Of the plans put forward by the federal government to identify and stop budding terrorists, among the least understood are the FBI’s “Shared Responsibility Committees.”
The idea of the committees is to enlist counselors, social workers, religious figures, and other community members to intervene with people the FBI thinks are in danger of radicalizing — the sort of alternative to prosecution and jail time many experts have been clamoring for. But civil liberties groups worry the committees could become just a ruse to expand the FBI’s network of informants, and the government has refused to provide details about the program.
The Intercept has obtained a letter addressed to potential committee members from the FBI, outlining how the process would work. While the letter claims that committees will not be used “as a means to gather intelligence,” it also makes clear that information from the committees may be shared widely by the FBI, including with spy agencies and foreign governments, and that committee members can be subpoenaed for documents or called to testify in cases against the people they are trying to help. At the same time, committee members are forbidden even from seeking advice from outside experts without permission from the FBI.
The letter implies that Shared Responsibility Committees (or SRCs) would emerge organically, as “multidisciplinary groups voluntarily formed in local communities — at the initiative of the group and sometimes with the encouragement of the FBI.” The FBI would refer “potentially violent extremists” to the SRC, whose members would design an intervention plan, possibly including mental health or substance abuse treatment and help with education or housing.
According to the letter, the FBI “may or may not” inform the committee of any ongoing investigation, and law enforcement could also decide to arrest or charge the referred individual without telling the SRC. If committee members give information to the FBI, “the FBI may share any information the SRC provides with other law enforcement agencies, members of the U.S. intelligence community, and foreign government agencies as needed.”
SRC members, in contrast, must sign confidentiality agreements, and cannot consult outside experts on treatment plans. The committee members get no special legal protection, raising concerns they could be held liable if an individual they are helping turns violent as feared.
“Our society has established a number of protective zones where you’re allowed to be candid: with your doctor, your religious clergy, even to a certain extent within a school system, with student privacy laws,” said Mike German, a former FBI agent who is now a fellow at the Brennan Center for Justice. “This program that the FBI is setting up seems not to acknowledge those privileges, and in fact, seems to be intent on undermining them.”
The FBI declined to comment for this story.
But the letter closely echoes draft memoranda of understanding that were shown to activists in meetings with the FBI last summer and fall.
“The FBI seems to be outsourcing its intelligence gathering and surveillance to the community.”
People who attended the meetings, alarmed by what they saw as an inappropriate commingling of law enforcement with mental health and education, complained to the Justice Department, and SRCs were reportedly put on hold.
Abed Ayoub, legal director of the American-Arab Anti-Discrimination Committee, was one of those who attended the initial meetings, and has been critical of the program.
“There are many reasons why we feel the SRC program is problematic, but the main reason is that the FBI seems to be outsourcing its intelligence gathering and surveillance to the community,” Ayoub told The Intercept. “There are issues with liability and information sharing, particularly with foreign governments. But it is also troubling that the people on these committees would be ordinary civilians with little training, who may well have their own personal biases.”
Following the initial backlash, SRCs drew attention again late last month, after the ISIS attacks in Belgium, when Politico ran a piece describing SRCs as part of the “FBI’s secret Muslim network” to spot would-be terrorists. But the FBI would not give examples of groups that were part of the program nor even specify in which cities it would be tested.
In a March letter in response to questions from Rep. Bennie Thompson, D-Miss., the ranking member of the House Homeland Security Committee, a Justice Department official said that “the FBI is in the process of rolling out a limited pilot of the [SRC] concept,” in order to “assess its viability and effectiveness.”
The controversy over SRCs is part of a broader debate about other government “countering violent extremism” (or CVE) efforts and about the surveillance of Muslim communities by various law enforcement agencies.
Federal CVE initiatives in Los Angeles, Boston, and Minneapolis and St. Paul have been criticized by Muslim community groups as stigmatizing and ineffective. They have also proven divisive. In Minnesota, for example, there has been a debate within the Somali-American community over whether taking much-needed funds for youth and educational programs paints Somali youth as particularly prone to extremism.
Arun Kundnani, a lecturer on terrorism studies at New York University, said the SRCs, as described in the letter, resemble a highly controversial British anti-radicalization program called Channel.
“Like in the U.S., the program began as a voluntary arrangement between community organizations, high schools, and law enforcement. But it has since become compulsory for all public sector agencies,” said Kundnani. (A wide range of public entities, including police, schools, and local government, must “have due regard to the need to prevent people from being drawn into terrorism” under a U.K. counterterrorism law passed in July 2015. Government officials refer to the requirement as the “Prevent duty,” a reference to the Prevent anti-radicalization program to which Channel belongs.)
“In Britain, a lack of transparency has meant that questions and concerns about the program have remained unanswered,” Kundnani added. “Accordingly, there is little trust in the program at community level.”
German said one of his biggest concerns about SRCs is the secrecy surrounding their rollout.
