After 39 years of operating without an apparent conceptual understanding of “consequences,” this week Donald Trump Jr. tweeted out an email thread admitting to soliciting the help of the Russian government in order to damage Hillary Clinton and aid the family campaign. The emails are astounding for more than a few reasons, particularly because of what came next.
On June 3, British music publicist Rob Goldstone contacted Donald Jr. with an explicit offer: “Official documents and information that would incriminate Hillary and her dealings with Russia.” In case Donald Jr. was slow on the uptake, Goldstone made sure to spell out exactly what was happening. “This is obviously very high level and sensitive information but is part of Russia and its government’s support for Mr. Trump,” he offered, as if he were writing his email to make the work of future investigators simpler. Thus begun an extremely busy couple of weeks. On June 7, as Philip Bump at the Washington Post points out, the elder Trump “pledged that he’d give a major speech the following Monday, June 13, ‘discussing all of the things that have taken place with the Clintons.'” On June 9, a meeting between Donald Jr., two other members of the Trump campaign, and Russian attorney Natalia Veselnitskaya took place in New York, on the basis of the aforementioned “official documents.” The AP also reports that Russian-American lobbyist Rinat Akhmetshin was present at the meeting, and claims “Veselnitskaya brought with her a plastic folder with printed-out documents that detailed what she believed was the flow of illicit funds to the Democratic National Committee.”
Donald Jr. now says the meeting was a dud, and Veselnitskaya didn’t have the goods, but it was interesting enough that all of the participants conveniently forget to mention it at any point since then.
Just six days after the Trump/Veselnitskaya meeting, and 12 days after the initial contact by Goldstone, while working as a reporter for Gawker, I received an email tip, including official strategy and financial documents from the Democratic Party:
The U.S. intelligence community claims that “Guccifer 2.0″ was an entity operated by the Russian government. A second email that afternoon expanded on the document claims:
(At no point did Guccifer 2.0 and I have anything even resembling a confidential source agreement, and he very quickly, of course, went public with all of his claims.)
This timing is interesting for two reasons. The extreme proximity of promised Hillary-related documents and the arrival of Hillary-related documents just days later suggests Guccifer 2.0 could have been part of the plan Goldstone alluded to over email. But secondly, although the documents were surely “official” in that they originated from within the Democratic Party, no one ever found anything in them that could be considered “information that would incriminate Hillary and her dealings with Russia.” It doesn’t appear that any of the documents released by Guccifer, whether in private to reporters like myself or on the web, pertained to or referenced whatsoever any “dealings” between Clinton and Russia. Guccifer was very eager to “pitch” documents to me that he believed would be particularly damaging or newsworthy (virtually none of them were), so it stands to reason that he would have pushed the Russia/DNC angle were he in possession of documents along those lines. Guccifer mentioned Russia only a couple of times, first to deny to me that he was Russian, and secondly that “maybe russians were among” those who had hacked the DNC. So there’s nothing directly tying the contents of the Guccifer emails I (and reporters at other outlets) received to the contents Trump Jr. et al. were promised in this week’s explosive email thread.
This leaves a lot of possibilities, unfortunately, and chalking the whole thing up to nothing more than giant coincidence feels strange and unwise. Of course, a campaign takes place in a compressed time frame — though, mercilessly, not compressed enough — so the likelihood of events coinciding in time is heightened. It’s possible that a British music publicist wasn’t exactly plugged in to the alleged activities of Russian military intelligence and got the nitty gritty wrong in his email to Trump Jr. It’s possible the offer emailed to Trump Jr. was just a means of testing how receptive he was to the idea of state-sponsored opposition research (very). It’s possible these people are all smarter than they look, and deliberately did not refer to the actual nature of the hacked documents in writing. It’s possible Goldstone and company were entirely separate from Guccifer, a second, discrete branch of campaign dirt-digging. It’s possible these are coincidences — if so, it would behoove Trumps old and young to explain why the most notorious hacker persona of the modern age started shopping around Hillary-related documents less than a week after similar documents were promised to the campaign.
Good morning (or good evening, for some of you); I encourage you all to read this.
https://consortiumnews.com/2017/07/24/intel-vets-challenge-russia-hack-evidence/
– Connor Riese
Take these points to consider.
1. It hasn’t been established any of the major players were Russian Government / Russian interventions.
2. The probability that Rob Goldstone was connected to a sophisticated intelligence operation.
3. The role of Fusion GPS
4. The role of Crowd Strike
5. The high probability that Guccifer 2.0 was Ukranian SBU
6. The Clinton connection to Victor Pinchuk
7. The involvement of the Ukranian government in Clinton campaign
8. The Christopher Steele “dossier” involving Fusion GPS
9. Wikileaks denial of Russian connection
10. Clear efforts by Russian Banks and Intelligence agencies using Democrat lobbying groups (plural) to overturn sanctions.
11. Visa go ahead for Veselnitskaya by Loretta Lynch
There is a Russian and a Ukranian story – but who is ‘projecting’ this narrative – the side that has the clearest connection to Russian / Ukranian intelligence operations, took money from the Russians and the Ukranians and has been involved in Russian / Ukranian business operations.
Of course Veselnitskaya did meet wit Trump jr … there had been an indication she would pass on info about Ukranian donors to the Clinton campaign – this in itself is a very plausible and realistic scenario with reports Viktor Pinchuk has given up to $25 million in ‘donations’ to the Clinton Foundation.
Why isn’t this connection being followed up – sometimes you have to ask different questions ?
Why would Russia need Trump’s permission to shop around hacks? If Putin actually needed permission – which I highly doubt – that would put Trump in charge of Putin, which pwning Putin wouldn’t exactly be a bad thing.
Putin didn’t need permission. What he wanted was to trade. He wanted the sanctions lifted for providing dirt on Hillary. He also wanted tp find out how much eagerness there was in the Trump campaign for this stuff (dirt on Hillary). He found out there was a lot (Love it, said DT Junior.)
Reading this thread is a conspiracy theorists wet dream. Was it the Deep State that took down the World Trade Center?
The Intercept has a whole article with no mention of the Right Wing fantasy of the “Deep State”. What’s next?
So, why would Guccifer 2.0 publish the emails himself if he had brought them to WikiLeaks already, and WikiLeaks was going to be publish them? A UK ambassador said that they received the emails from an internal souce at the DNC. I trust WikiLeaks more than anyone. Perhaps G2.0 just happened to hack the emails AND someone internal also leaked them to WikiLeaks. Point is, you’re taking the word of G2.0, yet never question it, nor do you mention that the source was also identified as someone inside the DNC by the ambassador. Sloppy.
I posted yesterday that possibly the Hillary camp was behind this meeting. Maybe that’s not farfetched. See this link: Russian lawyer Veselnitskaya says Magnitsky Act lobbyist Browder behind Trump Jr. scandal https://www.rt.com/news/396728-russian-lawyer-scandal-america/
Hillary didn’t hold a gun to junior’so head.
One difference Sam, was that you were not running against a candidate that took millions in bribes from Russia. As Secretary of State, Hillary received millions in bribes to approve the transfer of 20% of our uranium assets to Russia:
https://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/24/us/cash-flowed-to-clinton-foundation-as-russians-pressed-for-control-of-uranium-company.html?_r=1
–” if so, it would behoove Trumps old and young to explain why the most notorious hacker persona of the modern age started shopping around Hillary-related documents less than a week after similar documents were promised to the campaign.”–
If they were offered to the campaign why were they given away to everyone for free?
In light of the fact that as you say there isn’t really anything incriminating about them isn’t the most obvious explanation that the Trump camp passed on the documents and “guccifer” went about looking for some other way of getting them released to the public?
Here’s a thought. Wonder if the Hillary camp knew Natalia Vaselnitskaya (they were both on the same side of the Magnitsky Act —
against it) and if Hillary put her up to contacting Don, Jr.? Through the music publicist Rob Goldstone! I’d investigate any contacts between them if possible. Shouldn’t surprise anyone if that were the case. The DEMs were always looking for something to tie Trump to Putin after he made that comment that if Putin had the remaining 30,000 Clinton emails he wished he would release them! (Just a joke, by God, with a grain of truth because, of course, it would have been nice.)
Agree with your post Sunset-We have seen SO much corruption in the Obama Regime, and they felt Hillary would Continue their agenda, so it is NOT far fetched to think that they were behind the “Trump Jr.” set up.
What makes it even MORE apparent, is that “A. G. Lynch, bypassed whatever she could, to allow Natalia Vaseinitsskya to come to America, as Natalia also had connections to Steele, who set forth the whole agenda to harm Trump.”
Proven fact, that Obama ‘spied And lied against Americans, and he’d do anything to maintain Democrat Power, as they thought Hillary would.’
It’s possible Veselnitskaya made the whole thing up. She wanted to discuss sanctions relief and used promises of non-existent documents as bait. But that she used that particular bait suggests that she knew Donnie was in the market for such things, and his reaction — the notion that his son, son-in-law and campaign manager would meet with purported representative of a foreign government behind his back is not credible — confirmed his interest.
I invite you to read two examples of “in-denial whataboutism” by Scandinavian and Jerome Fryer in my earlier post below. It is entertaining to examine the pattern.
Scandinavian begins with a tautological definition, followed by a false accusation, and finishes with irrelevant whatabouts.
Jerome Fryer skips the tautological definitions and jumps to false accusations immediately. He finishes with irrelevant whatabouts.
The toolbox of all these bots has the same tool set!
If you punch someone then they punch you back, claim that you have been wrongly assaulted — and anyone who points out that you started the fight is resorting to ‘whataboutery’. Only feeble-minded people get taken in by this tactic.
I first came across this accusatory tactic and distraction during the attempt to pretend that Ukraine’s recent trouble was visited upon them by Russia. Pointing out that the coup in Kiev and installation of extremists was the actual cause isn’t acceptable, because this was the fruit from scheming by the US and some EU governments. (It’s almost as though these ‘regime change’ policies aren’t really intended to benefit the people they’re imposed upon.)
What is the difference between Don Jr. and the Steele dossier? What do you call millions in donations from foreign governments to Clinton campaign if not “[Saudi Arabia, etc] and its government’s support for [Mrs. Clinton]?” How long is this farce going to go on?
Is Mister Biddle on the point of unmasking Guccifer2.0 or what ?
Yet anorher Clinton critic dead:
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-07-16/haiti-official-who-exposed-clinton-foundation-found-dead
LOL. Linking to a Russian-sympathetic website. How’s Moscow treating you, komrade?
Who cares about the source if the facts are right?
Which of the facts therein do you dispute? That he died perhaps?
Anyone in the Washington DC elite for as long as the Clintons is going to be connected to nearly every oligarch and high official in the world.
Given that the majority of journalists (and ‘journalists’) have written uncomplimentary pieces on Trump by now, should any future suspicious death be taken as ‘evidence’ that the short-fingered vulgarian had them murdered?
I can only assume that zerohedge and the like will be claiming so.
“Aha! A week after a private, Russian person offered incriminating information of a particular kind, another person offers a completely different entity unrelated information of a different kind! COULD THIS JUST BE COINCIDENCE? HMMM?”
Such are the workings of an either fevered or desperate mind. Not sure which one of the above Sam Biddle is, but one thing is for sure: The Russian narrative still isn’t leading anywhere.
“if so, it would behoove Trumps old and young to explain why the most notorious hacker persona of the modern age started shopping around Hillary-related documents less than a week after similar documents were promised to the campaign.”
