etc. With a bit more attention the words that make a rant a rant resolve themselves: not a blacklist but a disgusting blacklist, not a strategy of lying to the public but outright lying to the public. You’ve gilded the lily till she keeled right over dead, friend! Because when I read this I scarcely see the difference in “color” between your news coverage and the hyperbole you cover. I worry its spirit has metastasized right out of the blockquote tag. And this is trouble because while you’ve assembled a good collection of links and data for our delectation, you aren’t so much telling us what it means as that you really don’t like it. We may not be getting the points that you might be making.
In an era of over-the-top news, it might go better for you to take a step back, adopt a neutral tone worthy of the Christian Science Monitor, be the Virgil who guides us through these wonders, and allow our horror to come to us of our own accord.
How is stating that the emails are fabricated when there is absolutely no corroborating evidence hyperbole? I’m with you that there is a little more emotion than necessary, but that doesn’t diminish the fact that what they put out to the trusting American public was a lie, which, unless they are grossly unqualified for their positions in every empirical sense, could not be called anything else.
The article was disappointing for those of us who read Mr. Greenwald for his dispassionate understatement.
the Russians cannot be trusted … China is our new Big Friend … peace with strength etc
it sounded a lot like Nixon
“China is our new Big Friend”
Who doesn’t like to grab some Jhinese cuisine every now and then?
Always had wondered about the absolutely RAW Hate the PresO and CrookdClintons waged against Wilileaks and Manning
Many did not agree and found them faulty of even criminal behaviors. And voiced their opinions.
Fine.
But what PresO did to Manning is a sheer innermost hateful unfounded cruelty.
Bc, they exposed the darkness of the CrookdClintonsObama 3Musketeers Plan of profiteering over USA welfare.
When i see all of americans (it is for their votes to get me in the position) to steal and work for the WSSecretSpeechers!
Shut the Foundation down.
Clintonemail.com ONLY TO TALK TO CRIMINALS…and a pres who does not know? They are all 3 in on it!
Might notlikeTrump– no disagreement, but sure is not that bad!
I hope you got a chance to see the The Colbert Report’s two special episodes I had them do about CGI
http://podestaemails.blogspot.com/2016/12/i-hope-you-got-chance-to-see-the.html
“Yet MSNBC itself not only spreads Fake News but refuses to correct it when it is exposed. How do they have any credibility to denounce Fake News? They do not.”
But lots of people refuse to correct Fake News, including you, Glenn: such as when you accused Charlie Hebdo of having fired the cartoonist Siné for an ostensibly antisemitic article. It was pointed out to you then that this firing had been done for other purposes by a previous editor-in-chief; that the assassinated editor was a friend and supporter of Siné; that at least one of the murdered cartoonists had signed a petition in favor of Siné; that none of the victims had approved of the firing. And yet you stuck by your unfounded accusation, just as you refused to correct your first (and demonstrably wrong) article in which you said CH never mocked Judaism and was soft on Israel.
Just saying. Let those who are without sin throw the first stone.
Glenn did not publish “fake news” about Charlie Hebdo. Nor is what he wrote about the Siné firing false.
His factual reporting on Charlie Hebdo was very good; I strongly disagreed with certain of his opinions and judgments. He did not, at all, manufacture utter, wholesale bullshit, which certainly must be a journalistic offense included in any reasonable definition of “fake news.”
The facts were somewhat different … but no one was interested in facts.
“After the funeral, while I was downtown desperately celebrating my birthday, a Negro soldier, in the lobby of the Hotel Braddock, got into a fight with a white policeman over a Negro girl. Negro girls, white policemen, in or out of uniform, and Negro males— in or out of uniform—were part of the furniture of the lobby of the Hotel Braddock and this was certainly not the first time such an incident had occurred. It was destined, however, to receive an unprecedented publicity, for the fight between the policeman and the soldier ended with the shooting of the soldier. Rumor, flowing immediately to the streets outside, stated that the soldier had been shot in the back, an instantaneous and revealing invention, and that the soldier had died protecting a Negro woman. The facts were somewhat different—for example, the soldier had not been shot in the back, and was not dead, and the girl seems to have been as dubious a symbol of womanhood as her white counterpart in Georgia usually is, but no one was interested in the facts. They preferred the invention because this invention expressed and corroborated their hates and fears so perfectly. It is just as well to remember that people are always doing this. Perhaps many of those legends, including Christianity, to which the world clings began their conquest of the world with just some such concerted surrender to distortion. The effect, in Harlem, of this particular legend was like the effect of a lit match in a tin of gasoline. The mob gathered before the doors of the Hotel Braddock simply began to swell and to spread in every direction, and Harlem exploded.”
James Baldwin; 1955
Maybe the best way to tell if something is fake is to compare it to something real.
Ed Shultz still does real news. Check out RT.
https://www.rt.com/shows/news-with-ed-schultz/369807-news-with-ed-december8/
This sure reads familiar…You’d think that with Trump’s inauguration incoming, Glenn wouldn’t have to resort to recycling articles from not even two months ago.
https://theintercept.com/2016/10/11/in-the-democratic-echo-chamber-inconvenient-truths-are-recast-as-putin-plots/
https://theintercept.com/2016/11/26/washington-post-disgracefully-promotes-a-mccarthyite-blacklist-from-a-new-hidden-and-very-shady-group/
Glenn’s piece in a nutshell: Washington Post was disgusting and shameful; falling for fake news is bipartisan; MSNBC stinks and water is wet; only morons didn’t realize that sites like “The Daily News Bin” are a complete fraud (Laughably, many of TI’s intrepid viewers immediately fell for the fake HRC transcript talking about a “bucket of losers”; some guy named Craig Timberg is a “prominent journalist.”
“Fake news” is absolutely easy to define and nowhere near as ambiguous as the term “terrorism.”
Blatantly fabricating information and presenting it as news
That wasn’t hard. Here is the epitome of what fake news is: http://www.npr.org/sections/alltechconsidered/2016/11/23/503146770/npr-finds-the-head-of-a-covert-fake-news-operation-in-the-suburbs Glenn just decides to conflate “fake news” and its admitting authors with “journalists” that are intellectually lazy and are unwilling or unable to verify information and assess the credibility of sources.
My key takeaway is that extemporaneous comments from windbags on Twitter aren’t a great source for news but a great source for Glenn Greenwald Super-Hypocrisy™ articles.
Speaking of “fake news,” the ever-excellent Jimmy Dore analyzes Rachel Maddow: This Hilarious Video Wasn’t Meant To Be Funny
How many HRC voters stayed home because they were assured — by Maddow and other DNC hacks — that Hillary had it all wrapped up?
This is one of the most under-reported stories of the American media. Maddow and co. Spent so many hours trying to predict the future, (instead of doing their job, reporting on issues: climate change, corruption, healthcare education, jobs)…
That now that their crystal balls have failed, they are now compounding the problem, spending more time autopsying the failure of their hours of trying to predict how people were going to vote…
…instead of doing the important work of refactoring their news broadcasts into something that has room to report on things that are now front and centre: climate change denial, the minimum wage, healthcare, education.
Out of work factory workers don’t care how well Maddow can predict future elections, any more than they care how she did on her football pool. The need the issues that affect them discussed, preferably BEFORE the election.
Maddow probably means well but she is pretty much a tool. Her show basically is about telling you how dumb the GOP is…while repeating what they say and do. This only allows them to control the argument and her employers are well aware of this. She is blinded by her paycheck however.