“It’s a public-facing program, so one would think that everyone should have access to the same information,” he said. But like other CVE programs, “it seems they are being pushed to certain groups to the exclusion of others. That tends to be very divisive. It causes alienation of the ‘out’ group, and suspicion of the ‘in’ group.”
An overarching problem with CVE initiatives is that there is little evidence of a reliable set of indicators that someone is likely to become violent. As the U.N. Special Rapporteur for Counterterrorism and Human Rights stated in a recent report, “Many programs directed at radicalization are based on a simplistic understanding of the process as a fixed trajectory to violent extremism with identifiable markers along the way.”
Last year The Intercept published a questionnaire, developed by the National Counterterrorism Center, which police, social workers, and educators could use to score people based on risk factors for extremism, including poverty, depression, poor health, and isolation. Many of the indicators were highly subjective, while others were so commonplace as to be meaningless.
The FBI has its own controversial record of mixing counterterrorism and community engagement. In recent years, the American Civil Liberties Union uncovered cases in California where FBI agents attended events at mosques and Ramadan dinners and kept records on the participants. In 2009, an FBI initiative, which the FBI claims was quickly scrapped, used outreach to collect information on communities and build a “baseline profile of Somali individuals that are vulnerable to being radicalized.” And then there is the FBI’s widespread use of informants, believed to number at least 15,000 domestically. That figure, revealed in a 2008 budget request, is roughly 10 times the number of informants active during the era of J. Edgar Hoover and COINTELPRO.
More recently, the FBI previewed a website called “Don’t Be A Puppet,” which offered a series of games challenging players to spot signs of radicalization. Groups asked by the FBI to give input on the program worried that it focused heavily on Islamic terrorism and would lead to stigmatization of Arab and Muslim youth.
Last fall, when Thompson, the congressman, sent a letter to the Justice Department demanding more information about the committees and other CVE initiatives, he highlighted a recent report by the 9/11 Review Commission that argued the FBI’s “fundamental law enforcement and intelligence responsibilities do not make it an appropriate vehicle for the social and prevention role in the CVE mission.”
As Thompson was likely aware, SRCs are not the FBI’s first attempt to try and intervene with potential future criminals. “The whole premise [of SRCs] is to professionalize a process that has been ad hoc for a long time,” an unnamed law enforcement official told Politico.
After the September 11 attacks, the FBI reportedly worked with “deradicalizers,” members of the Muslim-American community who helped locate and dissuade youth who had joined or were at risk for joining terror groups. The FBI’s “Behavioral Analysis Unit,” meanwhile, has worked to divert people who appear to be plotting gun violence toward counseling. This program successfully disrupted nearly 150 shootings and violent attacks in 2013, Attorney General Eric Holder has claimed. FBI Director James Comey last year said of the unit, “I have these people who spend all day long thinking dark thoughts and doing research at Quantico, my Behavioral Analysis Unit. They have an incredibly important role to play in countering violent extremism.”
This January, the FBI released a presentation on “Preventing Violent Extremism in Schools,” which notes that many schools already have teams in place to handle troubled and potentially violent youth, teams that could “expand their scope to include violent extremism-specific concerning behavior.” The model of intervention and creation of an “off-ramp” described in the presentation echoes the SRC letter, although without precisely outlining the FBI’s role.
With SRCs, “the FBI has been unclear about what the threshold would be for even opening a case against an individual,” said Hoda Hawa, director of policy and advocacy at the Muslim Public Affairs Council. “The lack of transparency has been a challenging thing to overcome. At the moment, it’s not clear why an agency tasked with arresting people would also be handling community interventions.”
Have you received one of these letters or been contacted by the FBI about SRCs? Contact reporter Cora Currier or Murtaza Hussain. Here are instructions on how to contact us securely and anonymously.
Related:
Hi Murtaza – If you see this, can you please provide a documentcloud link for what was here (and linked to in your story as, I believe, the second ‘letter’ after the one Ricardo Camilo Lopez linked to just below me) – http://chsdemocrats.house.gov/sitedocuments/lynchletter.pdf ? Apparently the doc is no longer at that link. Thanks.
Sorry, Murtaza or Cora.
one of the most annoying habits of theIntercept (they always and, it seems, “responsibly” do that) is turning the documents into image-based, non-searchable pdf files:
https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/2815794/FBI-SRC-Letter.pdf
Right now I don’t have time to turn that pdf in a searchable one:
https://tfischernet.wordpress.com/2008/11/26/searchable-pdfs-with-linux/
RCL
I grew up during the cold war. About 1970 an FBI agent moved into the neighborhood most likely to keep an eye on the the people and their kids who worked at Sandia Labs on nuclear tests. The man was despicable. Both of his teenaged daughters went on to have major mental health issues. I knew the because my friends dated the girls and later lived with one of them. I say this because the FBI has just grown more powerful in “watching” the citizens they deem worthy of surveying, finding certain ones to keep an “eye” on other. Nothing has changed except increasing their power over the citizens of America.