Keep telling yourself that, kid. The denial is strong in you.
Guccifer2. admitted in pms to an ex actress Robin..that Seth had passed the Files to Him..which would make neither of them hackers…and worse..Place him in the same locale as Seth…as he would need to do it by thumb drive or snail mail..and time and distance preclude that. Recent independent expert analysis by Adam carter and Disobedient Media certainly point to that, making it an Internally generated scheme. But sorry no…no Russians.
Kuriouskat Bingo!
No doubt in my mind that is how the emails were obtained by Guccifer2 and WikiLeaks. Crowdstrike is a bogus DNC contractor.
How is the weather in Moscow today?
Ad hominem much?
I always found it curious Bernie was never hacked.if anyone had a case for collusion he sure did. I am sure also everyone now knows the Guccifer 2 was from inside..not externally..
Collusion depends on where you are standing from. If you understood the Democrats and its own collusions..and the depth and damage they did..then what happened with Trump Jt..is nothing to what happened to the election in 2016. And it was not Russians..
1.Wapo already Has a History of Partnering with The DNCs Shadowy Skunkworks
https: //www . powerlineblog com/archives/2016/11/democratic-national-committee-research-arm-of-the-washington-post.php
One of the most stunning Wikileak revelations is this email exchange inside the Democratic National Committee. Eric Walker, deputy communications director of the DNC, relays a “research request” to “RRResearch_D,” the “Rapid Response Research” department at the DNC. The subject heading is “research request: top 10 worst Trump quotes?” Walker explains: “Milbank doing a Passover-themed 10 plagues of Trump.” “Milbank” is Dana Milbank of the Washington Post. Apparently Walker assumes that the people at Rapid Response Research know who “Milbank” is and will not be surprised that they are being called on to help write a column in the Washington Post.
The emails follow, with commentary. First, Walker’s email of April 21, 2016. I have truncated Walker’s list, but you can view the full email at the link:
2. Then Lets take Yahoo News and Their Ukranian pipeline in the DNC Ali Chalupa
wikileaks . org /dnc-emails/emailid/3962
From: Chalupa, Ali
Sent: Tuesday, May 03, 2016 11:56 PM
To: Miranda, Luis
Subject: Re: You saw this, right?
A lot more coming down the pipe. I spoke to a delegation of 68 investigative journalists from Ukraine last Wednesday at the Library of Congress – the Open World Society’s forum – they put me on the program to speak specifically about Paul Manafort and I invited Michael Isikoff whom I’ve been working with for the past few weeks and connected him to the Ukrainians. More offline tomorrow since there is a big Trump component you and Lauren need to be aware of that will hit in next few weeks and something I’m working on you should be aware of.
3. Then Take Brent Budowski of The Hill who who originated the Slaughter Trump With Putin Propaganda right after NGP Van “Breach”
How about the Brent Budowski Podestas Self Appointed Guru @ the Hill
http s ://wikileaks org /podesta-emails/emailid/25651
That’s good, sooner it’s clarified the better, and the stronger the better. Re the Trump ISIS video, if we don’t have the proof campaign should assign 100 people to look for it ASAP, there is probably something on tape somewhere. p.s. On the UN last week, support it yes, but be careful. I love Kerry like a bro’ and support him always as HRC should and does. But be careful about the U.N., support but don’t go too far. Putin did not agree to anything about removing Assad and continues to bomb the people we support. We pushed the same position in 2012 (Geneva 1, which HRC knows all about) and Geneva 2 in 2014. Odds that Putin agrees to remove Assad are only slightly better than the odds the College of Cardinals chooses me to someday succeed Pope Francis.
Best approach is to slaughter Donald for his bromance with Putin, but not go too far betting on Putin re Syria. Brent
4. They not only stole Bernies votes and Money.. They Sabotaged Bidens Chances too
http : // dailycaller com/2016/10/12/email-suggests-biden-aide-sabotaged-his-presidential-aspirations-to-help-hillary/
5. Then theres Politicos Glenn Thrush ” I’m a Hack” who after being exposed colluding with Podesta went to the NYT to produce more hack pieces
https : // pjmedia . com /trending/2017/05/20/glenn-thrush-self-confessed-hack-commits-hackery/
I could go on and on
They had moles and 2 way pipelines to every single outlet and here we are dealing with the very same outlets and we are supposed to take them and
NYT when its own columnist Jared Y Sexton worked hand in glove with the subject Russian Atty seriously?
I think not
No Indeedy :)
I think it’s time to move beyond this “Russian Hacking” obsession. Clinton cheated Sanders and Trump cheated Clinton. The bottom line is, we don’t have a democracy. We have an oligarchy and dumbed down voters. And our foreign policy is killing more people than Hitler. And we thank our brave men and women in uniform for their “service”. So, basically, we’re insane.
Amen.
2nd.
…and you don’t sound like a Kremlin shill at all.
Maxim Gorki – I hate American foreign policy, but it is not killing more people than Hitler. Hitler’s forces killed 27 million people in Russia alone, along with 6 million Jews and a few million other people. American foreign policy in the Cold War killed about 10 million in Asia, and post Cold War about 2 million in Iraq and maybe a million or 2 elsewhere. That is less, not more, than Hitler, and over a very long time frame.
Actually, since 1945, Americans have killed over a billion people in its thirst for profits. 3 million people alone in Vietnam. Add in the number of people killed in Iraq because of sanctions, their were another million or more killed including 500,000 children which Madeline Albright said was worth it. Not sure what’s worth killing half a million children, but hey they were just Muslim kids so no worries, right?
Then add in the millions killed by despotic dictators that we put in power after overthrowing the elected governments of at least 50 countries by the CIA.
Next add in the people who were killed by the foreign militaries that were trained here at the School of the Americas.
How about the people who were killed in Japan after we dropped two nuclear bombs on them.
Then add in the children who have been born with heinous birth defects after we used depleted uranium bombs on their countries. Go ahead and search for pictures of those kids with horrible birth defects.
So yes, we are responsible for untold millions and millions of deaths.
Great country America, that is if you happen to be born to a rich enough family.
Oh yeah, let’s count the millions of deaths from people because they weren’t able to buy health insurance.
Count the number of times the term “possible” occurs in this article. Certainly not a good example of hard hitting journalism I’ve come to expect from the Intercept. Love you guys but this reads too much like conspiracy theory for my tastes.
What is whataboutism about?
We should take for granted that all journalism is biased, partial, and subjective. Even with that, the defense of Donald Jr.’s actions (and his clan’s actions) cannot be of the form: why don’t write about other potential criminals – for example, why didn’t you write about Clinton’s?
Let me simplify it. Even if the Clinton’s were criminals, it does not excuse Donald Jr. of and the clan’s activities.
This is a form of whataboutism. A dishonest practice that most of us readily understand. And, looking at this thread, we can pick out the whataboutists!
Accusations of “whataboutism” are the hypocrites first line of defense, since the “whataboutists” clearly show their hypocrisy.
What exactly IS the reason you didn’t speak up against the Clintonites shady dealings, but turn purple with outrage when Trump is in the drivers seat?
Surely it’s not because it’s “the other guy” doing it?
Because that would mean you’re doing exactly what many Democrats are accusing Republicans of: Putting party before country.
TLDR: Both parties are awful. The reason both the Democrats and Republicans are even lower than Trump in approval ratings, is because voters are fully aware of this.
This seems to have been an invention intended to rebuff those pointing out hypocrisy. Trotting out a ‘whataboutery defence’ marks you as dishonest, or somehow unable to grasp why hypocrisy is a problem for those claiming moral superiority.
Interestingly, I first came upon this bizarre attempt at disclaiming responsibility during the Ukraine fiasco. Now there was some real meddling in another country’s democratic processes. (An argument could be made that Ukraine was, and perhaps still is, just as democratic as the US. Possibly more so, as they don’t have an electoral college.)
What’s the point of this article? I’m confused. We don’t even know if Mr. Goldstone’s description of the meeting is accurate, let alone if anything came out of it. The only thing salient the author writes — though he is certainly not the first one to do so — is that the Trump campaign was willing to receive opposition research from foreign entities — JUST AS THE DEMS DID. Maybe Mr. Biddle should spend more time learning how to protect sources instead of speculating and trying to smear Wikileaks as he so often does.
Why you asked did Guccifer shop “Hillary-related documents less than a week after similar documents were promised to the campaign.” ? You answered it yourself when you said they were not similar. Doh!
Sammy, go back to Gawker………
Eugene Robinson, writing in his column for the WashPost asks a very good question about Mr. Kushner, who was responsible for the Trump campaign’s digital aspects:
“The Veselnitskaya encounter was one of more than 100 meetings or phone calls or phone calls with foreigners that somehow slipped Kushner’s mind when he applied for his security clearance. He revealed this one in one of his subsequent efforts to amend the form.’
‘Investigators believe that as Election Day approached, Russian trolls or “bots” flooded the social media accounts of key voters in swing states with “fake news” disinformation about Clinton, according to a report Wednesday by McClatchy newspapers.’
‘How would the Russians know which voters to target, down to the precinct level, in states such as Wisconsin and Michigan? This is a question that surely will be posed to Kushner, whose digital campaign operation tracked voters at a granular level”
(7-16-17)
How indeed? I think these boys running the country are about to get a lesson from investigators who will be posing all kinds of questions that the Trump campaign has been trying to cover up since last year.
Oh, hey, Biddle, I was wondering what you have to say regarding your colleague Glenn Greenwald saying on Democracy NOW! that Trump, Jr.’s emails aren’t a smoking gun or evidence of collusion. When even this publication’s founding member contradicts your baloney, you really ought to step back and consider the wisdom of jumping on board the corporate media’s Russia obsession train.
Oh, hey, Mikey…look up the definition of “soliciting” and “collusion”.
There is no evidence of collusion because there is no evidence (yet) that any information changed hands. Don Jr. said the meeting was a bust, but since the Trump family (and campaign staff) are chronic liars, you have to be brain-dead to believe a word they utter. However, Kushner, Manafort and Donald Jr. showed a willingness to collude because they all attended the meeting which apparently had ties to the Russian government. Supposedly, the Russian Lawyer had documents tying HRC to illegal activity with Russia. What Greenwald meant to say is that there is no smoking gun YET.
No, Greenwald said there’s no smoking gun—period. To believe that, you’d have to accept and acknowledge that the Clinton campaign did something equally as bad and potentially illegal in hiring a private firm with ties to the Kremlin in order to dig up dirt on Drumpf. But no one in the corporate media (including The Intercept) is seriously questioning these actions by the Clinton campaign or even giving it much mention. Why does Clinton get a free pass for doing what her partisans rip into Drumpf over? She basically did the same thing. Where’s the outrage over that? There is none and we all know the reason why: it’s okay when “your” tribe does it, but not okay when “their” tribe does it.
Hypocrisy is not, never has been, and never shall be a legitimate form of political opposition.
So, by your reasoning, if BOTH candidates are in deep doodoo, we should be fine with that. In other words if Clinton gets in trouble for her collusion, then Trump should too? I think about 75% of the country would be fine with having neither in charge. Trump is an embarrassment.
The Russians helped Trump to be elected? I hope it is true after all that’s what the US has been doing to Third World countries for the last 80 years. I have a question for you, How does it feel? Great? I hope so.
Kennedy was in favor of regime change to spread american values, or at least american power
but the the US as a banana republic for the plutocrats was probably not JFKs intended endgame
The US Army is still stuck outside Baghdad, stopped by the ferocious resistance of Saddam Hussein and the heroic Iraqi people …
… says Baghdad Bob.