Rachel, don’t let people criticize you for this – after all, the storm was brewing and what the heck could you do, put your finger in the dyke?
That’s just cruel, sis. …what about bob mackey’s feelings?
*I was thinking about your excellent observation the other day wrt “kind and degree” when I read this from Glenn above; “That lie – and that is what it was: a claim made with knowledge of its falsity or reckless disregard for its truth – ” which pretty much covers the ‘kind’ of all this nonsense, imo … since it’s as obvious as the noon-day sun ‘honesty is the bedrock foundation of every human affair’.
While ‘pizzagate’ or fake ‘pootin’gate forgeries’ propagated by MSNBC are tragic events (and, inevitably, can only lead to further widespread social unrest and panic!) … that Colin Powell’s case for the Iraq war at the UN seemed more ‘plausible’, I would submit to you, is only a matter of ‘degree’.
Agreed. But recall, at the time many sensible people were uncertain about the claims for invading Iraq, including (ahem) Glenn Greenwald.
Powell had a reputation for honesty and reasonableness. He trashed that with those claims at the UN, but that was not immediately apparent to many.
I don’t watch TV so Powell’s claims–often cited by reasonable liberals, including NYT reporter James Risen–as the primary reason they supported the Iraq invasion meant nothing to me. Didn’t register.
What I kept reading in news stories at the beginning of 2003 was U.N. inspector Hans Blix saying his team had found no WMD, the claims were baseless and at least let them complete the inspection before invading.
Those were basic wire stories from Reuters and AP. Available to anyone who buys / reads a newspaper.
Didn’t happen. NYT and other MSM couldn’t be bothered with facts.
I met James Risen at a press club event in 2005. He was the featured speaker. Afterwards, I asked him why he supported the Iraq invasion. He instantly became irritated and defensive. Told me, rather huffily, that Colin Powell said Iraq had WMD–on national television, no less. And that he trusted / believed Powell.
This baffled me. Was when I first understood how much weight Powell’s lies re Iraq had in swaying sceptical liberals re invading–even tho it was an obviously illegal, wrong, stupid, unnecessary thing for the USA to do.
Iraq had not threatened the USA and had no capability to do us harm. We invaded anyway. For humanitarian reasons or something. Because Colin Powell said to.
Oddly, instead of this debacle–the disaster that ensued, thousands of people dying and thousands more made refugees and Iraq turned into a failed state and becoming a breeding ground for Al Quaida, ISIS–plus it coming to light that Powell knowingly and obediently lied re WMD because he’s a loyal team player–instead of it discrediting him and ruining his career, he suffered no repercussions. He got a fat, lucrative, do-nothing job with a top venture capital firm and rakes in big bucks on speeches.
This whole kerfuffle about ‘fake news’ is nothing but groundwork for censorship. As such it does not ever need to be defined and it will not be defined. It is an arbitrary call.
“Fake news” have existed since creation of print. We have called it propaganda, advertising, tabloids, conspiracy theories, gossip, art.
To make it an issue suddenly, because Clinton lost, can be illustrated only by another ‘fake news’ story by Aesop, one we know as the Fox and the Grapes.
If hard Fascism comes to America it will be through liberalism and not conservatism. Liberals are such lying control freaks when you pull off their fake masks of concern.
Well, we call that a totalitarian Marxist state.
Dishonest is the word, Liberal is not.
LIBERAL, adjective, LIBERTY,noun, WethePeople Constitution 34th Word.
It still stands for what it is, no matter what the CrookdClintonsetal do to change the meaning for their purpose.
Donot fall for it.
Totally agree that liberal is from the root word liberty,but liberals today only want liberty to spew their own BS,and opposing voices are called every bad name in the book by illiberal hypocrites.
Their invective reveals who the actual haters are.
Yep. I have seen the ugly face of liberals / Clinton supporters from this election. They’re outraged by US wars, droning if Repubs do it, but could care a less if done by a Dem president and administration. Same with neoliberal economic policies that hurt working people.
Liberal Clintonistas are rich or quite comfortable financially. They only get activated by identity politics.
Great article!
When those with power cry about the narrative, prepare for propanganda and a loss of free speech.
NPR was a big player in the fake news stories prior to the election, such as this article, such as this by Scott Detrow, July 25 2016:
http://www.npr.org/2016/07/25/487356470/why-would-vladimir-putin-want-to-leak-the-dnc-emails?
NPR’s post-election to response to accusation of media bias in favor of Clinton has been boilerplate, in this form: “People need to distinguish between editorial opinion and the news feed. While editorial opinion may have been biased, the news feed was impartial and objective.”
That is absolute bullshit, however. There are in fact three general ways in which the news feed is manipulated:
1) Advertising disguised as “news”, aka “embedded advertising”, in which news articles are basically ghost-written by ad firms to promote products.
2) Political opinion disguised as “news”, as seen in the past election from almost all media outlets, from the “progressive left” to the “corporate centrist” to the “alt-right” sectors.
3) Government propaganda disguised as “news”, most notably in the lies about Iraq WMDs fed to parrot “journalists” by government officials, but see also Syria, Libya, TPP, etc.
NPR, like most other media outlets in the United States, is absolutely guilty of this behavior.
in the Boston area, NPR and WGBH host much wretched opinion as noise shows, providing condescending accommodationist ‘realism’ ..nee corporatism while promoting “acceptance” of Trump and “not ‘whining’ about everything”
Just…utter…shyte
I still don’t know what “Fake News” means.
Is it propaganda?
Is it false stories reminiscent of Jason Blair or Janet Cooke?
Is is craftily contrived disinformation like Swift Boat Veterens for Truth?
Is it poor vetting?
Is it disinformation of the sort published by the CIA/Russian SVR?
Is it pranksters?
Is it click-bait advertising?
Is it a publicity stunt?
Is it Fake News if any part of it is true?
Is it like a political lie like Trump claiming he saw thousands of American Muslims celebrating 911?
It seems to me there is accurate and inaccurate.
If we suddenly decide inaccurate means corrupt rather than shoddy or — gasp — politically driven why not say “false” instead of “fake”? There is all sorts of “fake” stuff — from Koch front groups to petroleum industry climate change denial stories.
There is literally nothing in today’s mediated society that is absolutely true or absolutely false. Different people, different factions, different commercial interests, different countries and even different cultures all lay claim to relative truths that — if repeated — could be categorized as “fake news.”
Before fulminating over Hillary Clinton’s allies promoting “Fake News,” as if this some sort of new invention, it seems to me you should first define what you mean by “Fake News.” As I’ve indicated, that project will be tougher than it might appear.
Does it makes sense for Hillary Clinton allies to produce fake news about a child sex ring operating out of the basement a pizzeria? This story is, as I understand it, the most recent and public example of Fake News.
There are many absolutely false things. It is hard to prove absolute truth for anything other than simple verifiable fates.
Milton, I suggest that before you post you do both of: 1. Read the article, and 2. Recall the author of the article.
This is the last sentence of the piece, my emphasis:
The same author has made this point about there being no definition countless times on Twitter.
Please give me your email address.
Normally I post things the way I do because I have a purpose. I have a point. But clearly I should check with you before I post. You must know better than me what I mean. So send me your email address and I’ll ask you what I mean before I post. Thank you in advance.