Imagine all the long months the FBI has had to investigate Hillary Rodham Clinton’s home brew server and the 30,000 emails she generated as Secretary of State plus the 30,000 “personal” emails she and “her staff” unilaterally decided were “personal” (all about yoga dates and wedding flowers etc.) and that they then “deleted and scrubbed from her server” (but thankfully have been “discovered”), plus any improprieties with Clinton’s work as Secretary of State and her involvement with The Clinton Foundation.
I would love to be a fly on the wall inside the FBI listening to FBI Director Comey’s conversations with other agents regarding the emails, The Clinton Foundation, “Guccifer’s testimony” the testimony of Bryan Pagliano and of course the impending “interview” Mr. Comey will be doing with Hillary Clinton and her bevy of high-priced lawyers.
Comey and Lynch have declared they “are in no hurry” to finish the investigation in order to make a decision as to whether or not Clinton and/or any of her staff broke any laws because they refuse to “politicize” the investigation.
Yet they apparently have no problem dragging their feet as the Democrat Party prepares to crown Hillary Clinton their queen, then around September if they decide an indictment is “on the table” this could seriously impact the presidential election as it would obviously be too late to dump Clinton and place an acceptable candidate on the ballot in lieu of her (like the hugely popular candidate Bernie Sanders).
I believe the vast majority of Americans would prefer the FBI spend their time and resources seeking justice in the cases of the “high profile/white collar” crimes being committed which easily have the same or worse implications for our society as trying to recruit every day Americans to spy on one another!
If FBI Director Comey and his team of agents recommend an indictment against Hillary Clinton PRIOR to July 25th of this year (the beginning of the convention in Philly), this will at least restore SOME level of faith for me in the FBI.
The FBI long ago proved itself untrustworthy. It is first and foremost a political police operation, and it always will be, even if it incidentally “protects and serves” the way a law enforcement outfit is supposed to. We will not have even the semblance of civil liberties until the agency is abolished. Abolish it. No more FBI.
SRCs will be fit nicely with the Stasi-like apparatus that’s already operational from coast to coast.
Correction:
SRCs will fit nicely with the Stasi-like apparatus that’s already operational from coast to coast.
Aren’t these SRCs sort of like juries? A group of local citizens determining whether and how a person’s behavior (in this case thought crimes) should be remediated.
Except that you don’t have a legal team picking the jury. And you don’t have a lawyer objecting to a line of questioning. And you don’t have an impartial judge experienced in the law controlling the proceedings and making sure that justice prevails. Other than that, who could object?!
You’re correct. And when a high school student, likely one already socially disadvantaged among his peer group, is pulled aside for a little “talk”, his emotional response is unlikely to be one of obedience and peace. The kid will immediately pick up on the fact that he has been singled out to be treated as”dangerous” and will respond logically: with increased paranoia, distrust, and hatred of authority. The very act of trying to “nip bad thoughts in the bud” will have the exact opposite effect.
You are giving those more appearance of “legality” and “decency” than they deserve.
There is nothing new to those they are called “CDR” in Cuba and Venezuela. They just don’t call them that because, apparently, they don’t want to have to pay the franchise to the Castros and Hugo Chávez, and, of course, because “it is different when we do it”, since we do it “freedom lovingly”.
https://theintercept.com/2016/04/09/fbis-shared-responsibility-committees-to-identify-radicalized-muslims-raises-alarms/?comments=1#comment-219525
Those sorts of things have always existed in “‘the’ land of ‘the’ free …” Before the FBI would pay mobsters, unions and such kinds of folks for their dirty work, now they want to expand it, make their “awareness” more “social”, trying to make people “work” for them “voluntarily”.
They already control the memes collectively entertained by the masses. Their “freedom of the press”, “responsible” media largely take care of that, then they have all kinds of online sock puppetry and JTRIG “psychological” persecution.
Those SRCs which by the way were already operating in NYC are an essential piece that was missing in a police state. Making people “responsibly” police themselves as just another of the lower layers of a control structure that will definitely include COINTELPRO-like divisions taking care of Zersetzung (including torture) with brown shirts on the top.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sturmabteilung
I, “Albretch Mueller”, happen to know at least two things about state represion (including the stasi). I did call Hubertus Knabe on a number of the points he was making in his ted talk.
http://www.ted.com/talks/hubertus_knabe_the_dark_secrets_of_a_surveillance_state
// __ Zersetzung made in U.S.A. (Posted on May 27, 2015)
https://ipsoscustodes.wordpress.com/2015/05/27/zersetzung-made-in-u-s-a/
A previous long blog about my experiences (including the Zersetzung made in U.S.A. post):
// __ Quis custodiet ipsos custodes … (Posted on October 16, 2010)
https://ipsoscustodes.wordpress.com/2010/10/16/quis-custodiet-ipsos-custodes/
RCL
Quite. I’m in favour of community diversion but not in a formalized manner and certainly not any kind that resembles a Stasi-like informant network on steroids (or even not on steroids). This is an example of how to *destroy* the curtailment of extremism and promote more fear and distrust while further enabling a ‘burn the witch’/lynch mob mentality — the very sort of thing that probably makes people become more extremist when standing up for their rights seems to attract more ire from the powers that be instead of positive change. It’s an embarrassment to our founding principles.