How did that Iraq war turn out, in the end?
Oh, right. It hasn’t ended yet. Well, just another few more years, thousands of lives, and tens of billions of taxpayer funds…
Huh?
Was ‘Baghdad Bob’ that far off the mark? Iraq is now effectively an ally of Iran (and Syria), following years of bloody occupation. And this war of aggression was supposedly about ‘WMDs’ that never existed.
Well, at least that disaster didn’t also spawn ISIS.
(Not a good example for you to select.)
The DNC influenced the election to favor Trump by undermining Sander’s campaign. This is a known fact. The DNC failed to support its most popular candidate. This exposes the fact that whether Trump or Clinton rigged the election does not matter in terms of criminal accountability. All that matters is hindering those in power in order to keep the government as ineffective as possible. THAT is why this Russian meme continues to live on. The goal is to provide a failed/crippled government to support its sale to the corporate state. This article supports that goal.
This is not correct. The DNC/Clintons thwarted democracy. That’s what is fact. Their cheating Sanders was a result of their own Greed/Donors, not to help Trump.
Russia meme continues because Trump caters to Russian oligarchs, not US oligarchs like our US politicians do.
Agreed, the DNC/Clintons actions thwarted democracy. Sanders’ campaign as a democrat was to recover the lost liberal progressive voters (that Obama ignored once elected) for the Clinton campaign. The DNC interference of his campaign in favor of Clinton promptly lost her those votes (and perhaps her war-criminal actions while Secretary of State). Therefore those lost votes favored Trump, enabling his election win. Sanders’ supporters were not voting for Clinton. That is a fact supported by exit polls.
The Russian meme continues to promote the MYTH that the U.S. has democratic elections. The meme is the shiny object (24 hour media coverage) that lulls the public into a hypnotic trance. If only the Russians hadn’t interfered we would have had a democratic election process. It shifts the focus away from Sanders’ message that Money = Political Power and his attempts to fracture that structure. Diminishing corporate power and increasing public influence. In other words, to create a more democratic system of government.
The meme also serves to create another enemy to assist our perpetual-war economy.
You and I disagree about the purpose of the Russian meme. I contend it is used to shape public opinion, i.e. manufacturing consent. It shifts the focus away from Sanders’ message of Money = Political Power = corruption to a much simpler and safer message of the Russian enemy we need to fear.
No, I think we do agree on purpose of Russia meme. It’s just the Dems version of the Obama Birth Record meme. It’s just meant to harass the opposition into not being able to pass legislation, ie…the bright shiny object as you say.
I merely meant to point out that in no way does DNC actions purport to “favor Trump” as you stated. I think their actions unintentionally helped Trump, but only because the truth was exposed by Wiki leaks and Podesta email releases.
I see your point Galactus. My poor choice of words. The DNC actions propelled Trump into the presidency. Sanders would have had a much better chance of winning.
I believe your statement “It’s just meant to harass the opposition into not being able to pass legislation, ie…the bright shiny object as you say.” has a much greater impact than not being able to pass legislation.
Both parties have been working toward neoliberal policies. Privatization of public services, lax regulation, & fiscal austerity being some of those policy goals. What better way to shift government services to the private sector than to create a paralyzed government? Defund actual working institutions like the Air Traffic Controllers, then proclaim that they have failed to modernize the air traffic tracking system. Then accurately proclaim that government doesn’t work so it must be sold to the private sector. My point is that this “harassment” is a successful tactic to achieve an end goal of privatization of government services. Both major parties share this goal.
I have enjoyed your input.
Same here.
Good comment above. Thanks. Enjoyable on this end as well.
I tend to be of a mind with Wilk, Hans, Socrates, and yourself (probably left out a few). To be honest, these days I’m tired at the end of my 8 hrs I put in, and tired on days off as well. I can’t follow everything I’d like to (totally gave up on the Maddow/forged doc thing). Nevertheless, comments here are enlightening, and often provide excellent summaries.
“If only the Russians hadn’t interfered …”
I’m going to take the liberty to digress, and plea for an explanation of a Snowden remark way back there. It’s a gap in my understanding from which place, for me, it’s a little difficult to proceed.
What server was he talking about?
“Edward Snowden stated on Twitter on August 16, 2016 that ‘circumstantial evidence and conventional wisdom indicates Russian responsibility'[36] and that the leak ‘is likely a warning that someone can prove US responsibility for any attacks that originated from this malware server [37] summarizing that it looks like ‘somebody sending a message that an escalation in the attribution game could get messy fast’.” https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Shadow_Brokers
Not sure with regards to the ‘server’ you mention above. But the Intercept and Biddle in particular did a series of articles regarding leaked NSA hacking tools that the ShadowBrokers were selling on the internet.
Here is one of those articles.
https://theintercept.com/2016/08/19/the-nsa-was-hacked-snowden-documents-confirm/
Do a google search on NSA Leaked Hacking Tools and you’ll find the articles.
This is a snipet of the article from the link I posted above. Perhaps Snowden was eluding to this server.
Thank you so much, Galactus, for the links. Would like to reply more cogently, but am running out of time today (I will return, though, when I can give more context with my remaining questions). On the top of my head (having no time left today to check your links) I have a couple questions. Firstly, weird to think only one server’s employed to desseminate SECONDDATE. Now I have this question…could it be the FOXACID server was the same server used to obtain the emails? Is that what Snowden was saying? I see where you say, “They also show how SECONDDATE has been used…” So, I will have to read up. Might be obvious to most, but for me I’m at the wonder stage…wondering if SECONDATE retrieves stuff.
The way it remains in my memory…probably remains there wrong…is that the ShadowBrokers put the tools out there for free. But if they were “only” for sale, I guess that would have been nearly the same exposure.
I may be mixing up two leaks, but I remember thinking at the time if the ShadowBrokers put all those tools out there…than that’s an indication they’d been passe for a while, and that someone out there has a whole host of tools commensurate yet not widely leaked or discovered/known. So, if ES was talking about FOXACID…if your guess is right 1)He’s implying the originator of the Podesta attacks came from a machine probably owned by the creators of SECONDDATE? and 2)the leaking of the tools can be taken as notice that the tools-leaker has commensurate tools which will be more effective in that US intel lacks knowledge regarding how they work?
If you don’t feel like going into this, I understand. I will go through your links up there when time’s available.
If Guccifer 2 was really against Hillary, as many would infer from his offers, why was his very first document one that was damaging to Trump and one that Shawn Henry was advertising the existence of in an article in the Washington Post just the previous day?
If the 2 files Shawn had mentioned were targeted in April (as stated) and no others were… and Falcon was installed on “the hundreds of the machines at the DNC” at the end of April (see Alperovitch’s statements on March 5th this year in a Wired article)… why would they say they were expelling hackers on the weekend of 11th-12th of June (indirectly admitting their product failed even though they didn’t seem to need to – and under conditions where almost every cyber-sec firm would have dealt with such a situation with discretion – if truly under the impression only the previously targeted files were anything to be concerned about)?
Would anyone have had a reason to want people to think there were hackers on the network as late as then (eg. discovering how late the leaked emails ran to and making sure hackers could be used as an excuse)? Could CS have wanted their activity at the DNC to be perceived as happening prior to Assanges announcement (on the 12th) and chose the date specifically for that purpose?
What does all this mean???? see disobedientmedia dot com and ask yourself why Cloudstrike is a smoking ruin.
The blather about DTjr is a mighty stupid tactic by the Dems and is backfiring already.
I answered my own question: there is one vacant Democratic seat on the FEC. It is currently staffed by an Independent commissioner and three Republicans. When does T intend to fill that vacancy?
If anyone brought this up, I haven’t seen it mentioned in any coverage; not on television, online, or in the press.
WOW! A LOT of russian trolls here today……
@John Lopez
Warmonger!
It’s difficult to separate the Russian trolls from the Libertarian and Republican parrots.
Their incredible lack of originality, disdain for all but Trump (and sometimes even that) and reflexive Clintonphobia makes them almost identical.
Weird syntax and peculiarly contrived screen names seem to be distinguishing features.
Too bad this comments section lacks history and search functions.
Those would make the various identifications more reliable.
Like a colony of Paratrechina longicornis?
Hahaha
Exactly.
Crazy ants!
Few show much initiative. Consistency isn’t important — like making noise rather than making music.
Trumpspherian Paratrechina longicornis: Where No Man Has Gone Before
And not even that is true…
Borrowing the work of Donella Meadows Archives:
“But the Trumpspherian managers, control freaks all, had the idea that everything should work perfectly, or at least appear to. So one thing they tried to manage was news about their project. Rather than admit breakdowns, they got caught in less-than-full disclosures. And they frustrated the press by suppressing nearly all information about the human side of the project. How did the Trumpspherian get along, sealed up together for two years? How did they relate to the managers outside the glass? And to their funder, Mr. Bass of Forth Worth?”
‘Reductionist Oriented Management Team.’ Almost same exact language then as now.
Let us assume for a moment that Russians indeed stole our elections and installed a puppet. What exactly is this puppet expected to deliver to them? I don’t recall this being addressed anywhere.
From what I understand they already obtained rights to some of our uranium under the previous administration. Why would they go to the trouble of getting in an unknown when things were rolling along smoothly?
Can somebody shed light on this please?
I think it’s pretty obvious that Ms. Clinton would advocate the neocon view of foreign policy, i.e., containment and rolling back Russia’s influence in its own region. Trump, on the other hand, has no foreign policy views, as he is a simpleton who appears friendly to Russia. Why he is so friendly to them may become apparent as the investigation progresses. The Russians aren’t stupid – the choice, for them, in our election was obvious.
Short answer: A country attacking itself and losing stature around the world.
Motivation for Trump… after six bankruptcies and going on seven, mister high stakes found that he could redeem his image by providing Tillerson and Exxon backers a half a trillion dollar bet on Russian oil. Read about that in Naomi’s new book.
Assuming this is a sincere questions:
1. Lift sanctions for Crimea.
2. Stop (or obstruct) NATO expansion.
3. Free hand in Ukraine.
4. US policy favoring exploitation of Russian oil reserves.
5. Extend influence into US Congress (like everyone else in the world.)
6. Favor oligarchs (billionaires) over regular people to exercise some measure of political influence. (Establish a working relationship with Republicans.)
7. Diminish Chinese influence.
… and probably a hundred other issues I have haven’t thought of.
If installing a puppet regime isn’t a good idea, it wouldn’t have been a central focus of US foreign policy for the last seventy years.
8. And, oh yeah. Payback for Boris Yeltsin.
Why would anyone in Russia’s government believe that Trump could (let alone would) deliver any of this?
Surely having such a weak-minded and ignorant man ‘in charge’ only ensures that the Republican Party apparatchiks control policy — and that is a worse outcome for Russian objectives than another Clinton, despised by the Republicans and ensuring ineffective government in the US.
Putin would have been prepared for Clinton, and undoubtedly viewed her as the better option.
Take a vague speculation (“Why would anyone ..”), add an irrelevant truism (“weak-minded and ignorant man”) point at another unsourced speculation (“Russian objectives”) , mind read Putin and conclude, “undoubtedly”…
How does this pass a three year old’s test for critical thinking?
Reality — from a rewritten Republican platform regarding Russia to the obvious acts of support for Trump’s election — makes your “undoubtedly” not only entirely dubious but completely contrary to known facts.
Clinton supported sanctions.
Clinton supported NATO expansion.