________________
If someone says, “I don’t know what FRITZLESPICE is, but I’m sure FRIZTLESPICE poisons people” then it’s appropriate to assist the person afraid of FRITZLESPICE.
Is FRITZLESPICE animal, vegetable or mineral. Will I see it in the sky or in the ocean … etc.
I’m a little frustrated by this constant display of Clintonphobia (the irrational hatred of Hillary Clinton) and especially when it is presented as a sort of unidentified toxin. Suppose a Clintonphobe says, “people everywhere are dying from the pure FRITZLESPICE the Clinton campaign manufactures .”
Geesh.
Sure, of course there’s Fake News, Batboy. Hillary Clinton even adopted this Batboy … or was it an alien baby she adopted?
Fake News is literally everywhere.
Blaming Clinton and her allies for Fake News seems a lot over the top.
____________________
Thanks for giving me the opportunity to clarify myself. I’ve had several post moderated to nothingness recently so I must remember to be more circumspect.
Huh? You’ve posts moderated here, as in altered? If that’s what you mean I am extremely skeptical.
In any event, I reaffirm my initial reply to you.
I didn’t say that.
I said,
Let me return some unsolicited advice I recently received.
Read the post
I offer this advice in exactly the spirit with which it was originally offered.
How ironic. You have no license for that purported counter-retort; I was quite clear when I wrote: IfIf that’s what you mean I am extremely skeptical.”
So you, Milton, should now read both Glenn’s article AND my comment. Not inappropriately abjure others to do what you do not.
And while you are at it, you might then explain what you meant by this, if it wasn’t what I asked you *IF* you meant:
Well?
“I’ve had several post moderated to nothingness recently … [i.e., not posted] ”
i.e., not posted.
Not that I like defending anyone in particular, but the two of you are going back and forth. Most likely due to mutual animosity.
Milton, you’re posts most likely ended up in the bucket in their IT department to be cleared. I’ve had several posts do the same thing. This is caused when two or more links are on the same post.
Try checking back the next day to your comment time. I’ve found that they clear at 11am PST the next day.
Thank you for this explanation.
I’ve always felt sourcing is important.
I include a link as a matter of courtesy in the process of citing sources. It’s easier to understand something when it’s contextualized. Googling something runs into many issues unless it’s an exact quote.
But you’re absolutely correct about too many links. It was already starting to dawn on me that links drive the moderators crazy here and at the Guardian. So I’ve stopped the courtesy and much of the sourcing.
Anyway, as I’ve argued, I don’t think people are interested in facts; we’re interested in precontextualized meanings. Individual facts are almost superfluous.
Meaning is more important than facts just like a house is more important than its constituent bricks.
Dissonant facts can cause your house to fall down.
Few people want that, especially after the trouble they’ve had building it.
Me, I don’t live anywhere. I just wander.
Mona & Milton, if anyone or any of you do not know what fake is I wonder if you’ll ever know the difference between light & darkness or Tony Blair & George Bush.
Fake news is lies and forgeries that the author/producer knows (or doesn’t care) are lies and forgeries and which are PACKAGED NEWS STORIES. Fake news is not a generic term for falsehoods and propaganda, nor does it equate to bad or sloppy reporting or reporting of hearsay which happens to be false. It is a distinct phenomenon which is rampant on social media.
Fake news is lies and fabrications that the author knows (or doesn’t care) are lies and fabrications and which are PACKAGED TO LOOK LIKE NEWS STORIES.
Fake news is not a generic term for falsehoods and propaganda. It does not mean bad or sloppy reporting or information which happens to be incorrect.
It is a distinct phenomenon. Fake news has existed in the past, but it is rampant on social media and played a major role in the election of Trump. Russia is clearly a major player in the creation of fake news, but hardly alone.
Well Trump’s supporters were more effective at the fake news game. Clinton’s blaming everything on Russia didn’t work so well, partly because it was done out of desperation to change the narrative and also because a lot of people rolled their eyes and expressed fear that she wanted war with the Russians (and if you don’t believe me go sign up for some of the leftist and Sanders FB fan posts). It shored her base, which was already voting for her, but if anything hurt her with most others.
I don’t get you, Milton. It seems really important to you to come across as a liberal and yet you continually espouse right-wing, pro-Clinton, pro-Democrat, pro-status quo positions.
Oh right…
“Oh right” what?
Oh, right. Whatever you mean remains in your head.
To clear up your apparent confusion. I voted for Sanders in my state caucus. I was disappointed when he wasn’t the nominee. Yes, I see why you think Clinton is everything bad. Her husband’s “triangulation” policies facilitated a rightwing agenda — the New Democrats were simply Republicans without the viciousness.
By August this year, I realized it was either Clinton or Trump.
One, a soft core Republican technocrat — who might even be apolitical.
The other a crude, loudmouthed bigot explicitly advocating torture and murder and supported by the Kremlin in it’s offensive to reacquire Ukraine. Additionally, I think he is borderline psychotic.
So you’re right. I chose.
It seems like an obvious choice to me.
But in the spirit of reciprocity, here’s what I don’t get.
Trump won, Clinton lost.
Why keep beating on Clinton? (This is the fourth in a series of anti-Clinton articles by Mr. Greenwald.)
Your hell bitch went to capitol hill and said Russian influence in election.
If she had any class,any integrity,or any good wishes for America,she would end this charade immediately,and retire to her criminal foundation,and leave US alone in peace,but no,power corrupts,and she is the epitome of said meme,in her continuance of this zionist divide and conquer.
I think a firing squad might be the final solution.
What happened a lot and what your article studiously ignores is that there was no shortage of articles Claiming that X or Y was revealed by the Podesta emails. Even if you acknowledge that every word posted on Wikileaks was in fact faithfully rendered from the account, it doesn’t change the fact that approximately 1/3 of the things that I encountered as being ‘revealed’ by the leaks was in fact nonsense made up by the authors and appeared nowhere on Wikileaks. Caution was indeed the proper response for anything that was supposedly revealed. Especially if it was ‘breaking’
Then I’m sure it would be with great ease that you cite three examples of this “nonsense” made up by authors?
http://wonkette.com/607459/oh-sht-hillary-clinton-was-sooooo-racist-in-these-made-up-wikileaks-emails-that-werent-from-her
http://www.snopes.com/julian-assange-drone-strike/
By the way, the original post on “RealTrueNews” was fake news: a deliberate forgery packaged as a news report. Everything after that was just carelessness, misunderstanding and sloppy reporting.
Good to see you sorted out that the Omnivore post was indeed an “obvious” fake. Your tweets at the time did not acknowledge this and you did not respond when I repeatedly pointed it out.
So it’s pretty clear what most likely happened here. Semonova saw the Ominvore post and tweeted a warning, aimed at general readers, that they would see forgeries like this presented as coming from the Podesta emails. Nance saw the Semenova tweet, assumed she was saying the fake transcript actually came from Wikileaks, and tweeted out his warning, which was picked up by Frum and propagated from there.
As a professional, Nance is to be faulted for not having checked whether the forgery did come from Wikileaks, and one can say the same about Frum and others on down the line. But let’s not forget that this did all start with an actual forgery.
Completely off topic, or maybe Trump’s win does fall under “fake news”…
What is the deal with the American recount system????
People have to not only raise millions of dollars, but have to prove to a court, in advance of any investigation, that the recount WILL (in the future), if allowed to go ahead, find evidence that the count is inacurate?