I have two concerns after reading this.
The government wanting citizens to do what citizens pay taxes for the government to do, is back-asswords.
And how will this NOT lead to further division among the public? How will this not result in deputizing hate crimes? Prejudice comes from ignorance, and if we are not letting trained professionals sort these issues out then it will just be screaming for trouble. This is a high school popularity contest with legally-authorized repercussions that could prove incredibly dangerous and destabilizing. When people police themselves you get lynch mobs.
spot on.
Somebody knows that the american dollar has lost ALL growth potential except for fraudulent valuation. The chinese were able to do what JFK was not allowed to do. And they know that the economy, with a a big war, is going to hit the brick wall. Hell, they can’t even pay for constitutionally guaranteed rights in Louisianna. And people are catching on to the sham. Even Elliot Spitzer called it a ponzi scheme. And now the scheme is about to hit the brick wall.
Lucky for america there is a new currency plan about to emerge. Only problem is, wallstreet thieves wont like it.
It sounds like a good idea just don’t invite the FBI. If they are formed voluntarily just get an willing attorney to be apart of the group. If every one on the committee and those they choose to help pays the attorney a nominal fee then the every one is protected by client-attorney privilege can’t be compelled to divulge the goings on of the committee.
No FBI involvement and no way to compel members to give law enforcement any information.
“FIDELITY? BRAVERY? LOYALTY?”
This is what motivates America’s Zersetzung goons? Sure fooled me given the fact I’ve witnessed so much of their sneaking and hiding behaviours. And renting nurses to attack someone in a medical lab is hardly brave. Patriotic, maybe, but not brave.
“INTEGRITY?”
Nope. None of that either.
To paraphrase an old adage, Patriotism is the cloak used to cover authoritarians.
Trying to predict future crimes based on thoughts? Looks like the “thought police” are now forming little think tanks to try and read your mind. This has “Minority Report” written all over it. And “information sharing” is “intelligence gathering” by another name. Who-TF to do they think they’re kidding?
“….teams that could “expand their scope to include violent extremism-specific concerning behavior.” The model of intervention and creation of an “off-ramp”
How about this off ramp: End the US lead coalition that has taken well over a million Arab lives all over the Middle East in what is now becoming a never ending WWIII.
How about for the sake of us and our children we turn off the corporate fear and war mongering media, violence filled boob tube, and “kill them all” video games.
How about instead of doing to our kids basically what the Nazis taught the kids to do, which was to turn in the adults that uttered anything negative about Hitler’s Brown Shirt bullies, we simply take care of and guide them ourselves, rather than betraying and handing them over to the servants of greed and oppression.
Woah, no need to attack pornhub and gta5. We need to defend liberty not attack it ourselves.
Choosing to turn something off is not an attack.
Hey! Why not save the taxpayers a lot of money and hassle – and maybe even get the FBI to start payin’ ya, like, right now! Who needs these committees when ya can start turnin’ in, droppin’ a dime, on anyone, anywhere anytime…!
Start with neighbors, maybe people ya don’t like, then dial in your friends and family… Be the first one on YOUR block – and then, mebbe the … last… one…
Psikhushkas are the next logical extension of the highly profitable prison industrial complex. Home grown terrorists (e.g. pro-life Christians, gun rights advocates, social traditionalists, constructionists, statists etc) will all be subjected to a diagnosis of “sluggish schizophrenia” that , when properly treated, will liberate their mind of illusory “ideas about a struggle for truth and justice” that are symptomatic of personalities with a “paranoid structure.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psikhushka
Already happening. The roll-out has been completed. Targeted by locals, an individual can undergo community policing and prolonged remote torture by the ‘healing’ behavior psychologists. Suicides often result in the targeted individual. If you survive the suicide program, along with all the counter-terrorism, you may loose your business, be arrested, go to jail, do community service, be separated from all your friends and family, have an car accident, have your bank accounts erased by trying to escape the terror, and be shunned by the entire community. Then on top of that, your brain will be thoroughly washed by the psychologists and you will become a new person, unable to cry, unable to feel anything. Completely numb brain. This is the new program they don’t want you to know about. Andre Delgado advocated it back in the 70’s. Remote, covert, psychosurgery – lobotomies done on those who don’t conform or give up. It is impossible to get medical records or any proof of what they are doing to you. You will be told you are mentally ill. And many trips to the psych hospital where they lock you up for months and remotely ‘fix’ your brain – involuntary and unrecorded psychosurgery. All by community proxy. No one will help you. There is no legal, human rights organizations, no one. No one will tell you what has been done to your brain. You are isolated and forgotten. Put on SSDI and removed from society. Get a minimum wage job they tell you – this is the new social cleansing program. Psychosurgery and slavery, or murder by suicide ASSIST. Coming to your door next.
