To remain in office after an election catastrophe, Theresa May will be forced to rely on the support of a small party of extremists from Northern Ireland.
Updated: June 10, 12:34 p.m. EDT
At the end of an election campaign that was nasty, brutish and short, British voters punished Prime Minister Theresa May at the polls on Thursday, depriving her Conservative Party of its governing majority in Parliament, and forcing her to rely on the support of a small party of extremists from Northern Ireland to stay in office.
Despite a late surge in support for the opposition Labour Party, whose leader Jeremy Corbyn offered a more uplifting vision of the future, the Conservatives managed to hold on to most of their seats, but are now the largest party in what’s known as a hung Parliament, where no single party can rule without some form of support from at least one other.
May said on Friday that she would govern with the backing of the Democratic Unionist Party, or D.U.P., extreme social conservatives from the Ulster Protestant community whose main aim is keeping the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland intact, by rejecting demands for a united Ireland.
I will form a government to "provide certainty and lead Britain forward" - Theresa May https://t.co/8xOR0z6PJc #bbcelection #GE2017 pic.twitter.com/GPFYj5GxH5
— BBC Breaking News (@BBCBreaking) June 9, 2017
As several commentators observed on Friday, the British public generally pays no attention to politics in Northern Ireland, and so might be in for a shock to discover just how extreme members of the D.U.P. are.
Ian Paisley, longtime leader of the DUP, was a religious fundamentalist. So much for May fighting extremism
— Omar Waraich (@OmarWaraich) June 9, 2017
The party, founded by the virulently anti-Catholic, evangelical preacher Ian Paisley — who once denounced Pope John Paul II to his face as “the Antichrist” — still includes fundamentalist Christians who believe in creationism but not climate science, and have fought to keep U.K. laws permitting both abortion and same-sex marriage from being implemented in Northern Ireland.
The DUP is the political wing of the 18th century, a bunch of homophobic bigots, and now they have the Tories over a barrel. ?
— Owen Jones (@OwenJones84) June 9, 2017
They have blocked a women's right to bodily autonomy. You can't have an abortion in Northern Ireland, thanks to the DUP.
— Stuart Gibson (@stuartgibson) June 9, 2017
Several of them, including former environment and health ministers, are young-earth creationists.
— Stuart Gibson (@stuartgibson) June 9, 2017
Terrorist organisations literally did a mail drop last week telling people they had to vote for them.
— Stuart Gibson (@stuartgibson) June 9, 2017
The #DUP is stuffed with climate change deniers, homophobes and misogynists. May's alliance is a dishonourable coalition of chaos.
— GeorgeMonbiot (@GeorgeMonbiot) June 9, 2017
According to research by Jon Tonge, a British and Irish politics professor at the University of Liverpool, 63 percent of D.U.P. members are against the legalization of abortion, 66 percent say that homosexuality is wrong, and 75 percent would mind if a relative married someone of a different religion.
Sixty-eight percent of the party’s members voted against the Good Friday Agreement that ended three decades of sectarian, armed conflict in 1998 and established a local government in which power is shared by the region’s mainly Protestant unionists, who see themselves as British, with its mainly Catholic nationalists, who consider themselves Irish. Seventy-three percent of the party’s members say they would vote against the agreement now. That might help to explain why the D.U.P. leader, Arlene Forster, has refused a demand by Sinn Fein, the leading nationalist party, to step down over corruption allegations, leading to the collapse of the regional government.
The D.U.P. also has a history of close ties to Ulster’s loyalist paramilitary gangs, who were responsible for terrorist atrocities against Irish Catholic civilians.
Good morning, Britain. Here’s some old photos of the DUP, in case you haven’t met them before. pic.twitter.com/3ZQGBCy2qM
— Colin Graham (@19acres) June 9, 2017
Those militant groups were supposed to have disbanded after the peace accord was signed in 1998, but they continue to exist and have been involved in gangland-style killings as recently as last month.
The party’s leader, Foster, even met last week with the head of the Ulster Defence Association, just days after the U.D.A. was implicated in a brutal murder in a supermarket car park, believed to be part of a feud between rival factions.
Jackie McDonald on chatting with Arlene Foster this week.https://t.co/XcZDCbx9At @irish_news pic.twitter.com/8oYQi1yn5W
— Brendan Hughes (@brendanhughes64) June 1, 2017
Given that the vicious tabloid campaign to smear Jeremy Corbyn as an “apologist for terror,” focused on his supposed failure to condemn the I.R.A. in strong enough terms, it will be interesting to see how those same newspapers now present May’s deal with the political allies of Ulster militants as perfectly acceptable.
"Jeremy Corbyn is weak on defence, he'll destroy our country, he's a terrorist sympathiser." You were saying? This lot endorse the DUP... pic.twitter.com/eZWIwl4kaP
— ChippingBarnetLabour (@ChippingLabour) June 9, 2017
When you've spent 2 years calling Jeremy Corbyn a terrorist sympathiser but now you're wanting the DUP to prop your government up. pic.twitter.com/UpnGXcXWYh
— Dale (@DaleRobertsDR) June 9, 2017
Add to all this the fact that, as the Northern Irish journalist Siobhan Fenton explains, “Northern Ireland’s peace process risks being destabilised by the coalition.”
“In the aftermath of the Troubles, British governments are required to be neutral towards Northern Irish parties and not pick ‘sides,'” Fenton notes. “With a D.U.P.-Conservative coalition, it is difficult to see how the Tories can claim to be a neutral broker on Northern Irish issues anymore.”
That’s particularly bad at the moment, since Northern Ireland’s local government is not functioning and the British and Irish governments are supposed to work as honest brokers to help resolve conflicts between the two communities.
Should May’s government survive throughout the Brexit negotiations — another election is certainly possible, as is an internal challenge to her leadership — cooperation with the Ulster Unionists will also put the focus on how the deal might effect the currently open border between the Republic of Ireland, which is staying in the E.U., and Northern Ireland, which will leave with the rest of the U.K.
The election results were May’s reward for running what was widely described as a dismal campaign, in which she promised an austere future marked by further cuts to social services and police numbers, and threatened to pull the U.K. from the European Union with no trade agreement at all if necessary to satisfy Brexit fanatics. She also, to no apparent profit, raised the possibility of lifting the ban on fox hunting, which appears to have cost her votes.
Anecdotally from candidates and based on our most-shared data, I really think fox hunting (& ivory ban) cost the Tories some marginal seats.
— Jim Waterson (@jimwaterson) June 9, 2017
I've just passed a fox ?.He looked well pleased. #hungparliament
— Jim Corbridge (@MrBonMot) June 9, 2017
2. Fox hunting & changes to social care were turning points in how people felt about the PM in highly personalised campaign
— Sarah Wollaston (@sarahwollaston) June 9, 2017
That the Conservatives lost at least a dozen seats, and Labour gained at least 29, was a stunning reversal from the expected outcome just seven weeks ago, when May called the election three years early because of a commanding lead in opinion polls that showed her more than 20 points ahead of the opposition leader Jeremy Corbyn’s Labour Party.
Although the Conservatives won at least 57 more seats than Labour, their final advantage in the popular vote was just two percentage points: 42-40.
The last time a losing Labour leader got 40% of the vote was 1970.
— Jeremy Vine (@theJeremyVine) June 9, 2017
Gordon Brown — 29%
Ed Miliband — 30%
Michael Foot — 28% pic.twitter.com/WBtxJD13lW
Given the unbridled hostility of Britain’s right-wing tabloids for Corbyn, and a lack of support from the more centrist members of his party, Labour’s strong second on a boldly left-wing platform — promising free university tuition and better funding for the National Health Service — was a remarkable showing.
This week, the anti-democratic Tory press tried to tell people how to vote. The people of Britain said, "FUCK NO, NOT THIS TIME." pic.twitter.com/UVllwI44fr
— hrtbps (@hrtbps) June 9, 2017
It was also made possible, at least in part, by a media law that compels British broadcasters to give genuinely fair and balanced coverage to major parties during election campaigns. For the past seven weeks, while the nation’s newspapers have been filled with anti-Corbyn invective, and the Conservatives flooded Facebook feeds with misleading video of his remarks about the I.R.A., television coverage of the campaign gave airtime to discussions of Labour’s policy proposals, which proved to be broadly popular.
While detailed estimates of the turnout by age are not yet available, many pollsters concluded that Corbyn’s campaign had inspired young voters, who overwhelmingly support him, to go to the polls in greater numbers than usual — upsetting turnout models that expected a Conservative win based on an older electorate.