Trump opposes sanctions.
Trump opposes NATO expansion.
Yet Putin “undoubtedly” preferred Clinton to Trump?
SMH
Has Trump opposed new sanctions? Does he oppose NATO expansion? No to both.
Do the Republicans have a freer hand to pursue their own agenda that is contrary to Russian interests than Clinton would have had? Why yes, they do.
The Russian government has competent people in it, too. Trump in office was and is a bigger problem for them than Clinton would have posed.
the only criminal action here was obamas supression of russian influence evidence on the grounds that it would influence the election
GREAT article!!! The Trumps are so guilty!!!! Just waiting for the Impeachment!
It tends very strong towards that the RNC and Donald where involved in the Hacking. Whoever carried it out for them.
Then feeding the DNC dirt to Wikileaks hence sticking it to them……
Seriously?? Good Lord
Interesting that Goldstone cut his teeth in the UK in Murdoch’s tabloids and the News of the World hacking culture, full of private eyes getting oppo on celebrities including hacking private and work phones.
But yes the timeline of all of this is bit too coincidental. Problem is, the Trumps have operated beyond the law for a long time and are not used to consequences. For now the GOP is quiet, wanting to push their agenda. We’ll see for how long.
Seems that ANY foreign gov’t hacking and maneuvering so successfully in our election should concern all of us, and all our elected reps. Dark days indeed.
Gee, Intercept about as bad as CNN, no stories re HRC? Bias?
Google the intercept clinton russia, and have at it.
I am still waiting for The Intercept to do a Q&A with Charles Ortel regarding the federal crimes committed by Bill, Hillary and Chelsea Clinton related to charity fraud in the BILLIONS on an international scale!
If Trump had any brains he’d have a special prosecutor called in to investigate The Clinton Foundation, The Clinton Global Initiative etc.
Psssttt…..Glenn…Charles Ortel is waiting for your call/email!
Apparently the left has difficulty understanding the long held meanings is “solicit” and “collusion “. Maybe they did solicit before the reported meeting, but all indications are that they responded to an offer. Maybe if you tried to use both offer and solicit in the same sentence. Was it an offer to solicit or solicitation of an offer.
So what does all this mean Sam?
Quite easy. Russia discovered that the DNC had met several times with the Ukraine. They wanted to counter that effort and once they had what they thought they needed they didn’t waste time.
Sam, I hate to be the bearer of bad tidin – but know one cares. Donald sr publicly called out on live national television for Russia’s help in bringing Hillary down.
And we all still voted for him. And would do so again.
To paraphrase the Bible, were all of the Clintons misdeeds documented there would not be enough paper (or bytes) in the Universe to document them all.
You hold that same election today (with only documented American citizens voting in California) and Donald wins far bigger.
“We all”?
You perhaps. 13 million more Americans voted against Trump than for him.
Um, the final certified popular vote difference was actually just under 3 million votes.
As reported by CNN on 12/21/2016:
You’re correct though that he’s never had a national mandate – and never will.
Different difference. I’m counting the difference between votes for Trump and votes against him. You’re counting the difference between votes for Trump and votes for Clinton.
You’re counting? Well I didn’t count anything and I don’t believe you did either. I cited statistics. Please cite your source that somehow accurately counted “votes against” Trump or Clinton and didn’t just loosely extrapolate based on selective exit polls.
In round numbers, there were 139 million votes total. 63 million were for Trump. 74 million were for other candidates, and therefore against Trump. Apparently another 2 million skipped the presidential race.
“Therefore???” That’s it?
We’re done here.
Sigh. No, it was just under 3 million. A lot, but you’ve inflated it by 10 million.
The claim should have been phrased “13 million more votes were for not-Trump than were for Trump.” Getting nitpicky detracts from the simple fact that “we all” means less than the majority. Setting aside votes for third party candidates, Trump lost the popular vote, and HRC received 2.8 million more than DJT.
2nd. Yes, had someone presented this potential offer to CrookdClintons, they prob would have accepted. There is no harm in exploring– this had potential of being harmful to the US.it fizzled, like a bad fireworks. No CrookdClinton Foundation offices along the border to help in any way, she does not care, just to get money and votes.
Roy, you, as well as a minority of Americans are completely deluded. You continue to deflect, deflect and deflect. Trump and his cohorts likely committed treason, making them vulnerable to blackmail by the Russian government. You keep using Hillary to deflect from all that is wrong with Trump and his administration. Clinton is old news. Trump has sold America down the river. Likely he won’t go to jail. The rich and powerful rarely do. But when he falls, he will fall so far and so hard that he will find a hole to crawl into and never show his face again. Find a new argument that makes some sense in your support for Trump, using Clinton as your foil, is yesterday’s tatic. Quit beating a dead horse.
Well said
You might be right, and if you are, then America is lost.
Mueller cares.
don’t make me laugh.
mueller is a ‘fixer’, called in to repair damage done by amateurs to the military/industrial/congressional complex.
he knows where the bodies are buried and how to deflect any serious lines of inquiry.
trust me, there will be no truth forthcoming from mueller.
see the warren commission report and the 9/11 report for the works of previous ‘fixers’.
making fools of americans is so easy.
well… there you have it folks.
Right from Stump™ hisself.
….and quoting from Putrid™ as well!
I just don’t know why anyone has questions about this anymore!
He says he didn’t and that’s that!
Why would Goldstone lie about having damaging documents?
He hates Hillary and everyone connected with her.
Unknown to Trump Jr., the campaign had Goldstone (and others?) on their payroll to provide “intelligence”.
Goldstone was desperate to become unber famous. This was his big chance.
Goldstone knew that providing this information would be illegal. Yet he knew that Trump Jr. would be stupid enough to actually write in an email “I love it!”.
Now, a Basic Law 101 question. If someone is offered damaging information about someone else and writes “I love it” in an email, are they being coerced in any way to getting this? Are they just saying that to trick the person offering the information so as to arrest them?
How come in all of these Russian investigations nobody’s been arrested and indicted? Because Mueller and his DOJ cronies are going for the top people involved. People who’ve already committed felonies (Sessions, Flynn and Kushner)? Offer them various degrees of immunity in exchange for implicating higher ups. That way they score more political points and make the DOJ look good. All prosecutors do operate on a bounty system.
What Trump Jr. did wasn’t illegal. Journalists routinely rely on scoops from sources/informants to get dirt on candidates, i.e., pussygate, golden showersgate. Or perhaps Trump Jr. thought he was getting Hillary’s missing pay-to-play state department emails from Russian intelligence that his dad ask help finding while debating on national Tee-Vee, the same emails that Hillary hired a private firm to bleach-bit (erase) from her laptop, the emails that our own NSA couldn’t find after Hillary’s team lost them, and then Hillary’s team re-discovered on her laptop, which was then shipped to the FBI via US postal service, which the FBI never received because that laptop got lost in the mail, never to be seen again. But……. SURPRISE! duplicate copies that Huma had placed on a flash drive and downloaded on her pedo porn-addict hubby Antony Weener’s unsecure laptop that the NYPD then seized during Weener’s investigation and the NYPD announced was going to expose those state department emails, which triggered Comey to suddenly re-open the closed investigation so the FBI would have jurisdiction to seize the laptop from the NYPD and sweep the latest lot under the rug and close the case again.
It’s a shame the author doesn’t read, write or understand the English language. If he did, he wouldn’t make ludicrous statements like these:
That’s bass-ackwards. IF it was interesting, they would have mentioned it. BECAUSE it was uninteresting, they didn’t mention it.
As Oregoncharles asks, HOW would they know that? How could they explain something they knew nothing about?
Sam Biddle, I strongly suggest that you contact the nearest community college about taking an English 101 course. You could certainly use it.
Why does the Trump team get all the dullards!? The principle person of interest, Don Jr. has said himself regarding the potential benefits from attending this meeting and I quote: “I love it”. Any lawyer will tell you that loving the idea of reaping the benefits of a criminal act and then taking steps to do so is? *Cough* Get back to me after you get your GED.
It’s also possible – and I say this as someone who likes nothing about trump – a music publicist was simply trying to do a favor for his singer client by getting his client’s friend an audience and thought this pitch would be the only way to open that door?
Why would they know that? HOW would they know that?
As Biddle says, the Trumps may well be the victims of a fishing expedition; in that case, or essentially any likely scenario, they would have no way to know what’s going on behind the scenes. And by his own account, Guccifer 2.0 was probably not the only one dabbling in the DNC servers. A main conclusion from all this is that the Democrats’ computer security was grotesquely incompetent.
Veselnitskaya was offering something from the Russian government, presumably from records IN Russia; Guccifer was downloading AMERICAN files. Why would there be any connection? The coincidence in time is just that.
The coincidence MIGHT be worth reporting, but this is grossly inflated.
Is it not illegal to have such a meeting in the first place, i.e. to use, or be willing to use information from a foreign entity to influence the American election process? In Iran-Gate, Ronald Wilson Reagan (memos “RWR” reported by McClatchy) was guilty of doing the same thing. Of course this discovery came much slower, toward the end of his second term in office. Perhaps this looming cloud over the initial workings of the Trump Administration will bring absolution, but likely not.
The problem for voters is that both candidates were crooked. Trump hadn’t proven how corrupt he was yet on a national scale. But grifting didn’t seem as bad as Hillary’s history of bed fellows with banksters, oil cartels, and the prison industrial complex. Trump is now actively proving, now by the many campaign promises he has rejected in favor of establishment politics, and lucrative corporate antics . Yet through her Foundation, as well as the State Department, Hillary Clinton made lucrative deals with the Russians, Exxxon, etc., exchanging the rights to uranium, out of Canada, boosting global fracking so she could funnel the money as donations to her “foundation,” and putting all students in debt by her sudden switch in favor of Goldman Sachs with the Bankruptcy Bill (as Senator). Clinton dissolved her “Foundation” shortly after the election.
What wasn’t mentioned at all, and still isn’t is the fact that both Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton are under investigation by the IRS for tax fraud. While Hillary was quick to demand Trump show his personal taxes, her personal fraud was tied to her foundation, which has been under investigation by the IRS since 2009–around the same time as Trump’s investigation–and is still an active case. They’ll each likely get slapped on the wrist, if anything, much like LBJ did, through his campaign contributors, when Halliburton and KBR were fined $3 million for election fraud (when LBJ was Congressman). The penalty never stopped LBJ from continuing to take money from his two primary donors, and KBR and H(e)lliburton received lucrative government contracts when the war was escalated by LBJ in Vietnam, which more than paid back those fines.
I purposely bring this case up because, of course, Dick Cheney had clandestine meetings (viewed by the Supreme Court as “national security”) and was CEO of H(e)lliburton when KBR and HB got greater lucrative contracts, including those involving the privatization of the military, orchestrated by Cheney and associates. Cheney was still receiving compensation from HB at the time, and his daughter was supposedly running his investments.
When LBJ said, “You can have your damn war!” He was said to be coding his words for KBR and HB. There is more than one reason Iraq is Arabic for Vietnam, and Lybia/Syria/Iran Farsi for Cambodia. I might add, sardonically, we may get to 5 million deaths before we are through in the Middle East, if we stay there as long as what’s been projected.
5 million needless deaths in Indochina; another 5 million in the Middle East, what wonderful notches to be proud of in needless wars for oil in both regions. That’s what HB was doing in the Gulf of Tonkin, exploring for oil. They only found gas they couldn’t yet transport. In the Middle East, war won’t run out, because the crude won’t run out. Iran is next on the hit list.