Assuming this rule wasn’t set up by a lunatic…what possible logical reason could there be for this kind of recount system? And apparently only Clinton has the standing to ask for the recount, because, she is the only one affected by Trump being the president? Really?
If you showed this to election officials around the world, they’d think you were mad.
excellent points.
However, I would add, that the ‘logic’ isn’t that of the mad, it is by design; intended to prevent accountability and give the imprimatur of legitimacy to a process that SHALL NOT be examined, analyzed, and inspected.
Cant make sense out of US laws – so convoluted and the courts are so politically oriented that one can actually rule as one wants to just like in Egypt.
Yes, I “could” turn on MSNBC literally every day.
But Fox News by any other name, politics…
Put down the remote … and back slowly away from the TV.
I tried but I’m weak, addicted to my Amy Goodman.
Can only afford either cable or internet so I chose Internet because of all you wonderful and free thinking people!
You can live stream Democracy Now directly from their website M-F at 8:00am Eastern, or watch the video of that day’s show when it’s posted later in the day.
Democracy Now is also carried by many PBS networks across the country, usually in the evening, often just requiring a TV and antenna.
I listened on radio before I got the internet. i watch it now but my connection is slow. I hear the words but the picture is slow. I wish more MSM outlets had as much guts as amy. HELL there isn’t a MSM out there that is qualified to wear her Jock Strap!
Sheesh.
I have not watched a single television news presentation — news readers or commentators — since the election.
If they — the media — got is so wrong why listen to their schoolkid excuses for no homework?
I’m done with corporate news.
….myself included. I am stunned at the blatant ‘who gives a fuckism™’ on display by opinionating blatherers who insist on “accepting the ‘legitimacy’ of the election…and acting like ‘adults'”…, especially by hacks at so-called ‘liberal’ or ‘main stream’ press.
It dawned on me I just called Amy a gateway drug.
I apologize, Amy, I didn’t mean it!
She’s a placebo.
How about some real news?
What does Julian Assange say about Wikileaks being accused of creating fake news?
Shouldn’t he get a chance to comment and give his side of the story?
Why not send someone over to interview Julian Assange?
It’s interesting that Assange himself overestimated the power of the corporate media system when he claimed, in that John Pilger interview, that “Donald Trump would not be allowed to win.”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_sbT3_9dJY4
That would be a good question to ask Assange: “Prior to the election, you believed that Donald Trump would not be allowed to win. Has the fact that he did win changed your views on the power of the media establishment?”
Assange underestimated the power of The Donald.
The Media People still don’t get it. They think they are the Top Dogs in society. You’d think they’d know better.
The very rich are not like you or I.
““Donald Trump would not be allowed to win.””
He hasn’t made it to the WH just yet …
I bet you a dollar Pence will be the guy in the Oval Office.
That supposed “intelligence experts” and “professional journalists” wouldn’t make use of the very easy to master search tools Wikileaks has provided, and find, instantly that the Marco Chacon text was a forgery, and a deliberately bad one at that, speaks to the professionalism, as well as the good faith of those on corporate TV presenting themselves as such.
Check out the twitter storm on Malcolm Nance’s page right now, someone just asked Nance, “Where in the Wikileaks docs are the forgeries?”
Nance replied: “Reams in there. Go sort them yourself.”
Maybe I should apply to be a MSNBC intelligence expert.
Fake news and moral panics
These DNC/neoliberal peddlers of the “fake news” meme have — no less than Trump and his minions — endangered the ability to have a national political discussion remotely based on reason and fact. Throughout U.S. history this has been an ebbing and flowing problem, especially vis-a-vis war and national security, but it can and has gotten better or worse. It’s worse right now.
Yesterday I had occasion to speak to a close relative who asked me what I knew about whether Hillary Clinton and John Podesta were trafficking kids at a pizza restaurant. This person is possessed of critical thinking skills, and the information I shared, and the reasoning I set forth — in addition to a link I followed up with — resolved the matter. For him.
But my point that the major media was entirely reporting all this pernicious nonsense as just that, wasn’t especially compelling, especially since he has heard me (properly) rant about their many sins against truth. On that point, I ended up saying that Glenn Greenwald referred to it as “insanity” on Twitter, and this person found that compelling.
So, neoliberals and their acolytes in the media are now open to large chunks of the population taking seriously the deranged notion that prominent Democrats are selling children for sex from the basement of a D.C. pizzeria. That would be funny — and just — if it were not that the restaurant owner, his employees, family, and surrounding businesses are receiving death threats, and a gunman went there to “investigate” over the weekend.
I’m so old I recall the Satanic Ritual Abuse panic that saw hundreds of innocent people all over the country investigated and often prosecuted and imprisoned over bullshit. Oh yes, that can happen again, or, people will end up dead. (There’s a reason convicted pedophiles are not usually held in the general prison population.) When the media is not trusted, an outbreak of a dangerous moral panic is very, very hard to counter.
Imagine the harm if the vice president of the US used this “new” technique to publish fake stories in the New York Times and then went on Meet the Press to promote war with another country.
That’s how you tell the amateurs from the professionals. The industrial-strength MIC version won’t bother with such “trivialities” as child sex and always results in far more death/destruction. :-s
They are very talented professionals. They can do both.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mr2oQExxGmU
I still think that the MIC sold WMD’S to Sadam who then used every bit of them on Iran thus leaving Bush with egg on his face when none were found. So it is possible that Bush’s WMD’ S were not Fake News but just too little too late. Poor Bush was probably saying to himself I know they were here I sold them to him. Honest America I was not lying.
JLocke, I’m not sure why you raised the point you did. I stated in my first paragraph:
I submit that harm from moral panics is also real and can be severe. To that end, I cited the Satanic Ritual Abuse nonsense that spread over the nation — and other parts of the world — in the 80s and 90s. Real people went to real prisons.
Mona, we’re very different people, I can see that now, It’s not you, it’s me. I look at the world and say “You’ve got to be kidding?!!?!
Do you realize we’ve been cyber chatting for years now? And where has it led us? Harold Hill is the president of the US!!
But back to our break-up, It’s my fault, one minute I’m all scholarly ad logical, the next, I’m doing my monty python sketch. I’ve sullied my brand. I should stick to one thing, like fascism like our friend Mussolini.
But I guess I’m not single minded enough for that. I kind of just go with the most honest response of the moment. And after reading your comment, I felt like highlighting one of the all time great moments in fake news.
You don’t have to get all defensive Mona, I’m not attacking you, I never was.
JLocke, I’m not remotely “defensive.” Rather, I’m highlighting the crucial point that critical thinking and the press are also especially important when the civil liberties and personal safety of citizens are threatened by moral panics.
The even the NYT says … meme from Cheney was spot on.
It seems little has changed. The corruption of the highest office in the land is obvious.
I was reading up on encryption (thanks to Mica Lee for his work) and found this interesting article from 2013 on elliptic curves, at ARStechnica
Elliptic curve encryption is the super-bomb of encryption but it needs a high entropy seed number for good random number generation. The seed is what NSA has corrupted. NIST is supposed to be the official independent arbiter of what’s what in technology.
When the NIST says something is secure, one should assume they have waterfront property in Florida for sale, too.
Maybe Jeff Sessions will show up at Trump Tower with some experts in child trafficking. Trump can tweet something like “Fighting child-trafficking will be a top priority in the next administration’s Justice Department.”
Perhaps Trump can restore confidence in the rule of law where the MSM has failed.