How did this result happen? My 14,000-sample post-vote poll points to the answers at https://t.co/jBlv7ScWJo pic.twitter.com/dDGpe6s0zZ
— Lord Ashcroft (@LordAshcroft) June 9, 2017
"Data suggests this is the first election since 1992 that the majority of young people (18-24's) have voted" - Prof Jon Tonge#bbcelection pic.twitter.com/uKpFM64WYj
— BBC Radio 5 live (@bbc5live) June 9, 2017
Top photo: Britain’s Prime Minister and leader of the Conservative Party Theresa May returns to 10 Downing Street in central London on June 9, 2017.
The UK Labour Party refuses to contest elections in Northern Irelands 18 constituencies [and in breach of its own rule book] although it is an integral part of the UK, workers there can only vote for either the Catholic candidate or the Protestant candidate or Unionist/Nationalist in other words if you cannot vote for the Party that governs you Conservative, Labour or LibDem, you effectively have no vote. Perhaps if working people in NI had the opportunity to vote for the only progressive and major party of the UK with a chance to form a government ‘The Labour Party’, then an alliance with the DUP may not have been neccessary. The Labour Party until very recently have refused to allow socialists and other Trade Unionists [the majority of whom are in British based Unions] to become individual members of the party, now they are, but the party will not allow them to organiize and contest elections in any of the NI constituencies in the Province. This is a glaring democratic deficit. People may criticize the DUP, but the British Labour Party is more to blame for excluding NI workers from any input on Labour Party policy in NI and at Westminster. [Tax rates, Defence, NHS and all non devolved mattters]. Why should the DUP be criticized when the Labour Party refuses to challenge the sectarian tribal politics of the DUP and other NI parties and consigns the NI electorate to a future of sectarianism.
Too funny.
Let’s accept your premise that the main UK mainland parties field candidates in NI. That means Labour, Conservatives and Lib Dems.
Lib Dems are an irrelevance who no-one in NI would vote for.
The ‘working people’ (whatever the hell that means in your obsolete class-ridden trade 60s trade union construct) spent 60 years being bombed, murdered and shot. Yep, before you tell me, there were Unionist paramilitaries doing it as well, (mostly targeted shootings though rather than bombings) but from a purely statistical point of view the ‘problem’ to wider civilians was the IRA (funded and equipped by their mates in the US). Fact is it was also the root cause because if it hadn’t been engaged in its activities to usurp the rule of law then the Unionist paramilitaries wouldn’t have formed as a response.
In any event, out of this mess, do you really think that there would have suddenly been an outpouring of support for Labour in NI from ‘working people’ given that they are all very well aware of Corbyn’s apologist stance on IRA terror? OK so his multiple pronouncements on why NI should be handed back to the Irish would be enough to ensure that he would never get any seats. Couple that with all the photos of him standing shoulder to shoulder with that arch murder Martin McGuinness and he has absolutely no prospect whatsoever of his party ever getting elected there as long as he is in charge, and probably a lot longer.
If, whichever god you pray to, forbid ‘The Labour Party’ ever gets to form a government, the UK will be bankrupted. It will take two decades to unscrew what they broke last time they were in power courtesy of the war criminal Tony Blair. The damage that they could do at this precise turning point in British history is absolutely unimaginable.
My definition of the working class may align with the US definition of middle class? Why are you so dismissive of such a large group of people Catholic and Protestant in Northern Ireland.
Back in the early sixties the ‘Northern Ireland Labour Party’ had considerable support [for a provincial party] My argument is because NI will be part of the UK for the forseeable future and any constitutional change must be by consent, and since all important legislation is passed at Westminster , the failure of the party of government and other major parties who aspire to govern to allow citizens of Northern Ireland to vote for them is a denial of democracy. If you cannot vote for the Parties that govern you, you essentially have no vote.
In order to break this sectarian log jam they should be given a non sectarian choice. In Liverpool we had Catholic and Protestant Parties with the accompanying violence to go with them, it was only in the 1970’s with the growth of a strong Liverpool Labour Party that workers were able to put aside their religious differences and come together to further their class interests on a non sectarian basis within the LP. Similarly Glasgow and other parts of Scotland experienced sectarianism [although on a smaller scale].
Hi – A very thoughtful response, particularly the observation about a non-sectarian alternative. That is a very good point. A non-sectarian alternative would definitely be a good thing.
The problem is that the two main parties – Labour and the Conservatives – are not non sectarian alternatives. That is my underlying point which possibly on reflection could have been made clearer. The Labour party in general and Corbyn (and his ridiculous shadow home secretary) was far, far, far too cosy throughout the troubles with the Provisional IRA and the very thinly disguised murders in Sinn Fein. The people of Northern Ireland have long memories and my point was that (even if the mainland millennials seem to have forgotten it) no-one in NI will have forgiven or forgotten Corbyn for being an apologist for terror and particularly not the section of society who might be regarded as the typical Labour voting demographic.
I don’t know how well up on NI you are at the moment, but the ‘Peace’ there is really a lot more fragile than the thin veneer of calm over the top would suggest. I certainly don’t think that the people have forgotten Corbyn.
For the Conservatives part. Well when the murderer in chief, Martin McGuinness recently died, Norman Tebbit said of him that the ‘world is a sweeter place’ and hopes he is ‘parked in a particularly hot and unpleasant corner of hell for all eternity’. Actually I couldn’t have put it better myself. Nevertheless I don’t see many NI Catholics seeing the Conservatives as a non-partisan choice. They also have long memories.
You could say what does it matter. So the Catholics all vote Labour and the Protestants all vote Conservative (I generalise but you get the point), at least they are all represented by main stream parties in the UK Parliament. Possibly, but it still remains partisan and that has the potential to get even more messy – and the UK has enough problems on its hands at the moment with Brexit and delusional Islamic psychopaths (and of course a slightly diminished Wee Jimmy Crankier still agitating in Scotland) to entertain another source of friction at the moment. Best keep the thing at arms length and sort out domestic sovereignty issues first before poking that hornets nest again.
The constitutional position of Northern Ireland has been settled with the signing of the Good Friday Agreement . In 1973 a border poll in NI found that 98.9% of the electorate prefered NI to remain part of the UK, whereas 1.1% prefered a United Ireland. Later a referendum was held in the Irish Republic to change articles 2 and 3 of the Irish constitution [which claimed sovereignty over the whole of Ireland and its territorial waters] the result 94.39% to change it, 5.6% to keep it. All perfectly democratic, there can be no change in the constitutional position of NI within the UK without the consent of a majority vote in NI approving it. Northern Ireland has the right to self determination and that fact has been given legitimacy in both parts of Ireland through the democractic process. It must be pointed out that various Nationalist Parties Boycotted the NI referendum, in my opinion this was because they knew what a disaster the result would be for them.
On another point A major survey by Northern Ireland’s two universities has found support for a united Ireland at an all-time low.
The DUP has welcomed the findings of the Northern Ireland Life and Times Survey which reported that just 16% were in favour of unification.
The survey, which was conducted between October and December last year, found just 33% of Catholics wanted Irish unity on the long term. More than half of Catholics said they would prefer to stay in the UK, a view shared by 90% of Protestants.http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/survey-most-northern-ireland-catholics-want-to-remain-in-uk-28628245.html
i suspect that dumya and cheney attacked iraq with the intent that the subsequent disruption would spread and that Europe would be flooded with refugees and turmoils and dumya and cheney did so with the intent of throwing europe into chaos to create a market for US weapons and the spread of the USD. It is possible that the US secretly wants to destroy european countries and wreak havoc around the planet.
Such devastation would result in countries begging for money to fix the problems that US caused. Then the world bank could step in to print money for loans to create more massive debt for their currency scheme.
Consumer credit defaults are rising. They will get much worse. The thieving imbeciles that run wallstreet will insist that their elected whores create more conflict and war to get cash into the economy.
Thank God for Jeremy Corbyn.When the wars amp up, the elected morons and their financiers can send themselves and their own sons and daughters to fight while the rest of US remain home, grow food, fix up and enjoy life.
The version of Hanlon’s razor, “Never attribute to guile that which can be adequately explained by stupidity” is IMO the operative thought when it comes to Cheney and Bush. Neither of those gentlemen has to my knowledge ever demonstrated any capacity for forward thinking.
I agree with you though that the elites in the US see Europe as a potential challenger and wish to do everything they can to weaken it, starting with the destruction of the EU. What could be better for Wall Street than all the countries in Europe allied against and at war with each other, leaving it to the US to profit by selling to both sides? And if Russia can be dragged into the mix, so much the better. After all, Napoleon “almost” defeated Russia, as did Hitler. Perhaps the third time would be a charm. The US certainly lacks the fortitude and stamina to waste 20 million lives defeating Russia (the number the Russians lost in WW2); better to let the Germans and French go at them.
“i suspect that dumya and cheney attacked iraq with the intent that the subsequent disruption would spread and that Europe would be flooded with refugees and turmoils and dumya and cheney did so with the intent of throwing europe into chaos to create a market for US weapons and the spread of the USD. It is possible that the US secretly wants to destroy european countries and wreak havoc around the planet”.