Ladys and Gents
Monas surrogate Nonanon…
Hardly. The truth is the truth even if no one believes it. A lie is a lie even if everyone believes it. Tag yourself as a surrogate. My words come from this unspeakable experience, not belief or pontification.
Thanks for the article. Since apparently some community organizations and people are actually interested in joining this program, I’d love to see an article about WHY they would voluntarily do so. Personally I can’t fathom it. Do they actually think the FBI will help them or the people they think are at risk? Couldn’t they just intervene on their own without all the baggage they’d get agreeing with all the BS the FBI would insist on? What do they possibly gain from the arrangement?
The legalisation of society has destroyed the freedom of common sense.
A lot of people revere the FBI (much like they did J. Edgar Hoover before he was disgraced) and would feel Oh So Special joining the War on Terror. That’s one of the scariest parts of this–who would volunteer????
Dumb-ass, control-freak, brown-nosing wannabes, that’s who.
Obviously, those people with some sense of morality and smarts would disqualify if they try to become members of those clubs. Those are folks just bored to death since they have nothing to do on their own and who find catharsis at sucking it up the chain of command.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milgram_experiment
RCL
Here are video feeds with even the footage of people’s reactions as they were conducting those Milgram experiments:
youtube.com/results?q=Milgram+experiment&sp=CAM%253D
Even all-Christiany, “good-looking”, daddy’s girls you would have a hard time believing capable of doing such things would easily submit to torturing other people
Something, true and hopeful, I found in such experiments (which have been repeated to exhaustion) is that (adult) age, gender, race, intellectuality, religious persuasion, class, financial solvency, … don’t seem to matter at all. It was about your inner sense of empathy, morality; a vital force, you can’t “teach”.
Could there be a biological explanation for this of the like of most people lacking enough mirror neurons to the point of reaching into moral, philosophical realm?
and, by the way, when I said “smarts” I didn’t mean that having a PhD in psychology will help see that torture is wrong. It is just that it is a bit harder for the police to find busy people for such things. They are too “distracted” to become committed @ssh0l3s:
// __ nytimes + abcnews: Police Can “legally” Bar High I.Q. Scores …
http://www.nytimes.com/1999/
http://abcnews.go.com/US/
it is as if there were official, public regulations stating: “if you are a decent person you can’t work in Wall Street” ;-)
RCL
the last two links were edited. The ones I posted were:
// __ nytimes + abcnews: Police Can “legally” Bar High I.Q. Scores …
http://www.nytimes.com/1999/09/09/nyregion/metro-news-briefs-connecticut-judge-rules-that-police-can-bar-high-iq-scores.html
http://abcnews.go.com/US/court-oks-barring-high-iqs-cops/story?id=95836
I know my access to the Internet is being “monitored” 24×7, including silly man in the middle operations, but at times I have my doubts.
Is theIntercept participating in this?
RCL
Hi Ricardo,
I moderate the comments here. I can assure you that we NEVER edit comments. We hide comments that go against our guidelines (harassment, abuse, etc.) but we never change a comment’s content.
Thank you very much for reading and for your commenting contributions to our community.
Thank you Travis@theintercept for letting us know at least you don’t edit messages which reach your shores.
I definitely know I am being man-in-the-middled and minded by them real time:
https://ipsoscustodes.wordpress.com/2014/05/18/man-in-the-middling-firstlook-orgs-the-intercept/
My messages and messages people send to me via email have been corrupted in ways that are very obvious, not “random”. They let you know they are the agents behind those actions by corrupting specific parts of what you are saying.
My conversations have been spoofed (as if they were responses from me or professional colleagues), even if I am not talking about a topic and frequenting fora in which people don’t talk about politics at all (I go as “Albretch Müller”):
http://mailman.uib.no/public/corpora/2011-August/013638.html
http://mailman.uib.no/public/corpora/2011-August/013639.html
It turns out that with that particular message LibreOffice and/or the Clipboard were parsing links (it seems, I am not 100%). At times I have found that LibreOffice’s automatic spell check doesn’t work at all and the response times of pages is way to slow and at times sites are non-responsive at all (even though you ping and traceroute them just fine).
When I post message which content exceeds, say, a short paragraph. messages get delayed and at times my posts don’t show up at all.