Let The Donald Do It.
https://youtu.be/J0-QGu8lOO4
I remember reading about the Salam Witch trials in the 1600’s . Some things never change.
Some witches deserve to burn.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2eFp2ub03s
I’m afraid that many women Will “burn” when the new SCOTUS is finalized.
Exactly. And the enlightened response is not “but Iraq!” No one whose life ( or that of a loved one) was destroyed by the Satanic Panic, or who owns or works at that pizza joint, is going to find such glib dismissals acceptable.
“I remember reading about the Salam Witch trials in the 1600’s . Some things never change.”
———————-
I agree. Terrible things happened to all salami in those times.
Educational attainment in the United States (2014)[3]
Education Age 25 and over Age 25-29
High school diploma 88.31% 90.83%
Some college 58.57% 64.31%
Associate and/or bachelor’s degree 41.89% 44.08%
Bachelor’s degree 31.96% 34.04%
Master’s and/or doctorate and/or professional degree 11.77% 7.57%
Doctorate and/or professional degree 3.27% 1.70%
Doctorate 1.77% 0.89%
Source: Wikipedia
The close to fifty percent who attained a bachelor’s degree or better probably have the smarts to use multiple sources for news and maybe the analytical skills to conclude news from BS. This leaves half of the population clueless. Can we expect anything better from a media world that caters to the latter?
The first percentage refers to over 25 years old. The second to cohort 25-29 years old.
At least as worrying is do they teach critical thinking in our public schools? Outside of exposure to the scientific method, how is the issue of determining truth handled, if it is handled at all?
A woman married to a public high school principal told me only yesterday she’s not sure they much address this.
Good question! I will discuss with my college junior grandson and HS junior granddaughter and report back.
Mona,
At Thanksgiving we had an evening long discussion with my daughter, son-in-law and the two grandchildren. It was abundantly clear that the latter knew truth from fiction. That is encouraging. Our grandson was clear that “The Millenials” did know the difference and that they would be important to reform.
I wish Debate was a required course in school.
The most important political (and beyond) thing my wingnut father taught me was this: “Just because it is in print that doesn’t mean it’s true.” (I would apply that fact to a variety of issues and sources he certainly didn’t intend for me to.)
That fundamental reality should be addressed in school , often. With examples, of which there is a literal flood.
Lets be rational here.
They don’t child pornography sex rings set out of pizzerias. i mean, come on.
They can just be good friends with Jeffrey Epstein.
There is always a flight going down to his island…
I took the time to read the Podesta emails myself. I learned the pedophile code words from the FBI list. The emails are full of them — obviously being used as code words, used by Podesta himself. I saw the Instagram posts and other social media posts by this James Alefantis and his cohorts. I don’t need anyone else to tell me that these people are sinister. That’s why this thing blew up. It was not unfounded accusations, and no one has yet investigated anything.
You’re either completely ignorant of what pizzagate is about, or you’re being wilfully obtuse for reasons best known to yourself. Pizzagate ostensibly concerns codewords used in emails by Podesta and various others: these codewords are known paedophile jargon. When you add to this Andrew Breitbart’s tweet from 2011 expressing his disbelief that Podesta had yet to be arrested for -guess what- paedophilia, people like yourself who refuse to entertain the notion that the great and good are capable of such horrifying acts serve only to enable the likes of Jimmy Savile, Cyril Smith, Ted Heath et al. How anyone can look at those Wikileaks emails and come to the conclusion that there’s absolutely nothing to be concerned about must in my opinion be viewed with suspicion.
Great article. Journalism is non existent in mainstream media.
https://backchannel.com/tech-journalism-just-got-worse-74d4a6763901#.hz002n70b
Cuts both ways, doesn’t it?
This is exactly why I refer to the pretense of the
United States of America
as the faking U$A.
We live in a world dominated by a lust for money. It is the god, the
supposed source of “freedom,” and the supposed source of
“security” for the overwhelming number of people on the planet.
It is the great trap which is going to drive this toxin-spewing
species (and many more) into an unimaginable hell.
The craving depends upon misrepresentation, pompous
prideful stupidity, and complicity.
Phoniness is promoted as integrity and the greatest example of this
is the belief that the faking U$A is or was primarily about human rights.
There is one human right which is sacred to the vast majority and
that is the right to acquire monetary wealth at the expense of all else.
The faking “supreme court” has determined that money is speech,
but they cannot dare allow themselves to recognize that the
faking state is a religious enterprise which worships
the accumulation of money above all else.
If you try to resist the religion, you are seen as an “indian”
and you will be removed, one way or another.
This is the policy of the democrats and the republicans, no
matter what faking words they use to manipulate and trap.
The greater problem is that this phony “american way of life”
is desperately wanted around the planet.
“The greater problem is that this phony “american way of life” is desperately wanted around the planet.”
Well, that itself is a two-fold myth: first, what the media presents as the “American way of life” is not how 99% of the American population actually lives; and second, the notion that other countries actually want the American way of life (world’s largest prison population, huge numbers of homeless, low-quality public education, no free health care system).
You are splitting hairs. How 99% percent of a population live
has not stopped approximately 97% of that population from endorsing
the negative aspects of the faking U$A when they vote for the
faking representatives of the greedy corporatists who depend upon
the delusional actions of the population.
Just because you can accurately see and connect the truth of
the inherent negative aspects
of the so-called ” american way of life” does not negate the fact
that the corruption is global. I dare say it is probably genetic.
Every ascendancy of a powerful “nation” in human history has fallen
under the same underlying over-reaching abusiveness coupled with
the illusion of some nationalistic pride and the inability of people
to see beyond their false identity and
the desire for excessive affluence keeps reappearing as a foolish
proof of supposed superiority, when it is actually a symptom of
a shared disease.
We are talking about fakery and I stated that the “american way of life”
is “phony.”
There is no “america.” That title itself is fakery, yet even you state it as
if it is a real identity, when it is just one of many delusions which
are used globally to limit human awareness.
There were 4 choices this year,and the American people chose the best candidate running.
Stein has shown her false colors,Johnson sucked,a zionist ball sucker,,and the Hell Bitch the worst possible choice in American history.
Thank you America.
Trump just nominated Goldman/Sachs CO Gary Cohen, to be Sec. Treasury.
I’m sure they made Trump an offer he couldn’t refu$e.
As a businessman, Trump will always have a price.
If only Shillary had been so honest …
What you just said would not be allowed in China or many Totalitarian countries. You would GO DIRECTLY to jail for critique of the regime. We may be a fake Knock Off of your “perfect country” but I have been in worse. A Knock off Gucci Democracy is manageable.
What you don’t want to face is that
by the time the corporate capitalist empire is through with
its global human resources, China’s intolerance will look
prescient.
There is a global war for resources and it has little to do with
human rights. It is about affluence and greed and it depends on
increasing feelings of insecurity and desperation in order to
manipulate people into rash actions.
The wars in Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria, Libya, Palestine, Pakistan,
and everywhere else the NATOmic machine pushes their agenda
are just a taste of what is in the future.
All of it is economics and the new Versailles is Wall Street.
They use words about human rights to hide what they are really
about – global economic domination.
There will never be enough for them.
Trump or Clinton, it doesn’t matter. They are both lying
corporate predators and the fact that they received so many
votes is very reassuring to the owners.