Yes. And meanwhile the rest of us think that you are completely and utterly barking mad.
Please. As a matter of interest, could you please illuminate us with your view on Roswell, Area 51 and what really lies on the dark side of the moon? I am genuinely curious.
What is a amazing is that she can still form a majority with the DUP, as her main opponent promised free tuition, unlimited free health care and a soft brexit. People must be really desperate in the UK to still believe in fairy tales.
What a blunder of May not to have debated those unrealistic dreams. For that alone I think she should go.
The results suggest May’s hard brexit is not what ordinary people want. And Brits have enjoyed free healthcare since just after ww2 and their higher ed was free up until the Conservative party took it away about a decade ago. TM wouldn’t debate other leaders face to face because she knew her whole program stank and would be exposed as stinking. You need to try and wean yourself off the fairytales of GB’s hard right, billionaire-owned press, it’s been thoroughly discredited in the last few weeks.
“Just so crazy that young people want the same free college and stable employment that their grandparents had”
– Lee Fang
A biggest collection of private Periscope streams with all $$exy 9irl. Just sl9n here ->> http://www.linkto.eu/1UVVA <<- and write me (@pscp_king) to get access ))
Biggest victory for Labour Party in decades.
majority threshold, 326
party before > after
conservatives 331 > 318 (-13)
labour 232 > 262 (+30)
SNP 56 > 35
liberal democrat 9 > 12
democratic unionist (DUPs) 8 > 10
sinn fein 4 > 7
plaid cymru 3 > 4
other 8 > 2
Jeremy Corbyn favors public ownership of life support and currency.
As the Oracle points out at http://tokyopr.blogspot.jp/, May teaming up with DUP is going to be good for Corbyn. While May or a May-replacement is trying to handle government with a bunch of rightwing crazies who want to teach schookids that the world was created 6000 years ago, Corbyn will have time to “deselect” the Blairite Fifth Column in parliament. His real opposition is this hardcore of timeservers.
“crazies who want to teach schookids that the world was created 6000 years ago,… AND SLAUGHTERING THE PALESTINIANS IS DOING GOD’S WORK,
Organised crime coupled with religious psychos for cover and pride.
Then we have the other organised crime outfit of a political party, coupled with wallstreet, that defrauds voters, likely involving hit jobs of murder in dc and florida, and insisting that Russia is a problem.
Sanders is the US version of Corbyn? Not by a long shot. Sanders supports Israel murdering Palestinians. You can cover your ears and scream I CAN’T HEAR YOU all you want. But that doesn’t change facts.
tomthetroll? Posted your stupid crap at that other article. No mention of Sanders here, fool.
May has nobody to blame but herself. To Corbyn’s credit, he’s held the high ground against a tsunami of media abuse. Now is having DUP support going to save May as PM and Tory leader? Corbyn now has the necessary momentum to put more pressure on May on key issues. The Tories would never dream of kicking May out as PM? Don’t bet on it.
Theresa May preparing for her negotiations with the DUP
No More Catholics Left: https://youtu.be/P-0hIJOqlnE?t=1m13s
https://www.rt.com/op-edge/315409-corbyn-sanders-us-uk/
Elites cannot live as normal human beings. They have a PHOBIA as if allergic to other people.
Chris Hedges is always brilliant! A truly great man.
And yeah, while I love Bernie, he is no Corbyn.
Very good piece that needs to be read by all Bernie supporters. The guy is no Jeremy Corbyn, and his feet will have to be held to the fire by his supporters or he is likely to completely sell out.
The author of this piece appears to inhabit some weird parallel universe not inhabited by the rest of us in the UK outside of the London bubble.
At the end of the day you can say what you want, but Corbyn is an unreformed crypto-communist who is on record as being an terrorist appologist, not just the IRA, but also some pretty unpleasant Palestinian groups with a penchant for blowing up children. If you bother reading up on it, this is not some misrepresentation cooked up by the right wing media which unfortunately in the UK is in reality quite left wing and PC, particularly the BBC which really is an awful left wing propaganda machine. Whilst I appreciate that supporting the IRA with arms, explosives and money to be used against British civilians was a popular American pastime throughout the Troubles, it is not a position widely approved of in the UK. Therefore anyone who actually remembers the IRA atrocities in the UK will have a pretty dim view of the man.
He has also voted against every single piece of anti terror legislation put before Parliament since he became an MP. He is in favour of unilateral nuclear disarmament – including the US by the way and also wants open borders so that any old terrorist can march in and pull off another Manchester.
His party essentially bankrupted Britain last time they were in power and the current government is still trying to sort out the mess.
To make matters worse, his shadow cabinet are also a bunch of craven PC, loony-left non-entities who, virtually to a man, have never held down a real job in their lives and who, when you google them, have in the past come out with some of the most startling claptrap which you will ever have heard come out of the mouth of a Politician. I know that in the US you have your own problems in this respect at the moment, but your lot have nothing on ours. In particular I wouldn’t trust his shadow home secretary to water my lawn much less deal with the utter mess which is the legacy of Tony Blair.
The man is positively dangerous and I just thank god that he didn’t claw his way into power. The country could not have taken 4 years of him without genuine break down of civil order.
The funny thing that Robert Mackey and his ilk have not considered is that a hung Parliament may actually be a good thing (from a right-wing perspective) in the long term given the impending Brexit negotiations. This is the reverse of what is being suggested. If the Conservatives had ended up with a significant majority, May could have forced through any number of botched negotiations which would have ended up with the UK having the worst of all worlds – no membership of the European club, but still subject to, amongst other things, the truly awful open and porous borders and the contemptible EU Human Rights Act and detestable court of Human Rights. I.e. a ‘soft Brexit’ as the left would perceive it would actually mean the worst of all worlds for the UK. This way, with no working majority the chances are she will have her hands tied trying to sort out the mess in Parliament and won’t be able to negotiate a thing with the EU. This will result in a ‘hard Brexit’. What that actually means is that the UK gets its Sovereignty back in totality (rejoice), we get to tear up the EU statute book in totality, including human rights legislation (hurrah) and we can control our own borders and get a grip of who is in the UK and who shouldn’t be (and not before time). We will then revert to WTO trade guidelines and get to negotiate our own trade deals as we see fit.
Frankly this solution works for most of us, other possibly than the immigrant cohorts in London and frightened little millennial bunny rabbits who grew up in the EUSSR and can’t conceive of the fact that the UK is perfectly capable of standing on its own two feet as a sovereign nation outside of what Frau Merkel is trying to turn into the Islamised bastard child of the USSR and the 4th Reich.
So all in all, not such a terrible short or long term outcome from a certain perspective.
This msg. is from the other parallel universe..
Crypto means secret, hidden..”terrorists sympathizer” means not giving the military anything they ask for,
Regarding the Troubles, isn’t the Prime Minister is sucking up to the DUP ? Didn’t the British create Northern Ireland in the first place?
What sort of man decides to be a politician in the first place?
A man who needs a job to support his family?
A man who has the gift of gab and lots of rich friends?
Corbyn is an unreformed crypto-communist?
Corbyn is a disciple of God’s will for public ownership of Life Support property provided by God Himself.
Corbyn is a terrorist appologist?
Terrorism is an act of the Torrie hangover hegemony from empire days of abuse and oppression of Ireland and the zion supported murder of Palestinians to steal land
frightened little millennial bunny rabbits who grew up in the EUSSR?
There is something wrong with your mind. Brain damage?
Never mind my supposed brain damage. What on earth do your first two lines in italic even mean? Your statement appears to be a jumble of words thrown together which have no coherent point and don’t relate to what I wrote. As it happens he is an unreformed crypto-communist and I am not quite sure what your objection is.
As for your second two lines in italics, that is also barely coherent, but at least I have some idea what you are trying to convey. Not too sure what exactly the British have to do with the current Zionist plot to take over the world… I mean. Come on. Really? I admire your attempt at brevity, but you do still need to be grounded in reality and write in a way that can be understood and responded to logically.
As for your third point when you turn to insults. Well, that tells me all I need to know.
What I actually wrote was “frightened little millennial bunny rabbits who grew up in the EUSSR and can’t conceive of the fact that the UK is perfectly capable of standing on its own two feet as a sovereign nation outside of what Frau Merkel is trying to turn into the Islamised bastard child of the USSR and the 4th Reich”.
Whilst you might take exception to my characterisation of the EU as the Islamised bastard child of the USSR and the 4th Reich, I note that you don’t. Probably because that is pretty much what it is starting to look like and it is difficult to disagree.
Also you don’t take exception to the point that millennials for the most part can’t conceive of the fact that the UK is perfectly capable of standing on its own two feet as a sovereign nation outside of the awful EU.