You may have no determining say in this, but I am -totally- against censorship. Of course, I know we are frequented by shills and such folks, but I would even take that to censorship. Besides, in the same sense that Luria investigated the minds of mnemonists, there are also “the minds of shills” (so, let’s them be themselves ;-))
Users (via a cookie), should be able to let theintercept filter those messages for them (somewhat a la theguardiannews) or not. Also, it should be nice if theintercept would let users have a public profile a lá:
https://profile.theguardian.com/user/id/12012573
https://profile.theguardian.com/user/id/13616704
Yes, they tried to run (did block) me out of theguardian ;-)
RCL
$ date
Fri May 6 23:10:58 EDT 2016
The FBI is itself a radical organization. It’s just not going to work for them to try to combat radicalization, because their own methods are so clearly radical, alienating and polarizing. They need to learn what civilized human behavior is, before they can even begin to positively address threats of terrorism.
ROFLOL..
They need to learn what civilized human behavior is,
But first one needs to be capable of learning.
Is there a clause about teaching children to inform on their parents?
Deja vu:
https://cryptome.org/2016/04/fbi-snitches.pdf
The FBI did something similar, convincing communists to change their ideology and become informants in the 1950’s.
At the risk of catching a lot of virtual flak here, i wish the F…B…I… would do something really right for a change, rather than spying on a list of enemies of the state, rather than presenting fraudulent evidence in a court, rather than participating in murder, rather than not arresting wallstreet, bush and cheney, and rather trying eminent domain on american digital innovation and privacy so they can become the new secret police.
It’s asking a lot of the F…B…I… given their will to do so many wrong things. (All the tv shows are propaganda). But I despise gangs. Gangs, including political parties, are nothing but a collection of human failures looking for a victory by hurting others. Gangs suck. And I would love a heads up if the F…B…I… had a way to alert me if my child was in any way involved in a gang.
Fire away.
your comments tend to be ad-hominem (instead of being topical (whatever your opinion)) and you are very obviously and explicitly trying to set off a flame war here. Yet, I will respond to the idea you propose because fear is a primal instinct which might motivate some parents to make decisions they will most likely regret later on, or even for good.
It makes total sense that a parent who doesn’t have a spine (and that thing called “love” you can look up in the dictionary) to deal with their own children, would call police and their snitches to “chop their own wood”.
By the way, I would suggest you should give your spouse (other parent of your child?) a grace period to decide if she or he would rather have the police or those SRCs to take care of his or her emotional and sexual needs.
It is OK for kids to hang out with their friends. It is part of their growing up. Furthermore, it is entirely fine and squarely morally and intellectually healthy to be upset about the current state of affairs.
Aren’t you? Why shouldn’t kids?
RCL
FBI GangStalking STASI are scum.
These scum take a more proactive role including the use of Directed Energy Weapons which are lethal over time.
Judge, Jury and Executioner.
This individual is one of these unfortunates. The above, important article is not about this affliction.
How terribly insightful of you Mona. Do you care to share the evidence upon which your conclusion is based?
No, she would not. She’s an American laywer (i.e., anachronism). She’s expressing their credo: “making an argument for anything”.
In this case she’s once again, like a true patriot, promoting her argument for the non-existence of Zersetzung murder programs and hundreds, possibly thousands of targets of those murder programs, without any evidence of course.
moner, it’s the same “Nondisclosure Agreement” you signed on entering the Agency…..
“…it’s the same “Nondisclosure Agreement” you signed on entering the Agency…..”
That’s just silly, stalked562. But what is clear, is that Mona is engaging in intellectual bullying.
Mona has zero game on these issues or she will respond to me here.
Crickets…
She will lose her game — strenuously attempting to persuade all TI readers the US voter & tax payer supported Zersetzung torture-to-death program does not exist in a society populated by people like her. It doesn’t get more ridiculous than that.
American star chambers are real; they torture, murder, and hide. I am a witness. Generations will instinctively take a very dim view of Americans. There is no avoiding it now, even if they do find a way to win a dumb war.
Less Than Human: The Psychology Of Cruelty
by David Livingstone Smith
***
The Montréal Review, September 2012
http://www.themontrealreview.com/2009/Less-Than-Human-Why-We-Demean-Enslave-and-Exterminate-Others.php
Excerpt:
This scheme was formalized during the Middle Ages as the Great Chain of Being or scala naturae (although the idea of a cosmic hierarchy is vastly more ancient and widespread than many intellectual historians would have us believe). Traditionally, God was placed at the apex of the hierarchy, with humans a little further down, just below the angels. All the other kinds of creatures occupied ranks below that of human beings, arranged from what we still call the “higher” animals to the “lower” ones. These, in turn were ranked above the plants, as plants were ranked above minerals. In the most elaborate versions, each rank was subdivided into sub-ranks, which were in turn divided into sub-sub-ranks. For example, during the 18th century, the rank of the human was divided into races, with white Europeans modestly situating themselves at the very top and relegating sub-Saharan Africans and Native Americans to the bottom, just a hair’s breadth above the great apes.
The notion of a hierarchy of intrinsic value is required to make sense of the notion of subhumanity. To be subhuman is to be a member of a natural kind that is ranked below the human on the Great Chain of Being.