It seems impossible to challenge invisible power, such as the Pentagon, Homeland, and the CIA. And those agencies have been spearheaded and designed to protect corporations, especially oil corporations. (The military needs its grease). When politicians play ball with these agencies, and are in their favor, it seems they walk away unscathed every time. Hillary and Donald are no exception but to serve as examples of exceptionalism, protected by that shield or bubble of plutocracy. JFK wouldn’t play ball, and look what happened.
Snowflakes are going to have to realize they were duped by a fake intelligence report. There was never any evidence that Russia broke into the DNC. The DNC used a Ukrainian company, Crowdstrike, that hates Russia to blame the attack on them. This are the people that cheered on the Nazi coup in the Ukraine:
https://consortiumnews.com/2015/06/12/u-s-house-admits-nazi-role-in-ukraine/
After the false flag McCarthyite report, Obama produced a fake intelligence report that makes Bush’s WMD report look like the gold standard. Snowflakes were lied to again, the report was not from all 17 agencies:
“The [assessment] was a coordinated product from three agencies: CIA, NSA and the FBI, not all 17 components of the intelligence community,”
– Clapper to the idiot Al Franken
The richest irony and manifestation of snowflake cognitive dissonance is their insistence that taking millions in bribes from Russia, as Hillary did — is just fine. But meeting with them is treason!
https://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/24/us/cash-flowed-to-clinton-foundation-as-russians-pressed-for-control-of-uranium-company.html?_r=1
This journalist is wrong.
Most codes of civic honor would applaud a campaign’s turning up of illegal actions on the part of one party’s candidate for President. Suppose for a moment, just suppose, that this meeting turned up indisputable evidence of Hilary treachery and illegality but the Trump campaign had declined to see it or hear about it on the basis of civic honor. They would be denying the media and the authorities extremely important information that would have (remember we are supposing) perhaps have stopped a traitor or criminal from becoming President.
What real journalist would agree that refusing to look at that information would be the right thing to do? Head in the sand, anyone?
Head is somewhere else for sure. I went to NYT (following a headline off The Drudge Report) and started reading the comments. They’ve gone completely loopy over there.
Hillary was rewarded richly for her ‘civic honor’
Saudi Arabia: $25,000,000 – State Dept. approval for U.S. arms sales to Saudi Arabia
Prince of Abu Dhabi: $5,000,000 – Muted criticism by State of Bahrain’s abysmal human rights practices.
Brunei: $5,000,000 – State Dept. clearance for U.S. weapons sales to Brunei.
GEMS Education, Dubai: $5,600,000 – Bill Clinton made honorary chairman.
Kuwait: $10,000,000 – State Dept. clearance for U.S. weapons sales to Kuwait.
Sheikh Mohammed H. Al Amoudi: $10,000,000 – Influence-buying within the Clinton State Dept.
Qatar: $5,000,000 – State Dept. approval for U.S. arms sales to Qatar.
United Arab Emirates: $5,000,000 – State Dept. approval for U.S. weapons sales to the UAE.
Oman: $5,000,000 – State clearance for U.S. weapons sales to Oman.
The United States has a long history of exporting weapons to these Muslim nations, notwithstanding their abysmal human rights record. Of course, the human rights record of the United States is in danger of becoming abysmal should Trump and the GOP-controlled Congress succeed in their attempt to destroy the health care services of 70 million people in the United States.
You don’t think it suspicious that these countries and individuals were suddenly seized by the desire to donate huge sums to the Clinton Foundation while Hillary was in the position to most influence decisions they wanted?
If you can see Donald Jr being willing to accept dirt concerning the Clinton campaign from ‘foreign agents’ as an issue (assume that they were, even though that seems a tenuous claim), then surely you can see that taking money from foreign countries and interested parties is a worse situation.
A couple of notes.
At first there was mention of a Russian or Azerbaijani pop star in the picture as the intermediary between Goldstone and the Russian MAFIA lawyer (which is important because that relationship takes precedences in ANY MAFIA ANYWHERE over national loyalty). Why am I not seeing any mention of that pop star anymore, and why do have a strong suspicion Goldstone’s relationship with that pop star was more than music business related.
If we knew the nature of their relationship we’d know A LOT more.
Further, I think everyone’s losing focus on why, if he did, Trump was dealing with the Russians. It’s BUSINESS, and the Russian mafia, much as the Italian mafia became, IS A BUSINESS VENTURE.
I’ve been making a rough guess that all this has to do with the recently privatized 19.5% stake in Rosneft the Russian National Oil/Gas company, and that every single creep in DC is either playing the Russian oil and gas markets, OR in the case of the DNC, Ukraine oil and gas. The DNC has KNOWN CONNECTIONS to a Ukraine billionaire who gave to their war chest, and one of Clinton’s main Fundraisers’ involvement with Crowdstrike AND Banderistas… ie. Nazis. MAybe Crowdstrike was simply trying to sabotage Russia’s oil trade by making a BS story about “Election Hacks” up? There’s still NOT ONE SPECK of forensic evidence available to the public in regard to it and I SURE THE F*UCK don’t believe “Intel Community Says So” nonsense.
About that oil and gas biz:
I LOVE Reuter’s lede here:
“How Russia sold its oil jewel: without saying who bought it”
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-russia-rosneft-privatisation-insight-idUSKBN1582OH
Guess who.
Ukraine via UPI:
Russian gas at play in U.S.-Ukrainian diplomacy
http://www.upi.com/Russian-gas-at-play-in-US-Ukrainian-diplomacy/2641499678712
Guess whose playing?
Every scumbag in DC.
This isn’t about a russian takeover of the US government, it’s the economic elite wheeling and dealing in grey areas where lawyers and money laundering through banks is business as usual. And all this IS business as usual.
The only difference, as far as Trump goes, is the economic elite used to go to the national leadership to get the policies they wanted enacted (see the Gilens and Page study). Now the economic elite has their shill in office who simply knows and does what they’d like. Trump’s failing is he can’t distance himself from that wheelings and dealings, no less dis-involve himself.
But ALL OF THIS IS “Business as Usual”… A HUGE MEDIA SUCKING RED HERRING SWIMMING IN THE Poe-Toe-Mac while millions of Americans sleep in doorways and shelters and our budget-destroying military is involved in EVERY CONFLICT ON THE PLANET.
In other words. Keep watching the putz. While the world burns and takes “America” down with it.
trump has ties to russia, and clinton has ties to china
but because trump’s ties are gritty business dealings, and clinton’s are supposedly high-concept joy to the world speaking engagement type stuff … trump must be stopped
this does nothing to address the fact that economic fears about china are just as valid as geopolitical fears about russia
because TI is on the side of the china one-worlders … when we’re all speaking chinese and riding bicycles dont say i didnt warn you
New here? Or is your own ox now being gored?
https://theintercept.com/2016/08/08/dems-tactic-of-accusing-adversaries-of-kremlin-ties-and-russia-sympathies-has-long-history-in-us/
Tip to the wise: people are unlikely to heed any written warning from a person who don’t understand punctuation.
“people are unlikely to heed any written warning from a person who don’t understand punctuation.”
The correct way to write this is — “from a person who doesn’t understand punctuation.”
So now, here’s the conundrum. Which advice should I ignore — the one from the person who doesn’t know punctuation or the one who doesn’t bother to check whether sentences are grammatically correct?
punctuation is a tool of the man to keep the people down
it serves the power structure … only the ellipsis is needed to carry out the work of the 99 percent
@hans
You are my new punctuation hero! Don’t let the Clinton trolls stifle your ellipses. Apologies for my usage of dominant orthodox punctuation–years of conditioning.
You should have said “from a person who doesn’t understand punctuation.” You need to brush up on your English grammar before you lecture other people about punctuation.
Much ado about nothing. We were all played in the general election by the AFP/Koch Interstate Crosscheck of Voter I.D. scam, led by Kris Kobach, that placed the outcome of the election in the hands of pre-positioned swing states who could remove votes legally using the automated computer program. What wasn’t legal was how this legal program was ‘programed’ to leave out specific identifiers thereby snaring wide swaths of ethnic votes.
And now we are being played by the Russia connection distraction while the FDA is gutted, EPA is gutted, Press/Free speech eroded, etc. etc.
Kris Kobach, who’s been sued four times by the ACLU for voter suppression (ACLU won each case), is then strangely put in charge of Trumps Voter Commission probing voter fraud. His first task is to ask states for even more insightful data about voters. Presumably to fine tune the now legal Crosscheck program. Apparently targeting ethic last names who traditionally vote Democratic isn’t enough for them. Since they got away with it so easily the first time they now want to spread the suppression around more evenly next time amongst white voters too.
(No need to add that we were simultaneously played by social media too and that they will only be more adept in the future as well.)
William Binney said early on about Russia hacking of the election that ‘if our intelligence had something actionable they would have come out with it by now’.
So then what’s all this about other than distraction & news ratings… rule #er 1 – you don’t mess with the Gestapo. They are making Trump pay. But it’s still a side-show.
This clinging for hope that Trump will be Impeached is understandable but for what? To fall into the hands of the Republicans wet dream for POTUS – Mike Pence?! (~shudder~).
Now they are ramping up using Health Care as a scare tactic distraction when every Republican knows that it would be political suicide.
Forget ‘evil’ Russia, America already has them on the ropes. We’re in bed and under the covers with the saintly Saudis and people are worried about Russia??
Keep your eye on the real issues – Net Neutrality, FDA, EPA, Climate Change, Freedom of the Press – all of which are under direct attack and losing. Wake up, we are still being played.
Good article Sam – keep at it. I bet we have just seen the tip of the iceberg to date
The entire “Russian” narrative rests upon forensic evidence held to this day by a private third party cyber firm called CrowdStrike, which should change its name to ClownStrike.
ClownStrike was under contract to the DNC. After the DNC servers were allegedly hacked, the FBI and the DHS were denied access to the servers. No confirmation that “Russians” hacked anything is hence available.
Three US government agencies, FBI, NSA and CIA, attested that “Russia did it.” FBI and CIA made this attestation with “high confidence.” NSA with “moderate confidence.”
This attestation was an “assessment,” not an “estimate.” An intelligence estimate includes input from all 17 US intelligence agencies and is a product of the National Intelligence Council. An assessment can be anything, to include an attestation by two agencies with high confidence and one agency with moderate confidence.
News accounts claiming that four intelligence agencies made the assessment are false. The Office of the Director of National Intelligence is not an agency. Hillary has blared “17 agencies say so.” This is obviously false, as well.
ClownStrike has been discredited. Anyone interested in confirming that can simply google the company’s name and “Ukraine.”
Any proof, any evidence, that “Russia did it” is consequently held on servers in the custody of a discredited private cyber firm that was under contract to the DNC.
Why did the DNC deny the FBI and DHS access to the servers?
Why does DNC deny the FBI and DHS access to the servers to this very day?
Why have those servers not been seized by the US government?
We see that news agencies engaged in a sustained and coordinated campaign of information warfare flog the “Russia did it” narrative in an unending fashion. They rely primarily upon leaked information.
Why has no proof, actual evidence, that “Russia did it” been leaked? Reality Winner does not count. Her documents confirmed nothing.
The intelligence community leaks like a sieve. Where are the leaks confirming that “Russia did it?”
Why are investigative journalists not all over ClownStrike?
I could go on, and on, but doing so would merely confirm for many readers that I am racist and misogynist.
“I could go on, and on, but doing so would merely confirm for many readers that I am racist and misogynist.”