OK. So what you actually are objecting to is my characterisation of millennials as frightened little bunny rabbits. So, permit me to rephrase that so that you can scuttle off back to the asylum happy. Delete “bunny rabbit”, insert “children”.
Better now?
” . . . the truly awful open and porous borders and the contemptible EU Human Rights Act and detestable court of Human Rights. . .” says all anyone needs to know about you and your ilk. The UK is the target of terrorist attacks as a result of centuries of imperialism, colonialism and neo-colonialism. You can bet there would be no terror attacks if the British leadership were not so eager to join with the US in our insane wars against the people of the Middle East. Corbyn is quite right to oppose the approach of British PMs of late, because everything they have done has only made the problem worse.
Lets put it this way. It isn’t as though the UK was a backward banana republic with no concept of ‘yuman rites’ before the enlighted EU came along and bestowed the concept on us. Hell, we came up with Magna Carta and the very concept of the Bill of Rights for god’s sake.
The problem that most law abiding people in the UK have with the EU Human Rights Act (and its consequent manifestation in UK domestic law) is that it prevents us from kicking out foreign criminals and terrorists who have no right whatsoever to be in the UK. To illustrate this point:
Drunk foreign national who is a failed asylum seeker runs unlicenced, unregistered and uninsured car at twice the speed limit through a red light and into a car crossing in front of him. He kills the mother driving the car, one of the children in the back and cripples the other child. Never should have been in the country in the first place, but was allowed to stay because his sick wife is receiving vastly expensive life saving medical treatment on the NHS (read the tax payer) for a lifelong condition which will kill her if she is sent home. She shouldn’t be in the UK either by the way.
Court decides that UK is not allowed to throw him (or indeed both of them out) because it would infringe her human right to life.
Meanwhile grieving husband has to pick up pieces of his life and care for crippled child for the rest of hers.
Taxpayer gets to pick up the legal aid bill, the child’s medical bill. the wife’s medical bill, housing for the two failed asylum seekers and welfare handouts to them for the rest of their natural lives because, lets face it, they are never going to be anything other than a parasite on the rest of society.
This wouldn’t be so bad if it were a one off. Problem is it is day in, day out, serious criminals, terrorist sympathisers and other general rabble who have absolutely no legitimate claim to be in our country. And then there is the whole industry of parasitic ambulance chasing human rights lawyers who have bled the system dry since this farce was enacted.
So. I would say that my statement does indeed say all anyone needs to know about me and my ilk. And I am happy about it. Hugely pissed off with my country being told what we can and cannot do by a bunch of foreigners, imposing their legislation on us with a complete and utter loss of sovereignty and self determination. See Brexit as a the natural consequence.
And yes, as soon as we start ripping up the statute book imposed on us by such a fantastically enlightened Europe, the happier we will be. Starting with the Human Rights Act (UK) and moving on from there.
I also notice that you live in the US which is still a sovereign country (unlike the UK) prior to Brexit. It is not without amusement that I note this. You realise that your Constitution was drafted using the English Bill of Rights as the starting point. You appear to have scorn for my position, objecting to foreign imposed legislation and loss of sovereignty and the usurping of British law founded on the English Bill of Rights and Magna Carta.
OK. Let say I suggest that the US became a federated state with Canada, Mexico and all South American countries, and that all US Citizens became subject to law based on the Spanish civil code issued by an undemocratic autocracy in Buenos Aires. All law issued by this remote foreign government usurps US law and every time something is introduced you have to amend your constitution.
What would you say to that?
Because that is what you are telling me that the British should accept for their own country. Sorry don’t think so.
The funny thing is that I was undecided about Brexit and how I would vote. You know what swung it for me. It was that idiot Obama standing up and telling British Citizens that we should collectively take it up the arse in perpetuity because we are a good proxy for American influence in Europe.
That was very helpful because it convinced me and a lot like me which way to vote.
Funny thing is that if Obama has stood up and said that the US should rip up its constitution and accept foreign governance from Buenos Aires, he would probably gone the way of JFK. But he and you lot on that side of the pond don’t seem to be able to get your heads around it.
Next point. Much of what you say about terrorism I actually (perhaps surprisingly to you) agree with the sentiment of. Particularly the bit about insane US wars in the Middle East. No argument there. I think your position is simplistic because I think we would still get terrorist attacks but perhaps I will leave that on a general note of agreement. I do have to disagree about Corbyn though. Just because the current approach is ‘bad’ doesn’t mean Corbyn’s position of disagreement is automatically ‘good’. Actually he is ‘worse’.
What is needed is to get the UK out of Europe for all the reasons stated and regain some sort of control over our own legislation, borders and destiny. After that sorts itself out and we actually have a functioning Parliament which can actually enact legislation without continually being buggered by Europe, then our MPs might have a chance of sorting out the legacy of Blair.
My God. What a load of tommy rot.
(I’m in a hurry. I don’t have time to deal with your “points”. But I’ll be back, DV.)
Damn millennials, why aren’t you NOT paying attention like your parents and grand parents?!
Why? Could I offer this:
There was a group of wild rabbits in the forest, they would skip around and play, eat and sleep. One day a pile of lettuce was placed in the forest so they ate it. The next day another pile appeared so they ate that too. After a few days they decided not to eat anywhere else because this pile of food kept appearing.
One day a single row of fence panels appeared next to the food, they thought nothing of it, and carried on eating. A few days later another row appeared, at right angles to the first, but it didn’t bother them, they had free food and that was good.
The next day another row of fence panels appeared, but the food was still there. They carried on eating and barely noticed the fence. Life was good, they had all that they needed and they didn’t need anything else.
One day while they were all eating, a fourth row of fencing appeared, it didn’t bother them, they had food, they had forgotten all about life outside of the fence, they even had baby rabbits that never knew what that life was like, or what it meant to skip all around a forest.
They just carried on eating the food, and their children never knew that there was anything else to think about, so it didn’t bother them either.
The older rabbits died, their offspring grew up inside the fence. They thought that the fence was normal, and hoped that no one came along and took it away.
Fortunately someone has just put the brakes on this rabbit farm by accidentally driven a backhoe through two sides of the fence. Now that bastard certainly wasn’t part of the agenda was it :-) Now all the bloody rabbits are just about to start hopping through the wood again, damn them.
Ok, so they might have to go and look for their own food again, but I am sure that they will get over it. When they realise that they now have self determination and self governance again.
For the tweeter who said that the DUP represented the 18th century, the 18th century was the age of the Enlightenment. The DUP belongs in the 14th century.
Labour’s Owen Smith: ‘I was wrong about Jeremy Corbyn’
Too bad UKIP has no seats now. Where is Nigel Farage when you need him?
Too bad? I suppose the reason why the UKIP has no seats is that virtually everyone in the UK, whether for or against BREXIT, realizes what a bunch of abject liars they are. For his part, Nigel continues to collect his EU salary as a member of the EU Parliament. I suppose he will continue to do so until the process is complete, by which time he will have cemented his ties with the Don. Who knows, he might wind up as FBI director.
Well the Tories hate terrorists, unless the terrorists are Protestants who kill Catholic children.
Indeed, or unless the terrorists at being bankrolled by their Saudi pals..
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/jun/05/theresa-may-urged-not-to-suppress-report-into-funding-of-jihadi-groups
Mona writes
“…….Many of us are far more than merely “uncomfortable.” The site’s first moral obligation is to a young woman named Reality Winner who is in a federal prison and charged with a crime that could take ten of the best years of her life by slamming her into a hellhole…….”
Reality has one thing going for her that Snowden and Manning did not. She allegedly released a single document – not 800,000 like Manning who could not have vetted the documents (who knows how many Snowden stole). Unless she is convicted of stealing a bunch more, she should not get much time. She broke the law – and there was nothing illegal by the (US) government exposed in the document. Just like Snowden and Manning, she signed a confidentiality agreement. You cannot decide what should be seen by the public – even in the case of Russian hacking – no matter how much of a nitwit Trump is.
Reality obviously is not that bright having used a work computer to contact the Intercept. She probably would have been caught no matter what even if the Intercept had just published the document (instead of verifying the document with the NSA).
For once you and I agree on something. Ms. Winner was a fool and doubly so for trusting the Intercept not to basically identify her to the NSA. Amateur hour all around in this case, presuming that TI insiders weren’t actually cooperating with the NSA’s investigation.
Missing from your would-be analysis is the classification of the document that Winner leaked – I doubt it was Top Secret, but I don’t know for sure. The cables that Manning released were definitely NOT highly classified. Winner is going to be made an example of by the government and TI should share in some of that accountability – for after all, the so-called revelation was actually a whole bunch of nothing. Spear phishing allegations that we’d mostly all heard before.
Craig is vile. My important replies to you occur in the Naomi Klein thread. (Craig often holds forth on matters about which he is entirely clueless; all reports are that Reality Winner contacted The Intercept in March to request copies of podcasts. Nothing to do with any leak.)