Although the idea that the universe is hierarchically organized is a relic of a prescientific age, and is fundamentally at odds with a Darwinian picture of the biosphere, it remains stubbornly entrenched in our psychology. Moral creatures that we are, we simply can’t get away from the idea of a hierarchy of value. Morality would probably be inconceivable without it.
When we dehumanize others we conceive of them as having human appearance but the essence of a creature occupying a sub-human rank on the hierarchy of value. With this in mind it is easy to understand how dehumanization fulfills its function of disinhibiting violence. Recognizing another being as human entails having moral obligations towards that being. But if that person is seen as essentially subhuman, he or she can be killed, abused, or enslaved with impunity. Dehumanization thus enables us to reap the advantages of doing violence to our neighbors-advantages such as robbing them of their resources and exploiting their labor without compensation-without being burdened by moral reservations.
At present, there is no research center anywhere in the world that is specifically concerned with investigating dehumanization and developing strategies for preventing it. If we want to fashion a future for humanity that is less hideous than its past, this has got to change. We need to make sure that the study of dehumanization is granted a prominent place on the research agenda, and that governments, non-governmental organizations, and universities devote serious resources to it. In the absence of such efforts, resolutions like “Never again!” are likely to be little more than empty talk.
I wish someone could persuade you to look at – to cite only one example – the published newspaper report and local TV news reports (here are the links) about the stalking of the city manager of Stockton, California, in 2011, by corrupt cops whose salary demands were rejected. The tactics are identical to those featured in numerous similar accounts.
http://www.recordnet.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20110818/A_NEWS/108180325
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fDnXlAkq8yE
The fact that you haven’t been banned from commenting here suggests that your claim about having some association with Glenn Greenwald is legitimate. Based partly on that, I’m inclined to give you the benefit of the doubt on the sincerity of your comments – including your comments about this issue. That said, I disagree with your analysis of the nature of the comments here about stalking by Law Enforcement Intelligence Units (LEIUs), federal intelligence agencies, and private investigators. I say this as someone who respects your often insightful comments here on other topics.
It seems never to have occurred to you that most of the comments here about this (especially the ones which make claims about satellite-based electronic mind-control weapons and such) are disinformation, rather than delusion. The purpose of those comments is to discredit the less numerous, but more credible, claims about “disruption” operations. Such operations – dating back to COINTELPRO and the Stasi – involve traditional methods of counterintelligence harassment.
People who are truly delusional are not reading serious journalism of the sort featured at The Intercept, and posting comments. At best, they are visiting InfoWars, or sites that are even less credible.
To my knowledge – correct me if I’m wrong – the only website which features a comprehensive archive of (published) news reports – with links – (from America and abroad) related to this subject is FightGangStalking. Readers of The Intercept who are interested in domestic counterintelligence operations can browse those news reports and decide for themselves what to make of the reported facts. Attempting to discern what is going on by reading anonymous comments – rather than reading news reports – is a waste of time.
I wish someone could persuade you to look at – to cite only one example – the published newspaper report and local TV news reports (here is one of the links) about the stalking of the city manager of Stockton, California, in 2011, by corrupt cops whose salary demands were rejected. The tactics are identical to those featured in numerous similar accounts. The claims were backed up by the city’s mayor.
http://www.recordnet.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20110818/A_NEWS/108180325
The fact that you haven’t been banned from commenting here suggests that your claim about having some association with Glenn Greenwald is legitimate. Based partly on that, I’m inclined to give you the benefit of the doubt on the sincerity of your comments – including your comments about this issue. That said, I disagree with your analysis of the nature of the comments here about stalking by Law Enforcement Intelligence Units (LEIUs), federal intelligence agencies, and private investigators. I say this as someone who respects your often-insightful comments here on other topics.
Most of the comments here about this issue (especially the ones which make claims about satellite-based electronic mind-control weapons and such) are disinformation, rather than delusion. The purpose of those comments is to discredit the less numerous, but more credible, claims about “disruption” operations. Such operations – dating back to COINTELPRO and the Stasi – involve traditional methods of counterintelligence harassment.
People who are truly delusional are not reading serious journalism of the sort featured at The Intercept. At best, they are visiting InfoWars, or sites that are even less credible.
To my knowledge – correct me if I’m wrong – the only website which features a comprehensive archive of (published) news reports – with links – (from America and abroad) related to this subject is FightGangStalking. Readers of The Intercept who are interested in domestic counterintelligence disruption operations can browse those news reports and decide for themselves what to make of the reported facts. Attempting to discern what is going on by reading anonymous comments – rather than reading news reports – is a waste of time.
The nazis had a term for these kinds sleazoid snitches, known as “Blockleiter. Currently in German slang they are known as “Blockwart” or snoops. Not at an attractive vision of American society, having neighbors spy on each other for an extraordinarily undistinguished and unimaginative law enforcement body.