The Fake News backlash is the corporate media / government propaganda sector’s response to their loss of control over narratives. John Kerry was caught moaning over this new reality a few years ago, i.e. the large amounts of information available to people outside those channels:
“Well, folks, ever since the end of the Cold War, forces have been unleashed that were tamped down for centuries by dictators, and that was complicated further by this little thing called the internet and the ability of people everywhere to communicate instantaneously and to have more information coming at them in one day than most people can process in months or a year. It makes it much harder to govern, makes it much harder to organize people. . . – John Kerry, August 2013
(This incidentally explains why the U.S. State Department has always been so supportive of dictatorships around the world, from the Middle East to Africa to South America and Asia, as long as they turn over their natural resources to American corporations in exchange for large Swiss bank accounts.)
Compare that to the effectiveness of the old media system. One example is the 1996 election of Boris Yeltsin in Russia. A year before the election, Yeltsin had a 3% approval rating. But his backers, the oligarchs Gusinsky and Berezovsky, combined their media assets (essentially all Russian media at the time) and demonized his opponents non-stop, while running only positive stories about Yeltsin, and managed to increase his approval rating to 53%, and Yeltsin won the election. There was no Internet in Russia at the time, of course; all channels were saying the same thing. That is detailed in Ben Mezrich’s “Once Upon a Time in Russia – The Rise of the Oligarchs.”
http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/23846393-once-upon-a-time-in-russia
Similar tactics were used by the U.S. and British government and media in 2002-2003 to promote the Iraq War and all the lies about WMDs – but notably, in 2013, a similar effort aimed at promoting a military assault on Syria by Obama and Cameron completely failed, with many people becoming aware that the supposed chemical attack by Syria was not factually linked to the Syrian government – thanks mainly to Internet information sources.
Likewise, the coordinated media campaign to demonize Donald Trump and secure the presidency for Hillary Clinton was an abject failure; although it was initially fairly effective in blocking Sanders from winning the Democratic primary, the end result was a disaster for the agenda of the corporate media owners.
So this response, corporate media and government propaganda interests blowing the “Fake News” trumpet, is not the least bit surprising. However, the only people who will believe it are that smallish section of the public who still trusts traditional media sources, which according to polls is only 25% of the population.
“Folks” is shorthand for “idiots.”
The Big Lie nearly succeeded in 2016, simply wasn’t big enough. Republicans failed to sabotage their own Convention and Primary process commensurately with Democrats. Time to astroturf the Big Lie, divorce it from authoritative oracles originating in major media markets, whom the unsophisticated un-persuaded only resent.
Wikipedia.org on “Martingale (betting system)”: “The simplest of these strategies was designed for a game in which the gambler wins his stake if a coin comes up heads and loses it if the coin comes up tails. The strategy had the gambler double his bet after every loss, so that the first win would recover all previous losses plus win a profit equal to the original stake…. Since a gambler with infinite wealth will, almost surely, eventually flip heads, the martingale betting strategy was seen as a sure thing by those who advocated it. Of course, none of the gamblers in fact possessed infinite wealth, and the exponential growth of the bets would eventually bankrupt ‘unlucky’ gamblers who chose to use the martingale.”
MSNBC should be toast, but, sadly, it is not. The mainstream media is playing a major role in weakening democracy.
Great article Glenn. The MSM has resorted to desperate measures in these desperate times because their doom now is inevitable. We are living in a information renaissance age very similar to the technology renaissance we experienced some 25 years ago. I can only hope the trend continues! Could you imagine the horror these elite presstitutes are experiencing right now. It’s as if the dark side has realize the Death Star is disintegrating before thier very eyes and jumping off of that burning pile of bullshit will only land them in the abyss! The beauty of it all….
Excellent article making a moral case against the promoters of these shenanigans. We also need libel suits, so that the case is not only moral but also impacts their bottom line.
Ho hum. Business as usual. Our lies are good. Their lies are bad.
You must not be familiar with Greenwald’s writing. He has been exposing the lies of the powerful – regardless of which side propagates them – since 2005, when he started with Bush. Things got more interesting in 2008 when he started taking Obama to task.
Fake news is necessary to fill the gap between the world as it is, and the world as we would like it to be. My main concern is that fake news is becoming clumsier and more transparent. I blame this on social media which disseminates of fake news before it can be fully polished and given a coherent narrative. When more fake news is generated by artificial intelligences, this problem will eventually be resolved.
I blame this on social media which disseminates of fake news before it can be fully polished and given a coherent narrative. When more fake news is generated by artificial intelligences, this problem will eventually be resolved.
If you say so, Benito. But it seems to me there are always more turds than turd polishers.
I suppose they could focus on the higher quality turds, but that still leaves a lot of floaters around to, um, gum up the works. ;-}
I’ve never seen ‘news’ on Facebook, all they do is gum-up my email. Don’t twit or ‘follow’ officially (I do, stay in touch.) and rarely watch MSNBCBSABCNN … I have a hard enough time trying to make sense of the New York Times!
*I’m like virgin, touched for the very first time. .. *h/t Madonna
Never bit on the facebark bait. Figured, if I wanted someone to see something/know something about me, I could always email or even write a good old fashioned letter (my stars!).
I find twitter to be an interesting way of keeping a finger (or two) on the particular pulses that interest me. Even following idjits can have some value, though it is, by necessity, diluted a bit by the dreck. ;-}
It may not be possible to polish every turd, but instituting a simple treatment process should not be too difficult. Far too many people are being exposed to toxic raw news. The first treatment stage will convert this to Fake News – useful for spreading memes but not much else. The second treatment stage converts it to Mainstream Media News – safe for mass consumption. The third and fourth treatment stages produce a highly potent product that is only suitable for high level decision makers who have been properly trained to handle the truth.
How to tell. I remember the old saying “If it’s TOO good to be true” In the end people will swallow which ever pill that will make their vision of the world more rosey
will robert mackey be writing a column on this?
Of course Robert Mackay has already written an article about this but unfortunately he’s usually on the side of helping spread the fake news.
he wrote a column about the hilary supporter writing a fake speech transcript?
seems uncharacteristic.
The willingness to run with fake news and lack of checking makes me wonder if MSNBC runs fake news all the time. In the past it was “spin” from government officials or maybe Party officials. The Internet has democratized “spin” into “fake news”. Shame on MSNBC and the WaPo and NYT, our supposedly respected media outlets.
Someone ought to keep a scorecard of which journalists report which fake news items.
And we need an honest progressive daily news organization now. I appreciate the work of The Intercept more than ever. Thank you!
I still think MSM has a long way to go to catch up with Trump who lies through his teeth every single minute.
The serial lying MSM hates Trump,as do their water carriers McCain and Graham who just amplified the Russian hacking election horseshite.
And the Hell bitch went to capitol hill with fake news claims.
When are people going to wake up to the fact that the enemy is the media and their real allegiance,zion,which hates the thought of American sovereignty that Trump embodies.
Oh,and the russkies(NYTs) are accusing virtuous serial criminals on pedophilia claims,which probably is an attempt to link to the Pizza gate stuff,which some here are too quick to call bogus,as these pos criminals are capable of anything,buggering children included.
HOW you spewed all that out of my simple one line statement says volumes about your way of thinking. Do you really think that MSM is that perverted. I think they are rather bland an shallow at best.