Whoever the source is, including if it is Reality Winner, merits full support from those of us who support all whistleblowers. Proud authoritarians like Craig are beneath contempt, and I have zero intention of discussing this important matter with a slug such as him. It’s depressing to see anyone else reasonable and decent choose to do so.
Mista Craigsummers:
Your incessant commentaries advocate nothing. You write like an out-of-work movie critic who by default, hates all movies. You express as if you were a zombie incapable of knowing what a good life is and how to enjoy it whilst including reasonable differences. You seem to lack imagination and critical thinking skills. You come across as Dr. Martin without the talent or expertise. If you actually do have friends or know of persons who like being in your company, my guess is that you are paying them.
Oh come on, write about Reality Winner, you guys. At least admit how weird the whole thing is.
http://www.mediaite.com/online/nsa-leaking-suspect-wrote-that-she-wanted-to-burn-the-white-house-down/
Note that the linked article is unduly frenzied and entirely lacking in any awareness of irony or privacy, even as it nevertheless points to the suspiciously difficult nature of the whole incident and the unlikely composite-personality of the individual who has been either instrumental or useful in undermining this publication.
Golly-gee, Maisie! Thanks for guiding my sorry, clueless self to a site where the comment section makes TI look like Aristotle’s Lyceum.
But I emphatically second the request: [W]rite about Reality Winner, you guys.
The comments on mediaite are generally like a slapping match between angry seals.
The sides taken are (incredibly uptight) establishment left and establishment right, which makes it damn funny when Jordan Chariton pens an article there and all of them turn on him instead because he supports neither.
I think this Winner mess needs honest confessions of confirmation-bias, over-eagerness, perhaps gullibility and even culpability. The CFR neoliberal wing here has wrought this imbroglio, in my view.
I rather enjoyed Peter Van Buren’s somewhat cynical skepticism 3 days ago regarding the whole Reality Winner story. I don’t echo every question he asked in this piece but found he certainly echoed a few of mine.
They didn’t need help with that. They did it quite thoroughly on their own. Multiple credible individuals have weighed in on the monumental fuck-up the reporters here perpetrated. To again cite just one, see John Kiriakou.
I’m weighing in, too! I think the source itself is suspicious, either set up by her superiors or something even more offensive.
Note to readers: This comment is just an opinion. Ask your conscience, gut-feeling and reflective logic if ‘Maisie’s Opinion’ is right for you.
Is this Opinion thing available over the counter or do I need a prescription?
And how does it affect old people’s sex lives?
It’s best taken as a supplement, sometimes with a pinch of salt.
It shouldn’t have adverse sexual effects, especially not if you’re as well hung as British parliament is today.
It’s a good thing that it’s hard to choke on ice cream, cuz it would be all your fault.
See medical attention if skepticism lasts longer than four hours.
I entirely lack skepticism about the reality of federal penitentiaries and what’s now happening to, and in store for, Reality Winner. I further lack skepticism about the monumental stupidity of “national security journalists” revealing a source’s post mark to a defense contractor, and then sending the government a copy of a micro-dot impregnated source document.
Those things, independent of whatever else may be true, are prima facie awful.
What this girl needs is a [Snowden-like] ‘Secret Mantle of Power’, pronto. Read some blurbs on Ms Winner’s arraignment yesterday and discovered she’s been talking on the jailhouse phone with her mother discussing ‘incriminating’ stuff. .. On the jailhouse phone!
For someone with a Top Secret security clearance, Ms Winner evidently has no spy-craft. Nada. None. .. which seems a bit odd.
I’m still trying to get a grip on that phone call, sis:
‘news outlet’ (hereafter TI): “Hello. This is ___ ____ from The Intercept. We have received a Top Secret NSA report anonymously and would like your comments on it?
‘gov. contractor’ (hereafter Pluribus Intl.): “What? Is you crazy. What is The Intercept and how did you get our number?”
TI: “I’m a ‘national security reporter’ with TI and the NSA Top Secret report we received anonymously via snail mail has a Augusta, Ga. post mark/routing code. Consulting my handy rolodex of IC contractors in the area, we thought Pluribus could verify it’s authentication before we report on it?
Pluribus Intl.: “Is this a prank call? Or fake news of some sort. As a national security reporter you must know as a private IC contractor handling sensitive gov. material we can neither confirm or deny the authenticity of any classified gov. material. Not wittingly, anyway.”
TI: “Well, it was a shot in the dark. I’ll call the NSA … and get back to you asap.”
Pluribus Intl. “Ok … we’ll leave the light on.”
p.s. Also, the appropriate gov. ‘authority’ who classified this NSA ‘nothing burger’ report as Top Secret obviously has some OCD issues.
The weird thing about her case is that her spycraft seems so utterly lacking that the average Internet conspiracy theorist knows more than she seems to. I mean, someone like that would have released WAAY more classified information to America’s enemies if she HADN’T decided to leak a document to the press, simply by not realizing something was fishy when she clicked on that chain letter when she went on the airport wi-fi with the classified laptop or something.
Long Live Ireland+Labour
An Island Called Ireland…
Imagine that John Lennon
I love Jeremy Corbyn and loads of British lads, but Ireland ain’t England…and it ain’t British either, regardless if one puts a Queen or N in front of it. It’s a flippin’ Island called Ireland. Leave them be.
Nate Allen
PostScript
How about this trade: we in LatAm trade Europe the Falklands for French Guiana, but ESA can keep their space station, and we all agree to give Northern Ireland to the nation whose name is….get this…Ireland!
PostScript 2
US agrees to stop their plans for 2 military bases in Argentina , in return, Argentina will sell them limes at a 2% discount
Yep. Meanwhile back to reality where absolutely none of that is going to happen any time soon.
So you’re probably right about none of this happening any time soon, but I’ll keep dreaming. Political reality is way too depressing right now.
This election clearly shows that change from the old order of elitists to a new progressive movement is possible when a good percentage (69 percent) of voters show up at the polls. Those in the US who hope for change from the staid regressive hierarchy can take note.
The difference? The Democrats shut progressives out. If Sanders had known that the Dems were going to go all McCarthy, and get caught with Podesta’s emails, would he have stayed in?
The folks voting 3rd party or staying home screamed volumes at the two parties…that they both had shit for candidates. The Dems are still totally deaf.
Sanders can always get back. I hope you guys do not underestimate Donald Trump. Remember his voters believe what he says, not the facts. Also be aware that Sanders will not change US foreign policy that much, and he cannot establish a single payer healthcare system at this time because the US cannot finance it. The US is not Denmark.
Check how much the USA spends on a grotesque military. The culture is at fault, because the culture can change the numbers. The Washington/London axis has been fascist for over a century; total denial of that fact is part of the problem.
That one is literally reciting from Hillary Clinton’s script, she said “The US is not Denmark.” He’s allergic to realities such as: New York City: Haitians Protest Hillary Clinton Commencement Address
1) I am not sure what this has to do with my points. I am not a US citizen. Your vote is your decision. Clinton/Trump/Sanders/Stein healthcare policies will not affect me. The same way Corbyn/May brexit is about the UK not Switzerland. I am stating the obvious. In 2002 Chavez even went to Norway and expressed how he wanted a similar model in Venezuela. How is it now? The US is not Denmark. Venezuela is not Norway. France is not Finland. That is just the way it is.
2) What is it so hard for you to ignore commenters who ask you to ignore them and whom you suggest others to ignore?
“Check how much the USA spends on a grotesque military.”
1) The US spending on military is essentially a subsidy to several corporations. You stop that subsidy, then thousands of people will lose their jobs. How many jobs a US president is willing to lose on his watch?
2) You can finance healthcare with higher taxes. The taxes Sanders proposed will not be enough. The US is not Denmark or Norway. Americans traditionally hate taxes while they want efficient services at the same time. The middle class will never accept the massive tax hike necessary to finance a single payer.
I told everybody in 2000 that Chavez’s plan will not work. And in 2015 I told everybody Tsipras would not be a communist when elected and he would follow the same austerity measures he had opposed. Everybody called me an imperialist then. Many will describe me as an imperialist for stating those obvious points about Sanders. I hope Sanders run again and get elected. The same way I hope Corbyn becomes prime minister soon. Then I will be vindicated.
Thanks for the opportunity to promote a highly worthwhile documentary, originally produced by and posted at this site, when Laura Poitras’ “Field of Visions” project was hosted here: (a href=”https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MZsHT2FZkxk”>#ThisIsACoup: how the EU destroyed the Tsipras government. As reviewed elsewhere:
Neoliberalism destroys lives. All should watch the series on its destruction of lives in Greece.