Ordinary American protesters have come up with a pretty straightforward anti-radicalization program. You take some Korans and burn them, and draw some Muhammad cartoons. If Muslims show up with guns, you shoot them. If they don’t, they obviously can’t be too radical. Problem Solved!
Seriously … Lady Liberty is an ugly broad, but that don’t mean ya don’t love her.
Numerous Koran burnings have taken place in the last year or so. American Muslims don’t seem to give a shit when a handful of mouth breathing, nose picking neanderthals get together and burn the book. The only ones showing up with guns are these so called, beer bellied “patriots”.
Like I said — problem solved! Seriously, the concern people have about Muslims is that we’re going to get our heads cut off for being infidels. So as long as you see some canaries in the coal mine standing up with their burnt Korans, everyone else can rest assured that the whole terrorist thing is a bit exaggerated. Which it invariably is, no matter who is expected to be doing it.
If the FBI thinks it can use social workers to try to disempower people it obviously hasn’t read the Social Worker Code of Ethics.
The FBI can compel them to violate their ethics with secret court orders. Problem solved!
Most of the social workers I’ve met are not especially bright or skilled and tend to be highly impressionable. There have been exceptions, but in general the field does not seem to attract the more brilliant minds of our society. Which is a shame, really.
“Ethics” from “social workers” and psychologists? Well, those were the Naziest of them all during the time der braune Scheiße. In fact, even Hitler himself at some point started to dislike them to the point of writing mandates to stop their practices. Did they stop? Never!
Also, why would “social workers” and psychologists care about “ethics” if a “constitutional lawyer” president has thoroughly wiped his @ss with the very, supposedly sacrosanct U.S. Constitution?
Here is all of that is documented
// __ The age of fear – psychiatry’s reign of terror …
~
youtube.com/watch?v=3hj49xDEXow
~
28:35: … September 1st 1949 … mit Ideen villeicht in Hintergrund dass der Krieg nicht nur nach aussen sondern auch innerhalb des Deutschem Volk …
33:40: what is not well known is that spite of Hitler’s order psychiatrists continued their murder spree …
34:30: … as psychiatrists before, during and after the Nazi era routinely starved their patients
38:20: … not just a few bad apples …
50:52: … Ich habe at nichts mehr geglaubt …
58:05: … and the worst part is that the psychologists will always twist things around … They are the boss regardless of what they do or say …
58:55: … had Prof. Scheneider been truly honest …
1:44:05: 2012 Germany’s Supreme Court ruled: involuntary treatment of patients illegal
~
Yes, that documentary was (partially?) funded by the Church of Scientology, but, hey! We are living in an era in which even Ann Coulter at times comes across as a sane and sound person (while criticizing her “Christian idol” for his misogynistic tirades)
http://www.salon.com/2016/03/29/why_was_donald_trumps_attack_on_heidi_cruz_the_last_straw_for_ann_coulter_tk_controversial_trump_statements_coulter_has_defended_in_the_past/
RCL
RCL – I think a lot of social workers, psychologists and mental health workers in general are also victims in this equation. They’ve been trained, for the most part, to believe that they’re doing good, and often they are, but that willingness to do good gets preyed upon at times by the powers that be telling them what is or isn’t ‘good’. Using the ‘harm to self or others’ clause is probably especially common. I’d argue so is the pressure to conform, especially given the fact that so many in the mental health professions at least start out highly empathic. Point blank, most mental health professionals just haven’t had the chance to learn that those in power may say that they have various peoples’ best interests at heart when really it’s something else entirely. And since they never see otherwise, how would they? Especially if they’re often up against people who *are* mentally unstable and so forth? I think in general, at least in America, it’s often unintentional but unfortunate.
I think I have heard that argument before (if that is what you meant) most eloquently explained by Hannah Arendt:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eichmann_in_Jerusalem#The_banality_of_evil
I know psychologists may be deranged and evil people too and, “why not using their expertise?” as those APA @ssh0l3s working as part of the torture squads from the CIA have publicly said. They knew very well the people they were torturing hadn’t been indited or anything resembling any legality.
Psychology has always been the b!tch of pseudo-sciences and those psychologists with some common sense have even thoroughly made fun of their profession.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosenhan_experiment
Do you know about Mk Ultra and such “experiments”?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edgewood_Arsenal_human_experiments
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_MKUltra
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unethical_human_experimentation_in_the_United_States
https://www.youtube.com/results?q=MK+Ultra&sp=CAM%253D
Top rank universities in the U.S. and Canada were being funded to do “research” on unsuspecting people. Of course, these @ssh0l3s knew what they were doing! However, as far as I know, not a single one of them had any kind of moral pangs to the point of blowing the whistle.
No, my buddy, no! I would accept that line of thinking if:
1) they would do such research in the open (following the well-established “scientific method”. notice Rosenhan_experiment above specially the 2nd round ;-))
2) they would offer themselves and their family members for those “experiments”
RCL
$ date
Sat May 7 00:02:08 EDT 2016