Yves Smith’s site, Naked Capitalism, sent a letter to WaPoo via their lawyer:
We Demand That The Washington Post Retract Its Propaganda Story Defaming Naked Capitalism and Other Sites and Issue an Apology
Of course, the WaPoo has chosen to ignore it:
Washington Post Refuses to Retract Article Defaming Naked Capitalism and Other Sites
Not just a letter, they’re suing them for defamation.
But look at this incredible piece by Mark Ames. Yes, I know and remember that Ames went totally nuts for some reason about Omidyar in relation to Greenwald and the Snowden documents a few years back, but the guy knows how to research so I have to get beyond that in order to let in what he writes when his writing are sometimes amazingly deep and well done.
Reading his article brought to mind how often some yahoo types, “Everybody already knew all of that.” As if everybody, including themselves, are yawning geniuses who are just putting up with all of us who are late to the hog trough of information. Well, that’s almost always an idiotic statement, not to mention, a lie, but in the case of this article by Ames I dare anyone to honestly say that they already knew all of that.
Here’s the final paragraph. No point in excerpting the article into bits and pieces.
Site Behind WAPO’s McCarthyite Blacklist Appears to Be Linked to Ukrainian Fascists and CIA Spies
Fake News indeed! I will look forward to seeing this article being taken out of context on vigilant citizen, the epoch times, infowars, zerohedge, breitbart, WND, beforeitsnews, et. al..
MSNBC…doing the impossible…making RW news credible. And…the Democratic Party? Who ran their campaign…Martha Coakley?
Great article Glenn. I lived in China for years and “fake news” and “false rumors” are the propaganda points the Communist Party uses to widely censor the internet. While they can and do point to some negative examples, somehow all the info about environmental degradation and violations of human rights get swept under the censorship rug too. Wonder how that happens? It is such a pain to use the internet behind the great firewall. I hope people don’t begin explicitly arguing for the US government to suppress fake news, because a whole lot of relevant information (wikileaks, snowden etc.) will get hushed up real quick.
it’s hard to actually do fake news unless you espouse fake events.
Most of the fakocity today has to do with rules for relationships being touted by elected who’ers for corporat power.
As i see it, the emphasis by wmd media is to be able to stifle free press by making it expensive or liable, not criminal, yet.
THEY STILL WANT A WAR.
Trump will privatize the internet. China will buy it!
Why would Trump destroy that which helped make him POTUS?
So there would be just serial liar reportage again?
I love how they dump on Trump,but don’t realize they are helping the enemy,zion,in keeping themselves in the dark.
It would be hillaryous,if it wasn’t so dumb.
The credibility of those disseminating Fake News is what should be addressed. Whether it’s willful disregard for the truth or just plain journalistic laziness, News and Media outlets are becoming less about communication of Fact to help the public make sound decisions and more about helping a candidate win an election, ie..Propoganda.
I feel that the journalistic community needs to have some sort of outside independent audit report on the integrity and factual accuracy it communicates to the public. Something similar to what public For-Profit companies are required to do through the SEC and the FASB.
The FCC should put together an independent panel whose responsibility it is to outline rules for accuracy and authenticity of communicating facts and stories to the public. And that if a company such as MSNBC wants to bear the title of a News Agency, it should have to earn it by undergoing an audit of its stories for factual correctness.
Otherwise,MSNBC should not be allowed to call itself a News Agency.
This is a matter of the public having the right to discern a company’s objective related to other companies. It’s analogous to an investor reading audited financial of different companies to decide where to put their money (faith) in.
Right now, it’s the wild-wild west and people put their trust into whom they believe the most, not necessarily whose the most factual.
how about a truth rating site that differentiates between events and meanings?
Who Checks the raters who check the raters who checks the raters on to infinity. Who pays Checkers to check the facts. Great employment scheme. # Big Brother is watching the watcher who is watching you. Paranoia runs deep into your life i will creep! WATCH OUT!
Big 4 accounting firms. They’re good at uncovering facts and not fooled by spoofs.
LOL< LOL<Does our pay them? IF YES add that to our bloated budget.
Auditors are paid by those who audit them…..in this case, it would be the MSM responsible for their fees, not the taxpayer.
Big 4 accounting firms. They’re good at uncovering facts and not fooled by spoofs.
I believe Deloitte is at the top of that pile of four, no?
Deloitte sued for $7.6B over mortgage fraud
Yeah, that’s the ticket. :-s
Two points on your comment.
1. That’s one case in how many audited financial statements produced over time? What’s the error rate? minimal. If that’s what you demand for a confidence level, you’ll be disappointed about anything in life.
2. No amount of auditing will protect from fraud by collusion. When parties collude to defraud an auditor, it’s hard to detect.
3. The defense against this suit will be, and is always for auditors, that they performed the audit with reasonable assurance, not absolute assurance.
4. You are now pointing a finger of guilt based on an accusation, not a finding. Are yo comfortable with that position?
Oooops, I guess it was more than two points….lol. my bad.
http://www.law360.com/articles/478030/deloitte-settles-suits-over-taylor-bean-audits
Gonna retract #4 above. Looks like DT did settle out of court for the case you mentioned. I didn’t realize this was back in 2011 and the case was settled. When I clicked on your link, I was getting an Insecure Connection Error message.
couldn’t agree more about the state of journalism … but holy shit Galactus-36215 … you are being serious here !!
“Big 4 accounting firms. They’re good at uncovering facts and not fooled by spoofs.”
… i just read on >> you are actually defending this comment – wow.
initially i was giggling at your (i thought, facetious) observation … now i’m just stunned.
No worries. Giggle on. But self-governance is the long term solution. We can debate on details over who would best be in a position to give an independent opinion, auditors or some other third party. But the thrust of my comment is that self-governance and independent opinion on the news organizations is the most viable solution.
Even if an audit of a news agency’s quality control process is the only outcome, then at least the readers/viewers have another data point to consider when channel-surfing or reading sh*t on the Internet.
Most of the big media orgs are public companies. They already have financial reporting obligations. I’m merely suggesting media reporting obligations and third party opinions and using the FASB/SEC for an example of what media and journalists could do to at least highlight more trustworthy sources.
Determine an event vs a meeting
This choice or knowing this doesn’t affect democracy or elections.
Hey, Galactus, I am sure you would make for a good candidate as “people’s protector” or something in China or maybe the Demos’ info director.
“if a company […] wants to bear the title of a News Agency, it should have to earn it by undergoing an audit of its stories for factual correctness.”
Seriously, are you suggesting that some ‘state organ’ licenses speech? Or maybe some independent and impartial org such as the League of Women Voters or the Center for Southern Poverty?
This is very funny, especially at a time when the ‘mainstream’ media (air quotes) are gaining speed on the slippery slope of losing credibility. Seriously, anything that’s ‘officially certified’ as trustworthy by some government body or even some fake ‘professional’ body is going to be instantly not trusted by the Millennials and even more so by Gen Z. And if Facebook, Twitter and the Youtubes volunteer to censor things in order to support certain agenda, people will leave them and find some other sources for information and commentary.
The FASB has 7 seats. 1 by the Government, 3 from corporations and 3 from big 4 audit firms.
The point being, they look to create rules by which they are measured.
The journalistic community should get together and create rules for fair reporting to the public. This is NOT a govt org as you suggest, but rather the journalistic community along with the govt come up with some rules they decide themselves that can be audited whereby the outcome leads to better and more accurate reporting.
An audit report can provide and independent judgement about fitness.
Yes, I think League of Woman Voters would make an excellent choice as one seat on the board making or deciding the rules.