Let’s try that link again: ThisIsACoup: how the EU destroyed the Tsipras government
And? What is your point? Am I factually incorrect? Did Tsipras stopped the austerity policies as he promised?
ThisIsACoup: how the EU destroyed the Tsipras government
More from the review:
All really should view this fine documentary series.
I still don’t get your point. Tsipras promised to stop the austerity measures. Did he keep his promise?
EU: we will not help unless you pass austerity measures. Regardless who get elected.
Tsipras: we will not pass the austerity measures.
Swisscheese in 2015: Tsipras will pass the austerity measures. He says he won’t just to get elected.
Conclusion: Tsipras passed the austerity measures.
You can blame the EU, Darth Vader…I am even surprised you did not blame Israel or Zionists for Greece problems. The point is that a candidate gave a promise he knew he could not keep. Sanders and Corbyn are doing the same. A single payer is too expensive for the US. Corbyn wants to spend money he does not have. If you are US citizen please vote for Sanders. If you are Brit vote for Corbyn. Give me a few months/years, and I will say I told you so.
Oh, I’m pretty sure you do. In any event, view the film, in which Greece’s statesmen/women, journalists and citizens address the depredations of neoliberals & etc. themselves.
No, I do not. My point:
1) candidates make promises they cannot keep just to get elected. Example: Tsipras.
2) leaders apply popular, but inefficient policies: Example Hugo Chavez
Your link: Neoliberals are bad people.
And?
Are you trying to inform me that neoliberals are bad people? If that is your point, then do not vote them. Or are you trying to inform me that many Greeks believe neoliberals are bad people? Then, they should not vote for them.
At any rate, that has nothing to do with my points.
You brought up Greece via Tsipras. Any possible “point” a neoliberal hack such as you might raise about matters in Greece is effectively and wholly rebutted in: ThisIsACoup: how the EU destroyed the Tsipras government You will not view it, but I expect other readers will, and therefore I took the opportunity you afforded to discuss and link to this fine documentary series. So, thanks for that.
My point is candidates do promises they know they cannot keep. This has been a fact for centuries. If you think that means I am a “neoliberal” then, it is sad that you are intellectually incapable of understanding that extremely simple point.
Again, if you believe neoliberals are bad people, then do not vote for them. If Greeks believe they are bad people, then they should not vote for them. If Greeks believe the EU is bad, then they should do like the UK and leave.
You link does not rebut my point BECAUSE IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH MY POINT.
I think you should ignore my comments as you have been claiming you would for the last two weeks. You are better at calling names than understanding simple points.
ThisIsACoup: how the EU destroyed the Tsipras government
I’m a little bit uncomfortable with the fact that TI has thus far neglected to address comments in the public sphere that they have burned their source in the Russian hacking story that turned out to be a whole lot of nothing. The way TI handled the documents, providing direct proof to the NSA, and the source itself was extremely sloppy, if not both morally and factually reprehensible. Will this ever be addressed?
It is a trademark of fascist systems to bring all media in line to prevent potential dissent. My educated guess is that TI is restraint at the moment through pressure from the powers to be. Not everyone has the courage of an Alan Rusbridger and rather destroys a hard drive instead of bowing to the pressure. TI has to prove to its readers that it has not become complicit to a political system that is ruthless and immoral. In the mean time all kinds of government agents are snooping around on this site. Be vigilant.
Many of us are far more than merely “uncomfortable.” The site’s first moral obligation is to a young woman named Reality Winner who is in a federal prison and charged with a crime that could take ten of the best years of her life by slamming her into a hellhole.
All because of gross incompetence on the part of journalists, and presumably an editor(s), who burned her (if, as widely reported, she is the source).
CIA torture whistleblower, John Kiriakou, was burned and betrayed by two of the same journalists. This is what he has to say about this whole fiasco.
A legal defense fund for Winner is the first, second and third causes to which this site should currently be devoting itself. That, and some accountability is overdue, as well as some transparency regarding how this travesty happened (to the extent such disclosures are consistent with the interests of Ms. Winner).
I echo your sentiments. Hope I have little that this will actually happen.
Mona, the following quote from you is key to everything else that you wrote:
I, same as everyone else, don’t know what is to come yet from The Intercept. I’ll see, along with everyone else, when they write about it, and what they have done, what they believe to have happened, and what they intend to do immediately and in the longer term. I have no doubt that The Intercept is working on it, and, even though I have rightfully expressed my deep concern, and that I am anxious and impatient to learn more as soon as is possible; not causing further harm has to be a huge consideration if not the very first consideration from The Intercept.
It’s crushing to see what Reality Winner has been faced with, and it has been extremely frustrating to see other media venues posting or speaking half-witted, half-baked, half-truths and non-truths while we wait for The Intercept, the only ones with the actual inside view of it all, to come out with a well considered response and statement about how they intend to go forward regarding Reality Winner and regarding the whole of the circumstance that has been created.
Whoa! Cole is Toast
Holy shit!!! What an indictment of Matthew Cole.
Jesus.
I agree, but I would really appreciate TI at least acknowledging this monumental “fuckup” (presuming it was indeed just a mistake or series of them) and making a statement of unwavering support for both Ms. Winner and a commitment to doing EVERYTHING possible to preserve the anonymity of sources. I am having a hard time getting over my disgust, and TI has taken a huge step down in my daily reading priority.
Which is why his criticisms of the authors and The Intercept should be viewed with skepticism. He has an axe to grind.
TI principals are acutely aware that there is a serious problem — nay, a fuck-up of such monumental proportion that, as Phil Giraldi says, ‘No one will go to The Intercept with information’
They also know, because they have been told in no uncertain terms that many of Glenn Greenwald’s longest-standing and most committed supporters are outraged and appalled by this disaster of incompetence.
Clear statements WRT accountability and corrective actions were expected, by this time, by many of us. The more time that passes before those are prominently issued, the greater the damage to TI’s (and its principals’) reputations for integrity and competence.
All of that said, Mona is correct: Job One is to set up and generously donate to a legal defense fund for a young woman languishing behind bars and facing, potentially, a decade in federal prison.
Yes. Could either you or Mona take up her case? Or is that your arena of expertise? Ms. Winner is going to need a very competent defense ala a Ben Wizner or such. WTF was Cole thinking!?!
While giving airtime and a platform for Labour and Corbyn during the campaign by the media undoubtedly did help reach voters not reached otherwise, to say that this was partly down to election fairness rules is incorrect. The election tv coverage was also biased against labour and corbyn, as it has been for the last 2 years. Not in the obvious pure sensationalism of the paper press, but in the way the narrative was framed and what questions, during reports, debates or otherwise, were asked and not asked and so on. Fair coverage election laws just amount to air time given in most cases.
May sides with the extremists, and the extremists side with May. The two terrorist attacks in the lead-up to election were clearly a vote by ISIS for the Conservatives.
They want to ensure the British people elect a government that’s frothing at the mouth about immigration and security.
Or a government willing to aid the Wahabi Saudis, target secular governments like Syria and the infidel Shi’a.
Exactly. Notice the similarity between, basically, religious conservatives in The West and extremists. Western government military action in the Middle East is simply uniformed terrorism. The security and fear industries, mated with the West’s military-industrial complex are making a killing in more ways than one.
Ali Abunimah: Theresa May to be propped up by Christian Zionists
They are, of course, much worse than just that., my emphasis:
DUP was actually founded for hating on Roman Catholics in Ireland. Large pockets of such Irish Catholics reside in places like Liverpool, and how May thinks she’s going to govern in alliance with DUP is, well, it is simply preposterous:
Of course, May likely won’t have long to carry on with this absurdity. Jeremy Corbyn could well be Prime Minister within a year.
Thanks for that. beat me to it?
As I mentioned in the other article, Paisley was very close to Bob Jones University in the USA, even when they defended segregation.
Yup. And this fucking site is doing it again — I posted a reply to Uncle Bob about Mackey, the Irish and Palestinians. It can only be read by clicking on “Latest” below the comments box.
“May likely won’t have long to carry on with this absurdity. Jeremy Corbyn could well be Prime Minister within a year.”
Let’s hope so.
I haven’t heard Corbyn commenting on taking the DUP into government. He was once calling for a unification of Ireland (something very much to support), so I would find it interesting to hear his stance on this, beyond his rightful call for May to resign.
Now for the Tories to give the most radical fraction of the Saxon settler movement in the colonized part of Ireland ministerial powers is unbelievable. I could have imagined a minority government supported by the DUP, but never a coalition.
Really, they have to have another election soon; otherwise civil war in NI could very well erupt again.
Well, yes, given that Theresa May is forging a coalition with a party of bigoted anti-Catholic, anti-Muslim, homophobic terrorists in the wholly unworthy cause of of settler colonialism in Ireland. May has the gall to do that after running a campaign ranting about Corbyn purportedly loving terrorists.