Doubtful !
Stop making sense, will you? You’ll spoil the party.
Not only is Crowdstrike under contract with the DNC, they are a near subsidiary of Google, whose CEO was dedicated to a Clinton victory.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PpQH6X1pY0o
17:02 Crowdstrike has “a shared, kindred spirit with Google in terms of our mission and what we care about and what we see at Crowdstrike.”
17:36 “See why Google Capital Led $100M Investment in Crowdstrike”
19:48 Google CEO Eric Schmidt were helping Hillary Clinton in her bid for the White House
Sounds like Biddle / Intercept are butthurt that they’re out of the loop on the self-serving Russiagate leaks the CIA continues to provide to WaPo and NYT.
Believe whatever you want to.. but the trump administration is not trust-worthy. there are too many questions and no answers. He avoid any oaths and affirms nothing – a street clown or charlatan can pull it off – – but the role of president doesn’t play well. The showman – like a juggler keeping everything in the air and people guessing. Add to that his many lies and threats…..His big push on the healthcare bill which is the opposite of what he was selling – doesn’t seem to going anywhere…
Attorney General Sessions & his Russian connections/meetings? Justice Department Defies Court Deadline To Release Sessions’ Contacts With Russians…(reported both on NPR and the HILL??)
General Flynn – Russian connections / meetings – on a foreign payroll? Taking the 5th??
Donnie Jr. – – ??
Donald’s praising Putin / and was it a joke asking for Putin to find Hillary’s e-mails??
TOO MANY QUESTIONS – NO ANSWERS yes he is a diversion for the republicans – –
helping to hide their deals but it is playing out…….
2018 mid-term congressional elections are up coming and the Koch brothers are fronting 400 million dollars to keep them in power – WHOSE SELLING WHAT?? WHOSE BUYING WHAT??
to say dirty old men dying – the sickness of wanting more and more – the curse of the Midas touch never enough….can’t enjoy what they have – can’t spend what they have – still wanting
The devil you say! If it wasn’t for corporate media blaring this 24/7, I’d never have guessed.
I hate to see The Intercept joining the corporate mass media and various Soros-funded entities (e.g., Democracy Now) on the “Russia hacked the election” propaganda train. The writer of this hit piece (I won’t call it journalism) left out how the Clinton campaign and the DNC met with people in the government of Ukraine for oppo research on the Trump campaign. They, in other words, colluded with a foreign government to alter the course of the campaign. And it worked. Soon after, Paul Mannafort was forced to step down as campaign chairman. Trump Jr., on the other hand, did not meet with someone connected to the Russian government and received no oppo research on the Clinton campaign. Yet the corporate mass media (which apparently includes The Intercept now) is only interested in speculating and weaving conspiracy theories about Trump and Russia.
Uh…in case you haven’t noticed, Trump’s in charge now.
And, you’re obviously new here: https://theintercept.com/2016/08/08/dems-tactic-of-accusing-adversaries-of-kremlin-ties-and-russia-sympathies-has-long-history-in-us/
Now, go get a bandaid and a blankie for that poor ox of yours that was gored.
I missed that article. Good one, thank you.
Truly disappointing. The Biddle article doesn’t bode well– especially after the Intercept’s back-to-back David Dayen hit pieces on the National Nurses United union.
I predict … that GG and NT will leave this site. Being owned by a corporate billionaire has political consequences and they will slowly grow to be more obvious. A drip/drip of articles is showing this.
You’re tragically misinformed, friend. Guess I’ll have to correct the record.
“Democracy Now! is a 501(c)3 non-profit news organization. We do not accept funding from advertising, underwriting or government agencies. We rely on contributions from our viewers and listeners to do our work. Please do your part today.”
I don’t care what Alex Jones tells you, Amy Goodman’s legit. Please don’t open your filthy pie hole about her again, aight? https://www.democracynow.org/2008/1/28/massacre_the_story_of_east_timor
Amy is generally good, but her political views are not really radical. She is a left/liberal whose main axe is human rights issues. Labor issues, economics, socialism and the like are given almost no coverage.
And people are allowed to critically engage with DN, unlike your ‘filthy pie hole’ comment. Crudity is its own dis-argument.
lol quit fouling up the air with your nose. “Crudity is its own dis-argument.” What a snob! You and that sentence make me wanna vomit.
If those are your sincere feelings, then why be here. Surely you have other sites that fit your viewpoint. Good luck.
Reeeeeeeeeeeeeead: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Amy_Goodman/Archive_1
The DNC showed their hand when they refused to allow investigation into their security breaches. This is a tempest in a tablespoon. Hillary’s Russian uranium deal is much, Much, MUCH more revealing of political corruption and political profit. https://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/24/us/cash-flowed-to-clinton-foundation-as-russians-pressed-for-control-of-uranium-company.html
we are told by the various US intelligence agencies that their Russian equivalents are highly sophisticated, pervasive and that they have successfully influenced the outcome of the 2016 presidential election. we are also told that they have Wikileak’s Julian Assange in their pockets.
and then we have junior Trump’s emails. all exchanged in the public domain and presumably harvested by whoever it is who collects all our phone and email data. this highly sophisticated Russian intelligence agency then uses a British music publicist, with no formal Russian connection to act as a courier, thus putting paid to ideas of Trump-Putin back channels. it is clear from the contact that there is no prior history, nothing to suggest that Trump and Putin are colluding at all, in fact quite the opposite. the use of Goldstone via some high government official sounds very amateurish, as does the approach itself which was out in the open, using phones and computers.
there is a disconnect between these two methodologies and narratives. if there were back channels between Putin and Trump, then they would have been used for this enterprise. the fact that not only Trump jr., but also Kushner and Manafort, a man who is under suspicion of being a conduit himself, all went to this meeting to find something of interest from a complete stranger, strongly indicates that there never was any collusion between the Trump camp and the Russians. If the Russians are so clever why use such an ad hoc method of contacting the Trump camp. if they had Assange in their pockets, why not use him. and why was the approach so unsubtle, if as is being claimed, it was instigated by the Kremlin.
Critical thinking at play…not allowed! ;)
Good points. Trump likely fears public disclosure of his decades-long business with the oligarchs who stole trillions in public assets from the collapsing Soviet state. Trump Inc, probably laundered this money.
The Russians use rank amateurs quite frequently in their covert operations because they are expendable. Consider the ex-Russian spy who was fatally poisoned by Polonium in Great Britain. The two young assassins who were assigned to this task (both 20-somethings) only succeeded in their mission after their third trip to Great Britain. They handled this dangerous radioactive substance with incredible incompetence, leaving behind themselves a radioactive trail all over London that eventually led to Moscow. The evidence indicates that they had no idea that they were handling a radioactive substance, and they suffered serious skin burns as a result. Conclusion: Russian intelligence is more than willing to employ useful idiots in their covert operations.
“the fact that not only Trump jr., but also Kushner and Manafort, a man who is under suspicion of being a conduit himself, all went to this meeting to find something of interest from a complete stranger, strongly indicates that there never was any collusion between the Trump camp and the Russians
” If the Russians are so clever why use such an ad hoc method of contacting the Trump camp.”
Because it works. We have the emails from the horse’s mouth. You can spin it, but you cannot deny that it worked quite well.
Putin has a history of this as it is — he used intermediaries (Lugovoy) to get in contact with people to put polonium-210 in the tea of former KGB spy-turned-whistleblower Alexander Litvinenko, and had Anna Politkovskaya gunned down before that. North Korea did the same thing a few months ago when Kim Jong-un ordered a hit on his estranged brother and used intermediaries to convince a couple of people that it was all a show.
” if they had Assange in their pockets, why not use him.”
Well for one, Assange cannot leave the Ecuadorian embassy he’s been living in for years without being extradited to the US on federal criminal charges. Can’t have him create a meeting he couldn’t attend.
Sounds to me like someone got ahold of this later in the game and tried to capitalize on it.
There are analyses of Guccifer 2.0’s disclosures which suggest that “he” was and is a creation of the DNC intended to discredit the disclosures of Hillary’s e-mails and DNC documents by Wikileaks and that Guccifer 2.0 appeared almost immediately after Wikileaks announced that it had such documents to reveal.
Start your reading here: http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-07-10/new-research-shows-guccifer-20-files-were-copied-locally-dnc-not-hacked-russians
But then follow the hypertext in the article to other supporting analyses which are equally suggestive of this if not convincing.
why am i supposed to care about the source of the dnc leaks? isn’t it enough to know that the dnc cheated my candidate, bernie sanders, out of the nomination?
No, it isn’t enough to know that there was collusion between the Clinton campaign and the DNC to favor HRC over Bernie. It isn’t enough to know that the press was feeding debate questions to the coronated one in advance of the debates. In fact, this is all your fault. Your support for Bernie lifted a candidate that left HRC wounded heading into the general. Why she wouldn’t have had to cheat had you not gotten your candidate so close to being able to win! Trump is your fault. You’re RUSSIAN, aren’t you?
It is my belief, that faced with the two worst candidates in history, Americans panicked and instead of refusing to vote en masse, picked the candidate they knew the least about. This leads to the obvious question that no one is asking – why didn’t some other country take up the task of revealing information about Mr. Trump? Unfortunately, it appears that Mr. Trump’s agenda of walling off the United States from the rest of the world is universally popular in other countries. Thus there was no country to step forward and shoulder the task of informing the American public about Mr. Trump.
This desperate situation calls for radical measures. Perhaps the press, rather than just publishing polls about who is leading the race, should perform investigative journalism. The editorial board of virtually every newspaper in the US came out in support of Mrs. Clinton. Couldn’t even one of them have performed an investigation of Mr. Trump? Perhaps the media is too wedded to the proposition that the American public must be kept ignorant at all costs. This created a vacuum that the Russians cleverly filled with information and the rest is history. Journalists will reject my suggestion that they should publish at least a modicum of information. But otherwise, when the truth presents itself, people will have no immunity, and succumb immediately. For example, as Mr. Biddle notes, the documents released by Gucifer 2.0 contained nothing incriminating. But people were so overwhelmed by the fact that information was available to them, that they interpreted it as a condemnation of Mrs. Clinton. How could someone, who allowed information about themselves to become public, be trusted to run a secret government?
The fact that Mr. Biddle states that virtually none of the e-mails were newsworthy shows a lack of imagination. An e-mail ordering a pizza can turn into Pizzagate. An e-mail addressed to someone who once talked to a Russian can turn into proof of collusion. As Richelieu supposedly observed, “If you give me six lines written by the hand of the most honest of men, I will find something in them which will hang him”. There is no such thing as an innocuous e-mail.
” picked the candidate they knew the least about.” Not quite. IMHO the voters who put him over the top knew exactly what they were doing. The “somewhat” independent thinking US voter had had enough. They make up a small part of the electorate, but you only need 5 – 10% to change the election. Faced with the poster child for political corruption and the military industrial complex and a molotov cocktail, they chose to burn down Washington.
Burn baby burn!!!!
Periodic cleansings are fine, but burning out the corruption in Washington risks starting a massive uncontrolled fire, simply because there is so much fuel. The problem with massive uncontrolled fires is they may end up destroying more than you bargained for. What if it destroys not only Washington, but the United States? Or not only the United States, but the entire world. Or even worse, it not only destroys the world, but also affects my personal wellbeing. Of course, there will always be anarchists who want to burn everything down. But it is not necessarily wise to put them in charge of government; the government has too much firepower.
That’s funny stuff, Benito!
this is a very well-articulated analysis.
bravo.