Fitness = fairness
Sorry.
Greenwald would be another excellent choice to sit on the board as well. He’s deeply committed to telling facts.
Of all the statements I see on here, yours is the one I like most.
There used to be a set of guiding principles for journalism…I’m old enough to remember studying them in school — high school AND college. But then the “change” took place, and journalists wanted to become reporters, and reporters wanted to become on air personalities. Integrity of following the written and unwritten rules went out the window for “interpretation” and personal flair (i.e. rating builders).
Perhaps the best thing that can come from this election cycle is that journalism — old school, written journalism that has been researched and vetted according to RULES — can rebound and become the art it used to be once again.
Thanks for you kind thoughts.
My main point is that up until now, the journalistic community has resorted to combating each other with their version of truth or fact. The media need to come up with some sort of structure to self-regulate or self-govern these sort of issues because screaming at each other from their own websites or formats isn’t cutting it.
I’m a firm believer that an honest person looking for truth will find it, but they do need to look carefully for it.
I’ll have to make a point and (not) watch some cable news and late night shows the next few days to (not) see their (lack of) commentary on this example of fake news.
I think I’m over thinking my thinking. I’ll have to think about that. “GROUNDHOG DAY”
Your boy Donald go elected, just like you wanted.
Shut up already, we’ve had enough of this fake-balance crap.
George Soros is funding the attacks on Comet Ping Pong Pizza
a lie – and that is what it is: a claim made with knowledge of its falsity or reckless disregard for its truth – and you most aggressively amplify
It’s been delicious this year seeing just about every claim the
Clinton/DNC/pundit camp made about others turn out to be self-descriptions.
Smear campaigns, online harassment, election tampering, unfair media coverage, fake news. They looked at themselves to discover the worst things they could say of others.
Seriously, this election has shown us one thing — when an establishment politician says something, you can be fairly sure the opposite is true. They don’t comment on things that they aren’t trying to spin (which is stupid, in its own right). I feel like ANY POLITICALLY AWARE PERSON, on stage against Trump or Clinton, could have beaten either in the debates.
With even this and the piece in The Daily Beast I don’t expect Eichenwald, Frum, Nance or Reid to acknowledge their complicit contribution to Chacon’s effort. What I do expect is, eventually, (ostensibly, because Trump) some twitter accounts will be wiped clean and some of the evidence of their support will be a fortuitous loss.
I held the claims against WikiLeaks at a distance. Not having seen the “evidence” of the spoofed email, all there seemed to be were the claims of those who wanted to spread the the claim. I don’t consider myself a sophisticated skeptic of the news or “news.” But, I am sensitive to when the argument is litigated by pounding the table. The absolute certainty of folks like Joy Reid was off-putting all on its own. I can envy people’s absolute certainty for some things, but I’ve sadly learned the world in which I live offers little consistent evidence for such save gravity.
Of course, the most important point is the side-by-side issue of defining “Fake News,” and any efforts to combat it. Censorship is not the way to go here. Our collective efforts at citizenship, no matter how messy or fumbling, will not be advanced by entities imposing some standard for “Fake News” that is too easily manipulated to advance preferred forms/origins of truth/”truth.” I have my own “filter system,” thanks. And, as inadequate as it may be, it still has the ability to adjust as evidence accrues.
I am sensitive to when the argument is litigated by pounding the table. The absolute certainty of folks like Joy Reid was off-putting all on its own.
Yes. There are some things – “tells”, if you will – that lend themselves, absent actual facts, in support that what’s being proffered might be something less than a useful truth.
It was fascinating to me to experience the 2000 election campaign season through my husband’s eyes. Raised as he was in the Czech Republic (Czechoslovakia at the time), he was well-versed in the uses of propaganda via so-called “news outlets”. He was quite good at spotting the “tells” and more than a little disappointed to find such in a country he’d (til recently) idealized.
Our collective efforts at citizenship, no matter how messy or fumbling, will not be advanced by entities imposing some standard for “Fake News” that is too easily manipulated to advance preferred forms/origins of truth/”truth.” I have my own “filter system,” thanks. And, as inadequate as it may be, it still has the ability to adjust as evidence accrues.
Exactly so. That last bolded bit seems to be what people like JoyAnn Reid and Eichenwald are lacking. Or maybe it’s just selected out by the time you rise to that level of remuneration.
indeed. Enduring the pain of fake news is the price of free speech. And worth it.
Marco was creating intentionally fake articles to bring attention to the right wing echo chamber friends of his that they were presenting him with fake articles and fake information (Clinton body count, etc). He went further and created articles so fake that no person could believe them in order to present the articles to them to show them how gullible they were to fake news.
SO FREAKING WELL SAID…KUDOS! if I could up vote you on this site I would.
If MSM put out a story that, “If you kiss your own ass, you can add 50 years to your life”, 90% of the American people would have broken spines and in back braces!
“If you Free your Mind… your Ass will catch up later!”
Great article. The way the Clinton campaign handled the wikileaks disclosure was nothing short of an embarrassment.
Their argument was also logically unsound: it was analogous to someone claiming that stolen goods are fake by virtue of being stolen!
Thank you, and the rest of the intercept team for your work. It turns out to be quite hard to find reliable journalism today.
Thanks Mr Greenwald, great article.
Perhaps some legal authority could explain why these fake newsers can’t be sued for libel?
At least one site — Naked Capitalism — has taken steps in that very direction:
https://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2016/12/we-demand-that-the-washington-post-retract-its-propaganda-story-defaming-naked-capitalism-and-other-sites-and-issue-an-apology.html#!
Libel laws are a valid tool for combatting false claims and statements, but they are also easily abused — by Peter Thiel, for example. So it’s interesting that you react to this story in a way that Glenn has criticized before in liberals and others: by advocating the use of state power to control speech you dislike. Let me stress that I’m not saying that nolib one should ever use libel law to protect themselves, only that the reflexive appeal to state power to regulate speech is suspect.
Spot on, Glenn. Alas, those who spread the real fake news are going unchecked, while those who bring up real news get smeared.
(Speaking of fake news, one of the sites listed is Moon Of Alabama. The standard smear is that it simply repeats Russian propaganda. This week it came to light that the reverse is true- after RT’s German service plagarized an article from said website.)
The link is to an article from the author of the Moon of Alabama article which RT plagiarized.
Moon of Alabama
oddly, http://RT.com is more like America used to be.
The mutant mainstream media (or WMD media) is nothing but propaganda for lopsided power relationships between thieves and their victims.
keep talking, my word shredder gets sharper by the shred.
ps – too bad about the yinon plan falling apart now that Syria will be a protectorate of Russia. awful, just awful.
Seems to always be the case, although there are exceptions:
“those who most loudly denounce [insert sin here] are typically those most aggressively [engaging in said sin].”
Willy said it best… “Me thinks thou doest protest too much” Hamlet.
Good bless you for publishing this. You’re my truth hero….
This is an important article, which reveals the “worst of the worst” of MSM spreaders of “Fake News.” I’m interested to see if any of them comment about this article or ever are taken to task by others for their proven lies and propaganda and their grossly shoddy “journalism.”
In the meantime, here is an edit correction you might want to make, Glenn:
Should be ‘excerpts’ rather than experts.
I think you meant to write excerpts here. If so, feel free to delete this comment when you make that edit.
Good article.
Yes.. Hegelian dangers. Nice read! :)