You forgot “anti-choice,” “anti-LGBT,” “climate change deniers,” “friends of assassins” and a few other things.
But it’s not easy to get all the Unionists’ fine attributes into a single post. ;^(
What percentage of the citizens turned out to vote?
I tried finding that number, but could not.
Did I miss it?
Overall 68,7%, which is only a bit higher than in the last couple of elections.
Although there is no exact breakdown of turnout published yet, it points to a very stark increase in participation by young voters. Some estimates say that more than 70% of people younger than 25 voted, in the last GE in 2015 it was just 42%.
Today I am enjoying some Gin and tonic water. With each sip, I’m more encouraged that the over-reach of the right wing and their morally stunted libertarian enablers will be amputated and that then all the little people who are routinely crushed by their enthusiasms can maybe hope to breath easy for awhile.
I was expecting for Corbyn to win. I hope he becomes the prime minister soon. His economic and foreign policy will not work. That is exactly why I would like him to win. So the U.K. can pull out of NATO, and withdraw all British troops overseas. I told everybody 20 years ago that Hugo Chavez’s economic policy will not work, but they called me an imperialist. This is Corbyn:
“When we celebrate, and it is a cause for celebration, the achievements of Venezuela, in jobs, in housing, in health, in education, but above all its role in the whole world as a completely different place, then we do that because we recognise what they have achieved.” June 2015
I will convince all my British friends to vote for Corbyn again, so the U.K. can celebrate the achievements of Venezuela.
Not sarcasm. I did convince my British friends to vote for Corbyn.
“I will convince all my British friends to vote for Corbyn”
Hmm
Is the UK heavily oil-dependent too? It’s not, and yet, it hasn’t grown since 2007.
This one’s a troll who in my experience is best ignored.
What hasn’t grown? UK dependence on oil or U.K. economy? Oil import has reached their highest levels in the U.K. for decades. The U.K. economy has been growing. Or are you referring to the UK budget being dependent on oil revenues? The UK is not really getting revenues from the oil industry. So I am not really clear on what you are referring to.
Anyway, oil revenue is not the only story behind Venezuela’s failure (or “achievements” according to Corbyn). Chavez chased private investors away in various sectors. He refused to admit reality. Corbyn is doing the same. He is promising a lot of spending but he will not find the money to finance it. You will close your ears if you like him. So, I would have voted for him if I was British just to prove my point.
Quarter to quarter there’s some growth, but if you look at its GDP in 2007, it’s basically the same as it is today.
Beyond that, it’s silly to pretend that either of us is equipped to analyze the economic situation of Venezuela in a more than superficial manner. But you might want to look at why Ecuador, for example, is getting out of the recession without major complications; or why Brazil’s economy has taken a dive under Temer.
First, you said it hasn’t grown since 2007 and now you are saying it is basically the same. These are the facts: in 2007 the UK GDP was 2.155 Trn. In 2016 the GDP was 2.812 Trn.
https://data.oecd.org/gdp/gross-domestic-product-gdp.htm
In mathematical sciences, when a number goes from 2.155 to 2.812 that is a growth.
“Beyond that, it’s silly to pretend that either of us is equipped to analyze the economic situation of Venezuela in a more than superficial manner”
You can talk for yourself, not for me. Venezuela spent money it did not have, relied heavily on oil, chased private investments away. It is not that complicated at all. You can try to complicate it or even blame the “great Satan” for Venezuela’s problems. I met first year students in economics in 2003 who predicted the current situation!
“Ecuador, for example, is getting out of the recession without major complications; or why Brazil’s economy has taken a dive under Temer.”
Because Ecuador reduced public spending, facilitate private investments, designed a budget to reduce poverty. Basically they did not spend money they did not have. Yes, you can still blame the US for all the problems in the world and apply realistic economic policies at the same time.
Brazil was diving before Temer! It is a result of poor fiscal policies and corruption.
You guys create your own facts even with mathematics!!
Take a look at World Bank data: 3.06 trillion in 2007 and 2.86 trillion as of 2015. (World Bank data is in “current US$” — presumably adjusted for inflation.)
Certainly, there are things with broad predictability about Venezuela, like its dependence on oil (one of the highest in the world, with oil that is relatively expensive to produce.) Everything else in your analysis, and the usual speculation, is basically driven by ideology. Venezuela is a market economy where the vast majority of companies are private. Compare to, say, China, whee 80% of enterprises are government-owned.
“Take a look at World Bank data: 3.06 trillion in 2007 and 2.86 trillion as of 2015. (World Bank data is in “current US$” — presumably adjusted for inflation.)”
Dude, you sincerely don’t understand or you pretend not to understand? Current US means they are using the current exchange rate without taking the effect of inflation into consideration. Taking inflation into account will reduce yearly GDP not increase it. You are looking at nominal GPD based on current exchange rates not real GDP or GDP with purchasing power parity. Even if you use the same data the NOMINAL CURRENT GDP current went down from 3.06 in 2007 to 2.367 in 2009 then it GREW from 2.367 to 2.861 in 2015. How do you look at those values and conclude UK GDP hasn’t grown since 2007?
“Venezuela is a market economy where the vast majority of companies are private. Compare to, say, China, whee 80% of enterprises are government-owned.”
I am starting to think that you really don’t know what you are talking about. You cannot possibly make those ignorant statements with the available facts. In Venezuela the Socialist Party nationalized oil, agriculture, finance, transportation, steel, gold, telecommunications, cement…I mean really, are you serious? It is not like Chavez was doing it secretly!
Moreover, China has been doing the opposite. They used a mixed ownership model (private/public) and they have been attracting private investors to take over their public enterprises. What exactly are you doing? Creating your own facts to please yourself?
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-venezuela-election-nationalizations-idUSBRE89701X20121008
Taking account inflation will obviously reduce the trend.
That’s ridiculous. You really think the UK grew at over 10%? You’re looking at different data and conflating the two.
“Taking account inflation will obviously reduce the trend.”
NO!! Inflation reduces the value of nominal GDP not the trend!
If your Nominal GDP is 100bn and your inflation rate is 10% then your Real GDP is 90bn. The following year, your nominal GDP is 110bn and inflation stays the same, then the Real GDP is 100bn. The value goes down, but the trend is upwards like the nominal value.
“That’s ridiculous. You really think the UK grew at over 10%? You’re looking at different data and conflating the two.”
World Bank: Nominal GDP UK Current:
2007: 3.063 2010: 2.43 2013: 2.72
2008: 2.875 2011: 2.609 2014: 2.999
2009: 2.367 2012: 2.646 2015: 2.861
What happened between 2009 and 2015?
http://data.worldbank.org/indicator/NY.GDP.MKTP.CD?end=2015&locations=GB&start=2007&view=chart
I take it you read some stuff online and then you think you know. You think oil was privately managed pre-Chavez? Regardless, after Chavez, a number of US companies have joint ventures with PDVSA. So yes, you hear sometimes that the Venezuelan government nationalized a particular company. It doesn’t mean it nationalized the entire industry or that it doesn’t work with the private sector. Do you think taxi co-ops are nationalized? Do you think the government runs the mobile networks? You can look up who the cellphone operators are. There are private internet providers, private media, etc.
I am baffled with the level of ignorance I encounter in this comment sections!!
Before Chavez, PDVSA was involved in joint ventures with private/foreign companies. Am I factually incorrect? Chavez seized their assets forcing those foreign companies to leave? Am I factually incorrect?
If more than 50% of your GDP depends on oil and the government stopped joint ventures, seized private companies assets involved in oil. do you consider the oil industry as free market?
If the other 50% of your GDP consists of manufacturing/ other resources, but the government seizes the main companies involved in manufacturing, natural resources, finance. Are you really going to state that this is a “market economy” because of private taxi cabs?
Dude, you need to improve your understanding of very basic economics.
At last, the word is spreading on the scum tgat us the DUP.
Theresa May Snoopers Charter Advocate busy making the case for ever fewer civil liberties in response to three successful Terrorist Attacks LOSES.
How long now have the Tory Lite supporters like Blair and the media (even the good old BBC and always “impartial” Guardian) been trying to destroy Corbyn. He’s WAY too radical. Rip the shit out of him. They tried and look what happened. He survived two votes of confidence. Now Labour has picked up 35 new seats. Now what are they saying? Fuck me! He’s NOT gonna go away. Bloody hell. What do we do now?
If May can’t form a govt., one possibility is another election. Will the public scream revolution and then burn down Parliament?
Great compilation of Labour backstabbers and what they said about Corbyn:
https://twitter.com/Channel4News/status/873223429218062337
Harsh, but here it goes..