You are right, the DNC and RNC painted us into an ugly unwinnable corner.
Please note that Mexican president Fox railed for months and months about tRump. National figures from Obama on down, railed for months and months. Canadian politicians, Eurpoean politicians, African, Middle-East, etc… There was no shortage of negative info on him.
There was no shortage of anti-tRump material. Hillary WAS and IS just that disliked and tRump is just that disgusting.
Benito…..thank you for your analysis; on point on all fours….
It has always been my thought that “there is no such thing as an innocuous e-mail”. There is such an anxiety by the media to be the first in line to disclose “new” information that many are not doing the research that should be required for validation.
Especially love your Richelieu quote!…..you are so good at that….
thanks…..
Fake News
Interesting…but I don’t think you will be receiving an explanation of anything from anyone. They are all gangsters, including the Ice Queen.
What the heck, you ‘ve had some kind of a weird cosmic encounter with the evil ones. Get some Holy Water, quickly.
(;
the wallstreet whore media keeps wanting Americans to waste their time on “russia”. Forget what really matters. Is this how you are now?
There is a joke that exemplifies how the thieving wallstreet whore media treats Americans this way….
how do you keep a gang of black guys from raping a blond?
A. toss them a basketball.
Don’t laff – this is how the thieves of wallstreet and their whore media conspire and COLLUDE to rob Americans and perpetrate war for israel.
WAKE THET FRIK UP
Why does this site, a supposed progressive publication, attract so many wacko Trumpsters, as evidenced by comments page? Those who voted for the man should finally face facts: You have supported a narcissistic half-witted liar. Stop blaming Obama and Hillary. Trump is toxic.
Said the kettle to the pot, er ,eh.showing your primary colors?.hmm.when/where/how/why did the newest version of Russia phobic hype begin?
How many iterations , versions, plot changes, chapters, character changes, plots, etc. have there been in the past 16 months or so?
I so agree – there are times that the idiocy leaves you breathless. For a large part it appears many are basement dwellers who haven’t a clue of what life is about.
Yes, there will always be trolls among us: But Sam Biddle’s interesting article *does* confirm how Hillary’s campaign was kept busy fighting the wrong battles — arguably because of its own IT contractors and certainly because of the deadline-oriented media-at-large, unwittingly playing its role for Trump and the Russians.
For too long, I suspect, Hillary & co insisted that ‘nothing important’ was taken (refusing to believe the released data existed); and 2) they defended the contents, without SCREAMING to some authority that Trump’s support of the hacking damaged the integrity of the campaign — and, by extension, the election. That said, federal investigators — not to mention Congressional panels — had already proved that they were no friends of the Hillary campaign….
Because a certain country has propaganda engines designed to flood comments sections with bullshit.
That’s a good question.
Leaving aside the paid trolls (something impossible to quantify), the Republican party and Trumpism converge nicely. The themes are the same for both political factions: consistent aggrievement with government and economic empowerment of commercial factions.
The media calls oligarchs bad for government in Russia, but billionaires entitled in America. There’s not much difference in their political interests.
Where’s the meaningful difference between a government run by a strongman acting in the interests of the privileged elite and a government run by an idiot acting in the interests of the privileged elite.
Obama wiretapped the Trump campaign. I’d call that state sponsored opposition research.
You forgot the “/s” tag. Too funny.
Sorry to double post, but, for any who think tz is onto something may wish to read this first, https://www.emptywheel.net/2017/07/11/don-jr-provides-proof-obama-didnt-tapp-trump/
I think Obama “wiretapped” (lol) the Russians and happened to also catch any Americans who happened to be talking to them.
I assume you know by now that a number of analysts have determined that Guccifer 2.0 may have been an invention of the Clinton campaign. http://g-2.space/
I notice that the article you cite was last updated July 9 2017, and its timeline begins after the June 9 2016 meeting between Don Jr., Kushner, Manafort, the Russian lawyer, etc. So it doesn’t take into account any of these recent developments.
” It’s possible these people are all smarter than they look, and deliberately did not refer to the actual nature of the hacked documents in writing.”
This makes a lot of sense. If, as was stated, the documents were of “..high level and sensitive information…”, that would quite possibly lead to the ability of U.S. “Services” to deduce their “assets” in this country.
This just in: Trump and Putin all swear that there’s no there there!
so, that’s the end of it
Right?
I mean, to all the commenters at TI… that’s good enough for them… and it oughta be good enough for you.
@ RMD
Warmonger!
…well… Trump swears (among other things) that he’s telling us the truth.
and Putin says Nyet! to queries about his involvement.
So… that kinda ends the whole investigation.
…excuse me while I pass an enormous amount of gas
“Let me tell you: You take on the intelligence community — they have six ways from Sunday at getting back at you,” said Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer Tuesday evening on MSNBC to host Rachel Maddow
Chilling Chuck Schumer – we need honest people to run for public office and clean out the government and get a bit in the mouth of rogue agencies.
Wow, it’s almost like the intelligence community’s entire job is to dig up dirt on people and organizations and nations, and that crossing them (such as, let’s say, repeatedly insulting them and attempting to discredit them throughout an election cycle) would lead to them publicly airing the dirty laundry of said person/people who crossed that community.
“The U.S. intelligence community claims that “Guccifer 2.0? was an entity operated by the Russian government.”
I assume this is a joke. Right here in the Intercept we have writers quoting unnamed intelligence community claims – unbelievable after thoroughly discrediting these institutions over and over now suddenly their high confidence is issued to readers as fact.
Your problem Intercept is that Trump is creating uncertainty which threatens your world view and commits the biggest sin of all – disobedience.
Clearly you would rather see Mike Pence president – really?
This is all a huge distraction anyway, the US just quite publicly demonstrated its willing to use nuclear weapons in a first strike – the position it has held over the past 70 years. Seventy years, by the way not a day of which passed when people were not killed by the United States. A B1-B bomber made a run near the North Korean border dropping a dummy nuclear bomb – making the open threat to China and Russia.
But never mind Trump Jr had a meeting.
Pathetic
Thank you. Couldn’t have written a better comment my self. The intercept is loosing a bit of my trust by stating certain “facts” when in the past the source of these facts has been proven as lies or plain ineptitude.
Russia is not a threat to anyone except the foreign policy whores who want influence US elections and rob the American public of resources, value, and a lot more. These foreign policy whores also are trying to rob the people of Palestine.
https://electronicintifada.net/tags/maan-news-agency
They care NOTHING of building Americans or American values or infrastructure or anything. They have colluded with the wallstreet bankster thieves to deprice America and bankrupt the country with their foreign policy whore dicisions.
You know, Biddle, you’d save yourself a lot of embarrassment if you’d actually verify what people send you before you go to print with this baloney. It’s been reported that the DNC files were lifted internally, by someone with access to their computers, and not hacked by foreign agents. But you’re so eager to believe conspiratorial nonsense you never bothered to check to see if your “source” was on the level. So you fell for another con job.
Even more disturbing, the copy date is July 5, 2016. Five days later, July 10, 2016), Seth Rich is killed.
http://telzilla.com/zero-hedge/new-research-shows-guccifer-2-0-files-were-copied-locally-not-hacked/
Here here..touché!..bravo
There’s no evidence linking Seth Rich to the DNC-Clinton-Podesta leaks, or that his murder wasn’t a coincidence. I’m not saying he wasn’t or that his death wasn’t linked, but we have no supporting information to confirm any of it. Until then, we cannot make that assumption, just as we cannot assume Russia was involved in hacking anything.
At this point, seeing Russia as being both the main instigator and practitioner of the hacking is much more than an assumption.
No it isn’t. You’re making assumptions based on unsubstantiated accusations that have yet to be supported by any evidence whatsoever.
Exactly! Why no stories on Seth Rich? DC Metropolitan police have a cold case at this point.
Did ‘The Profiling Project’ file a Freedom of Information Act request? Is nobody (except Tuck C) going to make the police department open up this case to the public? That ‘Daily Caller’ article ( yeah, I know)written by Ted Goodman said,
“The Profiling Project filed the lawsuit in D.C. Superior Court Wednesday morning, asserting that MPD has mismanaged the murder investigation. The group said that MPD’s stonewalling is unjustified.”
The police have video camera footage. Goodman’s article (05/31/17) said,
“MPD has a history of regularly releasing surveillance video to the public pertaining to unsolved criminal investigations. A quick look at the police department’s YouTube channel reveals that they post video footage in cases involving a person of interest. MPD has published 12 videos in the last week alone, to include unsolved murder investigations. Their habit for transparency with unsolved cases raises the question as to why they’ve been so tight-lipped about the Rich case.”
Too much here to ignore.
The Intercept, hopefully, is interested as well.
Things aren’t always what they seem. Seth Rich may have merely known who did the copying. What would be interesting to know is who had access to the system on July 5th, the day after the 4th of July holiday. Official Washington was probably asleep (hungover), with temps and low-level staffers manning the system.
Another thing to look into is the topology of the network. Did it have a domain controller? Which server version was it? Server 2008 or Server 2012? It will give a clue as to the skill set of the alleged hacker. A Linux boot may bypass the local Operating System but it will take more than that to get around the domain controller. Someone who can diddle a domain controller would rank as semi-professional or is using professional level intrusion tools.
Who knows? Maybe the DNC had all the information on a public share with access for Everybody including the guest account. But, if the copy came from the hacked target machine using a usb, then that narrows it down considerably to who had access to that machine, on that date, at that time.
Good points by you and Bowiepoet.
I found it very odd that the DNC didn’t seem to care less about his killing.
Why wasn’t that a big deal to them.
If there were rewards…how large were they, for example.
I do know his family doesn’t want the leak blamed on him, but you’re right, he could have simply known who did it.
Here’s hoping the Seth Rich Story will get 2% of the Russia attention…just dreaming.
looks like Putin’s disinformation campaign is still active. thanx Comrade!
More likely, the Democrat establishment’s disinformation campaign, which refuses to die in spite of lacking even a shred of evidence to prove its accusations. Look, there is plenty enough to impeach Drumpf over, for example, his multiple violations of the emoluments clause. But chasing after phantom Russia ties sets us on a dangerous path to extinction by way of nuclear holocaust resulting from U.S. efforts to reignite the Cold War. I want my four children to live well into old age. That won’t happen with the nutcases in the beltway trying to goad Drumpf into a conflict with nuclear-armed nations.
“Veselnitskaya brought with her a plastic folder with printed-out documents that detailed what she believed was the flow of illicit funds to the Democrats, Akhmetshin said. Veselnitskaya presented the contents of the documents to the Trump associates and suggested that making the information public could help the campaign, he said.
“This could be a good issue to expose how the DNC is accepting bad money,” Akhmetshin recalled her saying.’
(AP 7-14-17)
Ah, ye skeptics, just wait, the onion peeleth to reveal the rot within.
Even if it’s true, so what? One campaign trying to find dirt on the other under any rock is routine dirty politics and nothing new or shocking. This Russiagate tripe is cyops by the warmonger profiteers and their media enablers designed to prevent Trump’s campaign promise of diplomacy with nuclear armed Russia. The fake democratic progressives and the phony republican fiscal conservatives on the Russiagate train deserve Darwin awards as they lead us ever closer to the cliff.
As the people who know about these kinds of things (actual political campaign managers for the past several decades) have repeatedly pointed out in the past week or so, it is not normal for an American political campaign to meet with members of a foreign government, especially one with which the US is at odds over many issues, to receive illegally-acquired info on their campaign opponent. The two preceding campaigns during which one party was offered illegally-acquired info on their opponent, those parties have gone to the FBI.