Hmph..that last terror attack was big enough I guess..she still lost
Spellcheck..wasn’t
Jeremy Corbyn, another victory for the majority working people who refuse to be the slaves of the profiteering bankster thieves. The mechanism of currency thievery is becoming common knowledge. New laws will formalise the criminality of their ways as wealth in the face of poverty is wrong and as unequal power is wrong. Here is a clue on how distinct this will be… when the dependency flips, ownership flips. That is how it will be.
Public property makes equal power.
Wellsaid.somewhere in the 18th cent, intelligent people understood that some money spent for the common good is indeed well spent and benefits all. In passing, that is what made America great.
Macky is the worst loser I have ever encountered. And he loses a lot!
“I take responsibility for every decision I made, but that’s not why I lost.”
– Crooked Hillary
And that has…what to do with this column? You a stalker?
that’s what she gets from taking money and advice from her thieving bankster pimps.
Thanks. Hillarylovers are obsessed. Joe and Nete are mean wallstret workers doing some overtime!-)
Maybe they are getting a stipend from what was left over as the Clinton Foundation, the greatest charity evah, is winding down. I mean all those holla dollas from the Saudis and other despots gotta be spent somewhere. Oh right they bought AIDS and Malaria medicine with all of it. My bad.
Margaret Thatcher died…but that sort breeds…http://www.cbsnews.com/news/sc-lt-gov-andre-bauer-compares-helping-poor-to-feeding-stray-animals/
he has adopted the “mainstreet cattle corral” philosophy from his pimps.
“…includes fundamentalist Christians who believe in creationism but not climate science, and have fought to keep U.K. laws permitting both abortion and same-sex marriage from being implemented in the province.”
This sounds like most of the American GOP to me!
Mind you, these are people who go to the dentist, use a stove, turn on heating, drive a car and se science everyday. They donot believe what they say but use it as a control mechanism on their groupsters.Royalists wanting some pie.
For those who may not know, Ian Paisley was a big friend of Bob Jones University in the USA, even being on their board.
Gerrymandering?
Maybe gerrymandering, but that’s irrelevant. Like the U.S., the U.K. does not have proportional representation, which among other huge benefits like being far more democratic, eliminates any possibility of gerrymandering.
Mr. Mackey
“…….Given the unbridled hostility of Britain’s right-wing tabloids for Corbyn, and a lack of support from the more centrist members of his party,………”
Given the anti-Jewish bigotry which has run a muck in labour under Corbyn’s “leadership”; given Corbyn’s opposition to NATO; given Corbyn’s wrongly blaming the crisis in Ukraine on NATO; and given his reference to Hamas and Hezbollah as “friends”, it is no small wonder that he was the chair of the far left wing “stop the War Coalition” which refused to actively campaign against the war crimes committed by Assad in Syria – and they are numerous. In the same vein as Julian Assange, the Stop the War Coalition simply opposes the west. Corbyn resigned as chair of STWC to become leader of the Labour Party in 2015.
If Putin could have turned an election to favor one candidate in Britain, Corbyn would have been at the top of his list. Your article glosses over the dismal and radical political record of Corbyn which is why the media opposed Corbyn so decisively.
Hey, look everybody…it’s Craig…faithful supporter of the extreme right wing…
Being critical of Israel does not mean you’re anti-Jewish, any more than being critical of Saudi Arabia makes you an Islamophobe, or being critical of the Venezuelan government makes you racist.
Of course, you know that, but you still exploit it as a propaganda technique.
Just 5 years ago, you couldn’t get anyone in media to call out the GCC. Israel needs that same honesty. If you said the GCC funded armed and generally supported terrorism at the time, they would call you a loon or try to blackball you in the same manner that’s being done with any criticism of Israel.
This isn’t twitter…and I searched for GCC. Who or what is it?
I think it’s the Gulf Cooperative Council.
Thanks.
Unless you are living in a cave, then you are aware of the controversy surrounding Labour under Corbyn and the anti-Jewish bigotry in the upper levels of the labour party.
Yup, this will lay it all out there for the cave dwellers..
http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/2017/01/170111143904887.html
You mean like their suspending Tony Greenstein, head of the Palestinian Solidarity Campaign for being critical of Israel? (Mr . Greenstein is an Orthodox Jew, BTW.)
Ah, so it is “radical” to oppose the Iraq War, which killed hundreds of Brits, and which increased the UK’s risk of terrorism, according to that noted radical, Eliza Manningham-Butler, head of MI-5. (Meanwhile, Islamists from Manchester were permitted to go off to Libya to battle Ghadafi, with no questions asked- and no doubt with the knowledge of then-Home Secretary Theresa May.)
run amuck?
The primary run-a-mucks are the thieving murderous war crazy criminals who kill Palestinians to steal land under the colour of religion.
Other run-a-mucks are the globalist thieving warpigs who rob Americans of jobs, property, productivity, and future value.
New Law proposal – persons who advocate for reduction of public property or rights sall be charged with __________ and stripped of all assets.
Eeek gads Nigel, we’re having to rely on the damn Irish!
No other mainstream political party in w Europe would ally with bigots like NI’s extreme loyalists. The Conservative party have, again, clarified what they really are. But Corbyn’s achievement, in the face of all the filth thrown at him from the mainstream (incl ‘moderate’ bankers’ stooges like Obama), provides genuine hope for young people everywhere in the west. More power to this principled, kind, gentle figure and everything he stands for.
What could possibly be so important about hunting foxes that it would outweigh things like taking the UK out of the EU to put an end to human rights provisions? (after first having Cameron negotiating hard to try to get them revoked if the UK stays in, making it clear that this is no accident!) I mean, people don’t mind having BAE “black boxes” rigged to their internet connections to participate in a “voluntary” (now mandatory) system of ISP censorship, having David Cameron declare that female ejaculation was so dangerous you should go to jail for watching it, having Theresa May submit a “Snoopers’ Charter” for universal spying and declare that there must be no place anywhere in Britain where two Islamists would be able to talk crazy at each other without being recorded by the government ….. and they are offended by FOX HUNTING? Are you KIDDING me? I hope this news is bogus … otherwise these people are … just … plain … bogus. I mean, not even real.
“What could possibly be so important about hunting foxes …”
May apparently thinks that a member of the Tory tribe is for fox hunting. (I don’t know if this is still the norm among Tories.)
neotribalism (uncountable)
The sociological concept that humans have evolved to live in a tribal society and thus will naturally form social networks constituting new “tribes”.
Understand FoxHunting is code = xtremely royally moneyed– no care about the slaves.
Sounds like a bunch of bunk to me. In the U.S. people in rural areas see foxes all the time – hear them calling their weird mating call in the evening. There are even *urban* foxes. Typical redneck with a pistol on his hip could draw down on it and hunt it without so much as setting down his beer can. Might not *kill* it, sure as hell could hunt it though. Not sure why Britain would be much different, apart from a lack of right to bear arms. But if people are despising all use of that right because they’ve been denied it, they’re going the *wrong* way…
Here is an article that looks at the economic impact of Brexit on the U.K. and on Europe as a whole:
http://viableopposition.blogspot.ca/2017/04/the-economic-impact-of-brexit-no-win.html
While the economic impact on U.K. households will be substantial, in large part, the final outcome depends on what government policies are enacted after Brexit takes place.
Is Glenn Greenwald dead????
Certainly the Intercept is a tombstone now.
It’s been
quite a
TI RIP
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3yh2InVsFag
You stalking him?
careful, your explicit intrepidation of greater voices unmasks your subordininnity.
Of the responses to my comment, yours is most puzzling.
I do not understand what you are trying to say, but I can tell you
that Greenwald has been the best writer here and I am becoming
convinced by the plethora of democrap writing on this site
that his clarity of writing and the recent lack of it stands out
in distinct contrast to the majority of crap this site is
now promoting as journalism. I’m not gaga for Greenwald, but
his writing was one of the few things which separated this site
from the MSM mentality – which I have no intention of continuing
to put up with here.
The writings by Greenwald in the past have quickly skewered
exactly what this site has become. If Greenwald is serious about
what he has stated this site was supposed to be, it would help
if he turned his eyes onto this site in a deserved skewering instead
of just asking for money.
any disappointment this site suffers is probably to a mild mis-take that GG has editorial control of some sort or leadership by which others follow. It doesn’t seem there was a grand plan, just an idea for revelations of fact then revelations of meaning to fill the empty time and with the expectation that the site would naturally evolve into something distinct. As the format propels a rambling digest, the need for the population to have democratic goals is neither fulfilled. As time passes and readers tread water, the spaghetti is hitting the wall but at least it is being thrown. Could be worse.
For what it’s worth I recall Glenn commenting recently he’s been working on another book, but even if TI has a suggested summer reading this year I’m guessing it won’t be out that quick. You can bet he’ll eventually refocus on every day truth to power though, it’s his thing.
I like to keep track of him on Twitter between his Intercept articles: https://twitter.com/ggreenwald
I think he has a lot of other irons in the fire.