And yet Ronald Reagan sent George H.W. Bush to talk the Iranians into delaying release of the Tehran hostages until after the 1980 election- Arms for hostages.
Invitation of foreign meddling into our campaigns may not be ‘normal,’ but it is hardly new…
Distraction and more distraction, meanwhile the people are left to fester in poverty, high medical bills, homelessness, 40 million making 20 thousand a years, thousands living in cars, school children hungry, water has lead and other chemical substances, nuclear waste plume in the Columbia river…etc…and the only thing journalists are concerned is about Russia meddling in the elections of the POTUS?
The US has done much worse in many countries and created enormous amount of suffering by killing elected presidents.
Now Hillaryton is another thing…The election is over and the country needs to be governend. Who pays for the distraction is the people. I expect better from the Intercept.
I agree. The Dems are all in on Russia to the neglect of abuses which don’t need smoking guns or Guccifers, they’re right out in the open, as promised by Trump. What are they doing about them? Not much…
Of course if the “Intel community” says so, it MUST be true. They would never mislead….
Why do people bother to even consider all these developments?
We’ve already been informed that it is Russaphobia.
…and Trump clearly states that it”s a “which? hunt?!”
please… can’t we do some crack? reporting on how democrats are the source of all that is wrong?
[impatiently tapping my fingers]
Well?
I truly value the Intercept as a breath of fresh and balanced reporting among all the propaganda from NY Times, Fox News, MSNBC, CNN.
But this article was a disappointment because it mimicked the loose, speculative, non-important talk of the other media . Please keep focused and critical, your reporting is what strengthens democracy.
There is nothing of real substance in this article.
Loading on to the piles of innuendo is NOT anything more than
manipulative speculation – even down to the application of “he”
Gucci-fer.
It is as likely as not that all of this is a creation of the “intelligence”
community because they have to create a war against Russia and
Trump isn’t as reliable for that purpose as was Hillary.
LOL. It’s a mystery to me why anyone would publicly post their notion that “all of this is a creation of the intelligence community”, even though several figures involved in all of this have gradually come forward to personally confirm key portions of the story. The suggestion you’re offering is that these people are being forced to publicly incriminate themselves. That’s such a bizarre worldview that it beggars the imagination.
It appears that Biddle’s a ‘Mockingbird’.
Regardless of all of the possibilities, the body of evidence including the leak by Reality Winner, the interference in the various European elections and the very strong motive Russia had to undermine the candidacy of Hillary Clinton indicate a high likelihood of Russian interference in the US elections – as outlined by US intelligence. That much is becoming clearer by the day.
Yawn. Russia would have to get in line behind
Ukraine, Saudi Arabia, China, Israel and the list goes on.
The “Chinagate” fundraising scandal plagued the 1996 Bill Clinton-Al Gore campaign and Hillary was very much involved. Chinagate aka Commercegate is the most serious scandal in U.S. history. It involves the transfer of America’s most sensitive technology, including but not limited to nuclear missile and satellite technology, apparently in exchange for millions of dollars in contributions to the 1996 Clinton-Gore re-election effort and the Democratic National Committee. The Chinagate scandal of 1996 ended up in an award of 900,000 in attorney’s fees and costs to Judicial Watch ten years later. The scandal was an apparent scheme by the Clinton administration to sell seats on taxpayer-funded trade missions in exchange for campaign contributions to the 1996 Clinton-Gore campaign.
You applaud that investigation, and yet you think there should be no investigation of today’s broader foreign infiltration into US elections.
Wow, THIS article is really a nothing burger.
Disappointing. I expect more from The Intercept than a chain of “maybes.” At the pace this story is developing, Biddle should’ve sat on this piece for a week until it could’ve “maybe” had the opportunity to say to something meaningful.
hello me guccifer who hack
How is it that nobody mentioned before that guccifer talks like cookie monster? Presuming this is guccifer of course…
I would think the sort of professional nerds who make up the centrist lib class would be all over such embarassing diction.
ME GUFFIFER!!! EMAILS YUM YUM YUM YUM YUM!!!!!
“. . . admitting to soliciting “
The word soliciting here is used in an odd way. In normal speak it would be Trump Jr. who had been solicited.
Also,
“Thus begun an extremely busy couple of weeks. “ Should be “Thus began . . . ”
http://www.beedictionary.com/common-errors/began_vs_begun
One remains stuck in a linguistic quagmire, constantly being confronted with articles like this in which one becomes confused amongst A Russian, Russians, Some Russians, any Russian, the Russians, and the Russian Government. Lacking recourse to a Cambridge philosopher, one has decided to stop paying attention.
It’s weird. Replace Russian with another nationality – French, Chinese, African – it starts to sound odd.
I actually know some nice Russians!
I actually work with some Russians. They are ecmxtremely nice. And also, not gossipy.
Several have already mentioned.
Why is this news? Nothing but speculation for the fake news club. As someone recently said, STFU, DC.
As Alexander Hamilton writes in “The Federalist Papers,” the Constitution is designed to ensure “that the office of President will never fall to the lot of any man who is not in an eminent degree endowed with the requisite qualifications.”
Hmmm…if you removed the speculations, I don’t think there’d be much left.
Btw, it isn’t just Junior that can be excoriated over this, there’s Kushner. How far are any politicians really going to go against Netanyahoo’s darling boy.
Uhhh…seems to me that Hillary Clinton takes a back seat to no one when it comes to snivelling to Netanyahu.
Do we even know Guccifer 2.0 hacked anything?
We know he had some documents from the DNC, he could have been given them by the DNC, or by someone in the Intelligence Community. Or possibly by someone who had leaked them but wanted a third party (outside FBI jurisdiction) to go around and back a lot of noise to distract attention away from him.
I mean maybe spycraft standards are slipping, but last I heard KGB spies don’t go around online boasting about their exploits.
The whole Russia-thing looks like a deliberate distraction in case the “sleeping whale” emerged out of these email dumps – then everyone could pretend it was a Russian forgery.
It isn’t the Russians interfering in your elections, it is your own intelligence community
Do you always comment without first reading the article?
In case you’re wondering what that ringing sound in your head is, it’s the alarm clock telling you to wake up.
The article is premised on the basis that Guccifer 2.0 hacked the emails: “This is me who hacked the Democratic National Committee”
I was simply asking what the basis of that claim was.
I think the basis of the claim was all the attachments in the email saying stuff like, Donor List and Proposal List.
You know, all that stuff that came from the DNC servers that seems to be attached to the email depicted in the story.
The article then goes on to say that that same information from the attachments showed up on Guccifers website a couple days later.
“You know, all that stuff that came from the DNC servers that seems to be attached to the email depicted in the story.”
Did you miss the part where I suggested that might not be a very reliable indication?
If you were a member of the DNC you might think there was an advantage in spreading the rumor you had been hacked.
If you had hacked OR leaked from the DNC you might think there was an advantage in having someone beyond the reach of US law enforcement going around shouting at the top of their voice “it was me, it was me.”
We are in the realm of cyber crime and/or intelligence communities – deception is the norm. Just look at the way Adrian Lamo cuddled up to Chelsea Manning
That’s the stupidest thing I’ve heard this month. You’re suggesting that leaking the fact HRC cheating primary voters by rigging the election to cheat Sanders was somehow an advantage. LOL.
Because that was the information that was made public by Guccifer 2.0. Did you know that?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_Democratic_National_Committee_email_leak
Which bring us circling back to the question what is the basis for assuming Guccifoer 2.0 did do the hack.
It is true that if Guccifer 2.0 did the hack it is unlikely that he would be subsequently engaged by the DNC to pretend to have done the hack, but I don’t think a reasonable person would take that meaning from what I have written.
Can I introduce you to this concept?
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Principle_of_charity
It makes online discussions more productive and enjoyable for all participants. Assuming you are interested in productive discussions.
Have you listened to Trump?
To Julian Assange?
To Nigel Farange?
A proper propaganda campaign needs many voices to disseminate the core message.
In this case, the core message attacks the elitist West. The West isn’t just corrupt and stealing from its own people, it is also entirely incompetent. If they can’t protect their own secrets, how can they protect your interests?
Hillary Clinton embodies this kleptocratic incompetence. Look, she even stole the primary election from Bernie Sanders.
If you don’t believe me, just read a certain commentator here at The Intercept.
Silence is the last thing the GRU wants. Except about Russian soldiers in Ukraine.
Read this: https://consortiumnews.com/2017/07/24/intel-vets-challenge-russia-hack-evidence/
The article ends with another ‘we don’t know’. Odd coincidences aren’t really the stuff of serious journalism. And the final sentence makes no sense – if the hacker and the lawyer are fronts for the same team, why did one group not release the docs, but the other did? Guccifer said everyone was hacking the Dems.
We all want this to lead to Trump’s downfall, but the articles based on reaches are endless and they get tiresome, although I’m sure they generate hits.
It seems the Intercept has started to produce them as well, whereas before it was a bastion of objectivity on the subject.
If Chelsea received an email from a Russian lawyer saying she had proof that Trump was involved in corruption with Russians, wouldn’t we want her to check it out? And wouldn’t we cheer her if she used the meeting to score points against Trump?
We are speaking of two families of the same mold. The Clintons have wanted and strived to become part of the one percent. They have made it.
The Trumps have been there all of their lives.
The amounts of money both families possess gives them the security of being above the law.
These families need to be out of our political workings.
Like Paul Ryan, I don’t like hypotheticals, but I’m pretty sure she would have alerted the the FBI.
Well maybe she would have gone to the FBI, she’s a different character. But you see my point. The idea that only one of the bad guys would be curious doesn’t hold water.
“We all want this to lead to Trump’s downfall, but the articles based on reaches are endless and they get tiresome, although I’m sure they generate hits. ”
I don’t want that. It can’t happen without further damaging relations with Russia, which is stupid and could be very dangerous. They have nukes. I would like to see him brought down by something like the Kushner/Qatar issue. Now there is a scandal with some meat, not just phantoms. Or any of the other shady dealings that his refusal to divest will inevitably lead to.
Signed Sam Biddle….. still at the centre of ‘investigative journalism’.
Great work, Mr. Biddle. Thanks.
In the elite world of criminal governments, which the US is now experiencing, the theft of property common to regular people is replaced by “revealing of confidential information” and “intent to violate a rule”.
This is heresy upon the population, a trap, and a robbery of equality. To forbid people from having a relationship with the plastic fantastic echelon hogheads of a government they are supposed to own, is a betrayal by the hogheads, a usurpation of power. Eventually a political whore will have to stand before the public and tell US I have to lie to you because if i dont, i might accidentally reveal information you are not entitled to.
By the same tokens, the “governing” pharisees were insulted by Jesus’ presumption of equality and deemed this attempt at equality to be insubordination. But the pharisees only perceived relationships of hierarchy. Thus any person pronouncing equality was, in their eyes, subordinating them. Since the pharisees believed themselves to be top of their crop, they equivalated Jesus to be declaring himself a king. Jesus was only revealing information to the public from foreign sources for which the pharisees had him murdered.
The lynch pins for the overt tyranny were set by Truman. It’s been all downhill since. It only took this long to build the perfect beast.
Luke Skywalker, where are you? Time to bring down empire?
Great work, Mr. Biddle. Thank you for sharing something that I suspect your colleagues over at Jezebel or The Concourse wouldn’t be able to put together.